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Re: Laser Kerf Line for slider saw?
All this laser talk got me curious again. I was so disgusted after buying the cheap Chinese laser on ebay I gave up.
I happened to have an old David White laser that was no longer reliable as an install tool because of the gyro function not?working. I made a simple wood mount to attach it to my overarm guard. It works well enough, even with all the lights on to call it a win. A little hard to see in the photo, but it's there and not too wide/fuzzy 10 feet out. Jason Holtz J. Holtz Furniture 3307 Snelling Ave. South Minneapolis, MN 55406 612.432.2765 -- Jason J. Holtz Furniture 3307 Snelling Ave. South Minneapolis, MN 55406 |
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Re: Home-brew table extension rails for off-brand machines
Tom,
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the depth of lip on two of my ext tables measure 6.5mm. so if you can provide 7mm clearance then the tables should mount BUT i am curious why felder built it with more clearance on one side. perhaps it is to give more options but it could be for an accessory that requires more depth. maybe someone can chime in. imran On Dec 5, 2020, at 3:25 PM, imranindiana via groups.io <imranindiana@...> wrote:
?Tom, ¡° I'm still curious about the "standard" offset from the table surface to the top of the bar on Felder machines where the F-rail is integrated/milled into the table¡± i was not clear but in my last response, the 11mm i mentioned is the distance on the cast/machined F couplings on KF700 and dual51 planet cast iron tables - as made by felder. Imran On Dec 5, 2020, at 3:10 PM, tom@... wrote: I'm still curious about the "standard" offset from the table surface to the top of the bar on Felder machines where the F-rail is integrated/milled into the table |
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Re: Home-brew table extension rails for off-brand machines
Tom,
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
¡° I'm still curious about the "standard" offset from the table surface to the top of the bar on Felder machines where the F-rail is integrated/milled into the table¡± i was not clear but in my last response, the 11mm i mentioned is the distance on the cast/machined F couplings on KF700 and dual51 planet cast iron tables - as made by felder. Imran On Dec 5, 2020, at 3:10 PM, tom@... wrote:
I'm still curious about the "standard" offset from the table surface to the top of the bar on Felder machines where the F-rail is integrated/milled into the table |
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Re: Home-brew table extension rails for off-brand machines
After spending more time with the table extension and Felder mounting bars, I'm realizing that:
-- If I flip the mounting bars "upside down" so the fasteners are closer to the top of the bar, -- Use a smaller diameter spacer (stock is 20mm in diameter, I can can get on McMaster in 16mm diameter) -- The aluminum table extensions should just work, where I could mount it anywhere on the bar without worrying about interacting with the mounting bolts.? I'm still curious about the "standard" offset from the table surface to the top of the bar on Felder machines where the F-rail is integrated/milled into the table surface.... (EDIT: I'm just seeing now Imran's previous message, seeming to confirm 11mm offset) Tom Gensmer Heritage Home Renewals, LLC Minneapolis, MN |
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Re: Home-brew table extension rails for off-brand machines
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýTom, on 2 of my machines the top of F bar is 11mm below surface of machine table. i was going from memory so it is 11mm for me but others have stated that they mounted 10mm below. FWIW, the 40mm wide felder mounting bar center line is 35.5mm below jointer top as mounted on my machine (11mm top to top distance). imran On Dec 5, 2020, at 2:01 PM, tom@... wrote:
?Thanks Joe, Imran, and Chris, ?this is all great information.? Chris, that diagram is exactly what I was looking for. For reference, the band saw I'm currently using is a Laguna LT14 SUV, and has a table ~35mm in thickness. Going by the document you've scanned, it looks like the Aigner bars would?just work, I would just want to be careful that I'm only using table extensions with the leg support.? For reference, it looks like the Felder bars have the fastener centered 25mm below the top of the bar, which in turn should be ~11mm (10-12mm) below the table surface, so I'm inferring that the holes should be centered ~36mm below the table surface. <IMG_1104.jpeg> ?Imran, you mentioned setting the bar 10-12mm below the table surface. Based on the Felder aluminum extension table, I was planning on setting the bar 11mm below table surface. That being said, yes in a perfect world I'd want all of the bars to match, do you know what the drop is on the Felder machines where the bar is integral/milled into the table surface? I have a KF700SP on order that I could measure, but it won't arrive until January and I'd like to get these bars installed before then.? -- Tom Gensmer Heritage Home Renewals, LLC Minneapolis, MN |
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Re: Home-brew table extension rails for off-brand machines
Thanks Joe, Imran, and Chris, ?this is all great information.?
