Hi Michael,
I have to agree with everything your wrote, particularly this:
If you ram in the packing it is already compressed and can not be loosened effectively, thus causing problems of heat and too much friction.听
Which is why the 3/16" packing seemed to work better for me than the 1/4" stuff I had to jam in there.听 Not all stuffing boxes are created equally.听 3/16" just worked better for me and my old bronze stuffing box. YMMV.
Best,
Caleb D.
T27 #328
-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Connolly <crufone@...>
To: [email protected]; jeremy@...
Sent: Fri, Nov 13, 2020 11:15 am
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
Jeremy, Caleb, Patrick,
Caleb, the stuffing should press into the cavity around the shaft with little to no pressure. The ends of the cavity and nut should be tapered.听 As the nut is drawn up the packing compresses and pushes against the outside of the cavity and the shaft as well.听 This is what causes the seal.听 If you ram in the packing it is already compressed and can not be loosened effectively, thus causing problems of heat and too much friction.听 You can also purchase rope packing and wind it loosely around the shaft inside the cavity until it is full, carefully pushing it into the cavity as you go. Run the nut in and then back off the nut so you can place more into the cavity.听 Fill it until you can get the nut on perhaps two threads.听 Then you are good to go.听 Tightening the gland nut puts tremendous pressure on the packing creating the seal.
Jeremy, when you purchase a new box off the shelf it very well may be different than what was it you boat originally, even for the same shaft size.听 The T-27 as well as the Alberg 30 were standard production boats and they vary from one to another depending what was on hand at the time of their build.听 Builders bought stuffing boxes in quantity.听 When that supply ran out they bought whatever was at the best price at that time.听
Patrick, the clamps pictured in the link for the stuffing box Jeremy bought are exactly the type of clamps you should be using on the hose. They make a set of packing removal tools.听 They have a flexible shaft with a cork screw type working end and a "T" handle to turn them into the packing.
Best to you all,
Michael
听
On 11/12/2020 9:30 PM jeremy@... wrote:
Caleb,
3/16" packing is what you want to go with your 1" shaft and stuffing box.听 1/4" is too tight (don't ask me how I know this).
Alas. I am going to ask. I have repacked my stuffing box twice -- once in the water, and again when I replaced the entire stuffing box with a brand new one. According to the manufacturers website, the new stuffing box I am using does require 1/4" stuffing. However, I feel like packing the new glad was much harder than when I did it the first time. However, I have no records as to what size I used for the first time. (But, then I got smart and started keeping records, which is how I know I used 1/4" the second time).
Since the second time was with a new shaft and a new stuffing box, I wondered if the difference was that I used a different size packing material, or if it was just that everything was new.
I have not relaunched since I repacked, so I can not report on how it works in practice.
Here is my data saying that 1/4" is the 'official recommendation':
I can see you have been recommending the 3/16" over the 1/4" for at least 8 years,
I guess I am wondering if your recommendation has always been contrary to what the manufacturer recommends, or do I actually have a slightly different setup?
Given that I just paid for a new prop shaft, I am inclined to re-repack with the 3/16" and only re-re-repack with 1/4" if it seems to be dripping too much.
- jeremy
|
Jeremy, Caleb, Patrick,
Caleb, the stuffing should press into the cavity around the shaft with little to no pressure. The ends of the cavity and nut should be tapered.听 As the nut is drawn up the packing compresses and pushes against the outside of the cavity and the shaft as well.听 This is what causes the seal.听 If you ram in the packing it is already compressed and can not be loosened effectively, thus causing problems of heat and too much friction.听 You can also purchase rope packing and wind it loosely around the shaft inside the cavity until it is full, carefully pushing it into the cavity as you go. Run the nut in and then back off the nut so you can place more into the cavity.听 Fill it until you can get the nut on perhaps two threads.听 Then you are good to go.听 Tightening the gland nut puts tremendous pressure on the packing creating the seal.
Jeremy, when you purchase a new box off the shelf it very well may be different than what was it you boat originally, even for the same shaft size.听 The T-27 as well as the Alberg 30 were standard production boats and they vary from one to another depending what was on hand at the time of their build.听 Builders bought stuffing boxes in quantity.听 When that supply ran out they bought whatever was at the best price at that time.听
Patrick, the clamps pictured in the link for the stuffing box Jeremy bought are exactly the type of clamps you should be using on the hose. They make a set of packing removal tools.听 They have a flexible shaft with a cork screw type working end and a "T" handle to turn them into the packing.
Best to you all,
Michael
听
On 11/12/2020 9:30 PM jeremy@... wrote:
Caleb,
3/16" packing is what you want to go with your 1" shaft and stuffing box.听 1/4" is too tight (don't ask me how I know this).
Alas. I am going to ask. I have repacked my stuffing box twice -- once in the water, and again when I replaced the entire stuffing box with a brand new one. According to the manufacturers website, the new stuffing box I am using does require 1/4" stuffing. However, I feel like packing the new glad was much harder than when I did it the first time. However, I have no records as to what size I used for the first time. (But, then I got smart and started keeping records, which is how I know I used 1/4" the second time).
Since the second time was with a new shaft and a new stuffing box, I wondered if the difference was that I used a different size packing material, or if it was just that everything was new.
I have not relaunched since I repacked, so I can not report on how it works in practice.
Here is my data saying that 1/4" is the 'official recommendation':
I can see you have been recommending the 3/16" over the 1/4" for at least 8 years,
I guess I am wondering if your recommendation has always been contrary to what the manufacturer recommends, or do I actually have a slightly different setup?
Given that I just paid for a new prop shaft, I am inclined to re-repack with the 3/16" and only re-re-repack with 1/4" if it seems to be dripping too much.
- jeremy
|
Jeremy,
Re-reading your message it struck me that the main reason I went with the size below 1/4" was that it was quite difficult to work that packing into the nut and I reasoned that if it was tight it would create friction, heat and resistance to the shaft spinning.
3/16" worked well for me.
Best,
Caleb
T27 #328
-----Original Message-----
From: jeremy@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 9:30 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
Caleb,
3/16" packing is what you want to go with your 1" shaft and stuffing box.听 1/4" is too tight (don't ask me how I know this).
Alas. I am going to ask. I have repacked my stuffing box twice -- once in the water, and again when I replaced the entire stuffing box with a brand new one. According to the manufacturers website, the new stuffing box I am using does require 1/4" stuffing. However, I feel like packing the new glad was much harder than when I did it the first time. However, I have no records as to what size I used for the first time. (But, then I got smart and started keeping records, which is how I know I used 1/4" the second time).
Since the second time was with a new shaft and a new stuffing box, I wondered if the difference was that I used a different size packing material, or if it was just that everything was new.
I have not relaunched since I repacked, so I can not report on how it works in practice.
Here is my data saying that 1/4" is the 'official recommendation':
I can see you have been recommending the 3/16" over the 1/4" for at least 8 years,
I guess I am wondering if your recommendation has always been contrary to what the manufacturer recommends, or do I actually have a slightly different setup?
Given that I just paid for a new prop shaft, I am inclined to re-repack with the 3/16" and only re-re-repack with 1/4" if it seems to be dripping too much.
|
Jeremy,
Thanks for that.听 I will have to respond with what I think I remember about what I think I learned back then.
We had just replaced the cutlass bearing, drive shaft, stuffing box, hose clamps etc and I am pretty sure I put 1/4" packing in my packing gland while my boat was on the hard and I couldn't test it out properly.听 Maybe I didn't clean out the packing nut well enough but I found it difficult to insert the 1/4" packing into the nut but I eventually succeeded.听 After tightening the stuffing box and running the engine (once back in the water) for a bit I discovered that the stuffing box was starting to get a bit warm and it felt to me like the engine was fighting the pressure on the shaft created in the stuffing box.听 I am sure I tried to adjust it but found that it was either too tight or dripping too much if loosened.听 Too much torque on the shaft log hose can help cause it to give up the ghost as well.听
I reasoned that the stuffing is meant to be compressed in the stuffing nut which would cause it to expand slightly but at the same time allow some water through.听 I also didn't like the idea of friction creating heat in the stuffing box.听 My current working ASSUMPTION is that the O.D. of the stuffing box packing is in fact 1/4", but when you tighten down a few threads on the 3/16" packing it sneaks right up on 1/4".听 It solved my "stuffing box getting hot" problem and the engine seemed to run with less strain.
Part of the MaineSail (MarineHowTo) page on stuffing boxes does mention how heat from friction here could potentially get quite hot (300f) if water were unable to get through it as the cooling/lubricating substance it is intended to be.听 I have not heard of this happening on a T27 but I do think of the stuffing box as a fairly delicate assembly made of incredibly strong parts (bronze, graphite ...) with the weak part being the rubber hose (which probably has closer to a 20 year maintenance cycle) while I am certain that my stuffing box (bronze) was about 45 years old when I re-used it.
Just my experience and $.02.听 Your mileage may vary (ymmv).
Best,
Caleb D.
T27 #328
-----Original Message-----
From: jeremy@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 9:30 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
Caleb,
3/16" packing is what you want to go with your 1" shaft and stuffing box.听 1/4" is too tight (don't ask me how I know this).
Alas. I am going to ask. I have repacked my stuffing box twice -- once in the water, and again when I replaced the entire stuffing box with a brand new one. According to the manufacturers website, the new stuffing box I am using does require 1/4" stuffing. However, I feel like packing the new glad was much harder than when I did it the first time. However, I have no records as to what size I used for the first time. (But, then I got smart and started keeping records, which is how I know I used 1/4" the second time).
Since the second time was with a new shaft and a new stuffing box, I wondered if the difference was that I used a different size packing material, or if it was just that everything was new.
I have not relaunched since I repacked, so I can not report on how it works in practice.
Here is my data saying that 1/4" is the 'official recommendation':
I can see you have been recommending the 3/16" over the 1/4" for at least 8 years,
I guess I am wondering if your recommendation has always been contrary to what the manufacturer recommends, or do I actually have a slightly different setup?
Given that I just paid for a new prop shaft, I am inclined to re-repack with the 3/16" and only re-re-repack with 1/4" if it seems to be dripping too much.
|
Caleb,
3/16" packing is what you want to go with your 1" shaft and stuffing box.听 1/4" is too tight (don't ask me how I know this).
Alas. I am going to ask. I have repacked my stuffing box twice -- once in the water, and again when I replaced the entire stuffing box with a brand new one. According to the manufacturers website, the new stuffing box I am using does require 1/4" stuffing. However, I feel like packing the new glad was much harder than when I did it the first time. However, I have no records as to what size I used for the first time. (But, then I got smart and started keeping records, which is how I know I used 1/4" the second time).
Since the second time was with a new shaft and a new stuffing box, I wondered if the difference was that I used a different size packing material, or if it was just that everything was new.
I have not relaunched since I repacked, so I can not report on how it works in practice.
Here is my data saying that 1/4" is the 'official recommendation':
I can see you have been recommending the 3/16" over the 1/4" for at least 8 years,
I guess I am wondering if your recommendation has always been contrary to what the manufacturer recommends, or do I actually have a slightly different setup?
Given that I just paid for a new prop shaft, I am inclined to re-repack with the 3/16" and only re-re-repack with 1/4" if it seems to be dripping too much.
- jeremy
|
Still down for video chat.
I've had to do very little of that thankfully but I can certainly
understand how people who do would be very tired of it.
-s
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 0, patrick.mcgough@... wrote: WOW this is a fantastic group!!!!! So awesome to have 11 emails in 4
hours for help!!!! Thank you all!!!! I had put out previously about
maybe doing a virtual meeting of this group just to talk, find out
where everyone sails, projects everyone is contemplating for the
off-season, and just a break. I know like many I have maybe reached a
virtual meeting overload, but I would love to throw it out there if
people think they would be interested.
