I fear, krylon is cynoacrelic spay, like conformal coat.
If so,it might be difficult to remove at pad locations for soldering. A brush up with thinner might just be sufficient, i think.
On Tue, 16 Apr 2019, 5:19 pm Kevin Byrne via Groups.Io <kbyrne10= [email protected] wrote: I use a matte clear Krylon spray paint to keep good in storage. Keeps traces perfect copper till ready to solder. One can will go a long ways.
|
I use a matte clear Krylon spray paint to keep good in storage. Keeps traces perfect copper till ready to solder. One can will go a long ways.
|
Hello Sarmaji and friends, It is made by dissolving shellac in ethyl alcohol (spirit). It is a well known process that some of the Carpenters are making it locally also. This shellac like substance is available in some shops, which is used for smoking mosquitos. That substance is a good solder flux.
Thank you 73 Ameer Khan VU3SQM
Great news amir khan jee. We can use neutral color As nail polish, it would be costly. But as a lab chemical once we know the combination, it? gets daam cheaper. I suppose it is polyester? dissolved in thinner.?
Regards Sarma? ?vu3zmv
On Tue, 16 Apr 2019, 1:28 pm Ameer Khan < vu3sqm@... wrote: Hello friends You can use French polish coating over PCB. It will prevent oxidation and when soldering its layer will melt and act as a solder flux. I have successfully tried it and the PCB will remain shiny. I have tried with the brand Sheenlac, which is manufactured at Chennai and is categorised as a lacquer polish.
Thank you 73 Ameer Khan VU3SQM
IS plain enamel nail polish sufficient to prevent oxidation?
Re:After all we need to prevent oxidation of copper surface.
and
just curious.... how long can a PCB project? be left unprotected and
unbuilt?
and
if the copper does oxidize....
do we really care.... if a quick sand paper scrub makes it shiny
again?
On 04/16/2019 12:45 AM, MVS Sarma
wrote:
Yes Peter,
?things are getting costly. If we can access
any tin rod or a lump, perhaps we can try tin electro
plating. The industry adopts roller tinning but at home , it
nay not be feasible.
Cheapest appears tobe, some protective smear
that could break thro and allow soldering.? This coat could
be applied even after populating rhe board, and only
limitation is that we need to assemble immediately.
After all we need to prevent oxidisation of
copper surface.?
Regards Satma? ? vu3zmv
On Tue, 16 Apr 2019, 6:10 am Peter Ayearst
< ve3poa@... wrote:
I know
its being a while since I bought liquid tin, but it seems
to be quite expensive these days. Is there a less
expensive alternative out there? What does everyone else
do? Tin or leave the copper bare?
thanks Peter
ve3poa
|
The material used for French polish is shellac dissolved in ethanol (denatured or straight.) "Shellac is a resin secreted by the female lac bug, on trees in the forests of India and Thailand." <> for more.
I was very surprised when young that warming the shellac I had applied (as an electrical insulation) did not cause it to dry faster; rather it melted!
Donald.
--
*Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue
() no proprietary attachments; no html mail
/\ <>
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 16-Apr-2019 04:44, MVS Sarma wrote: Great news amir khan jee.
We can use neutral color
As nail polish, it would be costly. But as a lab chemical once we know the combination, it? gets daam cheaper. I suppose it is polyester? dissolved in thinner.
Regards
Sarma? ?vu3zmv
On Tue, 16 Apr 2019, 1:28 pm Ameer Khan <vu3sqm@... <mailto:vu3sqm@...> wrote:
Hello friends
You can use French polish coating over PCB. It will prevent oxidation
and when soldering its layer will melt and act as a solder flux. I have
successfully tried it and the PCB will remain shiny. I have tried with
the brand Sheenlac, which is manufactured at Chennai and is categorised
as a lacquer polish.
Thank you
73
Ameer Khan VU3SQM
On Tue 16 Apr, 2019, 10:21 AM Rob via Groups.Io
<roomberg@... <mailto:[email protected]> wrote:
IS plain enamel nail polish sufficient to prevent oxidation?
Re:After all we need to prevent oxidation of copper surface.
and
just curious.... how long can a PCB project? be left unprotected
and unbuilt?
and
if the copper does oxidize....
do we really care.... if a quick sand paper scrub makes it shiny again?
On 04/16/2019 12:45 AM, MVS Sarma wrote:
Yes Peter,
?things are getting costly. If we can access any tin rod or a
lump, perhaps we can try tin electro plating. The industry adopts
roller tinning but at home , it nay not be feasible.
Cheapest appears tobe, some protective smear that could break
thro and allow soldering.? This coat could be applied even after
populating rhe board, and only limitation is that we need to
assemble immediately.
After all we need to prevent oxidisation of copper surface.
Regards
Satma? ? vu3zmv
On Tue, 16 Apr 2019, 6:10 am Peter Ayearst <ve3poa@...
<mailto:ve3poa@...> wrote:
I know its being a while since I bought liquid tin, but it
seems to be quite expensive these days. Is there a less
expensive alternative out there? What does everyone else do?
Tin or leave the copper bare?
thanks Peter
ve3poa
|
Great news amir khan jee. We can use neutral color As nail polish, it would be costly. But as a lab chemical once we know the combination, it? gets daam cheaper. I suppose it is polyester? dissolved in thinner.?
Regards Sarma? ?vu3zmv
On Tue, 16 Apr 2019, 1:28 pm Ameer Khan < vu3sqm@... wrote: Hello friends You can use French polish coating over PCB. It will prevent oxidation and when soldering its layer will melt and act as a solder flux. I have successfully tried it and the PCB will remain shiny. I have tried with the brand Sheenlac, which is manufactured at Chennai and is categorised as a lacquer polish.
Thank you 73 Ameer Khan VU3SQM
IS plain enamel nail polish sufficient to prevent oxidation?
Re:After all we need to prevent oxidation of copper surface.
and
just curious.... how long can a PCB project? be left unprotected and
unbuilt?
and
if the copper does oxidize....
do we really care.... if a quick sand paper scrub makes it shiny
again?
On 04/16/2019 12:45 AM, MVS Sarma
wrote:
Yes Peter,
?things are getting costly. If we can access
any tin rod or a lump, perhaps we can try tin electro
plating. The industry adopts roller tinning but at home , it
nay not be feasible.
Cheapest appears tobe, some protective smear
that could break thro and allow soldering.? This coat could
be applied even after populating rhe board, and only
limitation is that we need to assemble immediately.
After all we need to prevent oxidisation of
copper surface.?
Regards Satma? ? vu3zmv
On Tue, 16 Apr 2019, 6:10 am Peter Ayearst
< ve3poa@... wrote:
I know
its being a while since I bought liquid tin, but it seems
to be quite expensive these days. Is there a less
expensive alternative out there? What does everyone else
do? Tin or leave the copper bare?
thanks Peter
ve3poa
|
Hello friends You can use French polish coating over PCB. It will prevent oxidation and when soldering its layer will melt and act as a solder flux. I have successfully tried it and the PCB will remain shiny. I have tried with the brand Sheenlac, which is manufactured at Chennai and is categorised as a lacquer polish.