Chris, that diagram is exactly what I was looking for. For reference, the band saw I'm currently using is a Laguna LT14 SUV, and has a table ~35mm in thickness. Going by the document you've scanned, it looks like the Aigner bars would?just work, I would just want to be careful that I'm only using table extensions with the leg support.? For reference, it looks like the Felder bars have the fastener centered 25mm below the top of the bar, which in turn should be ~11mm (10-12mm) below the table surface, so I'm inferring that the holes should be centered ~36mm below the table surface. Imran, you mentioned setting the bar 10-12mm below the table surface. Based on the Felder aluminum extension table, I was planning on setting the bar 11mm below table surface. That being said, yes in a perfect world I'd want all of the bars to match, do you know what the drop is on the Felder machines where the bar is integral/milled into the table surface? I have a KF700SP on order that I could measure, but it won't arrive until January and I'd like to get these bars installed before then.? -- Tom Gensmer Heritage Home Renewals, LLC Minneapolis, MN |
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Re: Home-brew table extension rails for off-brand machines
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýI added the Aigner rails on a few of my machines. Per specification, the mounting hole centerline needs to be 30mm from top to support the Aigner extensions.? I did have a machine that needed the top extended to support this 30mm requirement. ?? ? Regards, ? Chris Perren ? ? ? From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of imranindiana via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, December 5, 2020 11:53 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [FOG] Home-brew table extension rails for off-brand machines ? Oops! again. i only use pressure module on this aigner bar in bandsaw. actually, did not know until reading joe¡¯s (not in NO) response that it won¡¯t work with ext tables ?. so far i have not even attempt place one. ? Felder ones in dual51 are 40mm wide and i measure 47mm from top of jointer table to bottom of stand-off. stand-off is 20mm in dia. ? imran
? tom, ? sorry i missed center line part. so yes ~35mm. my bandsaw table is 32mm and aigner bar works - see pic. ? so you have machines with not as deep a skirt? ? <image0.jpeg> ? ? imran
? Tom, ? where are you getting 35mm from? the flat bars are placed either 10 or 12 mm below the machine table surface. i cannot remember which one of these two match my machine but others swear by the 2nd number. ? imran
?Hi gang! I did a search for this topic and couldn't find much, if this has been discussed previously I'd appreciate your grace and a link to the discussion.? |
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Re: Home-brew table extension rails for off-brand machines
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýOops! again. i only use pressure module on this aigner bar in bandsaw. actually, did not know until reading joe¡¯s (not in NO) response that it won¡¯t work with ext tables ?. so far i have not even attempt place one. Felder ones in dual51 are 40mm wide and i measure 47mm from top of jointer table to bottom of stand-off. stand-off is 20mm in dia. imran On Dec 5, 2020, at 12:42 PM, imranindiana via groups.io <imranindiana@...> wrote:
? tom, sorry i missed center line part. so yes ~35mm. my bandsaw table is 32mm and aigner bar works - see pic. so you have machines with not as deep a skirt? <image0.jpeg> imran On Dec 5, 2020, at 12:28 PM, imranindiana via groups.io <imranindiana@...> wrote: ?
Tom, where are you getting 35mm from? the flat bars are placed either 10 or 12 mm below the machine table surface. i cannot remember which one of these two match my machine but others swear by the 2nd number. imran On Dec 5, 2020, at 11:35 AM, tom@... wrote: ?Hi gang! I did a search for this topic and couldn't find much, if this has been discussed previously I'd appreciate your grace and a link to the discussion.?
