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Re: differences between scale and hi-rail

 

Just for grins...

Two Pacific Rail Shops boxcars: One Hi|Rail. the other Scale.

Rich G(ajnak)


Re: Vintage cars in 1/64

 

Avoid Johnny Lightning cars. ?All that i have seen are undersize. ?Their pickups measure to be correct 1/64. ?
These cars are typically accurate 1/64:
M2
Auto World
Greenlight


Sent from my Tardis

--
Ted Larson
trainweb.org/mhrr/??????? --------??????? NASG.org??????? --------???????
GN in 1965


Re: differences between scale and hi-rail

 

On Sat, Jul 6, 2024 at 07:00 PM, Chris Fauxturkey wrote:
Are MTH S models for instance plenty good enough for the discriminating modeler?
Well, here's a comparison of the MTH F3 vs. the SHS F7.? And yes, the long warbonnet and lack of stainless steel on the MTH model is correct for that particular class of Santa Fe F3's.

Rich G(ajnak)


Re: d00ifferences between scale and hi-rail

 

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With one exception: the AM locomotives come in either scale or AF-compatible, and of those, either DC or AC.? As with the older Weaver diesels in O scale, it is still possible to convert the AF-type drives to DC scale but more work than converting the SHS diesels.? The SHS?
2-8-0 comes as one or the other and conversion is pretty much more trouble than it is worth.? Some of the earlier brass imports (never RRM)?
were also available as AF-type wheels and wiring, but not too many of them; scale conversion would be also not much fun.
Jace Kahn

.


From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Chris Fauxturkey via groups.io <skogkatt007@...>
Sent: Saturday, July 6, 2024 8:28 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [S-Scale] differences between scale and hi-rail
?
Let me repjrase the question this way. If you buy an AM, SHS, whatever brand, and it specifically says "hi-rail" on the box. What seems clear to me is the wheelsets and couplers have to be replaced. Anything else? Are hi-rail cars offered by American models and whoever else over the last 40 years say simply their scale cars with hi-rail wheels and couplers? Are the tricks themselves essentially scale?


Re: differences between scale and hi-rail

 

Chris, to answer your specific question, MTH never designed anything they produced; all of their designs were inherited from the previous owner of the line (S Helper Service). Even the fishbelly-side hopper car which was first produced by MTH had been designed and tooled by SHS, just not produced because the Chinese manufacturer went out of business. SHS was led by S scale hobbyists who were fastidious in their designs; you can't do any better with RTR cars. MTH took no shortcuts in reproducing them.

I should add, however, that MTH did completely re-design?the interior electronics for the diesel locomotives that they produced. I have heard some horror stories in terms of operation, although the two I bought and have used for several years have operated flawlessly. But based on what I have heard, I would not buy an MTH locomotive without a test run. The electronics are designed to run on AC, DC, DCC, or the MTH proprietary system.?

The current owner of the line, ScaleTrains, has not yet produced any locomotives but their rolling stock is up to the original SHS standards as well, and the boxes include their scale wheels as well as the hirail wheels that are actually installed on the models.

Sorry you don't have enough time off to justify a trip to the convention. You could see a lot of this with your own eyes if you were able to come, talk to many of us, and see equipment operate on the three layouts that will be there. S scale has always been largely a mail order scale; only a few large or enlightened hobby shops have stocked it over the decades, and many of them are disappearing anyway, sadly enough.

Hope this helps.

Jim Whipple, NASG President

On Sat, Jul 6, 2024 at 10:00?PM Chris Fauxturkey via <skogkatt007=[email protected]> wrote:
So it's been over 10 years when I first took a look at S scale. Never had any interest in Flyer, Marx, whatever. I had issues of S Gaugian I think it was called, and S/Sn3 Modeler. Both now defunct I think sadly. I got the impressiom S scalers were absolute sticklers for detail and dimension. If a particular car rode a scale inch too low (admittedly an unnecessary discrepancy, .015". Or did I just pick up some bad habits???). Now I see ample talk of MTH and other make equipment. Admittedly Lionel, Williams, MTH has come a considerable way in the direction of prototypical fidelity. But, and I also have an interest in 1:48, I look at Bachmann/Williams, MTH diesels and say no way. Not interested. To each his own. But a company like Atlas makes models that IMO are head and shoulders above that other stuff.