Thank you 73 Ameer Khan VU3SQM
IS plain enamel nail polish sufficient to prevent oxidation?
Re:After all we need to prevent oxidation of copper surface.
and
just curious.... how long can a PCB project? be left unprotected and
unbuilt?
and
if the copper does oxidize....
do we really care.... if a quick sand paper scrub makes it shiny
again?
On 04/16/2019 12:45 AM, MVS Sarma
wrote:
Yes Peter,
?things are getting costly. If we can access
any tin rod or a lump, perhaps we can try tin electro
plating. The industry adopts roller tinning but at home , it
nay not be feasible.
Cheapest appears tobe, some protective smear
that could break thro and allow soldering.? This coat could
be applied even after populating rhe board, and only
limitation is that we need to assemble immediately.
After all we need to prevent oxidisation of
copper surface.?
Regards Satma? ? vu3zmv
On Tue, 16 Apr 2019, 6:10 am Peter Ayearst
< ve3poa@... wrote:
I know
its being a while since I bought liquid tin, but it seems
to be quite expensive these days. Is there a less
expensive alternative out there? What does everyone else
do? Tin or leave the copper bare?
thanks Peter
ve3poa
|
Hi Rob, I generally hide etched pcb in side a polythene cover and seal it off, till i use it. Shining is ever retained. If we can finish soldering fadt, perhaps? protective spray could hep us to enhance board's life.
IS plain enamel nail polish sufficient to prevent oxidation?
Re:After all we need to prevent oxidation of copper surface.
and
just curious.... how long can a PCB project? be left unprotected and
unbuilt?
and
if the copper does oxidize....
do we really care.... if a quick sand paper scrub makes it shiny
again?
On 04/16/2019 12:45 AM, MVS Sarma
wrote:
Yes Peter,
?things are getting costly. If we can access
any tin rod or a lump, perhaps we can try tin electro
plating. The industry adopts roller tinning but at home , it
nay not be feasible.
Cheapest appears tobe, some protective smear
that could break thro and allow soldering.? This coat could
be applied even after populating rhe board, and only
limitation is that we need to assemble immediately.
After all we need to prevent oxidisation of
copper surface.?
Regards Satma? ? vu3zmv
On Tue, 16 Apr 2019, 6:10 am Peter Ayearst
< ve3poa@... wrote:
I know
its being a while since I bought liquid tin, but it seems
to be quite expensive these days. Is there a less
expensive alternative out there? What does everyone else
do? Tin or leave the copper bare?
thanks Peter
ve3poa
|
IS plain enamel nail polish sufficient to prevent oxidation?
Re:After all we need to prevent oxidation of copper surface.
and
just curious.... how long can a PCB project? be left unprotected and
unbuilt?
and
if the copper does oxidize....
do we really care.... if a quick sand paper scrub makes it shiny
again?
On 04/16/2019 12:45 AM, MVS Sarma
wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Yes Peter,
?things are getting costly. If we can access
any tin rod or a lump, perhaps we can try tin electro
plating. The industry adopts roller tinning but at home , it
nay not be feasible.
Cheapest appears tobe, some protective smear
that could break thro and allow soldering.? This coat could
be applied even after populating rhe board, and only
limitation is that we need to assemble immediately.
After all we need to prevent oxidisation of
copper surface.?
Regards Satma? ? vu3zmv
On Tue, 16 Apr 2019, 6:10 am Peter Ayearst
< ve3poa@... wrote:
I know
its being a while since I bought liquid tin, but it seems
to be quite expensive these days. Is there a less
expensive alternative out there? What does everyone else
do? Tin or leave the copper bare?
thanks Peter
ve3poa
|
Yes Peter, ?things are getting costly. If we can access any tin rod or a lump, perhaps we can try tin electro plating. The industry adopts roller tinning but at home , it nay not be feasible.
Cheapest appears tobe, some protective smear that could break thro and allow soldering.? This coat could be applied even after populating rhe board, and only limitation is that we need to assemble immediately.
After all we need to prevent oxidisation of copper surface.? Regards Satma? ? vu3zmv
On Tue, 16 Apr 2019, 6:10 am Peter Ayearst < ve3poa@... wrote: I know its being a while since I bought liquid tin, but it seems to be quite expensive these days. Is there a less expensive alternative out there? What does everyone else do? Tin or leave the copper bare?
thanks Peter
ve3poa
|
I know its being a while since I bought liquid tin, but it seems to be quite expensive these days. Is there a less expensive alternative out there? What does everyone else do? Tin or leave the copper bare?
thanks Peter
ve3poa
|
Re: ALLPCB may not want hobby PCB business
Definitely would like to see the gerbers where
those shorts happened....
and learn what clearance error sizing is the
correct way to design PCBs.
One thing I noticed when I moved from hand
crafting DIP circuits to using CAD software was that
I never would use traces and pads thin enough to
actually pass between DIP pins
while the standard for the CAD programs has no
problem fitting traces between dip pins.
The reason for me using such fat traces was
because I had to trace with a marker over my traces or else I
would have
missing copper spots.
so I always used fatter traces
and then
when I first learned EAGLE I set the default to
fatter traces so I could still kitchen table etch PCBs
BUT
and heres a surprise.....
EAGLE tripped all over itself and could not
auto-route with fatter traces.
It really like being able to duck between pads
on a DIP.
On 04/11/2019 06:51 PM, stefan_trethan
wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Would be interesting if there is a clearance
error in the files that makes for a marginal design.
ST
Timely
that a conversation about AllPCB has just come up.
I
am actually using JLCPCB for my hobby stuff at the
moment.? JLCCPB completely screwed one of my boards from
the last batch with a giant trace running through the
middle that was not in the gerbers.? That is another
story and JLCPCB sent me new boards without question so
I am still happy with them.
Back
to the ALLPCB issue.? I was given a batch of 50 PCBs
from ALLPCB to populate.? The boards have 180ish
components including a few QFN/DFN parts.
After
making 36 boards I had 5 non functional.? Not terrible
given my equipment as some rework is always needed.? Two
of the five a visual inspection and found problems with
DFN packages and fixed them.? This left me with 3 that I
could not visually see a fault.
I
got out the scope and began trouble shooting.? First
board I found the 1v8 power supply was not working.? Bit
more checking I found a dead short to GND on the enable
pin.
This
did not involve any DFN/QFN parts that could hide a
short underneath.? So pulled off a 100TQFP and an
SOT23-5 which should have been the only copper
connections.? Short to GND still there.
Turns
out all 3 remaining faulty boards had shorts to GND on
the internal layers.? One of these was not a dead short
but had a few K resistance and was "fixed" with a large
capacitor.? I am not going to treat that board as good
but I wanted to see if the short could be ablated.
They
where meant to be 100% e-test which I thought should
catch things like that.
Hi there.
I've been dealing with ALLPCB for some while now -
more than two dozen orders since December 2016.? Some
orders are a single board number but most are two or
more different boards in each order.? Quantities range
from 5pcs to 25pcs of each board number.
