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ratflector

 

Well I did as A Type I got? np3jd.ddns.net BUT I still can not access it,?
NP3JD
 

I think you are using your LAN IP address, not your WAN IP address. A LAN IP can be fixed (static) which only means when you reboot your router that device gets the same internal IP address. That has nothing to do with your WAN IP address, which is what you need. That is the real IP address your router is using to reach the internet. As I'm sure you know, most ISPs give you a dynamic address...they can change it from time to time and often do. A static IP address often costs more. You can also get one free from a number of services that you can route through. A static IP address is beneficial to an internet asset (like a ratflector) so other people can find it in the same place all the time. Otherwise, it can work, but you may have to give everyone your current IP address frequently.?
This is my IP address (at the moment)?131.106.226.224?

Yours will be totally different and unique. Anything with 192.168.xxxxxx is a local address only on your own LAN.?
 

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HI Michael, when you sat that I m using the ?the LAN or wan ?address where exactly is that piece of info need to be placed? On the router , on the ratflector?

?

Just in case this are the step that I follow:

  1. My pc has an Static ip address 192.168.8.50.
  2. That Ip Address is on the router under virtual service as :
    1. wan port 9000-9500;
    2. ip 192.168.8.50 (pc static ip);
    3. ?lan port : 9000-9500,
    4. tcp/upd; status on.
  3. On the same router under DDNS I have the NOIP configuration :
    1. provider NO-IP.com;
    2. status on;
    3. domain name: np3jd.ddns.net;
    4. connection status: Connected.
    5. With username and password ok
  4. On the pc I run UCD NOIP software so it can send the right IP every 5 minutes to np3jd.ddns.net on NOIP. Right now is 72.50.16.221 and UCD ?will check every 5 minutes
  5. I turn on the Drats repeater program. NO info added, nothing here no ip no nothing, I ?just click on ?“trust localhost”???
  6. On the same ?laptop also I run DRATS with only 1 radio connected to net:localhost:9000. This is to see the traffic on the Drats repeater programs.
  7. I see on the drats ?client on this pc that it is connected to drats repeater program

?

But nothing I can not connect to it from another computer. AS a matter of fact UCD has under Tools menu a nice ingredient. It is a “Open Port Check Tool” if you click on it, it will take you to a web site whre you can add the port and it will verify if it is working or not. And guess what jajaj mine aint working jajajajaj

?

So where exactly on those steps do I have to put the WAN IP Address?????? Router set up? Drats repeater paths? Jajaaj this is driving my nuts jajajajajjaj

?

V/R

Jose

NP3JD

?

PS We are specting Fiona Storm in Puerto Rico, hopefully no Donkey jajajajja

?

73

?

?

?

Sent from for Windows

?

From: Michael Mandell
Sent: Saturday, September 17, 2022 1:56 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [d-rats] ratflector

?

I think you are using your LAN IP address, not your WAN IP address. A LAN IP can be fixed (static) which only means when you reboot your router that device gets the same internal IP address. That has nothing to do with your WAN IP address, which is what you need. That is the real IP address your router is using to reach the internet. As I'm sure you know, most ISPs give you a dynamic address...they can change it from time to time and often do. A static IP address often costs more. You can also get one free from a number of services that you can route through. A static IP address is beneficial to an internet asset (like a ratflector) so other people can find it in the same place all the time. Otherwise, it can work, but you may have to give everyone your current IP address frequently.?
This is my IP address (at the moment)?131.106.226.224?

Yours will be totally different and unique. Anything with 192.168.xxxxxx is a local address only on your own LAN.?

?

8B07458A42B04092A8754DEABB657EA5.png

 

On 9/17/2022 5:44 AM, José David Colón Custodio wrote:
HI Michael, when you sat that I m using the the LAN or wan address where exactly is that piece of info need to be placed? On the router , on the ratflector?
Just in case this are the step that I follow:
1. My pc has an Static ip address 192.168.8.50.
2. That Ip Address is on the router under virtual service as :
* wan port 9000-9500;
* ip 192.168.8.50 (pc static ip);
* lan port : 9000-9500,
* tcp/upd; status on.
3. On the same router under DDNS I have the NOIP configuration :
* provider NO-IP.com;
* status on;
* domain name: np3jd.ddns.net;
* connection status: Connected.
* With username and password ok
Very important bit of information is still missing.
What IP address does your router say is was assigned?

