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File : /Antennas/CounterpoiseKit/CountepoiseKit.txt
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sv1uy@...

Hi guys and gals,

Here is a nice article that Dale, W8ABZ sent me and I got permission to
upload it here at the HFpack group or other groups so that others may
benefit by it. This kit is made of 6 pieces of speaker, or whatever
multistranded insulated wire, each wire having a small socket on either end
similar to banana sockets and plugs. By connecting together at least 2
pieces at a time, you have the counterpoise you need for each band. So by
using variuos combinations of these 6 pieces you can cover all bands between
80 and 6 meters.

I built this nice kit and I tested it in all bands except for 80m. Sorry
guys I forgot to test 80 meters but it should work. My ATX, using my FT-817,
tuned straight away even on 15 meters where I have always had problems. I
also used it with my MP-1 and FT-817. I even used it with the 8 foot whip
that my RACAL 4031 has as standard accessory.

I used different colours of permanent markers to mark the white wires I
used, rather than using different colour plugs and sockets, as Dale suggests
in his nice article. I just could not find 6 different colour plugs here in
Greece. I only found blue ones, so I just used the markers to colour the
wires, well not all the length of the wire, just 1 inch near the connectors
at both ends.

I will upload the file and a picture that Dale sent me to the files section
of this group, so it is always there. You will be notified accordingly.

Enough talk. Here is the article:

------beggining of forwarded file-------------
From: "Dale E. Reed" <w8abz@...>
To: <articles@...>
Copies to: <sv1uy@...>, <dave@...>,
"Roy Hadden (KB8VJF)" <KB8VJF@...>,
"Jim & Elaine Kile" <starbird@...>
Subject: Article: Counterpoise kit for ATX antenna and FT-817
Date sent: Mon, 7 May 2001 22:22:40 -0400

QRP or Helpful Portable Hint (SAR?):
Counterpoise Kit for FT-817 with ATX-Walkabout Antenna

I am one of the many hams who has purchased the Yaesu FT-817 Backpack
Portable and found that it, indeed, brings the fun back into amateur radio.
I carry it with me in my computer bag daily to and from work. And my
notebook PC has RITTY, ChromaPix, DigiPan, Stream, AGWPE, WinAPRS and
several other ham applications loaded, so I'm pretty much always ready for
emergency or non-emergency (like demonstration) operations. And with a few
presentations (in Microsoft Powerpoint) always at the ready, I've managed to
get tapped to speak at a couple of club meetings while on business travel!

One of the items that completes the portable setup is the Watson
ATX-Walkabout antenna. I found out about this antenna after reading about
SV1UY's record-breaking pedestrian mobile QRP contact in the e-mail ARRL
Letter. (Yes, I know this is WorldRadio, but I am an ARRL member and read
the League's news, too!) I went to check out Demetre's web site
(), and there he mentioned this antenna.
It's
available at the Waters & Stanton PLC web site ().

The ATX-Walkabout looks like a little brother to the Outbacker series
of antennas. I've used the Outbacker Perth Plus and Outreach, both
excellent antennas. The ATX has a similar tap arrangement, but has a BNC
connector on the bottom instead of the 3/8-24 thread, and has a
telescoping upper part instead of a whip. The whole thing breaks down to
about a foot long and easily fits in the computer bag.

The manufacturer of this antenna recommends (for very good reason,
right Kurt?) that a counterpoise be attached to the ground lug of the
FT-817 for best operation. The length of the counterpoise wire, of course,
depends on the frequency, and a table of lengths vs bands is provided with
the
antenna.

Rather than carry all those lengths of wire, I decided that something
with a few wire segments with quick disconnects would roll up a lot
smaller. The trick was figuring out a small set of wire lengths that
would add to give all the lengths needed. I don't claim to have the
"mathematically optimal" set of lengths, but below is the design I
came up with.