Our CAD package (CADint) generates Gerber Extended
(RS274X) but doesn't use what I consider to be
industry-standard file naming conventions.?
Nonetheless, ALLPCB hasn't had much problem with
producing our boards.? I simply include a text file
describing the file names for all of the layers inside
the ZIP file.
We are more than a hobbyist customer but our
quantities are relatively small - I use ALLPCB mostly
for prototype boards.? I still do use APCircuits in
Calgary, Canada for really rush prototype boards (2
days for me to receive my boards) but ALLPCB's
delivery time of about a week is good most of the
time.? That's to Edmonton, Canada.
They make great boards (and solder-paste stencils).
I find ALLPCB to be too expensive for our production
boards but that's okay - we have qualified a couple of
Chinese PCB manufacturers who also make great boards.
Customer service from ALLPCB is pretty good.? They
have caught some stupid errors that we made which
saved us both time and money.
All in all - I think that ALLPCB does a good job and I
plan to keep using them for the foreseeable future.
dwayne
At 11:02 AM 4/10/2019, Rob via Groups.Io wrote:
was? ??
[homebrewpcbs] can anyone make a 3 component example
in DIPTRACE
I made gerber and drill files and
I followed the naming convention rules.
and then
I displayed my gerber files in GERBV on Linux and
GERBVIEW on Windows 10
and
I zipped my gerbers and sent them to OSHPARK and
they immediately displayed the correct results
so ...with oshpark showing those images I figured I
passed the industry stand tests for gerber and drill
files
and
I did not buy from OSHPARK this time because they
wanted $60 for 3 PCBs.
and then I sent them to ALLPCB because they were
supposed to be real cheap.
and after they rejected them
I sent the same zip file to JLCPCB and they had no
problem producing 50 PCBs for $42 and ..delivered in
6 days.
while
at the same time
ALLPCB kept rejecting my zip file and telling me
they had issues like asking me if my solder mask was
negative
and then another time they said there was no copper
layer... at all.
I played with ALLPCB .... I went along with all of
their "issues"... asked questions... got answers...
changed what they asked for...
and then figured out a pattern of their standard
operating procedure.
They do correspondence in English with a customer
service rep who is not an engineer.
Then ...they pass along files to engineers.
Then
the engineers use multiple types of software to
display and approve a production run.
They sent me screen images that were all in Chinese
except for key words like RS-274-X
and then other emails they sent me clear English and
all that time I am certain no TWO same engineers
examined my ZIP file.
?? ??
and then
I told the customer service rep to have the engineer
look at this image :
? ??
on this web page
??
and then tell me whats wrong with my gerber and
drill files
and then they replied that?? my copper was mixed
with my pads.
WTF?????
and then
JLCPCB delivered
?
and I pulled the plug on ALLPCB and they refunded my
$116.??
So.... this got me wondering.........
why would ALLPCB give me such a hard time to make a
hundred dollar order?
Why would such a high tech staff of engineers who
are used to playing with multilayer thousand hole
PCBs
and SMT tolerances only seen with a
microscope........... ?? ?? ?? WHY WOULD THEY BLOW
ME OFF?
A guy who hands them a single layer PCB for hobby
electronics?
Is it because ALLPCB expects you to buy a low volume
prototype batch and then sign on for a lifetime of
thousands of PCBs made by them later?
So...? ?? I guy like me shows up asking for 100 PCBs
...once....? ?? tell that guy to go away... they
don't need my $100.
Well.. they saved me $50.
Their price with shipping clocked in at 97 cents per
PCB and JLCPCB was 42 cents per PCB.
? ALL of my gerber files came from reaConverter and
my drill files were hand crafted and nothing came
from DIPTRACE.
I wanted to see what simple files looked like. To
learn what it should look like.
Thats why I asked for ONE LED one resister and one 9
volt batter with leads.
I only picked DIPtrace because I have diptrace and
if I could not get my diptrace to make exactly what
one of you guys made as an example then that
would mean I screwed with settings on diptrace and
broke something.
?
and
I just learned about Sprint-Layout-6
so
I am done chasing Diptrace gerber syntax.......
Definitely much easier to live with Sprint-Layout-6.
--
Trinity Electronics Systems Ltd??? Edmonton, AB,
CANADA
780-489-3199 voice?? 780-487-6397 fax??
888-489-3199 Toll Free
Custom Electronics Design and Manufacturing
|
Re: ALLPCB may not want hobby PCB business
It was not my board however I do have the gerbers and they pass a 6/6 DRC.
I personally leave bigger spaces on inner layers if I can.
The three shorts spotted so far are also on different nets on different regions of the PCB
I've still got 14 unpopulated boards I could possibly beep out all the internal hidden traces but seems a waste of time.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Would be interesting if there is a clearance error in the files that makes for a marginal design.
ST
Timely that a conversation about AllPCB has just come up.
I am actually using JLCPCB for my hobby stuff at the moment.? JLCCPB completely screwed one of my boards from the last batch with a giant trace running through the middle that was not in the gerbers.? That is another story and JLCPCB sent me new boards without
question so I am still happy with them.
Back to the ALLPCB issue.? I was given a batch of 50 PCBs from ALLPCB to populate.? The boards have 180ish components including a few QFN/DFN parts.
After making 36 boards I had 5 non functional.? Not terrible given my equipment as some rework is always needed.? Two of the five a visual inspection and found problems with DFN packages and fixed them.? This left me with 3 that I could not visually see a fault.
I got out the scope and began trouble shooting.? First board I found the 1v8 power supply was not working.? Bit more checking I found a dead short to GND on the enable pin.
This did not involve any DFN/QFN parts that could hide a short underneath.? So pulled off a 100TQFP and an SOT23-5 which should have been the only copper connections.? Short to GND still there.
Turns out all 3 remaining faulty boards had shorts to GND on the internal layers.? One of these was not a dead short but had a few K resistance and was "fixed" with a large capacitor.? I am not going to treat that board as good but I wanted to see if the short
could be ablated.
They where meant to be 100% e-test which I thought should catch things like that.
Hi there.
I've been dealing with ALLPCB for some while now - more than two dozen orders since December 2016.? Some orders are a single board number but most are two or more different boards in each order.? Quantities range from 5pcs to 25pcs of each board number.
Our CAD package (CADint) generates Gerber Extended (RS274X) but doesn't use what I consider to be industry-standard file naming conventions.? Nonetheless, ALLPCB hasn't had much problem with producing our boards.? I simply include a text file describing the
file names for all of the layers inside the ZIP file.
We are more than a hobbyist customer but our quantities are relatively small - I use ALLPCB mostly for prototype boards.? I still do use APCircuits in Calgary, Canada for really rush prototype boards (2 days for me to receive my boards) but ALLPCB's delivery
time of about a week is good most of the time.? That's to Edmonton, Canada.
They make great boards (and solder-paste stencils).
I find ALLPCB to be too expensive for our production boards but that's okay - we have qualified a couple of Chinese PCB manufacturers who also make great boards.
Customer service from ALLPCB is pretty good.? They have caught some stupid errors that we made which saved us both time and money.
