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Re: Feedback on the sliding saw selection imran All Messages By This Member #140519 开云体育 Hi Stan, The outrigger glides along the length of the slider with unlocking of one kip lever. So you don’t need to retract the slider all the way to make a cut. On my 10’ slider, I routinely have the outrigger 4’ towards the infeed, akin to a 6’ slider. I can straight line rip over 5’ (leaving room for the infeed clamp) and Xcut pretty much everything. If I do a conventional rip and the long xcut fence is in the way of the offcut, I either move the outrigger farther back on the slider (towards outfeed) or push the slider along with my left hand as I make the cut. This when I need the slider to support the material being ripped or if doing a lot of it, just move the long xcut fence to the 45 deg angle position and push it as far away from blade as needed or if needed, completely remove the long xcut fence but the outrigger stays put You will need to pull/retract the slider completely to change the blade though. This also requires the outrigger to be within 1 ft of the far (outfeed) end of the slider. For my next point, it would help to share my shop setup. Here are 2 pics that show the shop from one side to the other. Saw sits next to the right side wall. Outrigger clears the vertical post (brown column) by 1/4”. Dual51 sits in the middle and KF700 sits along the left wall. As I mentioned earlier, I made the mistake of buying the KF700 without the outrigger. So I got used to the short xcut fence. I wanted a longer slider and an outrigger so I bought K975 with 10’ slider. The outrigger completely blocks the saw lane so I have to walk around between the J/P and the KF700. Since I was used to the short xcut fence on KF700, my thought was to only use outrigger when absolutely needed. So I spent around $700 to outfit me with the short xcut fence on K975 including the 90 deg registration fix from David Best. I calibrated the entire machine and during this I learned the capability of the long xcut fence vs the short xcut fence. Needless to say, the short xcut fence rarely comes out. I would suggest you get a slider that is as long as you think you can make work and get an outrigger. I am not certain about the difference between 1100 and 1300. I believe 1100 has 90 deg registration stop in middle rail of the outrigger (blue part in pic below). I believe 1300 has 90 deg registration towards the end of the outrigger (red circle in pic below), one on each side. 1500 has a beefier xcut fence, a roller ?and the registration is with what I call donuts (red circle pic below), one on each side of the outrigger. If you are interested in used machines, it could take some time to find one. You should be prepared to travel to check the machine and handle crating and transportation. On a new machine, I recommend you get commissioning, I only have anecdotal info, probably adds $2K to $3K.? Imran Malik IAM Wood Creations toggle quoted message Show quoted text On Mar 25, 2025, at 7:26?PM, David Luckensmeyer via groups.io <david@...> wrote: ? Hi Stan: ? You are thinking well, and I appreciate your openness to a lot of conflicting opinions given here. Respect. ? In answer to some of your follow-up questions/observations. ? 20’ shop length is a key issue. My shop is 24’ and it comfortably fits a 3200mm slider. You are likely correct that a 3200mm table may not fit in your shop. David B. will have the size requirement committed to memory I’m pretty sure? And David B., thanks for posting the photo of us. That was a good day! ? Yes the slider will completely dominate the space. I used to be hung up on that but it works for me. Regarding conventional ripping, awkwardness aside, I think you are (understandably) thinking about ripping as you have always done rather than ripping on the slider. In reality, like me, you will probably rarely rip on the right side of the blade. Ripping on the left side, using clamps and parallel fence/s is safer and more accurate. There is more setup time, but not a lot more. ? That’s a great question to ask about whether anyone has downsized from a longer slider. I’m quite keen to hear any answers on that one. The closest I’m familiar with is that some choose to run multiple machines, either a slider and a conventional saw, or two sliders one of which is a short-stroke. ? You are correct that the outrigger usually sits towards the far end of a slider to make more space for ripping. The outrigger is a spectacular thing – so much better than a mitre gauge on a conventional saw that it cannot really be compared. You will not want to take off the outrigger and put it back on every time you want to park the convertible, and every time you want to make crosscuts. The outrigger is big and heavy. You ask whether you can still cut small stuff without the outrigger? Of course you can. But the outrigger is quick and accurate for 90 degrees and angles. And the cross cut stops can be relied upon. And with digital (as I have) I simply don’t want to use anything else – my outrigger and large crosscut fence are used