Inset or overlay work identical, when parked there is no sag, the sag only occurs when the slide is extended. For drawer front adjustment I use the tried and true Blum fastening system. See below if unfamiliar.
[Edited Message Follows]
I use blum movento and grass dynapro. Drawers still sag up to 2mm if heavy object are inside. But I only build frameless full overlay with 3mm reveals.?
I am not sure how inset cabinetry works. If the runners pull the drawers box in and you¡¯re reliant on the bumpers stoping the drawers face and that¡¯s what makes the drawer face flush with the face frame. I could see how the drawer wouldn¡¯t sag.
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Jonathon. Have you tried the fast cap drawer face jig? I just got it in the mail, I¡¯m always up for saving time. Right now, I have been using my own jig. Using inset furniture nuts and a 3-1/2¡± flat bolt as my guide. I measure from bottom of drawer to bottom of cabinet. Then use 3mm spacer ?and measure next drawer after bottom face is done, etc. adjust the screws with each drawer face.
ive gotten it down to 8 minutes for a bank (3) of drawers.
But I live by paul Akers 2 second lean! So I am up for new ideas!!
edit: had some bad typos..
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I use blum movento and grass dynapro. Drawers still sag up to 2mm if heavy object are inside. But I only build frameless full overlay with 3mm reveals.?
I am not sure how inset cabinetry works. If the runners pull the drawers box in and you¡¯re reliant on the bumpers stoping the drawers face and that¡¯s what makes the drawer face flush with the face frame. I could see how the drawer wouldn¡¯t sag.
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Re: I did something stupid!
David,
I hope I didn¡¯t destroy power drive with int the first ten seconds of me raising the blade due to the electrical wiring being wrong. At first the machine turned on, the panel was lit up. Now, nothing.
I will call electrician and have him fix it.?
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Hi Imran,
If memory serves me correctly, the overhead guard for my saw added about $1,000 to the price of the saw. ?At the time, it seemed somewhat expensive, but significantly better than the alternative. ?The guard and dust collection function well. ?I will just have to make some changes to the mount when I get tired of the guard drooping onto the rip fence when I swing it out of the way. ?Oddly enough, the guard and tubing are way overbuilt and heavy. ?They spared no expense on the arms and guard assembly. ?They just missed the boat on the attachment point where the guard support tubing attaches to the saw chassis.
Mine is designed to swing away, which is where the problem becomes obvious. When in position over the blade the swing arm that the supports the guard is in line with the mount. ?When swung away, the weight of the arm is 90 degrees to the mount, causing a lot more strain in another plane to the support. ?The design doesn¡¯t provide enough support for the weight of the arm and guard when in this position.
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On Feb 17, 2020, at 10:00 PM, imranindiana via Groups.Io <imranindiana@...> wrote:
? Alex,
I would be just as much upset with the floppy guard do you think it is a price point issue?
Comparatively, the guard tube on my K975 is massive but it comes with a much more expensive saw. BTW, mine does not swing out either, may be new ones do.
Imran? On Feb 18, 2020, at 10:49 AM, Alex Bowlds <aabj@...> wrote:
? I have the Felder overhead guard on my KF700SP. ?It is on a saw with the wide rip option, so the arm is quite long. ?The pros include... ?It is really built heavy duty. ?It functions well, and with the right dust extractor system, it collects the vast majority of the sawdust. ?It easily swings out of the way. ?
It¡¯s only drawback is the mounting system that felder used to attach it to the saw chassis. ?For engineers, they really missed the boat on this one. ?Mine is a 2018 vintage saw. ?I have not checked to see if they improved the mounting method. ?Due to the weight, the length of the arm, and the poor mounting method, when the guard is swung out of the way, it droops down several inches. ?This is probably not as much of an issue with the shorter arm used on the narrow rip capacity saws.
When I get disgusted enough, I will take the time to make a better mounting bracket and kick the Felder stupidity to the curb. ?
And before you go down the ¡°did you bring this to the attention of Felder¡± path, indeed I did. ?To no avail. ?I am apparently the only one that has a problem with the mounting design of their overhead saw guard. ?I guess a little droop is not too much of an inconvenience for others.
Again I think it is probably not a problem on a narrow rip capacity saw. ?I would probably purchase it again, and modify the mounting bracket prior to the initial installation. ?It really is well built except for the one flaw.
Alex On Feb 10, 2020, at 12:40 PM, Sang Luu <sangluu@...> wrote:
?I've read a few older posts about this but I must say, I sort of regret not getting the overhead saw guard on my K700s. The stock Euro Guard II doesn't work too well especially if there's a hose connected to it. The weight of the hose, even when suspended in the air, can deflect the guard making it a pain to use.?
I'm wondering if someone here has been able to make (force!) the stock Euro Guard II work well enough for daily use?