As I'm very early into my journey acquiring "real" shop equipment, I'm having to make-do with some "lesser" machines until budget allows for more robust units. For Felder equipment, I currently own a Hammer A3-41 and HS-950, with a KF700SP arriving sometime in January 2021. So, I'm planning on getting into the Felder/Aigner table extension ecosystem, and have already acquired a Felder aluminum table extension with the leg support, along with a pair of the 400mm table extension support bars from Felder.? One of the intended uses of the aluminum table extension with leg support is for out feed support on my band saw, as well as for use with the Felder/Aigner circle cutting jig (band saw and edge sander).? The issue I'm bumping into is, the Felder table extension support bars seem intended for machines with cast iron tables that have at least a ~50mm+ tall apron (by my math, I think the centerline of the fasteners is ~35mm down from the table surface). Many of the machines I currently own have much shallower aprons, they all seem to be ~35mm deep.? -- For those who are using the Aigner support bars, can you please let me know what you think the minimum depth of apron is required to use them?? -- I see Felder sells a sort of "Universal" support bar, part # 1.0.150, but I can't find any information regarding how it mounts to a machine, and what the minimum apron thickness is? Does anybody have experience or a diagram??? -- If the above two products don't work out, I'm left with the option of either: ? ? ? A.) Bolting or welding 2" bar stock to the machine tables to act as a deeper apron and using the Felder or Aigner support bars, or? ? ? ? B.) Home-brewing my own extension bars that would accommodate the shallow (~35mm) aprons of my current machines. If I go with this option, it would likely necessitate using smaller diameter fasters, which in my mind would simple mean I'd need more (I'd probably use 4 or 5 support bolts for a 400mm bar, versus the 3 larger bolts Felder uses). I was thinking 1/4-20 bolts with 1/2" diameter spacers. I would also only use the table extension with a leg for these machines, not the tables which cantilever.? Any input or experience would be much appreciated.? Tom Gensmer Heritage Home Renewals, LLC Minneapolis, MN |
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Re: Home-brew table extension rails for off-brand machines
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýtom, sorry i missed center line part. so yes ~35mm. my bandsaw table is 32mm and aigner bar works - see pic. so you have machines with not as deep a skirt? imran On Dec 5, 2020, at 12:28 PM, imranindiana via groups.io <imranindiana@...> wrote:
? Tom, where are you getting 35mm from? the flat bars are placed either 10 or 12 mm below the machine table surface. i cannot remember which one of these two match my machine but others swear by the 2nd number. imran On Dec 5, 2020, at 11:35 AM, tom@... wrote: ?Hi gang! I did a search for this topic and couldn't find much, if this has been discussed previously I'd appreciate your grace and a link to the discussion.?
As I'm very early into my journey acquiring "real" shop equipment, I'm having to make-do with some "lesser" machines until budget allows for more robust units. For Felder equipment, I currently own a Hammer A3-41 and HS-950, with a KF700SP arriving sometime in January 2021. So, I'm planning on getting into the Felder/Aigner table extension ecosystem, and have already acquired a Felder aluminum table extension with the leg support, along with a pair of the 400mm table extension support bars from Felder.? One of the intended uses of the aluminum table extension with leg support is for out feed support on my band saw, as well as for use with the Felder/Aigner circle cutting jig (band saw and edge sander).? The issue I'm bumping into is, the Felder table extension support bars seem intended for machines with cast iron tables that have at least a ~50mm+ tall apron (by my math, I think the centerline of the fasteners is ~35mm down from the table surface). Many of the machines I currently own have much shallower aprons, they all seem to be ~35mm deep.? -- For those who are using the Aigner support bars, can you please let me know what you think the minimum depth of apron is required to use them?? -- I see Felder sells a sort of "Universal" support bar, part # 1.0.150, but I can't find any information regarding how it mounts to a machine, and what the minimum apron thickness is? Does anybody have experience or a diagram??? -- If the above two products don't work out, I'm left with the option of either: ? ? ? A.) Bolting or welding 2" bar stock to the machine tables to act as a deeper apron and using the Felder or Aigner support bars, or? ? ? ? B.) Home-brewing my own extension bars that would accommodate the shallow (~35mm) aprons of my current machines. If I go with this option, it would likely necessitate using smaller diameter fasters, which in my mind would simple mean I'd need more (I'd probably use 4 or 5 support bolts for a 400mm bar, versus the 3 larger bolts Felder uses). I was thinking 1/4-20 bolts with 1/2" diameter spacers. I would also only use the table extension with a leg for these machines, not the tables which cantilever.? Any input or experience would be much appreciated.? Tom Gensmer Heritage Home Renewals, LLC Minneapolis, MN |
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Re: Home-brew table extension rails for off-brand machines