So I went out and doused the nuts with PB Blaster, the article is read,
three questions:
* So the packing comes in a lot of different diameters...1/4, 1/8,
3/16, 3/8, 5/16, 5/8, 7/16....what size would I want?
* Going to go with the Duramax Ultra-X, I think unless someone thinks
more highly of another brand...what brand do you all use?
* The set I saw had 1 7/8, 2 �, 2, 2 �, and 2 3/4...the one link for
Catalina direct was for 1 7/8 on a 1" shaft...is that the standard
for the T27?
Thanks for all the help and guidance!!!! The article is a great
resource Caleb!!!!!!
Patrick
From: John Bailey <john.bailey50@...>
Sent: Thursday, November 12, 2020 7:04 PM
To: [email protected]
Cc: patrick.mcgough@...
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
I have had great luck with a non drip packing. The brand
is [1]
I have run the engine for 4 straight hours and could still touch the
bronze. Only warm.
I did have to tighten the gland once after the prop got fouled on the
St. Lawrence.
Shook really bad and the gland started to drip fast.
I repaked after about 4 years as I wondered how long it could hold up
and what I pulled out was perfect!!
John Bailey
Kiltie T27 #226
On Thu, Nov 12, 2020 at 6:02 PM Michael Connolly
<[2]crufone@...> wrote:
Patrick,
Like I mentioned you can make the wrenches out of flat stock steel and
a hack saw. Bacon's might have used the size you need. !/8" flat
steel is thick enough.
Michael
On 11/12/2020 5:38 PM [3]patrick.mcgough@... wrote:
Caleb...what additionally did you need to do this while in the water?
Michael...I like the idea of working on this when she is high and
dry...the creek here off of Middle River here on the Chesapeake blows
out with just the right kind of winds. I just bought this house in
July so I am experiencing the winter new here on the water....Ice Eater
ordered for the cold but the high and dry has definitely been an
experience...
Article references shaft packing wrenches and on Amazon they run around
about $200....now I know BOAT stands for Bring On Another Thousand, but
do I really need special shaft packing wrenches?
From: [4][email protected] <[5][email protected]> On Behalf Of
Caleb Davison via [6]groups.io
Sent: Thursday, November 12, 2020 5:31 PM
To: [7][email protected]
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
I definitely recommend soaking the packing nut/locking nut in PB
Blaster for up to a week before you attempt to break them free. I
would not recommend using heat in this area especially if you have an
Atomic 4 and a gas tank right over this area.
I just reviewed this article and he has expanded it since I looked at
it. It is quite comprehensive in all respects. He mentions some of
the home made tools that can make this job go easier and even the
details of how you should cut the packing rings when adding new (there
is a best way and a not-so-best way).
[8]
It is a longer read than I remembered.
Best of luck.
Caleb
-----Original Message-----
From: [9]patrick.mcgough@...
To: [10][email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 5:04 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
I will definitely read that article, just wondering what additionally I
would need to keep water out of the boat if trying to do this in the
water.
I think if I remove the batteries on the starboard side I could
possibly get to this from in the cockpit. The two side panels that can
be removed just don't seem to be sized to be able to get any leverage.
Should these things be soaked in PB Blaster...guessing that heat near
that rubber gland marked 1 is not a good thing. What things other than
the packing material and wrenches help with this project? A breaker
bar or something for leverage?
Thank you all so far for the quick responses...
Patrick
From: [11][email protected] <[12][email protected]> On Behalf Of
Caleb Davison via [13]groups.io
Sent: Thursday, November 12, 2020 4:37 PM
To: [14][email protected]
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
The best on-line tutorial on Stuffing Boxes is
here: [15]
x/
Study it well before you attempt any boat yoga trying to access this
spot.
Scott spotted and noted the rustic looking hose clamps that should be
replaced (and yes, you need 2 for all under waterline applications).
I will add that it is probably time to replace the packing (that goes
into the stuffing box) as this is a maintenance/wear item that should
be replaced something like every 10 years, or sooner. I believe the
marinehowto page makes a reccommendation on which packing to use.
Interestingly they do not call it "stuffing" that goes into a "stuffing
box". It is more like you just put "stuff" in there that will wear
down over time while keeping your boat mostly dry.
I have done this a couple of times and it is not so difficult that it
can't be done with the boat in the water. You just need to plan ahead
so the job goes smoothly and quickly. If you replace the packing
material it may take some minor adjustments in the beginning to get the
# of drips to where you want it. You should be able to get it mostly
dry with the shaft not spinning and only a few drips per minute with
the shaft rotating.
Best of luck with this.
Caleb D.
T27 #328
-----Original Message-----
From: aksjghkajshd <[16]scott@...>
To: [17][email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 3:54 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
In the picture, 4 doesn't look like it's immediately next to a nut
but it looks like 2 in the most astern nut and 3 the slightly forward
one.
2 and 3 are currently screwed against each other. 3 is a "locknut".
Friction against 2 and against the threads keep it and 2 from moving.
So you'd back 3 off of 2 a bit, with a wrench on each, then tighten
2 a bit, then with two wrenches again, tighten 3 on to 2 while keeping
2 from moving.
It may be time to replace the stuffing in the stuffing box.
And that rusted stainless on the hose clamps is no good. Can you
replace
those, one at a time?
Hmm, someone else was just telling me about stuffing boxes a few
months back.
Water looks incredible.
And yup, not a fun position. I spent a lot of time cleaning up bilge
paint and rough fiberglass under the stern tube before laying up more
fiberglass, apparently due to cracking from the wrong size cutlass
bearings being hammered in creating a spiderweb of cracks.
Good luck!
-scott
On 0, [18]patrick.mcgough@... wrote:
> How appropriate to be talking about stuffing 2 weeks before
> Thanksgiving...oh wait a second....not the same type of
stuffing!!!!!
>
>
> I am looking for a little help here with my Tartan 27 and the
stuffing
> box and the packing and adjustments. I have my Tartan 27 right
out
> back on my pier so it is right here to monitor and keep an eye on,
and
> so I went out to start her up and run her for a bit and check on
the
> drip that is supposed to be 1-2 drops per minute is more like a
steady
> stream.
>
>
> It is a tight fit for my 250# girth sliding in along the engine
and so
> I want to make sure I get it right when I try and stop or slow
this
> drop.
>
> Here is a picture. The drop is coming from right around #4. Is
that
> where it is supposed to drip? What do I want to adjust and which
way
> do I want to adjust them in? I can go take more pictures and
video,
> but I thought labeling this picture might at least start a
discussion.
>
>
> Thank you in advance for any help you can provide. I am not in
risk of
> sinking as the water isn't that deep anyway...in the other picture
you
> can see how she was high and dry just a little bit ago...
>
>
> [cid:[19]image002.jpg@...]
> [cid:[20]image004.jpg@...]
>
>
> Patrick
>
>
>
References
1.
2. mailto:crufone@...
3. mailto:patrick.mcgough@...
4. mailto:[email protected]
5. mailto:[email protected]
6.
7. mailto:[email protected]
8.
9. mailto:patrick.mcgough@...
10. mailto:[email protected]
11. mailto:[email protected]
12. mailto:[email protected]
13.
14. mailto:[email protected]
15.
16. mailto:scott@...
17. mailto:[email protected]
18. mailto:patrick.mcgough@...
19. mailto:image002.jpg@...
20. mailto:image004.jpg@...
|
I think you will find large span wrenches used by听 plumbers for installing kitchen sink drains might work.听 they have worked for me.听 Need two, one for packing nut, other for lock nut.听 Be sure you do not put torque on the rubber tube...if old it may easily split...
Good Luck,
Jim
-----Original Message-----
From: John Bailey <john.bailey50@...>
To: [email protected]
Cc: patrick.mcgough@...
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 7:03 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
I have had great luck with a non drip packing. The听brand is听
I have run the engine for 4 straight hours and could still touch the bronze. Only warm.
I did have to tighten the gland once听after the prop got fouled听on the St. Lawrence.听
Shook really听bad and the gland started to drip fast.
I repaked after about 4 years as I wondered how long it could hold up and what I pulled out was perfect!!
John Bailey
Kiltie T27 #226
On Thu, Nov 12, 2020 at 6:02 PM Michael Connolly < crufone@...> wrote:
Patrick,
Like I mentioned you can make the wrenches out of flat stock steel and a hack saw.听 Bacon's might have used the size you need.听 !/8" flat steel is thick enough.
Michael
Caleb鈥hat additionally did you need to do this while in the water?
Michael鈥 like the idea of working on this when she is high and dry鈥he creek here off of Middle River here on the Chesapeake blows out with just the right kind of winds.听 I just bought this house in July so I am experiencing the winter new here on the water鈥�.Ice Eater ordered for the cold but the high and dry has definitely been an experience鈥�
Article references shaft packing wrenches and on Amazon they run around about $200鈥�.now I know BOAT stands for Bring On Another Thousand, but do I really need special shaft packing wrenches?
I definitely recommend soaking the packing nut/locking nut in PB Blaster for up to a week before you attempt to break them free.听 I would not recommend using heat in this area especially if you have an Atomic 4 and a gas tank right over this area.
I just reviewed this article and he has expanded it since I looked at it.听 It is quite comprehensive in all respects.听 He mentions some of the home made tools that can make this job go easier and even the details of how you should cut the packing rings when adding new (there is a best way and a not-so-best way).
It is a longer read than I remembered.
听
I will definitely read that article, just wondering what additionally I would need to keep water out of the boat if trying to do this in the water.
I think if I remove the batteries on the starboard side I could possibly get to this from in the cockpit.听 The two side panels that can be removed just don鈥檛 seem to be sized to be able to get any leverage.听 Should these things be soaked in PB Blaster鈥uessing that heat near that rubber gland marked 1 is not a good thing.听 What things other than the packing material and wrenches help with this project?听 A breaker bar or something for leverage?
Thank you all so far for the quick responses鈥�
The best on-line tutorial on Stuffing Boxes is here:听听
Study it well before you attempt any boat yoga trying to access this spot.
Scott spotted and noted the rustic looking hose clamps that should be replaced (and yes, you need 2 for all under waterline applications).听听
I will add that it is probably time to replace the packing (that goes into the stuffing box) as this is a maintenance/wear item that should be replaced something like every 10 years, or sooner.听 I believe the marinehowto page makes a reccommendation on which packing to use.听 Interestingly they do not call it "stuffing" that goes into a "stuffing box".听 It is more like you just put "stuff" in there that will wear down over time while keeping your boat mostly dry.听听
I have done this a couple of times and it is not so difficult that it can't be done with the boat in the water.听 You just need to plan ahead so the job goes smoothly and quickly.听 If you replace the packing material it may take some minor adjustments in the beginning to get the # of drips to where you want it.听 You should be able to get it mostly dry with the shaft not spinning and only a few drips per minute with the shaft rotating.
-----Original Message-----
From: aksjghkajshd <scott@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 3:54 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
In the picture, 4 doesn't look like it's immediately next to a nut
but it looks like 2 in the most astern nut and 3 the slightly forward
one.
2 and 3 are currently screwed against each other.听 3 is a "locknut".
Friction against 2 and against the threads keep it and 2 from moving.
So you'd back 3 off of 2 a bit, with a wrench on each, then tighten
2 a bit, then with two wrenches again, tighten 3 on to 2 while keeping
2 from moving.
It may be time to replace the stuffing in the stuffing box.
And that rusted stainless on the hose clamps is no good.听 Can you replace
those, one at a time?
