Re: Reviving the atomic 4 [1 Attachment]
Great to hear. ?
Those Atomic 4's are pretty indestructible.? Glad you persevered.
Dave
From: "Tim tim@... [T27Owners]"
To: T27Owners@...
Sent: Tuesday, August 8, 2017 12:33 AM
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Re: Reviving the atomic 4 [1 Attachment]
Thanks to everyone! The Atomic 4 is revived! Have run it for a couple hours now and everything seems great! New alternator, new electric fuel pump, new fuel lines, cleaned out the carb two more times. Moving water well, temps are good and it shifts well ?
?
All normal installations have a fuel pump managing the fuel flow, rather than relying on gravity only. ?I've had success with a manual fuel pump, ?but electric fuel pumps are becoming more common. ?They are not expensive and simple to install. ?Alternatively, if you squeeze the priming bulb every couple of seconds maybe you can "be the fuel pump" for testing purposes.
The Zenith carbs use the floats in the carburetor to control the inlet control valve. ?The Carb bowl fills with gas until the floats shut off the flow, and provides several seconds of running time before call for more fuel.?
good luck on your project.
David On August 2, 2017 at 3:27 PM "Tim tim@... [T27Owners]" < T27Owners@...> wrote: ??
?
I'm not sure about the fuel pump comments. I will describe how I was attempting to get fuel to the carb. I used ?a portable fuel tank sitting on the cockpit seat with a fuel line that included a priming bulb and a fuel filter. feeding directly to the carb. Pumped up the line and figured it would be gravity fed. I cleaned out every orafice I could on the carb. Am I missing something? It did start initially right away ran for a few seconds and died. I did not use any starting fluid on that initial start. I'm hoping to get it fully running this coming weekend so I can assess the cooling system. I'm thinking the carb may have plugged up from something in the line. And planned on cleaning it again, But would like any advice I can get.
Thanks to everyone!
Tim ? fuel pump;
-----Original Message----- From: tim@... [T27Owners] < T27Owners@...> To: T27Owners < T27Owners@...> Sent: Tue, Aug 1, 2017 12:41 am Subject: [T27Owners] Re: Reviving the atomic 4 [1 Attachment] [ from tim@... [T27Owners] included below] I'm getting closer! Got the stuck valve unstuck, compression is now roughly 90 in all four cylinders. Cleaned out the carb once and it fired right up and ran beautifully for about 10 seconds then died... Then could only start and run with starting fluid. I'm thinking even though I am using good gas in a temporary tank, something must have made its way in and clogged it up somewhere... Will clean it again... Is there supposed to be a spring or a wire ?holding in the inlet valve with the float? If there is it is missing. ?I also need a new alternator. Any good options out there? Then I need to sort out the fuel line, pump, filters and valves. Here is a quick video of it starting with starter fluid. ?
?
?
?
|
Warren,
Your boat was built by? Douglass & McLeod Plastic corp. They built the Tartan 27 from 1961-1970. In 1966 they went from a bolt on lead keel to a pored lead keel into a fiberglass molded cavity and
added an additional 350 lbs of ballast. In 1971 Tartan Marine was formed. So what you are seeing is the fairing compound, which is subject to shrinkage, expansion, contraction and cracking; thus the keel joint is visible. You scrape out the old material and
re-fair it with a good marine fairing compound made for the purpose. Prep and paint the bottom with anti fouling paint and forget about it. Is your keel falling off, no. Are your keel bolts loose, almost certainly not. You can see the bolts in the bilge. After
you fair it, at some point in the future you will have to do it again. It is ongoing maintenance with a bolt on keel and no big deal or concern. Bolt on fin keel boats go through the same process.?
Dan
Sent from my iPhone
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?
My PO was "Screemin' Bob" and the boat (hull No. 90) was formerly Gabba Hey. ?If you search the forum for photos you will find photos of when he unbolted and dropped the lead ballast keel and installed new keel bolts. ?I've never heard of another
owner doing that, but you might find it interesting.?
Sent from my iPad
?
Thanks for the welcome and all of the input. I do not know what the hull # is but it was built in 1967. I live three hours away by car so putting in refit hours is going to be a challenge. I am planning on working on her this week, so I'l post the hull
#.?