These are the lengths of the wire segments and the color coding of the
quick-disconnect connectors:

Black connectors: 10"
Red connectors: 33"
Yellow connectors: 77"
Green connectors: 93"
Blue connectors: 120"
White connectors: 296"

...plus a very short wire with a spade lug to a connector, which I
leave on the back of the radio always ready.

For a given band, the length of the counterpoise = 180 feet / F (MHz).
(Yes, it's shorter than a quarter wave. See the explanation at the W&S web
site...) All combinations work out to the length recommended by the
manufacturer except as shown below.

Band Length Wire Segments vs Mfr. recommended
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
6m 43" Black + Red (as recommended)
10m 77" Yellow (as recommended)
12m 87" Black + Yellow (as recommended)
15m 103" Black + Green (as recommended)
17m 120" Blue (as recommended)
20m 153" Blue + Red (recommended = 154")
30m 213" Blue + Green (recommended = 216")
40m Phone 296" White (not specified)
40m CW 306" White + Black (recommended = 309")
75m G Phone 552" All except Yellow (not specified)
75m A/E Phone 586" All except Black and Red (not specified)
80m Data/Novice 596" All except Red (not specified)
80m CW 619" All except Black (recommended = 618")

(U.S. bandplan shown)

Notice how you never have more than two wire segments until you get to
75/80m. Of course, other combinations can be assembled for SWL or other
purposes. The whole package of wires and connectors rolls up to about the
size of a small donut or bagel.

I used Anderson Powerpole connectors because they are available with
the required shell colors, they are "genderless", but mostly because they
are very well engineered. They are popular with search-and-rescue
operations and local ARES groups, as I learned from the APRS SIG at
tapr.org -- repeatedly! (The Powerpole connectors seem to be a recurring
topic of heated debate on the SIG for some reason... :-)

Of course, I wouldn't suggest this design if I hadn't tried it. A 5-9
report from S57IIO on 15 meters the first weekend of May from the picnic
table in my backyard is typical.

There's only one other thing I want to add to this kit. I'd like to
get some small clips (or maybe hook/loop fastener straps in kind of an "H"
shape -- these could be used for rolling up the wires too!) to use for
locking
the connectors together so you don't lose most of the wire when you drop it
out
that hotel window!

Other quick disconnects can be used, but I strongly recommend the
Anderson Powerpole connectors for repeatably reliable connections and ease
of color coding. The counterpoise wires and a copy of the color chart
above,
tucked in a small zipper-locked plastic freezer bag, now have a permanent
place in my portable station. I hope you will find them useful too!

[Attached is a photo of the FT-817, the ATX antenna (two pieces, coil/tap
unit and separate telescoping whip), and the Counterpoise Kit.
Unfortunately I had no yellow Powerpole connector shells, so I used red ones
for the wire that should have yellow shells. Hey, it's just a prototype!
BTW, the green connectors are very dark green, and they look almost black in
the photo, but they are, in fact, green.]

Dale, W8ABZ
Cleveland Heights, Ohio USA
EN91
---------end of forwarded message-----------

====
73 de Demetre SV1UY

Does anyone know of an amp that would cover HF/6m/2m/70cm and cover all
modes? The THP HL-50B seems reasonably priced for what it gives you. But
the HL-726D, which cover 2m/70cm all mode, seems to be very expensive for
what it covers.

Gene and Princess

--- In FT817@y..., thomas4174@y... wrote:

--- In FT817@y..., "Brian Frobisher" <flingit@l...> wrote:

I paid the $25.00 and the $5.00 shipping.
Wanna know what I got?

BUGGY BETAWARE that does NOT work!

Yes, I got mine too. It is able to read the data from the radio, but when you try to send data back to the radio the program crashes every time. I've sent an e-mail to RT Systems tech support, but so far no response (although this could be because of the holiday...

And now - Monday evening - got an updated version from RT systems in my e-mail, installed it, and the program is now able to send data to the radio. RT systems responded very quickly even though this is a holiday. All my gripes are hereby withdrawn!