Hmm, someone else was just telling me about stuffing boxes a few
months back.
Water looks incredible.
And yup, not a fun position.听 I spent a lot of time cleaning up bilge
paint and rough fiberglass under the stern tube before laying up more
fiberglass, apparently due to cracking from the wrong size cutlass
bearings being hammered in creating a spiderweb of cracks.
Good luck!
-scott
On听 0, patrick.mcgough@... wrote:
>听 听 How appropriate to be talking about stuffing 2 weeks before
>听 听 Thanksgiving...oh wait a second....not the same type of stuffing!!!!!
>
>
>听 听 I am looking for a little help here with my Tartan 27 and the stuffing
>听 听 box and the packing and adjustments.听 I have my Tartan 27 right out
>听 听 back on my pier so it is right here to monitor and keep an eye on, and
>听 听 so I went out to start her up and run her for a bit and check on the
>听 听 drip that is supposed to be 1-2 drops per minute is more like a steady
>听 听 stream.
>
>
>听 听 It is a tight fit for my 250# girth sliding in along the engine and so
>听 听 I want to make sure I get it right when I try and stop or slow this
>听 听 drop.
>
>听 听 Here is a picture.听 The drop is coming from right around #4.听 Is that
>听 听 where it is supposed to drip?听 What do I want to adjust and which way
>听 听 do I want to adjust them in?听 I can go take more pictures and video,
>听 听 but I thought labeling this picture might at least start a discussion.
>
>
>听 听 Thank you in advance for any help you can provide.听 I am not in risk of
>听 听 sinking as the water isn't that deep anyway...in the other picture you
>听 听 can see how she was high and dry just a little bit ago...
>
>
>听 听 [cid:image002.jpg@...]
>听 听 [cid:image004.jpg@...]
听
|
Patrick,
Yes, this is a great group of folks.听 Very helpful.听 So are the folks at Moyer Marine if you need Atomic 4 help and this group knows a pretty fair amount about the Atomic 4 as well.听 The folks from Moyer Marine are just across the Bay bridge on the eastern shore up the Chester River.听 Their forum has also been a great resource.
3/16" packing is what you want to go with your 1" shaft and stuffing box.听 1/4" is too tight (don't ask me how I know this).听
1-7/8" should also be standard for a 1" shaft stuffing box wrench, but don't take my word for it.
Best,
Caleb D.
T27 #328
-----Original Message-----
From: patrick.mcgough@...
To: 'John Bailey' <john.bailey50@...>; [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 7:37 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
WOW this is a fantastic group!!!!!听 So awesome to have 11 emails in 4 hours for help!!!!听 Thank you all!!!!听 I had put out previously about maybe doing a virtual meeting of this group just to talk, find out where everyone sails, projects everyone is contemplating for the off-season, and just a break.听 I know like many I have maybe reached a virtual meeting overload, but I would love to throw it out there if people think they would be interested.
听
So I went out and doused the nuts with PB Blaster, the article is read, three questions:
- So the packing comes in a lot of different diameters鈥�1/4, 1/8, 3/16, 3/8, 5/16, 5/8, 7/16鈥�.what size would I want?
- Going to go with the Duramax Ultra-X, I think unless someone thinks more highly of another brand鈥hat brand do you all use?
- The set I saw had 1 7/8, 2 录, 2, 2 陆, and 2 3/4鈥he one link for Catalina direct was for 1 7/8 on a 1鈥� shaft鈥s that the standard for the T27?
Thanks for all the help and guidance!!!!听 The article is a great resource Caleb!!!!!!
听
Patrick
听
From: John Bailey <john.bailey50@...> Sent: Thursday, November 12, 2020 7:04 PM To: [email protected]Cc: patrick.mcgough@... Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
听
I have had great luck with a non drip packing. The听brand is听
I have run the engine for 4 straight hours and could still touch the bronze. Only warm.
I did have to tighten the gland once听after the prop got fouled听on the St. Lawrence.听
Shook really听bad and the gland started to drip fast.
I repaked after about 4 years as I wondered how long it could hold up and what I pulled out was perfect!!
听
On Thu, Nov 12, 2020 at 6:02 PM Michael Connolly < crufone@...> wrote:
Like I mentioned you can make the wrenches out of flat stock steel and a hack saw.听 Bacon's might have used the size you need.听 !/8" flat steel is thick enough.
Caleb鈥hat additionally did you need to do this while in the water?
听
Michael鈥 like the idea of working on this when she is high and dry鈥he creek here off of Middle River here on the Chesapeake blows out with just the right kind of winds.听 I just bought this house in July so I am experiencing the winter new here on the water鈥�.Ice Eater ordered for the cold but the high and dry has definitely been an experience鈥�
听
Article references shaft packing wrenches and on Amazon they run around about $200鈥�.now I know BOAT stands for Bring On Another Thousand, but do I really need special shaft packing wrenches?
听
听
I definitely recommend soaking the packing nut/locking nut in PB Blaster for up to a week before you attempt to break them free.听 I would not recommend using heat in this area especially if you have an Atomic 4 and a gas tank right over this area.
I just reviewed this article and he has expanded it since I looked at it.听 It is quite comprehensive in all respects.听 He mentions some of the home made tools that can make this job go easier and even the details of how you should cut the packing rings when adding new (there is a best way and a not-so-best way).
It is a longer read than I remembered.
听
I will definitely read that article, just wondering what additionally I would need to keep water out of the boat if trying to do this in the water.
I think if I remove the batteries on the starboard side I could possibly get to this from in the cockpit.听 The two side panels that can be removed just don鈥檛 seem to be sized to be able to get any leverage.听 Should these things be soaked in PB Blaster鈥uessing that heat near that rubber gland marked 1 is not a good thing.听 What things other than the packing material and wrenches help with this project?听 A breaker bar or something for leverage?
Thank you all so far for the quick responses鈥�
The best on-line tutorial on Stuffing Boxes is here:听听
Study it well before you attempt any boat yoga trying to access this spot.
Scott spotted and noted the rustic looking hose clamps that should be replaced (and yes, you need 2 for all under waterline applications).听听
I will add that it is probably time to replace the packing (that goes into the stuffing box) as this is a maintenance/wear item that should be replaced something like every 10 years, or sooner.听 I believe the marinehowto page makes a reccommendation on which packing to use.听 Interestingly they do not call it "stuffing" that goes into a "stuffing box".听 It is more like you just put "stuff" in there that will wear down over time while keeping your boat mostly dry.听听
I have done this a couple of times and it is not so difficult that it can't be done with the boat in the water.听 You just need to plan ahead so the job goes smoothly and quickly.听 If you replace the packing material it may take some minor adjustments in the beginning to get the # of drips to where you want it.听 You should be able to get it mostly dry with the shaft not spinning and only a few drips per minute with the shaft rotating.
-----Original Message-----
From: aksjghkajshd <scott@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 3:54 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
In the picture, 4 doesn't look like it's immediately next to a nut
but it looks like 2 in the most astern nut and 3 the slightly forward
one.
2 and 3 are currently screwed against each other.听 3 is a "locknut".
Friction against 2 and against the threads keep it and 2 from moving.
So you'd back 3 off of 2 a bit, with a wrench on each, then tighten
2 a bit, then with two wrenches again, tighten 3 on to 2 while keeping
2 from moving.
It may be time to replace the stuffing in the stuffing box.
And that rusted stainless on the hose clamps is no good.听 Can you replace
those, one at a time?
Hmm, someone else was just telling me about stuffing boxes a few
months back.
Water looks incredible.
And yup, not a fun position.听 I spent a lot of time cleaning up bilge
paint and rough fiberglass under the stern tube before laying up more
fiberglass, apparently due to cracking from the wrong size cutlass
bearings being hammered in creating a spiderweb of cracks.
Good luck!
-scott
On听 0, patrick.mcgough@... wrote:
>听 听 How appropriate to be talking about stuffing 2 weeks before
>听 听 Thanksgiving...oh wait a second....not the same type of stuffing!!!!!
>
>
>听 听 I am looking for a little help here with my Tartan 27 and the stuffing
>听 听 box and the packing and adjustments.听 I have my Tartan 27 right out
>听 听 back on my pier so it is right here to monitor and keep an eye on, and
>听 听 so I went out to start her up and run her for a bit and check on the
>听 听 drip that is supposed to be 1-2 drops per minute is more like a steady
>听 听 stream.
>
>
>听 听 It is a tight fit for my 250# girth sliding in along the engine and so
>听 听 I want to make sure I get it right when I try and stop or slow this
>听 听 drop.
>
>听 听 Here is a picture.听 The drop is coming from right around #4.听 Is that
>听 听 where it is supposed to drip?听 What do I want to adjust and which way
>听 听 do I want to adjust them in?听 I can go take more pictures and video,
>听 听 but I thought labeling this picture might at least start a discussion.
>
>
>听 听 Thank you in advance for any help you can provide.听 I am not in risk of
>听 听 sinking as the water isn't that deep anyway...in the other picture you
>听 听 can see how she was high and dry just a little bit ago...
>
>
>听 听 [cid:image002.jpg@...]
>听 听 [cid:image004.jpg@...]
听
|
Patrick,
The issue with using adjustable/pipe wrenches is that they mess up the bronze nuts.听 The flat open-end wrenches are the way to go.听 After you clean up the bronze nut and lock nut you might find that it is too deteriorated听to reuse.
I stressed the over kill of cleaning all components thoroughly and installing new packing right from the start.听 In most cases like yours just trying to tighten the gland nut to attempt to compress the old packing is usually only a short fix if it is effect at all.
Once all is cleaned you can more accurately inspect for damaged goods. At this point you can measure the nuts to know what size wrenches to purchase or fabricate yourself. When all is lubricated and the packing replaced with a set of wrenches you can easily make adjustments in the future with confidence in the results.听 This is not the place to do a patch-up bandadge job.
Michael
On 11/12/2020 7:37 PM patrick.mcgough@... wrote:
WOW this is a fantastic group!!!!!听 So awesome to have 11 emails in 4 hours for help!!!!听 Thank you all!!!!听 I had put out previously about maybe doing a virtual meeting of this group just to talk, find out where everyone sails, projects everyone is contemplating for the off-season, and just a break.听 I know like many I have maybe reached a virtual meeting overload, but I would love to throw it out there if people think they would be interested.
So I went out and doused the nuts with PB Blaster, the article is read, three questions:
- So the packing comes in a lot of different diameters鈥�1/4, 1/8, 3/16, 3/8, 5/16, 5/8, 7/16鈥�.what size would I want?
- Going to go with the Duramax Ultra-X, I think unless someone thinks more highly of another brand鈥hat brand do you all use?
- The set I saw had 1 7/8, 2 录, 2, 2 陆, and 2 3/4鈥he one link for Catalina direct was for 1 7/8 on a 1鈥� shaft鈥s that the standard for the T27?
Thanks for all the help and guidance!!!!听 The article is a great resource Caleb!!!!!!
Patrick
From: John Bailey <john.bailey50@...>
Sent: Thursday, November 12, 2020 7:04 PM
To: [email protected]
Cc: patrick.mcgough@...
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
I have had great luck with a non drip packing. The听brand is听
I have run the engine for 4 straight hours and could still touch the bronze. Only warm.
I did have to tighten the gland once听after the prop got fouled听on the St. Lawrence.听
Shook really听bad and the gland started to drip fast.
I repaked after about 4 years as I wondered how long it could hold up and what I pulled out was perfect!!
On Thu, Nov 12, 2020 at 6:02 PM Michael Connolly <crufone@...> wrote:
Like I mentioned you can make the wrenches out of flat stock steel and a hack saw.听 Bacon's might have used the size you need.听 !/8" flat steel is thick enough.