for crosscutting long and short items. I use it 99% of the time. ? My shop is larger than yours but is absolutely crammed with machinery. I have to move the sliding table in order to walk from one side of my shop to another. I also have to walk around the end of my outrigger too. That sounds annoying – except that the saw is such a hard-working and accurate machine in my shop that I do not resent having to walk around it. ? I think Mac once told us all to harden up – we complain too much about having to walk around our machinery! (I loved that advice Mac, thank you.) ? ? Hammers are nice machines. Plus it frees up money money for shaper tooling, Mac’s pneumatic clamps, Brian’s parallel fences, a power feeder, etc. I wish you well with your deliberations. ? Warm regards, Lucky ? Dr David Luckensmeyer Designer & Maker @luckensmeyer M: 0413 013 115 ? From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Stan K via groups.io <4279427@...> Date: Wednesday, 26 March 2025 at 08:59 To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [FOG] Feedback on the sliding saw selection Thank you gentlemen, this is excellent feedback. ? I suspected that the table length is a controversial topic and I did read the advice to buy the longest table one can fit. My shop is 20'x10' once I subtract the dead space taken by cabinets. This is half of the garage; I like to keep the other half available for the car, but it can be temporarily encroached upon. I figured the outrigger can?overhang into that space. The ceilings are 9' but the overhead garage door reduces it by 18" or so. It is not impossible to fit a large slider (I've seen it done with a comparable Minimax), but it will completely dominate the space and make navigating it kinda awkward. Worst case, the convertible can live on the driveway. ? When observing people that have long sliders, I noticed several things. One, the crosscut fence is typically mounted on the very end of the slider, presumably to keep it free for the long rips. In a small shop, the infeed will typically be against the garage door, making it impossible to use the crosscut without opening the door. Additionally, long carriage makes it awkward to use the rip fence. I thought I could avoid both issues by limiting myself to a short stroke and ripping long boards in the traditional way. ? Clearly the consensus is that I would be making an expensive mistake and I hear it loud and clear. This is exactly the type of feedback I was hoping for. But let me try and exhaust the short stroke avenue before I give up on it entirely. Anyone here who actually downsized from a long slider to a short stroke? Derek — seeing your setup is very helpful and the product you create is way over anything I would be able to produce on an unlimited budget. ? As for the type of work I tend to do, it's all over the place. It's hard to say where the hobby will take me, but on the spectrum proposed by Lucky I gravitate towards Krenov-style furniture rather than dining tables. ? Most of the last year was spent on house remodeling, so there was more panel work than I'd like — hence the itch for a scoring blade. Few doors as well. Milling, assembling, and gluing them up completely monopolized the shop space even without a slider in the way.?Some of them were over 100" high, so I doubt a 8' slider would make a difference...?Jacques' power-fed setup is definitely intriguing. Outrigger is definitely on the list, but again, my bogey was set at 1100mm and Imran suggests 1500. Can it be off most of the time? Do I need to put it on for the tiniest of crosscuts? Anything involving setup time will have me looking for shortcuts — it's a character flaw that I learned to accept. For the same reason, wheeling the tools around before I can start working would be a deal breaker. ? All in all, I am finding new angles to think about it, and you all have my thanks. The used KF700S that I believe Imran has linked to would fit the bill, but the seller did not reply to my inquiries. I think I might err on the lower side and try a B3, which may not scratch the same itch but will definitely give me a much better understanding and appreciation of the workflow. ? Stan ?
Re: Feedback on the sliding saw selection [email protected] All Messages By This Member #140518 On Tue, Mar 25, 2025 at 04:25 PM, David Luckensmeyer wrote: That’s a great question to ask about whether anyone has downsized from a longer slider. I’m quite keen to hear any answers on that one. The closest I’m familiar with is that some choose to run multiple machines, either a slider and a conventional saw, or two sliders one of which is a short-stroke. For downsizing, I know that Albert downsize his slider. He mostly use his slider as a giant miter saw and he has the 2.2m slider. Stan, When I am not using the oturigger, I remove it and put it on the mobility kit. It takes 5-6min to put it off/on the slider. Something to keep in mind - If you chose to go with Felder DRO, You'll be getting the Format4 xcut fence, which is beefier. It is a nice upgrade, but it gets heavy, you'll defensively feel it when you remove the outrigger.