If that address not 72.50.16.221, that means that you have two levels of NAT translation going on, and that is the reason it is not working for you.

I mentioned that on a previous post.

The only manual I can find online is the Quick Start manual.

4. On the pc I run UCD NOIP software so it can send the right IP every 5 minutes to np3jd.ddns.net on NOIP. Right now is 72.50.16.221 and UCD will check every 5 minutes
You only need to NOIP set up on your NAT router. Nothing is needed on the PC, except the ratflector.

5. I turn on the Drats repeater program. NO info added, nothing here no ip no nothing, I just click on “trust localhost”
You have found a minor bug in d-rats_repeater.py. The "trust localhost" is only needed if you have "Require Authentication" also checked.
So the trust localhost button should not be enabled unless you have "Require Authentication" also enabled.

6. On the same laptop also I run DRATS with only 1 radio connected to net:localhost:9000. This is to see the traffic on the Drats repeater programs.
7. I see on the drats client on this pc that it is connected to drats repeater program
But nothing I can not connect to it from another computer. AS a matter of fact UCD has under Tools menu a nice ingredient. It is a “Open Port Check Tool” if you click on it, it will take you to a web site whre you can add the port and it will verify if it is working or not. And guess what jajaj mine aint working jajajajaj
So where exactly on those steps do I have to put the WAN IP Address?????? Router set up? Drats repeater paths? Jajaaj this is driving my nuts jajajajajjaj
Earlier you posted that you can not reach the ratflector on a different system on your network.

You need to check your PC firewall program to make sure that port 9000 is not blocking it.

You would need to use the current LAN IP 192.168.8.50 of the system running the ratflector to work from another system on your own network.

That issue has nothing to do with your router configuration. There is no point in trying to get NO-IP to work until the above works.

Once you get it working with your LAN IP address of the ratflector, then you can try testing with your public IP address.

Next you need to find out is what your NAT Router thinks the external IP address is. I asked you to do that check before.

If it is not 72.50.16.221, then you will probably have to see if you can find a support person for your wireless provider that knows how to make your port 9000 visible.

Also check terms and conditions of your ISP, in the U.S. many of the residential ISPs explicitly prohibit running a server visible to the public internet.

73,
-John
 

On 9/16/2022 10:03 AM, David Ranch wrote:
Hello John,

All IPV4 addresses are now assigned.
Any thoughts on how much work it would be to make D-Rats be IPv6 compatible?? IPv6 is clearly the future of the Internet, most ISPs support it now, and the ridiculous number of IPs you get from your ISP are all publicly reachable.
I am not setup for IPV6 to smoke test things at this time.

The raflector may just work if you try to connect to it by its IPV6 address.

73,
-John
wb8tyw
 

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Router’ s WAN IP address I no the same as PC IP address.

?

I give up jajajajja

?

NP3JD

?

Sent from for Windows

?

From: John E. Malmberg
Sent: Saturday, September 17, 2022 7:14 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [d-rats] ratflector

?

On 9/17/2022 5:44 AM, José David Colón Custodio wrote:
> HI Michael, when you sat that I m using the? the LAN or wan? address where exactly is that piece of info need to be placed? On the router , on the ratflector?
>
> Just in case this are the step that I follow:
>
>??? 1.? My pc has an Static ip address 192.168.8.50.
>??? 2.? That Ip Address is on the router under virtual service as :
>?????? *?? wan port 9000-9500;
>?????? *?? ip 192.168.8.50 (pc static ip);
>?????? *??? lan port : 9000-9500,
>?????? *?? tcp/upd; status on.
>??? 3.? On the same router under DDNS I have the NOIP configuration :
>?????? *?? provider NO-IP.com;
>?????? *?? status on;
>?????? *?? domain name: np3jd.ddns.net;
>?????? *?? connection status: Connected.
>?????? *?? With username and password ok

Very important bit of information is still missing.
What IP address does your router say is was assigned?

If that address not 72.50.16.221, that means that you have two levels of
NAT translation going on, and that is the reason it is not working for you.

I mentioned that on a previous post.