Caleb鈥hat additionally did you need to do this while in the water?
Michael鈥 like the idea of working on this when she is high and dry鈥he creek here off of Middle River here on the Chesapeake blows out with just the right kind of winds.听 I just bought this house in July so I am experiencing the winter new here on the water鈥�.Ice Eater ordered for the cold but the high and dry has definitely been an experience鈥�
Article references shaft packing wrenches and on Amazon they run around about $200鈥�.now I know BOAT stands for Bring On Another Thousand, but do I really need special shaft packing wrenches?
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Caleb Davison via
Sent: Thursday, November 12, 2020 5:31 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
I definitely recommend soaking the packing nut/locking nut in PB Blaster for up to a week before you attempt to break them free.听 I would not recommend using heat in this area especially if you have an Atomic 4 and a gas tank right over this area.
I just reviewed this article and he has expanded it since I looked at it.听 It is quite comprehensive in all respects.听 He mentions some of the home made tools that can make this job go easier and even the details of how you should cut the packing rings when adding new (there is a best way and a not-so-best way).
It is a longer read than I remembered.
听
-----Original Message-----
From: patrick.mcgough@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 5:04 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
I will definitely read that article, just wondering what additionally I would need to keep water out of the boat if trying to do this in the water.
I think if I remove the batteries on the starboard side I could possibly get to this from in the cockpit.听 The two side panels that can be removed just don鈥檛 seem to be sized to be able to get any leverage.听 Should these things be soaked in PB Blaster鈥uessing that heat near that rubber gland marked 1 is not a good thing.听 What things other than the packing material and wrenches help with this project?听 A breaker bar or something for leverage?
Thank you all so far for the quick responses鈥�
The best on-line tutorial on Stuffing Boxes is here:听听
Study it well before you attempt any boat yoga trying to access this spot.
Scott spotted and noted the rustic looking hose clamps that should be replaced (and yes, you need 2 for all under waterline applications).听听
I will add that it is probably time to replace the packing (that goes into the stuffing box) as this is a maintenance/wear item that should be replaced something like every 10 years, or sooner.听 I believe the marinehowto page makes a reccommendation on which packing to use.听 Interestingly they do not call it "stuffing" that goes into a "stuffing box".听 It is more like you just put "stuff" in there that will wear down over time while keeping your boat mostly dry.听听
I have done this a couple of times and it is not so difficult that it can't be done with the boat in the water.听 You just need to plan ahead so the job goes smoothly and quickly.听 If you replace the packing material it may take some minor adjustments in the beginning to get the # of drips to where you want it.听 You should be able to get it mostly dry with the shaft not spinning and only a few drips per minute with the shaft rotating.
-----Original Message-----
From: aksjghkajshd <scott@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 3:54 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
In the picture, 4 doesn't look like it's immediately next to a nut
but it looks like 2 in the most astern nut and 3 the slightly forward
one.
2 and 3 are currently screwed against each other.听 3 is a "locknut".
Friction against 2 and against the threads keep it and 2 from moving.
So you'd back 3 off of 2 a bit, with a wrench on each, then tighten
2 a bit, then with two wrenches again, tighten 3 on to 2 while keeping
2 from moving.
It may be time to replace the stuffing in the stuffing box.
And that rusted stainless on the hose clamps is no good.听 Can you replace
those, one at a time?
Hmm, someone else was just telling me about stuffing boxes a few
months back.
Water looks incredible.
And yup, not a fun position.听 I spent a lot of time cleaning up bilge
paint and rough fiberglass under the stern tube before laying up more
fiberglass, apparently due to cracking from the wrong size cutlass
bearings being hammered in creating a spiderweb of cracks.
Good luck!
-scott
On听 0, patrick.mcgough@... wrote:
>听 听 How appropriate to be talking about stuffing 2 weeks before
>听 听 Thanksgiving...oh wait a second....not the same type of stuffing!!!!!
>
>
>听 听 I am looking for a little help here with my Tartan 27 and the stuffing
>听 听 box and the packing and adjustments.听 I have my Tartan 27 right out
>听 听 back on my pier so it is right here to monitor and keep an eye on, and
>听 听 so I went out to start her up and run her for a bit and check on the
>听 听 drip that is supposed to be 1-2 drops per minute is more like a steady
>听 听 stream.
>
>
>听 听 It is a tight fit for my 250# girth sliding in along the engine and so
>听 听 I want to make sure I get it right when I try and stop or slow this
>听 听 drop.
>
>听 听 Here is a picture.听 The drop is coming from right around #4.听 Is that
>听 听 where it is supposed to drip?听 What do I want to adjust and which way
>听 听 do I want to adjust them in?听 I can go take more pictures and video,
>听 听 but I thought labeling this picture might at least start a discussion.
>
>
>听 听 Thank you in advance for any help you can provide.听 I am not in risk of
>听 听 sinking as the water isn't that deep anyway...in the other picture you
>听 听 can see how she was high and dry just a little bit ago...
>
>
>听 听 [cid:image002.jpg@...]
>听 听 [cid:image004.jpg@...]
听
|
WOW this is a fantastic group!!!!!听 So awesome to have 11 emails in 4 hours for help!!!!听 Thank you all!!!!听 I had put out previously about maybe doing a virtual meeting of this group just to talk, find out where everyone sails, projects everyone is contemplating for the off-season, and just a break.听 I know like many I have maybe reached a virtual meeting overload, but I would love to throw it out there if people think they would be interested. 听 So I went out and doused the nuts with PB Blaster, the article is read, three questions: - So the packing comes in a lot of different diameters鈥�1/4, 1/8, 3/16, 3/8, 5/16, 5/8, 7/16鈥�.what size would I want?
- Going to go with the Duramax Ultra-X, I think unless someone thinks more highly of another brand鈥hat brand do you all use?
- The set I saw had 1 7/8, 2 录, 2, 2 陆, and 2 3/4鈥he one link for Catalina direct was for 1 7/8 on a 1鈥� shaft鈥s that the standard for the T27?
Thanks for all the help and guidance!!!!听 The article is a great resource Caleb!!!!!! 听 Patrick 听
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: John Bailey <john.bailey50@...>
Sent: Thursday, November 12, 2020 7:04 PM
To: [email protected]
Cc: patrick.mcgough@...
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box 听 I have had great luck with a non drip packing. The听brand is听 I have run the engine for 4 straight hours and could still touch the bronze. Only warm. I did have to tighten the gland once听after the prop got fouled听on the St. Lawrence.听 Shook really听bad and the gland started to drip fast. I repaked after about 4 years as I wondered how long it could hold up and what I pulled out was perfect!! 听 On Thu, Nov 12, 2020 at 6:02 PM Michael Connolly <crufone@...> wrote: Like I mentioned you can make the wrenches out of flat stock steel and a hack saw.听 Bacon's might have used the size you need.听 !/8" flat steel is thick enough. Caleb鈥hat additionally did you need to do this while in the water? 听 Michael鈥 like the idea of working on this when she is high and dry鈥he creek here off of Middle River here on the Chesapeake blows out with just the right kind of winds.听 I just bought this house in July so I am experiencing the winter new here on the water鈥�.Ice Eater ordered for the cold but the high and dry has definitely been an experience鈥� 听 Article references shaft packing wrenches and on Amazon they run around about $200鈥�.now I know BOAT stands for Bring On Another Thousand, but do I really need special shaft packing wrenches? 听 From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Caleb Davison via
Sent: Thursday, November 12, 2020 5:31 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box 听 I definitely recommend soaking the packing nut/locking nut in PB Blaster for up to a week before you attempt to break them free.听 I would not recommend using heat in this area especially if you have an Atomic 4 and a gas tank right over this area. I just reviewed this article and he has expanded it since I looked at it.听 It is quite comprehensive in all respects.听 He mentions some of the home made tools that can make this job go easier and even the details of how you should cut the packing rings when adding new (there is a best way and a not-so-best way). It is a longer read than I remembered. 听 -----Original Message-----
From: patrick.mcgough@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 5:04 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box I will definitely read that article, just wondering what additionally I would need to keep water out of the boat if trying to do this in the water. I think if I remove the batteries on the starboard side I could possibly get to this from in the cockpit.听 The two side panels that can be removed just don鈥檛 seem to be sized to be able to get any leverage.听 Should these things be soaked in PB Blaster鈥uessing that heat near that rubber gland marked 1 is not a good thing.听 What things other than the packing material and wrenches help with this project?听 A breaker bar or something for leverage? Thank you all so far for the quick responses鈥� The best on-line tutorial on Stuffing Boxes is here:听听 Study it well before you attempt any boat yoga trying to access this spot. Scott spotted and noted the rustic looking hose clamps that should be replaced (and yes, you need 2 for all under waterline applications).听听 I will add that it is probably time to replace the packing (that goes into the stuffing box) as this is a maintenance/wear item that should be replaced something like every 10 years, or sooner.听 I believe the marinehowto page makes a reccommendation on which packing to use.听 Interestingly they do not call it "stuffing" that goes into a "stuffing box".听 It is more like you just put "stuff" in there that will wear down over time while keeping your boat mostly dry.听听 I have done this a couple of times and it is not so difficult that it can't be done with the boat in the water.听 You just need to plan ahead so the job goes smoothly and quickly.听 If you replace the packing material it may take some minor adjustments in the beginning to get the # of drips to where you want it.听 You should be able to get it mostly dry with the shaft not spinning and only a few drips per minute with the shaft rotating. -----Original Message-----
From: aksjghkajshd <scott@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 3:54 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
In the picture, 4 doesn't look like it's immediately next to a nut
but it looks like 2 in the most astern nut and 3 the slightly forward
one.
2 and 3 are currently screwed against each other.听 3 is a "locknut".
Friction against 2 and against the threads keep it and 2 from moving.
So you'd back 3 off of 2 a bit, with a wrench on each, then tighten
2 a bit, then with two wrenches again, tighten 3 on to 2 while keeping
2 from moving.
It may be time to replace the stuffing in the stuffing box.
And that rusted stainless on the hose clamps is no good.听 Can you replace
those, one at a time?
Hmm, someone else was just telling me about stuffing boxes a few
months back.
Water looks incredible.
And yup, not a fun position.听 I spent a lot of time cleaning up bilge
paint and rough fiberglass under the stern tube before laying up more
fiberglass, apparently due to cracking from the wrong size cutlass
bearings being hammered in creating a spiderweb of cracks.
Good luck!
-scott
On听 0, patrick.mcgough@... wrote:
>听 听 How appropriate to be talking about stuffing 2 weeks before
>听 听 Thanksgiving...oh wait a second....not the same type of stuffing!!!!!
>
>
>听 听 I am looking for a little help here with my Tartan 27 and the stuffing
>听 听 box and the packing and adjustments.听 I have my Tartan 27 right out
>听 听 back on my pier so it is right here to monitor and keep an eye on, and
>听 听 so I went out to start her up and run her for a bit and check on the
>听 听 drip that is supposed to be 1-2 drops per minute is more like a steady
>听 听 stream.
>
>
>听 听 It is a tight fit for my 250# girth sliding in along the engine and so
>听 听 I want to make sure I get it right when I try and stop or slow this
>听 听 drop.
>
>听 听 Here is a picture.听 The drop is coming from right around #4.听 Is that
>听 听 where it is supposed to drip?听 What do I want to adjust and which way
>听 听 do I want to adjust them in?听 I can go take more pictures and video,
>听 听 but I thought labeling this picture might at least start a discussion.
