Re: Mechanical and electric fuel pumps on my X Air
Anyone have a diagram of what setup I should have ? I'll? dismantle the floor tomorrow and remove and replace the facet pump filter but then also try and plumb? fuel lines to bypass this pump, in the event it may fail.
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Re: Mechanical and electric fuel pumps on my X Air
Yes.? Geoff Gartshore Zenith CH200 GCUD Waterloo, Ontario?
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On Apr 17, 2022, at 7:49 AM, Justin Gregoris <jgregoris789@...> wrote:
?
I'm assuming I can unscrew the fasteners from the bottom of the aircraft and drop the floor to access all of the fuel lines and pump?
Mine has a bypass made with a one-way check valve that t's around the pump. It has a small silver filter before the pump and another filer between the tank and the filter pump. I'm not aware of any internal filter and it's not been a problems as of yet for
me.
Tom
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Re: Mechanical and electric fuel pumps on my X Air
I'm assuming I can unscrew the fasteners from the bottom of the aircraft and drop the floor to access all of the fuel lines and pump?
Mine has a bypass made with a one-way check valve that t's around the pump. It has a small silver filter before the pump and another filer between the tank and the filter pump. I'm not aware of any internal filter and it's not been a problems as of yet for
me.
Tom
|
Re: Mechanical and electric fuel pumps on my X Air
Mine has a bypass made with a one-way check valve that t's around the pump. It has a small silver filter before the pump and another filer between the tank and the filter pump. I'm not aware of any internal filter and it's not been a problems as of yet for me.
Tom
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Re: Mechanical and electric fuel pumps on my X Air
Ok so most X Air Hanuman's come with that fuel pump - and those fuel pumps also have a filter built inside them?
Is there a way to dismantle these fuel pumps to clean the built-in filter?
Justin
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A facet pump will not have any problems running dry until it primes. The inbuilt fuel filter is a problem because it can clog and you can't see anything because it is fully closed so extra care must be taken. You need to have a one-way bypass valve fitted
and if you need more information just let me know. Also note: they come in different pressure outputs so you must make sure you get the correct one, I have seen somebody install a 10 psi unit and it simply vent fuel out of the carburettor when the engine is
not running because the fuel pressure is so high
Justin Gregoris wrote on 16/04/2022 10:53 pm:
Thanks?for providing a link!
So, if my fuel lines have no fuel and I turn this pump on, will damage occur before any fuel lubricates the pump, or should i turn the engine over by hand or try starting it with choke on - without using the electric fuel pump?
I'd like to prime all fuel lines without damaging anything.
My electric fuel pump is on the firewall. It's an automotive type like this one.
--
With regards, Michael Coates
AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017
mailto:mcoates@...
skype name: xcomavionics
Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process.
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do. Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.
Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.
"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."
|
Re: Mechanical and electric fuel pumps on my X Air
A facet pump will not have any problems running dry until it primes.
The inbuilt fuel filter is a problem because it can clog and you
can't see anything because it is fully closed so extra care must be
taken. You need to have a one-way bypass valve fitted and if you
need more information just let me know. Also note: they come in
different pressure outputs so you must make sure you get the correct
one, I have seen somebody install a 10 psi unit and it simply vent
fuel out of the carburettor when the engine is not running because
the fuel pressure is so high
Justin Gregoris wrote on 16/04/2022
10:53 pm:
Thanks?for providing a link!
So, if my fuel lines have no fuel and I turn this pump on, will
damage occur before any fuel lubricates the pump, or should i
turn the engine over by hand or try starting it with choke on -
without using the electric fuel pump?
I'd like to prime all fuel lines without damaging anything.
My electric fuel pump is on the firewall. It's an automotive
type like this one.
--
With regards, Michael Coates
AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017
mailto:mcoates@...
skype name: xcomavionics
Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process.
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do. Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.
Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.
"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."
|
Basically, the material is a lamination on top of Dacron. It came
out with all the fanfare of being the new one the material but
unfortunately in areas of very high UV (think Australia) the bonding
material deteriorated in the plastic can get peeled off like you are
shelling an egg. Underneath is normal Dacron so the plane is still
very usable, the problem is if this starts to tear off during flight
it can lift off in really large areas.
I would use some sort of signwriting vinyl to make a big patch to go
over the top of it to try and stop it from peeling and try and
preserve the covering for as long as possible before you need to
replace the fabric
mcressman via groups.io wrote on
16/04/2022 9:04 pm:
I have an 09 X-Air LS (USA S-LSA).? I have notice 2 spots where
the clear film on the OPAC covering is peeling.? After a long
search, I have not been able to locate anyone using OPAC material
to make sails.? Being this is a factory built S-LSA, are there
other options?? Is it possible to patch the spots to slow the
spread?? Any help is appreciated.