?But am I missing something? Are MTH S models for instance plenty good enough for the discriminating modeler? Not many shops around here (Ocean county NJ) that even sell the stuff. Seems éverything is r/c and Warhammer. Can't get a close up look.


Re: differences between scale and hi-rail

 

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Mike Wolf of MTH took over the S Helper line after its original owners decided they needed to retire (fortified in that decision by corporate stupidity from the owners of the Chinese factory that produced its products).? MTH S scale is no different from SHS except for some of the road names and the electronics in the switchers and F units.? Scale Trains has now bought the S scale assets of MTH.

As I have been in O scale considerably longer than I have been in S, I'd say you are too hasty in condemning the MTH line; all of their Premier line is full-scale (and quite a bit even of their RailKing).? Not only did MTH offer some of its locomotives as two-rail early on, but after a period of not doing so, resumed two-rail offerings.? During its last years, they offered two-rail conversion kits for locomotives and cars, and the cars had Kadee coupler mounts for easy conversion.? Quite a bit of the Lionel line made in China is also full scale, making conversion often very straightforward.

Scale fidelity is a goal for almost everyone on this list; most of the models entered in the convention contests are as good as anything done in any scale.? Several of the members of this list are active in the RP movement and display their work at regional meets.

Sadly, the number of bricks-and-mortar hobby shops has been rapidly diminishing, and of those left, even fewer carry any S scale.? Even worse, several of the major mail order/online suppliers for S scale have closed their doors in the past few years, usually from death or retirement.? Those wanting to buy S scale need to order direct from the manufacturer where possible or find what they need at S scale shows, the NASG convention, ebay, or this list.

Jace Kahn



From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Chris Fauxturkey via groups.io <skogkatt007@...>
Sent: Saturday, July 6, 2024 10:00 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [S-Scale] differences between scale and hi-rail
?
So it's been over 10 years when I first took a look at S scale. Never had any interest in Flyer, Marx, whatever. I had issues of S Gaugian I think it was called, and S/Sn3 Modeler. Both now defunct I think sadly. I got the impressiom S scalers were absolute sticklers for detail and dimension. If a particular car rode a scale inch too low (admittedly an unnecessary discrepancy, .015". Or did I just pick up some bad habits???). Now I see ample talk of MTH and other make equipment. Admittedly Lionel, Williams, MTH has come a considerable way in the direction of prototypical fidelity. But, and I also have an interest in 1:48, I look at Bachmann/Williams, MTH diesels and say no way. Not interested. To each his own. But a company like Atlas makes models that IMO are head and shoulders above that other stuff.

?But am I missing something? Are MTH S models for instance plenty good enough for the discriminating modeler? Not many shops around here (Ocean county NJ) that even sell the stuff. Seems éverything is r/c and Warhammer. Can't get a close up look.


Re: differences between scale and hi-rail

 

So it's been over 10 years when I first took a look at S scale. Never had any interest in Flyer, Marx, whatever. I had issues of S Gaugian I think it was called, and S/Sn3 Modeler. Both now defunct I think sadly. I got the impressiom S scalers were absolute sticklers for detail and dimension. If a particular car rode a scale inch too low (admittedly an unnecessary discrepancy, .015". Or did I just pick up some bad habits???). Now I see ample talk of MTH and other make equipment. Admittedly Lionel, Williams, MTH has come a considerable way in the direction of prototypical fidelity. But, and I also have an interest in 1:48, I look at Bachmann/Williams, MTH diesels and say no way. Not interested. To each his own. But a company like Atlas makes models that IMO are head and shoulders above that other stuff.

?But am I missing something? Are MTH S models for instance plenty good enough for the discriminating modeler? Not many shops around here (Ocean county NJ) that even sell the stuff. Seems éverything is r/c and Warhammer. Can't get a close up look.


