Re: Newbie with Minifish

#17081

On Sunday, February 03, 2019 08:40:48 AM lewis.kent@... [sunfish_sailor] 
wrote:
I think you described Arizona...To what are you referring?  Who described Arizona?

Re: Newbie with Minifish

#17080

I think you described Arizona...

2019!

#17079

What's on the Fun Float Plan agenda for 2019? We are finishing a wooden Sunfish Restoration and plan to get a photo of our Standard Sailfish WINNIE, Super Sailfish ZSA and wooden Sunfish ZIP and CHIP, which represent the first 3 models of Alcort boats. And we plan to get all the keels wet on our fleet of wooden and fiberglass boats, even the Catfish :)

We are trimming our parts inventory, if someone is looking for a vintage part, post a message here. If we don't have it, we know the other used parts sellers out there. And we can provide advice on restorations.

Cheers!
Clark and Skipper

Re: Newbie with Minifish

#17078

开云体育

Gail,

I have dried out my Force 5 but boats like the F5 and sunfish are prone to getting some water inside and therefore the foam ?stays wet virtually all sailing season.? Impossible to dry them out unless you force air thru them.? The repairs to unglued foam blocks are difficult at best and the.? I suspect my sunfish has loose foam blocks.? I can hear it creak in stonger winds when the boat is well stressed.? I will likely put an access covesr in both my boats to take a peek at things and then decide.

?

Mr Mike

?

Sent from for Windows 10

?

Show quoted text

From: sunfish_sailor@... on behalf of gail@... [sunfish_sailor]
Sent: Wednesday, January 2, 2019 1:04:01 AM
To: sunfish_sailor@...
Subject: Re: [sunfish_sailor] Re: Newbie with Minifish

?

Dan Feldman was Chair of the Sunfish Class Advisory Council for years.? He knows the boat inside and out.? His recommendations are here.? I count them as a Bible:

The white foam inside Sunfish is Styrofoam, stronger than any expanding foam.? The 2-part expanding foam was the "glue" to hold the Styrofoam in place.? It can be dried, but takes time.? A whole winter in a heated basement with air blowing through a hull would do it.?

Good luck, folks.?

Re: Newbie with Minifish

#17077

Dan Feldman was Chair of the Sunfish Class Advisory Council for years.? He knows the boat inside and out.? His recommendations are here.? I count them as a Bible:

The white foam inside Sunfish is Styrofoam, stronger than any expanding foam.? The 2-part expanding foam was the "glue" to hold the Styrofoam in place.? It can be dried, but takes time.? A whole winter in a heated basement with air blowing through a hull would do it.?

Good luck, folks.?

Re: Newbie with Minifish

#17076

I dried out my sunfish with a little fan and light bulb, but took about 6 months in garage, I thought about the ideal place would be rent a dehumidified storage room in one of those fort Knox Wearhouse type places big enough to fit hull in and run a fan through inspection holes, 1 hole front of dagger 1 hole front of rudder, put drain plug flange in transom in a dehumidified room and you should have a dry boat soon. I found a perfect fan at auto zone made to fit in cup holder of car pluged into cig lighter , round upright cylinder type fan dropped into the 5 inch port, kept on a car battery with trickle charger hooked up, my foam in good condition and still bonded

Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid

Re: Newbie with Minifish

[email protected]

#17075

On the Minifish I have, I would not attempt to separate the deck from the hull.  The lip is like an inverted V shape, and I am sure there is epoxy/adhesive on both sides making it about impossible to separate without damage.  
If I were to try the dry out method, I'd plumb a dehumidifier air output to an inspection port rather than use a vacuum.  I blew air through mine for weeks in a heated garage and it really didn't lose any noticeable weight.  I think you'd need a stock of shop vacs to run them that long.
Regarding the discussion of foam absorbing water, my case seems to be the opposite of what I've read...the expanding foam in my boat was mostly dry, but the white structural styrofoam was completely saturated.

