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Fw: [psa-info] lecture
H. MacDonald
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýFor Your information...
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?The Konstanty Reynert Chair of Polish Studies in conjunction with The Adam Mickiewicz Foundation in Canada will present a lecture by ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ?Alexander J. Opalinski Ph.D. Candidate, Department of History ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? University of Toronto??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? The Deportations ofPolish Citizens to the USSR, 1940¨C41 ???? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? Tuesday, February 5th, 2002 ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? 7:30 PM
??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? Music Room, Hart House (University of Toronto) ? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? Free AdmissionCommunity email addresses: ? Post message: psa-info@... ? Subscribe:??? psa-info-subscribe@... ? Unsubscribe:? psa-info-unsubscribe@... ? List owner:?? psa-info-owner@... Shortcut URL to this page: ? Visit our Website: psa.sa.utoronto.ca Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the . |
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Re: Polish Deportations to USSR
Someone(Steve?) should arrange to have this material on our web
site. On 20 Jan 2002, at 13:23, chrisgladun wrote: The Konstanty Reynert Chair of Polish Studies in conjunction with The J Roy-Wojciechowski Honorary Consul, Republic of Poland 51 Granger Road, Howick, Auckland. NZ. Tel.649 534 4670. Fax. 649 535 4068 email(polish@...) website www.polishheritage.co.nz |
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Re: Polish Deportations to USSR
Yes Elizabeth, its all about knowledge not revenge.
On 20 Jan 2002, at 16:46, Elizabeth wrote: Chris, J Roy-Wojciechowski Honorary Consul, Republic of Poland 51 Granger Road, Howick, Auckland. NZ. Tel.649 534 4670. Fax. 649 535 4068 email(polish@...) website www.polishheritage.co.nz |
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Re: Polish Deportations to USSR
Elizabeth
Chris,
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When will you understand that NO ONE is a winner in war? We can discuss the question of monetary compensation till we are all blue in the face. Money cannot compensate for anything, least of all the loss of loved ones. This website is all about research, remembering and recognising (bringing to the attention of others) what happened to our families. It's not a platform for airing our personal views on "right" and "wrong" or "good" and "bad". Elizabeth ----- Original Message -----
From: "chrisgladun" <cgladun@...> To: <Kresy-Siberia@...> Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2002 2:23 PM Subject: [Kresy-Siberia] Polish Deportations to USSR The Konstanty Reynert Chair of Polish Studies in conjunction with The |
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Re: Polish Deportations to USSR
S'truth
What's the world coming to, a Russian Leader laying wreaths on a Capitalist tombs Amazing things can happen, now all we need is for them to return all of our belongings and we could possibly be quits Paul Yet Putin did lay a wreath at the monument to the Polish underground
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Polish Deportations to USSR
chrisgladun
The Konstanty Reynert Chair of Polish Studies in conjunction with The
Adam Mickiewicz Foundation in Canada will present a lecture by Alexander J. Opalinksi, Ph.D Candidate, Department of History, University of Toronto THE DEPORTATIONS OF POLISH CITIZENS TO THE USSR, 1940-41 on Tuesday. February 5th, 2002, 7:30 pm, Music Room, Hart House (University of Toronto) Free Admission Re admission of guilt/repartions/justice, by the Soviets/Russians to Poles for loss of property, suffering, slave-labour, during WWII and under Stalinism, I saw the news report on Polish TV (Toronto)on Putin's visit to Poland and meeting with Kwasniewski, where this question was brought up. Soviet citizens who were victims of Stalinism, have been acknowledged for some ten years, and are receiving compensation--even though it is a pittance. But as one Polish survivor stated: "We haven't received even one penny." Compensation presently is limited to those who were residing in the former lands of the USSR and still live there--I assume that the countless Polish graves there don't count. Putin stipulated that any comparison or linkage between Nazi crimes and Soviet crimes is not acceptable, and would not be productive. What gall! We are witnessing Russian dilution of the suffering of Poles and other nations at the hands of the Soviets--even as Stalin's son is heading a new party in Russia! Some Russian historians and writers still place Katyn at the hands of the Nazis, and Russian Historiography, especially its teaching, can only be described as revisionism, denial and whitewashing. Yet Putin did lay a wreath at the monument to the Polish underground and AK which would have been unthinkable a few years ago--but I doubt if it was shown by Moscow TV. Chris, Toronto |
