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Re: Cannot connect a second time, Decoder Pro
Thanks Marc you just saved me couple hours of car time and the cost of a PR4. ?Interestingly, on a second try with the PR3/Soundloader setup on the PC I get a COM error message and cannot connect. ?So the issue is isolated to the PC/ports, it's not a JMRI/ Decoder Pro issue. A bit of a time consuming process to learn this and I regret taking the time of JRMI experts when it is not really a JRMI issue. ?But again, thanks to all who helped. ? I have been thinking of getting a dedicated laptop for the layout and this pushes me in that direction.
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Even more simple is BackAndForthTimed.py.
No need to sensors at each end.?
These are run within PanelPro? >? Panels? > Run Script? after you have started? PanelPro > Thread Monitor and? Script Output? to see what goes on.
You can also stat up Monitor Loconet and Slot Monitor to see what is going on? without being connected to the layout, just a command Station.
Engine is on address 14.. and top speed is 90.
Marc
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Re: Some questions about signaling and the best way to debug the layout
Bob,
I was able to get the browser view working. I had to change the style sheet href and disable cross-origin restrictions in the Safari Developer menu.
The XSLT appears to work OK for most things. The blocks section is not picking up the block user name or the assigned sensor. The layout editor track segment does not include block assignments. The layout turnout entry does include the first block name, but not the additional blocks for cross-overs.
I am thinking about creating a "Where Used" tool. This would replace the existing getTypeAndNames method in jmri.jmrit.beantable.Maintenance, currently accessed via the Logix Tools menu.
Dave Sand
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----- Original message ----- From: Bob Jacobsen <rgj1927@...> To: [email protected]Subject: Re: [jmriusers] Some questions about signaling and the best way to debug the layout Date: Saturday, February 01, 2020 1:58 PM Sorry, I meant the various block, logic, etc, parts that live in a panel file. If that all displays nicely in a browser, then it would be easy to move around with ^F (or equivalent) to see what references a given name. Bob On Feb 1, 2020, at 11:13 AM, Dave Sand <ds@...> wrote:
I have not noticed any issues with displaying the signaling aspect and appearance XML files using XSLT.
If I understood correctly, Scott was looking for a global cross-reference.
The "Tools >> Find Cross References" menu item in the Logix table does this but only for a specified item. It appears to have some issues with items that have the same user name in different classes.
----- Original message -----
From: Bob Jacobsen <rgj1927@...>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [jmriusers] Some questions about signaling and the best way to debug the layout
Date: Saturday, February 01, 2020 12:31 PM
Do the signaling parts of XML files display well when opening in a browser from the JMRI web server? (The file is translated via XSLT when that¡¯s done, but not all of the XSLT formatting is up to date)
Bob
On Feb 1, 2020, at 10:23 AM, Dave Sand <ds@...> wrote:
The easiest method to find references is to search the xml file. The challenge is understanding the format of the file. Also, references are sometimes by system name and sometimes by user name.
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Update :? A replacement computer? was sourced,? running Win10,? and all is well. JMRI 4.18 is now up and running fine.?
Not really a "solution" in it's self but he is happy with the outcome.
Strange little problem.
Marc
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Re: Layout Editor Bridge Decoration line width problem
PR?#7992 has been merged.
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Re: Cannot connect a second time, Decoder Pro
On Sat, Feb 1, 2020 at 12:55 PM, <gjs1010@...> wrote:
I'm thinking my best option might be to get a new PR4, and try again on Windows?
I would not waste my time / money. To Windows, PR3 or PR4 are one and the same. Same driver, same setup.? If you can't get the PR3 to work, you will hit the same wall with the PR4. Also the PR4 does not like PAGE mode and causes it's own garbage.? The PR3 is not prone to this and works as well under Page or Direct.? I have both a PR3 and a PR4. spend most of the time using the PR3.? Used it under WinXp, Win7, Win8, Win10. I still use it under WinXP on a very old Lenovo T60 2Ghz/2Gbram.? Used it since NEW and currently under JMRI 4.19.3 ..? I arranged Device Manager so that no matter where I plug the PR3 in, it is always seen as the same COM port. Saves a bunch of aggravation. If the PR3 runs under Digitrax Soundloader (even after power off/on :-) ), that rules out a driver, cable, port, PR3 issue...? unfortunately..? Marc
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Re: Cannot connect a second time, Decoder Pro
On Sat, Feb 1, 2020 at 01:35 AM, <gjs1010@...> wrote:
Thanks Marc. ?I tried the update about 5 times, "program failed", "port not recognized" error messages.