Re: Newbie with Minifish

#17074

开云体育

On the minifish I have the edges are rolled down?, giving it a seamless appearance.

From: rhkramer@... [sunfish_sailor]

Sent: Tuesday, January 1, 2019 7:27 PM

To: sunfish_sailor@...

Reply To: sunfish_sailor@...

Subject: Re: [sunfish_sailor] Re: Newbie with Minifish

Does that mean you can't even partially separate the deck from the hull like
to peel it back at the ends?

On Tuesday, January 01, 2019 03:19:37 PM Allan Milo allanmilo01@...
[sunfish_sailor] wrote:
> I think the big difference is that you can't separate the top from the
> bottom on a mini fish.
>
> From: rhkramer@... [sunfish_sailor]
> Sent: Tuesday, January 1, 2019 11:15 AM
> To: sunfish_sailor@...
> Reply To: sunfish_sailor@...
> Subject: Re: [sunfish_sailor] Re: Newbie with Minifish
>
> Are you both (or is everybody here) talking about the same boat, that is,
> a Sunfish or a Minifish? Does it make a difference?

Re: Newbie with Minifish

#17073

The Mini fish has the deck rolled over the top of the sides, so there's no easy place to slip the putty knife in to break that joint, like on the Sunfish.    You could still separate the deck on the mini fish, I suppose, with a jig saw,  but it would be a LOT harder to do, and more difficult to repair later. I wouldn't recommend that.  Sorry.  On the Mini fish, if inspection ports are too narrow, I'd probably look at cutting out and saving a panel of the deck, then placing it back afterwards and glassing the joint, and painting or gel-coating over the edges to hide it. Or -maybe- very careful use of a heat gun could persuade the epoxy joint open at the deck/hull interface?  Not a job I'd wanna do... one other, probably bad idea: cut out the transom, at least on one side of the rudder/centerline, with some border left all around the edge, to make a big access to the innards, then glass that back into place and re-finish it when done? Anybody ever try that?
--------------------------------------------

Show quoted text

On Tue, 1/1/19, rhkramer@... [sunfish_sailor] <sunfish_sailor@...> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [sunfish_sailor] Re: Newbie with Minifish
 To: sunfish_sailor@...
 Date: Tuesday, January 1, 2019, 5:40 PM


 ?







  

       Does that mean you can't even partially
 separate the deck from the hull like

 to peel it back at the ends?



 On Tuesday, January 01, 2019 03:19:37 PM Allan Milo
 allanmilo01@...

 [sunfish_sailor] wrote:

 > I think the big difference is that you can't
 separate the top from the

 > bottom on a mini fish.

 >

 > From: rhkramer@... [sunfish_sailor]

 > Sent: Tuesday, January 1, 2019 11:15 AM

 > To: sunfish_sailor@...

 > Reply To: sunfish_sailor@...

 > Subject: Re: [sunfish_sailor] Re: Newbie with
 Minifish

 >

 >   Are you both (or is everybody here) talking about the
 same boat, that is,

 > a Sunfish or a Minifish? Does it make a difference?




 






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Re: Newbie with Minifish

#17072

Does that mean you can't even partially separate the deck from the hull like 
to peel it back at the ends?

On Tuesday, January 01, 2019 03:19:37 PM Allan Milo allanmilo01@... 
[sunfish_sailor] wrote:
I think the big difference is that you can't separate the top from the
bottom on a mini fish.

From: rhkramer@... [sunfish_sailor]
Sent: Tuesday, January 1, 2019 11:15 AM
To: sunfish_sailor@...
Reply To: sunfish_sailor@...
Subject: Re: [sunfish_sailor] Re: Newbie with Minifish

  Are you both (or is everybody here) talking about the same boat, that is,
a Sunfish or a Minifish? Does it make a difference?

Re: Newbie with Minifish

#17071

开云体育

I think the big difference is that you can't separate the top from the bottom on a mini fish.

From: rhkramer@... [sunfish_sailor]

Sent: Tuesday, January 1, 2019 11:15 AM

To: sunfish_sailor@...

