Re: 36" Moak bandsaw for sale
Randy texted me that link earlier. ?I am about to get a vintage bandsaw, but if not for that, I would find this of major interest if it runs as good as it looks. ?This is his website
I saw this also
According to the audio of his shop tour, he is in a space where the building just sold and the new owner wants the space, and so he needs to vacate with 3 weeks notice and has to downsize. ?That seems terrible. ?He was saying that it will be hard to find a space with 3 phase. ?I called him and suggested he think about a Phase Perfect and to consider coming to the FOG to get better advice than I am able to give.
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36" Moak bandsaw for sale
Saw this on Instagram for a Moak 36" restored bandsaw.in case anyone is interested..
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Re: Felder Silent Power Dado 6.3-20mm
#forsale
David, thank you so much!!! ?Your knowledge is so profound, it saves many of us tons of time and expense!
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On May 20, 2023, at 5:39 PM, Jacques Gagnon <jacques.gagnon309@...> wrote:
David,
Thanks for this excellent explanation. It is really helpful to understand the ? less obvious ? parameters at play when looking at tooling.?
Regards,
Jacques
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Re: KF700S assembly warning stickers
Welcome Matt,
I’m also in Washington, In the Milton area. ?Never heard of Pomeroy, had to look that one up. ?Your way down in the corner of the state. ??? Enjoy your new machine.
I have a 2021 K700S, and my new AD941 is headed to terminal in Portland, OR for me to pick up next week.
Wade
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On May 20, 2023, at 7:01 PM, fiftyeight180@... wrote:
?Hello All, I am new to the group and have started assembly/set-up of my KF700S with electronic motor movements. The first sticker I figured out - the one showing to remove the two 8mm bolts before tilting the blade. I also found that answer in the group messages.? A photo of the two identical stickers that I haven't figured out is attached and I assume someone can save me a call to Felder Tech...  The saw and 10' slider arrived undamaged (from shipping at least) and I was able to install the slider with the help of a lifting cart. However, the slider is consistently below the surface of the cast table at the shaper end...so more work to do there. Thanks, Matt Hanson Pomeroy, WA
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KF700S assembly warning stickers
Hello All, I am new to the group and have started assembly/set-up of my KF700S with electronic motor movements. The first sticker I figured out - the one showing to remove the two 8mm bolts before tilting the blade. I also found that answer in the group messages.? A photo of the two identical stickers that I haven't figured out is attached and I assume someone can save me a call to Felder Tech...  The saw and 10' slider arrived undamaged (from shipping at least) and I was able to install the slider with the help of a lifting cart. However, the slider is consistently below the surface of the cast table at the shaper end...so more work to do there. Thanks, Matt Hanson Pomeroy, WA
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Re: Felder Silent Power Dado 6.3-20mm
#forsale
David,
Thanks for this excellent explanation. It is really helpful to understand the ? less obvious ? parameters at play when looking at tooling.?
Regards,
Jacques
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Brandon,
I would never give up my router table even though I have a Profil 45 shaper. ?For simple operations, the router table is far quicker to set up. ?However, part of its simplicity is that it’s not part of the shaper. ?A router spindle for the shaper sounds on par with a shaper cutter in terms of setup time and fussing around. I do like the convenience of having the router table set up for edge-easing, leaving the shaper set up for more complex profile operations.
That said, if you wanted a round-over cutter for the shaper, Whitehill makes an indexable stepped cutter with 2-6mm radii, but check the cavity depth of your shaper to ensure this cutter will fully lower into the spindle hole:
I have a Freud Industrial round-over indexable shaper cutter that I just love. ?According to the Freud Industrial catalog it is still available. ?You can download their catalog here: ?
The cutter I have is the TP31M - it will cut 8-17.5mm radius concave or convex profiles for edging work. ?It’s a 160mm diameter cutter with a 35mm arbor hole that I have a dedicated top-hat bushing pair to shim it down to 30mm. ?The inserts are HSS and easily sharpened, duplicated or made into other radii at a good sharpening shop.
Here are some photos:
David Best
DBestWorkshop@...
https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidpbest/collections/
https://www.youtube.com/@David_Best
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On May 20, 2023, at 3:45 PM, Brandon Nickel <brandon.nickel@...> wrote:
Ok, time to tap the group knowledge. I've got a Felder KF700, 1.25" spindle that I acquired but haven't used the shaper yet.
I recently attended Alpine Workshop with a few great new friends. It was a great learning experience, but somehow I never got around to asking the following question, so here it goes:
I would like to use the shaper to replace my existing router table, mostly to regain that floor space. I could spend $1k to buy the high speed router spindle, but that seems pretty drastic, especially given the disadvantages of bits vs cutters.?