The only manual I can find online is the Quick Start manual.

>??? 4.? On the pc I run UCD NOIP software so it can send the right IP every 5 minutes to np3jd.ddns.net on NOIP. Right now is 72.50.16.221 and UCD? will check every 5 minutes

You only need to NOIP set up on your NAT router.? Nothing is needed on
the PC, except the ratflector.

>??? 5.? I turn on the Drats repeater program. NO info added, nothing here no ip no nothing, I? just click on? “trust localhost”

You have found a minor bug in d-rats_repeater.py.? The "trust localhost"
is only needed if you have "Require Authentication" also checked.
So the trust localhost button should not be enabled unless you have
"Require Authentication" also enabled.

>??? 6.? On the same? laptop also I run DRATS with only 1 radio connected to net:localhost:9000. This is to see the traffic on the Drats repeater programs.
>??? 7.? I see on the drats? client on this pc that it is connected to drats repeater program
>
> But nothing I can not connect to it from another computer. AS a matter of fact UCD has under Tools menu a nice ingredient. It is a “Open Port Check Tool” if you click on it, it will take you to a web site whre you can add the port and it will verify if it is working or not. And guess what jajaj mine aint working jajajajaj
>
> So where exactly on those steps do I have to put the WAN IP Address?????? Router set up? Drats repeater paths? Jajaaj this is driving my nuts jajajajajjaj

Earlier you posted that you can not reach the ratflector on a different
system on your network.

You need to check your PC firewall program to make sure that port 9000
is not blocking it.

You would need to use the current LAN IP 192.168.8.50 of the system
running the ratflector to work from another system on your own network.

That issue has nothing to do with your router configuration.? There is
no point in trying to get NO-IP to work until the above works.

Once you get it working with your LAN IP address of the ratflector, then
you can try testing with your public IP address.

Next you need to find out is what your NAT Router thinks the external IP
address is.? I asked you to do that check before.

If it is not 72.50.16.221, then you will probably have to see if you can
find a support person for your wireless provider that knows how to make
your port 9000 visible.

Also check terms and conditions of your ISP, in the U.S. many of the
residential ISPs explicitly prohibit running a server visible to the
public internet.

73,
-John







?
 

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Change of router then is the COA. I ll be using a Hughes HT2010 Lets see If that Router can do the Trick

WG9115AAC22-HS model .

?

?

V/R

NP3JD

?

Sent from for Windows

?

From: José David Colón Custodio
Sent: Saturday, September 17, 2022 7:57 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [d-rats] ratflector

?

Router’ s WAN IP address I no the same as PC IP address.

?

I give up jajajajja

?

NP3JD

?

Sent from for Windows

?

From: John E. Malmberg
Sent: Saturday, September 17, 2022 7:14 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [d-rats] ratflector

?

On 9/17/2022 5:44 AM, José David Colón Custodio wrote:
> HI Michael, when you sat that I m using the? the LAN or wan? address where exactly is that piece of info need to be placed? On the router , on the ratflector?
>
> Just in case this are the step that I follow:
>
>??? 1.? My pc has an Static ip address 192.168.8.50.
>??? 2.? That Ip Address is on the router under virtual service as :
>?????? *?? wan port 9000-9500;
>?????? *?? ip 192.168.8.50 (pc static ip);
>?????? *??? lan port : 9000-9500,
>?????? *?? tcp/upd; status on.
>??? 3.? On the same router under DDNS I have the NOIP configuration :
>?????? *?? provider NO-IP.com;
>?????? *?? status on;
>?????? *?? domain name: np3jd.ddns.net;
>?????? *?? connection status: Connected.
>?????? *?? With username and password ok

Very important bit of information is still missing.
What IP address does your router say is was assigned?

If that address not 72.50.16.221, that means that you have two levels of
NAT translation going on, and that is the reason it is not working for you.

I mentioned that on a previous post.

The only manual I can find online is the Quick Start manual.

>??? 4.? On the pc I run UCD NOIP software so it can send the right IP every 5 minutes to np3jd.ddns.net on NOIP. Right now is 72.50.16.221 and UCD? will check every 5 minutes

You only need to NOIP set up on your NAT router.? Nothing is needed on
the PC, except the ratflector.