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýTom,It is good to have all your f-rails be uniform so moving extensions from table to table is easy. I added Aigner f-rails to the table on my Northfield Unipoint saw and found that the Aigner rails are shallower than a Felder rail. ? ?The shallow f-rail would not work with the Felder extension table so I milled a strip of aluminum and bolted it to the bottom of the Aigner rail. ?I think the aluminum strip was 10mm x 10mm or so and what ever the length required. ? Joe
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Re: Home-brew table extension rails for off-brand machines
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýTom, where are you getting 35mm from? the flat bars are placed either 10 or 12 mm below the machine table surface. i cannot remember which one of these two match my machine but others swear by the 2nd number. imran On Dec 5, 2020, at 11:35 AM, tom@... wrote:
?Hi gang! I did a search for this topic and couldn't find much, if this has been discussed previously I'd appreciate your grace and a link to the discussion.? As I'm very early into my journey acquiring "real" shop equipment, I'm having to make-do with some "lesser" machines until budget allows for more robust units. For Felder equipment, I currently own a Hammer A3-41 and HS-950, with a KF700SP arriving sometime in January 2021. So, I'm planning on getting into the Felder/Aigner table extension ecosystem, and have already acquired a Felder aluminum table extension with the leg support, along with a pair of the 400mm table extension support bars from Felder.? One of the intended uses of the aluminum table extension with leg support is for out feed support on my band saw, as well as for use with the Felder/Aigner circle cutting jig (band saw and edge sander).? The issue I'm bumping into is, the Felder table extension support bars seem intended for machines with cast iron tables that have at least a ~50mm+ tall apron (by my math, I think the centerline of the fasteners is ~35mm down from the table surface). Many of the machines I currently own have much shallower aprons, they all seem to be ~35mm deep.? -- For those who are using the Aigner support bars, can you please let me know what you think the minimum depth of apron is required to use them?? -- I see Felder sells a sort of "Universal" support bar, part # 1.0.150, but I can't find any information regarding how it mounts to a machine, and what the minimum apron thickness is? Does anybody have experience or a diagram??? -- If the above two products don't work out, I'm left with the option of either: ? ? ? A.) Bolting or welding 2" bar stock to the machine tables to act as a deeper apron and using the Felder or Aigner support bars, or? ? ? ? B.) Home-brewing my own extension bars that would accommodate the shallow (~35mm) aprons of my current machines. If I go with this option, it would likely necessitate using smaller diameter fasters, which in my mind would simple mean I'd need more (I'd probably use 4 or 5 support bolts for a 400mm bar, versus the 3 larger bolts Felder uses). I was thinking 1/4-20 bolts with 1/2" diameter spacers. I would also only use the table extension with a leg for these machines, not the tables which cantilever.? Any input or experience would be much appreciated.? Tom Gensmer Heritage Home Renewals, LLC Minneapolis, MN |
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Home-brew table extension rails for off-brand machines
Hi gang! I did a search for this topic and couldn't find much, if this has been discussed previously I'd appreciate your grace and a link to the discussion.?
As I'm very early into my journey acquiring "real" shop equipment, I'm having to make-do with some "lesser" machines until budget allows for more robust units. For Felder equipment, I currently own a Hammer A3-41 and HS-950, with a KF700SP arriving sometime in January 2021. So, I'm planning on getting into the Felder/Aigner table extension ecosystem, and have already acquired a Felder aluminum table extension with the leg support, along with a pair of the 400mm table extension support bars from Felder.? One of the intended uses of the aluminum table extension with leg support is for out feed support on my band saw, as well as for use with the Felder/Aigner circle cutting jig (band saw and edge sander).? The issue I'm bumping into is, the Felder table extension support bars seem intended for machines with cast iron tables that have at least a ~50mm+ tall apron (by my math, I think the centerline of the fasteners is ~35mm down from the table surface). Many of the machines I currently own have much shallower aprons, they all seem to be ~35mm deep.? -- For those who are using the Aigner support bars, can you please let me know what you think the minimum depth of apron is required to use them?? -- I see Felder sells a sort of "Universal" support bar, part # 1.0.150, but I can't find any information regarding how it mounts to a machine, and what the minimum apron thickness is? Does anybody have experience or a diagram??? -- If the above two products don't work out, I'm left with the option of either: ? ? ? A.) Bolting or welding 2" bar stock to the machine tables to act as a deeper apron and using the Felder or Aigner support bars, or? ? ? ? B.) Home-brewing my own extension bars that would accommodate the shallow (~35mm) aprons of my current machines. If I go with this option, it would likely necessitate using smaller diameter fasters, which in my mind would simple mean I'd need more (I'd probably use 4 or 5 support bolts for a 400mm bar, versus the 3 larger bolts Felder uses). I was thinking 1/4-20 bolts with 1/2" diameter spacers. I would also only use the table extension with a leg for these machines, not the tables which cantilever.? Any input or experience would be much appreciated.? Tom Gensmer Heritage Home Renewals, LLC Minneapolis, MN |