--
|
With regards, Michael Coates
Pipistrel Aircraft Master Distributor for USA,
Australia & New Zealand
AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237
Slovenia +386 3041 6470
Email: info@...
Web:
Skype: xcomavionics
|
|
|
Pipistrel Aircraft -
Dealer of the year 2012
Winner of the EAA August
Raspet Award 2012
Pipistrel Aircraft -
Dealer of the year 2017
|
|
Re: Mechanical and electric fuel pumps on my X Air
Thanks?for providing a link!
So, if my fuel lines have no fuel and I turn this pump on, will damage occur before any fuel lubricates the pump, or should i turn the engine over by hand or try starting it with choke on - without using the electric fuel pump?
I'd like to prime all fuel lines without damaging anything.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
My electric fuel pump is on the firewall. It's an automotive type like this one.
https://www.pegasusautoracing.com/productdetails.asp?RecId=82&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=FAC-40104&gclid=Cj0KCQjwr-SSBhC9ARIsANhzu16nYoajG3iH-QHypEbUsLiKnsYV_l8iP6iAmbfj-O7I8MYuZIQYLocaAv0qEALw_wcB
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I would remove the peeling covering very carefully if you are able to and then apply Gorilla Clear Vinyl Repair Tape. It may sound at first as a? 'Mickey Mouse' fix/repair, but you will be surprised how strong Gorilla Tape is and its superior adhesion and UV/weather
resistant capabilities it has.?
When I purchased my 2008 X Air, it had some fairly aggressive hangar rash at the top of the vertical; stabilizer - the previous owner had the X Air on amphibious floats and only has a couple inches of clearance while moving the plane in and out of the hangar.
My profilam covering ripped and after trying a couple options, I decided?to resort to Gorilla Tape.?
You can barely notice the repair and it currently shows no signs of being compromised - highly recommend.??
Visit link:?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
I have an 09 X-Air LS (USA S-LSA).? I have notice 2 spots where the clear film on the OPAC covering is peeling.? After a long search, I have not been able to locate anyone using OPAC material to make sails.? Being this is a factory built S-LSA, are there
other options?? Is it possible to patch the spots to slow the spread?? Any help is appreciated.
|
I have an 09 X-Air LS (USA S-LSA).? I have notice 2 spots where the clear film on the OPAC covering is peeling.? After a long search, I have not been able to locate anyone using OPAC material to make sails.? Being this is a factory built S-LSA, are there other options?? Is it possible to patch the spots to slow the spread?? Any help is appreciated.
|
Re: X Air Hawk fuel tank 'shedding' particles into fuel
You put a lot of effort in your response - I appreciate it!
Agreed, it is nothing to do with the engine it is to do with fibreglass, vinyl ester resins, epoxy resins and their weaknesses to current aviation and/or car fuels.
This issue is simply, fuels or additives in fuels leach into the resins and dissolve them therefore leaving exposed fibres from the fibreglass which eventually get broken off from the fuel sloshing around and then they end up in the fuel lines and the fuel
filters eventually causing fuel supply issues, engine stoppages etc.
It is only the bottom end of aviation that uses fibreglass fuel tanks, every other industry knows their weaknesses and has moved on to other products. Most cars 25 years ago used steal for their fuel tanks but almost unanimously they have all now change to
polyethylene because it does not rust, it is much superior in an accident and it does not get affected by the fuels we are currently using.
The problem in the aviation industry is fibreglass is easy to manufacture and fairly cheap, you can make round shapes very easily like the corners of the fuel tank, it does not rust and most importantly for us, it is lightweight, the downside is it is not durable
when it comes to different fuels.
Polyethylene is used for aviation fuel tanks in some aircraft but it is about 10 times the weight.....??
There are a number of "sloshing compounds" that can be used which you mix up and pour into a fibreglass fuel tank and then turn it around in all directions so that the surfaces are coated and when it dries it provides a barrier between the fuel and the fibreglass.
The problem with these is that they are not always successful in bonding with the fibreglass material even when you use the proper primer and it is because the inside of the fuel tank is nice and smooth because this is the inside of the mould when it is made
and the material doesn't stick so well....
Something else which is worth looking at is a fuel bladder but these are also heavy and are quite expensive....
The current alternative seems to be, remove the fuel tanks once every 12 months, throw a chain inside and move it around breaking off all the fibres and put the fuel tank back into service.? Clean fuel system regularly, use a good quality fuel filter that can
capture the fibres and the problems are solved, or mitigated at least.
