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I had a go at making my first homebrew board last week, using a marker pen, some etchant and a needle. First I set out the design using software I borrowed called Easy PC. I printed the pin locations on transfer paper and ironed it to the back of the board. Then I put the needle into an electric drill, and made the holes. Next I drew the tracks onto the copper side, and experimented putting it into etchant for different lengths of time, until finally the unwanted copper was gone. Then I rinsed and cleaned it. Okay, I think I learnt the following:- 1. A needle leaves indentations on both sides of the board. (not good) 2. Life is easier if the holes are far apart. 3. Life is easier if the holes are far apart.

Hi, I think everyone on the list should take a look on this link on the "direct PCB plot section". Seem pretty much doable, even more for the fortunate ones that have a CNC mill around. Regular size pens could be used. http://hem2.passagen.se/sm0vpo/ Best regards, Alexandre Guimaraes

I have posted a chunk of the HP Graphics Language on my site: www.tech-diy.com , i.e. the instruction set, an example etc.

If there is interest I will put up the HP G/L code on one of my web- pages. HP/Agilent provides a little support for these old, workhorse products, but not much. I also have a "fix" for converting the Gerber output produced by Ultiboard to something which will plot on an HP7475 in minutes instead of hours. The old serial plotters go for a few tens of dollars on EBay. Jack

There is a commercial product designed to make PCB's with plotters; it includes the copper. First you plot on the copper with the right ink, then you stick the copper to substrate, then you etch. Jan Axelson's book on PCB's has the address (I don't have the book or specifics) for the materials. Grant

I posted quite a few pages, there's more to do, but you will get the idea. It's on www.tech-diy.com you can play around with the codes, create a "*.txt" file and send it with the following commands: mode com1:9600,n,8,1,p copy myfile.txt com1 I use WordPad instead of NotePad, as WordPad has "find and replace". I've taken apart some of the Gerber files generated by Ultiboard -- they can be quite simplified -- the most annoying and time consuming is the AA -- arc absolute -- in Ultiboard a 1% angle is specified -- this can and should be changed using "find and replace" in Wordpad.

I have been playing with the various types of paper I can find (coated, shiny, plastic foils etc). So far I have had the best luck with an 80lb plain polished paper (it is quite shiny but no coating I can detect). The combination that has worked the best is preheat the board for 3 minutes and iron with gentle pressure (ie a little more than the weight of the iron) for 30 seconds. The problem I am having is getting the paper off when I have finished ironing. If I soak it overnight I am fine but I would like to speed up the softening process. Any suggestions? I was thinking of boiling water but I suspect that will soften the toner to much. Are there any safe chemicals that will soften the paper but not destroy the copper or my kitchen? My second question is if anybody knows of a way to get the printer to deposit more toner. I am using an HP 1200 laserjet (which is great) but I am getting better results if I run the paper through twice. The problem with this is I don't always get perfect registration. Brian

How do other folks handle vias on double sided pcbs? I have tried two methods 1. WIRE Place a hole close to each via and use this to solder in a piece of wire. I put a letter "v" in copper on the bottom side of board next to the hole so I can quickly check that all the vias are taken care of. Of course this means you have to drill more pcb holes. 2. INSERTS I got some gold plated MillMax inserts that fit into a drill hole and are hollow and big enough for typical resistor and dip leads. I think the OD is about 0.039". You have to be careful when you solder them in because the solder tends to wick into the hole. I do not have the part number now and the last time I looked no one (Digikey has some MillMax) was carrying them. This seems to be the neatist solution to the hombrew via problem. However I only have a few left, so I will have to find another source. If I have to buy thousands, is anyone interested in a group buy? Comments? Dave The Inexpensive Seismometer Project http://www.infiltec.com/seismo

Hey guys, for anyone interested, I have started a new PIC C SIG for anyone interested in PIC micros and C. Come on in and check it out. It's at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/micropicc/ Jason KE4NYV

I was messing around with all these old blue sheets. Then I thought about others that wanted to silk-screen the component side of the board. So I took the old Blue sheet and ironed on the finished component side. Sure enough it sticks better on the bare PCB than on copper and has a nice blue lettering. I used scotch bright on it and it doesn't come off just lightened up. It didn't stick where there were holes, so you need to put it on before you drill. I'd have to say blue sheets work great as a cheap silk screen. Derek

I have quite a few blue-sheets that have PCB designs on them. They have mistakes in the routes so I could not use them. If someone would like a sheet or two let me know. This is a good way to get your ironing skills down before you use a good sheet. Just use Lacquer thinner to remove the traces and use the board again. Or if someone knows how to remove the toner from the blue sheet without hurting the sheet let me know. Derek

Jason - Just in case you are not aware of the PicList, here is the link for information: http://www.piclist.com This was a very active list. Many experts willing to share. I got busy and had to unsubscribe, but I am sure it is still a valuable resource, in case you were not aware of it. Mike > Message: 3 > Date: Tue, 08 Jan 2002 23:59:14 -0000 > From: "ke4nyv" <ke4nyv@...> > Subject: New PIC C SIG > > Hey guys, for anyone interested, I have started a new PIC C SIG for > anyone interested in PIC micros and C. Come on in and check it out. > > It's at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/micropicc/ > > Jason KE4NYV >

Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the Homebrew_PCBs group. File : /PCB Software/TC1-3/tcizip.exe Uploaded by : hightechsystems1 <hightechsystems@...> Description : Free PCB layout Software in French not crippled has gerber too You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBs/files/PCB%20Software/TC1-3/tcizip.exe To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, hightechsystems1 <hightechsystems@...>

Does anyone have any experience connecting an HP7550A plotter to Windows 2000? I am having some problems with cables and drivers. I plan on using this plotter to directly plot onto a PCB for etching if I can get it to work. Thanks Daryl Owen