Re: differences between scale and hi-rail

 

Chris,

I believe the answer to your question is that the ONLY differences between AM and SHS/MTH/Scale Trains hi-rail vs scale cars are the wheelsets and the couplers.? ?The 'bodies' of the cars are identical with same level of detail.? ?Both these manufacturers also have Kadee mounting pads molded into their car body so once the trucks are removed to remove the AF-compatible coupler, installing a Kadee or equivalent is easy.? Then, its a simple matter to swap out the hi-rail wheelsets for scale ones.? ?One of the things that is often not understood by those new to S from other scales is that AM and SHS/MTH/Scale Trains both use the same sprung truck side frames for for both scale and hi-rail wheels.? ?So if you buy a hi-rail car, you really don't need to replace the complete trucks...only the wheelsets.?

The attached is from a presentation I've given to NMRA meetings explaining the challenges and opportunities of modeling in S.? It shows a 'hi-rail' car in the foreground and the Kadee pad is visible in the car in the back.? The hi-rail wheels are easily 'popped out' of the truck and the scale wheels installed.

'Hope that's helpful!

Brooks


Re: differences between scale and hi-rail

 

Yes. Just replace the wheels and couplers. That's all I usually do.


On Sat, Jul 6, 2024, 7:28 PM Chris Fauxturkey via <skogkatt007=[email protected]> wrote:
Let me repjrase the question this way. If you buy an AM, SHS, whatever brand, and it specifically says "hi-rail" on the box. What seems clear to me is the wheelsets and couplers have to be replaced. Anything else? Are hi-rail cars offered by American models and whoever else over the last 40 years say simply their scale cars with hi-rail wheels and couplers? Are the tricks themselves essentially scale?


Re: differences between scale and hi-rail

 

Let me repjrase the question this way. If you buy an AM, SHS, whatever brand, and it specifically says "hi-rail" on the box. What seems clear to me is the wheelsets and couplers have to be replaced. Anything else? Are hi-rail cars offered by American models and whoever else over the last 40 years say simply their scale cars with hi-rail wheels and couplers? Are the tricks themselves essentially scale?


Re: differences between scale and hi-rail

 

On Sat, Jul 6, 2024 at 02:42 PM, Hans von Draminski wrote:
Having never bought AM freight cars new I cannot tell if they come with scale wheels. The ones I bought used had scale wheels on them.
With regards to new American Models products, one has to specify HiRail or Scale when ordering.? They will build it either way.? (I believe they build to order nowadays.) The same is true for their locomotives.

In AM's early days couplers were not included on scale cars.? Nowadays they mount their "SnapLock" dummy coupler on scale cars.

Rich G(ajnak)


Re: Vintage cars in 1/64

 

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Hans,? At one time Don Heimberger (S Gaugian) had a photo contest in conjunction with Erthl.? I won second place and received dozens of 'sane' versions of their cars plus modified hot rods (one goes a long way), & construction equipment. Frank Titman won 1st place. ? The hot rods were given to neighborhood kids while I changed out the chrome wheels on the normal stuff.? Later on I used a couple of crawler Cats on the layout, then gave away the rest to Toys For Tots for Christmas.?
Today the vehicles have gotten much better--I put a couple my newer purchases on this list--just need some dust..? The costs for the larger 18 Wheeler's have now become expensive but you get what you pay for too!? My layout really doesn't have room for them either, so I'm happy where I'm at.

Bob Werre
PhotoTraxx

Hello to all. When I watch videos about S scale layouts I see some beautiful model cars crowding the streets. A search in the bay will get me not that many results when looking for classics of the 1950ies and 60ies. I was scanning the portfolios of Greenlight and Johnny Lightning but it seems there are much more Muscle Cars from the Seventies then Oldies from the Golden Era after WW II. Am I missing something? Or am I just too late and a lot of what I look for is just out of print yet?
The last car I got was a Mercury from the early Fifties in Canary Yellow, by the way...

Greetings from the heart of Football Sadness, Hans



Re: Vintage cars in 1/64

 

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Check John Agnew's RailMaster website; he has had a large variety of transition era trucks/lorries and cars and may still have some.