>
>
>听 听 Thank you in advance for any help you can provide.听 I am not in risk of
>听 听 sinking as the water isn't that deep anyway...in the other picture you
>听 听 can see how she was high and dry just a little bit ago...
>
>
>听 听 [cid:image002.jpg@...]
>听 听 [cid:image004.jpg@...] 听
|
I have had great luck with a non drip packing. The听brand is听 I have run the engine for 4 straight hours and could still touch the bronze. Only warm. I did have to tighten the gland once听after the prop got fouled听on the St. Lawrence.听 Shook really听bad and the gland started to drip fast. I repaked after about 4 years as I wondered how long it could hold up and what I pulled out was perfect!! John Bailey Kiltie T27 #226
On Thu, Nov 12, 2020 at 6:02 PM Michael Connolly < crufone@...> wrote:
Patrick,
Like I mentioned you can make the wrenches out of flat stock steel and a hack saw.听 Bacon's might have used the size you need.听 !/8" flat steel is thick enough.
Michael
Caleb鈥hat additionally did you need to do this while in the water?
Michael鈥 like the idea of working on this when she is high and dry鈥he creek here off of Middle River here on the Chesapeake blows out with just the right kind of winds.听 I just bought this house in July so I am experiencing the winter new here on the water鈥�.Ice Eater ordered for the cold but the high and dry has definitely been an experience鈥�
Article references shaft packing wrenches and on Amazon they run around about $200鈥�.now I know BOAT stands for Bring On Another Thousand, but do I really need special shaft packing wrenches?
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Caleb Davison via
Sent: Thursday, November 12, 2020 5:31 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
I definitely recommend soaking the packing nut/locking nut in PB Blaster for up to a week before you attempt to break them free.听 I would not recommend using heat in this area especially if you have an Atomic 4 and a gas tank right over this area.
I just reviewed this article and he has expanded it since I looked at it.听 It is quite comprehensive in all respects.听 He mentions some of the home made tools that can make this job go easier and even the details of how you should cut the packing rings when adding new (there is a best way and a not-so-best way).
It is a longer read than I remembered.
听
-----Original Message-----
From: patrick.mcgough@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 5:04 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
I will definitely read that article, just wondering what additionally I would need to keep water out of the boat if trying to do this in the water.
I think if I remove the batteries on the starboard side I could possibly get to this from in the cockpit.听 The two side panels that can be removed just don鈥檛 seem to be sized to be able to get any leverage.听 Should these things be soaked in PB Blaster鈥uessing that heat near that rubber gland marked 1 is not a good thing.听 What things other than the packing material and wrenches help with this project?听 A breaker bar or something for leverage?
Thank you all so far for the quick responses鈥�
The best on-line tutorial on Stuffing Boxes is here:听听
Study it well before you attempt any boat yoga trying to access this spot.
Scott spotted and noted the rustic looking hose clamps that should be replaced (and yes, you need 2 for all under waterline applications).听听
I will add that it is probably time to replace the packing (that goes into the stuffing box) as this is a maintenance/wear item that should be replaced something like every 10 years, or sooner.听 I believe the marinehowto page makes a reccommendation on which packing to use.听 Interestingly they do not call it "stuffing" that goes into a "stuffing box".听 It is more like you just put "stuff" in there that will wear down over time while keeping your boat mostly dry.听听
I have done this a couple of times and it is not so difficult that it can't be done with the boat in the water.听 You just need to plan ahead so the job goes smoothly and quickly.听 If you replace the packing material it may take some minor adjustments in the beginning to get the # of drips to where you want it.听 You should be able to get it mostly dry with the shaft not spinning and only a few drips per minute with the shaft rotating.
-----Original Message-----
From: aksjghkajshd <scott@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 3:54 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
In the picture, 4 doesn't look like it's immediately next to a nut
but it looks like 2 in the most astern nut and 3 the slightly forward
one.
2 and 3 are currently screwed against each other.听 3 is a "locknut".
Friction against 2 and against the threads keep it and 2 from moving.
So you'd back 3 off of 2 a bit, with a wrench on each, then tighten
2 a bit, then with two wrenches again, tighten 3 on to 2 while keeping
2 from moving.
It may be time to replace the stuffing in the stuffing box.
And that rusted stainless on the hose clamps is no good.听 Can you replace
those, one at a time?
Hmm, someone else was just telling me about stuffing boxes a few
months back.
Water looks incredible.
And yup, not a fun position.听 I spent a lot of time cleaning up bilge
paint and rough fiberglass under the stern tube before laying up more
fiberglass, apparently due to cracking from the wrong size cutlass
bearings being hammered in creating a spiderweb of cracks.
Good luck!
-scott
On听 0, patrick.mcgough@... wrote:
>听 听 How appropriate to be talking about stuffing 2 weeks before
>听 听 Thanksgiving...oh wait a second....not the same type of stuffing!!!!!
>
>
>听 听 I am looking for a little help here with my Tartan 27 and the stuffing
>听 听 box and the packing and adjustments.听 I have my Tartan 27 right out
>听 听 back on my pier so it is right here to monitor and keep an eye on, and
>听 听 so I went out to start her up and run her for a bit and check on the
>听 听 drip that is supposed to be 1-2 drops per minute is more like a steady
>听 听 stream.
>
>
>听 听 It is a tight fit for my 250# girth sliding in along the engine and so
>听 听 I want to make sure I get it right when I try and stop or slow this
>听 听 drop.
>
>听 听 Here is a picture.听 The drop is coming from right around #4.听 Is that
>听 听 where it is supposed to drip?听 What do I want to adjust and which way
>听 听 do I want to adjust them in?听 I can go take more pictures and video,
>听 听 but I thought labeling this picture might at least start a discussion.
>
>
>听 听 Thank you in advance for any help you can provide.听 I am not in risk of
>听 听 sinking as the water isn't that deep anyway...in the other picture you
>听 听 can see how she was high and dry just a little bit ago...
>
>
>听 听 [cid:image002.jpg@...]
>听 听 [cid:image004.jpg@...]
听
|
They fit really well in the space available on the T27. If you get a pair, set them on the nuts so the handles are about 10 degrees apart and squeeze and it opens right up. I wished I had spent the $60 or so on the pair years sooner as I tried a variety of different tools/methods that were not as easy as using these.
Good luck! XR mobile device
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Nov 12, 2020, at 6:55 PM, Brent Bass < bjbass@...> wrote: These are the wrenches I got and they were money well spent!
The 1-7/8 wrenches worked with my Buck Algonquin stuffing box for my 1 inch shaft.
Brent S/V Lola - #438 Cataumet, MA XR mobile device Caleb鈥hat additionally did you need to do this while in the water? 听 Michael鈥 like the idea of working on this when she is high and dry鈥he creek here off of Middle River here on the Chesapeake blows out with just the right kind of winds.听 I just bought this house in July so I am experiencing the winter new here on the water鈥�.Ice Eater ordered for the cold but the high and dry has definitely been an experience鈥� 听 Article references shaft packing wrenches and on Amazon they run around about $200鈥�.now I know BOAT stands for Bring On Another Thousand, but do I really need special shaft packing wrenches? 听 From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Caleb Davison via
Sent: Thursday, November 12, 2020 5:31 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box 听 I definitely recommend soaking the packing nut/locking nut in PB Blaster for up to a week before you attempt to break them free.听 I would not recommend using heat in this area especially if you have an Atomic 4 and a gas tank right over this area. I just reviewed this article and he has expanded it since I looked at it.听 It is quite comprehensive in all respects.听 He mentions some of the home made tools that can make this job go easier and even the details of how you should cut the packing rings when adding new (there is a best way and a not-so-best way). It is a longer read than I remembered. 听 -----Original Message-----
From: patrick.mcgough@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 5:04 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box I will definitely read that article, just wondering what additionally I would need to keep water out of the boat if trying to do this in the water. I think if I remove the batteries on the starboard side I could possibly get to this from in the cockpit.听 The two side panels that can be removed just don鈥檛 seem to be sized to be able to get any leverage.听 Should these things be soaked in PB Blaster鈥uessing that heat near that rubber gland marked 1 is not a good thing.听 What things other than the packing material and wrenches help with this project?听 A breaker bar or something for leverage? Thank you all so far for the quick responses鈥� The best on-line tutorial on Stuffing Boxes is here:听听 Study it well before you attempt any boat yoga trying to access this spot. Scott spotted and noted the rustic looking hose clamps that should be replaced (and yes, you need 2 for all under waterline applications).听听 I will add that it is probably time to replace the packing (that goes into the stuffing box) as this is a maintenance/wear item that should be replaced something like every 10 years, or sooner.听 I believe the marinehowto page makes a reccommendation on which packing to use.听 Interestingly they do not call it "stuffing" that goes into a "stuffing box".听 It is more like you just put "stuff" in there that will wear down over time while keeping your boat mostly dry.听听 I have done this a couple of times and it is not so difficult that it can't be done with the boat in the water.听 You just need to plan ahead so the job goes smoothly and quickly.听 If you replace the packing material it may take some minor adjustments in the beginning to get the # of drips to where you want it.听 You should be able to get it mostly dry with the shaft not spinning and only a few drips per minute with the shaft rotating. -----Original Message-----
From: aksjghkajshd <scott@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 3:54 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
In the picture, 4 doesn't look like it's immediately next to a nut
but it looks like 2 in the most astern nut and 3 the slightly forward
one.
2 and 3 are currently screwed against each other.听 3 is a "locknut".
Friction against 2 and against the threads keep it and 2 from moving.
So you'd back 3 off of 2 a bit, with a wrench on each, then tighten
2 a bit, then with two wrenches again, tighten 3 on to 2 while keeping
2 from moving.
It may be time to replace the stuffing in the stuffing box.
And that rusted stainless on the hose clamps is no good.听 Can you replace
those, one at a time?
Hmm, someone else was just telling me about stuffing boxes a few
months back.
Water looks incredible.
And yup, not a fun position.听 I spent a lot of time cleaning up bilge
paint and rough fiberglass under the stern tube before laying up more
fiberglass, apparently due to cracking from the wrong size cutlass
bearings being hammered in creating a spiderweb of cracks.
Good luck!
-scott
On听 0, patrick.mcgough@... wrote:
>听 听 How appropriate to be talking about stuffing 2 weeks before
>听 听 Thanksgiving...oh wait a second....not the same type of stuffing!!!!!
>
>
>听 听 I am looking for a little help here with my Tartan 27 and the stuffing
>听 听 box and the packing and adjustments.听 I have my Tartan 27 right out
>听 听 back on my pier so it is right here to monitor and keep an eye on, and
>听 听 so I went out to start her up and run her for a bit and check on the
>听 听 drip that is supposed to be 1-2 drops per minute is more like a steady
>听 听 stream.
>
>
>听 听 It is a tight fit for my 250# girth sliding in along the engine and so
>听 听 I want to make sure I get it right when I try and stop or slow this
>听 听 drop.
>
>听 听 Here is a picture.听 The drop is coming from right around #4.听 Is that
>听 听 where it is supposed to drip?听 What do I want to adjust and which way
>听 听 do I want to adjust them in?听 I can go take more pictures and video,
>听 听 but I thought labeling this picture might at least start a discussion.
>
>
>听 听 Thank you in advance for any help you can provide.听 I am not in risk of
>听 听 sinking as the water isn't that deep anyway...in the other picture you
>听 听 can see how she was high and dry just a little bit ago...
>
>
>听 听 [cid:image002.jpg@...]
>听 听 [cid:image004.jpg@...] 听
|
These are the wrenches I got and they were money well spent!
The 1-7/8 wrenches worked with my Buck Algonquin stuffing box for my 1 inch shaft.
