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Re: Inverted option grayed out in turnout table
Dan,
Inverting turnouts or sensors just takes which event you use as the
active/thrown and inactive/closed. So it is just swap the two event ids
making the system name. This is intentional to keep clear the state of what
is what. Remember the events don't know what they are, it is how we view
them.
As Dave said, your other choice is to invert the turnout at the node. I
strongly suggest you make sure the concepts of what is what matches with the
feedback. I've seen Digitrax layouts where invert was used and the turnout
could get into a loop somehow.
-Ken Cameron, Member JMRI Dev Team
www.jmri.org
www.fingerlakeslivesteamers.org
www.cnymod.org
www.syracusemodelrr.org
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Locked
Re: Speed matching tips
Note too that the old NCE decoder (almost certainly) has no BEMF, and a such will be much more sluggish at slow speed than the WOW, however hard you try to get it to match. ?Best thing would be to replace it with a modern decoder with tunable BEMF. A non-sound TCS decoder might be a good choice as it probably has the same motor drive algorithms as the WOW.
Mick
________________________________
Mick Moignard
m: +44 7774 652504
Skype: mickmoignard
, so please excuse the typos.
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Locked
Re: Inverted option grayed out in turnout table
Dan,
My first idea is to create a new turnout in JMRI and reverse the event numbers. ?Once that is done, move the user name from the old one to the new one. ?When everything works, delete the old turnout entry.
Another idea is to change the CDI definition for the output actions.
Dave Sand
----- Original message -----
From: Daniel Kubarych <danandsharek@...>
Subject: [jmriusers] Inverted option grayed out in turnout table
Date: Sunday, December 01, 2019 12:05 AM
Hello:
Not sure if this is a JMRI question or an LCC question...
Have a small number of turnouts that where we need to change the closed and thrown positions. Of course we could change the wires connecting pin #1 and #8 on the tortoise .? To avoid climbing under the layout, we decided to use the inverted option in the turnout table.? That option is grayed is grayed out.? The documentation states that turnouts that cannot be inverted will be grayed out.? These turnouts use tortoises wired to an RR-Cirkits BOD4-CP installed on a Signal LCC card. The turnouts were created using the Create turnout feature in the OpenLCB CDI menu item.? There is also a sensor defined to monitor turnout position. What would cause the inverted selection in the turnout table to be grayed out?
Dan Kubarych
ARHS
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Locked
Inverted option grayed out in turnout table
Hello:
Not sure if this is a JMRI question or an LCC question...
Have a small number of turnouts that where we need to change the closed and thrown positions. Of course we could change the wires connecting pin #1 and #8 on the tortoise .? To avoid climbing under the layout, we decided to use the inverted option in the turnout table.? That option is grayed is grayed out.? The documentation states that turnouts that cannot be inverted will be grayed out.? These turnouts use tortoises wired to an RR-Cirkits BOD4-CP installed on a Signal LCC card. The turnouts were created using the Create turnout feature in the OpenLCB CDI menu item.? There is also a sensor defined to monitor turnout position. What would cause the inverted selection in the turnout table to be grayed out?
Dan Kubarych
ARHS
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Locked
Re: Speed matching tips
Also of note.. TCS has several momentum related CV's.? Grand total of 15 CV's.? So make sure they are all set = 00
Then there is Motor delay, CV 182.
Marc
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Locked
Re: Speed matching tips
Yes, the whole issue of manual brake is another issue that some decoders can
do it and some can't. It is just another issue of which decoders can be
matched to other decoders. Locos with matching speeds with matching momentum
is another example of some will match and others will not match. But last
thing to keep in mind, the physical locos may have issues that make matching
difficult. Some models may never really match each other.
-Ken Cameron, Member JMRI Dev Team
www.jmri.org
www.fingerlakeslivesteamers.org
www.cnymod.org
www.syracusemodelrr.org
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Locked
Re: Speed matching tips
Paul
The previous messages are correct. The reason for the difference - the default for cv3 is 32 and the default for CV4 is 96 - you are meant to use the brake to stop the loco. As said the NCE is primitive non sound decoder.
