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Re: PCB milling - getting started

 

@Cornelis van Rensburg?Agreed: The laser method does really work well. I think it is better overall.

Mark as an option, you could easily add a laser diode to your cnc.?They have gotten really inexpensive.
Re: PCB milling - getting started

 

I did some really fine pitch work using a cnc3020 but had depth issues where the bed wasn't perfectly level.
-I used on of the 30 degree v-bits at about 7-10K rpm?The bits do wear fast.(higher rpms is better with these)?
-I found that by using a thicker board .062 or thicker and working/cutting a few mils deeper was more reliable.
-The lighter the copper oz the easier.
-I tried to do only isolation at 1pass,?
-I haven't tried the self leveling features.

-To test the depth, I would add the board a trace to outline the board, first for adjusting the depth.
? ? ?This way you can see where to put the board and then rerun to test/adjust how the depth is cutting over the entire area outline.
-I used solder paste for all the fine close work. Regular solder was hard to keep from bridging often, requiring solder wicking to remove.
Re: PCB milling - getting started

 

I’ve tried milling on a mini mill (sieg x1) that I converted, but finally settled for laser.

bought a laser engraver off banggood. 3w laser diode i think.

clean the pcb with scotchbrite pad/ steelwool. Give it coat of black spray paint.?

I use Flatcam to generate the Isolation routing gcode.?

The laser engraver runs opensource software, requires reflashing. Cannot remember the name now.

after engraving, give it a rub with a sponge and drop in cupric chloride? ( hydrogen peroxide and HCL mix)

seems to come out fine, laser beam can be focussed to about 0.3mm?
Re: PCB milling - getting started

 

Also what software are you using for creating the pcb then the isolation paths?


On Tue, May 7, 2019 at 1:05 PM indigoredster <indigoredster@...> wrote:
Hi Mark,?
Post some pictures of your attempts and the pcb mill so far. Are you shooting for smt fine pitch or general .1" stuff.


On Tue, May 7, 2019 at 11:53 AM Mark Pilant <mark@...> wrote:
I did a bunch of searching but didn't really seen anything appropriate.
So here goes ...

After building electronic "stuff" for a long time (I started out using
vacuum tubes / valves :-), I wanted to try my hand at making my own PCBs.
After looking around the Internet, it seemed as though milling PCBs was
a real possibility.

So I invested in one of the many import CNC mills.? In my case, it was
one of the 3018 / Woodpecker based mills.? It went together fine, and
seems to be reasonably stable and accurate for a couple of my first
attempts.? I did add limit switches and a Z-axis probe.

But attempting to mill a PCB (2.5 x 5 inches / 65mm x 130mm) of my own
design... I have spent a lot of time over the past month without any real
success.

The first problem I am having is copper tear-out milling the traces.? I
expect this is probably a feed rate that is too high or dull milling bits.
I have tried both 30 degree "V" bits as well as 0.7mm end mills.? The end
mills gave the cleanest cut.

The second problem is insufficient depth of cut when milling.? I've tried
clamping the PCB stock, double sided tape for the stock, and auto leveling
(OpenCNCPilot) software.? Using OpenCNCPilot to auto level and mill the
PCB stock with a "V" bit was the most successful, but I haven't managed
to generate a "good" PCB.? I expect a vacuum table would be best, but
where do I stop "improving"?

All over the Internet I see lots of success stories, but none of them
really go into detail about the setup (bit type, depth of cut, feed rate,
type of PCB stock, etc.)

I hope it isn't to out of place to ask what people have actually been
using / doing which is successful.

Thanks in advance.

- Mark
Re: PCB milling - getting started

 

Hi Mark,?
Post some pictures of your attempts and the pcb mill so far. Are you shooting for smt fine pitch or general .1" stuff.


On Tue, May 7, 2019 at 11:53 AM Mark Pilant <mark@...> wrote:
I did a bunch of searching but didn't really seen anything appropriate.
So here goes ...

After building electronic "stuff" for a long time (I started out using
vacuum tubes / valves :-), I wanted to try my hand at making my own PCBs.
After looking around the Internet, it seemed as though milling PCBs was
a real possibility.

So I invested in one of the many import CNC mills.? In my case, it was
one of the 3018 / Woodpecker based mills.? It went together fine, and
seems to be reasonably stable and accurate for a couple of my first
attempts.? I did add limit switches and a Z-axis probe.

But attempting to mill a PCB (2.5 x 5 inches / 65mm x 130mm) of my own
design... I have spent a lot of time over the past month without any real
success.

The first problem I am having is copper tear-out milling the traces.? I
expect this is probably a feed rate that is too high or dull milling bits.
I have tried both 30 degree "V" bits as well as 0.7mm end mills.? The end
mills gave the cleanest cut.