Brent S/V Lola - #438 Cataumet, MA
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Nov 12, 2020, at 5:38 PM, patrick.mcgough@... wrote: Caleb鈥hat additionally did you need to do this while in the water? 听 Michael鈥 like the idea of working on this when she is high and dry鈥he creek here off of Middle River here on the Chesapeake blows out with just the right kind of winds.听 I just bought this house in July so I am experiencing the winter new here on the water鈥�.Ice Eater ordered for the cold but the high and dry has definitely been an experience鈥� 听 Article references shaft packing wrenches and on Amazon they run around about $200鈥�.now I know BOAT stands for Bring On Another Thousand, but do I really need special shaft packing wrenches? 听 From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Caleb Davison via
Sent: Thursday, November 12, 2020 5:31 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box 听 I definitely recommend soaking the packing nut/locking nut in PB Blaster for up to a week before you attempt to break them free.听 I would not recommend using heat in this area especially if you have an Atomic 4 and a gas tank right over this area. I just reviewed this article and he has expanded it since I looked at it.听 It is quite comprehensive in all respects.听 He mentions some of the home made tools that can make this job go easier and even the details of how you should cut the packing rings when adding new (there is a best way and a not-so-best way). It is a longer read than I remembered. 听 -----Original Message-----
From: patrick.mcgough@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 5:04 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box I will definitely read that article, just wondering what additionally I would need to keep water out of the boat if trying to do this in the water. I think if I remove the batteries on the starboard side I could possibly get to this from in the cockpit.听 The two side panels that can be removed just don鈥檛 seem to be sized to be able to get any leverage.听 Should these things be soaked in PB Blaster鈥uessing that heat near that rubber gland marked 1 is not a good thing.听 What things other than the packing material and wrenches help with this project?听 A breaker bar or something for leverage? Thank you all so far for the quick responses鈥� The best on-line tutorial on Stuffing Boxes is here:听听 Study it well before you attempt any boat yoga trying to access this spot. Scott spotted and noted the rustic looking hose clamps that should be replaced (and yes, you need 2 for all under waterline applications).听听 I will add that it is probably time to replace the packing (that goes into the stuffing box) as this is a maintenance/wear item that should be replaced something like every 10 years, or sooner.听 I believe the marinehowto page makes a reccommendation on which packing to use.听 Interestingly they do not call it "stuffing" that goes into a "stuffing box".听 It is more like you just put "stuff" in there that will wear down over time while keeping your boat mostly dry.听听 I have done this a couple of times and it is not so difficult that it can't be done with the boat in the water.听 You just need to plan ahead so the job goes smoothly and quickly.听 If you replace the packing material it may take some minor adjustments in the beginning to get the # of drips to where you want it.听 You should be able to get it mostly dry with the shaft not spinning and only a few drips per minute with the shaft rotating. -----Original Message-----
From: aksjghkajshd <scott@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 3:54 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
In the picture, 4 doesn't look like it's immediately next to a nut
but it looks like 2 in the most astern nut and 3 the slightly forward
one.
2 and 3 are currently screwed against each other.听 3 is a "locknut".
Friction against 2 and against the threads keep it and 2 from moving.
So you'd back 3 off of 2 a bit, with a wrench on each, then tighten
2 a bit, then with two wrenches again, tighten 3 on to 2 while keeping
2 from moving.
It may be time to replace the stuffing in the stuffing box.
And that rusted stainless on the hose clamps is no good.听 Can you replace
those, one at a time?
Hmm, someone else was just telling me about stuffing boxes a few
months back.
Water looks incredible.
And yup, not a fun position.听 I spent a lot of time cleaning up bilge
paint and rough fiberglass under the stern tube before laying up more
fiberglass, apparently due to cracking from the wrong size cutlass
bearings being hammered in creating a spiderweb of cracks.
Good luck!
-scott
On听 0, patrick.mcgough@... wrote:
>听 听 How appropriate to be talking about stuffing 2 weeks before
>听 听 Thanksgiving...oh wait a second....not the same type of stuffing!!!!!
>
>
>听 听 I am looking for a little help here with my Tartan 27 and the stuffing
>听 听 box and the packing and adjustments.听 I have my Tartan 27 right out
>听 听 back on my pier so it is right here to monitor and keep an eye on, and
>听 听 so I went out to start her up and run her for a bit and check on the
>听 听 drip that is supposed to be 1-2 drops per minute is more like a steady
>听 听 stream.
>
>
>听 听 It is a tight fit for my 250# girth sliding in along the engine and so
>听 听 I want to make sure I get it right when I try and stop or slow this
>听 听 drop.
>
>听 听 Here is a picture.听 The drop is coming from right around #4.听 Is that
>听 听 where it is supposed to drip?听 What do I want to adjust and which way
>听 听 do I want to adjust them in?听 I can go take more pictures and video,
>听 听 but I thought labeling this picture might at least start a discussion.
>
>
>听 听 Thank you in advance for any help you can provide.听 I am not in risk of
>听 听 sinking as the water isn't that deep anyway...in the other picture you
>听 听 can see how she was high and dry just a little bit ago...
>
>
>听 听 [cid:image002.jpg@...]
>听 听 [cid:image004.jpg@...] 听
|
The marine howto guide is great. There is a lot of unresolved debate about whether you should use graphite impregnated packing material due to the possibility of galvanic corrosion. Marine Howto and the ABYC recommend against it -- but many people seem to like it. I think the graphite stuff lasts longer, so you do not have to repack as often, but somewhat increases your chances of crevice corrosion on the shaft. However, it clearly does not increase the chances enough that shafts are failing at a high rate. After replacing my stuffing box in the water, I decided I was ok with repacking the stuffing box more often.
I splurged on a set of these, $90 seems excessive until you find yourself covered with bruises from trying to use ill fitting pipe wrenches or other tools while crammed into a tight space. I did have to do a tiny bit of filing on my nut (which was brand new) and the wrenches. But the upside is I now have a nice set of properly fitting wrenches. Like many boat projects, repacking the stuffing box would be easy if the rest of the boat wasn't in your way. Trying to do it one-handed at arms length is what makes it hard.
I would also recommend a good tool for scraping the old packing material out, though I do not have any specific recommendations. I bought a fancy corkscrew-like tool designed for the job, but it was too big, so I returned it and just used a small screwdriver. But the small screwdriver was less than satisfactory.
The first time I changed my stuffing box (or any stuffing box at all), my T27 was in the water. I was terrified that the water was going to come gushing out when I removed the packing nut. But it was, in fact, very underwhelming.
- jeremy
How appropriate to be talking about stuffing 2 weeks before Thanksgiving鈥h wait a second鈥�.not the same type of stuffing!!!!! 听 I am looking for a little help here with my Tartan 27 and the stuffing box and the packing and adjustments.听 I have my Tartan 27 right out back on my pier so it is right here to monitor and keep an eye on, and so I went out to start her up and run her for a bit and check on the drip that is supposed to be 1-2 drops per minute is more like a steady stream. 听 It is a tight fit for my 250# girth sliding in along the engine and so I want to make sure I get it right when I try and stop or slow this drop. Here is a picture.听 The drop is coming from right around #4.听 Is that where it is supposed to drip?听 What do I want to adjust and which way do I want to adjust them in?听 I can go take more pictures and video, but I thought labeling this picture might at least start a discussion.听 听 Thank you in advance for any help you can provide.听 I am not in risk of sinking as the water isn鈥檛 that deep anyway鈥n the other picture you can see how she was high and dry just a little bit ago鈥� 听  
听 Patrick
|
Patrick,
Like I mentioned you can make the wrenches out of flat stock steel and a hack saw.听 Bacon's might have used the size you need.听 !/8" flat steel is thick enough.
Michael
On 11/12/2020 5:38 PM patrick.mcgough@... wrote:
Caleb鈥hat additionally did you need to do this while in the water?
Michael鈥 like the idea of working on this when she is high and dry鈥he creek here off of Middle River here on the Chesapeake blows out with just the right kind of winds.听 I just bought this house in July so I am experiencing the winter new here on the water鈥�.Ice Eater ordered for the cold but the high and dry has definitely been an experience鈥�
Article references shaft packing wrenches and on Amazon they run around about $200鈥�.now I know BOAT stands for Bring On Another Thousand, but do I really need special shaft packing wrenches?
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Caleb Davison via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, November 12, 2020 5:31 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
I definitely recommend soaking the packing nut/locking nut in PB Blaster for up to a week before you attempt to break them free.听 I would not recommend using heat in this area especially if you have an Atomic 4 and a gas tank right over this area.
I just reviewed this article and he has expanded it since I looked at it.听 It is quite comprehensive in all respects.听 He mentions some of the home made tools that can make this job go easier and even the details of how you should cut the packing rings when adding new (there is a best way and a not-so-best way).
It is a longer read than I remembered.
听
-----Original Message-----
From: patrick.mcgough@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 5:04 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
I will definitely read that article, just wondering what additionally I would need to keep water out of the boat if trying to do this in the water.
I think if I remove the batteries on the starboard side I could possibly get to this from in the cockpit.听 The two side panels that can be removed just don鈥檛 seem to be sized to be able to get any leverage.听 Should these things be soaked in PB Blaster鈥uessing that heat near that rubber gland marked 1 is not a good thing.听 What things other than the packing material and wrenches help with this project?听 A breaker bar or something for leverage?
Thank you all so far for the quick responses鈥�
The best on-line tutorial on Stuffing Boxes is here:听听
Study it well before you attempt any boat yoga trying to access this spot.
Scott spotted and noted the rustic looking hose clamps that should be replaced (and yes, you need 2 for all under waterline applications).听听
I will add that it is probably time to replace the packing (that goes into the stuffing box) as this is a maintenance/wear item that should be replaced something like every 10 years, or sooner.听 I believe the marinehowto page makes a reccommendation on which packing to use.听 Interestingly they do not call it "stuffing" that goes into a "stuffing box".听 It is more like you just put "stuff" in there that will wear down over time while keeping your boat mostly dry.听听
I have done this a couple of times and it is not so difficult that it can't be done with the boat in the water.听 You just need to plan ahead so the job goes smoothly and quickly.听 If you replace the packing material it may take some minor adjustments in the beginning to get the # of drips to where you want it.听 You should be able to get it mostly dry with the shaft not spinning and only a few drips per minute with the shaft rotating.
-----Original Message-----
From: aksjghkajshd <scott@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 3:54 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
In the picture, 4 doesn't look like it's immediately next to a nut
but it looks like 2 in the most astern nut and 3 the slightly forward
one.
2 and 3 are currently screwed against each other.听 3 is a "locknut".
Friction against 2 and against the threads keep it and 2 from moving.
So you'd back 3 off of 2 a bit, with a wrench on each, then tighten
2 a bit, then with two wrenches again, tighten 3 on to 2 while keeping
2 from moving.
It may be time to replace the stuffing in the stuffing box.
And that rusted stainless on the hose clamps is no good.听 Can you replace
those, one at a time?
Hmm, someone else was just telling me about stuffing boxes a few
months back.
Water looks incredible.
And yup, not a fun position.听 I spent a lot of time cleaning up bilge
paint and rough fiberglass under the stern tube before laying up more
fiberglass, apparently due to cracking from the wrong size cutlass
bearings being hammered in creating a spiderweb of cracks.
Good luck!
-scott
On听 0, patrick.mcgough@... wrote:
>听 听 How appropriate to be talking about stuffing 2 weeks before
>听 听 Thanksgiving...oh wait a second....not the same type of stuffing!!!!!