Gerry
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 1/12/2019 2:16 pm, Ken Cameron wrote: Yes, speed match first. Then keep in mind that, regardless of the standard,
some vendors don't use the same formulas for momentum.
-Ken Cameron, Member JMRI Dev Team
www.jmri.org
www.fingerlakeslivesteamers.org
www.cnymod.org
www.syracusemodelrr.org
--
Gerry Hopkins MMR #177 FNMRA
Great Northern Downunder
NMRA Australasian Region
Contest & AP Chairman
Web Administrator
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What is peculiar here is the fact the programming is carried out and does effect the decoder: IE: changes done are reflected in decoder operation.
The only issue is a recurring? 308 error during programming in Service mode (program track). ?
TSU-PNP decoders do not require the Program Track Booster (PTB-100) or other. And do not require a resistor.
If? you have other than Soundraxx decoders available, try it.? If same result suspect your DCC++ setup.? Other than Soundtraxx TSU2 or ECO you should see a distinct knudge forward. My program track runs off a 15Volt power, and the engine being program almost leaps forward, you can not miss it..
If the the decoder programming is succefull, engine nudges forward but still encounter? 308 error, further suspect the program track (clean it), clean the wheels. If still 308 error some is bad with your DCC++ setup.
There are many a thread in various forums re DCC++ and 308 error: here are but a few I found.
This certainly not a JMRI ussue as he is looking and posting what result is returned by the DCC++.? and your seems to be erratic,
Marc
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Locked
Re: Speed matching tips
Yes, speed match first. Then keep in mind that, regardless of the standard,
some vendors don't use the same formulas for momentum.
-Ken Cameron, Member JMRI Dev Team
www.jmri.org
www.fingerlakeslivesteamers.org
www.cnymod.org
www.syracusemodelrr.org
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Locked
Re: Speed matching tips
Set momentum to 0 then speed match. Once speed is matched then match momentum.
--
Peter Ulvestad
JMRI Users Group Moderator - ( )
Tam Valley Group Moderator - ( )
Sprog-DCC Group Moderator - ( )
Edmonton Model Railroad Association -
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I’ve been chasing my tail on speed matching an NCE D13SRF Rev D decoder with a WOW Diesel 101 SS3. Both are in Athearn Tunnel Motors. It seems the WOW decoder has so much momentum in it (that is proving to be hard to control) and NCE seems super basic (and probably really old) and has very few features comparatively.
How would you guys go about speed matching them because what I’m doing ain’t working....
Thanks
Paul
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Russ,
I've found it needed to keep the following types of programming connections
available:
1. Right from the command station (important for Tsunami 2, no booster)
2. Via a booster like the PTB-100
3. With a 1K across the programming outputs
4. With a 10K across the programming outputs
I try each of these until something works. If I'm seeing the loco twitch,
but feedback fails, I figure I have to write blind to that decoder.
-Ken Cameron, Member JMRI Dev Team
www.jmri.org
www.fingerlakeslivesteamers.org
www.cnymod.org
www.syracusemodelrr.org
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Marc,? I checked trainboard.com, but it looks to be more for the hobby in general.? No 308 issues similar to mine.? When I first saw the failure of the Read full sheet, I had the motor disconnected, but subsequently reconnected when you mentioned the possibility of a current related issue.? I reconnected the motor and still get the same behavior.? Do you think that resistor across the connection might would be useful?? I don't know what value to try, but it would increase the current load.
If you have any suggestions for any other sites or boards I can post on for assistance, that would be great.
Thanks,
Russ
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Locked
Re: java Exception when try to add a second internal sensor
Steve, Andy,
I am still working on this issue. ?The scope has expanded. ?
