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Re: IABSM: Question on appropriate cards for scenarios
Not sure why my font is so large? I am sure it has to be a StuG III/G because there is no StuG III/H. There is a StuH 42 which is a /G version with a 10.5 cm howitzer instead of the 7.5 cm L48 gun in the /G version. The /G version came off the production lines starting in DEC 1942. 7720 were produced plus 173 converted from Panzer III tanks returned to the factory. Production ended March 1945. There were various improvements but no major changes made during production. StuH 42. 1211 produced Oct 42 - Feb 45 plus 1 prototype. These were in the German independent StuG battalions/Brigades with ~1 StuH per 3 StuG normal. A StuG Company of 10-14 StuG would have 3-4 StuH? and 7-10 StuG.? Panzer, Panzerjager, SS StuG Bn did not have them. Source. Page 84 and 85 ENCYCLOPEDIA OF GERMAN TANKS OF WW2. Tech Editor Thomas L Jentz. Source.? STURMGESCHUTZE VOR! Franz Kurowski pages 5-8, 31, 115, 159, 254 Ask Rich who I am. ? Mike Reese TRACTICS? |
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Re: Turn sequence help
Normally 1 blind per platoon plus maybe 1 or 2 dummies per side. There's only 1 chit/card for all blinds, not 1 per blind. So the initial deck is one blind card for each side and the tea break.
Although personally I dump the tea break until something comes off blinds.? ?When a unit fires or is spotted, figures go on the table, and the unit's card goes in the deck for next turn (if you use the big cards which came out with IABSM v3 you can use the cards themselves as blinds, then you won't forget to add the card to the deck when a unit comes off the blind) On Thu, 30 Jan 2020 at 19:12, Bruce Ross via Groups.Io <acctingman69=[email protected]> wrote: Hello |
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Re: IABSM: Question on appropriate cards for scenarios
Indeed so. The Big Men need to be converted as per 'Speaking IABSM3', which is in the group files but I've attached a copy anyway. The armour platoons should be given a platoon card in place of the individual cards, as per v3. The 'Support weapons' card could be read as either the heavy weapons platoon or the regimental support, but by comparison with the 'Freezing 401st' I would guess that there is a card missing for the heavy weapons platoon. The support weapons card would then cover the infantry guns. I wouldn't activate the Stugs on it, just the guns. As a last note, IABSM v3 groups armour in platoons (or troops if you are British! ;^D) and uses platoon orders. This covers trained platoons with good communications, at least from the leader to the other vehicles, so most tanks in WW2, especially the latter part. I would personally consider using individual cards in scenarios where there was historically very poor communications, but that would be an exception rather than a rule.? Hope that helps. Cheers, Jim On Thu, 30 Jan 2020 09:46 Steve Burt, <steve.and.mary.burt@...> wrote:
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Re: IABSM: Question on appropriate cards for scenarios
2005 would be IABSM v2 rather than the current v3 - so big man are defined as d4+1, d6 dAv and so on? If so, then yes, there are likely to be differences; tanks operating in platoons only came in with v3 as I recall. On Thu, 30 Jan 2020 at 01:48, Dan <dan.albrecht.vt@...> wrote: So I've just bought the 2005 Summer and 2005 Christmas Specials in order to be able to try out the two Battle of the Bulge scenarios, "Walking in a Winter Wonderland" and "The Freezing 401st" |
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IABSM: Question on appropriate cards for scenarios
So I've just bought the 2005 Summer and 2005 Christmas Specials in order to be able to try out the two Battle of the Bulge scenarios, "Walking in a Winter Wonderland" and "The Freezing 401st"
Two items I noticed are in the OOB / Cards list of Winter Wonderland:?? Item A: Regimental Support Two 75mm infantry guns (5 crew)
3 x Stug IIIH (one of which is commanded by Bart
Klankern (Big Man) and is classed as Elite.
There are also three separate Panzer cards, one for each Stug.? Does that mean if the Regimental Support card is drawn both the 75mm guns and all three Stugs could be activated? And that the Panzers have two options for getting activated, either via an individual panzer card or via the Regimental Support Card Item B: There is an OOB for a? Heavy Platoon?