All in all - I think that ALLPCB does a good job and I plan to keep using them for the foreseeable future.
dwayne
At 11:02 AM 4/10/2019, Rob via Groups.Io wrote:
was? ?? [homebrewpcbs] can anyone make a 3 component example in DIPTRACE
I made gerber and drill files and
I followed the naming convention rules.
and then
I displayed my gerber files in GERBV on Linux and GERBVIEW on Windows 10
and
I zipped my gerbers and sent them to OSHPARK and they immediately displayed the correct results
so ...with oshpark showing those images I figured I passed the industry stand tests for gerber and drill files
and
I did not buy from OSHPARK this time because they wanted $60 for 3 PCBs.
and then I sent them to ALLPCB because they were supposed to be real cheap.
and after they rejected them
I sent the same zip file to JLCPCB and they had no problem producing 50 PCBs for $42 and ..delivered in 6 days.
while
at the same time
ALLPCB kept rejecting my zip file and telling me they had issues like asking me if my solder mask was negative
and then another time they said there was no copper layer... at all.
I played with ALLPCB .... I went along with all of their "issues"... asked questions... got answers... changed what they asked for...
and then figured out a pattern of their standard operating procedure.
They do correspondence in English with a customer service rep who is not an engineer.
Then ...they pass along files to engineers.
Then
the engineers use multiple types of software to display and approve a production run.
They sent me screen images that were all in Chinese except for key words like RS-274-X
and then other emails they sent me clear English and all that time I am certain no TWO same engineers
examined my ZIP file.
?? ??
and then
I told the customer service rep to have the engineer look at this image :
? ??
on this web page
??
and then tell me whats wrong with my gerber and drill files
and then they replied that?? my copper was mixed with my pads.
WTF?????
and then
JLCPCB delivered
?
and I pulled the plug on ALLPCB and they refunded my $116.??
So.... this got me wondering.........
why would ALLPCB give me such a hard time to make a hundred dollar order?
Why would such a high tech staff of engineers who are used to playing with multilayer thousand hole PCBs
and SMT tolerances only seen with a microscope........... ?? ?? ?? WHY WOULD THEY BLOW ME OFF?
A guy who hands them a single layer PCB for hobby electronics?
Is it because ALLPCB expects you to buy a low volume prototype batch and then sign on for a lifetime of thousands of PCBs made by them later?
So...? ?? I guy like me shows up asking for 100 PCBs ...once....? ?? tell that guy to go away... they don't need my $100.
Well.. they saved me $50.
Their price with shipping clocked in at 97 cents per PCB and JLCPCB was 42 cents per PCB.
? ALL of my gerber files came from reaConverter and my drill files were hand crafted and nothing came from DIPTRACE.
I wanted to see what simple files looked like. To learn what it should look like.
Thats why I asked for ONE LED one resister and one 9 volt batter with leads.
I only picked DIPtrace because I have diptrace and if I could not get my diptrace to make exactly what one of you guys made as an example then that
would mean I screwed with settings on diptrace and broke something.
?
and
I just learned about Sprint-Layout-6
so
I am done chasing Diptrace gerber syntax.......
Definitely much easier to live with Sprint-Layout-6.
--
Trinity Electronics Systems Ltd??? Edmonton, AB, CANADA
780-489-3199 voice?? 780-487-6397 fax?? 888-489-3199 Toll Free
Custom Electronics Design and Manufacturing
|
Re: ALLPCB may not want hobby PCB business
Would be interesting if there is a clearance error in the files that makes for a marginal design.
ST
Timely that a conversation about AllPCB has just come up.
I am actually using JLCPCB for my hobby stuff at the moment.? JLCCPB completely screwed one of my boards from the last batch with a giant trace running through the middle that was not in the gerbers.? That is another story and JLCPCB sent me new boards without
question so I am still happy with them.
Back to the ALLPCB issue.? I was given a batch of 50 PCBs from ALLPCB to populate.? The boards have 180ish components including a few QFN/DFN parts.
After making 36 boards I had 5 non functional.? Not terrible given my equipment as some rework is always needed.? Two of the five a visual inspection and found problems with DFN packages and fixed them.? This left me with 3 that I could not visually see a fault.
I got out the scope and began trouble shooting.? First board I found the 1v8 power supply was not working.? Bit more checking I found a dead short to GND on the enable pin.
This did not involve any DFN/QFN parts that could hide a short underneath.? So pulled off a 100TQFP and an SOT23-5 which should have been the only copper connections.? Short to GND still there.
Turns out all 3 remaining faulty boards had shorts to GND on the internal layers.? One of these was not a dead short but had a few K resistance and was "fixed" with a large capacitor.? I am not going to treat that board as good but I wanted to see if the short
could be ablated.
They where meant to be 100% e-test which I thought should catch things like that.
Hi there.
I've been dealing with ALLPCB for some while now - more than two dozen orders since December 2016.? Some orders are a single board number but most are two or more different boards in each order.? Quantities range from 5pcs to 25pcs of each board number.
Our CAD package (CADint) generates Gerber Extended (RS274X) but doesn't use what I consider to be industry-standard file naming conventions.? Nonetheless, ALLPCB hasn't had much problem with producing our boards.? I simply include a text file describing the
file names for all of the layers inside the ZIP file.
We are more than a hobbyist customer but our quantities are relatively small - I use ALLPCB mostly for prototype boards.? I still do use APCircuits in Calgary, Canada for really rush prototype boards (2 days for me to receive my boards) but ALLPCB's delivery
time of about a week is good most of the time.? That's to Edmonton, Canada.
They make great boards (and solder-paste stencils).
I find ALLPCB to be too expensive for our production boards but that's okay - we have qualified a couple of Chinese PCB manufacturers who also make great boards.
Customer service from ALLPCB is pretty good.? They have caught some stupid errors that we made which saved us both time and money.
All in all - I think that ALLPCB does a good job and I plan to keep using them for the foreseeable future.
dwayne
At 11:02 AM 4/10/2019, Rob via Groups.Io wrote:
was? ?? [homebrewpcbs] can anyone make a 3 component example in DIPTRACE
I made gerber and drill files and
I followed the naming convention rules.
and then
I displayed my gerber files in GERBV on Linux and GERBVIEW on Windows 10
and
I zipped my gerbers and sent them to OSHPARK and they immediately displayed the correct results
so ...with oshpark showing those images I figured I passed the industry stand tests for gerber and drill files
and
I did not buy from OSHPARK this time because they wanted $60 for 3 PCBs.
and then I sent them to ALLPCB because they were supposed to be real cheap.
and after they rejected them
I sent the same zip file to JLCPCB and they had no problem producing 50 PCBs for $42 and ..delivered in 6 days.
while
at the same time
ALLPCB kept rejecting my zip file and telling me they had issues like asking me if my solder mask was negative
and then another time they said there was no copper layer... at all.
I played with ALLPCB .... I went along with all of their "issues"... asked questions... got answers... changed what they asked for...
and then figured out a pattern of their standard operating procedure.
They do correspondence in English with a customer service rep who is not an engineer.
Then ...they pass along files to engineers.
Then
the engineers use multiple types of software to display and approve a production run.