The second problem is insufficient depth of cut when milling.? I've tried
clamping the PCB stock, double sided tape for the stock, and auto leveling
(OpenCNCPilot) software.? Using OpenCNCPilot to auto level and mill the
PCB stock with a "V" bit was the most successful, but I haven't managed
to generate a "good" PCB.? I expect a vacuum table would be best, but
where do I stop "improving"?

All over the Internet I see lots of success stories, but none of them
really go into detail about the setup (bit type, depth of cut, feed rate,
type of PCB stock, etc.)

I hope it isn't to out of place to ask what people have actually been
using / doing which is successful.

Thanks in advance.

- Mark
PCB milling - getting started

 

I did a bunch of searching but didn't really seen anything appropriate.
So here goes ...

After building electronic "stuff" for a long time (I started out using
vacuum tubes / valves :-), I wanted to try my hand at making my own PCBs.
After looking around the Internet, it seemed as though milling PCBs was
a real possibility.

So I invested in one of the many import CNC mills. In my case, it was
one of the 3018 / Woodpecker based mills. It went together fine, and
seems to be reasonably stable and accurate for a couple of my first
attempts. I did add limit switches and a Z-axis probe.

But attempting to mill a PCB (2.5 x 5 inches / 65mm x 130mm) of my own
design... I have spent a lot of time over the past month without any real
success.

The first problem I am having is copper tear-out milling the traces. I
expect this is probably a feed rate that is too high or dull milling bits.
I have tried both 30 degree "V" bits as well as 0.7mm end mills. The end
mills gave the cleanest cut.

The second problem is insufficient depth of cut when milling. I've tried
clamping the PCB stock, double sided tape for the stock, and auto leveling
(OpenCNCPilot) software. Using OpenCNCPilot to auto level and mill the
PCB stock with a "V" bit was the most successful, but I haven't managed
to generate a "good" PCB. I expect a vacuum table would be best, but
where do I stop "improving"?

All over the Internet I see lots of success stories, but none of them
really go into detail about the setup (bit type, depth of cut, feed rate,
type of PCB stock, etc.)

I hope it isn't to out of place to ask what people have actually been
using / doing which is successful.

Thanks in advance.

- Mark
Re: Drill Press

 

I have a Delta drill press that came with cross hair laser sights. It works after following a long alignment procedure but the beam is too fat to position anything smaller than 1/8". I think I have used it less than a half dozen times.

--
-- The only difference between men and boys, is the price of their toys.
Re: Drill Press

 

Thank you for all your replies and ideas. I have some cheep lasers at MPJA to check out also as I need help due to bad eyes these days at 64 years old. Best Kevin
Re: Drill Press

 

Clear thin (both width and thickness) strip of plastic.??

Scrap bit of PCB at each end, pulled taught and affixed to drill bed.??

Put a scrap PCB underneath and drill through, mark around hole for easier sighting,? now put your pcb to be drilled under there and use that to align.

Ogviously the plastic strip needs to be long enough that you have sufficient ability to locate the PCB under the hole for all holes required.

Picture for clarity.
? ?

As others have said, those cross hair laser things are not made for such small and precise holes.? Camera and/or mirrors better for removing any parallax error (or rather making it consistently compensated for).
Re: Drill Press

 

开云体育


On 5/6/2019 12:18 PM, Kevin Byrne via Groups.Io wrote:
I believe right about now cross hairs best idea. Bangood.com in china seem to have parts needed but cost could be expensive.
Mount table on pernament wood then mount holders on wood to align I guess. Any pics or drawings to assist plus parts list would be appreciated. I do not see how to mount drill motor underneath as it is a brand new drill press stand.

You mount the mirror under the table at a 45 degree angle.? You get a cheapie TV camera and focus it on the bottom of the board.? Print an overlay on a transparency and either put it on the mirror (may work) or the monitor (will work).? Adjust the camera position and zoom in so that you get the largest convenient size of hole.? Take a piece of scrap board and drill a very small hole.? Do not move the board, and use that hole for a target when centering the camera.

I've built an upside down drill press, but it involved some moderately complicated stuff.? With what you have, this ought to be easier.?

Harvey
Re: Drill Press

 

Been there, tried that. I experimented with the typical 650nm (red), 5mW laser modules with dot, line and cross-hair lenses available on eBay, Amazon and elsewhere. At the standard intensity the line is far too wide for the accuracy needed. You can make the line narrower by reducing the intensity either by reducing the supplied voltage or by putting a polarizing filter in front of it. In either case it becomes to dim to see except in a dimly lit room and a single dot is very difficult to localize.

?

I am dubious that starting with a higher powered laser and reducing the intensity would work well but might be worth trying. Perhaps using a violet or green laser would be easier to see on the reddish copper. I think if you want to pursue this idea the best option would be two line lasers crossing at 90 degrees focused to as narrow a line as possible with cylindrical lenses. Unlike use on a standard drill press, where you are drilling objects of varying height, the point of focus will remain at a constant distance and once set the focus should not need adjusting.