If you had to choose between spending $1k on a high speed spindle or putting that money towards cutters that do similar jobs, what would you choose? Most of my router bits are pretty standard round overs and beads. My shaper came with cope and stick, panel-raising, and chamfer cutters, so I have already "replaced" those.
Looking at Amana's carbide-tipped cutters, I could buy their whole line of round overs and rub collars for under $1k. Or would insert cutters be better? If so, which head and cutters do you recommend?
I got to use the asking Rangate products at Alpine Workshop, but I'm not sure that $2k for their multi purpose cutter is the most cost effective choice for a hobbyist workshop. But, I'm open to suggestions.
Thanks,
Brandon
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I have KF700sp in my double car garage, space is tight, but I will not get rid of my router table.?
The changeover on KF700sp just takes TOO MUCH time, it is a real pain. I love the shaper, but absolutely hate the changeover.
I am a hobbyist, cannot image KF as a only saw/shaper machine in a professional workshop.
James
Ok, time to tap the group knowledge. I've got a Felder KF700, 1.25" spindle that I acquired but haven't used the shaper yet.
I recently attended Alpine Workshop with a few great new friends. It was a great learning experience, but somehow I never got around to asking the following question, so here it goes:
I would like to use the shaper to replace my existing router table, mostly to regain that floor space. I could spend $1k to buy the high speed router spindle, but that seems pretty drastic, especially given the disadvantages of bits vs cutters.?
If you had to choose between spending $1k on a high speed spindle or putting that money towards cutters that do similar jobs, what would you choose? Most of my router bits are pretty standard round overs and beads. My shaper came with cope and stick, panel-raising, and chamfer cutters, so I have already "replaced" those.
Looking at Amana's carbide-tipped cutters, I could buy their whole line of round overs and rub collars for under $1k. Or would insert cutters be better? If so, which head and cutters do you recommend?
I got to use the asking Rangate products at Alpine Workshop, but I'm not sure that $2k for their multi purpose cutter is the most cost effective choice for a hobbyist workshop. But, I'm open to suggestions.
Thanks,
Brandon
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Re: Felder Silent Power Dado 6.3-20mm
#forsale
Mike, there are lots of other adjustable groovers similar to the Felder dado cutter. ?However, they are geared for use on a shaper or tenoning machine, and thus are designed with different constraints in mind. ?One example might be the Whitehill 10-19mm adjustable groover you can find here for about US$300 plus shipping: ?
It’s available with a 30mm bore, in various groove cutting min/max widths:
Like a lot of other indexable groovers, this one is 160mm, sized so that it can project to maximum depth of cut (“Tmax”) through the window on a smaller shaper hood. ?When installed on on a K700, the maximum depth of cut will be limited. ?The K700 has a max depth of cut of 104mm with a 315mm blade, which would put a 160mm cutter at ~26mm above the top of the machine when fully elevated. ?That cutting depth may be further restricted by the Tmax dimension of the Whitehill grover (see photo above) which they don’t specify.
However, ?the real issue with these types of cutters is the thickness of the hub as shown below. ?This particular cutter appears to have a hub that is significantly thicker than the cutting blade itself:
The arbor length on the K700 saw is limited, and the Felder dado cutter is specifically designed with minimal thickness hubs so that even when fully spaced apart, the cutter still fits on the saw arbor with the end-cap engaged. ? The hub thickness of the Felder 12-20mm dado cutter is 15.4mm with no shims installed, so at it’s maximum groove cutting spec of 20mm, the hub thickness grows to 23.4mm. ?So before looking at other adjustable width groovers, consider the ~23.4mm hub thickness as the limit of what your saw arbor can tolerate. ?There ?may be other impingements with the sliding table or cast iron top depending on the hub configuration of the cutter you’re considering. ?See below:
Of course, Whitehill isn’t the only adjustable groover manufacturer. ? Rangate makes adjustable groovers in 160 and 225mm diameters, but the groove widths achievable with them aren’t ideal for use on dado cutting for conventional 3/4” or 18mm thick plywood. ?Amana makes adjustable groovers also, but the groove width range isn’t ideal. ?And of course, there is the hub thickness issue to figure out.
Hope this helps.
David Best
DBestWorkshop@...
https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidpbest/collections/
https://www.youtube.com/@David_Best
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On May 20, 2023, at 2:19 PM, habacomike via groups.io <habacomike@...> wrote:
A FOG member reached out with an offer to sell his 6.4mm-12mm dado and we’ve reached agreement on that. ?If anyone has a 12-20mm they’d like to sell, let me know.
I’ve been searching for adjustable grooving cutters for circular saws, but the only thing that I find is the Felder tool. ?Doesn’t anyone else make or sell it? ?It seems strange to me as I am under the impression that almost all (or is it all?) of Felder’s shaper cutters are made by others.