They sent me screen images that were all in Chinese except for key words like RS-274-X
and then other emails they sent me clear English and all that time I am certain no TWO same engineers
examined my ZIP file.
?? ??
and then
I told the customer service rep to have the engineer look at this image :
? ??
on this web page
??
and then tell me whats wrong with my gerber and drill files
and then they replied that?? my copper was mixed with my pads.
WTF?????
and then
JLCPCB delivered
?
and I pulled the plug on ALLPCB and they refunded my $116.??
So.... this got me wondering.........
why would ALLPCB give me such a hard time to make a hundred dollar order?
Why would such a high tech staff of engineers who are used to playing with multilayer thousand hole PCBs
and SMT tolerances only seen with a microscope........... ?? ?? ?? WHY WOULD THEY BLOW ME OFF?
A guy who hands them a single layer PCB for hobby electronics?
Is it because ALLPCB expects you to buy a low volume prototype batch and then sign on for a lifetime of thousands of PCBs made by them later?
So...? ?? I guy like me shows up asking for 100 PCBs ...once....? ?? tell that guy to go away... they don't need my $100.
Well.. they saved me $50.
Their price with shipping clocked in at 97 cents per PCB and JLCPCB was 42 cents per PCB.
? ALL of my gerber files came from reaConverter and my drill files were hand crafted and nothing came from DIPTRACE.
I wanted to see what simple files looked like. To learn what it should look like.
Thats why I asked for ONE LED one resister and one 9 volt batter with leads.
I only picked DIPtrace because I have diptrace and if I could not get my diptrace to make exactly what one of you guys made as an example then that
would mean I screwed with settings on diptrace and broke something.
?
and
I just learned about Sprint-Layout-6
so
I am done chasing Diptrace gerber syntax.......
Definitely much easier to live with Sprint-Layout-6.
--
Trinity Electronics Systems Ltd??? Edmonton, AB, CANADA
780-489-3199 voice?? 780-487-6397 fax?? 888-489-3199 Toll Free
Custom Electronics Design and Manufacturing
|
Re: ALLPCB may not want hobby PCB business
Timely that a conversation about AllPCB has just come up.
I am actually using JLCPCB for my hobby stuff at the moment.? JLCCPB completely screwed one of my boards from the last batch with a giant trace running through the middle that was not in the gerbers.? That is another story and JLCPCB sent me new boards without
question so I am still happy with them.
Back to the ALLPCB issue.? I was given a batch of 50 PCBs from ALLPCB to populate.? The boards have 180ish components including a few QFN/DFN parts.
After making 36 boards I had 5 non functional.? Not terrible given my equipment as some rework is always needed.? Two of the five a visual inspection and found problems with DFN packages and fixed them.? This left me with 3 that I could not visually see a fault.
I got out the scope and began trouble shooting.? First board I found the 1v8 power supply was not working.? Bit more checking I found a dead short to GND on the enable pin.
This did not involve any DFN/QFN parts that could hide a short underneath.? So pulled off a 100TQFP and an SOT23-5 which should have been the only copper connections.? Short to GND still there.
Turns out all 3 remaining faulty boards had shorts to GND on the internal layers.? One of these was not a dead short but had a few K resistance and was "fixed" with a large capacitor.? I am not going to treat that board as good but I wanted to see if the short
could be ablated.
They where meant to be 100% e-test which I thought should catch things like that.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Hi there.
I've been dealing with ALLPCB for some while now - more than two dozen orders since December 2016.? Some orders are a single board number but most are two or more different boards in each order.? Quantities range from 5pcs to 25pcs of each board number.
Our CAD package (CADint) generates Gerber Extended (RS274X) but doesn't use what I consider to be industry-standard file naming conventions.? Nonetheless, ALLPCB hasn't had much problem with producing our boards.? I simply include a text file describing the
file names for all of the layers inside the ZIP file.
We are more than a hobbyist customer but our quantities are relatively small - I use ALLPCB mostly for prototype boards.? I still do use APCircuits in Calgary, Canada for really rush prototype boards (2 days for me to receive my boards) but ALLPCB's delivery
time of about a week is good most of the time.? That's to Edmonton, Canada.
They make great boards (and solder-paste stencils).
I find ALLPCB to be too expensive for our production boards but that's okay - we have qualified a couple of Chinese PCB manufacturers who also make great boards.
Customer service from ALLPCB is pretty good.? They have caught some stupid errors that we made which saved us both time and money.
All in all - I think that ALLPCB does a good job and I plan to keep using them for the foreseeable future.
dwayne
At 11:02 AM 4/10/2019, Rob via Groups.Io wrote:
was? ?? [homebrewpcbs] can anyone make a 3 component example in DIPTRACE
I made gerber and drill files and
I followed the naming convention rules.
and then
I displayed my gerber files in GERBV on Linux and GERBVIEW on Windows 10
and
I zipped my gerbers and sent them to OSHPARK and they immediately displayed the correct results
so ...with oshpark showing those images I figured I passed the industry stand tests for gerber and drill files
and
I did not buy from OSHPARK this time because they wanted $60 for 3 PCBs.
and then I sent them to ALLPCB because they were supposed to be real cheap.
and after they rejected them
I sent the same zip file to JLCPCB and they had no problem producing 50 PCBs for $42 and ..delivered in 6 days.
while
at the same time
ALLPCB kept rejecting my zip file and telling me they had issues like asking me if my solder mask was negative
and then another time they said there was no copper layer... at all.
I played with ALLPCB .... I went along with all of their "issues"... asked questions... got answers... changed what they asked for...
and then figured out a pattern of their standard operating procedure.
They do correspondence in English with a customer service rep who is not an engineer.
Then ...they pass along files to engineers.
Then
the engineers use multiple types of software to display and approve a production run.
They sent me screen images that were all in Chinese except for key words like RS-274-X
and then other emails they sent me clear English and all that time I am certain no TWO same engineers
examined my ZIP file.
?? ??
and then
I told the customer service rep to have the engineer look at this image :
? ??
on this web page
??
and then tell me whats wrong with my gerber and drill files
and then they replied that?? my copper was mixed with my pads.
WTF?????
and then
JLCPCB delivered
?
and I pulled the plug on ALLPCB and they refunded my $116.??
So.... this got me wondering.........
why would ALLPCB give me such a hard time to make a hundred dollar order?
Why would such a high tech staff of engineers who are used to playing with multilayer thousand hole PCBs
and SMT tolerances only seen with a microscope........... ?? ?? ?? WHY WOULD THEY BLOW ME OFF?
A guy who hands them a single layer PCB for hobby electronics?
Is it because ALLPCB expects you to buy a low volume prototype batch and then sign on for a lifetime of thousands of PCBs made by them later?
So...? ?? I guy like me shows up asking for 100 PCBs ...once....? ?? tell that guy to go away... they don't need my $100.
Well.. they saved me $50.
Their price with shipping clocked in at 97 cents per PCB and JLCPCB was 42 cents per PCB.
? ALL of my gerber files came from reaConverter and my drill files were hand crafted and nothing came from DIPTRACE.
I wanted to see what simple files looked like. To learn what it should look like.