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Re: Digest Number 102
H. MacDonald
The variances in camp descriptors are noted in Jan Gross' book, "Revolution
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from Abroad". He's very thorough in describing the variations in Soviet legitimization for deportations as well as the variations in camp 'experience' which is under the rubric "special resettlement" as "free labour", as opposed to penal settlement/labour. Helen. ----- Original Message -----
From: <Kresy-Siberia@...> To: <Kresy-Siberia@...> Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2002 4:35 AM Subject: [Kresy-Siberia] Digest Number 102 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ + KRESY-SIBERIA GROUP + Research, Remembrance, Recognition +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ + Websites: + +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ + Replies to this message will go directly to the full list. + Send e-mails to: Kresy-Siberia@... +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ + To SUBSCRIBE, send an e-mail to: + Kresy-Siberia-owner@... + saying who you are and your interest in the group +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ + To UNSUBSCRIBE from this group, send an email to: + Kresy-Siberia-unsubscribe@... +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ------------------------------------------------------------------------ There are 5 messages in this issue. Topics in this digest: 1. Work camps? in Russia From: Stefan Wisniowski <swisniowski@...> 2. Welcome Matt Lawson From: Stefan Wisniowski <swisniowski@...> 3. Welcome Matt Lawson From: Stefan Wisniowski <swisniowski@...> 4. Re: Work camps? in Russia From: "henrysokolowski" <hsokol@...> 5. standard for diacritical marks From: Stefan Wisniowski <swisniowski@...> ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ Message: 1 Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2002 00:38:49 +1100 From: Stefan Wisniowski <swisniowski@...> Subject: Work camps? in Russia Here is something from Elizabeth, with my rough translation on a line by line basis. I do not know about the details of the compensation claims, so can not answer. Is this something that Wanda in Canada can shed some light on? -- Stefan Wisniowski Moderator, Kresy-Siberia From: Elizabeth Olsson <elzunia@...>According to thee official terminology, these were not labour camps, but specjalne". RzTnica polega?a na tym, zTe "poprawcze obozy pracy"special settlements. The difference is based on the fact that "corrective labour camps" [also called GULAGs] przeznaczone by?y dla osb skazanych na pozbawienie wolnosci, natomiastwere reserved for people sentenced to loss of liberty, while "specposio?ki" ? dla zes?ancw, osb bez wyroku saodowego, wobec ktrych"specialposiolki" [special settlements] were for deportees, people without a court hearing, for whom zastosowano inny rodzaj represji ? mianowicie ograniczenie wolnosci."was arranged a different kind of repression - namely restriction of liberty.
________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ Message: 2 Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2002 01:06:50 +1100 From: Stefan Wisniowski <swisniowski@...> Subject: Welcome Matt Lawson Please welcome Matt Lawson to the group. He is in England, and is the grandson of Michael Krupa, the author of Shallow Graves In Siberia - the book I posted about recently. To read all about the true story, go to the website: Great to have you aboard, Matt. -- Stefan Wisniowski Moderator, Kresy-Siberia ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ Message: 3 Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2002 00:41:10 +1100 From: Stefan Wisniowski <swisniowski@...> Subject: Welcome Matt Lawson Please welcome Matt Lawson to the group. He is in England, and is the grandson of Michael Krupa, the author of Shallow Graves In Siberia - the book I posted about recently. To read all about the story, go to the website: . PS to any film-makers in the group, this story would make a fantastic true-life drama adventure. Great to have you aboard, Matt. Best regards, Stefan -- Stefan Wisniowski Moderator, Kresy-Siberia ---------- From: "Matt" <mrl@...> Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 07:29:23 -0000 To: <Kresy-Siberia-owner@...> Subject: subscribe hi please subscribe me to you group Matt Lawson Shallow Graves In Siberia - An amazing true story [This message contained attachments] ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ Message: 4 Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 18:23:34 -0000 From: "henrysokolowski" <hsokol@...> Subject: Re: Work camps? in Russia Stefan, Does our group follow a standard for diacritical marks? For example, my surname could be spelled Soko?owski. It would be handy. Henry --- In Kresy-Siberia@y..., Stefan Wisniowski <swisniowski@p...