Here is a picture of the crack. The lighting was not good so it's a tad sketchy.
|
Re: Crack in keel [1 Attachment]
My PO was "Screemin' Bob" and the boat (hull No. 90) was formerly Gabba Hey. ?If you search the forum for photos you will find photos of when he unbolted and dropped the lead ballast keel and installed new keel bolts. ?I've never heard of another owner doing that, but you might find it interesting.?
Sent from my iPad
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On Aug 8, 2017, at 1:02 PM, phcagent phcagent@... [T27Owners] < T27Owners@...> wrote:
?
Thanks for the welcome and all of the input. I do not know what the hull # is but it was built in 1967. I live three hours away by car so putting in refit hours is going to be a challenge. I am planning on working on her this week, so I'l post the hull #.? Here is a picture of the crack. The lighting was not good so it's a tad sketchy.
|
Thanks for the welcome and all of the input. I do not know what the hull # is but it was built in 1967. I live three hours away by car so putting in refit hours is going to be a challenge. I am planning on working on her this week, so I'l post the hull #.? Here is a picture of the crack. The lighting was not good so it's a tad sketchy.
|
Yup, looking at the "_Tartan 27 production date.pdf" file in the library in
this group gives year/hull number cut offs for the switch from external
ballast to internal (encapsulated in fiberglass). But now that Warren
mentions it, symmetrical cracks does strongly suggest external ballast.
-scott
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On 0, "Warren Stein wrsteinesq@... [T27Owners]" <T27Owners@...> wrote:
Welcome! This is a great forum. What's your hull number? Sounds like
an earlier boat with external lead ballast, and you're seeing the line
where the lead casting meets the hull. Probably nothing to worry about.
Sent from my iPad
On Aug 8, 2017, at 11:30 AM, [1]phcagent@... [T27Owners]
<[2]T27Owners@...> wrote:
Hi Folks,
I am a new Tartan 27 owner. Her name is Brass Ring and she is on the
hard in Stony Point NY. on the Hudson. I think that she is basically in
sound condition in need of some cosmetic sprucing up. There is however
a crack line that extends from the forward end of the keel aft about 6
feet. It is approximately 10 inches up from the bottom and at the six
foot mark, takes a 45 degree turn to the keel's bottom. This crack
appears on both sides of the keel.
I would appreciate anyone's thoughts on what might this be, what may
have caused it and possible remedies.
Thanks, Ron
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Hi Ron,
Congratulations on your new old boat.
The Tartan Owner's Handbook in the files section is an excellent reference
as you inventory the state of things. Spreaders, chainplates for the side
shroud, keel bolts (depending on the year), mast step, centerboard pin and
pendant, and various other things need inspection and in some cases, upgrade
if they haven't yet been.
Cosmetics tend to be the most noticible, but I'd encourage you to put that
off until the more serious stuff is inspected. Or maybe you did all of
that already. Since you're already on dry land, now is a really good time
to inspect the centerboard pin. If it has never been replaced, it's due.
The pendant suddenly failing can also cause a complete loss of the
centerboard as reported by a few people here.
Start rebedding deck hardware if it is due. That's one often neglected thing
that easily escapes attention but causes a lot of damage. Ditto portlights.
(3M 5200 for the deck hardware, butyl rubber for portlights, IMO.)
A few things could have caused the crack... bottoming out onto rocks, or
water getting into a smaller crack and freezing and expanding. Repair of the
fiberglass should be straightforward, but people do more elaborate things
to make sure the water is out (dehumidification tents, heaters, long
dry-out periods). Being symmetrical and starting at the forward end, this
sounds more likely a hard grounding.
If you want to do the work yourself, _The Fiberglass Boat Repair Manual_
and _Surveying Fiberglass Sailboats_ are both good.
And if you click on the "More" dropdown, then "Database" link, you can enter
yourself and your hull number into the little spreadsheet of Tartan 27 owners.
Cheers,
-scott
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On 0, "phcagent@... [T27Owners]" <T27Owners@...> wrote:
Hi Folks,
I am a new Tartan 27 owner. Her name is Brass Ring and she is on the
hard in Stony Point NY. on the Hudson. I think that she is basically in
sound condition in need of some cosmetic sprucing up. There is however a
crack line that extends from the forward end of the keel aft about 6 feet.