>??? 5.? I turn on the Drats repeater program. NO info added, nothing here no ip no nothing, I? just click on? “trust localhost”

You have found a minor bug in d-rats_repeater.py.? The "trust localhost"
is only needed if you have "Require Authentication" also checked.
So the trust localhost button should not be enabled unless you have
"Require Authentication" also enabled.

>??? 6.? On the same? laptop also I run DRATS with only 1 radio connected to net:localhost:9000. This is to see the traffic on the Drats repeater programs.
>??? 7.? I see on the drats? client on this pc that it is connected to drats repeater program
>
> But nothing I can not connect to it from another computer. AS a matter of fact UCD has under Tools menu a nice ingredient. It is a “Open Port Check Tool” if you click on it, it will take you to a web site whre you can add the port and it will verify if it is working or not. And guess what jajaj mine aint working jajajajaj
>
> So where exactly on those steps do I have to put the WAN IP Address?????? Router set up? Drats repeater paths? Jajaaj this is driving my nuts jajajajajjaj

Earlier you posted that you can not reach the ratflector on a different
system on your network.

You need to check your PC firewall program to make sure that port 9000
is not blocking it.

You would need to use the current LAN IP 192.168.8.50 of the system
running the ratflector to work from another system on your own network.

That issue has nothing to do with your router configuration.? There is
no point in trying to get NO-IP to work until the above works.

Once you get it working with your LAN IP address of the ratflector, then
you can try testing with your public IP address.

Next you need to find out is what your NAT Router thinks the external IP
address is.? I asked you to do that check before.

If it is not 72.50.16.221, then you will probably have to see if you can
find a support person for your wireless provider that knows how to make
your port 9000 visible.

Also check terms and conditions of your ISP, in the U.S. many of the
residential ISPs explicitly prohibit running a server visible to the
public internet.

73,
-John






?

?

DC5620A7BF8B42CAA6D89238B6225B2D.png

 

On 9/18/2022 6:35 AM, José David Colón Custodio wrote:
Change of router then is the COA. I ll be using a Hughes HT2010 Lets
see If that Router can do the Trick WG9115AAC22-HS model .
I do not expect that to work. The settings have to changed at the NAT router that is in the telephone company's data center.

Router’ s WAN IP address I no the same as PC IP address.
I am assuming that means the Router's WAN IP address is not the same as the IP shown by the whatismyip.com.

Posted earlier:

On 9/16/2022 10:03 AM, David Ranch wrote:
This is not entirely true as a user has at least two more options:

- The ISP's operated NAT is usually a form of Carrier Grade NAT
(CG-NAT) which should be able to support port forwarding via Port
Control Protocol (PCP) - . The
enduser will need to contact their ISP to see if they support PCP for
their endusers

- The end user can setup a VPN with a provider that supports port
forwarding or supports static IPs for their tunnels. I've heard good
success with vendors like vultr, etc. The VPNs aren't too expensive
to operate.
Other options are to rent a docker container or a VM for a hosting company and just put the ratflector there.

73,
-John
 

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HI John

?

Indeed the router’s wan IP I s not the same PC IP that can be found on whatismyip.com.?? I still scratching the babck omy head. I tried yesterday to set the ratflector on Hughes HT2010 model router but did not work neither. SO I ‘m doing the same mistake on both of them? Mmmmm ?I think so, or both companies? do not support port forwarding??? To much of a coincidence. In my opinion I ‘m not doing it right And my mistakes is on what ports and where should I have to place on the router. I did exactly as this guy did it but the result is different If you can take a look from minutes 4:30 on where he is setting the port forward, on WAN PORT and LAN PORT in both I’m placing 9000 .

?

About VPN well I ‘ll have to learn more about this kind of science jajajajja

ON the alternative I guess I ll have to learn How to do the Docker container COA or the VM

?

V/R

NP3JD

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of John E. Malmberg <wb8tyw@...>
Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2022 7:07:29 AM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [d-rats] ratflector

?

On 9/18/2022 6:35 AM, José David Colón Custodio wrote:
> Change of router then is the COA. I ll be using a Hughes HT2010 Lets
> see If that Router can do the Trick WG9115AAC22-HS model .
I do not expect that to work.? The settings have to changed at the NAT
router that is in the telephone company's data center.