Reply To: sunfish_sailor@...

Subject: Re: [sunfish_sailor] Re: Newbie with Minifish

Are you both (or is everybody here) talking about the same boat, that is, a
Sunfish or a Minifish? Does it make a difference?

On Tuesday, January 01, 2019 09:20:00 AM Tom Salwasser tomsalwasser@...
[sunfish_sailor] wrote:
> Oh that's good, answers my question too. Thanks Mark.
> Oh, and happy new year sunfish sailors!
> On Monday, December 31, 2018, 11:30:01 PM CST, mark.suszko@...
> [sunfish_sailor] wrote:
>
>
> Mike, having pried up the foredeck on my restoration, as well as trying to
> work thru ports, I'd say partial deck separation and re-attachment is not
> only faster and easier, but looks better when you're done. I'd be leery
> of using the expanding foams as replacements though: they are generally
> open cell sponges and/or not structurally as firm and stiff as blocks of
> closed-cell foam. The blocks keep the boat from flexing and breaking.
>
> Using a mallet and sharp new paint scraper, you can break the deck/hull
> seal open cleanly without much effort, and it epoxies back together well,
> leaving no sign you ever did it... whereas ports, though occasionally
> handy for minor storage, in my opinion lessen the appearance of the boat
> and advertise that you had to fix stuff inside. I'd suggest you leave the
> deck and hull connected around the central tub area, to keep overall
> alignment. And spend some time making sure the daggerboard trunk area is
> solid and leak-proof, while you have the access. When you close it back
> up, it will look nice.

Re: Newbie with Minifish

#17070

Are you both (or is everybody here) talking about the same boat, that is, a 
Sunfish or a Minifish?  Does it make a difference?

On Tuesday, January 01, 2019 09:20:00 AM Tom Salwasser tomsalwasser@... 
[sunfish_sailor] wrote:
 Oh that's good, answers my question too. Thanks Mark.
Oh, and happy new year sunfish sailors!
    On Monday, December 31, 2018, 11:30:01 PM CST, mark.suszko@...
[sunfish_sailor] <sunfish_sailor@...> wrote:

  
Mike, having pried up the foredeck on my restoration, as well as trying to
work thru ports, I'd say partial deck separation and re-attachment is not
only faster and easier, but looks better when you're done.  I'd be leery
of using the expanding foams as replacements though: they are generally
open cell sponges and/or not structurally as firm and stiff as blocks of
closed-cell foam.  The blocks keep the boat from flexing and breaking.

Using a mallet and sharp new paint scraper, you can break the deck/hull
seal open cleanly without much effort, and it epoxies back together well,
leaving no sign you ever did it... whereas ports, though occasionally
handy for minor storage, in my opinion lessen the appearance of the boat
and advertise that you had to fix stuff inside.  I'd suggest you leave the
deck and hull connected around the central tub area, to keep overall
alignment. And spend some time making sure the daggerboard trunk area is
solid and leak-proof, while you have the access. When you close it back
up, it will look nice.

Re: Newbie with Minifish

#17069

Oh that's good, answers my question too. Thanks Mark.

Oh, and happy new year sunfish sailors!

On Monday, December 31, 2018, 11:30:01 PM CST, mark.suszko@... [sunfish_sailor] wrote:

Mike, having pried up the foredeck on my restoration, as well as trying to work thru ports, I'd say partial deck separation and re-attachment is not only faster and easier, but looks better when you're done. ?I'd be leery of using the expanding foams as replacements though: they are generally open cell sponges and/or not structurally as firm and stiff as blocks of closed-cell foam. ?The blocks keep the boat from flexing and breaking.

Using a mallet and sharp new paint scraper, you can break the deck/hull seal open cleanly without much effort, and it epoxies back together well, leaving no sign you ever did it... whereas ports, though occasionally handy for minor storage, in my opinion lessen the appearance of the boat and advertise that you had to fix stuff inside. ?I'd suggest you leave the deck and hull connected around the central tub area, to keep overall alignment. And spend some time making sure the daggerboard trunk area is solid and leak-proof, while you have the access. When you close it back up, it will look nice.

