South Bend 11 FS Reno Nv CL
this is some serious $$$$
oh yea , not mine
animal
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Re: First lathe rebuild questions
I used this formula when I rebuilt my 1960 era 9A a while ago.? I have a number of SB parts and accessories from different, unknown, sources and eras and the color seems to match pretty decently.?
?
Works for me.
?
Matt
?
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From: [email protected] < [email protected]>
On Behalf Of Greg via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2023 5:46 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [SouthBendLathe] First lathe rebuild questions
?
Lord. knows the chosen paint colors vary with taste. Like someone else said, I don't think there actually was an ORIGINAL SB gray color for these machines. My 10L heavy was green and rusted when I got it. I stripped it & painted it with
a blueish tinted gray that I found from someone on one of these sites. Not a straight gray, but I like it.?  
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Re: First lathe rebuild questions
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Re: First lathe rebuild questions
That greenish tint was what I was hoping for when I bought the
Sherwin-Williams mix. I like that color. It is what I most associate
with SB products. It was the only time I actually tried to get a
color match on a restoration. Usually, I look to see what I have
left from buying paint on clearance. My Gloss Royal Blue period is
coming to an end much as it did with Picasso.
Seriously, I do not think SB or any company for that matter really
worried too much about the exact color years ago. It was a more
practical time. They were past the hand painted gold pin stripes and
fleur de lis you saw in the late 19th century.
On 7/26/2023 3:12 PM, Jack Reynolds
wrote:
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I don't know if anyone really knows how diligent South Bend was
over it's history with color match and consistency.? God only
knows what went on during the war years and as long as SB was
building lathes there were probably multiple cost savings
involving paint suppliers.? One of the other variables is the
history of the individual machine.? Depending on how much crud
was allowed to accumulate and what solvents and cleaners were
used to remove it I am sure that a lot of the surviving machines
vary in color significantly.? In the case of my heavy 10, which
I know has never been painted, the color tends toward green as
much as gray.? You may want to concern yourself more with the
quality and user friendliness of the paint you choose than how
closely it matches someone else's lathe.? Just my two cents.
On 7/26/2023 11:57 AM, Mike Poore
wrote:
- I used the Sherwin-Williams mix and was not impressed. It
looked to me almost identical to the Rust-oleum oil based
Smoke Gray that I used on another machine. I admit to being
a bad judge of color. I have read, but cannot say with
certainty, that there is no proper SBL gray because of
variations year to year. I can say that I have seen multiple
SBL models that were supposedly sporting original paint and
looked different. One unanswered question for me is how age
affects the original color of 80 year old paint and if you
color match old paint are you really matching the original
color.
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Re: First lathe rebuild questions
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Re: First lathe rebuild questions
I couldn’t find his original post, I must have deleted it, so I tagged Mike’s post as he mentioned the motor. That should be a ? hp single phase, instant reverse motor with a relay. The wiring depends on which drum switch you have. Either a Furnas 789 or a Cutler Hammer 790. Attached link to both below: wswells.com/download/GE-KC-with-relay-5-wire.jpg ? Steve ?
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From: [email protected] < [email protected]> On Behalf Of Mike Poore Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2023 11:58 AM To: [email protected]Subject: Re: [SouthBendLathe] First lathe rebuild questions ? - Not familiar with the GE motor numbers. You need to determine if it is single or three phase first. Many motors have a diagram on the case.
- I bought that kit and used it to rebuild a 9A. The book is really well done. It will be a big help. The felts fit as they should.
- I used the Sherwin-Williams mix and was not impressed. It looked to me almost identical to the Rust-oleum oil based Smoke Gray that I used on another machine. I admit to being a bad judge of color. I have read, but cannot say with certainty, that there is no proper SBL gray because of variations year to year. I can say that I have seen multiple SBL models that were supposedly sporting original paint and looked different. One unanswered question for me is how age affects the original color of 80 year old paint and if you color match old paint are you really matching the original color?
? On 7/25/2023 5:50 PM, Jefferson wrote: I just bought my first lathe (9" 744 A 167045) and I have some questions. It is covered with surface rust, and the motor has been disconnected.
1) Does anyone have a wiring diagram to connect the motor (GE 5kc63ab776) to the barrel switch and a power cord?
2) Is the ILION rebuild kit and "Guide to Renovating" (Amazon $80) the way I should proceed?
3) What gray (It was originally gray right?) brush-able paint would you recommend?