Jace Kahn



From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Gaylord Gill <gcgill@...>
Sent: Saturday, July 6, 2024 7:34 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [S-Scale] Vintage cars in 1/64
?
Grü?e, Hans

Unfortunately, you might be a bit late for finding a lot of choices from that era.? Here in the States we are able to walk into stores such as WalMart and find several 1:64 diecast models on the shelves.? But over the past three decades I have noticed a shift, with most vehicles formerly dating back to the '40's and now back only to the '70's.

But there are still products available.? Keep searching the internet -- another big distributor is 3000Toys.com? Also, many of us old-timers have stock-piled more vehicles than we need, so try posting specific requests to this list.? Just state the range of years and vehicle models you're interested in, and mention if there are particular pieces you don't want.

By the way, when you refer to "Football" Sadness, I think most of us have to translate the term to "soccer."? Sorry for Germany's loss.

Gaylord Gill
Highland, MIchigan

.


Re: New Reading

 

These two AM GP9's masquerading as RDG GP7's are from the same source as Bill's two RS3's and GP35.
As Bill indicated a little rough around the edges but with some work this past two weeks, presentable.
The tank car is a converted AF unit from a while back.
Had not planned on getting any more engines.....? well you guys know how that goes.

Hugh
?


Re: Vintage cars in 1/64

 

Grü?e, Hans

Unfortunately, you might be a bit late for finding a lot of choices from that era.? Here in the States we are able to walk into stores such as WalMart and find several 1:64 diecast models on the shelves.? But over the past three decades I have noticed a shift, with most vehicles formerly dating back to the '40's and now back only to the '70's.

But there are still products available.? Keep searching the internet -- another big distributor is 3000Toys.com? Also, many of us old-timers have stock-piled more vehicles than we need, so try posting specific requests to this list.? Just state the range of years and vehicle models you're interested in, and mention if there are particular pieces you don't want.

By the way, when you refer to "Football" Sadness, I think most of us have to translate the term to "soccer."? Sorry for Germany's loss.

Gaylord Gill
Highland, MIchigan

.


Re: Vintage cars in 1/64

 

One of our club members got 40's era cars from?

Nice looking cars but too old for?me.

Ken G,
SMSG


On Sat, Jul 6, 2024 at 7:00?PM Peter Vanvliet via <peter=[email protected]> wrote:
Hi Hans,

Sometimes doing "generic" searches will not yield satisfactory results. It might be helpful if you really narrow-down your search to a specific model. Since you are looking for cars from specific years, I would suggest looking at this listing on the NASG web site:



You can then pick a year, select a model make, and then see which manufacturer created that car. Where available, I have listed at least one of the manufacturer's model IDs (number, PLU, SKU, etc.), so those can be helpful when doing searches.

So, instead of searching for "1950s cars" and not finding much, you can search for, for example, "Racing Champions 1951 Chevrolet Corvair RC004", and then get a listing of companies that might still have that model in their inventory.

Use the NASG web site to find out what is, or was, available, and then do your searches using that specific information.

You may also want to use a generic search engine, such as Google, DuckDuckGo, Bing, Yandex, etc. to do your searches, rather than doing a search specifically on the eBay's site only. These generic search engines will still list eBay entries, but they will also list manufacturers' web sites (some do sell directly) and/or other vendor web sites that sell diecast vehicles. In other words, instead of limiting your search to just eBay, now you can search the entire Internet for the model that you are interested in, and you will likely have better results.

I hope this helps,
- Peter.



On 07/06/2024 04:59 PM, Hans von Draminski via wrote:
Hello to all. When I watch videos about S scale layouts I see some beautiful model cars crowding the streets. A search in the bay will get me not that many results when looking for classics of the 1950ies and 60ies. I was scanning the portfolios of Greenlight and Johnny Lightning but it seems there are much more Muscle Cars from the Seventies then Oldies from the Golden Era after WW II. Am I missing something? Or am I just too late and a lot of what I look for is just out of print yet?
The last car I got was a Mercury from the early Fifties in Canary Yellow, by the way...