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Re: Heavy duty cart
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýMark, very interesting. on a somewhat related note, i live near Kokomo, IN. this is the only area in the world that makes all Chrysler transmissions. when i came to the area in 1989 there was one original plant and over the years they have added 3 more. only the original plant has furnace so we see these trucks with a huge crucible transporting molten AL. kind of cool. imran On Dec 4, 2020, at 11:54 PM, Mark Kessler <mkessler10@...> wrote:
? Totally not woodworking but thought some of you would get a kick out of this cart they made at work, I think its for a 144 drop PET hotrunner (HR = melt delivery system for a mold) for water bottles so probably rated for around 5k but looks to be much more than that. Last picture shows a hot half on the left and the cold half on the right, the hot half would lay on its back on the cart which they would then roll into an area to do a heat test before shipping. I could be wrong on the cart thought, the lashing points are throwing me off, will have to check into it next week. <image0.jpeg> <image1.jpeg> <image2.jpeg> Regards, Mark
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Heavy duty cart
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýTotally not woodworking but thought some of you would get a kick out of this cart they made at work, I think its for a 144 drop PET hotrunner (HR = melt delivery system for a mold) for water bottles so probably rated for around 5k but looks to be much more than that. Last picture shows a hot half on the left and the cold half on the right, the hot half would lay on its back on the cart which they would then roll into an area to do a heat test before shipping. I could be wrong on the cart thought, the lashing points are throwing me off, will have to check into it next week. Regards, Mark |
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Re: Laser Kerf Line for slider saw?
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýsimilar to comments from Brett and Mark, for me, it really is an aid to line up rough board for the first straight line rip. at least that is how i used it 3 yrs ago. getting ready to use if again with laser relocated to saw¡¯s new location. imran On Dec 4, 2020, at 1:53 PM, Brett Wissel <Brettwissel@...> wrote:
? Mark Kessler -? My original interest in starting this thread was not so much accuracy but to more efficiently align the first cuts on stock to maximize yield but work around defects like knots, bows, and grain runoff. I have found many times I keep jostling back and forth with front and rear edges and checking my gage blocks at the ends when I'm really trying to find the straightline?through the materials, and I'm tired of feeling like I should be smarter than I am. Once the straightline is established, it's back to positive stops, fences. and parallel?guides to get the accuracy we paid for in these fancy saws. Sadly, I have discovered that while I have solved this issue/problem , I have yet to solve the problem of feeling like I should be more clever, smarter than I am, lol. As for remarks about fuzzy lines, line widths, etc., I believe that this is a result of such variable specifications among products sold and inability to trust the specs on equipment listings for lasers or equipment containing lasers. So thanks to all those who have shared their real-world experiences, and for justifying?my curiosity in this solution that apparently many of us have shared. On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 12:06 PM Mark Kessler <mkessler10@...> wrote:
Brett Wissel
Saint Louis Restoration 1831 S Kingshighway Blvd (at Shaw Blvd) St Louis, MO 63110 314.772.2167 brett@... |
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Re: Laser Kerf Line for slider saw?
Mark Kessler -? My original interest in starting this thread was not so much accuracy but to more efficiently align the first cuts on stock to maximize yield but work around defects like knots, bows, and grain runoff. I have found many times I keep jostling back and forth with front and rear edges and checking my gage blocks at the ends when I'm really trying to find the straightline?through the materials, and I'm tired of feeling like I should be smarter than I am. Once the straightline is established, it's back to positive stops, fences. and parallel?guides to get the accuracy we paid for in these fancy saws. Sadly, I have discovered that while I have solved this issue/problem , I have yet to solve the problem of feeling like I should be more clever, smarter than I am, lol. As for remarks about fuzzy lines, line widths, etc., I believe that this is a result of such variable specifications among products sold and inability to trust the specs on equipment listings for lasers or equipment containing lasers. So thanks to all those who have shared their real-world experiences, and for justifying?my curiosity in this solution that apparently many of us have shared. On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 12:06 PM Mark Kessler <mkessler10@...> wrote:
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Brett Wissel Saint Louis Restoration 1831 S Kingshighway Blvd (at Shaw Blvd) St Louis, MO 63110 314.772.2167 brett@... |
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Re: Any pictures out there of aftermarket rip fence DRO installs?
#whysoexpensive
I use a Wixey on my bandsaw and it works really well. It's my second one. Not sure about a table saw, but it's certainly accurate enough for me and the bandsaw. Bill B¨¦langer On Fri, Dec 4, 2020 at 11:04 AM <tomruth@...> wrote: Mark Kessler, |
Jason Holtz
imran
Tom Gensmer
Bill Belanger