It is approximately 10 inches up from the bottom and at the six foot mark,
takes a 45 degree turn to the keel's bottom. This crack appears on both
sides of the keel.
I would appreciate anyone's thoughts on what might this be, what may have
caused it and possible remedies.
Thanks, Ron
References
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I have hull 125 with the same "crack".? It is the ballast, as Warren said.? It drives me crazy to see it, but seems benign. Robin
|
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On Tue, Aug 8, 2017 at 11:44 AM, Warren Stein wrsteinesq@... [T27Owners] <T27Owners@...> wrote:
?
Welcome! ? This is a great forum.? What's your hull number?? Sounds like an earlier boat with external lead ballast, and you're seeing the line where the lead casting meets the hull. ? Probably nothing to worry about. ?
Sent from my iPad
?
Hi Folks,
? I am a new Tartan 27 owner. Her name is Brass Ring and she is on the hard in Stony Point NY. on the Hudson. I think that she is basically in sound condition in need of some cosmetic sprucing up. There is however ?a crack line that extends from the forward end of the keel aft about 6 feet. It is approximately 10 inches up from the bottom and at the six foot mark, takes a 45 degree turn to the keel's bottom. This crack appears on both sides of the keel. I would appreciate anyone's thoughts on what might this be, what may have caused it and possible remedies.
Thanks, Ron
|
Welcome! ? This is a great forum. ?What's your hull number? ?Sounds like an earlier boat with external lead ballast, and you're seeing the line where the lead casting meets the hull. ? Probably nothing to worry about. ?
Sent from my iPad
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Show quoted text
On Aug 8, 2017, at 11:30 AM, phcagent@... [T27Owners] < T27Owners@...> wrote:
?
Hi Folks,
? I am a new Tartan 27 owner. Her name is Brass Ring and she is on the hard in Stony Point NY. on the Hudson. I think that she is basically in sound condition in need of some cosmetic sprucing up. There is however ?a crack line that extends from the forward end of the keel aft about 6 feet. It is approximately 10 inches up from the bottom and at the six foot mark, takes a 45 degree turn to the keel's bottom. This crack appears on both sides of the keel. I would appreciate anyone's thoughts on what might this be, what may have caused it and possible remedies.
Thanks, Ron
|
Hi Folks,
? I am a new Tartan 27 owner. Her name is Brass Ring and she is on the hard in Stony Point NY. on the Hudson. I think that she is basically in sound condition in need of some cosmetic sprucing up. There is however ?a crack line that extends from the forward end of the keel aft about 6 feet. It is approximately 10 inches up from the bottom and at the six foot mark, takes a 45 degree turn to the keel's bottom. This crack appears on both sides of the keel. I would appreciate anyone's thoughts on what might this be, what may have caused it and possible remedies.
Thanks, Ron
|
Re: Reviving the atomic 4 [1 Attachment]
Great to hear! Good work.
Keep an eye on oil usage until you figure out whether it is or isn't using oil
heavily.
-s
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On 0, "Tim tim@... [T27Owners]" <T27Owners@...> wrote: Thanks to everyone! The Atomic 4 is revived! Have run it for a couple hours now and everything seems great! New alternator, new electric fuel pump, new fuel lines, cleaned out the carb two more times. Moving water well, temps are good and it shifts well ????
On Aug 2, 2017, at 1:45 PM, David Moir David.Moir@... [T27Owners] <T27Owners@...> wrote:
All normal installations have a fuel pump managing the fuel flow, rather than relying on gravity only. I've had success with a manual fuel pump, but electric fuel pumps are becoming more common. They are not expensive and simple to install. Alternatively, if you squeeze the priming bulb every couple of seconds maybe you can "be the fuel pump" for testing purposes.
The Zenith carbs use the floats in the carburetor to control the inlet control valve. The Carb bowl fills with gas until the floats shut off the flow, and provides several seconds of running time before call for more fuel.
good luck on your project.
