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Hi,
Q1: Would a LLMC result in concealment loss for units that fail and break?
Q2: Would a LLTC result in concealment loss for units that fail and become pinned?
Context: In our scenario example, a DFPh shot affected the non-concealed units (including the leader who broke) and had no affect on the concealed units. According to the Concealment Loss Chart: - If a LLMC breaks a unit it loses concealment
- If a LLTC pins a unit it would not lose its concealment
Thanks, —笔补耻濒
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I also found A12.141 Actions: ? LLTC/LLMC, attempts to entrench, set a Fire, Deploy, Recombine, make a Sniper Check or PF/MOL/ATMM check, rally a broken unit, engage in Clearance attempts, change CA, apply a leadership modifier to anything other than a PAATC, or place SMOKE grenades are examples of actions that cause loss of concealment.
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Hi,
Q1: Would a LLMC result in concealment loss for units that fail and break?
Q2: Would a LLTC result in concealment loss for units that fail and become pinned?
Context: In our scenario example, a DFPh shot affected the non-concealed units (including the leader who broke) and had no affect on the concealed units. According to the Concealment Loss Chart: - If a LLMC breaks a unit it loses concealment
- If a LLTC pins a unit it would not lose its concealment
Thanks, —笔补耻濒
|
Go by the Concealment Loss table. The rules themselves list that as the go-to. I believe take a TC/MC is on there.
On Wed, Mar 26, 2025, 3:58 PM Paul Chicoine via <Paul_Chicoine= [email protected]> wrote: I also found A12.141 Actions: ? LLTC/LLMC, attempts to entrench, set a Fire, Deploy, Recombine, make a Sniper Check or PF/MOL/ATMM check, rally a broken unit, engage in Clearance attempts, change CA, apply a leadership modifier to anything other than a PAATC, or place SMOKE grenades are examples of actions that cause loss of concealment.
Hi,
Q1: Would a LLMC result in concealment loss for units that fail and break?
Q2: Would a LLTC result in concealment loss for units that fail and become pinned?
Context: In our scenario example, a DFPh shot affected the non-concealed units (including the leader who broke) and had no affect on the concealed units. According to the Concealment Loss Chart: - If a LLMC breaks a unit it loses concealment
- If a LLTC pins a unit it would not lose its concealment
Thanks, —笔补耻濒
|
Thanks Carl, I might need new glasses… I don’t see it on the chart, which is why I’m asking. ? The chart doesn’t list taking or failing LLTC but A12.141 has it listed as an example.
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Go by the Concealment Loss table. The rules themselves list that as the go-to. I believe take a TC/MC is on there.
On Wed, Mar 26, 2025, 3:58 PM Paul Chicoine via <Paul_Chicoine= [email protected]> wrote: I also found A12.141 Actions: ? LLTC/LLMC, attempts to entrench, set a Fire, Deploy, Recombine, make a Sniper Check or PF/MOL/ATMM check, rally a broken unit, engage in Clearance attempts, change CA, apply a leadership modifier to anything other than a PAATC, or place SMOKE grenades are examples of actions that cause loss of concealment.
Hi,
Q1: Would a LLMC result in concealment loss for units that fail and break?
Q2: Would a LLTC result in concealment loss for units that fail and become pinned?
Context: In our scenario example, a DFPh shot affected the non-concealed units (including the leader who broke) and had no affect on the concealed units. According to the Concealment Loss Chart: - If a LLMC breaks a unit it loses concealment
- If a LLTC pins a unit it would not lose its concealment
Thanks, —笔补耻濒
|
I am at the hotel right now so no chart handy, but attacked resulting in a MC/TC is on that chart somewhere.
On Wed, Mar 26, 2025, 4:06 PM Paul Chicoine via <Paul_Chicoine= [email protected]> wrote: Thanks Carl, I might need new glasses… I don’t see it on the chart, which is why I’m asking. ? The chart doesn’t list taking or failing LLTC but A12.141 has it listed as an example.