Re: Feedback on the sliding saw selection [email protected] All Messages By This Member #140517 Couldn't resist adding my 2 cents. Note that I am fairly new and only got my CF741 SP 18 months ago. Although you are going with a Saw/Shaper only, there is a lot of commonality with combination machine. ? To summarize, I would suggest getting the 2500mm slider on you next saw... ? I got the 2500mm slider, 1300mm outrigger table and the 2600mm crosscut fence. My workshop is dedicated and is 12x24, so a bit longer than yours. Unless you want to use 100% of the length of your workshop, I would not go with the 10ft slider. I never realized how often I have to go around the slider/outrigger, and if it were longer, that is just more walking around. I do projects that are solid wood, as well as sheet goods for cabinets. I have processed boards that were up to 12ft (lots of them) ripping them to size and the shorter slider was not an issue - remove the crosscut fence and keep pushing when you reach the end of the slider. It is when you work with sheet goods that the slider must be at least 2500mm. In my case, I see absolutely no problem cutting 4x8, but when you are finished cutting, the material does not go beyond the saw, so you have (well is is better to) to stop the motor before processing the next sheet - not an issue for me. ? The 2600mm crosscut fence allows you to process very long boards. I was happy having it when I was processing 12ft long planks on the shaper, putting a profile at the end of the board. To do this, I have to open my double doors and have the board extend outside, but with 8-9 ft boards, I am ok inside. However, this crosscut fence is almost always in the way when I go from one side of my workshop to the other, especially if I have to carry something between one of my 2 workbenches that sit at the opposite end of the workshop. I use the crosscut fence to its maximum only 1 day per month so I decided to buy the accessory to remove the outrigger and ordered a short crosscut fence that would fit on the slider only. I think I will use it 80% of the time. So you may consider a shorter crosscut fence altogether. ? hope this helps and not add confusion! ? ?
Re: Feedback on the sliding saw selection David Luckensmeyer All Messages By This Member #140516 开云体育 Hi Stan: ? You are thinking well, and I appreciate your openness to a lot of conflicting opinions given here. Respect. ? In answer to some of your follow-up questions/observations. ? 20’ shop length is a key issue. My shop is 24’ and it comfortably fits a 3200mm slider. You are likely correct that a 3200mm table may not fit in your shop. David B. will have the size requirement committed to memory I’m pretty sure? And David B., thanks for posting the photo of us. That was a good day! ? Yes the slider will completely dominate the space. I used to be hung up on that but it works for me. Regarding conventional ripping, awkwardness aside, I think you are (understandably) thinking about ripping as you have always done rather than ripping on the slider. In reality, like me, you will probably rarely rip on the right side of the blade. Ripping on the left side, using clamps and parallel fence/s is safer and more accurate. There is more setup time, but not a lot more. ? That’s a great question to ask about whether anyone has downsized from a longer slider. I’m quite keen to hear any answers on that one. The closest I’m familiar with is that some choose to run multiple machines, either a slider and a conventional saw, or two sliders one of which is a short-stroke. ? You are correct that the outrigger usually sits towards the far end of a slider to make more space for ripping. The outrigger is a spectacular thing – so much better than a mitre gauge on a conventional saw that it cannot really be compared. You will not want to take off the outrigger and put it back on every time you want to park the convertible, and every time you want to make crosscuts. The outrigger is big and heavy. You ask whether you can still cut small stuff without the outrigger? Of course you can. But the outrigger is quick and accurate for 90 degrees and angles. And the cross cut stops can be relied upon. And with digital (as I have) I simply don’t want to use anything else – my outrigger and large crosscut fence are used for crosscutting long and short items. I use it 99% of the time. ? My shop is larger than yours but is absolutely crammed with machinery. I have to move the sliding table in order to walk from one side of my shop to another. I also have to walk around the end of my outrigger too. That sounds annoying – except that the saw is such a hard-working and accurate machine in my shop that I do not resent having to walk around it. ? I think Mac once told us all to harden up – we complain too much about having to walk around our machinery! (I loved that advice Mac, thank you.) ? ? Hammers are nice machines. Plus it frees up money money for shaper tooling, Mac’s pneumatic clamps, Brian’s parallel fences, a power feeder, etc. I wish you well with your deliberations. ? Warm regards, Lucky ? Dr David Luckensmeyer Designer & Maker @luckensmeyer M: 0413 013 115 ? From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Stan K via groups.io <4279427@...