I'm asking so I can pretend to exhaust all options before I break down and just buy or make/adapt a non-Felder version to the saw.?
BTW, this is the non-Felder option I've been looking at:?
It's made by a Taiwanese panel saw manufacturer (clones of Euro saws) but they have a pretty neat dust guard which I think is 95% bolt on. The only modification would be the placement of the arm, relative to the extension tables, to match the Felder dimensions, but otherwise the mounting is conceptually the same. If it costs me $500 and couple of hours of fitting, it would be a good option, price-wise, mee-thinks.?
Here's a video of it in action:?
Sang
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Re: I did something stupid!
David & all i think my post was back assbackwards, so don't listen to me. David, so the brown wire should be on the manufactured leg? I know I did what you you told me to do and I did it just that way and all has been good. My memory is not doing that well these days. But not many electrical fires now.
Glen
Big Tree Woodworking
P.O. Box 257 Avery Ca 95224
Nomenclature can be confusing here. ? The Phase Perfect manufactured leg is T3. ? American Rotary manufactured leg is T3 or ¡°C".? For consistency throughout my shop, T3 is connected to L3 in the wall socket, and the brown wire from the Felder machine goes to L3 in the plug. ? T1 to L1, T2 to L2, T3 to L3 etc. ??
Shinta, your document shows the manufactured leg on L2. ??
Frankly it doesn¡¯t matter a hill of beans which lug on the plug and socket is the manufactured leg so long as the brown wire from the Felder cable goes to the manufactured leg.? If you start swapping T1 and T2 in the wall sockets, some machines will run backwards. ? So consistency is important.
But connecting the PP T3 or AR T3 output to L2 in the receptacle is asking for confusion IMO. ?
The PP manufactured leg is very stable, whereas the AR (or Kay or whatever brand rotary converter you¡¯re using) manufactured leg can swing wildly even with the ¡°voltage stabilization¡± options installed. ? Keeping the brown lead from Felder equipment connected to the manufactured leg of a rotary phase converter is vital, otherwise the wild voltages will end up destroying or causing error conditions in the electronic positioning systems like DigiDrive and PowerDrive - been there, done that. David Best On Feb 17, 2020, at 10:28 PM, Shinta Wakahisa via Groups.Io < vnh84@...> wrote:
I uploaded a PDF of my plug wiring note to the document/electrical file upload section last week.? This applies to my 2019 and 2020 3-phase Felder machines.
SW
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Re: I did something stupid!
I uploaded a PDF of my plug wiring note to the document/electrical file upload section last week.? This applies to my 2019 and 2020 3-phase Felder machines.
SW
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Re: I did something stupid!
Also ask David Best, he walked me through the correct wiring and made it clear cut and simple. Glen
Big Tree Woodworking
P.O. Box 257 Avery Ca 95224
I will show this message to the electrician. Would the power drive panel had worked like it did if the wiring was not correct? That¡¯s what I¡¯m a bit confused about.
thanks!
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Any new info on the "next upgrade"?
Bob
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Alex,
I would be just as much upset with the floppy guard do you think it is a price point issue?
Comparatively, the guard tube on my K975 is massive but it comes with a much more expensive saw. BTW, mine does not swing out either, may be new ones do.
Imran? On Feb 18, 2020, at 10:49 AM, Alex Bowlds <aabj@...> wrote:
? I have the Felder overhead guard on my KF700SP. ?It is on a saw with the wide rip option, so the arm is quite long. ?The pros include... ?It is really built heavy duty. ?It functions well, and with the right dust extractor system, it collects the vast majority of the sawdust. ?It easily swings out of the way. ?
It¡¯s only drawback is the mounting system that felder used to attach it to the saw chassis. ?For engineers, they really missed the boat on this one. ?Mine is a 2018 vintage saw. ?I have not checked to see if they improved the mounting method. ?Due to the weight, the length of the arm, and the poor mounting method, when the guard is swung out of the way, it droops down several inches. ?This is probably not as much of an issue with the shorter arm used on the narrow rip capacity saws.
When I get disgusted enough, I will take the time to make a better mounting bracket and kick the Felder stupidity to the curb. ?
And before you go down the ¡°did you bring this to the attention of Felder¡± path, indeed I did. ?To no avail. ?I am apparently the only one that has a problem with the mounting design of their overhead saw guard. ?I guess a little droop is not too much of an inconvenience for others.
Again I think it is probably not a problem on a narrow rip capacity saw. ?I would probably purchase it again, and modify the mounting bracket prior to the initial installation. ?It really is well built except for the one flaw.
Alex On Feb 10, 2020, at 12:40 PM, Sang Luu <sangluu@...> wrote:
?I've read a few older posts about this but I must say, I sort of regret not getting the overhead saw guard on my K700s. The stock Euro Guard II doesn't work too well especially if there's a hose connected to it. The weight of the hose, even when suspended in the air, can deflect the guard making it a pain to use.?