Four MMGs (3 crew each)
Two SdKfz 251/2 with 80mm mortars
One SdKfz 251/9
However, there is not a German Heavy Platoon card listed. Is that an oversight? Lastly, in looking at both of these Bulge scenarios, I noticed that each tank has its own card. However in other scenarios I notice that tanks are more commonly grouped in platoons.? For future scenario design considerations ( I hope to adapt some AH Squad Leader, Battlefront, or Fireball Forward scenarios to IABSM)....is there a general rule for determining when e.g. 3-4 tanks should have their own Armor Platoon Card vs individual Armor 1, Armor 2, etc. cards Thanks in advance. -Dan |
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Vikings on the Danube IABSM game
This IABSM game was really designed o fit in with the Viking month at GigaBites Caf¨¦ and to be played in under 3 hours max.? The idea was taken from actions involving the SS Wiking div during their drive to relieve Budapest during Konrad II.? On January 20, 1945, the 5th Company, SS Panzer Rgt 5 had just occupied a slope ridge covered with corn when they were attacked from the north by the 110th Tank Brigade. ? T34s and Panthers were the main armour.
The table was dominated by a ridge in the center of the table with a farmstead.? Most of the are is covered by old corn fields.? The sky is overcast and roads are iced over.? Snow covering is not deep. Link to flickr AAR ?https://www.flickr.com/photos/6mmgaming/albums/72157712876373686 Mark |
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Re: Spotting modifiers
Thanks, James Catchpole...? ?good info to know and seems to make sense. I've played several games and also engaged in numerous discussions about blinds, ambushes, etc on the TFL Forum and on FB and the general assumption is:
you are Either on a Blind or acting as a blind if hidden in terrain...........the moment you open fire, you are revealed to all. as supported by the following citations: page 22:?Blinds are replaced with figures when they are spotted by the enemy or?when the troops they represent open fire page 27: Spotting is only used against Blinds or areas of terrain that may hide unspotted units. page 28: To spot the player first states which enemy blind or area of terrain he is attempting to spot. Adding that modifier just seems to piling on too many shackles to the section (e.g. Brits) that just got shot at. If a (e.g. German) unit is hidden in terrain and then comes off its blind to fire, at minimum it is in Somewhat Obscured (Okay Shot) and many times......Badly Obscured......(Poor Shot). That being said, requiring a Spotting Action on a Unit-That-Fired-At-You for heavy fog, night, thick forest (e.g. Hurtgen) could make some sense |
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Bloody Bucket
Bloody Bucket: Questions for the Hive Mind and/or??
When armour becomes available to the attackers, can it appear via infiltration points at any table or does it have to come up the road through Table 1? (i.e. Attackers have to clear Table 1 to deploy Panzer Lehr armoured support at Table 2 & so on?) Bazza |
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Re: Spotting modifiers
Hi John, We've never played it like that, and on the one occasion I helped Rich run a game, he didn't (although I know he can be as prone to forget things as the rest of us!). Also, the one example which mentions spotting and firing, on p.17, allows the units on overwatch to fire immediately the unspotted unit has opened fire, without any spotting. 'An area of terrain that may hide an unspotted unit' just refers to the the fact that unspotted units don't put down blinds unless they move. I'm pretty sure this was discussed years ago and Rich's answer was that this is guidance for scenarios where spotting is harder for some reason (night fighting, heavy mist, firer very well camouflaged or the like), so firing may not be an automatic giveaway, unlike normal conditions. Cheers, Jim On Tue, 28 Jan 2020 01:58 John Ewing via Groups.Io, <jonewing1=[email protected]> wrote: It¡¯s neither a typo nor an exception. When a unit comes off a blind to fire it still needs to be spotted by the enemy before they can shoot back at it. It simple ceases to be a unit on a Blind but becomes ¡°an area of terrain occupied by an unspotted unit¡± which is the second category of things you use the spotting rules to see as per page 27. |
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Re: Spotting modifiers
Thanks, John.? On a personal note, let me first say, I appreciate your guidance and explanations. I posted a rather long reply on the IABSM Facebook page. I do understand your point of view. I'm just frustrated because your explanation is directly contradicted by other parts of the rules and your explanation is not stated anywhere in the rules that I could find.