?> Router’ s WAN IP address I no the same as PC IP address.

I am assuming that means the Router's WAN IP address is not the same as
the IP shown by the whatismyip.com.

Posted earlier:

On 9/16/2022 10:03 AM, David Ranch wrote:
?> This is not entirely true as a user has at least two more options:
?>
?>??? - The ISP's operated NAT is usually a form of Carrier Grade NAT
?> (CG-NAT) which should be able to support port forwarding via Port
?> Control Protocol (PCP) - . The
?> enduser will need to contact their ISP to see if they support PCP for
?> their endusers
?>
?>??? - The end user can setup a VPN with a provider that supports port
?> forwarding or supports static IPs for their tunnels.? I've heard good
> success with vendors like vultr, etc.? The VPNs aren't too expensive
> to operate.
Other options are to rent a docker container or a VM for a hosting
company and just put the ratflector there.

73,
-John




Sent from for Windows

?
 

开云体育


Hopefully y'll can see this doc please comment on the ports setting WAN and LAN?

TNX
NP3JD

De: [email protected] <[email protected]> en nombre de John E. Malmberg <wb8tyw@...>
Enviado: domingo, 18 de septiembre de 2022 2:07 p.?m.
Para: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Asunto: Re: [d-rats] ratflector
?
On 9/18/2022 6:35 AM, José David Colón Custodio wrote:
> Change of router then is the COA. I ll be using a Hughes HT2010 Lets
> see If that Router can do the Trick WG9115AAC22-HS model .
I do not expect that to work.? The settings have to changed at the NAT
router that is in the telephone company's data center.

?> Router’ s WAN IP address I no the same as PC IP address.

I am assuming that means the Router's WAN IP address is not the same as
the IP shown by the whatismyip.com.

Posted earlier:

On 9/16/2022 10:03 AM, David Ranch wrote:
?> This is not entirely true as a user has at least two more options:
?>
?>??? - The ISP's operated NAT is usually a form of Carrier Grade NAT
?> (CG-NAT) which should be able to support port forwarding via Port
?> Control Protocol (PCP) - . The
?> enduser will need to contact their ISP to see if they support PCP for
?> their endusers
?>
?>??? - The end user can setup a VPN with a provider that supports port
?> forwarding or supports static IPs for their tunnels.? I've heard good
> success with vendors like vultr, etc.? The VPNs aren't too expensive
> to operate.
Other options are to rent a docker container or a VM for a hosting
company and just put the ratflector there.

73,
-John





huawei port forward ports.docx
huawei port forward ports.docx

 

On 9/18/2022 9:32 AM, José David Colón Custodio wrote:
Indeed the router’s wan IP I s not the same PC IP that can be found
on whatismyip.com. I still scratching the babck omy head. I tried
yesterday to set the ratflector on Hughes HT2010 model router but did
not work neither. SO I ‘m doing the same mistake on both of them?
There is probably nothing that you can configure to on your router to make it work. Your ISP is what is blocking you from running a public ratflector. That is what I have been trying to get you to understand.

The instructions in the manual and the video do not deal with your ISP's configuration.

The instructions only work with this configuration:

PC <> Your Nat router <> ISP <> public Internet

Your configuration is:

PC <> Nat router <> ISP Nat Router <> Public Internet.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
|
The "ISP Nat Router" is what is stopping you.

The port forwarding needs to be set on both NAT routers, or it will not work. And you need to check with your ISP to find out if there is any way to to set the ISP Nat router to forward port 9000.

Looking back at your previous posts, your whatsmyip address is changing quite a bit. That indicates their may be multiple ISP NAT routers that would need to have the port forwarding set up.

So it does not matter what router that you use. The directions just do not apply because of how your ISP has set up their network.

What do you want to run a ratflector for?

There are quite a few existing public ratflectors that do not appear to be heavily used. Is there any reason that you can not use one of them?

Mmmmm I think so, or both companies do not support port
forwarding??? To much of a coincidence.

They support port forwarding, but it only works if the ISP is not also using NAT. As soon as you wrote that the WAN IP address did not match the whatsmyip reported IP address, as I have replied to you several times now, those instructions you have been trying to follow are never going to work. And it really does not matter how many different router models that you try.