I'm wondering if someone here has been able to make (force!) the stock Euro Guard II work well enough for daily use?
I'm asking so I can pretend to exhaust all options before I break down and just buy or make/adapt a non-Felder version to the saw.?
BTW, this is the non-Felder option I've been looking at:?
It's made by a Taiwanese panel saw manufacturer (clones of Euro saws) but they have a pretty neat dust guard which I think is 95% bolt on. The only modification would be the placement of the arm, relative to the extension tables, to match the Felder dimensions, but otherwise the mounting is conceptually the same. If it costs me $500 and couple of hours of fitting, it would be a good option, price-wise, mee-thinks.?
Here's a video of it in action:?
Sang
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I have the Felder overhead guard on my KF700SP. ?It is on a saw with the wide rip option, so the arm is quite long. ?The pros include... ?It is really built heavy duty. ?It functions well, and with the right dust extractor system, it collects the vast majority of the sawdust. ?It easily swings out of the way. ?
It¡¯s only drawback is the mounting system that felder used to attach it to the saw chassis. ?For engineers, they really missed the boat on this one. ?Mine is a 2018 vintage saw. ?I have not checked to see if they improved the mounting method. ?Due to the weight, the length of the arm, and the poor mounting method, when the guard is swung out of the way, it droops down several inches. ?This is probably not as much of an issue with the shorter arm used on the narrow rip capacity saws.
When I get disgusted enough, I will take the time to make a better mounting bracket and kick the Felder stupidity to the curb. ?
And before you go down the ¡°did you bring this to the attention of Felder¡± path, indeed I did. ?To no avail. ?I am apparently the only one that has a problem with the mounting design of their overhead saw guard. ?I guess a little droop is not too much of an inconvenience for others.
Again I think it is probably not a problem on a narrow rip capacity saw. ?I would probably purchase it again, and modify the mounting bracket prior to the initial installation. ?It really is well built except for the one flaw.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Feb 10, 2020, at 12:40 PM, Sang Luu <sangluu@...> wrote:
?I've read a few older posts about this but I must say, I sort of regret not getting the overhead saw guard on my K700s. The stock Euro Guard II doesn't work too well especially if there's a hose connected to it. The weight of the hose, even when suspended in the air, can deflect the guard making it a pain to use.?
I'm wondering if someone here has been able to make (force!) the stock Euro Guard II work well enough for daily use?
I'm asking so I can pretend to exhaust all options before I break down and just buy or make/adapt a non-Felder version to the saw.?
BTW, this is the non-Felder option I've been looking at:?
It's made by a Taiwanese panel saw manufacturer (clones of Euro saws) but they have a pretty neat dust guard which I think is 95% bolt on. The only modification would be the placement of the arm, relative to the extension tables, to match the Felder dimensions, but otherwise the mounting is conceptually the same. If it costs me $500 and couple of hours of fitting, it would be a good option, price-wise, mee-thinks.?
Here's a video of it in action:?
Sang
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Jonathan, Nice cabinetry ? On Feb 18, 2020, at 10:36 AM, jontathan samways <jonathansamways@...> wrote:
? Glen I use spax 4mm screws and drill a 5mm hole, gives a little wiggle?room.? I fit the front's in the shop to save time on site. I use spacers to set the front up and then just screw it up, if you use quality runners you get very little sag
Attached is one I did last week.
Jonathan?
<20200214_151148.jpg>
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Glen,
Below is the link to the torx bit I use the Wurth Assy screws. ? It has what Wera calls a ¡°Holding Function¡± which basically means the bit is a tight fit to the recess and has a slightly tapered torx star pattern, which translates into ¡°you can hold a screw with the bit horizontally or vertically without it falling off the bit¡± ? It also means you can really push down hard on the screw when starting it with much less risk that the screw will angle over and the bit go diving into the material you¡¯re trying to screw into. ??
Here¡¯s a review of the various Wera torx bit styles that explains.
?
These bits are more expensive, but hold up very well and are worth the extra money IMO. ? If you get the proper size, the HF bits work just as well with GRK.
David Best
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Hi all, I want to thank everyone on the input on what screws to use. after your thoughts and what I read, Straight slot is the.... no never mind.
I have decided on GRK for the BS projects i do and the fact That I have a lot of them.
Going with David suggestion on Wurth assy plus for boxes.
?And Michael suggestion on Hafele for the drawer fronts.
I try this approach as see how it goes.?
On drawer slides? i am going to give the bottom mounts a try, Little more money. But this is what I found.
on the shitty side mounts I got and used, I spent a lot of time using spacers to get the fronts as close as I could. Now moving my stuff in to the drawers I have movement in the slides to throw off my alignment. I actually thought about preloading the drawers with some bricks before hand but didn't.