> Date: Wednesday, 26 March 2025 at 08:59 To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [FOG] Feedback on the sliding saw selection Thank you gentlemen, this is excellent feedback. ? I suspected that the table length is a controversial topic and I did read the advice to buy the longest table one can fit. My shop is 20'x10' once I subtract the dead space taken by cabinets. This is half of the garage; I like to keep the other half available for the car, but it can be temporarily encroached upon. I figured the outrigger can?overhang into that space. The ceilings are 9' but the overhead garage door reduces it by 18" or so. It is not impossible to fit a large slider (I've seen it done with a comparable Minimax), but it will completely dominate the space and make navigating it kinda awkward. Worst case, the convertible can live on the driveway. ? When observing people that have long sliders, I noticed several things. One, the crosscut fence is typically mounted on the very end of the slider, presumably to keep it free for the long rips. In a small shop, the infeed will typically be against the garage door, making it impossible to use the crosscut without opening the door. Additionally, long carriage makes it awkward to use the rip fence. I thought I could avoid both issues by limiting myself to a short stroke and ripping long boards in the traditional way. ? Clearly the consensus is that I would be making an expensive mistake and I hear it loud and clear. This is exactly the type of feedback I was hoping for. But let me try and exhaust the short stroke avenue before I give up on it entirely. Anyone here who actually downsized from a long slider to a short stroke? Derek — seeing your setup is very helpful and the product you create is way over anything I would be able to produce on an unlimited budget. ? As for the type of work I tend to do, it's all over the place. It's hard to say where the hobby will take me, but on the spectrum proposed by Lucky I gravitate towards Krenov-style furniture rather than dining tables. ? Most of the last year was spent on house remodeling, so there was more panel work than I'd like — hence the itch for a scoring blade. Few doors as well. Milling, assembling, and gluing them up completely monopolized the shop space even without a slider in the way.?Some of them were over 100" high, so I doubt a 8' slider would make a difference...?Jacques' power-fed setup is definitely intriguing. Outrigger is definitely on the list, but again, my bogey was set at 1100mm and Imran suggests 1500. Can it be off most of the time? Do I need to put it on for the tiniest of crosscuts? Anything involving setup time will have me looking for shortcuts — it's a character flaw that I learned to accept. For the same reason, wheeling the tools around before I can start working would be a deal breaker. ? All in all, I am finding new angles to think about it, and you all have my thanks. The used KF700S that I believe Imran has linked to would fit the bill, but the seller did not reply to my inquiries. I think I might err on the lower side and try a B3, which may not scratch the same itch but will definitely give me a much better understanding and appreciation of the workflow. ? Stan ?
Re: Feedback on the sliding saw selection Morgan Skinner All Messages By This Member #140515 开云体育 Stan, I have a Hammer B3 Perform, which is basically the largest of the Hammer saws, with a slider length of 2500mm and an integrated shaper. It’s an excellent machine for a hobbyist like me, and buying second hand I got a lot of saw for the money. If I had Felder money, I’d buy a Felder machine. Why? My main gripe with the Hammer series is where the on/off switches are, which is on the body of the saw at the front - and in this position it’s almost always obscured by whatever I’m cross cutting. This is especially true when cutting an 8x4 sheet. The Felder saws I’ve seen have switches on the end of the slider itself, which if you ask me is the most sensible position for them. Other than that gripe, a Hammer machine is very well built (for a hobbyist) and will last a lifetime. Good luck choosing! Cheers, Morgan toggle quoted message Show quoted text On 25 Mar 2025, at 17:15, Derek Cohen via groups.io <derekcohen@...> wrote: ? Stan, I thought to add a few recent pieces I have built to show that size is not limited on a short stop K3 ... ? Dining table in Hard Maple and Jarrah, and two carvers (the chairs were largely made with hand tools).? ? ? ? ? Chest of drawers ... ? ? Many beds. Here is a kingsize ... ? ? Regards from Perth ? Derek ? ?
