To be honest it was over three years ago that I purchased the parts and also ordered several other parts at the time, IIRC the set was @ $45.00. Clausing is fairly easy to deal with but you need to ask for a quote first. Clausing :Phone: (800) 323-0972 email: info@...
Ken H in AZ
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Ken,? What? does? Clausing hit you up for a set? Might be "custom" , might be stock. Just curious.? Dave?
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Re: Concern with my Spindle
Hi Jody,? I just went down in the basement for a look.? I'd have to bring my .0001 indicator from work to be definitive but I kind of have zero. Radial or thrust.? Topped off the oil cups while I was at It! Mine drain around the same rate and there's plenty of total loss oil in the chip pan from various sources! Oil is cheap compared to parts. Couple pics. I really like the Fisso articulating arm. The one stuck to my Atlas is kind of nice too just not that nice. They're both very "experienced" though. Dave?
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-------- Original message -------- From: Jody <jp4lsu@...> Date: 1/23/19 17:36 (GMT-06:00) Subject: Re: [atlas-craftsman IO] Concern with my Spindle
Good point Dave. I was in the middle of setting something up? in the chuck, and had the test indicator mounted in a QCTP holder.? I was setting up a piece in the 4 jaw and I inadvertently bumped the chuck with my arm and saw the needle move a good bit. So I purposefully tugged sideways on the chuck and saw the indicator move around 0.002.? My work piece was short but couple that with the amount of chuck hanging off the end of the spindle, I'm sure spindle movement appears exaggerated some. Also as you pointed out, the indicator was not on the headstock casting. I'll get the chuck off and check the spindle properly. I'm guessing the oil loss differential from the front to back bearings has to do with the metal dust caps sealing better on one end. I'm curious if other's oil cups are empty on the spindle each time they use it? Thanks, Jody
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my South Bend 9A has the same configuration , there are shim's
in the slit between the front bottom of the? cap & the spindle housing
.? there is a procedure online google "South Bend 9A head stock or maybe
??? ??? spindle adjustment " & something should show up so at least ya
can see how it's done on a South Bend lathe , not sure how similar? the
Craftsman/Atlas mite be
??? ??? YMMV
??? ??? animal
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On 1/24/2019 12:32 PM, Ken Harrington wrote: The bearings as Robert points out do not have shims nor is there a
"cap" there is however more what could be described as a clamp (see
photo, chuck side is the same). This clamp (please correct me if you
know the proper name) can be tightened but with great caution as the
clamps can brake/crack. Tightening will remove some of the slop in the
spindle, I would not use more than a firm hand on a screw driver to be
safe. Also see a photo of the replacement bearings with no "holes".
Robert, is there any known specifications for tightening the bearing
clamps, inch pounds, number of turns... or ?
Ken H in AZ_,_
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Forgot to add, Welcome to the group Don.
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The bearings as Robert points out do not have shims nor is there a "cap" there is however more what could be described as a clamp (see photo, chuck side is the same). This clamp (please correct me if you know the proper name) can be tightened but with great caution as the clamps can brake/crack. Tightening will remove some of the slop in the spindle, I would not use more than a firm hand on a screw driver to be safe. Also see a photo of the replacement bearings with no "holes".
Robert, is there any known specifications for tightening the bearing clamps, inch pounds, number of turns... or ?
Ken H in AZ
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Re: Concern with my Spindle
??? ??? AIR they are still available from the big suppliers. $$$
of course!? Bill in Boulder CO USA
On 1/24/19 5:22 AM, Jody wrote:
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That's pretty cool looking.? On the 12" the belt adjust knob/bar
goes right over the top of the rear oil cup.? I actually have to
lift the knob/bar up to put oil in the cup now.? I would have to
cut the bar down and reinstall the knob to get this to work.
I've seen these things in older pictures of rotating equipement
though.? Cool stuff.