Thats why I asked for ONE LED one resister and one 9 volt batter with leads.
I only picked DIPtrace because I have diptrace and if I could not get my diptrace to make exactly what one of you guys made as an example then that
would mean I screwed with settings on diptrace and broke something.
?
and
I just learned about Sprint-Layout-6
so
I am done chasing Diptrace gerber syntax.......
Definitely much easier to live with Sprint-Layout-6.
--
Dwayne Reid?? <dwayner@...>
Trinity Electronics Systems Ltd??? Edmonton, AB, CANADA
780-489-3199 voice?? 780-487-6397 fax?? 888-489-3199 Toll Free
Custom Electronics Design and Manufacturing
|
Re: ALLPCB may not want hobby PCB business
Good to hear......
Thats encouraging.
On 04/10/2019 05:49 PM, Dwayne Reid
wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Hi there.
I've been dealing with ALLPCB for some while now - more than two
dozen
orders since December 2016.? Some orders are a single board number
but most are two or more different boards in each order.?
Quantities
range from 5pcs to 25pcs of each board number.
Our CAD package (CADint) generates Gerber Extended (RS274X) but
doesn't
use what I consider to be industry-standard file naming
conventions.? Nonetheless, ALLPCB hasn't had much problem with
producing our boards.? I simply include a text file describing the
file names for all of the layers inside the ZIP file.
We are more than a hobbyist customer but our quantities are
relatively
small - I use ALLPCB mostly for prototype boards.? I still do use
APCircuits in Calgary, Canada for really rush prototype boards (2
days
for me to receive my boards) but ALLPCB's delivery time of about a
week
is good most of the time.? That's to Edmonton, Canada.
They make great boards (and solder-paste stencils).
I find ALLPCB to be too expensive for our production boards but
that's
okay - we have qualified a couple of Chinese PCB manufacturers who
also
make great boards.
Customer service from ALLPCB is pretty good.? They have caught
some
stupid errors that we made which saved us both time and money.
All in all - I think that ALLPCB does a good job and I plan to
keep using
them for the foreseeable future.
dwayne
At 11:02 AM 4/10/2019, Rob via Groups.Io wrote:
was? ??
[homebrewpcbs] can
anyone make a 3 component example in DIPTRACE
I made gerber and drill files and
I followed the naming convention rules.
and then
I displayed my gerber files in GERBV on Linux and GERBVIEW on
Windows
10
and
I zipped my gerbers and sent them to OSHPARK and they
immediately
displayed the correct results
so ...with oshpark showing those images I figured I passed the
industry
stand tests for gerber and drill files
and
I did not buy from OSHPARK this time because they wanted $60 for
3
PCBs.
and then I sent them to ALLPCB because they were supposed to be
real
cheap.
and after they rejected them
I sent the same zip file to JLCPCB and they had no problem
producing 50
PCBs for $42 and ..delivered in 6 days.
while
at the same time
ALLPCB kept rejecting my zip file and telling me they had issues
like
asking me if my solder mask was negative
and then another time they said there was no copper layer... at
all.
I played with ALLPCB .... I went along with all of their
"issues"... asked questions... got answers... changed what they
asked for...
and then figured out a pattern of their standard operating
procedure.
They do correspondence in English with a customer service rep
who is not
an engineer.
Then ...they pass along files to engineers.
Then
the engineers use multiple types of software to display and
approve a
production run.
They sent me screen images that were all in Chinese except for
key words
like RS-274-X
and then other emails they sent me clear English and all that
time I am
certain no TWO same engineers
examined my ZIP file.
?? ??
and then
I told the customer service rep to have the engineer look at
this image
:
? ??
on this web page
??
and then tell me whats wrong with my gerber and drill files
and then they replied that?? my copper was mixed with my
pads.
WTF?????
and then
JLCPCB delivered
?
and I pulled the plug on ALLPCB and they refunded my $116.??
So.... this got me wondering.........
why would ALLPCB give me such a hard time to make a hundred
dollar
order?
Why would such a high tech staff of engineers who are used to
playing
with multilayer thousand hole PCBs
and SMT tolerances only seen with a microscope........... ?? ??
?? WHY WOULD THEY BLOW ME OFF?
A guy who hands them a single layer PCB for hobby electronics?
Is it because ALLPCB expects you to buy a low volume prototype
batch and
then sign on for a lifetime of thousands of PCBs made by them
later?
So...? ?? I guy like me shows up asking for 100 PCBs
...once....?
?? tell that guy to go away... they don't need my $100.
Well.. they saved me $50.
Their price with shipping clocked in at 97 cents per PCB and
JLCPCB was
42 cents per PCB.
? ALL of my gerber files came from reaConverter and my drill
files were
hand crafted and nothing came from DIPTRACE.
I wanted to see what simple files looked like. To learn what it
should
look like.
Thats why I asked for ONE LED one resister and one 9 volt batter
with
leads.
I only picked DIPtrace because I have diptrace and if I could
not get my
diptrace to make exactly what one of you guys made as an example
then
that
would mean I screwed with settings on diptrace and broke
something.
?
and
I just learned about Sprint-Layout-6
so
I am done chasing Diptrace gerber syntax.......
Definitely much easier to live with Sprint-Layout-6.
--
Trinity Electronics Systems Ltd??? Edmonton, AB,
CANADA
780-489-3199 voice?? 780-487-6397 fax??
888-489-3199 Toll Free
Custom Electronics Design and Manufacturing
|
Re: ALLPCB may not want hobby PCB business
Hi there.
I've been dealing with ALLPCB for some while now - more than two dozen
orders since December 2016.? Some orders are a single board number
but most are two or more different boards in each order.? Quantities
range from 5pcs to 25pcs of each board number.
Our CAD package (CADint) generates Gerber Extended (RS274X) but doesn't
use what I consider to be industry-standard file naming
conventions.? Nonetheless, ALLPCB hasn't had much problem with
producing our boards.? I simply include a text file describing the
file names for all of the layers inside the ZIP file.
We are more than a hobbyist customer but our quantities are relatively
small - I use ALLPCB mostly for prototype boards.? I still do use
APCircuits in Calgary, Canada for really rush prototype boards (2 days
for me to receive my boards) but ALLPCB's delivery time of about a week
is good most of the time.? That's to Edmonton, Canada.
They make great boards (and solder-paste stencils).
I find ALLPCB to be too expensive for our production boards but that's
okay - we have qualified a couple of Chinese PCB manufacturers who also
make great boards.
Customer service from ALLPCB is pretty good.? They have caught some
stupid errors that we made which saved us both time and money.