Your explanation is reasonable. I posted some possible "comprises" in the Facebook comments.? Thanks, Dan |
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Re: Spotting modifiers
It¡¯s neither a typo nor an exception. When a unit comes off a blind to fire it still needs to be spotted by the enemy before they can shoot back at it. It simple ceases to be a unit on a Blind but becomes ¡°an area of terrain occupied by an unspotted unit¡± which is the second category of things you use the spotting rules to see as per page 27.
John |
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Re: Spotting modifiers
Hi Dan, I was puzzled by the modifier too, and wondered if it was an error, perhaps a survival of an earlier edition of the rules that got missed in the editing process.? However, I now think the modifier might be used in the rare situation where a unit fires but is not immediately deployed from the blind.? The basic rule is indeed that units are deployed from blinds when they open fire, but (a) an umpire might make an exception in particular circumstances, and (b) there is at least one specific exception in the rules, see section 3.4 Spotting at Night.? The rule refers to units opening fire at night being marked by a single stand, and are only fully revealed after firing 3 times, or unless spotted.? Presumably, the modifier would apply in these circumstances. Craig B.
On Tuesday, 28 January 2020, 02:43:39 am AEST, Dan <dan.albrecht.vt@...> wrote:
sorry, not trying to pick a fight but Section 3 states: (page 27) Spotting is only used against Blinds or areas of terrain that may hide unspotted units. (page 28) To spot the player first states which enemy blind or area of terrain he is attempting to spot. |
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Re: Spotting modifiers
I hear what you are saying Nick..........the phenomenon you are describing however is capture in the "Ambush" rule:
AN AMBUSH OCCURS ANY TIME AN UNSPOTTED UNIT THAT IS ACTIVATED BY ITS BLINDS CARD (NOT ON THE T EA bREAK CARD) OPENS FIRE FROM BLINDS OR A HIDDEN POSITION AT CLOSE RANGE. FIRE OCCURS AS NORMAL, BUT TO REPRESENT THE IMPACT OF SURPRISE ANY SHOCK INFLICTED ON THE TARGET UNIT IN THE FIRST ROUND OF FIRE IS DOUBLED.?
.but IABSM Version 3 clearly states: Section 2.1, page 22,? Blinds are replaced with figures when they are spotted by the enemy or?when the troops they represent open fire. (page 27) Spotting is only used against Blinds or areas of terrain that may hide unspotted units. Would be great if Richard Clarke or Nick Skinner could let us know what they meant with this modifier.?? |
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Re: Spotting modifiers
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Is this rule not to reflect the "real time" conditions that when a section comes under fire it does? not automatically know where the fire came from? That's the logic I apply - most of my WW2 gaming is in the Normandy bocage and this rule makes sound sense
to me.
Hope that helps rather than confuses!
Mick
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Dan <dan.albrecht.vt@...>
Sent: 27 January 2020 21:17 To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [TooFatLardies] Spotting modifiers ?
You are correct, Nick.? The confusion I? have is with the wording of this modifier: "add +1" to attempt to spot role if target fired this turn"
The problem is that this + 1 modifier to spotting would never be applicable..........because the moment a unit fires...........the blind comes off.....? ?That's why I'm confused.... |
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Re: Spotting modifiers
You are correct, Nick.? The confusion I? have is with the wording of this modifier: "add +1" to attempt to spot role if target fired this turn"
The problem is that this + 1 modifier to spotting would never be applicable..........because the moment a unit fires...........the blind comes off.....? ?That's why I'm confused.... |
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Re: Spotting modifiers
Surely that would only apply if you were planning to shoot at a target that you had not yet spotted, ie one represented by a blind? On Mon, 27 Jan 2020 at 19:49, Dan <dan.albrecht.vt@...> wrote: I hear what you are saying... I guess I should have said............. --
Nick Meredith nick.meredith@... |
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Re: Spotting modifiers
I hear what you are saying... I guess I should have said.............
This rule:??"add +1" to attempt to spot role if target fired this turn"? makes no sense in light of all the citations in the rules. If that was the case......then all the firing rules should have said:..."you must always use your first action to spot.........before firing...." |
Michael Reese
Nick
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