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Re: AXA tool post holder
On Sun, Mar 6, 2022 at 01:38 PM, Rick wrote:
In a home shop I see no real advantage in the Multifix, maybe in a production shop. ?The KDK looks like it sticks out too much. I recently turned a magneto backing plate that was 8” on a SB9 and had to retract the tool in very close on my AXA. I don’t see any way that would have worked with the KDK.I'd have to see the set up. With the KDK you can turn the base any angle on the compound and the holders flip, so a left hand becomes a right hand. Also there are a variety of holders and shapes. If I had an 8" disc I'm fortunate to have a SB 13" as well as the SB 9". That said, I've done 11" discs (loco wheels) on the 13" with KDK, so about the same ratio. John |
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Re: AXA tool post holder
Things like that are why I said we shouldn't get rid of the lantern tool posts. I bought the AXA because it was cheap, I could get it fast, and I didn't have a complete lantern tool post, either. I'd never seen a Multifix or KDK at that time. I'd seen the BXA & CXA tool posts on the school lathes for the class I'm still taking for a few months more. IIRC, when I was in the high school class in 1973 all they had were lantern posts. I'm not doing production work, myself. Though that could change, I suppose. ;) Even the clone Multifix tool posts are way too expensive for my budget. And so far, I'm happy with what I have, but I may make a KDK type just for giggles. If nothing else, it's more good practice for making other stuff, and it might be handy. Bill in OKC William R. Meyers, MSgt, USAF(Ret.) Aphorisms to live by: SEMPER GUMBY! Improvise, Adapt, and Overcome. Physics doesn't care about your schedule. The only reason I know anything is because I've done it wrong enough times to START to know better On Sunday, March 6, 2022, 03:38:30 PM CST, Rick <vwrick@...> wrote: In a home shop I see no real advantage in the Multifix, maybe in a production shop. ?The KDK looks like it sticks out too much. I recently turned a magneto backing plate that was 8” on a SB9 and had to retract the tool in very close on my AXA. I don’t see any way that would have worked with the KDK. |
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Re: AXA tool post holder
I can answer a bit of that, about the difference between the Multifix and Aloris types, anyway. The Multifix has (IIRC) 38 specific angles that are built into the toolpost so you can select a tool holder and angle of approach for that tool holder quite repeat ably. The AXA style post give you two angles. You can get more angles by shifting the post but it's not indexable in the same way the Multifix is. Do you NEED it? I have no idea! ;) So far, I've been able to do anything I needed to do with an AXA clone. Though I can see how the multiple repeatable angles could be very handy for someone doing certain kinds of production work. The thing I like about the KDK-style post is the same thing I like about the AXA post, but I also like that the lock and unlock lever on the KDK operated in a vertical direction, instead horizontal like the AXA style post. I've had problems with that handle getting in the way on both my AXA at home, and the BXA on the lathe I most use at school. Would any one of them be great to have? Heck yes! All three might be a bit of overkill, though. I wouldn't get rid of my lantern toolpost either. They have advantages the QCTP's don't, as well. And disadvantages. Yeah, I know, not a lot of help there, huh? ;) Bill in OKC William R. Meyers, MSgt, USAF(Ret.) Aphorisms to live by: SEMPER GUMBY! Improvise, Adapt, and Overcome. Physics doesn't care about your schedule. The only reason I know anything is because I've done it wrong enough times to START to know better On Sunday, March 6, 2022, 01:57:57 PM CST, Matthew Kosh <matthewkosh11@...> wrote: I’m curious why? What have you found to be the benefits of the Multifix or KDK designs over the Aloris? I’ve used an Aloris for many years and have no complaints about its quality or repeatability, but having only played with a Multifix at a friend’s shop, I just don’t have experience with them, and never seen a KDK except in pictures. Can you say more? Matthew On Mar 6, 2022, at 9:17 AM, mike allen <animal@...> wrote:
??? ??? Yea , the multi-fixstyle it what I'd buy if i was ever to do it again over a Aloris clone . ??? ??? animal On 3/6/2022 9:08 AM, Bill in OKC too via groups.io wrote: As far as I can tell, you can get Chinese import clones of the KDK. An AXA equivalent with 5 holders is $3-400, IIRC, search on Ebay and you'll find them. The Multifix is worse, pricewise, but that multiple fixed angles thing is a nifty feature. Bill in OKC William R. Meyers, MSgt, USAF(Ret.) Aphorisms to live by: SEMPER GUMBY! Improvise, Adapt, and Overcome. Physics doesn't care about your schedule. The only reason I know anything is because I've done it wrong enough times to START to know better On Sunday, March 6, 2022, 11:04:06 AM CST, mike allen <animal@...> wrote: ??? ??? ??? While I don't have a KDK I really like them . I have noticed that of all the " real machine shops " that the most common tool post are the KDK & the Multi-fix? over the Aloris . While a real KDK is totally out of my price range if I were to ever upgrade I'll probably get one of the multi-fix clones . Are the KDK 's still being made ? ??? animal On 3/6/2022 6:49 AM, comstock_friend wrote: I had to eliminate 'T nut' and 'belt' from my eBay South Bend searches as half of the returns were T nuts and belts which I have no current need for. As for the Aloris style post and locking lever, my KDK's are nicely off to the side. I have the 0 size on the SB 9" and the 100 size on the SB 13". I always liked the clean top of the KDK style. Although the KDK's can be found all over the USA, they are certainly more populous on the West Coast as they started in the LA area... John |
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Re: AXA tool post holder
The US KDK is gone, only import now for new. The side lever is not as robust as the Aloris, and there is only the one dovetail, not the two at 90 degrees. The tool holders for the 0, 100, 150 and 200 all interchange with the others blocks. Quite the overhang for a 200 tool holder on a 0 block, and maybe the heights can't be worked out. ? KDK's were on Burbank HS's 13" South Bends before Disney offered them a sound stage and the machine shop went away. On all the lathes at Glendale College machine shop including SB's, LeBlond Servoshifts, Monarch and the big American Pacemaker, this all in the last 30 years. My work place also had KDK's on Monarch, Pacemaker, Mori Seiki, etc. |
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Re: AXA tool post holder
As far as I can tell, you can get Chinese import clones of the KDK. An AXA equivalent with 5 holders is $3-400, IIRC, search on Ebay and you'll find them. The Multifix is worse, pricewise, but that multiple fixed angles thing is a nifty feature. Bill in OKC William R. Meyers, MSgt, USAF(Ret.) Aphorisms to live by: SEMPER GUMBY! Improvise, Adapt, and Overcome. Physics doesn't care about your schedule. The only reason I know anything is because I've done it wrong enough times to START to know better On Sunday, March 6, 2022, 11:04:06 AM CST, mike allen <animal@...> wrote: ??? ??? ??? While I don't have a KDK I really like them . I have noticed that of all the " real machine shops " that the most common tool post are the KDK & the Multi-fix? over the Aloris . While a real KDK is totally out of my price range if I were to ever upgrade I'll probably get one of the multi-fix clones . Are the KDK 's still being made ? ??? animal On 3/6/2022 6:49 AM, comstock_friend wrote: I had to eliminate 'T nut' and 'belt' from my eBay South Bend searches as half of the returns were T nuts and belts which I have no current need for. As for the Aloris style post and locking lever, my KDK's are nicely off to the side. I have the 0 size on the SB 9" and the 100 size on the SB 13". I always liked the clean top of the KDK style. Although the KDK's can be found all over the USA, they are certainly more populous on the West Coast as they started in the LA area... John |
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Re: AXA tool post holder
I may not have mentioned it here before, but I'm a cheap bastrich. ;) Only reason I have an AXA-clone is that it was $130 when I bought it, with five tool holders. I think I'll make my own! I paid $750 for my Atlas TH42 lathe, and $950 for the South Bend Heavy 10L. And the SB is still in need of some heavy restoration work. There is some tooling I have to buy, since I'm not that good a machinist yet, and possibly for ever, but I have made some, too, so I'm getting better. Bill in OKC William R. Meyers, MSgt, USAF(Ret.) Aphorisms to live by: SEMPER GUMBY! Improvise, Adapt, and Overcome. Physics doesn't care about your schedule. The only reason I know anything is because I've done it wrong enough times to START to know better On Sunday, March 6, 2022, 09:03:55 AM CST, comstock_friend <jfriend314@...> wrote: Used KDK brand holders can be expensive used, especially considering their sometimes beat up condition. There is a cheaper clone option. These are very nice compared to some Chinesium... John |