All in all - I think that ALLPCB does a good job and I plan to keep using
them for the foreseeable future.
dwayne
At 11:02 AM 4/10/2019, Rob via Groups.Io wrote:
was? ?? [homebrewpcbs] can
anyone make a 3 component example in DIPTRACE
I made gerber and drill files and
I followed the naming convention rules.
and then
I displayed my gerber files in GERBV on Linux and GERBVIEW on Windows
10
and
I zipped my gerbers and sent them to OSHPARK and they immediately
displayed the correct results
so ...with oshpark showing those images I figured I passed the industry
stand tests for gerber and drill files
and
I did not buy from OSHPARK this time because they wanted $60 for 3
PCBs.
and then I sent them to ALLPCB because they were supposed to be real
cheap.
and after they rejected them
I sent the same zip file to JLCPCB and they had no problem producing 50
PCBs for $42 and ..delivered in 6 days.
while
at the same time
ALLPCB kept rejecting my zip file and telling me they had issues like
asking me if my solder mask was negative
and then another time they said there was no copper layer... at
all.
I played with ALLPCB .... I went along with all of their
"issues"... asked questions... got answers... changed what they
asked for...
and then figured out a pattern of their standard operating
procedure.
They do correspondence in English with a customer service rep who is not
an engineer.
Then ...they pass along files to engineers.
Then
the engineers use multiple types of software to display and approve a
production run.
They sent me screen images that were all in Chinese except for key words
like RS-274-X
and then other emails they sent me clear English and all that time I am
certain no TWO same engineers
examined my ZIP file.
?? ??
and then
I told the customer service rep to have the engineer look at this image
:
? ??
on this web page
??
and then tell me whats wrong with my gerber and drill files
and then they replied that?? my copper was mixed with my
pads.
WTF?????
and then
JLCPCB delivered
?
and I pulled the plug on ALLPCB and they refunded my $116.??
So.... this got me wondering.........
why would ALLPCB give me such a hard time to make a hundred dollar
order?
Why would such a high tech staff of engineers who are used to playing
with multilayer thousand hole PCBs
and SMT tolerances only seen with a microscope........... ?? ??
?? WHY WOULD THEY BLOW ME OFF?
A guy who hands them a single layer PCB for hobby electronics?
Is it because ALLPCB expects you to buy a low volume prototype batch and
then sign on for a lifetime of thousands of PCBs made by them later?
So...? ?? I guy like me shows up asking for 100 PCBs ...once....?
?? tell that guy to go away... they don't need my $100.
Well.. they saved me $50.
Their price with shipping clocked in at 97 cents per PCB and JLCPCB was
42 cents per PCB.
? ALL of my gerber files came from reaConverter and my drill files were
hand crafted and nothing came from DIPTRACE.
I wanted to see what simple files looked like. To learn what it should
look like.
Thats why I asked for ONE LED one resister and one 9 volt batter with
leads.
I only picked DIPtrace because I have diptrace and if I could not get my
diptrace to make exactly what one of you guys made as an example then
that
would mean I screwed with settings on diptrace and broke something.
?
and
I just learned about Sprint-Layout-6
so
I am done chasing Diptrace gerber syntax.......
Definitely much easier to live with Sprint-Layout-6.
--
Dwayne Reid?? <dwayner@...>
Trinity Electronics Systems Ltd??? Edmonton, AB,
CANADA
780-489-3199 voice?? 780-487-6397 fax??
888-489-3199 Toll Free
Custom Electronics Design and Manufacturing
|
Re: can anyone make a 3 component example in DIPTRACE
|
Re: can anyone make a 3 component example in DIPTRACE
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Works for you. Thats nice. Keep using it.
ALL of the electronic design automation (EDA)
software....... EAGLE and DIPTRACE .... etc..... make GERBER and
EXCELLON drill files which
ALL of the PCB board houses accept.
SO
I don't care if an example is with DIPTRACE or EAGLE or KICAD or any
other EDA.....
what I was looking for was an example of a single sided PCB with
copper on the bottom and components on the top
using through hole parts,? nothing surface mount....
using one LED and one resister and one 9 volt battery two wire
battery connector that solders through two holes to the PCB.
AND
then ....? no matter what software makes the gerber files....
I wanted to compare my gerber files to the example gerber files to
see what I was doing wrong because ALLPCB had problems with my
gerber files.?
There ARE no examples ANYwhere on the internet that shows JUST A
SIMPLE EXAMPLE for
board outline
top silk screen
top solder mask
bottom copper
bottom solder mask
bottom silk screen
drill file
so there is no way to learn what those files SHOULD have in them
without peeling apart each one in a simple example.
AND
I have EAGLE,DIPTRACE,KICAD,CIRCAD and have messed with way too many
settings so I don't know what I broke here.
Thats why I wanted to see an example made by somebody who KNOWS what
they are doing.
I'm just learning how to break this stuff.
?
?
On 04/08/2019 08:38 AM, Kevin Byrne via
Groups.Io wrote:
EDA & JLPCB accepts your winrar files, price is a ton
cheeper for 10 boards prototype. $2.00 plus expedited shipping
equals $20.00
or so. Works for me every time so far. Convert to EDA files
or go JLPCB site direct. EDA- Eagle and two others no Dip
Trace so upload to?
JLPCB ad give it a once over due to prices only if for no
other reason.
|
Re: ALLPCB may not want hobby PCB business
Your files look a bit weird and non-standard, that's probably what threw them. I don't personally think you wanted anything particularly difficult, just the opposite, but it doesn't look like the hundreds of files they deal with every day.
Some suppliers are more inclined to "risk it" and deliver what they assume you want, or even modify your files to fit their needs, and others want all the details clarified and approved first to avoid complaints later. . I see this all the time dealing with different PCB suppliers, there are some I know will just produce the boards and some where I absolutely know there will be questions asked. The funny thing is one supplier will ask questions every time, but different ones, for identical files. It becomes tiring and I simply go to the cheaper "no questions asked" board house because they don't waste my, or their, time, both of which I have to pay for in the end.
In Asia it is very common that you will deal with a customer service rep and not the engineers directly, due to the language barrier. As a very small customer, you won't have fixed contacts and someone from a pool of staff will process your order, again that is not unusual.
Just stick with the supplier you like, no point wasting your time if they decide to be complicated.
ST
On Wed, Apr 10, 2019 at 7:02 PM Rob via Groups.Io <roomberg= [email protected]> wrote:
was?? [homebrewpcbs] can anyone make a 3 component example in
DIPTRACE
I made gerber and drill files and
I followed the naming convention rules.
and then
I displayed my gerber files in GERBV on Linux and GERBVIEW on
Windows 10
and
I zipped my gerbers and sent them to OSHPARK and they immediately
displayed the correct results
so ...with oshpark showing those images I figured I passed the
industry stand tests for gerber and drill files
and
I did not buy from OSHPARK this time because they wanted $60 for 3
PCBs.
and then I sent them to ALLPCB because they were supposed to be real
cheap.
and after they rejected them
I sent the same zip file to JLCPCB and they had no problem producing
50 PCBs for $42 and ..delivered in 6 days.
while
at the same time
ALLPCB kept rejecting my zip file and telling me they had issues
like asking me if my solder mask was negative
and then another time they said there was no copper layer... at all.
I played with ALLPCB .... I went along with all of their "issues"...
asked questions... got answers... changed what they asked for...
and then figured out a pattern of their standard operating
procedure.
They do correspondence in English with a customer service rep who is
not an engineer.
Then ...they pass along files to engineers.
Then
the engineers use multiple types of software to display and approve
a production run.