Bernhard Svavarsson wrote on 16/04/2022 8:54 am:
This issue has nothing to do with different type of engines
----- Upprunalegt skeyti -----
Frá: Brian Ellis via groups.io <bellis2uk@...>
Til: [email protected]
Sent: Fri, 15 Apr 2022 16:52:50 -0000 (GMT)
Efni: Re: [XAIR] X Air Hawk fuel tank 'shedding' particles into fuel
Thanks
Just reading that I am glad we chose a Rotax
On 15 Apr 2022, at 14:02, Justin Gregoris <jgregoris789@...> wrote:
?fuel tank sealant colours- see Jabiru website: "JSL007-7" service bulletin for all who are interested. lots of great information there,
--
With regards, Michael Coates
AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017
mailto:mcoates@...
skype name: xcomavionics
Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process.
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do. Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.
Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.
"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."
|
Re: Mechanical and electric fuel pumps on my X Air
My electric fuel pump is on the firewall. It's an automotive type like this one.
https://www.pegasusautoracing.com/productdetails.asp?RecId=82&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=FAC-40104&gclid=Cj0KCQjwr-SSBhC9ARIsANhzu16nYoajG3iH-QHypEbUsLiKnsYV_l8iP6iAmbfj-O7I8MYuZIQYLocaAv0qEALw_wcB
|
Re: X Air Hawk fuel tank 'shedding' particles into fuel
Agreed, it is nothing to do with the engine it is to do with
fibreglass, vinyl ester resins, epoxy resins and their weaknesses to
current aviation and/or car fuels.
This issue is simply, fuels or additives in fuels leach into the
resins and dissolve them therefore leaving exposed fibres from the
fibreglass which eventually get broken off from the fuel sloshing
around and then they end up in the fuel lines and the fuel filters
eventually causing fuel supply issues, engine stoppages etc.
It is only the bottom end of aviation that uses fibreglass fuel
tanks, every other industry knows their weaknesses and has moved on
to other products. Most cars 25 years ago used steal for their fuel
tanks but almost unanimously they have all now change to
polyethylene because it does not rust, it is much superior in an
accident and it does not get affected by the fuels we are currently
using.
The problem in the aviation industry is fibreglass is easy to
manufacture and fairly cheap, you can make round shapes very easily
like the corners of the fuel tank, it does not rust and most
importantly for us, it is lightweight, the downside is it is not
durable when it comes to different fuels.
Polyethylene is used for aviation fuel tanks in some aircraft but it
is about 10 times the weight.....??
There are a number of "sloshing compounds" that can be used which
you mix up and pour into a fibreglass fuel tank and then turn it
around in all directions so that the surfaces are coated and when it
dries it provides a barrier between the fuel and the fibreglass.
The problem with these is that they are not always successful in
bonding with the fibreglass material even when you use the proper
primer and it is because the inside of the fuel tank is nice and
smooth because this is the inside of the mould when it is made and
the material doesn't stick so well....
Something else which is worth looking at is a fuel bladder but these
are also heavy and are quite expensive....
The current alternative seems to be, remove the fuel tanks once
every 12 months, throw a chain inside and move it around breaking
off all the fibres and put the fuel tank back into service.? Clean
fuel system regularly, use a good quality fuel filter that can
capture the fibres and the problems are solved, or mitigated at
least.
Bernhard Svavarsson wrote on 16/04/2022
8:54 am:
This issue has nothing to do with different type of engines
----- Upprunalegt skeyti -----
Frá: Brian Ellis via groups.io <bellis2uk@...>
Til: [email protected]
Sent: Fri, 15 Apr 2022 16:52:50 -0000 (GMT)
Efni: Re: [XAIR] X Air Hawk fuel tank 'shedding' particles into fuel
Thanks
Just reading that I am glad we chose a Rotax
On 15 Apr 2022, at 14:02, Justin Gregoris <jgregoris789@...> wrote:
?fuel tank sealant colours- see Jabiru website: "JSL007-7" service bulletin for all who are interested. lots of great information there,
--
With regards, Michael Coates
AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017
mailto:mcoates@...
skype name: xcomavionics
Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process.
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do. Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.
Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.
"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."
|
Re: X Air Hawk fuel tank 'shedding' particles into fuel
This issue has nothing to do with different type of engines ----- Upprunalegt skeyti ----- Frá: Brian Ellis via groups.io <bellis2uk@...> Til: [email protected]Sent: Fri, 15 Apr 2022 16:52:50 -0000 (GMT) Efni: Re: [XAIR] X Air Hawk fuel tank 'shedding' particles into fuel Thanks Just reading that I am glad we chose a Rotax
On 15 Apr 2022, at 14:02, Justin Gregoris <jgregoris789@...> wrote:
?fuel tank sealant colours- see Jabiru website: "JSL007-7" service bulletin for all who are interested. lots of great information there,
|
Re: Mechanical and electric fuel pumps on my X Air
make and model of fuel pump?
any pictures to send/show me?
if not, all good - just thought i'd ask
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
My fuel pump is under the right seat in my hanuman.