Mike On May 19, 2023, at 7:58 PM, habacomike via groups.io <habacomike@...> wrote:
Btw, if successful in identifying and procuring said adjustable groover for circular saws, a Forrest dado stack will be available…. 8”
Mike On May 19, 2023, at 7:56 PM, habacomike via groups.io <habacomike@...> wrote:
Primarily for cutting grooves (dados) in solid stock for furniture work. ?My spouse is looking for an anniversary present for me. ?The Forrest stack is ok, but the adjustability of the width of the groove is a pain in the ass. ?I have adjustable groovers for the shaper on CF741. ?I want to be able to set my dado up like David Best! ?Budget is less that 1.2k. ?I’d hoped to buy the groover that was listed above but no luck for a deal…
Mike On May 19, 2023, at 7:41 PM, David P. Best <dbestworkshop@...> wrote:
Mike, Can you comment a bit on your budget for the groover and your intended ?application? ?That would help narrow the alternatives. David Best
DBestWorkshop@...
https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidpbest/collections/
https://www.youtube.com/@David_Best
On May 19, 2023, at 6:37 PM, habacomike via groups.io <habacomike@...> wrote:
Thanks everyone. ?I have a Forrest dado stack; what I want is an adjustable groover for the saw. ?Any options other than Felder?
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Ok, time to tap the group knowledge. I've got a Felder KF700, 1.25" spindle that I acquired but haven't used the shaper yet.
I recently attended Alpine Workshop with a few great new friends. It was a great learning experience, but somehow I never got around to asking the following question, so here it goes:
I would like to use the shaper to replace my existing router table, mostly to regain that floor space. I could spend $1k to buy the high speed router spindle, but that seems pretty drastic, especially given the disadvantages of bits vs cutters.?
If you had to choose between spending $1k on a high speed spindle or putting that money towards cutters that do similar jobs, what would you choose? Most of my router bits are pretty standard round overs and beads. My shaper came with cope and stick, panel-raising, and chamfer cutters, so I have already "replaced" those.
Looking at Amana's carbide-tipped cutters, I could buy their whole line of round overs and rub collars for under $1k. Or would insert cutters be better? If so, which head and cutters do you recommend?
I got to use the asking Rangate products at Alpine Workshop, but I'm not sure that $2k for their multi purpose cutter is the most cost effective choice for a hobbyist workshop. But, I'm open to suggestions.
Thanks,
Brandon
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Re: A3-31 setup and calibration
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Re: Felder Silent Power Dado 6.3-20mm
#forsale
A FOG member reached out with an offer to sell his 6.4mm-12mm dado and we’ve reached agreement on that. ?If anyone has a 12-20mm they’d like to sell, let me know.
I’ve been searching for adjustable grooving cutters for circular saws, but the only thing that I find is the Felder tool. ?Doesn’t anyone else make or sell it? ?It seems strange to me as I am under the impression that almost all (or is it all?) of Felder’s shaper cutters are made by others.
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On May 19, 2023, at 7:58 PM, habacomike via groups.io <habacomike@...> wrote:
Btw, if successful in identifying and procuring said adjustable groover for circular saws, a Forrest dado stack will be available…. 8”
Mike On May 19, 2023, at 7:56 PM, habacomike via groups.io <habacomike@...> wrote:
Primarily for cutting grooves (dados) in solid stock for furniture work. ?My spouse is looking for an anniversary present for me. ?The Forrest stack is ok, but the adjustability of the width of the groove is a pain in the ass. ?I have adjustable groovers for the shaper on CF741. ?I want to be able to set my dado up like David Best! ?Budget is less that 1.2k. ?I’d hoped to buy the groover that was listed above but no luck for a deal…
Mike On May 19, 2023, at 7:41 PM, David P. Best <dbestworkshop@...> wrote:
Mike, Can you comment a bit on your budget for the groover and your intended ?application? ?That would help narrow the alternatives. David Best
DBestWorkshop@...
https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidpbest/collections/
https://www.youtube.com/@David_Best
On May 19, 2023, at 6:37 PM, habacomike via groups.io <habacomike@...> wrote:
Thanks everyone. ?I have a Forrest dado stack; what I want is an adjustable groover for the saw. ?Any options other than Felder?
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Re: A3-31 setup and calibration
I’m not disagreeing with the measurement amounts. The issue is that if the OP tilts his outfeed table to get the right height to the cutterhead, he can run out of up and down adjustment on the infeed side. If this was a combo machine, you would set the outfeed table to be parallel to the saw table, but on a stand alone j/p you can really mess things up if you don’t keep the outfeed in the right plane.