David
On August 2, 2017 at 3:27 PM "Tim tim@... [T27Owners]" <T27Owners@...> wrote:
I'm not sure about the fuel pump comments. I will describe how I was attempting to get fuel to the carb. I used a portable fuel tank sitting on the cockpit seat with a fuel line that included a priming bulb and a fuel filter. feeding directly to the carb. Pumped up the line and figured it would be gravity fed. I cleaned out every orafice I could on the carb. Am I missing something? It did start initially right away ran for a few seconds and died. I did not use any starting fluid on that initial start. I'm hoping to get it fully running this coming weekend so I can assess the cooling system. I'm thinking the carb may have plugged up from something in the line. And planned on cleaning it again, But would like any advice I can get.
Thanks to everyone!
Tim
On Jul 31, 2017, at 9:51 PM, Caleb Davison calebjess@... [T27Owners] <T27Owners@...> wrote:
fuel pump;
-----Original Message-----
From: tim@... [T27Owners] <T27Owners@...>
To: T27Owners <T27Owners@...>
Sent: Tue, Aug 1, 2017 12:41 am
Subject: [T27Owners] Re: Reviving the atomic 4 [1 Attachment]
[Attachment(s) from tim@... [T27Owners] included below]
I'm getting closer! Got the stuck valve unstuck, compression is now roughly 90 in all four cylinders. Cleaned out the carb once and it fired right up and ran beautifully for about 10 seconds then died... Then could only start and run with starting fluid. I'm thinking even though I am using good gas in a temporary tank, something must have made its way in and clogged it up somewhere... Will clean it again... Is there supposed to be a spring or a wire holding in the inlet valve with the float? If there is it is missing. I also need a new alternator. Any good options out there? Then I need to sort out the fuel line, pump, filters and valves. Here is a quick video of it starting with starter fluid.
|
Re: Reviving the atomic 4
Thanks to everyone! The Atomic 4 is revived! Have run it for a couple hours now and everything seems great! New alternator, new electric fuel pump, new fuel lines, cleaned out the carb two more times. Moving water well, temps are good and it shifts well ?
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Show quoted text
On Aug 2, 2017, at 1:45 PM, David Moir David.Moir@... [T27Owners] < T27Owners@...> wrote:
?
All normal installations have a fuel pump managing the fuel flow, rather than relying on gravity only. ?I've had success with a manual fuel pump, ?but electric fuel pumps are becoming more common. ?They are not expensive and simple to install. ?Alternatively, if you squeeze the priming bulb every couple of seconds maybe you can "be the fuel pump" for testing purposes.
The Zenith carbs use the floats in the carburetor to control the inlet control valve. ?The Carb bowl fills with gas until the floats shut off the flow, and provides several seconds of running time before call for more fuel.?
good luck on your project.
David On August 2, 2017 at 3:27 PM "Tim tim@... [T27Owners]" < T27Owners@...> wrote: ??
?
I'm not sure about the fuel pump comments. I will describe how I was attempting to get fuel to the carb. I used ?a portable fuel tank sitting on the cockpit seat with a fuel line that included a priming bulb and a fuel filter. feeding directly to the carb. Pumped up the line and figured it would be gravity fed. I cleaned out every orafice I could on the carb. Am I missing something? It did start initially right away ran for a few seconds and died. I did not use any starting fluid on that initial start. I'm hoping to get it fully running this coming weekend so I can assess the cooling system. I'm thinking the carb may have plugged up from something in the line. And planned on cleaning it again, But would like any advice I can get.
Thanks to everyone!
Tim ? fuel pump;
-----Original Message----- From: tim@... [T27Owners] < T27Owners@...> To: T27Owners < T27Owners@...> Sent: Tue, Aug 1, 2017 12:41 am Subject: [T27Owners] Re: Reviving the atomic 4 [1 Attachment] [Attachment(s) from tim@... [T27Owners] included below] I'm getting closer! Got the stuck valve unstuck, compression is now roughly 90 in all four cylinders. Cleaned out the carb once and it fired right up and ran beautifully for about 10 seconds then died... Then could only start and run with starting fluid. I'm thinking even though I am using good gas in a temporary tank, something must have made its way in and clogged it up somewhere... Will clean it again... Is there supposed to be a spring or a wire ?holding in the inlet valve with the float? If there is it is missing. ?I also need a new alternator. Any good options out there? Then I need to sort out the fuel line, pump, filters and valves. Here is a quick video of it starting with starter fluid. ?