> wrote: Here is something from Elizabeth, with my rough translation on aline by line basis. I do not know about the details of the compensationclaims, so can not answer. Is this something that Wanda in Canada can shedsome light on?did it:you? It could be of interest to the Kresy group, if you translate "osiedle According to thee official terminology, these were not labour camps,but "correctivespecjalne". RzTnica polega?a na tym, zTe "poprawcze obozy pracy"special settlements. The difference is based on the fact that labour camps" [also called GULAGs]natomiastprzeznaczone by?y dla osb skazanych na pozbawienie wolnosci, were reserved for people sentenced to loss of liberty, whilektrych"specposio?ki" ? dla zes?ancw, osb bez wyroku saodowego, wobec "specialposiolki" [special settlements] were for deportees, peoplewithout a court hearing, for whomwolnosci."zastosowano inny rodzaj represji ? mianowicie ograniczenie was arranged a different kind of repression - namely restriction ofliberty. compensation. PrisonersHave you registered your family with "Former Polish Political in USSR (Canada) Inc."? ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ Message: 5 Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2002 17:06:53 +1100 From: Stefan Wisniowski <swisniowski@...> Subject: standard for diacritical marks No Henry, we have not adopted a standard for Polish diacritical marks (or accents). Perhaps we should just explain for the group what the various ways of representing the marks are, so that nobody is confused. Then I suggest that people use whatever approach is most convenient for them. First, the only complete letter supported by the standard keyboards as a character is "" or "". Everything else is a compromise of some kind. 1. Many of us just pretend diacritical marks do not exist, and write the letters without the marks (eg my surname is written as "Wisniowski" here in Australia.) 2. Others, and this seems to be a standard in the English e-mail world, use the tilde "~" after any letter with a diacritical mark. Hence "Wis~niowski". Similarly is written as o~, l~ means "l with a line/kreska", and so on. The ~ simply replaces the customary diacritical mark. 3. Polish speakers seem to access a different keyboard set, where actual marks are inserted after the letters, as in "Wisniowski". The exception is l~ which comes out as "?" (the more obvious "" is sometimes also used). Since I do not know how to generate the Polish keyboard on my own Australian keyboard (there may be a tricky technological way), I will list them here as copied from authentic Polish e-mails for the cut-and-paste convenience of any intrepid Polish writers without access to a Polish keyboard. ao Ao c C eo Eo n N ? s S zT ZT z Z Until Microsoft, Apple and everyone else bring in standard Polish, I suggest we all become aware of all of these imperfect approaches. -- Stefan Wisniowski Moderator, Kresy-Siberia
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Re: New website - families of Katyn officers
Stefan
Good site, I've just found out that a few of my family(Szostak) were killed in Katyn something else to do research on Paul At 01:42 01/20/2002 +1100, you wrote: I would like to refer you to an interesting website which is new (for me
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Home page;?? Eastern Borderlands of II RP; ? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ |
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New website - families of Katyn officers
Stefan Wisniowski
I would like to refer you to an interesting website which is new (for me
anyway). is about the widows of the Polish Officers captured by the Soviets and murdered at Katyn and other places. The website translates the Polish book "Written with Love" by the families of the killed officers. As families of Polish officers, most were deported by the Soviets to labour in camps in Kazakhstan, and - unlike those who joined Anders army and evacuated to Persia and England - they returned to Poland after the war. Their stories provide glimpses of prewar Poland as well as of the deportation experience. Please visit the site and read the stories if you get the chance. -- Stefan Wisniowski Moderator, Kresy-Siberia |
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new web-site
Stefan,
just read those stories, wonderful web-site, thanks,??? janie :-) I would like to refer you to an interesting website which is new (for me anyway).? http://www.katynfamilies.com/ is about the? widows of the Polish Officers captured by the Soviets and murdered at Katyn and other places. |
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Re: First message
Fran Biber
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýMy father (came to Australia, Dec 1950) had to sign a contract to work for
2 years where ever he was sent. He ended up with the PMG (Postmaster General
Dept) doing pick and shovel work building manholes for telephones etc. Others
worked for the Railways or the State Electricity Commission. A lot of people
remained working in those jobs till they retired.