?

Craig



On Mon, May 6, 2019 at 09:18 AM, Kevin Byrne wrote:
I believe right about now cross hairs best idea. Bangood.com in china seem to have parts needed but cost could be expensive.
Mount table on pernament wood then mount holders on wood to align I guess. Any pics or drawings to assist plus parts list would be appreciated. I do not see how to mount drill motor underneath as it is a brand new drill press stand.
Re: Drill Press

 

I believe right about now cross hairs best idea. Bangood.com in china seem to have parts needed but cost could be expensive.
Mount table on pernament wood then mount holders on wood to align I guess. Any pics or drawings to assist plus parts list would be appreciated. I do not see how to mount drill motor underneath as it is a brand new drill press stand.
Re: Drill Press

 

开云体育

I'd suggest two crossing lines with the lasers attached to the drill table.? You can often buy "line" lasers that put out a line rather than a point.? If you have difficulty finding some, I'd suggest taking apart some very cheap laser line levels for parts.? It's just a laser pointer with an odd lens.? If you can, 3D printing is likely your friend.? You want a holder that's sturdy, but still attaches to the table to give you a maximum size.

You could also mount a TV camera under the table, with a 45 degree mirror, put a set of crosshairs on the monitor, and that works as well.

Harvey


On 5/6/2019 8:42 AM, Kevin Byrne via Groups.Io wrote:

I just bought a quality drill motor and drill press from Jameco and need help with a laser siteing idea to put a laser dot under board in center of hole to be drilled.
Has anyone done this that has a parts list I can adapt to my press? How about a cross hatch on top of board? Which would be best? I am open to ideas and looking for assistance.

Re: Drill Press

 

开云体育

The best way, but not the easiest way, is to do what was commercially done a very long time ago: Drill from the bottom and have a laser dot from the top.? Of course in the old days it was a cross hair in a microscope.

Bertho

?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Kevin Byrne via Groups.Io
Sent: Monday, May 6, 2019 08:42
To: [email protected]
Subject: [homebrewpcbs] Drill Press

?

I just bought a quality drill motor and drill press from Jameco and need help with a laser siteing idea to put a laser dot under board in center of hole to be drilled.
Has anyone done this that has a parts list I can adapt to my press? How about a cross hatch on top of board? Which would be best? I am open to ideas and looking for assistance.

Drill Press

 

I just bought a quality drill motor and drill press from Jameco and need help with a laser siteing idea to put a laser dot under board in center of hole to be drilled.
Has anyone done this that has a parts list I can adapt to my press? How about a cross hatch on top of board? Which would be best? I am open to ideas and looking for assistance.
Re: [Slightly OT] Recommendations for hot air soldering gun

 

I got one of those. They can blow individual components away if you aren’t careful. Make sure to get spare heater elements , they are cheap and it won’t cause a project delay if you have them. If I remember correctly they were around $7 each

On Apr 22, 2019, at 4:53 AM, David Slipper <softfoot@...> wrote:


Thanks for all the suggestions :-)

I already have a very good soldering iron so I think I'll go for an 858D
(just the hot air gun).

Again, Many thanks all,

Dave
Re: [Slightly OT] Recommendations for hot air soldering gun

 

Thanks for all the suggestions :-)

I already have a very good soldering iron so I think I'll go for an 858D
(just the hot air gun).

Again, Many thanks all,

Dave
Re: [Slightly OT] Recommendations for hot air soldering gun

 

开云体育

got a picture? make? model?

and show what you do with the soda cans.



On 04/21/2019 11:32 PM, John wrote:

Hobby Lobby (Craft Stores) sells a tool for leather work .? It is less than $20. Works well for me.

Cut up soda cans with scissors to keep the heat off of the protected areas.

Start far back and move in cautiously, NEVER feel for the heat.


Re: [Slightly OT] Recommendations for hot air soldering gun

 

Hobby Lobby (Craft Stores) sells a tool for leather work .? It is less than $20. Works well for me.

Cut up soda cans with scissors to keep the heat off of the protected areas.

Start far back and move in cautiously, NEVER feel for the heat.

--
John Ferrell W8CCW
Julian NC 27283
It is better to walk alone,
than with a crowd going the wrong direction.
--Diane Grant
Re: Tinning Boards

Jim Higgins
 

Received from MVS Sarma at 4/19/2019 03:15 UTC:

I need to enquire regarding this type of tin pate. Perhaps we can do lead coating also in a similar way.
Perhaps, but lead coatings don't adhere all that well to copper unless the copper is first tin plated. And lead plating is less wettable/solderable than tin.

Jim H
721 - 740 of 36932