Re: Newbie with Minifish

#17068

开云体育

I like the vacuum idea. Shop vacs allow you to hook the hose in reverse as well.

From: Mike King mrmike17@... [sunfish_sailor]

Sent: Monday, December 31, 2018 9:04 PM

To: sunfish_sailor@...

Reply To: sunfish_sailor@...

Subject: RE: [sunfish_sailor] Re: Newbie with Minifish

I have a old sunfish I rescued from a back yard.? It came with decent rigging and sail and I have sailed it often this past summer.? Not much water came out when I opened the ports but I suspect all the foam is either detached or deteriorated and perhaps waterlogged.? Separating the hull from deck looks like major surgery so I am solicitating opinions on the following repairs.? I will cut access ports to access both the forward and aft ends of the boat.? With homemade tools I will loosen all the foam, chip it into smaller pieces and ?vacuum it out.? I would replace it with that waterproof closed cell foam that they spray between the rafters in homes for insulation.? It will add rigidity and buoyancy.? It will not be an easy job just painstaking.? Comments welcome.

?

Incidently, I dry the inside of my boats with an old Electrolux vacuum cleaner.? I hooked up the hose backwards so it blows (The old vacuum cleaners did this).? I place a small electric heater? near the inlet so it blows warm air thru out the hull and let it run for as ?long as is necessary.

?

First post,

Comments welcome!

?

Mr Mike

?

ent from for Windows 10

?

Show quoted text

From: sunfish_sailor@... on behalf of Craig cjo1023@... [sunfish_sailor]
Sent: Saturday, December 29, 2018 3:29:37 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [sunfish_sailor] Re: Newbie with Minifish

?

I am still a member. Alive and on the right side of the grass. I will have Minifish sails in a couple of months. I am getting a bunch made along with Sunfish sails.

On Saturday, December 29, 2018, 1:11 PM, Tom Leone tgleone@... [sunfish_sailor] wrote:

?

I bought several Sunfish parts (including a sail) from Craig Obara, cjo1023@... and I was very happy with his prices, quality, and service.? I'm not sure if he has a Minifish sail but you could try contacting him.? I met him through this list, I'm not sure if he is still a member....

On Sat, Dec 29, 2018 at 8:44 AM Joseph D'Ambrosio kzooprof@... [sunfish_sailor] <sunfish_sailor@...> wrote:

?

Hey all,
Happy to see this post! 18 months ago my wife responded to an offer on Facebook from a very old friend for a well used Sunfish. Her friend had sailed this boat on Lake Mackatawa (Michigan) for some 40-50 years and had decided to upgrade! We picked up a very heavy and waterlogged Minifish which is actually in great shape and was well cared for overall! It has been sitting in storage for all this time and as I will retire in a couple of months will have more time to devote to restoration. Initially before we got it in the car I opened the drain port and we drained out gallons of water. We were then (barely) able to get it into the back of her Subaru for a short trip home but it clearly needs some drying out! I am reticent to try replacing foam so I will start with inspection ports and dehumidified, heated air for a time. I would love to hear from those with experience and get a more detailed position for the inspection ports! The boat has supposedly the original sail and that will need replacement! Any suggestions about a source? I just missed on an ad last year for a private sale of an almost unused minifish sail and I have seen at least one sailmaker (Neil Pryde) who advertises minxish sails at a pretty reasonable price! I will post some pictures soon and also post as I restore.
Joe

Re: Newbie with Minifish

#17067

Mike, having pried up the foredeck on my restoration, as well as trying to work thru ports, I'd say partial deck separation and re-attachment is not only faster and easier, but looks better when you're done. ?I'd be leery of using the expanding foams as replacements though: they are generally open cell sponges and/or not structurally as firm and stiff as blocks of closed-cell foam. ?The blocks keep the boat from flexing and breaking.