Greetings from the heart of Football Sadness, Hans

-- 
Peter Vanvliet (info@...)
owner, Fourth Ray Software
Houston, Texas

 (personal web site)


Re: Vintage cars in 1/64

 

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Hi Hans,

Sometimes doing "generic" searches will not yield satisfactory results. It might be helpful if you really narrow-down your search to a specific model. Since you are looking for cars from specific years, I would suggest looking at this listing on the NASG web site:



You can then pick a year, select a model make, and then see which manufacturer created that car. Where available, I have listed at least one of the manufacturer's model IDs (number, PLU, SKU, etc.), so those can be helpful when doing searches.

So, instead of searching for "1950s cars" and not finding much, you can search for, for example, "Racing Champions 1951 Chevrolet Corvair RC004", and then get a listing of companies that might still have that model in their inventory.

Use the NASG web site to find out what is, or was, available, and then do your searches using that specific information.

You may also want to use a generic search engine, such as Google, DuckDuckGo, Bing, Yandex, etc. to do your searches, rather than doing a search specifically on the eBay's site only. These generic search engines will still list eBay entries, but they will also list manufacturers' web sites (some do sell directly) and/or other vendor web sites that sell diecast vehicles. In other words, instead of limiting your search to just eBay, now you can search the entire Internet for the model that you are interested in, and you will likely have better results.

I hope this helps,
- Peter.



On 07/06/2024 04:59 PM, Hans von Draminski via groups.io wrote:
Hello to all. When I watch videos about S scale layouts I see some beautiful model cars crowding the streets. A search in the bay will get me not that many results when looking for classics of the 1950ies and 60ies. I was scanning the portfolios of Greenlight and Johnny Lightning but it seems there are much more Muscle Cars from the Seventies then Oldies from the Golden Era after WW II. Am I missing something? Or am I just too late and a lot of what I look for is just out of print yet?
The last car I got was a Mercury from the early Fifties in Canary Yellow, by the way...

Greetings from the heart of Football Sadness, Hans

-- 
Peter Vanvliet (info@...)
owner, Fourth Ray Software
Houston, Texas

 (personal web site)


Re: Vintage cars in 1/64

 

? ? Try that.

George Courtney


EMD E7 A-B-A diesel lashup (perfect nose)

 

Gents........

Starting life as an Overland bare brass beauty, this diesel set had its distorted misshaped metal noses removed in our plastic surgery laboratory.? Replacing them was a vastly improved American Models plastic nose with properly shaped windows and nose contours.? As a result, I believe this is the only E7 in the S scale world with a correct and proper nose.? Impressed?

In addition, each unit has paint, decals, weathering, crew, decoder (SOUND!), windows and couplers.? What else could you want?? Yes, working diaphragms are included.? The Tsunami 2 decoder has the 2-prime-mover sounds proper for an E7 or any other E-unit.? ?Note the large grille-like openings on the roof.? Beneath those openings is a large speaker aimed toward the stars.? The sound is truly amazing !!!!??

As usual, make your best reasonable offer and this E7 set can be moving toward your shops next week.? A most beautiful engine to pull your crack passenger train.? Or being test run on a local freight after a major shopping overhaul.? Either way is correct.

Email preferred.? Phone works.? ? ? ?Loizeaux? aht? ?SBC //? Global? ? daht? ?net? ? ? ? ? ?1-650-962-1577

Thanks........Ed L.



--
Ed Loizeaux
Los Altos, CA


My parts

 

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Hans

?

I did not get a American Models RS11 until maybe a year ago so I did not make anything for it. You must have missed that Shapeways closed forever this week.

?

Thank You,
Bill Lane

Modeling the Mighty Pennsy, PRSL & Reading in 1957 in S Scale since 1987

See my finished models at:

Look at what has been made in PRR in S Scale!

?

See my layout progress at:



Join the Pennsylvania Reading Seashore Lines Historical Society
It's FREE to join!??
Preserving The Memory Of The PRSL

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