-------- Original message --------
From: Geoffrey Gartshore <geoff.gartshore@...>
Date: 2022-04-15 9:03 a.m. (GMT-04:00)
Subject: Re: [XAIR] Mechanical and electric fuel pumps on my X Air
Justin
Check under the floor for the electronic fuel pump…….
Geoff Gartshore
Zenith CH200 GCUD
Waterloo, Ontario?
On Apr 15, 2022, at 7:33 AM, Justin Gregoris <jgregoris789@...> wrote:
?Hello Gentlemen,
Does my X Air mechanical fuel pump use any residual motor oil from crankcase for lubrication or is it an entirely separate system, and keeps cool using the fuel as a lubricator?
Also, I cannot seem to find where my electronic fuel pump is...? Do most pilots install their pumps underneath the fiberglass floor or is it installed behind the instrument panel??
Right now my fuel tank is full but my fuel lines are bone dry as well as no fuel in the fuel filter. Will the electronic fuel pump siphon fuel through the lines into the carb or do I keep throttle closed but choke fully engaged to prime/pump fuel mechanically
using the starter and mechanical fuel pump?
Thanks again,
Justin
|
Re: Mechanical and electric fuel pumps on my X Air
My fuel pump is under the right seat in my hanuman.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
-------- Original message --------
From: Geoffrey Gartshore <geoff.gartshore@...>
Date: 2022-04-15 9:03 a.m. (GMT-04:00)
Subject: Re: [XAIR] Mechanical and electric fuel pumps on my X Air
Justin
Check under the floor for the electronic fuel pump…….
Geoff Gartshore
Zenith CH200 GCUD
Waterloo, Ontario?
On Apr 15, 2022, at 7:33 AM, Justin Gregoris <jgregoris789@...> wrote:
?Hello Gentlemen,
Does my X Air mechanical fuel pump use any residual motor oil from crankcase for lubrication or is it an entirely separate system, and keeps cool using the fuel as a lubricator?
Also, I cannot seem to find where my electronic fuel pump is...? Do most pilots install their pumps underneath the fiberglass floor or is it installed behind the instrument panel??
Right now my fuel tank is full but my fuel lines are bone dry as well as no fuel in the fuel filter. Will the electronic fuel pump siphon fuel through the lines into the carb or do I keep throttle closed but choke fully engaged to prime/pump fuel mechanically
using the starter and mechanical fuel pump?
Thanks again,
Justin
|
Re: X Air Hawk fuel tank 'shedding' particles into fuel
Thanks Just reading that I am glad we chose a Rotax
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 15 Apr 2022, at 14:02, Justin Gregoris <jgregoris789@...> wrote:
?fuel tank sealant colours- see Jabiru website: "JSL007-7" service bulletin for all who are interested. lots of great information there,
|
Re: X Air Hawk fuel tank 'shedding' particles into fuel
fuel tank sealant colours- see Jabiru website: "JSL007-7" service bulletin for all who are interested. lots of great information there,
|
Re: Mechanical and electric fuel pumps on my X Air
Justin
Check under the floor for the electronic fuel pump……. Geoff Gartshore Zenith CH200 GCUD Waterloo, Ontario?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Apr 15, 2022, at 7:33 AM, Justin Gregoris <jgregoris789@...> wrote:
?Hello Gentlemen,
Does my X Air mechanical fuel pump use any residual motor oil from crankcase for lubrication or is it an entirely separate system, and keeps cool using the fuel as a lubricator?
Also, I cannot seem to find where my electronic fuel pump is...? Do most pilots install their pumps underneath the fiberglass floor or is it installed behind the instrument panel??
Right now my fuel tank is full but my fuel lines are bone dry as well as no fuel in the fuel filter. Will the electronic fuel pump siphon fuel through the lines into the carb or do I keep throttle closed but choke fully engaged to prime/pump fuel mechanically using the starter and mechanical fuel pump?
Thanks again,
Justin
|
Mechanical and electric fuel pumps on my X Air
Hello Gentlemen,
Does my X Air mechanical fuel pump use any residual motor oil from crankcase for lubrication or is it an entirely separate system, and keeps cool using the fuel as a lubricator?
Also, I cannot seem to find where my electronic fuel pump is...? Do most pilots install their pumps underneath the fiberglass floor or is it installed behind the instrument panel??
Right now my fuel tank is full but my fuel lines are bone dry as well as no fuel in the fuel filter. Will the electronic fuel pump siphon fuel through the lines into the carb or do I keep throttle closed but choke fully engaged to prime/pump fuel mechanically using the starter and mechanical fuel pump?
Thanks again,
Justin
|
Geoffrey Gartshore
Tom Yoder
Mike Cressman