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Re: AXA tool post holder
Patented a decade before I took machine shop, so I guess it's no surprise I missed them. They wouldn't have been all that common yet, and highly unlikely to be in a high school machine shop. I've attached a copy of the patent just in case anyone else is interested. ;) Would you be willing to take some measurements off your tool posts? When you have literally nothing else to do. I already have quite the project list going. :) Bill in OKC William R. Meyers, MSgt, USAF(Ret.) Aphorisms to live by: SEMPER GUMBY! Improvise, Adapt, and Overcome. Physics doesn't care about your schedule. The only reason I know anything is because I've done it wrong enough times to START to know better On Sunday, March 6, 2022, 08:49:48 AM CST, comstock_friend <jfriend314@...> wrote: I had to eliminate 'T nut' and 'belt' from my eBay South Bend searches as half of the returns were T nuts and belts which I have no current need for. As for the Aloris style post and locking lever, my KDK's are nicely off to the side. I have the 0 size on the SB 9" and the 100 size on the SB 13". I always liked the clean top of the KDK style. Although the KDK's can be found all over the USA, they are certainly more populous on the West Coast as they started in the LA area... John |
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Re: AXA tool post holder
I grew up in SoCal, and took my first machine shop class there in 1973. Also left the state that year, and have never seen that style of tool post before. I like it! Think I'm going to try to track down a copy of the patent listed on the label in your photo. Pretty nifty! Thanks! Bill in OKC William R. Meyers, MSgt, USAF(Ret.) Aphorisms to live by: SEMPER GUMBY! Improvise, Adapt, and Overcome. Physics doesn't care about your schedule. The only reason I know anything is because I've done it wrong enough times to START to know better On Sunday, March 6, 2022, 08:49:48 AM CST, comstock_friend <jfriend314@...> wrote: I had to eliminate 'T nut' and 'belt' from my eBay South Bend searches as half of the returns were T nuts and belts which I have no current need for. As for the Aloris style post and locking lever, my KDK's are nicely off to the side. I have the 0 size on the SB 9" and the 100 size on the SB 13". I always liked the clean top of the KDK style. Although the KDK's can be found all over the USA, they are certainly more populous on the West Coast as they started in the LA area... John |
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Re: AXA tool post holder
I had to eliminate 'T nut' and 'belt' from my eBay South Bend searches as half of the returns were T nuts and belts which I have no current need for.
As for the Aloris style post and locking lever, my KDK's are nicely off to the side. I have the 0 size on the SB 9" and the 100 size on the SB 13". I always liked the clean top of the KDK style. Although the KDK's can be found all over the USA, they are certainly more populous on the West Coast as they started in the LA area... John |
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Re: AXA tool post holder
I wouldn't worry too much about that.? I haven't sold a tool yet.? I already have an A2Z CNC tool post on it but sm not totally happy as it is not that rigid and the little lathe is flexible enough already. James On Sat, Feb 26, 2022 at 2:44 PM Bill in OKC too via <wmrmeyers=[email protected]> wrote: Be careful about installing that OXA clone. As soon as I did that on my 7x10 mini-lathe, I turned around and sold it. ;) |
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Re: AXA tool post holder
This is the one that I read about that is supposed to be as good as the original.? Also more expensive. Bill in OKC? William R. Meyers, MSgt, USAF(Ret.) Aphorisms to live by: SEMPER GUMBY! Improvise, Adapt, and Overcome. Physics doesn't care about your schedule. The only reason I know anything is because I've done it wrong enough times to START to know better
On Saturday, February 26, 2022, 07:51:23 PM CST, mike allen <animal@...> wrote:
??? ??? This one is a import from China I believe . I have read some reviews on it & they seem favorable . I have heard of some European clones , some good & some not so good .? The 2 I have read the most about is the Creat Tool? ( china ) & the Pewetools ( germany ) ??? ??? I read a lot of folks talking smack about the one from China on the forums but none of those folks have one . ??? ??? I have the QCTP from CDCO & looking at some of the other clones out there it's probably one of the better ones? .I had to replace the dog point screws out of the box . I also had to take it apart to clean out all the crap inside from manufacturing , but I would have done that anyways just to see how it worked & I had to re-clock the handle anyways . The adjusting screws have had issues since I bought the tool post? , so I'll be replacing those along with the brass thumb nuts? sooner than later . I bought a bunch of tool holders here & there same thing with those the hardware sucks but? the base part is fine . ??? ??? end of rant for now ??? ??? animal On 2/26/2022 12:42 PM, Bill in OKC too via groups.io wrote:
> MIke, is that the "Good" clone, or the bad clone? Someone else bought the one that's imported into Germany, and it was two or three times that cost. It is supposedly the "Good" clone. I didn't touch it so can't say for sure. Think it was mentioned on the SouthBendLathe group, but could be wrong/ > > Bill in OKC > > William R. Meyers, MSgt, USAF(Ret.) > >? Aphorisms to live by: > SEMPER GUMBY! > Improvise, Adapt, and Overcome. > Physics doesn't care about your schedule. > The only reason I know anything is because I've done it wrong enough times to START to know better > >? On Saturday, February 26, 2022, 02:28:45 PM CST, mike allen <animal@...> wrote: > >? ? ??? ??? If I was to buy a new tool post to replace my import AXA I > would get one of these Multi-Fix clones . Had I know that they were > around I would have bought one instead of the AXA . > >? ??? ??? A bit more than the AXA , but I can live with that . When I buy > something I study the hall out of it . I don't have as much disposable > income as a lot of folks . I like the option to change the clock of the > tool holder without having to loosen the nut on top of the QCTP . I look > at a lot of the machine shops I've been in & the KDK & Multi-Fix far out > number the Aloris style of QCTP's . > > Yea it isn't as easy to make more tool holders , but what's wrong with a > challenge ? At $190.00 it's still cheaper than some AXA clones out there . > > > >? ??? animal > > On 2/26/2022 12:02 PM, Bill in OKC too via groups.io wrote: >> True that, and why I generally say AXA-Clone. Partially because mine is a Chinese copy, and partially because the AXA-size is the one that fits 9-12" lathes, generally speaking. My school lathe that I love is a 13" Clausing Colchester, which has the BXA tool post, the other machines are 15" CC lathes, and they have CXA tool posts. The BXA I use is an Aloris, IIRC. They are very nice for some things. I'm also collecting tooling for the lantern-style tool posts, as there are some things they work better for. Best is to have both a QCTP of some sort, and the lantern style. Both will easily do some things the other cannot. If? you work production, you'll mostly want the QCTP. >> >> If you never do duplicate parts, you won't need a QCTP at all, but AFAIK, most folks who are hobbyists can make good use of both. Name brand QCTP's tend to be rather expensive. Just the tool post without tool holders is about half of what I paid for my Atlas TH42, and about a third of what I paid for my restoration project SB Heavy 10L. is about $380. Technically, the Phase II is actually a clone, too, of the Aloris. Supposedly of higher quality than mine, but I couldn't prove it. ;) Mine is around $160 on Amazon with 5 toolholders. >> >> For folks who can't afford or don't want to spend the money to get either, you can make a Van Norman style. GK at the SouthBendLathe group just did that, based partially on the Ralph Patterson version that was popular on the 7x Mini-lathes. You can find that info here: /g/Mini-Lathes/files/Ralph%20Patterson%20Mini-Lathe%20and%20metalworking%20projects%21/RalphPattersonML among other stuff. I'm the owner of that group, and anyone who's interested in welcome to join. >> >> Bill in OKC >> >> William R. Meyers, MSgt, USAF(Ret.) >> >>? ? Aphorisms to live by: >> SEMPER GUMBY! >> Improvise, Adapt, and Overcome. >> Physics doesn't care about your schedule. >> The only reason I know anything is because I've done it wrong enough times to START to know better >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>? ? On Saturday, February 26, 2022, 01:26:51 PM CST, Rick <vwrick@...> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >>? ? On Wed, Feb 23, 2022 at 08:37 PM, piper184 wrote: >> >> I have a PhaseII (same as AXA if I understand it properly) holder on my SB 10K. It came that way. Looks like it was a direct replacement for the old lantern style holder. PhaseII just slides right onto the T-slot in the compound. >> For future reference in case a newbie reads this, Phase II is a brand, AXA is a size. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > > > > |
davesmith1800
comstock_friend
Bill in OKC too
James Rice