Try programming it in the radio by hand then exporting it to see what it
thinks that it's supposed to look like.

--- In FT817@y..., "Bob Nickels" <ranickel@m...> wrote:

I just got my FT-817 last week so have barely scratched the

surface - but

I'm puzzled by one thing: According to the manual, the power level

display

changes the number of "bars", with 3 "bars" for 2.5 watts and the

same "3

bar" display, blinking, to indicate the 5 watt level.

On my radio, as I press the PWR function key I get the little "L"

with 3

bars, 2 bars, 1 bar - then the icon goes blank. No blinking. Is

this

normal, or a change since the manual was written? I couldn't find

mention

of it in the FAQ.

Thanks and 73,
Bob W9RAN

Hi Bob,

Welcome to the 817 owners! When using external power, the icon does
not show (blank) for 5 W level.

BTW, this is covered in the FAQ ( see 3rd entry under POWER OUTPUT.

FWIW, the FAQ is best viewed using the "printable report" option so
that you can quickly move though the data.

72 de Barry - W4WB
FT817 FAQ Moderator

--- In FT817@y..., bringmethecatsass@y... wrote:

I dint cut the green wire
It works fine
why are people cuting the green wire

Please read the FAQ under TOPIC - GREEN WIRE. The FAQ section of the
FT817 Group is always a good place to start looking for answers.

73 de Barry - W4WB

I just got my FT-817 last week so have barely scratched the surface - but
I'm puzzled by one thing: According to the manual, the power level display
changes the number of "bars", with 3 "bars" for 2.5 watts and the same "3
bar" display, blinking, to indicate the 5 watt level.

On my radio, as I press the PWR function key I get the little "L" with 3
bars, 2 bars, 1 bar - then the icon goes blank. No blinking. Is this
normal, or a change since the manual was written? I couldn't find mention
of it in the FAQ.

Thanks and 73,
Bob W9RAN

Norm,

Thank you for the response, you are the first person to tell me why the green wire has to be cut.
Many Thanks
John



DATE

RT Systems had told me this was available at the Dayton Hamfest.
When I inquired about it at "the Ham Station" they had to look around
a while before they found it. When they did, it couldn't be
demonstrated because they "didn't have a computer system up and
running" (What a shame!!)

I was referred to the Yaesu exibit, having been told "Yaesu has a
demo setup" Yaesu didn't (What a sham(e)!!!)

I didn't buy. (What a stroke of wizdom!!)

...think I'll stick with FT Basic!

72 de Tony, VE3TNW



--- In FT817@y..., thomas4174@y... wrote:

--- In FT817@y..., "Brian Frobisher" <flingit@l...> wrote:

I paid the $25.00 and the $5.00 shipping.
Wanna know what I got?

BUGGY BETAWARE that does NOT work!

Yes, I got mine too. It is able to read the data from the radio,

but when you try to send data back to the radio the program crashes
every time. I've sent an e-mail to RT Systems tech support, but so
far no response (although this could be because of the holiday...)

I dint cut the green wire
It works fine
why are people cuting the green wire

Ok,

I got the patch and now I can save and upload files to and from the FT-817 using this software.

I am trying to program a 2m repeater with an odd offset (Not 600) and although I am able to get the numbers in the software, once I load the file and try the radio, it is not transmitting on the input freq I put in the software, it appears to be simplex.

Any ideas?

wondering what the output of the amp

Approximately (varies by band), 45w max before and 60w
after.

73
John Newell
KB1FPM

In a message dated 5/28/01 8:38:26 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
pgerhardt@... writes:

Where can I buy one ? Lee/k3re

The green wire needs to be cut if you are using rechargeable batteries.

The green wire is there to prevent an alkaline battery from being
accidentally charged.


Norm Wesler K2YEW

Ray,

I'm certainly interested in trying this out. With a similar
arrangement to support the loop vertically it could possibly be
used /P in situations without anything to hang it from.