There is a specific process to update the PR3 and it is documented on the Digitrax web site you should read it: http://www.digitrax.com/media/apps/software/download/24/PR3_Update_v1.0_for_64bit.pdf 1 -. The PR3 must be in a specific mode for the update. 2 -? DIGIIPL will indicate a failure of the update run.? This is normal. 3 -? If you are still encountering COM port issues with DIGIIPL,? some thing is faulty with the hardware involved.. You tried to run the DIGIIPL firmware update 5 times and it failed, you have either a bad USB socket, bad USB cable, bad PR3 device.? Using DIGIIPL? rules out anything JAVA or JMRI related. Try uninstalling the PR3 from Device Manager and reinstalling it. Win10 will use it's own driver? ( usbser.sys )? but if Windows does not even see the PR3 on occasion, playing with driver will not help you. Marc
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Re: Cannot connect a second time, Decoder Pro
One last update for the benefit of others who might find this thread. Exploring based on Marc's comments, I found Digitrax's Soundloader 2 software and installed.? My PR3 worked the first time, no issues with the communication.
Soundloader is very crude compared to Decoder Pro, but at least I can read the CVs (my Digitrax system uses a 20-year old DB150 command station that can't read CVs) and get a couple new locos speed matched which is what started this project. My brother is a true computer expert, next time he visits I look forward to returning to this thread to get JMRI/Decoder Pro up and running someday soon - your kind help will not go to waste.??
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Re: Some questions about signaling and the best way to debug the layout
Sorry, I meant the various block, logic, etc, parts that live in a panel file. If that all displays nicely in a browser, then it would be easy to move around with ^F (or equivalent) to see what references a given name.
Bob
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On Feb 1, 2020, at 11:13 AM, Dave Sand <ds@...> wrote:
I have not noticed any issues with displaying the signaling aspect and appearance XML files using XSLT.
If I understood correctly, Scott was looking for a global cross-reference.
The "Tools >> Find Cross References" menu item in the Logix table does this but only for a specified item. It appears to have some issues with items that have the same user name in different classes.
----- Original message -----
From: Bob Jacobsen <rgj1927@...>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [jmriusers] Some questions about signaling and the best way to debug the layout
Date: Saturday, February 01, 2020 12:31 PM
Do the signaling parts of XML files display well when opening in a browser from the JMRI web server? (The file is translated via XSLT when that¡¯s done, but not all of the XSLT formatting is up to date)
Bob
On Feb 1, 2020, at 10:23 AM, Dave Sand <ds@...> wrote:
The easiest method to find references is to search the xml file. The challenge is understanding the format of the file. Also, references are sometimes by system name and sometimes by user name.
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Re: Some questions about signaling and the best way to debug the layout
Thanks -- that was quite helpful. Of course that led to further questions --
It seems that LRoutes and Double Crossovers only understand Signal Heads and not Masts. So how do I associate a Signal Mast with a crossover (I only get the option to place Signal Heads)? I did manage to place a Signal Mast at the boundary of the next track segment and it successfully discovered the correct destinations through that crossover. Perhaps my problem is that I (luckily?) created my double crossover with track segments out of each of the four corners.
I finally find the "LRoute Initializer" under the "Add LRoute", as a radio button. It sure would be nice if that were documented somewhere. (Based on your mention of it I started digging and finally found it -- the only mention seems to be where Bob Jacobsen calls it out in the release notes for 2.12). I'll use that to set up some of my sensors, though it looks like I can't actually set Masts.
Scott
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There is a script to do this included with every release. For some
funny reason it is called "backandforth.py". It is in the jython
folder of the resources folder.
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On Sat, 1 Feb 2020 at 18:41, :Larry Sebelley <sebelley@...> wrote:
Group:
Before I try to reinvent the wheel, has someone already created a JMRI Logix to control a back & forth train movement, similar to a trolley shuttle? The layout is Digitrax-controlled, if that is important. I imagine that I will need two optical detectors, one at each end of the track area, to generate the control signals.
I wish to use a small DCC decoder equipped switcher to move 3 grain cars VERY slowly back & forth at an unloading spot. I want the movement to be essentially unnoticeable if one watches it, but apparent if one looks away for a few minutes.
L.A. (Larry) Sebelley
Convention Chair, Pacific Northwest Region
Assistant Treasurer, Pacific Northwest Region
Treasurer, PNR 7th Division
Treasurer, Coldslap Free-mo
(604) 858-5717
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Re: Some questions about signaling and the best way to debug the layout
Bob,
I have not noticed any issues with displaying the signaling aspect and appearance XML files using XSLT.