>
>
>听 听 I am looking for a little help here with my Tartan 27 and the stuffing
>听 听 box and the packing and adjustments.听 I have my Tartan 27 right out
>听 听 back on my pier so it is right here to monitor and keep an eye on, and
>听 听 so I went out to start her up and run her for a bit and check on the
>听 听 drip that is supposed to be 1-2 drops per minute is more like a steady
>听 听 stream.
>
>
>听 听 It is a tight fit for my 250# girth sliding in along the engine and so
>听 听 I want to make sure I get it right when I try and stop or slow this
>听 听 drop.
>
>听 听 Here is a picture.听 The drop is coming from right around #4.听 Is that
>听 听 where it is supposed to drip?听 What do I want to adjust and which way
>听 听 do I want to adjust them in?听 I can go take more pictures and video,
>听 听 but I thought labeling this picture might at least start a discussion.
>
>
>听 听 Thank you in advance for any help you can provide.听 I am not in risk of
>听 听 sinking as the water isn't that deep anyway...in the other picture you
>听 听 can see how she was high and dry just a little bit ago...
>
>
>听 听 [cid:image002.jpg@...]
>听 听 [cid:image004.jpg@...]
听
|
Patrick,
I never needed the special shaft packing wrenches but you do need 2 wrenches and they can't have very long handles.听 You could fabricate "special" wrenches just for this project out of some heavier stock if you are handy at working with metal.
To do this in the water you would need to read that entire article I posted (https://marinehowto.com/re-packing-a-traditional-stuffing-box/ ) and buy your packing material and have it cut and ready to go before you open up the stuffing box.听 You need to have all the tools and materials ready and on hand before you start.听 Have a sponge ready and hopefully your bilge pump is working fine.听 I never experienced a whole lot of water coming in though.听 If your Cutlass bearing is well worn though there will be room for more water to flow into the boat.听 The last drive train work I did on #328 included putting in a new SS shaft, shaft log hose, hose clamps, Cutlass bearing and new packing in the old stuffing box.听 Pretty sure you will need 3/16" packing material.听 Consult marinehowto as to which packing materials are recommended.听听
Best of luck with this.
Caleb D.
T27 #328
-----Original Message-----
From: patrick.mcgough@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 5:38 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
Caleb鈥hat additionally did you need to do this while in the water?
听
Michael鈥 like the idea of working on this when she is high and dry鈥he creek here off of Middle River here on the Chesapeake blows out with just the right kind of winds.听 I just bought this house in July so I am experiencing the winter new here on the water鈥�.Ice Eater ordered for the cold but the high and dry has definitely been an experience鈥�
听
Article references shaft packing wrenches and on Amazon they run around about $200鈥�.now I know BOAT stands for Bring On Another Thousand, but do I really need special shaft packing wrenches?
听
听
I definitely recommend soaking the packing nut/locking nut in PB Blaster for up to a week before you attempt to break them free.听 I would not recommend using heat in this area especially if you have an Atomic 4 and a gas tank right over this area.
I just reviewed this article and he has expanded it since I looked at it.听 It is quite comprehensive in all respects.听 He mentions some of the home made tools that can make this job go easier and even the details of how you should cut the packing rings when adding new (there is a best way and a not-so-best way).
It is a longer read than I remembered.
听
I will definitely read that article, just wondering what additionally I would need to keep water out of the boat if trying to do this in the water.
I think if I remove the batteries on the starboard side I could possibly get to this from in the cockpit.听 The two side panels that can be removed just don鈥檛 seem to be sized to be able to get any leverage.听 Should these things be soaked in PB Blaster鈥uessing that heat near that rubber gland marked 1 is not a good thing.听 What things other than the packing material and wrenches help with this project?听 A breaker bar or something for leverage?
Thank you all so far for the quick responses鈥�
The best on-line tutorial on Stuffing Boxes is here:听听
Study it well before you attempt any boat yoga trying to access this spot.
Scott spotted and noted the rustic looking hose clamps that should be replaced (and yes, you need 2 for all under waterline applications).听听
I will add that it is probably time to replace the packing (that goes into the stuffing box) as this is a maintenance/wear item that should be replaced something like every 10 years, or sooner.听 I believe the marinehowto page makes a reccommendation on which packing to use.听 Interestingly they do not call it "stuffing" that goes into a "stuffing box".听 It is more like you just put "stuff" in there that will wear down over time while keeping your boat mostly dry.听听
I have done this a couple of times and it is not so difficult that it can't be done with the boat in the water.听 You just need to plan ahead so the job goes smoothly and quickly.听 If you replace the packing material it may take some minor adjustments in the beginning to get the # of drips to where you want it.听 You should be able to get it mostly dry with the shaft not spinning and only a few drips per minute with the shaft rotating.
-----Original Message-----
From: aksjghkajshd <scott@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 3:54 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
In the picture, 4 doesn't look like it's immediately next to a nut
but it looks like 2 in the most astern nut and 3 the slightly forward
one.
2 and 3 are currently screwed against each other.听 3 is a "locknut".
Friction against 2 and against the threads keep it and 2 from moving.
So you'd back 3 off of 2 a bit, with a wrench on each, then tighten
2 a bit, then with two wrenches again, tighten 3 on to 2 while keeping
2 from moving.
It may be time to replace the stuffing in the stuffing box.
And that rusted stainless on the hose clamps is no good.听 Can you replace
those, one at a time?
Hmm, someone else was just telling me about stuffing boxes a few
months back.
Water looks incredible.
And yup, not a fun position.听 I spent a lot of time cleaning up bilge
paint and rough fiberglass under the stern tube before laying up more
fiberglass, apparently due to cracking from the wrong size cutlass
bearings being hammered in creating a spiderweb of cracks.
Good luck!
-scott
On听 0, patrick.mcgough@... wrote:
>听 听 How appropriate to be talking about stuffing 2 weeks before
>听 听 Thanksgiving...oh wait a second....not the same type of stuffing!!!!!
>
>
>听 听 I am looking for a little help here with my Tartan 27 and the stuffing
>听 听 box and the packing and adjustments.听 I have my Tartan 27 right out
>听 听 back on my pier so it is right here to monitor and keep an eye on, and
>听 听 so I went out to start her up and run her for a bit and check on the
>听 听 drip that is supposed to be 1-2 drops per minute is more like a steady
>听 听 stream.
>
>
>听 听 It is a tight fit for my 250# girth sliding in along the engine and so
>听 听 I want to make sure I get it right when I try and stop or slow this
>听 听 drop.
>
>听 听 Here is a picture.听 The drop is coming from right around #4.听 Is that
>听 听 where it is supposed to drip?听 What do I want to adjust and which way
>听 听 do I want to adjust them in?听 I can go take more pictures and video,
>听 听 but I thought labeling this picture might at least start a discussion.
>
>
>听 听 Thank you in advance for any help you can provide.听 I am not in risk of
>听 听 sinking as the water isn't that deep anyway...in the other picture you
>听 听 can see how she was high and dry just a little bit ago...
>
>
>听 听 [cid:image002.jpg@...]
>听 听 [cid:image004.jpg@...]
听
|
Caleb鈥hat additionally did you need to do this while in the water? 听 Michael鈥 like the idea of working on this when she is high and dry鈥he creek here off of Middle River here on the Chesapeake blows out with just the right kind of winds.听 I just bought this house in July so I am experiencing the winter new here on the water鈥�.Ice Eater ordered for the cold but the high and dry has definitely been an experience鈥� 听 Article references shaft packing wrenches and on Amazon they run around about $200鈥�.now I know BOAT stands for Bring On Another Thousand, but do I really need special shaft packing wrenches? 听
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Caleb Davison via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, November 12, 2020 5:31 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box 听 I definitely recommend soaking the packing nut/locking nut in PB Blaster for up to a week before you attempt to break them free.听 I would not recommend using heat in this area especially if you have an Atomic 4 and a gas tank right over this area. I just reviewed this article and he has expanded it since I looked at it.听 It is quite comprehensive in all respects.听 He mentions some of the home made tools that can make this job go easier and even the details of how you should cut the packing rings when adding new (there is a best way and a not-so-best way). It is a longer read than I remembered. 听 -----Original Message-----
From: patrick.mcgough@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 5:04 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box I will definitely read that article, just wondering what additionally I would need to keep water out of the boat if trying to do this in the water. I think if I remove the batteries on the starboard side I could possibly get to this from in the cockpit.听 The two side panels that can be removed just don鈥檛 seem to be sized to be able to get any leverage.听 Should these things be soaked in PB Blaster鈥uessing that heat near that rubber gland marked 1 is not a good thing.听 What things other than the packing material and wrenches help with this project?听 A breaker bar or something for leverage? Thank you all so far for the quick responses鈥� The best on-line tutorial on Stuffing Boxes is here:听听 Study it well before you attempt any boat yoga trying to access this spot. Scott spotted and noted the rustic looking hose clamps that should be replaced (and yes, you need 2 for all under waterline applications).听听 I will add that it is probably time to replace the packing (that goes into the stuffing box) as this is a maintenance/wear item that should be replaced something like every 10 years, or sooner.听 I believe the marinehowto page makes a reccommendation on which packing to use.听 Interestingly they do not call it "stuffing" that goes into a "stuffing box".听 It is more like you just put "stuff" in there that will wear down over time while keeping your boat mostly dry.听听 I have done this a couple of times and it is not so difficult that it can't be done with the boat in the water.听 You just need to plan ahead so the job goes smoothly and quickly.听 If you replace the packing material it may take some minor adjustments in the beginning to get the # of drips to where you want it.听 You should be able to get it mostly dry with the shaft not spinning and only a few drips per minute with the shaft rotating. -----Original Message-----
From: aksjghkajshd <scott@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 3:54 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
In the picture, 4 doesn't look like it's immediately next to a nut
but it looks like 2 in the most astern nut and 3 the slightly forward
one.
2 and 3 are currently screwed against each other.听 3 is a "locknut".
Friction against 2 and against the threads keep it and 2 from moving.
So you'd back 3 off of 2 a bit, with a wrench on each, then tighten
2 a bit, then with two wrenches again, tighten 3 on to 2 while keeping
2 from moving.
It may be time to replace the stuffing in the stuffing box.
And that rusted stainless on the hose clamps is no good.听 Can you replace
those, one at a time?
Hmm, someone else was just telling me about stuffing boxes a few
months back.
Water looks incredible.
And yup, not a fun position.听 I spent a lot of time cleaning up bilge
paint and rough fiberglass under the stern tube before laying up more
fiberglass, apparently due to cracking from the wrong size cutlass
bearings being hammered in creating a spiderweb of cracks.
Good luck!
-scott
On听 0, patrick.mcgough@... wrote:
>听 听 How appropriate to be talking about stuffing 2 weeks before
>听 听 Thanksgiving...oh wait a second....not the same type of stuffing!!!!!
>
>
>听 听 I am looking for a little help here with my Tartan 27 and the stuffing
>听 听 box and the packing and adjustments.听 I have my Tartan 27 right out
>听 听 back on my pier so it is right here to monitor and keep an eye on, and
>听 听 so I went out to start her up and run her for a bit and check on the
>听 听 drip that is supposed to be 1-2 drops per minute is more like a steady
>听 听 stream.
>
>
>听 听 It is a tight fit for my 250# girth sliding in along the engine and so
>听 听 I want to make sure I get it right when I try and stop or slow this
>听 听 drop.
>
>听 听 Here is a picture.听 The drop is coming from right around #4.听 Is that
>听 听 where it is supposed to drip?听 What do I want to adjust and which way
>听 听 do I want to adjust them in?听 I can go take more pictures and video,
>听 听 but I thought labeling this picture might at least start a discussion.