Re: Feedback on the sliding saw selection Stan K All Messages By This Member #140514 Thank you gentlemen, this is excellent feedback. I suspected that the table length is a controversial topic and I did read the advice to buy the longest table one can fit. My shop is 20'x10' once I subtract the dead space taken by cabinets. This is half of the garage; I like to keep the other half available for the car, but it can be temporarily encroached upon. I figured the outrigger can?overhang into that space. The ceilings are 9' but the overhead garage door reduces it by 18" or so. It is not impossible to fit a large slider (I've seen it done with a comparable Minimax), but it will completely dominate the space and make navigating it kinda awkward. Worst case, the convertible can live on the driveway. When observing people that have long sliders, I noticed several things. One, the crosscut fence is typically mounted on the very end of the slider, presumably to keep it free for the long rips. In a small shop, the infeed will typically be against the garage door, making it impossible to use the crosscut without opening the door. Additionally, long carriage makes it awkward to use the rip fence. I thought I could avoid both issues by limiting myself to a short stroke and ripping long boards in the traditional way. Clearly the consensus is that I would be making an expensive mistake and I hear it loud and clear. This is exactly the type of feedback I was hoping for. But let me try and exhaust the short stroke avenue before I give up on it entirely. Anyone here who actually downsized from a long slider to a short stroke? Derek — seeing your setup is very helpful and the product you create is way over anything I would be able to produce on an unlimited budget. As for the type of work I tend to do, it's all over the place. It's hard to say where the hobby will take me, but on the spectrum proposed by Lucky I gravitate towards Krenov-style furniture rather than dining tables. Most of the last year was spent on house remodeling, so there was more panel work than I'd like — hence the itch for a scoring blade. Few doors as well. Milling, assembling, and gluing them up completely monopolized the shop space even without a slider in the way.?Some of them were over 100" high, so I doubt a 8' slider would make a difference...?Jacques' power-fed setup is definitely intriguing. Outrigger is definitely on the list, but again, my bogey was set at 1100mm and Imran suggests 1500. Can it be off most of the time? Do I need to put it on for the tiniest of crosscuts? Anything involving setup time will have me looking for shortcuts — it's a character flaw that I learned to accept. For the same reason, wheeling the tools around before I can start working would be a deal breaker. All in all, I am finding new angles to think about it, and you all have my thanks. The used KF700S that I believe Imran has linked to would fit the bill, but the seller did not reply to my inquiries. I think I might err on the lower side and try a B3, which may not scratch the same itch but will definitely give me a much better understanding and appreciation of the workflow. Stan signature.asc signature.asc
Re: For Sale - Felder Eccentric Clamp #forsale joe_tedesco All Messages By This Member #140513 yes, it should fit in the $19 flat rate box.
Re: For Sale - Felder Eccentric Clamp #forsale Rob H Member Profile All Messages By This Member #140512 USPS Flat Rate Box would work for that? ?
Re: For Sale - Felder Eccentric Clamp #forsale joe_tedesco All Messages By This Member #140511 ok, great. ?I can fit it into a 10" x 12" x 6" box, and it weighs 16 pounds.?
Re: For Sale - Felder Eccentric Clamp #forsale Brad Wall Member Profile All Messages By This Member #140510 I’ll take it — I can look up shipping if you tell me how big of box and weight B+ toggle quoted message Show quoted text On Tue, Mar 25, 2025 at 4:23?PM joe_tedesco via <joe_tedesco=[email protected]> wrote: Hello, I'm tired of tripping over this clamp, so I figured I'd offer it up for sale.? Several years old, but i'ver never used it.? I'd like $100 + shipping, but any reasonable offers will be considered.? I'm located in St. James, NY for shipping $ purposes.? ? Thanks -Joe
For Sale - Felder Eccentric Clamp #forsale joe_tedesco All Messages By This Member #140509 Hello, I'm tired of tripping over this clamp, so I figured I'd offer it up for sale. ?Several years old, but i'ver never used it. ?I'd like $100 + shipping, but any reasonable offers will be considered. ?I'm located in St. James, NY for shipping $ purposes.? ? Thanks -Joe
Re: 2007 CF741 Houston Area For Sale; also Maple Workbench #forsale [email protected] All Messages By This Member #140508 Hi Cindy, is the cf741 machine still for sale? Can you send pictures to this email if available. Best regards, Thomas Elbanna 604-839-9397 ?