Thanks in advance,
?
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Re: First lathe rebuild questions
??? ??? Good one Eddie , & just in time for the movie .
animal
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That's got to be a toy one in the
"Barbie" range of accessories??
Eddie
------ Original Message ------
From: "Jim_B" <jim@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Wednesday, 26 Jul, 23 At 21:14
Subject: Re: [SouthBendLathe] First lathe rebuild questions
Then there is this option.
Don’t worry it’s from Photoshop. ?
On Jul 26, 2023, at 4:03 PM, Andrei <calciu1@...> wrote:
? Making mine bright yellow, so I can see easily any things I might drop.
Don't get hung up on color. Manufacturers changed colors and paint base depending on the lowest bidder for that batch, or month, or year.
Gray was the cheapest color because you could make it by dumping in all the paint remnants and a squirt or two of color to get some "consistent" hue.
Make your lathe the color that floats your boat. Be unique. Enjoy your toy.
Polka dots are fun, too, especially for lathes sitting on a cabinet.
Food for thought. My 1929 SB 9” Junior original color was black (japanning) with white color inside the bed ways (nice contrast while viewing your work). I kept all the japanning, simply top coated with semi gloss black. Your lathe, your color…..all the the restored machines in my shop are dark gray, the SB is my exception.
Sent by my iPhone
On Jul 26, 2023, at 2:28 PM, E A <b-arch@...> wrote:
? This is an extremely close match to paint that had been hidden by the gear box since 1942... Went on nicely as well...
But as others have said, the color formulas changed over ……..
--
Jim B
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Re: First lathe rebuild questions
??? ??? Mine works just as good a any red , yellow or blue lathe
I've seen . Plus for polka dots , just ask Buddy Guy . On the
yellow color , I see alot of lathes FS where the handles &
hand wheels are painted yellow & I seem to think the ones in
shop class in early 70's all has yellow handles & hand wheels
. Some kind of safety plan I guess.
animal
On 7/26/23 1:02 PM, Andrei wrote:
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Show quoted text
Making mine bright yellow, so I can see easily any things I
might drop.
Don't get hung up on color. Manufacturers changed colors and
paint base depending on the lowest bidder for that batch, or
month, or year.
Gray was the cheapest color because you could make it by dumping
in all the paint remnants and a squirt or two of color to get
some "consistent" hue.
Make your lathe the color that floats your boat. Be unique.
Enjoy your toy.?
Polka dots are fun, too, especially for lathes sitting on a
cabinet.?
Food for thought. ?My 1929 SB 9” Junior original
color was black (japanning) with white color inside the bed ways
(nice contrast while viewing your work). ?I kept all the
japanning, simply top coated with semi gloss black. ? Your
lathe, your color…..all the the restored machines in my shop are
dark gray, the SB is my exception. ?
Sent by my iPhone
?
This is an extremely close match to paint that had been
hidden by the gear box since 1942... Went on nicely as
well...
But as others have said, the color formulas changed over
……..
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Re: First lathe rebuild questions
That's got to be a toy one in the "Barbie" range of accessories??
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
------ Original Message ------
From: "Jim_B" <jim@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Wednesday, 26 Jul, 23 At 21:14
Subject: Re: [SouthBendLathe] First lathe rebuild questions
Then there is this option.
Don’t worry it’s from Photoshop. ?On Jul 26, 2023, at 4:03 PM, Andrei <calciu1@...> wrote:
? Making mine bright yellow, so I can see easily any things I might drop.
Don't get hung up on color. Manufacturers changed colors and paint base depending on the lowest bidder for that batch, or month, or year.
Gray was the cheapest color because you could make it by dumping in all the paint remnants and a squirt or two of color to get some "consistent" hue.
Make your lathe the color that floats your boat. Be unique. Enjoy your toy.
Polka dots are fun, too, especially for lathes sitting on a cabinet.
Food for thought. My 1929 SB 9” Junior original color was black (japanning) with white color inside the bed ways (nice contrast while viewing your work). I kept all the japanning, simply top coated with semi gloss black. Your lathe, your color…..all the the restored machines in my shop are dark gray, the SB is my exception. Sent by my iPhone On Jul 26, 2023, at 2:28 PM, E A <b-arch@...> wrote:
? This is an extremely close match to paint that had been hidden by the gear box since 1942... Went on nicely as well...
But as others have said, the color formulas changed over ……..