-Jody
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On 01/23/2019 11:30 PM, Steven H via Groups.Io wrote: Looks like you might get a hernia trying to move the
tailstock on that 20” Cincinnati lathe. Some large lathes
have a crank handle mechanism using the bed rack to move
the tailstock along the bed.
The tailstock on my 15" Sheldon is quite a beast, and getting it to move the first time in a session takes a little oomph. Once it has slid onto a film of oil, though, it glides with hardly more than fingerip pressure. I do have to disassemble it into the upper half and the lower half to take it off the bed, each half weighs close to 100 Lbs. I'd guess a 20" tailstock would be more massive. Jon
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Re: Concern with my Spindle
On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 6:36 PM Jody < jp4lsu@...> wrote:
I'm curious if other's oil cups are empty on the spindle each time they use it?
I have a 12" x 36 Atlas/Craftsman and the oil cup on the left side of the headstock uses a lot more oil than the cup to the right (toward the tailstock). Each has a felt purchased from Clausing. If remove the felt from the right cup, the oil runs through a bit more. I have to let the spindle run for an extended?period of time and see if I can feel or measure any difference in temperature on either side. In an hour turning session (intermittent running), the left cup might essentially run out while the right cup doesn't seem to use much at all.
I thought of finding a test tube of the right size to hold the felt and see how the oil flows through the felt in that situation. It's on the LLTTD (Long List of Things To Do ;-)
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That will be some good core exercise moving that tailstock.? LOL. -Jody
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-------- Original message -------- From: "Steven H via Groups.Io" <stevesmachining@...> Date: 1/23/19 11:30 PM (GMT-06:00) To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [atlas-craftsman IO] Find on Craigslist Looks like you might get a hernia trying to move the tailstock on that 20” Cincinnati lathe. Some large lathes have a crank handle mechanism using the bed rack to move the tailstock along the bed. Steve Haskell
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Re: Concern with my Spindle
That's pretty cool looking.? On the 12" the belt adjust knob/bar goes right over the top of the rear oil cup.? I actually have to lift the knob/bar up to put oil in the cup now.? I would have to cut the bar down and reinstall the knob to get this to work.
I've seen these things in older pictures of rotating equipement though.? Cool stuff.
-Jody
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Re: Concern with my Spindle
Thanks Ken,
Sure it maybe apples to oranges comparing your results to the Timken bearings on mine, but it is interesting you have a similar issue with the back one emptying first even with a solid sintered bearing.
I'm trying to remember when I rebuilt it and adjusted the spindle if I ran it for 30 min or so to check for heat.? I think I did.? I think mine is running out of the back one mostly after sitting stationary.? I've checked it while using it and it seems it drains after usage mostly.? Of course I typically can only get a couple of hours use with schedule and duties around the house.
-Jody (DFW)
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Wow, I can imagine how hard that would be.? Did you hoist it out of trailer?
There is also a SB13 here locally.? I sure wouldn't mind having a bigger lathe.? I think a mill will come before I get another lathe.? A shop will have to come also before that happens as well.? Too much to do...so little money.
-Jody
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I am sorry, too, but the online article that you copied is another ?good bad example of Internet Disinformation.? The lathe in the photos is a Craftsman 101.07301.? Which IS a 6 x 18 but IS NOT a 618.? If you had a sleeve bearing lathe made by Atlas for Sears, it was also either a 101.07301 or remotely possible that it was a 101.07300 which had a smaller diameter spindle but buttoned up and in dim light could be easily confused with the 101.07301. ? Also, there were or are no shims in the bearings of a 101.07301.? At least not as shipped from the Atlas factory.? The two bearings are both Sintered Bronze bushings, AKA Oilite.? They come with no oil holes in them because they do not need any oil holes drilled in them.? ? Robert Downs ?
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From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of brokenwrench1 .
Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2019 17:25
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [atlas-craftsman IO] Welcome to [email protected]? sorry? but i had a very early 618 atlas lathe that had? shimmed? brass bearings? and a newer craftsman that had? the timken's. i took both apart and? readusted and cleaned them all the castings? were the same part numbers except the one with the part number of the headstock on the? bronze bushing one. i bought it for the huge amount of extra tooling and sold it to a starter generator rebuilder with the armature? tools and special chucks. ?here is what i had the SN dated it to approx 1939-1940? ? ? On Tue, Jan 22, 2019 at 4:37 PM Robert Downs via Groups.Io <wa5cab=[email protected]> wrote: Jay, ? The rumor that early 618’s had sleeve bearing is Internet disinformation.? All 618’s (and 612’s) had the same Timken tapered roller bearings from first to last? I think that the rumor got started by some people misnaming any 6 x 18 as a 618.? I have certainly seen quite a few people mis-identify a 101.07301 and call it a 618.? I have a copy of the first Atlas catalog that the 618 ever appeared in and although it has a strange looking countershaft that probably no one has ever seen, it has Timken spindle bearings. ? ? ? Welcome to our group Don!? You came to the right place.? Is your 618 equipped with roller bearings or babbet bearings? The 618’s are good machines for light home work.? I rarely use the mill attachment I have as it is only for very light work and hard to view the cut when it is in use. Jay Greer ? ? ? ? Hi,
I'm new to the group. I've done virtually no machining since high school
(over 40 years ago), but in the last year have acquired an Atlas 618, an
identical Sears lathe with the milling attachment and a Levin lathe. The
618 was working before disassembly for moving. The Sears hadn't seen use
in decades, though it still looks to be in good condition. I've got
manuals for both and numerous accessories. The Levin hadn't seen use in
some years and needs restoration. The Levin was bought by NASA in the
early 60's and was used to make parts that went to the moon. I'm a
software engineer by trade, but like projects at home.
That's it,
Don
On 1/22/2019 5:17 AM, [email protected] Group Moderators wrote: Hello,
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Re: Concern with my Spindle
the older 618 i had someone had installed? ?adjustable drip oilers on it in place of the cups? ? similar to this? ??? ? ? ? ?
?? ? ? ?
Jody, I have a Craftsman 6" lathe with the solid bearings and It has always retained oil much longer in the rear cup than the front (towards the tail stock) cup. It has concerned me so I always drip a little extra oil on either side of that bearing. I tried leaving both cup lids open while running the lathe and it didn't seem to make any difference. I also have checked after running the lathe for an hour or more and there doesn't seem to be any difference in the temperature of the two bearings and neither really gets hot. I pulled the felts like you mentioned and neither has a through hole to the spindle. Also I purchased a new set of bearings from Clausing for the next time in need to pull the spindle I thought I would go a head and replace them while I have it apart. Interestingly the replacements have no holes or galley ways of any kind. So I take it that the design is to allow the oil to simply saturate through the sintered bearing material. This may have no relation to your lathe especially if yours have the Timkin roller bearings.
Ken H in AZ
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Re: Concern with my Spindle
Jody, I have a Craftsman 6" lathe with the solid bearings and It has always retained oil much longer in the rear cup than the front (towards the tail stock) cup. It has concerned me so I always drip a little extra oil on either side of that bearing. I tried leaving both cup lids open while running the lathe and it didn't seem to make any difference. I also have checked after running the lathe for an hour or more and there doesn't seem to be any difference in the temperature of the two bearings and neither really gets hot. I pulled the felts like you mentioned and neither has a through hole to the spindle. Also I purchased a new set of bearings from Clausing for the next time in need to pull the spindle I thought I would go a head and replace them while I have it apart. Interestingly the replacements have no holes or galley ways of any kind. So I take it that the design is to allow the oil to simply saturate through the sintered bearing material. This may have no relation to your lathe especially if yours have the Timkin roller bearings.
Ken H in AZ
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I'd love to have it.? I think it would look really good sitting next to my South Bend 16" with the 12' bed option.? It would only be 2-3' longer but probably weighs twice as much.? I unloaded the SB16 by myself and it was a PITA.??