Go by the Concealment Loss table. The rules themselves list that as the go-to. I believe take a TC/MC is on there.
On Wed, Mar 26, 2025, 3:58 PM Paul Chicoine via <Paul_Chicoine= [email protected]> wrote: I also found A12.141 Actions: ? LLTC/LLMC, attempts to entrench, set a Fire, Deploy, Recombine, make a Sniper Check or PF/MOL/ATMM check, rally a broken unit, engage in Clearance attempts, change CA, apply a leadership modifier to anything other than a PAATC, or place SMOKE grenades are examples of actions that cause loss of concealment.
Hi,
Q1: Would a LLMC result in concealment loss for units that fail and break?
Q2: Would a LLTC result in concealment loss for units that fail and become pinned?
Context: In our scenario example, a DFPh shot affected the non-concealed units (including the leader who broke) and had no affect on the concealed units. According to the Concealment Loss Chart: - If a LLMC breaks a unit it loses concealment
- If a LLTC pins a unit it would not lose its concealment
Thanks, —笔补耻濒
|
The shot completely missed the concealed units and only affected the unconcealed units (see context below). ? It was a DFPh shot that affected the unconcealed units but had not affect on the concealed units (off the chart), but the unconcealed 9-1 broke, meaning everyone in the location needed to take a -1TC (LLTC) including the concealed guys. ?My questions are specific to that of taking either LLMC and LLTC. ? Chart and A12.141 differ. so that is why the lawyers need to get involved. ?I checked the latest version of the chart.
Thanks,
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I am at the hotel right now so no chart handy, but attacked resulting in a MC/TC is on that chart somewhere.? On Wed, Mar 26, 2025, 4:06 PM Paul Chicoine via ??<Paul_Chicoine= [email protected]> wrote: Thanks Carl, I might need new glasses… I don’t see it on the chart, which is why I’m asking. ? The chart doesn’t list taking or failing LLTC but A12.141 has it listed as an example.
Go by the Concealment Loss table. The rules themselves list that as the go-to. I believe take a TC/MC is on there. On Wed, Mar 26, 2025, 3:58 PM Paul Chicoine via ??<Paul_Chicoine= [email protected]> wrote: I also found ?A12.141 Actions: ? LLTC/LLMC, attempts to entrench, set a Fire, Deploy, Recombine, make a Sniper Check or PF/MOL/ATMM check, rally a broken unit, engage in Clearance attempts, change CA, apply a leadership modifier to anything other than a PAATC, or place SMOKE grenades?are examples of actions that cause loss of concealment.
Hi,
Q1:?Would a?LLMC?result in concealment loss for units that fail and break?
Q2:?Would a?LLTC?result in concealment loss for units that fail and become pinned?
Context:?In our scenario example, a DFPh shot affected the non-concealed units (including the leader who broke) and had no affect on the concealed units. According to the Concealment Loss Chart: - If a?LLMC?breaks a unit it loses concealment
- If a?LLTC?pins a unit it would?not?lose its concealment
Thanks, —笔补耻濒
|
Another interesting fact. ?The original first printing of the ASL rules had "LLMC/LLTC” omitted in A12.141. ? This was added later to A12.141, however they did not update the Concealment Loss Chart. ?The list in A12.141 is exactly like the line in the chart, the difference being the “LLMC/LLTC” reference.
In my opinion, AH/MMP intentionally added it to A12.141, so I would favor that either LLMC/LLTC is a concealment loss regardless of passing/failing, despite the chart not listing it.
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I am at the hotel right now so no chart handy, but attacked resulting in a MC/TC is on that chart somewhere.? On Wed, Mar 26, 2025, 4:06 PM Paul Chicoine via ??<Paul_Chicoine= [email protected]> wrote: Thanks Carl, I might need new glasses… I don’t see it on the chart, which is why I’m asking. ? The chart doesn’t list taking or failing LLTC but A12.141 has it listed as an example.