Start JMRI with CBUS Simulator, open the Sensor table, select Add, select MERG, type the letter a. ?The same java exception that occurs when adding a second internal sensor.
Current issues: - CBUS system name validation is not handling illegal system names properly. ?This is the actual problem.
- A residual listener is causing the default connection (first listed) to be invoked before trying the the selected connection.
- When the connection is changed, such as from Internal to MERG, the previous value should be reset to empty.
Dave Sand
----- Original message -----
From: Dave Sand <ds@...>
Subject: Re: [jmriusers] java Exception when try to add a second internal sensor
Date: Tuesday, November 26, 2019 2:54 PM
Steve,
I have identified a possible cause for the unexpected CBUS validation. ?There is a listener left when the first Add window is closed which is triggered when Add is selected again. ?When CBUS is the FIRST connection, it gets called to validate the saved input from the first add. ?The previous value is reused to facilitate entering multiple similar names.
If LocoNet, NCE, etc. are the FIRST connection, they get called instead of CBUS, but their validation is not as comprehensive as CBUS so the error does not occur. ?Creating a virtual LocoNet connection as the first connection is a temporary work around. ?A review of Preferences >> Defaults would be required.
I still need to identify if this is the true problem and figure out a solution. ?Another issue is that there is a change to validation in progress which may or may not affect this particular issue.
Dave Sand
----- Original message -----
From: "steve young via Groups.Io" <icklesteve@...>
Subject: Re: [jmriusers] java Exception when try to add a second internal sensor
Date: Tuesday, November 26, 2019 10:39 AM
Hi Andy,
Thanks for reporting, have been able to reproduce the same exception.
Will need to do a bit of digging around why any sort of Internal Sensor validation is going via CBUS Sensor validation,
Steve.
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I have expanded the content of the zip file. ?It now includes a panel xml file which uses just a Layout Editor panel formatted to look like a typical Panel Editor CTC panel.
To simplify panel development, the required icons were copied to the user files location resources/icons. ? ?
Dave Sand
----- Original message -----
From: Dave Sand <ds@...>
Subject: Re: [jmriusers] PanelPro CTC tools
Date: Friday, November 29, 2019 7:14 PM
This is a complete profile with panels, demo content, the tutorial PDF file. ?If the file is unzipped and the resulting profile is placed next to existing profiles, the JMRI profile selector should see it. ?If you have the selector disabled, use Preferences >> Config Profiles to find it.
You can also just copy the panel xml files, the PDF document and the ctc directory to an existing profile.
Dave Sand
----- Original message -----
From: John Pearson <pearsonjohn99@...>
Subject: Re: [jmriusers] PanelPro CTC tools
Date: Thursday, November 28, 2019 1:38 AM
David
Me to?
Looking forward to your CTC ?tutorial
Thank you?
John Pearson
On 27 Nov 2019, at 22:02, Dave Sand <ds@...> wrote:
?
Nick, Greg,
The CTC tool is completely functional. ?It will generate all of the required sensors, a basic panel and the logic to put it all together. ?The basic prerequisite is a functional JMRI ABS signaling implementation.
I can put together a tutorial over the next several days. ?I will probably release it in phases.
Dave Sand
----- Original message -----
From: "Greg McCartney via Groups.Io" <gregmcty@...>
Subject: Re: [jmriusers] PanelPro CTC tools
Date: Wednesday, November 27, 2019 2:00 PM
Hey Nick,?
? ?I have tried to use the tools myself but I am not certain it is complete.? I haven't asked if it was complete, just got the impression after multiple times of trying to use it over different versions of JMRI.? I did get it to draw a panel once but it seems to be very hap hazard at this point.? I hope that work continues on it because it looks like an awesome product.
Greg McCartney
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Hello,
This email message is a notification to let you know that the following files have been uploaded to the Files area of the [email protected]
group.