I'd be interested in more details of the feed arrangement; meanwhile
I may just try it out with my SGC Smartuner when I get it down from
the loft in preparation for moving.

Julian, G4ILO

--- In FT817@y..., "Ray Goff" <ray@g...> wrote:

Hi,

I have just got back from a week in a hotel in Belgium where I have

been

testing my 40-30-20m portable loop antenna with the FT817.

Scattered in the 350 or so emails waiting for me from this

reflector was a

discussion thread on loop antennas, so I thought I would add my
experiences...

My loop consists of 16 feet of hook up wire in a diamond shape.

Across the

diagonal of the diamond is a spreader made from three 20 inch

lengths of

dowel which are fitted together to give 60 inches by pieces of

plastic

tubing made from old felt-tip pens. Incidentally, twenty inches was

chosen

because it fits into my suitcase.

At the top of the loop is the suspension point, made from a piece

of MDF

about 3 inches square. This also mounts a three position slide

switch switch

and four bee-hive trimmers. The feedpoint, at the bottom of the

loop,

consists of a toroidal transformer housed in a 35mm film canister.

The

aerial is fed from a length of 50 Ohm coax cable terminated in a BNC
connector.

The three position switch selects a different capacitor for each

band (I

found I needed two in parallel for resonance on 40). At first I

tried

paralleling the capacitors to tune the lower bands, but the tuning

became

too interactive, so I now use different capacitors for each band.

By adjusting the turns ratio on the toroidal transformer I have

been able to

achieve 1:1 SWR on all bands.

The aerial worked surprisingly well in Belgium, so I decided to

test it

further in the WPX contest over the weekend. I hung it from the

light

fitting in the ground floor kitchen of my house and worked loads of

stations

on 40 and 20. Best DX on 20m was NW7R in Arizona, easily 7000 miles

from my

QTH in Oxford, England. On 40, I worked several Asiatic Russian

stations.

All with 5 Watts from the FT817...

You may also be interested to know that the aerial was originally

resonated

at the QRP frequencies for each band, but during the contest I

worked the

entire CW section of each band without bothering to retune.

If there is an interest in the aerial, I would be happy to write it

up

further.

Ray g4fon

-----Original Message-----
From: Glyph [mailto:bbp@a...]
Sent: 28 May 2001 01:28
To: FT817@y...
Subject: Re: [FT817] Loop antenna


It would be interesting to design a "fold-up" loop of some sort

that could

be very compact but expandable into a really efficient size. Of

couse, the

design perameters usually call for a very good conductor with no

purely

mechanical connections if at all possible. They're usually built

out of

copper pipe (anyone got gold pipe?). Here's someone's mission

impossible.

-- Bil KD6JUI

----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Walker <kd7jzb@m...>
To: <FT817@y...>
Sent: Wednesday, May 23, 2001 8:19 AM
Subject: Re: [FT817] Loop antenna

True, the efficiency of mine calculates to be around 35% at

14.1Mhz and of

course various factors will reduce it to less than that. The

thing you

have

to remember is that it was designed to be small, not efficient.

the actual

diameter of a 1/10 wave loop at this design frequency is less

than 2 feet

3

inches. If you start getting larger in diameter the radiation

pattern

changes from directional, on the plane of the loop, to omni-

directional

then back to directional, perpendicular to the plane of the loop,

as you

approach the diameter of a full wave loop. At 14.1Mhz the full

wave loop

would not fit in the back of my pickup truck. :-)

72,

At 20:56 5/22/01 -0700, you wrote:

There are optimal loop sizes for various frequencies. Yours

seems too

small

to have good radiation efficiency on 20 meters. Maybe 10 meters

or 6

meters

would be optimal. I'm too lazy to look up the optimal sizes in

the ARRL

antenna handbook.

I'm going on a 4-day fishing trip with my sons. They fish, I

fish for

contacts. This will be my first time to really put the 817

through its

paces

with various field-type antennas -- specifically, hamsticks,

G5RV-type

inverted V and 110' long wire with counterpoise. See ya at the

lake!