Go by the Concealment Loss table. The rules themselves list that as the go-to. I believe take a TC/MC is on there. On Wed, Mar 26, 2025, 3:58 PM Paul Chicoine via ??<Paul_Chicoine= [email protected]> wrote: I also found ?A12.141 Actions: ? LLTC/LLMC, attempts to entrench, set a Fire, Deploy, Recombine, make a Sniper Check or PF/MOL/ATMM check, rally a broken unit, engage in Clearance attempts, change CA, apply a leadership modifier to anything other than a PAATC, or place SMOKE grenades?are examples of actions that cause loss of concealment.
Hi,
Q1:?Would a?LLMC?result in concealment loss for units that fail and break?
Q2:?Would a?LLTC?result in concealment loss for units that fail and become pinned?
Context:?In our scenario example, a DFPh shot affected the non-concealed units (including the leader who broke) and had no affect on the concealed units. According to the Concealment Loss Chart: - If a?LLMC?breaks a unit it loses concealment
- If a?LLTC?pins a unit it would?not?lose its concealment
Thanks, —笔补耻濒
|
This lawyer thinks that is the right interpretation - the later rules revision is highly probative if not dispositive.?
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On Mar 26, 2025, at 16:30, Paul Chicoine via groups.io <Paul_Chicoine@...> wrote:
Another interesting fact. ?The original first printing of the ASL rules had "LLMC/LLTC” omitted in A12.141. ? This was added later to A12.141, however they did not update the Concealment Loss Chart. ?The list in A12.141 is exactly like the line in the chart, the difference being the “LLMC/LLTC” reference.
In my opinion, AH/MMP intentionally added it to A12.141, so I would favor that either LLMC/LLTC is a concealment loss regardless of passing/failing, despite the chart not listing it.
I am at the hotel right now so no chart handy, but attacked resulting in a MC/TC is on that chart somewhere.? On Wed, Mar 26, 2025, 4:06 PM Paul Chicoine via ??<Paul_Chicoine= [email protected]> wrote: Thanks Carl, I might need new glasses… I don’t see it on the chart, which is why I’m asking. ? The chart doesn’t list taking or failing LLTC but A12.141 has it listed as an example.
Go by the Concealment Loss table. The rules themselves list that as the go-to. I believe take a TC/MC is on there. On Wed, Mar 26, 2025, 3:58 PM Paul Chicoine via ??<Paul_Chicoine= [email protected]> wrote: I also found ?A12.141 Actions: ? LLTC/LLMC, attempts to entrench, set a Fire, Deploy, Recombine, make a Sniper Check or PF/MOL/ATMM check, rally a broken unit, engage in Clearance attempts, change CA, apply a leadership modifier to anything other than a PAATC, or place SMOKE grenades?are examples of actions that cause loss of concealment.
Hi,
Q1:?Would a?LLMC?result in concealment loss for units that fail and break?
Q2:?Would a?LLTC?result in concealment loss for units that fail and become pinned?
Context:?In our scenario example, a DFPh shot affected the non-concealed units (including the leader who broke) and had no affect on the concealed units. According to the Concealment Loss Chart: - If a?LLMC?breaks a unit it loses concealment
- If a?LLTC?pins a unit it would?not?lose its concealment
Thanks, —笔补耻濒
|
This is a family show. Watch that language Mark ;-).
This lawyer thinks that is the right interpretation - the later rules revision is highly probative if not dispositive.? On Mar 26, 2025, at 16:30, Paul Chicoine via <Paul_Chicoine= [email protected]> wrote:
Another interesting fact.? The original first printing of the ASL rules had "LLMC/LLTC” omitted in A12.141. ? This was added later to A12.141, however they did not update the Concealment Loss Chart.? The list in A12.141 is exactly like the line in the chart, the difference being the “LLMC/LLTC” reference.