Brian Lamb
blamb11@...
www.lambtoolworks.com
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On May 20, 2023, at 7:19 AM, mac campshure via groups.io <mac512002@...> wrote:
Brian I was trained to set the height of the cutter head 8/10 of mm below the table edge side to side within max .06 mm then set the knives cutting circle .03 mm above table edge. Mac,, Designing and building for 50 years On May 20, 2023, at 9:01 AM, Richard <rirving@...> wrote:
?.031” above the body of the cutterhead, the range called for in the setup guide is .026” - .038”, and getting it precise to a mark is difficult because of how everything adjusts - two bolts front side, two m6 studs on the hinge side.?
I am wondering if I did mess up level of the outfeed and didn’t realize it when making my adjustments. Will check this am.?
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Re: A3-31 setup and calibration
Brian I was trained to set the height of the cutter head 8/10 of mm below the table edge side to side within max .06 mm then set the knives cutting circle .03 mm above table edge. Mac,, Designing and building for 50 years
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On May 20, 2023, at 9:01 AM, Richard <rirving@...> wrote:
?.031” above the body of the cutterhead, the range called for in the setup guide is .026” - .038”, and getting it precise to a mark is difficult because of how everything adjusts - two bolts front side, two m6 studs on the hinge side.?
I am wondering if I did mess up level of the outfeed and didn’t realize it when making my adjustments. Will check this am.?
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Re: A3-31 setup and calibration
.031” above the body of the cutterhead, the range called for in the setup guide is .026” - .038”, and getting it precise to a mark is difficult because of how everything adjusts - two bolts front side, two m6 studs on the hinge side.?
I am wondering if I did mess up level of the outfeed and didn’t realize it when making my adjustments. Will check this am.?
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Re: A3-31 setup and calibration
Wouldn’t it be too low in this case if I have to set the tables to near the lower end of their travel to achieve proper distance between cutterhead and tables??
Certainly possible, though I’m hoping there’s a geometry issue with the tables that I’ve overlooked since those adjustments are much easier. :-)?
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Re: A3-31 setup and calibration
.031" above the body of the cutterhead, or the height of the blades? How. Did you adjust the outfeed table? If you didn’t keep it level as you adjusted it, then tipping the plane of the table could easily put you out of range on the adjustment of the infeed table.
Brian Lamb
blamb11@...
www.lambtoolworks.com
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On May 19, 2023, at 9:12 PM, Richard <rirving@...> wrote:
So I’ve gotten the outfeed leveled and set .031” above the cutterhead. The problem when I do that is the infeed loses the majority of its travel and now has a height adjustment of only 0 - .09”. Beyond that the height adjustment bottoms out at the end of its travel. I’m sure there’s something I screwed up adjusting the outfeed but I haven’t figured it out yet.?
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Re: A3-31 setup and calibration
I’m talking whole cutter head not table to head Designing and building for 50 years
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On May 20, 2023, at 8:12 AM, mac campshure <mac512002@...> wrote:
? Maybe the cutterhead assembly is too high??? Mac,, Designing and building for 50 years On May 19, 2023, at 11:12 PM, Richard <rirving@...> wrote:
?So I’ve gotten the outfeed leveled and set .031” above the cutterhead. The problem when I do that is the infeed loses the majority of its travel and now has a height adjustment of only 0 - .09”. Beyond that the height adjustment bottoms out at the end of its travel. I’m sure there’s something I screwed up adjusting the outfeed but I haven’t figured it out yet.?
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Re: A3-31 setup and calibration
Maybe the cutterhead assembly is too high??? Mac,, Designing and building for 50 years
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On May 19, 2023, at 11:12 PM, Richard <rirving@...> wrote:
?So I’ve gotten the outfeed leveled and set .031” above the cutterhead. The problem when I do that is the infeed loses the majority of its travel and now has a height adjustment of only 0 - .09”. Beyond that the height adjustment bottoms out at the end of its travel. I’m sure there’s something I screwed up adjusting the outfeed but I haven’t figured it out yet.?
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Re: Electronic brake C3 31
Hi Nathan,
I sent you a private msg.
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On May 20, 2023, at 2:13 AM, Nathan D'Elboux <nathan.delboux@...> wrote: ?Hi all, I used to own a 2012 model hammer c31 combo unit and I remember the electric motor of the table saw used to applying an electronic break buzzing sound to slow the blade to a complete stop, as my n4400 bandsaw currently has as well. ?I no longer own that 2012 model, my current model is a 2016 and everything else is the same but the table saw doesn’t apply an electric brake when I turn it off. The helical head and router spindle does but the tablesaw slows down eventually there’s no buzzing sound
do others find the same? Is it supposed to have one consistently across the range of products and I should be raising it as a fault with Felder directly or it’s not common across all hammer motors?
I just thought it would have one given an older saw used to but this is not the case
thanks for any advice
Nathan?
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David P. Best
imran