?
?
?
|
I'm looking into replacing the original scuppers and I saw some photos from this group and was curious if anyone had any thoughts or advice.
Chris
|
Re: Reviving the atomic 4
All normal installations have a fuel pump managing the fuel flow, rather than relying on gravity only. ?I've had success with a manual fuel pump, ?but electric fuel pumps are becoming more common. ?They are not expensive and simple to install. ?Alternatively, if you squeeze the priming bulb every couple of seconds maybe you can "be the fuel pump" for testing purposes.
The Zenith carbs use the floats in the carburetor to control the inlet control valve. ?The Carb bowl fills with gas until the floats shut off the flow, and provides several seconds of running time before call for more fuel.?
good luck on your project.
David
On August 2, 2017 at 3:27 PM "Tim tim@... [T27Owners]" <T27Owners@...> wrote: ??
?
I'm not sure about the fuel pump comments. I will describe how I was attempting to get fuel to the carb. I used ?a portable fuel tank sitting on the cockpit seat with a fuel line that included a priming bulb and a fuel filter. feeding directly to the carb. Pumped up the line and figured it would be gravity fed. I cleaned out every orafice I could on the carb. Am I missing something? It did start initially right away ran for a few seconds and died. I did not use any starting fluid on that initial start. I'm hoping to get it fully running this coming weekend so I can assess the cooling system. I'm thinking the carb may have plugged up from something in the line. And planned on cleaning it again, But would like any advice I can get.
Thanks to everyone!
Tim ? fuel pump;
-----Original Message----- From: tim@... [T27Owners] < T27Owners@...> To: T27Owners < T27Owners@...> Sent: Tue, Aug 1, 2017 12:41 am Subject: [T27Owners] Re: Reviving the atomic 4 [1 Attachment] [Attachment(s) from tim@... [T27Owners] included below] I'm getting closer! Got the stuck valve unstuck, compression is now roughly 90 in all four cylinders. Cleaned out the carb once and it fired right up and ran beautifully for about 10 seconds then died... Then could only start and run with starting fluid. I'm thinking even though I am using good gas in a temporary tank, something must have made its way in and clogged it up somewhere... Will clean it again... Is there supposed to be a spring or a wire ?holding in the inlet valve with the float? If there is it is missing. ?I also need a new alternator. Any good options out there? Then I need to sort out the fuel line, pump, filters and valves. Here is a quick video of it starting with starter fluid. ?
?
?
?
|
Re: W.D. Schock built Tartan 27 roll call [3 Attachments]
Got most of the cushion and canvas order in, and making the boat more comfortable.
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On Jul 27, 2017, at 12:17 PM, Scott Walters scott@... [T27Owners] < T27Owners@...> wrote:
?
You already heard from me but here's a pic or two =)
If you navigate to the Tartan 27 Owners Yahoo Group and pick the
"more" drop-down, then pick "Databases", there's a little spreadsheet
like thing that people have entered themselves in to. You should be
able to pick out any other Schock Tartan owners in there from the
serial numbers (84, 91-95, 141-145, 171-175, 230, 234, 251-255, 351,
352, according to _Tartan 27 production date.pdf also in the group's
Files).
-scott
On 7/26/17, chris blasucci tartan2767@... [T27Owners]
<T27Owners@...> wrote:
> Yes! Bunky mamma
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Jul 26, 2017, at 9:37 PM, tim@... [T27Owners]
>> <T27Owners@...> wrote:
>>
>> [Attachment(s) from tim@... [T27Owners] included below]
>> So I was curious... There were 24 Tartan 27 boats that were not built in
>> Ohio, but were built in California by W.D. Schock. There are a few bigger
>> differences between these and the Ohio boats. more information is
>> available here
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> I was curious how many of the Ca boats were still around? And how many
>> belong to this group. So please chime in with pictures of your boat and
>> hull # and any relevant information you want to share.