If I understood correctly, Scott was looking for a global cross-reference.
The "Tools >> Find Cross References" menu item in the Logix table does this but only for a specified item. It appears to have some issues with items that have the same user name in different classes.
Dave Sand
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
----- Original message ----- From: Bob Jacobsen <rgj1927@...> To: [email protected]Subject: Re: [jmriusers] Some questions about signaling and the best way to debug the layout Date: Saturday, February 01, 2020 12:31 PM Do the signaling parts of XML files display well when opening in a browser from the JMRI web server? (The file is translated via XSLT when that¡¯s done, but not all of the XSLT formatting is up to date) Bob On Feb 1, 2020, at 10:23 AM, Dave Sand <ds@...> wrote:
The easiest method to find references is to search the xml file. The challenge is understanding the format of the file. Also, references are sometimes by system name and sometimes by user name.
-- Bob Jacobsen rgj1927@...
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Group:
Before I try to reinvent the wheel, has someone already created a JMRI Logix to control a back & forth train movement, similar to a trolley shuttle? The layout is Digitrax-controlled, if that is important. I imagine that I will need two optical detectors, one at each end of the track area, to generate the control signals.
I wish to use a small DCC decoder equipped switcher to move 3 grain cars VERY slowly back & forth at an unloading spot. I want the movement to be essentially unnoticeable if one watches it, but apparent if one looks away for a few minutes.
L.A. (Larry) Sebelley
Convention Chair, Pacific Northwest Region
Assistant Treasurer, Pacific Northwest Region
Treasurer, PNR 7th Division
Treasurer, Coldslap Free-mo
(604) 858-5717
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Locked
Re: Some questions about signaling and the best way to debug the layout
Do the signaling parts of XML files display well when opening in a browser from the JMRI web server? (The file is translated via XSLT when that¡¯s done, but not all of the XSLT formatting is up to date) Bob On Feb 1, 2020, at 10:23 AM, Dave Sand <ds@...> wrote:
The easiest method to find references is to search the xml file. The challenge is understanding the format of the file. Also, references are sometimes by system name and sometimes by user name.
-- Bob Jacobsen rgj1927@...
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Re: Some questions about signaling and the best way to debug the layout
Scott,
1. ?An end bumper is a block boundary. ?I create a virtual mast and attach it like any other mast using the right click context menu and select "Set Signal Mast...". ?This provides a destination mast. ?When a mast is the destination for signal mast logic, it will default to the "danger" aspect as defined in the appearance xml file for the mast. ?This will normally be Stop.
A virtual mast can also be used at the transition from signaled to "dark" territory. ?For this case I use an initialization Logix to set the desired aspect.
2. ?I use a Route to set default values for future sensors (and for simulation mode). ?I use the LRoute Initializer to set the layout state during startup. ?It sets a "Reset" sensor which then triggers appropriate Routes and/or Logixs.
3. ?Your "Layout Editor >> Tools >> Check" items all look good for the Pennsy West Main panel. ?To see where a block is used, select the block on the tool bar and click on Highlight. ?You may need to check both panels.
4. ?If you have been making a lot of block changes, it helps to use the Tools >> Tables >> Blocks >> Paths >> Delete paths menu item. ?After doing a Store/Stop/Start/Open sequence, the block paths will be re-created. ?
A double cross-over can cause strange behavior. ?Signal mast logic may not find all of the routes and may create a route the turns 180? in the cross-over. ?The bad SML has to be deleted and the missing ones created manually.
The easiest method to find references is to search the xml file. ?The challenge is understanding the format of the file. ?Also, references are sometimes by system name and sometimes by user name.
Dave Sand
----- Original message -----
From: Scott Walton <jscottwalton@...>
Subject: [jmriusers] Some questions about signaling and the best way to debug the layout
Date: Saturday, February 01, 2020 8:45 AM
I've been building a Panel with the mainline for my railroad with quite a few signals on it and have several questions about how to debug the panel. I'd really like to know HOW to diagnose the problems, rather than have someone just fix the panel. The panel is located in the ProblemsBeingWorkedOn folder, under "Scott_Walton".
1. The ends of the layout still haven't been connected (it's an around the wall layout and I need to get my toolbox in and out still). What's the best way to place a signal at an "End Bumper" and set it to permanent Stop? How do you handle the Destination mast for a signal that doesn't have one?
2. I have named the blocks for the layout extension, but they don't have track yet. Is there a way to set a sensor to "Occupied" when it doesn't exist yet? (Short of putting a resistor across a block sensor and associating with the non-existent block?