They sent me screen images that were all in Chinese except for key
words like RS-274-X
and then other emails they sent me clear English and all that time I
am certain no TWO same engineers
examined my ZIP file.
? ?
and then
I told the customer service rep to have the engineer look at this
image :
??
on this web page
?
and then tell me whats wrong with my gerber and drill files
and then they replied that? my copper was mixed with my pads.
WTF?????
and then
JLCPCB delivered
?
and I pulled the plug on ALLPCB and they refunded my $116.?
So.... this got me wondering.........
why would ALLPCB give me such a hard time to make a hundred dollar
order?
Why would such a high tech staff of engineers who are used to
playing with multilayer thousand hole PCBs
and SMT tolerances only seen with a microscope........... ? ? ? WHY
WOULD THEY BLOW ME OFF?
A guy who hands them a single layer PCB for hobby electronics?
Is it because ALLPCB expects you to buy a low volume prototype batch
and then sign on for a lifetime of thousands of PCBs made by them
later?
So...?? I guy like me shows up asking for 100 PCBs ...once....??
tell that guy to go away... they don't need my $100.
Well.. they saved me $50.
Their price with shipping clocked in at 97 cents per PCB and JLCPCB
was 42 cents per PCB.
?ALL of my gerber files came from reaConverter and my drill files
were hand crafted and nothing came from DIPTRACE.
I wanted to see what simple files looked like. To learn what it
should look like.
Thats why I asked for ONE LED one resister and one 9 volt batter
with leads.
I only picked DIPtrace because I have diptrace and if I could not
get my diptrace to make exactly what one of you guys made as an
example then that
would mean I screwed with settings on diptrace and broke something.
?
and
I just learned about Sprint-Layout-6
so
I am done chasing Diptrace gerber syntax.......
Definitely much easier to live with Sprint-Layout-6.
?
On 04/10/2019 11:07 AM, designer_craig
wrote:
Rob,
Possibly they got confused by your Gerber file names,? though in
theory any file name can be used. ? I usually set my names to be:
BoardOutline.gbr, Bottom.gbr, BottomMask.gbr, Top.gbr.
TopMask.gbr, TopSilk.gbr, Through.drl? and sometimes
BotSilk.gbr.?? You can also add past mask for a stencil, and other
special cutouts etc. ? I include all layers even if they contain
no info.
You should get in the habit of viewing your Gerber files as a
final sanity check before sending them to the fabricator.? I use
the free program called ViewMate by Pentalogix to see exactly what
the fabricator should see.?? Also when you generate the Gerber
Files in Diptrace? you are able to view the rendered files as well
but I like ViewMate better.
I don't have a 3 component boad but have attached a 3Ghz
prescaller I did for my HP53131 counter a while back.???? If you
are relatively new to DipTrace it can be a little overwhelming,
what is missing in the DipTrace documentation is a 20,000 foot
view of the entire process.? Attached is a notes file I did for a
friend that was new to DipTrace,? hope it will be of some help.
Craig
|
ALLPCB may not want hobby PCB business
was?? [homebrewpcbs] can anyone make a 3 component example in
DIPTRACE
I made gerber and drill files and
I followed the naming convention rules.
and then
I displayed my gerber files in GERBV on Linux and GERBVIEW on
Windows 10
and
I zipped my gerbers and sent them to OSHPARK and they immediately
displayed the correct results
so ...with oshpark showing those images I figured I passed the
industry stand tests for gerber and drill files
and
I did not buy from OSHPARK this time because they wanted $60 for 3
PCBs.
and then I sent them to ALLPCB because they were supposed to be real
cheap.
and after they rejected them
I sent the same zip file to JLCPCB and they had no problem producing
50 PCBs for $42 and ..delivered in 6 days.
while
at the same time
ALLPCB kept rejecting my zip file and telling me they had issues
like asking me if my solder mask was negative
and then another time they said there was no copper layer... at all.
I played with ALLPCB .... I went along with all of their "issues"...
asked questions... got answers... changed what they asked for...
and then figured out a pattern of their standard operating
procedure.
They do correspondence in English with a customer service rep who is
not an engineer.
Then ...they pass along files to engineers.
Then
the engineers use multiple types of software to display and approve
a production run.
They sent me screen images that were all in Chinese except for key
words like RS-274-X
and then other emails they sent me clear English and all that time I
am certain no TWO same engineers
examined my ZIP file.
? ?
and then
I told the customer service rep to have the engineer look at this
image :
??
on this web page
?
and then tell me whats wrong with my gerber and drill files
and then they replied that? my copper was mixed with my pads.
WTF?????
and then
JLCPCB delivered
?
and I pulled the plug on ALLPCB and they refunded my $116.?
So.... this got me wondering.........
why would ALLPCB give me such a hard time to make a hundred dollar
order?
Why would such a high tech staff of engineers who are used to
playing with multilayer thousand hole PCBs
and SMT tolerances only seen with a microscope........... ? ? ? WHY
WOULD THEY BLOW ME OFF?
A guy who hands them a single layer PCB for hobby electronics?
Is it because ALLPCB expects you to buy a low volume prototype batch
and then sign on for a lifetime of thousands of PCBs made by them
later?
So...?? I guy like me shows up asking for 100 PCBs ...once....??
tell that guy to go away... they don't need my $100.
Well.. they saved me $50.
Their price with shipping clocked in at 97 cents per PCB and JLCPCB
was 42 cents per PCB.
?ALL of my gerber files came from reaConverter and my drill files
were hand crafted and nothing came from DIPTRACE.
I wanted to see what simple files looked like. To learn what it
should look like.
Thats why I asked for ONE LED one resister and one 9 volt batter
with leads.
I only picked DIPtrace because I have diptrace and if I could not
get my diptrace to make exactly what one of you guys made as an
example then that
would mean I screwed with settings on diptrace and broke something.
?
and
I just learned about Sprint-Layout-6
so
I am done chasing Diptrace gerber syntax.......
Definitely much easier to live with Sprint-Layout-6.
?
On 04/10/2019 11:07 AM, designer_craig
wrote:
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Rob,
Possibly they got confused by your Gerber file names,? though in
theory any file name can be used. ? I usually set my names to be:
BoardOutline.gbr, Bottom.gbr, BottomMask.gbr, Top.gbr.
TopMask.gbr, TopSilk.gbr, Through.drl? and sometimes
BotSilk.gbr.?? You can also add past mask for a stencil, and other
special cutouts etc. ? I include all layers even if they contain
no info.
You should get in the habit of viewing your Gerber files as a
final sanity check before sending them to the fabricator.? I use
the free program called ViewMate by Pentalogix to see exactly what
the fabricator should see.?? Also when you generate the Gerber
Files in Diptrace? you are able to view the rendered files as well
but I like ViewMate better.
I don't have a 3 component boad but have attached a 3Ghz
prescaller I did for my HP53131 counter a while back.???? If you
are relatively new to DipTrace it can be a little overwhelming,
what is missing in the DipTrace documentation is a 20,000 foot
view of the entire process.? Attached is a notes file I did for a
friend that was new to DipTrace,? hope it will be of some help.
Craig
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