In my opinion, AH/MMP intentionally added it to A12.141, so I would favor that either LLMC/LLTC is a concealment loss regardless of passing/failing, despite the chart not listing it.
I am at the hotel right now so no chart handy, but attacked resulting in a MC/TC is on that chart somewhere.? On Wed, Mar 26, 2025, 4:06 PM Paul Chicoine via ??<Paul_Chicoine= [email protected]> wrote: Thanks Carl, I might need new glasses… I don’t see it on the chart, which is why I’m asking. ? The chart doesn’t list taking or failing LLTC but A12.141 has it listed as an example.
Go by the Concealment Loss table. The rules themselves list that as the go-to. I believe take a TC/MC is on there. On Wed, Mar 26, 2025, 3:58 PM Paul Chicoine via ??<Paul_Chicoine= [email protected]> wrote: I also found ?A12.141 Actions: ? LLTC/LLMC, attempts to entrench, set a Fire, Deploy, Recombine, make a Sniper Check or PF/MOL/ATMM check, rally a broken unit, engage in Clearance attempts, change CA, apply a leadership modifier to anything other than a PAATC, or place SMOKE grenades?are examples of actions that cause loss of concealment.
Hi,
Q1:?Would a?LLMC?result in concealment loss for units that fail and break?
Q2:?Would a?LLTC?result in concealment loss for units that fail and become pinned?
Context:?In our scenario example, a DFPh shot affected the non-concealed units (including the leader who broke) and had no affect on the concealed units. According to the Concealment Loss Chart: - If a?LLMC?breaks a unit it loses concealment
- If a?LLTC?pins a unit it would?not?lose its concealment
Thanks, —笔补耻濒
|
Yes. Interesting observation on the chart though. Carl
On Wed, Mar 26, 2025, 4:30 PM Paul Chicoine via <Paul_Chicoine= [email protected]> wrote: Another interesting fact.? The original first printing of the ASL rules had "LLMC/LLTC” omitted in A12.141. ? This was added later to A12.141, however they did not update the Concealment Loss Chart.? The list in A12.141 is exactly like the line in the chart, the difference being the “LLMC/LLTC” reference.
In my opinion, AH/MMP intentionally added it to A12.141, so I would favor that either LLMC/LLTC is a concealment loss regardless of passing/failing, despite the chart not listing it.
I am at the hotel right now so no chart handy, but attacked resulting in a MC/TC is on that chart somewhere.? On Wed, Mar 26, 2025, 4:06 PM Paul Chicoine via ??<Paul_Chicoine= [email protected]> wrote: Thanks Carl, I might need new glasses… I don’t see it on the chart, which is why I’m asking. ? The chart doesn’t list taking or failing LLTC but A12.141 has it listed as an example.
Go by the Concealment Loss table. The rules themselves list that as the go-to. I believe take a TC/MC is on there. On Wed, Mar 26, 2025, 3:58 PM Paul Chicoine via ??<Paul_Chicoine= [email protected]> wrote: I also found ?A12.141 Actions: ? LLTC/LLMC, attempts to entrench, set a Fire, Deploy, Recombine, make a Sniper Check or PF/MOL/ATMM check, rally a broken unit, engage in Clearance attempts, change CA, apply a leadership modifier to anything other than a PAATC, or place SMOKE grenades?are examples of actions that cause loss of concealment.
Hi,
Q1:?Would a?LLMC?result in concealment loss for units that fail and break?
Q2:?Would a?LLTC?result in concealment loss for units that fail and become pinned?
Context:?In our scenario example, a DFPh shot affected the non-concealed units (including the leader who broke) and had no affect on the concealed units. According to the Concealment Loss Chart: - If a?LLMC?breaks a unit it loses concealment
- If a?LLTC?pins a unit it would?not?lose its concealment
Thanks, —笔补耻濒
|