3. I have phantom blocks. I know they don't exist, but when deleting them, Layout editor says they are in use in the panel. How do I find the object that uses them (either looking at the XML, or looking at the panel)?
4. Some of the signal masts find destination masts that seem to be far away (an example is "Sg_I34", which finds mast "Sg_I11", which should be several blocks away. So far the only way I've found is looking at "Block Routing" for several blocks and slowly narrowing down the bad block location by steadily reducing the Hop Count to the bad block. There has to be a better way! I wish there was a way to see the object names for the blocks, signals, turnouts and so forth, without selecting and editing each.
Scott Walton
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Re: Cannot connect a second time, Decoder Pro
Thank you for all your replies. Sadly, smartphones and Macs have spoiled me and my troubleshooting skills on PCs are meager. ?I use the PC strictly for running flight simulators which so far have run ok, not requiring troubleshooting. ? I found the log, used Device manager attempting to apply the advice received. ?No connection.
Given my humble/non-existant ability to troubleshoot the Windows connection issue, I've spent several hours today upgrading my Mac to Java 11 and trying to install the newest production version of JMRI/Decoder Pro. Another long story, don't want to try the patience of those tying to help by describing that connection battle other than to say I cannot get the Mac to connect to the PR3.?
I'm thinking my best option might be to get a new PR4, and try again on Windows? ?
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Thanks Klaus!? Lots of info here.? Downloaded Audacity and it appears to be just what I needed.? As to Loop Points being on the Audio Table input screen but unimplemented, well, I guess the developer must have expected to get around to it...- but I will add a note to the Audio Table help to save time of the next unsuspecting user.? And, as to interpreting the JavaDoc and programming a script to use "offsets," I'll leave that to another day...
Jerry
___________________________________
jerryg2003@...
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Re: Cannot connect a second time, Decoder Pro
Are you 'hot' connecting the Cable to the PR3 and the computer, i.e. with the computer already booted up are you connecting the serial cable? Some devices do function well when connected that way. Also if this is a USB connection into the computer are you using the same USB port and more importantly, ejecting the usb connection before unplugging the cable? Device drivers can get corrupted when the device is not ejected from windows or Mac OS. Typically the device will create a new port if you use a different USB port on the computer, or if the device was not ejected properly. This can create issues when the device tries to talk with the computer, 'am I port 1, am I port 3, am I port 4?', the computer is looking for a specific port, the device randomly grabs one and uses it. By ejecting the device you clear it's driver so it doesn't remember the wrong port.
Try reinstalling the device driver, if that doesn't correct delete the device from the computer in device manager and reinstall.?
P.S. Getting in a hurry once and not properly ejecting a USB thumbdrive cost me my entire Decoderpro backup data, along with several hundred pictures.?
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Some questions about signaling and the best way to debug the layout
I've been building a Panel with the mainline for my railroad with quite a few signals on it and have several questions about how to debug the panel. I'd really like to know HOW to diagnose the problems, rather than have someone just fix the panel. The panel is located in the ProblemsBeingWorkedOn folder, under "Scott_Walton".
1. The ends of the layout still haven't been connected (it's an around the wall layout and I need to get my toolbox in and out still). What's the best way to place a signal at an "End Bumper" and set it to permanent Stop? How do you handle the Destination mast for a signal that doesn't have one?
2. I have named the blocks for the layout extension, but they don't have track yet. Is there a way to set a sensor to "Occupied" when it doesn't exist yet? (Short of putting a resistor across a block sensor and associating with the non-existent block?
3. I have phantom blocks. I know they don't exist, but when deleting them, Layout editor says they are in use in the panel. How do I find the object that uses them (either looking at the XML, or looking at the panel)?
4. Some of the signal masts find destination masts that seem to be far away (an example is "Sg_I34", which finds mast "Sg_I11", which should be several blocks away. So far the only way I've found is looking at "Block Routing" for several blocks and slowly narrowing down the bad block location by steadily reducing the Hop Count to the bad block. There has to be a better way! I wish there was a way to see the object names for the blocks, signals, turnouts and so forth, without selecting and editing each.
Scott Walton
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Re: CATS: Where is new CATS Group? Was Moving objects on the designer panel
#cats
AFAIK, there is still the CATS group on Yahoo. It didn't make the move that
I remember.
-Ken Cameron, Member JMRI Dev Team
www.jmri.org
www.fingerlakeslivesteamers.org
www.cnymod.org
www.syracusemodelrr.org
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George Warner
Bob Jacobsen
Larry Sebelley
Ken Cameron