In my opinion I ‘m not doing it right And my mistakes is on what
ports and where should I have to place on the router. I did exactly
as this guy did it but the result is on the router.
Again, those instructions do not apply to how your ISP has set up your connection to the internet. It does not matter what Nat Router that you use, or how you configure it. Your ISP is blocking you from having a ratflector that is visible on the public internet.

About VPN well I ‘ll have to learn more about this kind of science jajajajja
ON the alternative I guess I ll have to learn How to do the Docker
container COA or the VM.
I do not think that a VPN solution will work for you. You are using "Cell Phone" internet. A VPN in simple terms is a NAT router with encryption. It does not give you a public IP address for incoming connections.

VPNs will allow our outgoing traffic to appear at a different public IP, but you will still need a server at the public IP end to run the ratflector.

A container is like a light weight VM. and should have a lower monthly fee than a full VM. The hosting companies will generally show you how to set them up.

73,
-John, wb8tyw
 

开云体育

Thanks I got plenty of food for my thoughts! I wanted the ratflector for Emcomm.?

I did not wanted to bother any particular ratflector owner.?

I guess that as I try to be more proficient on Drats I ll be hanging around those that are already up.

Thanks to y'll for you advise. Even though I could not make it I learned a lot in the process.

V/R?
NP3JD

Get

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of John E. Malmberg <wb8tyw@...>
Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2022 12:11:37 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [d-rats] ratflector
?
On 9/18/2022 9:32 AM, José David Colón Custodio wrote:
>
> Indeed the router’s wan IP I s not the same PC IP that can be found
> on whatismyip.com.?? I still scratching the babck omy head. I tried
> yesterday to set the ratflector on Hughes HT2010 model router but did
> not work neither. SO I ‘m doing the same mistake on both of them?
There is probably nothing that you can configure to on your router to
make it work.? Your ISP is what is blocking you from running a public
ratflector.? That is what I have been trying to get you to understand.

The instructions in the manual and the video do not deal with your ISP's
configuration.

The instructions only work with this configuration:

PC <> Your Nat router <> ISP <> public Internet

Your configuration is:

PC <> Nat router <> ISP Nat Router <> Public Internet.
???????????????????? ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
?????????????????????????? |
The "ISP Nat Router" is what is stopping you.

The port forwarding needs to be set on both NAT routers, or it will not
work.? And you need to check with your ISP to find out if there is any
way to to set the ISP Nat router to forward port 9000.

Looking back at your previous posts, your whatsmyip address is changing
quite a bit.? That indicates their may be multiple ISP NAT routers that
would need to have the port forwarding set up.

So it does not matter what router that you use.? The directions just do
not apply because of how your ISP has set up their network.

What do you want to run a ratflector for?

There are quite a few existing public ratflectors that do not appear to
be heavily used.? Is there any reason that you can not use one of them?

> Mmmmm? I think so, or both companies? do not support port
forwarding??? To much of a coincidence.

They support port forwarding, but it only works if the ISP is not also
using NAT.? As soon as you wrote that the WAN IP address did not match
the whatsmyip reported IP address, as I have replied to you several
times now, those instructions you have been trying to follow are never
going to work.? And it really does not matter how many different router
models that you try.

> In my opinion I ‘m not doing it right And my mistakes is on what
> ports and where should I have to place on the router. I did exactly
> as this guy did it but the result is on the router.
Again, those instructions do not apply to how your ISP has set up your
connection to the internet.? It does not matter what Nat Router that you
use, or how you configure it.? Your ISP is blocking you from having a
ratflector that is visible on the public internet.

> About VPN well I ‘ll have to learn more about this kind of science jajajajja
> ON the alternative I guess I ll have to learn How to do the Docker
> container COA or the VM.

I do not think that a VPN solution will work for you.? You are using
"Cell Phone" internet.? A VPN in simple terms is a NAT router with
encryption.? It does not give you a public IP address for incoming
connections.

VPNs will allow our outgoing traffic to appear at a different public IP,
but you will still need a server at the public IP end to run the ratflector.

A container is like a light weight VM. and should have a lower monthly
fee than a full VM.?? The hosting companies will generally show you how
to set them up.

73,
-John, wb8tyw

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