James
On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 6:00 PM Jody < jp4lsu@...> wrote:
In case anybody is looking to upgrade.
If it was shorter, might have to think about it.? LOL
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Looks like you might get a hernia trying to move the tailstock on that 20” Cincinnati lathe. Some large lathes have a crank handle mechanism using the bed rack to move the tailstock along the bed.
Steve Haskell
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Re: Concern with my Spindle
Oh Dave, I haven't tried thread wires yet. I have some adaptors that help hold the 2 wires on to the mic.? The are made by PD.
I'll let you and Andrei know if they work. JP
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-------- Original message -------- From: Andrei <calciu1@...> Date: 1/23/19 7:55 PM (GMT-06:00) To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [atlas-craftsman IO] Concern with my Spindle
You can always use a dab of grease on the threads to hold the wires. No third hand required.
Jody,
Not being critical to anyone but ...
Having an indicator setup in the toolpost seems like a PITA .I've been using a mag base my entire life,? so versatile and I always have the contact at 12:00 unless I'm checking or matching an angle. Then 9:00 Is the way.
Did you practice holding the thread wires yet?
Dave?
Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE Device
-------- Original message --------
From: Jody <jp4lsu@...>
Date: 1/23/19 17:36 (GMT-06:00)
Subject: Re: [atlas-craftsman IO] Concern with my Spindle
Good point Dave.
I was in the middle of setting something up? in the chuck, and had the test indicator mounted in a QCTP holder.? I was setting up a piece in the 4 jaw and I inadvertently bumped the chuck with my arm and saw the needle move a good bit.
So I purposefully tugged sideways on the chuck and saw the indicator move around 0.002.? My work piece was short but couple that with the amount of chuck hanging off the end of the spindle, I'm sure spindle movement appears exaggerated some.
Also as you pointed out, the indicator was not on the headstock casting.
I'll get the chuck off and check the spindle properly.
I'm guessing the oil loss differential from the front to back bearings has to do with the metal dust caps sealing better on one end.
I'm curious if other's oil cups are empty on the spindle each time they use it?
Thanks,
Jody
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Re: Concern with my Spindle
I can definitely see where the mag on the ways could be quicker. I have a qctp holder with a test indicator installed, used just for indicating and then slide on the test indicator.
Perhaps if I had a better setup on my mag base I would start using it for that.
It's the old school Starrett with the solid arms.? I haven't found a convenient way of attaching the test indicator to the arms.? -Jody
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-------- Original message -------- From: Dave Matticks <dpm100@...> Date: 1/23/19 7:51 PM (GMT-06:00) To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [atlas-craftsman IO] Concern with my Spindle Jody, Not being critical to anyone but ... Having an indicator setup in the toolpost seems like a PITA .I've been using a mag base my entire life,? so versatile and I always have the contact at 12:00 unless I'm checking or matching an angle. Then 9:00 Is the way. Did you practice holding the thread wires yet? Dave?
Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE Device
-------- Original message -------- From: Jody <jp4lsu@...> Date: 1/23/19 17:36 (GMT-06:00) Subject: Re: [atlas-craftsman IO] Concern with my Spindle
Good point Dave. I was in the middle of setting something up? in the chuck, and had the test indicator mounted in a QCTP holder.? I was setting up a piece in the 4 jaw and I inadvertently bumped the chuck with my arm and saw the needle move a good bit. So I purposefully tugged sideways on the chuck and saw the indicator move around 0.002.? My work piece was short but couple that with the amount of chuck hanging off the end of the spindle, I'm sure spindle movement appears exaggerated some. Also as you pointed out, the indicator was not on the headstock casting. I'll get the chuck off and check the spindle properly. I'm guessing the oil loss differential from the front to back bearings has to do with the metal dust caps sealing better on one end. I'm curious if other's oil cups are empty on the spindle each time they use it? Thanks, Jody
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Ken H
Terry Lund
Steven H