Frania
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Re: Posiolek Gorna Kamionka
Stefan Wisniowski
Henry
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Thanks for sharing this. I believe that the archives are a gold mine, which only a few have prospected in so far. Not all families left depositions, though - I envy your "find". Armed with this information, you can surely now get Soviet archive database information from Alexander Guryanov if you have not already done so! -- Stefan Wisniowski Moderator, Kresy-Siberia From: "henrysokolowski" <hsokol@...> |
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Posiolek Gorna Kamionka
henrysokolowski
Good Evening to All,
I would like to thank Irena Czernichowska of the Hoover Archive for sending me a copy of my father's Second Corps debriefing statement. I am extremely happy that, along with a copy of the original handwritten statement, Irene sent me a copy of the typed transcript. I simply cannot read my father's beautiful cursive script. It turns out that he and his family were deported to a Posiolek (posio?ek) called Gorna (Go'rna) Kamionka also known by various spellings of Viechnaya Kamionka. It was about 60 km north of the railway station called Nowa Zaimka Onieskiej Oblasti, more or less halfway between Omsk and Sverdlovsk. It belonged to the Yurginsky region of Omsk Oblast although this does not look correct on a modern map. There were 45 families (3 of them Ukrainian) and 4 singles for a total of 142 deportees from the powiats of Sambor and Dobromil. The specific places they came from are: " Felsztyn, Gleboka (G?e,boka), Czaple (kolonis'ci z Zachodu - colonists from the west), dwie rodziny z (2 families from) Laszek Murowanych, 1 family from Szumincy, 1 family from Bylic, 1 z okolic (1 from the vicinity of) Drohobycza, i reszta z (and the rest from) Lozow (?ozo'w) powiata dobromilskiego (kolonis'ci od Krosna - colonists from Krosno)." That first summer of 1940 they had an epidemic of Typhus and some 20 people died. In total, by August 1942, 32 of the original 142 had died (not quite 25%). Almost half were children or teenagers. For some reason, my father wrote down the names of the deceased. Here are the surnames: Materna, Szajna, Skraba, Dolenko (Do?en'ko), Biskup, Hawret, Kondziolka (Kondzio?ka), Panek, Bachman, Antosz, Zak, Czarnota, Domaradzki, Prystoj, Cynkar, Batycka, Kwolek, Rysz, Horysniak (Horys'niak). The archives must be a gold mine if there exist thousands of statements such as this. Henry Sokolowski |
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Odp: From Linder Stachnik - question?
Wladyslaw Czapski
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From Linder Stachnik - question?
Linder Ladbrooke
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýHi Group,
?
Can anyone help me find a 1939-1941 map of 'the
former USSR' on the net? My father joined the Anders-Sikorski Army in 1942,
after being released from a 'camp'. He enlisted at 'ISDUD'. which I'm told was a
small village, taken over by the Russians and used to gather all the men that
wanted to enlist.
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If I could find the right map, then I could also
see if the 8 'camps' that our friend in Moscow mentioned, were anywhere nearby.
[Perhaps near a railway line?]