-- Bil KD6JUI

----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Walker <kd7jzb@m...>
To: <FT817@y...>
Sent: Monday, May 21, 2001 11:10 PM
Subject: Re: [FT817] Loop antenna

Check out the following web page and brows the "Antennas"

link for

"Small

HF Transmitting Loop Antennas".



Steve has a loop design program free to download which works

very

well.

Actually loops are very simple to build. I have a 2 foot 6

inch

diameter

loop which tunes 20M thru 12M and appears to be comparable in

performance

to my half wave dipole.
After completing construction of my loop I set it on top of a

cheap

camera

tripod in the shack about 4 feet above the floor and using my

trusty

FT-817

at 5 watts, answered N8LWV calling CQ on 20M (ssb) from Grand

Rapids

Michigan. I really didn't think he would hear me but he came

back with

a

339 signal report! Not bad from Tucson Arizona!
I built my loop out of half inch soft copper tubing made for

water

lines.

I

purchased the tubing at Home Depot in a 10 foot coil for a

little over

$10.

The small 6 inch diameter primary loop is made from #6 copper

wire.

I like my loop for portable operation like when I want to

grab the

radio

and go to the park, and it seems to work pretty well 7 or 8

feet above

the

ground. I'm sure it would work better up higher, I use mine

oriented

vertically. The loop has a very high Q resulting in a narrow

bandwidth

of

only a few Khz. This means that you must retune the loop if

you vary

your

frequency very much. This is fine when using CW or PSK31 but

is to

narrow

for SSB unless you have a motorized tuning capacitor so that

you can

retune

easily. I believe that MFJ has a loop with some form of

automatic

tuning

mechanism which would help immensely but from what I remember

they

want a

premium price for such an otherwise simple antenna. I spent

less than

$20

building mine but I have to manually tune it.
If you are interested, let me know and I'll put some images

on my web

page

for you to look at for ideas.

At 21:45 5/21/01 +0000, you wrote:

I remember an article some years back in PW that had a 2

merte loop

about 4 inches in diameter and it worked quite well.
Any one have a copy as I want to make a loop for 20metres

for my

FT817. Any other ideas or perhaps we should have a group for

portable

antennas.

Bill Walker - KD7JZB




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Bill Walker - KD7JZB




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Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to

Karin at RT systems just emaile me the "FIX"

Software still performs an ilegal operation when I try to select the send data to radio mode.

Ouch!

Hello everyone!

? Just dropping a short line on a new group just starting on Yahoo called=
[PA-ham]. If you enjoy the hobby from in or around PA, we want you! ? ? ? T=
his forum was set up for hams(or future hams) in and around PA to keep up on=
news and events affecting ham radio, LOCALLY!! ? ? ?

Anything may be posted dealing with the hobby, including hamfests, fox=
-hunts, contests, special events stations, club meetings, pic-nics, ect.....=
And if you need help, maybe someone can help you locally! Extra gear sittin=
g around? Feel free to post that too! Like I said, anything dealing with the=
hobby! ?

? ? Members may also place their favorite links in the Bookmarks, along wi=
th posting your events in the Calander! What more could you ask for? ?

? ? In this day and age when we are losing so many from our ranks to the i=
nternet, what better way to merge the two? ?

? ? Please remember that this is a new forum set up for all hams in and ar=
ound Pennsylvania. The more the merrier!


? [PA-ham] To Join:
PA-ham-subscribe@...


Tnx in adv 73


Fran / N3ZHC

<N3ZHC@...>

[PA-ham] Forum Manager

Hi,

I just bought a FT 817 and the RS ni-mh 1.6 A/h cells. So as I understand
it, I have to cut the green wire, and what option of Charge time do I use. I
have the Wall Wart from Yaesu, and the DC power cable. Please adivse, and
Thank you for your time.

Regards,

John


DATE