Uploaded By:
Dave Sand <ds@...>
Description:
A tutorial for getting started with the new CTC tool. Unzip the file and move the resulting profile and its contents to the JMRI profiles location. Avoid putting this profile within an existing profile. This is an updated version which adds a Layout Editor formatted CTC panel.
Cheers,
The 开云体育 Team
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Conrad, Am 30.11.2019 um 15:50 schrieb conrad: For Klaus: My apologies for not responding to your PM of 11/13. Your RDC mod worked very well. I just got frustrated as I could not replicate your fix. I tried and tried with no success so I took a break from VSD and just ran the trains. My apologies again. Sorry for the confusion. Yes, I modified the RDC sounds. I did that as usual by cutting the sound files at a zero crossing. Then I sent you the files. But later I noticed the real reason for the clicks. For short: the RDC files had a wrong length value, which cause the click. Audacity can correct this very easily: open the file, save the file. This doesn't change the file length, but it does correct the data length. Then I sent you this simpler recipe. This background might explain why you can't replicate it. On the wrong-length-error (not an JMRI error): Matt Harris, author of SoundPro and much more, fixed the error in 2016. Now we have found an example produced by the old error. Klaus
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Phil
For lots of VSD info search for VSD on this site.? Klaus is really the goto VSD guy and is very, very helpful.? I think he is in Germany so there is a time delay.
For notching I use speed tables to try and match the speed to the notch sounds.? Thus for switchers I'm going real slow at a speed step of say 50.? The 0,33,67,100 was just a first guess.? One thing to understand is that the accel/decel notch transitions in VSD have a fixed momentum value built in.? So a quick drop of the throttle will "slowly" step the notches down from say notch 5 to idle.? Therefore I try to match this with the loco's decoder momentum settings.?
For your S-1 I have initially set the engine volume to 0.2 and it seems to be a reasonable setting vs. the bell and horn volumes.
I'm an NTraker and don't have an S-1 but I love the sounds of the ALCO 539 in your S-1, and the 539T (turbo) in my S-2 and the 12-251C (also turbo) in my RS-11.? The RS-11 prototype uses a V12 251B turbocharged diesel while mine uses the 12-251C from a C420 loco.? I'm not sure of the difference.
Conrad
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Hey, Conrad. Thanks for chiming in.? If, on my layout, I even got to speed step 30, I would be violating the speed limit.? I set this up for switching, and it's unlikely to get above 15. That's why I had the settings that I had.? When starting off from 0, the loco would notch up when it hit speed step 2 (or 3, I don't remember now), similar to what you suggested.? But I want to notch the prime mover up sooner than 30, otherwise I would always be in Notch 1.?
I am working on an Alco RS-3 VSD now, and am having some issues.? Next week I'll be able to spend more time and see what's wrong with my work.
Phil in gorgeous Young Harris, Georgia, USA
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For Phil:
The diesel sounds good to me. One small comment on the idle file. As you said, I do hear the “pop-off” and right after a non-voiced tick. Is the tick an artifact of the file? It’s not really a problem but it is there.
On notching, I think on previous VSD post someone pointed out that a loco will move (depending on train load) with the diesel at idle. That is the diesel remains at idle (notch 0) and the field windings of the generator are energized thus powering the traction motors. This being said, I modified your notch settings to 0-33, 33-67 and 67-100.
For engine gain, a check of several config files shows :
<sound name="ENGINE" type="diesel3">
<fade-in-time>0</fade-in-time>
<fade-out-time>0</fade-out-time>
<gain>0.8</gain>
<start-sound>
So this is why I could never change the level of the engine sounds, interesting. Need to mod config for <engine-gain>0.8</engine-gain>.
Finally, you have found the VSD guru – Klaus Killinger!
For Klaus: My apologies for not responding to your PM of 11/13. Your RDC mod worked very well. I just got frustrated as I could not replicate your fix. I tried and tried with no success so I took a break from VSD and just ran the trains. My apologies again.
Conrad
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Ken Cameron
Peter Ulvestad
Paul Champlin
conrad