--
Jim B
|
Re: First lathe rebuild questions
Then there is this option.?
 Don’t worry it’s from Photoshop.?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Jul 26, 2023, at 4:03 PM, Andrei <calciu1@...> wrote:
?
Making mine bright yellow, so I can see easily any things I might drop.
Don't get hung up on color. Manufacturers changed colors and paint base depending on the lowest bidder for that batch, or month, or year.
Gray was the cheapest color because you could make it by dumping in all the paint remnants and a squirt or two of color to get some "consistent" hue.
Make your lathe the color that floats your boat. Be unique. Enjoy your toy.?
Polka dots are fun, too, especially for lathes sitting on a cabinet.?
Food for thought. ?My 1929 SB 9” Junior original color was black (japanning) with white color inside the bed ways (nice contrast while viewing your work). ?I kept all the japanning, simply top coated with semi gloss black. ? Your lathe, your
color…..all the the restored machines in my shop are dark gray, the SB is my exception. ?
Sent by my iPhone
On Jul 26, 2023, at 2:28 PM, E A <b-arch@...> wrote:
?
This is an extremely close match to paint that had been hidden by the gear box since 1942... Went on nicely as well...
But as others have said, the color formulas changed over ……..
--
Jim B
|
Re: First lathe rebuild questions
Making mine bright yellow, so I can see easily any things I might drop.
Don't get hung up on color. Manufacturers changed colors and paint base depending on the lowest bidder for that batch, or month, or year.
Gray was the cheapest color because you could make it by dumping in all the paint remnants and a squirt or two of color to get some "consistent" hue.
Make your lathe the color that floats your boat. Be unique. Enjoy your toy.?
Polka dots are fun, too, especially for lathes sitting on a cabinet.?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Food for thought. ?My 1929 SB 9” Junior original color was black (japanning) with white color inside the bed ways (nice contrast while viewing your work). ?I kept all the japanning, simply top coated with semi gloss black. ? Your lathe, your
color…..all the the restored machines in my shop are dark gray, the SB is my exception. ?
Sent by my iPhone
On Jul 26, 2023, at 2:28 PM, E A <b-arch@...> wrote:
?
This is an extremely close match to paint that had been hidden by the gear box since 1942... Went on nicely as well...
But as others have said, the color formulas changed over ……..
|
Re: First lathe rebuild questions
Food for thought. ?My 1929 SB 9” Junior original color was black (japanning) with white color inside the bed ways (nice contrast while viewing your work). ?I kept all the japanning, simply top coated with semi gloss black. ? Your lathe, your color…..all the the restored machines in my shop are dark gray, the SB is my exception. ? Sent by my iPhone
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Jul 26, 2023, at 2:28 PM, E A <b-arch@...> wrote:
?
This is an extremely close match to paint that had been hidden by the gear box since 1942... Went on nicely as well...
But as others have said, the color formulas changed over …….. _._,_._,_
|
Re: First lathe rebuild questions
I am as guilty as most of you in admitting my love of my heavy 10
and I understand the pride and concern for originality that many
of us share.? Heck, I even love my Logan and I still use flat
leather belts! ?? Nevertheless, the O'Brien brothers who founded
SBL set out to build rugged, accurate, reliable machine tools.? I
think they may be looking down from some cosmic machine shop,
sipping Irish whiskey and wondering how their creations have
become objects d' art.
With tongue in cheek,
Jack Reynolds
On 7/26/2023 3:12 PM, Jack Reynolds via
groups.io wrote:
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Show quoted text
I don't know if anyone really knows how diligent South Bend was
over it's history with color match and consistency.? God only
knows what went on during the war years and as long as SB was
building lathes there were probably multiple cost savings
involving paint suppliers.? One of the other variables is the
history of the individual machine.? Depending on how much crud
was allowed to accumulate and what solvents and cleaners were
used to remove it I am sure that a lot of the surviving machines
vary in color significantly.? In the case of my heavy 10, which
I know has never been painted, the color tends toward green as
much as gray.? You may want to concern yourself more with the
quality and user friendliness of the paint you choose than how
closely it matches someone else's lathe.? Just my two cents.