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Any help appreciated
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Linder????????? |
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standard for diacritical marks
Stefan Wisniowski
No Henry, we have not adopted a standard for Polish diacritical marks (or
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accents). Perhaps we should just explain for the group what the various ways of representing the marks are, so that nobody is confused. Then I suggest that people use whatever approach is most convenient for them. First, the only complete letter supported by the standard keyboards as a character is "¨®" or "?". Everything else is a compromise of some kind. 1. Many of us just pretend diacritical marks do not exist, and write the letters without the marks (eg my surname is written as "Wisniowski" here in Australia.) 2. Others, and this seems to be a standard in the English e-mail world, use the tilde "~" after any letter with a diacritical mark. Hence "Wis~niowski". Similarly ¨® is written as o~, l~ means "l with a line/kreska", and so on. The ~ simply replaces the customary diacritical mark. 3. Polish speakers seem to access a different keyboard set, where actual marks are inserted after the letters, as in "Wis?niowski". The exception is l~ which comes out as "?" (the more obvious "?" is sometimes also used). Since I do not know how to generate the Polish keyboard on my own Australian keyboard (there may be a tricky technological way), I will list them here as copied from authentic Polish e-mails for the cut-and-paste convenience of any intrepid Polish writers without access to a Polish keyboard. a? A? c? C? e? E? n? N? ? ¨® ? s? S? z? Z? z? Z? Until Microsoft, Apple and everyone else bring in standard Polish, I suggest we all become aware of all of these imperfect approaches. -- Stefan Wisniowski Moderator, Kresy-Siberia
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Re: Work camps? in Russia
henrysokolowski
Stefan,
Does our group follow a standard for diacritical marks? For example, my surname could be spelled Soko?owski. It would be handy. Henry --- In Kresy-Siberia@y..., Stefan Wisniowski <swisniowski@p...> wrote: Here is something from Elizabeth, with my rough translation on aline by line basis. I do not know about the details of the compensationclaims, so can not answer. Is this something that Wanda in Canada can shedsome light on?did it:you? It could be of interest to the Kresy group, if you translate "osiedle According to thee official terminology, these were not labour camps,but "correctivespecjalne". R¨®z?nica polega?a na tym, z?e "poprawcze obozy pracy"special settlements. The difference is based on the fact that labour camps" [also called GULAGs]natomiastprzeznaczone by?y dla os¨®b skazanych na pozbawienie wolnos?ci, were reserved for people sentenced to loss of liberty, while°ì³Ù¨®°ù²â³¦³ó"specposio?ki" ? dla zes?an?c¨®w, os¨®b bez wyroku sa?dowego, wobec "specialposiolki" [special settlements] were for deportees, peoplewithout a court hearing, for whomwolnos?ci."zastosowano inny rodzaj represji ? mianowicie ograniczenie was arranged a different kind of repression - namely restriction ofliberty. compensation. PrisonersHave you registered your family with "Former Polish Political in USSR (Canada) Inc."? |
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Welcome Matt Lawson
Stefan Wisniowski
Please welcome Matt Lawson to the group. He is in England, and is the
grandson of Michael Krupa, the author of Shallow Graves In Siberia - the book I posted about recently. To read all about the true story, go to the website: Great to have you aboard, Matt. -- Stefan Wisniowski Moderator, Kresy-Siberia |
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Welcome Matt Lawson
Stefan Wisniowski
Please welcome Matt Lawson to the group. ?He is in ?England, and is the grandson of Michael Krupa, the author of Shallow Graves In Siberia - the book I posted about recently. ?To read all about the story, go to the website: ?http://go.to/shallowgraves.
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PS to any film-makers in the group, this story would make a fantastic true-life drama adventure. Great to have you aboard, Matt. Best regards, Stefan -- Stefan Wisniowski Moderator, Kresy-Siberia ---------- hi please subscribe me to you group |
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Work camps? in Russia
Stefan Wisniowski
Here is something from Elizabeth, with my rough translation on a line by
line basis. I do not know about the details of the compensation claims, so can not answer. Is this something that Wanda in Canada can shed some light on? -- Stefan Wisniowski Moderator, Kresy-Siberia From: Elizabeth Olsson <elzunia@...>According to thee official terminology, these were not labour camps, but specjalne". R¨®z?nica polega?a na tym, z?e "poprawcze obozy pracy"special settlements. The difference is based on the fact that "corrective labour camps" [also called GULAGs] przeznaczone by?y dla os¨®b skazanych na pozbawienie wolnos?ci, natomiastwere reserved for people sentenced to loss of liberty, while "specposio?ki" ? dla zes?an?c¨®w, os¨®b bez wyroku sa?dowego, wobec °ì³Ù¨®°ù²â³¦³ó"specialposiolki" [special settlements] were for deportees, people without a court hearing, for whom zastosowano inny rodzaj represji ? mianowicie ograniczenie wolnos?ci."was arranged a different kind of repression - namely restriction of liberty.
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