Using a mallet and sharp new paint scraper, you can break the deck/hull seal open cleanly without much effort, and it epoxies back together well, leaving no sign you ever did it... whereas ports, though occasionally handy for minor storage, in my opinion lessen the appearance of the boat and advertise that you had to fix stuff inside. ?I'd suggest you leave the deck and hull connected around the central tub area, to keep overall alignment. And spend some time making sure the daggerboard trunk area is solid and leak-proof, while you have the access. When you close it back up, it will look nice.

Re: Newbie with Minifish

#17066

开云体育

I have a old sunfish I rescued from a back yard.? It came with decent rigging and sail and I have sailed it often this past summer.? Not much water came out when I opened the ports but I suspect all the foam is either detached or deteriorated and perhaps waterlogged.? Separating the hull from deck looks like major surgery so I am solicitating opinions on the following repairs.? I will cut access ports to access both the forward and aft ends of the boat.? With homemade tools I will loosen all the foam, chip it into smaller pieces and ?vacuum it out.? I would replace it with that waterproof closed cell foam that they spray between the rafters in homes for insulation.? It will add rigidity and buoyancy.? It will not be an easy job just painstaking.? Comments welcome.

?

Incidently, I dry the inside of my boats with an old Electrolux vacuum cleaner.? I hooked up the hose backwards so it blows (The old vacuum cleaners did this).? I place a small electric heater? near the inlet so it blows warm air thru out the hull and let it run for as ?long as is necessary.

?

First post,

Comments welcome!

?

Mr Mike

?

ent from for Windows 10

?

Show quoted text

From: sunfish_sailor@... <sunfish_sailor@...> on behalf of Craig cjo1023@... [sunfish_sailor]
Sent: Saturday, December 29, 2018 3:29:37 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [sunfish_sailor] Re: Newbie with Minifish

?

I am still a member. Alive and on the right side of the grass. I will have Minifish sails in a couple of months. I am getting a bunch made along with Sunfish sails.

On Saturday, December 29, 2018, 1:11 PM, Tom Leone tgleone@... [sunfish_sailor] wrote:

?

I bought several Sunfish parts (including a sail) from Craig Obara, cjo1023@... and I was very happy with his prices, quality, and service.? I'm not sure if he has a Minifish sail but you could try contacting him.? I met him through this list, I'm not sure if he is still a member....

On Sat, Dec 29, 2018 at 8:44 AM Joseph D'Ambrosio kzooprof@... [sunfish_sailor] <sunfish_sailor@...> wrote:

?

Hey all,
Happy to see this post! 18 months ago my wife responded to an offer on Facebook from a very old friend for a well used Sunfish. Her friend had sailed this boat on Lake Mackatawa (Michigan) for some 40-50 years and had decided to upgrade! We picked up a very heavy and waterlogged Minifish which is actually in great shape and was well cared for overall! It has been sitting in storage for all this time and as I will retire in a couple of months will have more time to devote to restoration. Initially before we got it in the car I opened the drain port and we drained out gallons of water. We were then (barely) able to get it into the back of her Subaru for a short trip home but it clearly needs some drying out! I am reticent to try replacing foam so I will start with inspection ports and dehumidified, heated air for a time. I would love to hear from those with experience and get a more detailed position for the inspection ports! The boat has supposedly the original sail and that will need replacement! Any suggestions about a source? I just missed on an ad last year for a private sale of an almost unused minifish sail and I have seen at least one sailmaker (Neil Pryde) who advertises minxish sails at a pretty reasonable price! I will post some pictures soon and also post as I restore.
Joe

Re: Newbie with Minifish

#17065

I am still a member. Alive and on the right side of the grass. I will have Minifish sails in a couple of months. I am getting a bunch made along with Sunfish sails.

Show quoted text

On Saturday, December 29, 2018, 1:11 PM, Tom Leone tgleone@... [sunfish_sailor] wrote:

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I bought several Sunfish parts (including a sail) from Craig Obara, cjo1023@... and I was very happy with his prices, quality, and service.? I'm not sure if he has a Minifish sail but you could try contacting him.? I met him through this list, I'm not sure if he is still a member....