On 7/26/2023 11:57 AM, Mike Poore
wrote:
- I used the Sherwin-Williams mix and was not impressed. It
looked to me almost identical to the Rust-oleum oil based
Smoke Gray that I used on another machine. I admit to being
a bad judge of color. I have read, but cannot say with
certainty, that there is no proper SBL gray because of
variations year to year. I can say that I have seen multiple
SBL models that were supposedly sporting original paint and
looked different. One unanswered question for me is how age
affects the original color of 80 year old paint and if you
color match old paint are you really matching the original
color.
|
Re: First lathe rebuild questions
This is an extremely close match to paint that had been hidden by the gear box since 1942... Went on nicely as well...
But as others have said, the color formulas changed over the years.
Erik A
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
I don't know if anyone really knows how diligent South Bend was over it's history with color match and consistency.? God only knows what went on during the war years and as long as SB was building lathes there were probably multiple cost savings involving
paint suppliers.? One of the other variables is the history of the individual machine.? Depending on how much crud was allowed to accumulate and what solvents and cleaners were used to remove it I am sure that a lot of the surviving machines vary in color
significantly.? In the case of my heavy 10, which I know has never been painted, the color tends toward green as much as gray.? You may want to concern yourself more with the quality and user friendliness of the paint you choose than how closely it matches
someone else's lathe.? Just my two cents.
On 7/26/2023 11:57 AM, Mike Poore wrote:
- I used the Sherwin-Williams mix and was not impressed. It looked to me almost identical to the Rust-oleum oil based Smoke Gray that I used on another machine. I admit to being a bad judge of color. I have read, but cannot say with certainty, that there
is no proper SBL gray because of variations year to year. I can say that I have seen multiple SBL models that were supposedly sporting original paint and looked different. One unanswered question for me is how age affects the original color of 80 year old
paint and if you color match old paint are you really matching the original color.
|
Re: First lathe rebuild questions
I don't know if anyone really knows how diligent South Bend was
over it's history with color match and consistency.? God only
knows what went on during the war years and as long as SB was
building lathes there were probably multiple cost savings
involving paint suppliers.? One of the other variables is the
history of the individual machine.? Depending on how much crud was
allowed to accumulate and what solvents and cleaners were used to
remove it I am sure that a lot of the surviving machines vary in
color significantly.? In the case of my heavy 10, which I know has
never been painted, the color tends toward green as much as gray.?
You may want to concern yourself more with the quality and user
friendliness of the paint you choose than how closely it matches
someone else's lathe.? Just my two cents.
On 7/26/2023 11:57 AM, Mike Poore
wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
- I used the Sherwin-Williams mix and was not impressed. It
looked to me almost identical to the Rust-oleum oil based
Smoke Gray that I used on another machine. I admit to being a
bad judge of color. I have read, but cannot say with
certainty, that there is no proper SBL gray because of
variations year to year. I can say that I have seen multiple
SBL models that were supposedly sporting original paint and
looked different. One unanswered question for me is how age
affects the original color of 80 year old paint and if you
color match old paint are you really matching the original
color.
|
Re: First lathe rebuild questions
- Not familiar with the GE motor numbers. You need to determine
if it is single or three phase first. Many motors have a diagram
on the case.
- I bought that kit and used it to rebuild a 9A. The book is
really well done. It will be a big help. The felts fit as they
should.
- I used the Sherwin-Williams mix and was not impressed. It
looked to me almost identical to the Rust-oleum oil based Smoke
Gray that I used on another machine. I admit to being a bad
judge of color. I have read, but cannot say with certainty, that
there is no proper SBL gray because of variations year to year.
I can say that I have seen multiple SBL models that were
supposedly sporting original paint and looked different. One
unanswered question for me is how age affects the original color
of 80 year old paint and if you color match old paint are you
really matching the original color?
On 7/25/2023 5:50 PM, Jefferson wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
I just bought my first lathe (9" 744 A 167045) and I have some
questions. It is covered with surface rust, and the motor has been
disconnected.
1) Does anyone have a wiring diagram to connect the motor (GE
5kc63ab776) to the barrel switch and a power cord?
2) Is the ILION rebuild kit and "Guide to Renovating" (Amazon $80)
the way I should proceed?
3) What gray (It was originally gray right?) brush-able paint
would you recommend?
Thanks in advance,
|
Re: First lathe rebuild questions
The ILION Book and felt kit is a great start. As well as their lube kit.? Dennis
via Moto Z3
716-720-0940 -- Dennis western NY, USA
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Re: First lathe rebuild questions
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Here is my copy I have in my folder. Maybe it is better. This was from someone else posted here.
?
?
?