I was thinking about trying something I am against but... When you buy premade shit cabs from HD or Blows, the drawer box hole is oversize so you can adjust the front.
Not my way but anybody do it this way ?
Thanks? for all your help as always
Glen? ?
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Re: Felder overhead guard vs. riving knife mounted guard
Dust collection aside, my issue with riving mounted guard is the fact that I am removing the guard often for buried cuts. The riving knife is recommended to be above the top of blade which also improves clearance for clamps etc to not interfere with the knob that secures the guard in the riving knife.
So on my KF, I have resorted to keeping the riving knife below top of blade so I only remove the guard for buried cuts.
I have recently acquired K975 with overhead guard. I have not used it yet so will see if I am going to be happy with it.
Imran On Feb 18, 2020, at 10:02 AM, John Harden <caliplinker2@...> wrote:
?If you figure out the answer, let me know.? The stock riving knife mounted guard with small dust port works okay, but misses quite a lot of the dust.? I've toyed with either making or buying an overarm system that accepts a 4" port. ?
I've looked at the shark guard, which isn't bad, and has the advantage of custom, 3D printed dust ports.? From YouTube reviews, it seems to catch most all of the dust.? I would think with "whiskers" such as these attached, it would catch most everything.
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Glen I use spax 4mm screws and drill a 5mm hole, gives a little wiggle?room.? I fit the front's in the shop to save time on site. I use spacers to set the front up and then just screw it up, if you use quality runners you get very little sag
Attached is one I did last week.
Jonathan?
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Re: I did something stupid!
I will show this message to the electrician. Would the power drive panel had worked like it did if the wiring was not correct? That¡¯s what I¡¯m a bit confused about.
thanks!
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Then there's this guy.? Probably nicest DIY blade guard I've ever seen and would work well with our sliders where we do most of our ripping from left of blade.? His video work is even better than his blade guard.? LOL!!!
https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=shark+guard+system&ru=%2fvideos%2fsearch%3fq%3dshark%2bguard%2bsystem%26FORM%3dHDRSC3&view=detail&mid=7F9CB23C2D4936FD845C7F9CB23C2D4936FD845C&&FORM=VDRVRV
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Re: Felder overhead guard vs. riving knife mounted guard
If you figure out the answer, let me know.? The stock riving knife mounted guard with small dust port works okay, but misses quite a lot of the dust.? I've toyed with either making or buying an overarm system that accepts a 4" port. ?
I've looked at the shark guard, which isn't bad, and has the advantage of custom, 3D printed dust ports.? From YouTube reviews, it seems to catch most all of the dust.? I would think with "whiskers" such as these attached, it would catch most everything.
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Re: I did something stupid!
Mac is has a great point here. When I was setting up my stuff< i was told to make sure that the electronics are not connected to the manufactured leg. I asked Felder several times and here as well. After being less unsure what I was doing I did it and it worked.
In my case with a Phase Perfect it was L-1 and L3 were the line side and L2 the manufactured leg, on my machines the brown wire was the one to pay close attention to.
I cant remember it exactly but it worked out fine and for the machines running backwards it was a simple switch of L1 and L3 I think. Dont go by this but David Best and others can explain it very simple and follow them. Glen
Big Tree Woodworking
P.O. Box 257 Avery Ca 95224
On Mon, Feb 17, 2020 at 8:27 PM mac campshure via Groups.Io <mac512002= [email protected]> wrote: you ?need to make sure T 3 generated leg is not Hook to control circuit the gray lead I think ?You also ?want to make sure the AR is I think X series or voltage sensitive
Designing and building for 47 years ?Well...
Electrician came, installed phase converter. It is an American Rotary PL- 20 which will be connected to the 940 S.
Voltage read 243,248,249.?
The saw is still on the crate, I literally just unloaded it and didn't have time to off load the machine yet. All the "goodies" around the main saw are off - only the saw remains.
We plugged it into the saw, just to make sure the panel lit up and the machine was getting "power".
It lit up and was getting power... and, I just couldn't resist touching the power drive for height. I turned the height up until the riving knife was exposed. Then... the panel went blank.?
Machine won't turn on.
So, I read through some of the manual and i know there is a motor switch on the back by the main (black nub inside clear dome)
But, I did not want to touch anything... First order of business.. I guess is to unload it fully off the crate :D
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Felder overhead guard vs. riving knife mounted guard
I know this must have been discussed in the past, but my search didn't answer my question.
Is it pretty well concluded that the overarm system is superior to the standard type that connects to the riving knife.
Is the bulkiness of the OG overcome by it's advantages? I'm still on the fence on this feature for a KF 700.
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Michael Glaser
imran
David P. Best