Bob Bozarth You sent me a email virus. If this is an accident you need to fix it. To all on list do not open Humor.mp3.scr Derek

First off, let's take this off list. 2nd, get a virus checker. You should be running one. My wife wasn't, her computer got infected without even getting it by email, we think it was from someone's website. 3 days after she started running without a virus checker, Norton Antivirus reported more than 2000 infected files, none could be cleaned but only quarantined. I ended up doing an FDisk, Format, and Reinstall. 3rd, -don't- -open- -executable- -attachments-! Not without scanning with a current virus checker first, and even then if you weren't expecting it, don't open it. So many people tell me, "But I only open them if they are from someone I know!" Well, duh, that is how the virus propogates. It uses your list of email addresses so you are SENDING IT TO PEOPLE YOU KNOW!! 4th, change your default settings in Windblows- set it so you can see the three letter extension for -all- filetypes. IE, turn off "hide extension for registered file types". Note the name of the virus below- If Windblows hides the ".scr" (script), then it looks like an MP3. About the only things that can't hide viruses these days are JPG, GIF, PNG, RTF, and TXT files. Please, last word on the list on viruses. Try the newsgroup alt.comp.anti-virus and you'll get a lot more experienced people. http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&group=alt.comp.anti-virus I use Norton AntiVirus from Symantec. You can download a 30 day trial version. http://www.symantec.com Steve, moderator --- Bob Bozarth <jbdetails@...> wrote: > How could this happen? I've got notices from > other people complaining > about the same thing. How do I fix it? I've never > had this problem before. > Bob > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "High Tech" <hightechsystems@...> > To: <Homebrew_PCBs@...> > Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2002 2:01 PM > Subject: RE: [Homebrew_PCBs] Warning! > > > > Bob Bozarth > > You sent me a email virus. If this is an accident > you need to fix it. > > To all on list do not open Humor.mp3.scr > > Derek > > -----Original Message----- > > From: ROBERT L BOZARTH JR. > [mailto:jbdetails@...] > > Sent: Tuesday, January 08, 2002 11:07 PM > > To: Homebrew_PCBs@... > > Subject: Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Blue Sheets > > > > > > I would like to try some, I need practice. What > is your email address so > I > > can send you my mailing address? > > > > Bob Bozarth > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "High Tech" <hightechsystems@...> > > To: <Homebrew_PCBs@...> > > Sent: Monday, January 07, 2002 12:45 PM > > Subject: [Homebrew_PCBs] Blue Sheets > > > > > > > I have quite a few blue-sheets that have PCB > designs on them. They > have > > > mistakes in the routes so I could not use > them. > > > If someone would like a sheet or two let me > know. This is a good way > to > > get > > > your ironing skills down before you use a good > sheet. Just use Lacquer > > > thinner to remove the traces and use the board > again. > > > Or if someone knows how to remove the toner > from the blue sheet > without > > > hurting the sheet let me know. > > > Derek > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > > > Homebrew_PCBs-unsubscribe@... > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > > ADVERTISEMENT > > > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > > Homebrew_PCBs-unsubscribe@... > > > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > Homebrew_PCBs-unsubscribe@... > > > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > > > > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > Homebrew_PCBs-unsubscribe@... > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE video emails in Yahoo! Mail! http://promo.yahoo.com/videomail/

I use Ultiboard, so have the option of generating output in HP Graphics Language or Gerber. Looking at the file of the same project produced in the two languages, it seems to me that it would be fastest to use a translation of Gerber to HP G/L -- convert the "tools" that Gerber flashes for different pad sizes and trace widths to different pen sizes. With HP G/L and Ultiboard, a circle is drawn with the "Arc Absolute" command, using a chord angle of 1 degree. This is very slow. I use "Search and Replace" to change the chord angle to 15 or 30 degrees which speeds it up dramatically. I guess you could use "Search and Replace" to draw a circle using CI, but this assumes that the current pen position is the center of the circle (which it is not) and you need to recalculate the coordinates with a little trig to determine the true center of a circle.

I'm fed up with Easy-PC and put it up for auction at eBay. http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1322475745&r=0& t=0&showTutorial=0&ed=1011923141&indexURL=0&rd=1

I gave myself a Christmas present, the current edition of the ARRL's "Hints and Kinks". The author recommends Staedler Lumocolor 318's which he fits into one of the refillable plotter pens. (That is, he cuts the marker with a utility knife and fits it, tip and all, into the carcass of refillable pen. (I guess that it's kind of messy, but that hasn't stopped any of us in the past.) HP7475 pcb construction: " FAST AND EASY PRINTED CIRCUIT BOARDS Like many hams, I prefer to build some of my gear. I started etching my own PC boards several years ago, and I have tried several methods. The least expensive approach is hand-drawing the pattern on the board with a permanent marker. This can be very time consuming and does not easily permit a good parts density, so it wastes copper.

I've started a group called SumoRobot. Sumo Robots or SumoBots are small robots that try and push each other out of a small flat ring area. They are -not- supposed to damage each other. There are numerous weight classes from Ant-weight of several hundred grams to Japanese Sumo class at 3 to 5Kg. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sumorobot/ I intend to advertize to get people to the list. Other robotics lists are more general than I am looking for. I'm interested personally in the autonomous 500g Sumo Robots but discussion of other Sumo Robot classes is welcome and invited. I've already posted a small number of links in the Bookmarks section there. I'm interested in more links, especially to suppliers of motors, gearing, wheels, and pre-geared motors. Steve Greenfield Team Evil Genius __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE video emails in Yahoo! Mail! http://promo.yahoo.com/videomail/