Could not read the label. Too fuzzy. Can you share the link to the original image?
yea , that's? it , that's the ticket !
animal
On 7/25/23 7:22 PM, Bob Kellermann via groups.io wrote:
?
Join up over here , they have a SOuth Bend lathe specific form . In either the Sticky topic or the one below it for links should have a picture of the label of a can of paint mixed up at Sherwin Williams . The whole paint recipe is on the label in the pic
. I used it when I redid my 9A . Great paint I went to a art store & bought some real good paint brushes to use & the paint is self leveling . I made the mistake of putting mine back together after a couple of days . When & if I ever decide to do it again
I'll let it sit & harden for a couple of weeks . If you can't find the pic just ask & someone will pipe up with the info of where it's at . Great forum probably a couple thousand years of South Bend lathe experience there .
good luck , & remember pictures or it never happened .
animal
?
On 7/25/23 2:50 PM, Jefferson wrote:
I just bought my first lathe (9" 744 A 167045) and I have some questions. It is covered with surface rust, and the motor has been disconnected.
1) Does anyone have a wiring diagram to connect the motor (GE 5kc63ab776) to the barrel switch and a power cord?
2) Is the ILION rebuild kit and "Guide to Renovating" (Amazon $80) the way I should proceed?
3) What gray (It was originally gray right?) brush-able paint would you recommend?
Thanks in advance,
|
Re: First lathe rebuild questions
Here is my copy I have in my folder. Maybe it is better. This was from someone else posted here. ? ?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] < [email protected]> On Behalf Of Andrei Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2023 12:06 AM To: [email protected]Subject: Re: [SouthBendLathe] First lathe rebuild questions ? Could not read the label. Too fuzzy. Can you share the link to the original image?
yea , that's? it , that's the ticket ! animal On 7/25/23 7:22 PM, Bob Kellermann via groups.io wrote: 
? Join up over here , they have a SOuth Bend lathe specific form . In either the Sticky topic or the one below it for links should have a picture of the label of a can of paint mixed up at Sherwin Williams . The whole paint recipe is on the label in the pic . I used it when I redid my 9A . Great paint I went to a art store & bought some real good paint brushes to use & the paint is self leveling . I made the mistake of putting mine back together after a couple of days . When & if I ever decide to do it again I'll let it sit & harden for a couple of weeks . If you can't find the pic just ask & someone will pipe up with the info of where it's at . Great forum probably a couple thousand years of South Bend lathe experience there . good luck , & remember pictures or it never happened . animal ? On 7/25/23 2:50 PM, Jefferson wrote: I just bought my first lathe (9" 744 A 167045) and I have some questions. It is covered with surface rust, and the motor has been disconnected.
1) Does anyone have a wiring diagram to connect the motor (GE 5kc63ab776) to the barrel switch and a power cord?
2) Is the ILION rebuild kit and "Guide to Renovating" (Amazon $80) the way I should proceed?
3) What gray (It was originally gray right?) brush-able paint would you recommend?
Thanks in advance,
|
Re: First lathe rebuild questions
Could not read the label. Too fuzzy. Can you share the link to the original image?
Get
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
yea , that's? it , that's the ticket !
animal
On 7/25/23 7:22 PM, Bob Kellermann via groups.io wrote:
?
Join up over here , they have a SOuth Bend lathe specific form . In either the Sticky topic or the one below it for links should have a picture of the label of a can of paint mixed up at Sherwin Williams . The whole paint recipe is on the label in the pic
. I used it when I redid my 9A . Great paint I went to a art store & bought some real good paint brushes to use & the paint is self leveling . I made the mistake of putting mine back together after a couple of days . When & if I ever decide to do it again
I'll let it sit & harden for a couple of weeks . If you can't find the pic just ask & someone will pipe up with the info of where it's at . Great forum probably a couple thousand years of South Bend lathe experience there .
good luck , & remember pictures or it never happened .
animal
On 7/25/23 2:50 PM, Jefferson wrote:
I just bought my first lathe (9" 744 A 167045) and I have some questions. It is covered with surface rust, and the motor has been disconnected.
1) Does anyone have a wiring diagram to connect the motor (GE 5kc63ab776) to the barrel switch and a power cord?
2) Is the ILION rebuild kit and "Guide to Renovating" (Amazon $80) the way I should proceed?
3) What gray (It was originally gray right?) brush-able paint would you recommend?
Thanks in advance,
|
Greg
Jim_B
Carl Bukowsky
ww_big_al