>>
>>
>>
>> I have put up some pictures of my boat. Mine is hull 171 and was the 12th
>> boat built in CA. I have only had it about 2 months and am currently
>> working on getting the atomic 4 back in running condition. We also just
>> ordered a bunch of new canvas and cushions for it and have started on the
>> exterior bright work. (Just going with teak oil for now) mine is a 1967
>> model built in 1966 and is currently slipped in Dana Point, Ca it is
>> currently named "Sea Biscuit" but I am thinking about going back to its
>> original name of "Bunky Mama" (any guidance on removing the painted on
>> name without damaging the 2004 linear polyurethane paint job would be
>> appreciated.) the boat has got a bit of racing history as there are some
>> plaques mounted on a bulkhead. I am led to believe that it won 1st place
>> in its class in the 1980 Newport to Ensenada international race.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks for playing along. Looking forward to having fun with this!
>>
>>
>>
>> Tim
>>
>>
>
|
Re: Reviving the atomic 4
I'm not sure about the fuel pump comments. I will describe how I was attempting to get fuel to the carb. I used ?a portable fuel tank sitting on the cockpit seat with a fuel line that included a priming bulb and a fuel filter. feeding directly to the carb. Pumped up the line and figured it would be gravity fed. I cleaned out every orafice I could on the carb. Am I missing something? It did start initially right away ran for a few seconds and died. I did not use any starting fluid on that initial start. I'm hoping to get it fully running this coming weekend so I can assess the cooling system. I'm thinking the carb may have plugged up from something in the line. And planned on cleaning it again, But would like any advice I can get.
Thanks to everyone!
Tim
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Show quoted text
On Jul 31, 2017, at 9:51 PM, Caleb Davison calebjess@... [T27Owners] < T27Owners@...> wrote:
?
fuel pump;
-----Original Message-----
From: tim@... [T27Owners] < T27Owners@...>
To: T27Owners < T27Owners@...>
Sent: Tue, Aug 1, 2017 12:41 am
Subject: [T27Owners] Re: Reviving the atomic 4 [1 Attachment]
[Attachment(s) from tim@... [T27Owners] included below]
I'm getting closer! Got the stuck valve unstuck, compression is now roughly 90 in all four cylinders. Cleaned out the carb once and it fired right up and ran beautifully for about 10 seconds then died... Then could only start and run with starting fluid. I'm thinking even though I am using good gas in a temporary tank, something must have made its way in and clogged it up somewhere... Will clean it again... Is there supposed to be a spring or a wire ?holding in the inlet valve with the float? If there is it is missing. ?I also need a new alternator. Any good options out there? Then I need to sort out the fuel line, pump, filters and valves. Here is a quick video of it starting with starter fluid.
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Hello Ron,
Thank you for the correction! It makes perfect sense to change out the ports for blue water sailing. I have to think the factory ports would be a weak spot for that. Anyway, thanks again for the accurate info! Good luck with her!
Fred
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Fred , ur welcome, however , Hygelig still has the metal opening ports with real glass,? which Mr.Cobb had installed .??????????????? Ron
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From: "fred4936@... [T27Owners]"
To: T27Owners@...
Sent: Wednesday, August 2, 2017 9:12 AM
Subject: [T27Owners] Re: Offshore Tartan 27-2
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Thank you for all the info! R.I.P. Mr. Cobb. I love all the info about making already seaworthy boats more seaworthy. It does look like Hyelig still has the plastic ports. I am glad about that since I replaced mine recently. Anyway, thanks again for all the info about Russ Cobb and the Tartan 27's!
Fred Liesegang #662 Eagle
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Thank you for all the info! R.I.P. Mr. Cobb. I love all the info about making already seaworthy boats more seaworthy. It does look like Hyelig still has the plastic ports. I am glad about that since I replaced mine recently. Anyway, thanks again for all the info about Russ Cobb and the Tartan 27's!
Fred Liesegang #662 Eagle
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Sad news about Mr. Cobb, I was thankful for him because it was really comforting to know that another Tartan had done some blue water sailing. I just know his experiences from other posts, but he had crossed the Atlantic twice as well as the pacific and spent a big portion of his life on that boat. He seemed like a true cruiser and the kind of person that you would want to buy a boat from.
I'm kind of your neighbor on the west coast of Malaysia close to the Thai border and I sailed from Florida. I expect to pass through the Philippines next year.
Congrats on the boat, and I'll keep an eye out for you, unless you're hanging around Mindano.
-Scott. S/V ARGO
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