>
>
>听 听 Thank you in advance for any help you can provide.听 I am not in risk of
>听 听 sinking as the water isn't that deep anyway...in the other picture you
>听 听 can see how she was high and dry just a little bit ago...
>
>
>听 听 [cid:image002.jpg@...]
>听 听 [cid:image004.jpg@...] 听
|
I definitely recommend soaking the packing nut/locking nut in PB Blaster for up to a week before you attempt to break them free.听 I would not recommend using heat in this area especially if you have an Atomic 4 and a gas tank right over this area.
I just reviewed this article and he has expanded it since I looked at it.听 It is quite comprehensive in all respects.听 He mentions some of the home made tools that can make this job go easier and even the details of how you should cut the packing rings when adding new (there is a best way and a not-so-best way).
https://marinehowto.com/re-packing-a-traditional-stuffing-box/
It is a longer read than I remembered.
Best of luck.
Caleb
-----Original Message-----
From: patrick.mcgough@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 5:04 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
I will definitely read that article, just wondering what additionally I would need to keep water out of the boat if trying to do this in the water.
听
I think if I remove the batteries on the starboard side I could possibly get to this from in the cockpit.听 The two side panels that can be removed just don鈥檛 seem to be sized to be able to get any leverage.听 Should these things be soaked in PB Blaster鈥uessing that heat near that rubber gland marked 1 is not a good thing.听 What things other than the packing material and wrenches help with this project?听 A breaker bar or something for leverage?
听
Thank you all so far for the quick responses鈥�
听
Patrick
听
听
The best on-line tutorial on Stuffing Boxes is here:听听
Study it well before you attempt any boat yoga trying to access this spot.
Scott spotted and noted the rustic looking hose clamps that should be replaced (and yes, you need 2 for all under waterline applications).听听
I will add that it is probably time to replace the packing (that goes into the stuffing box) as this is a maintenance/wear item that should be replaced something like every 10 years, or sooner.听 I believe the marinehowto page makes a reccommendation on which packing to use.听 Interestingly they do not call it "stuffing" that goes into a "stuffing box".听 It is more like you just put "stuff" in there that will wear down over time while keeping your boat mostly dry.听听
I have done this a couple of times and it is not so difficult that it can't be done with the boat in the water.听 You just need to plan ahead so the job goes smoothly and quickly.听 If you replace the packing material it may take some minor adjustments in the beginning to get the # of drips to where you want it.听 You should be able to get it mostly dry with the shaft not spinning and only a few drips per minute with the shaft rotating.
听
-----Original Message-----
From: aksjghkajshd <scott@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 3:54 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
In the picture, 4 doesn't look like it's immediately next to a nut
but it looks like 2 in the most astern nut and 3 the slightly forward
one.
2 and 3 are currently screwed against each other.听 3 is a "locknut".
Friction against 2 and against the threads keep it and 2 from moving.
So you'd back 3 off of 2 a bit, with a wrench on each, then tighten
2 a bit, then with two wrenches again, tighten 3 on to 2 while keeping
2 from moving.
It may be time to replace the stuffing in the stuffing box.
And that rusted stainless on the hose clamps is no good.听 Can you replace
those, one at a time?
Hmm, someone else was just telling me about stuffing boxes a few
months back.
Water looks incredible.
And yup, not a fun position.听 I spent a lot of time cleaning up bilge
paint and rough fiberglass under the stern tube before laying up more
fiberglass, apparently due to cracking from the wrong size cutlass
bearings being hammered in creating a spiderweb of cracks.
Good luck!
-scott
On听 0, patrick.mcgough@... wrote:
>听 听 How appropriate to be talking about stuffing 2 weeks before
>听 听 Thanksgiving...oh wait a second....not the same type of stuffing!!!!!
>
>
>听 听 I am looking for a little help here with my Tartan 27 and the stuffing
>听 听 box and the packing and adjustments.听 I have my Tartan 27 right out
>听 听 back on my pier so it is right here to monitor and keep an eye on, and
>听 听 so I went out to start her up and run her for a bit and check on the
>听 听 drip that is supposed to be 1-2 drops per minute is more like a steady
>听 听 stream.
>
>
>听 听 It is a tight fit for my 250# girth sliding in along the engine and so
>听 听 I want to make sure I get it right when I try and stop or slow this
>听 听 drop.
>
>听 听 Here is a picture.听 The drop is coming from right around #4.听 Is that
>听 听 where it is supposed to drip?听 What do I want to adjust and which way
>听 听 do I want to adjust them in?听 I can go take more pictures and video,
>听 听 but I thought labeling this picture might at least start a discussion.
>
>
>听 听 Thank you in advance for any help you can provide.听 I am not in risk of
>听 听 sinking as the water isn't that deep anyway...in the other picture you
>听 听 can see how she was high and dry just a little bit ago...
>
>
>听 听 [cid:image002.jpg@...]
>听 听 [cid:image004.jpg@...]
听
|
Patrick,
The article referenced by Caleb Davison is good and very thorough.听 How often is your boat left high and dry via the tide? If this is common during the tide cycle then you are lucky.听 Firstly, I would spray the metal components down with a penetrating oil after wire brushing off all the corrosion you can. Better to have wrenches which fit the flats on the hex nuts than using any kind of adjustable wrenches. These can be fashioned out of flat stock if need be.听 Wait until the boat is high and dry and attempt to disassemble.听 No need to rush, especially if the boat is in your back yard so to speak.听
Don't force the nuts apart if they are jammed听together, I mean really tight.听 Fashion a trough out of aluminum foil and set up so when filled with vinegar the vinegar covers all the shaft and bronze fittings.听 Let set over night or a bit longer if necessary.听 Green corrosion will disappear and the bronze will appear a light pink in color. The vinegar will actually get to the corrosion in the threaded area under the nuts. Wire brush again and then tape gently with a hammer.听 Get the nuts apart and unscrew from the shaft housing.
Inspect the shaft where the packing rests.听 Make certain it is very smooth, polish as necessary.听 Any packing new or old will be short lived if compressed against a rough shaft.
Otherwise follow the article Caleb referenced.听 Get rid of those screw clamps and replace with smooth band clamps with a "T" bolt for adjusting. Inspect the rubber hose. Make certain it has not been replace with some crap by the P.O.
Take your time, replace the packing prior to adjusting, after you have all nice and corrosion free.听 Do a little each time the boat is high and dry.听 When completed spray all down with WD-40 or better yet T-9 Boeshield.
Do your self a favour and inspect two or three times a year. Spray down to prevent the type of corrosion you have now.听 Adjust at least once a year even though you don't think you have to.听 Then if you have an emergency at sea you can easily adjust to stop a leaking packing.
I have an Alberg 30, but it is the same drill.
Michael
On 11/12/2020 3:40 PM patrick.mcgough@... wrote:
How appropriate to be talking about stuffing 2 weeks before Thanksgiving鈥h wait a second鈥�.not the same type of stuffing!!!!!
I am looking for a little help here with my Tartan 27 and the stuffing box and the packing and adjustments.听 I have my Tartan 27 right out back on my pier so it is right here to monitor and keep an eye on, and so I went out to start her up and run her for a bit and check on the drip that is supposed to be 1-2 drops per minute is more like a steady stream.
It is a tight fit for my 250# girth sliding in along the engine and so I want to make sure I get it right when I try and stop or slow this drop.
Here is a picture.听 The drop is coming from right around #4.听 Is that where it is supposed to drip?听 What do I want to adjust and which way do I want to adjust them in?听 I can go take more pictures and video, but I thought labeling this picture might at least start a discussion.听
Thank you in advance for any help you can provide.听 I am not in risk of sinking as the water isn鈥檛 that deep anyway鈥n the other picture you can see how she was high and dry just a little bit ago鈥�
 
Patrick
|
I will definitely read that article, just wondering what additionally I would need to keep water out of the boat if trying to do this in the water. 听 I think if I remove the batteries on the starboard side I could possibly get to this from in the cockpit.听 The two side panels that can be removed just don鈥檛 seem to be sized to be able to get any leverage.听 Should these things be soaked in PB Blaster鈥uessing that heat near that rubber gland marked 1 is not a good thing.听 What things other than the packing material and wrenches help with this project?听 A breaker bar or something for leverage? 听 Thank you all so far for the quick responses鈥� 听 Patrick 听
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Caleb Davison via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, November 12, 2020 4:37 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box 听 The best on-line tutorial on Stuffing Boxes is here:听听 Study it well before you attempt any boat yoga trying to access this spot. Scott spotted and noted the rustic looking hose clamps that should be replaced (and yes, you need 2 for all under waterline applications).听听 I will add that it is probably time to replace the packing (that goes into the stuffing box) as this is a maintenance/wear item that should be replaced something like every 10 years, or sooner.听 I believe the marinehowto page makes a reccommendation on which packing to use.听 Interestingly they do not call it "stuffing" that goes into a "stuffing box".听 It is more like you just put "stuff" in there that will wear down over time while keeping your boat mostly dry.听听 I have done this a couple of times and it is not so difficult that it can't be done with the boat in the water.听 You just need to plan ahead so the job goes smoothly and quickly.听 If you replace the packing material it may take some minor adjustments in the beginning to get the # of drips to where you want it.听 You should be able to get it mostly dry with the shaft not spinning and only a few drips per minute with the shaft rotating.
听
-----Original Message-----
From: aksjghkajshd <scott@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Nov 12, 2020 3:54 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Stuffing Box
In the picture, 4 doesn't look like it's immediately next to a nut
but it looks like 2 in the most astern nut and 3 the slightly forward
one.
2 and 3 are currently screwed against each other.听 3 is a "locknut".
Friction against 2 and against the threads keep it and 2 from moving.
So you'd back 3 off of 2 a bit, with a wrench on each, then tighten
2 a bit, then with two wrenches again, tighten 3 on to 2 while keeping
2 from moving.
It may be time to replace the stuffing in the stuffing box.
And that rusted stainless on the hose clamps is no good.听 Can you replace
those, one at a time?
Hmm, someone else was just telling me about stuffing boxes a few
months back.
Water looks incredible.
And yup, not a fun position.听 I spent a lot of time cleaning up bilge
paint and rough fiberglass under the stern tube before laying up more
fiberglass, apparently due to cracking from the wrong size cutlass
bearings being hammered in creating a spiderweb of cracks.
Good luck!
-scott
On听 0, patrick.mcgough@... wrote:
>听 听 How appropriate to be talking about stuffing 2 weeks before
>听 听 Thanksgiving...oh wait a second....not the same type of stuffing!!!!!
>
>
>听 听 I am looking for a little help here with my Tartan 27 and the stuffing
>听 听 box and the packing and adjustments.听 I have my Tartan 27 right out
>听 听 back on my pier so it is right here to monitor and keep an eye on, and
>听 听 so I went out to start her up and run her for a bit and check on the
>听 听 drip that is supposed to be 1-2 drops per minute is more like a steady
>听 听 stream.
>
>
>听 听 It is a tight fit for my 250# girth sliding in along the engine and so
>听 听 I want to make sure I get it right when I try and stop or slow this
>听 听 drop.
>
>听 听 Here is a picture.听 The drop is coming from right around #4.听 Is that
>听 听 where it is supposed to drip?听 What do I want to adjust and which way
>听 听 do I want to adjust them in?听 I can go take more pictures and video,
>听 听 but I thought labeling this picture might at least start a discussion.
>
>
>听 听 Thank you in advance for any help you can provide.听 I am not in risk of
>听 听 sinking as the water isn't that deep anyway...in the other picture you
>听 听 can see how she was high and dry just a little bit ago...
>
>
>听 听 [cid:image002.jpg@...]
>听 听 [cid:image004.jpg@...] 听
|