On Sat, Dec 29, 2018 at 8:44 AM Joseph D'Ambrosio kzooprof@... [sunfish_sailor] <sunfish_sailor@...> wrote:

?

Hey all,
Happy to see this post! 18 months ago my wife responded to an offer on Facebook from a very old friend for a well used Sunfish. Her friend had sailed this boat on Lake Mackatawa (Michigan) for some 40-50 years and had decided to upgrade! We picked up a very heavy and waterlogged Minifish which is actually in great shape and was well cared for overall! It has been sitting in storage for all this time and as I will retire in a couple of months will have more time to devote to restoration. Initially before we got it in the car I opened the drain port and we drained out gallons of water. We were then (barely) able to get it into the back of her Subaru for a short trip home but it clearly needs some drying out! I am reticent to try replacing foam so I will start with inspection ports and dehumidified, heated air for a time. I would love to hear from those with experience and get a more detailed position for the inspection ports! The boat has supposedly the original sail and that will need replacement! Any suggestions about a source? I just missed on an ad last year for a private sale of an almost unused minifish sail and I have seen at least one sailmaker (Neil Pryde) who advertises minxish sails at a pretty reasonable price! I will post some pictures soon and also post as I restore.
Joe

Re: Newbie with Minifish

#17064

I bought several Sunfish parts (including a sail) from Craig Obara, cjo1023@... and I was very happy with his prices, quality, and service.? I'm not sure if he has a Minifish sail but you could try contacting him.? I met him through this list, I'm not sure if he is still a member...

Show quoted text

On Sat, Dec 29, 2018 at 8:44 AM Joseph D'Ambrosio kzooprof@... [sunfish_sailor] <sunfish_sailor@...> wrote:

?

Hey all,
Happy to see this post! 18 months ago my wife responded to an offer on Facebook from a very old friend for a well used Sunfish. Her friend had sailed this boat on Lake Mackatawa (Michigan) for some 40-50 years and had decided to upgrade! We picked up a very heavy and waterlogged Minifish which is actually in great shape and was well cared for overall! It has been sitting in storage for all this time and as I will retire in a couple of months will have more time to devote to restoration. Initially before we got it in the car I opened the drain port and we drained out gallons of water. We were then (barely) able to get it into the back of her Subaru for a short trip home but it clearly needs some drying out! I am reticent to try replacing foam so I will start with inspection ports and dehumidified, heated air for a time. I would love to hear from those with experience and get a more detailed position for the inspection ports! The boat has supposedly the original sail and that will need replacement! Any suggestions about a source? I just missed on an ad last year for a private sale of an almost unused minifish sail and I have seen at least one sailmaker (Neil Pryde) who advertises minxish sails at a pretty reasonable price! I will post some pictures soon and also post as I restore.
Joe

Re: Newbie with Minifish

[email protected]

#17063

So this morning the inside of the hull is very dry!? Sweet!? FYI a dry Minifish hull with no foam at all in it weighs 78.2 lbs.? :)

To answer some questions, a new sail is available on eBay from CT for $150.??

I wouldn't have gotten all the foam out through the two inspection ports that I cut in; this hull had a previous patch that is actually in a very good spot to remove/insert foam pieces.? I cut the patch out and opened it up a bit more.? Once all the foam is back in I will repair the hole properly.? You can see all this in my newbie photo album.? I added a photo last night showing where I cut two ports to be able to reach in where I needed to.??

Oh, the minifish deck can't be separated from the hull easily due to the curved lip.? I've seen where the Sunfish deck front and rear can be peeled up some for access; I'm sure some searching here would turn up that project.? I'm glad to see there are more people interested in saving some of these old fish!??

Re: Newbie with Minifish

#17062

开云体育

Thanks for the update. I also have a gutted minifish with flexy spots on the hull. Interested in seeing how others handle the support issue?.