Re: Feedback on the sliding saw selection Derek Cohen All Messages By This Member #140507 Stan, I thought to add a few recent pieces I have built to show that size is not limited on a short stop K3 ... ? Dining table in Hard Maple and Jarrah, and two carvers (the chairs were largely made with hand tools).? ? ? ? ? Chest of drawers ... ? ? Many beds. Here is a kingsize ... ? ? Regards from Perth ? Derek ? ?
Re: Feedback on the sliding saw selection Derek Cohen All Messages By This Member #140506 Hi Stan ? Welcome to the group. Many wise heads here. Wiser than mine. ? I am also a hobbiest, working from a two-car garage, and after a few decades of Chinese-made machines, upgraded to Hammer machines about a dozen or so years ago. My slider is the Hammer K3 with a 1250mm wagon. This is a "short stroke", but entirely satisfactory for ripping shorter boards and crosscutting all. I only work with solid hard woods. Keep in mind that extra long boards are rarely kept this way - unless you are in the habit of building lots of dining tables and kingsize beds - and even then there is a work around. Most boards are broken down, and then ripping on the wagon is rarely an issue. The K3 does have a fine rip fence as well, just like a cabinet saw. ? For the very rare use of panels, there is a tracksaw available.? ? My K3 is somewhat "modified", insofar as their is a router table built into the outfeed, an parallel guide for the wagon, which is used in harmony with the crosscut fence (situated at the foot of the wagon - short stop sliders work in reverse), and a knee-stop for the on-off switch.? There is microadjust sfor the rip- and crosscut fences. ? I'm very happy with the K3. There are better machines available, but it does all I need it to do in building furniture,. Much of the time I include hand tools as well. I really have no desire to upgrade after 10 years of ownership. ? My other Hammer machines are an A3-31 combo and N4400 bandsaw. Again, the quality of the Felders is another jump up, but these represent extremely good quality for their cost. I am very happy with all of them, for their performance and reliability. ? ? ? ? ? No thoughts for a shaper. The router table fence is connected to the rip fence and uses its micro-adjust ... ? ? ? ? Please free to reach out for more.? ? Regards from Perth ? Derek ? inthewoodshop.com ? ?
Re: Felder AD941 vs SCM Fs41ES Aaron Inami All Messages By This Member #140505 Steve - were you using the Euro guard on the FS41ES??? Or was it the porkchop guard? ? -Aaron Inami
Re: OT: Teknatools USA affiliate (maker of Nova drill presses) files for CH 11 reorganization Rohit Kulshreshtha All Messages By This Member #140504 Thanks for sharing. I had the exact same experience. Grizzly was the only company that had them in stock. Everyone else was quoting delivery dates into the middle of the year. Unfortunately, I didn't make too much of it. I ordered on Jan 27th and the drill press arrived the next week. This Reddit thread has some (maybe ex) employees sharing context and answering questions: ? Hopefully they’re back on their feet soon.
OT: Teknatools USA affiliate (maker of Nova drill presses) files for CH 11 reorganization imran All Messages By This Member #140503 开云体育 Couple of weeks ago the chuck on my ~30 yr old Delta DP suddenly failed. Long story short I stumbled on Nova Viking sale advertisement at Grizzly. It was nearly $500 off. I ordered it few days ago but delayed shipment as I am out of town. It has been in the back of my mind that I could not find any floor model Nova Viking anywhere. So I decided to search and found that the USA affiliate of the New Zealand based company filed for chapter 11 reorg on Feb 25, 2025. I guess I will call the company now to learn more and determine if I still want to go forward with this purchase. The Grizzly site has following on warranty: Contact??regarding warranties on their NOVA products and technical support.The PRO-TEKTOR Premium covers your motor for an additional 8 years and ALL electronics for an additional 3 years. Limited time 10-year motor warranty and 5-year electronics extended warranty! Imran Malik IAM Wood Creations
Re: Feedback on the sliding saw selection imran All Messages By This Member #140502 开云体育 Stan, Not sure where you are located but I just shared this on my FB group. A used machine can stretch one’s funds a long way. This one is in Texas. After seeing the building quality of my 2002 KF the rest of my Felders were bought used.