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Date

Re: KD122 workshop and breakdown timeline

 

What epoxy brand? I guess propagation through the plywood will be the main consideration. We have various options ($400-600 per 30kg) here in Australia plus I could import Araldite for some extra $$$ if need perfection. Hot weather also very helpful to get it done right.


Re: KD122 workshop and breakdown timeline

 

Yes Bernd we already have all the material available I finish the Duo 900 and go to Sicily to build the second KD 122
.I have a big caponnone at my disposal 150m from the sea the boat will be all finished in this structure.
A photo of all the epoxy, fiber and other materials ...


Re: KD122 workshop and breakdown timeline

 

Domenico
You are ready to go to Sicily to build the next KD 122? Terrible with the fires here. Any changes.? Because of this.
It is a strange year. Success with the DUO 900

Ciao Bernd


Re: Updated album CATAPROA, Harald, Germany #photo-notice

 

Hi Philip

You have done very interesting things. Have you some more photos from our boat and sail. There are now more Cataproas under construction. Your new designed and built
sail can be an inspiration for other Cataproa owners. I understand what you have done, but for newcomers it can be difficult to understand. Have you, or can you make
some photos. We do not expect masterpieces of photos or, if you can, videos. But this would help greatly.

Cheers
Bernd

N.B.: Out of personal reasons, I can not sail this year with my Cataproa?


Re: Updated album CATAPROA, Harald, Germany #photo-notice

 

Hi Bernd, Hi Philip,

thank you for the ideas and your experience, good to read, that the 12 qm will work, there was a Hobie Cat 16 at Denmark, faster than my Cataproa:)

I'm looking forward to the next stronger winds.

Cheers,

Harald


Re: Updated album CATAPROA, Harald, Germany #photo-notice

 

Herald,?
Yes I have sailed in strong winds on the lake and the sea. My sail is bigger 12 sq m and I have added reefing. I attach as per Bernds design. However I have two top fastening points one for reefed and one for unreefed. These are positioned so that the boom hangs horizontal. I added a strap with velcro to the mast at the boom. I mostly keep my mast windward of the sail for efficiency. So I undo the velcro strap and pull back and pass the boom at the rear of the mast, then reapply the velcro strap to keep the boom at the mast. Where the spar and the boom meet I tied a rope that I tie to the mast to control the forward meeting point again to keep the boom horizontal. I do not mess wit this line when tacking and sailing I tie it once and then only undo when finished or reef.
When the boat become difficult to control i drop the sail into the boat. the boat being a cat is then very stable and will drift very slowly. Then I use my time to tie in the reef , move the top position and rehoist make the boom horizontal and sail on. My boat sail very well when reefed.

Cheers
Philip Malan

On Sunday, 1 August 2021, 17:45:38 SAST, Bernd Kohler <ikarus342000@...> wrote:


Its me
Harald
Go to the photos from Hans. He has a Little Tri. Same rig as on the Cataproa.?Little Trimaran Hans.
He is a very keen and experienced sailor and has made many good extras on his boat and rig.
He uses a Dyneema loop to hold the jard to the mast. A brail rope to scandalize the sail in a quick way and a zipper
reef system. I sailed the boat without a reef on the Med without any problem
Cheers
Bernd?


Re: KD122 workshop and breakdown timeline

 

As far as Bernd the Duo 900 is missing I am working on the preparation of the hull connection pipes, base for the mast and etc.
The problem was the strong heat of June and July 2021 and I was unable to work full time with the last resin and stucco works ....
The hulls are ready to be painted but we hope we try the tubes on the boat (just to be sure everything is ok) and diving boards.
After I take everything apart and paint the hulls ;-)
Bye


Re: KD122 workshop and breakdown timeline

 

Thank you Domenico

for passing your thought about the construction of the

KD 122. Always best, from hear from the builder self.

How far is the DUO 900?

Ciao Bernd?


Re: KD122 workshop and breakdown timeline

 

I confirm this is a good solution for times and costs.
The boat is ready for the final part of the assembly.
Bye


Re: KD122 workshop and breakdown timeline

 

?i I built the KD 122 Italy for a customer.
The boat is very nice and strong but to build you need at least a 14x10 shed to be able to see the sanding phases when the boat is assembled.
I heated the shed with a pellet stove to work the epoxy resin because I was in northern Italy in the cold season.
I have delegated the KD 122 pantry to a carpentry shop to cut all the douglas strips, so you take less time and have a clean job.
I had the bulkheads cut in CNC but you can also do it by hand following the table, there are only 16 bulkheads ....
The boat can be easily built with the mast central or A-frame.
So it really depends on your manual skills and the time at your disposal.
In October I will build the second KD 122 Italy in southern Italy where in the cold season it does not drop below 12 degrees and I think that in 6 months, to finish the whole boat (also considering my experience of the first KD 122) working every day full time. which is not happening now with the KD Duo 900 for various commitments ...
We are in the process of building the A-Frame mast out of red cedar battens.
here you can see all the photos of the KD 122 Italy
Bye




/g/K-designs-Multihull-Sailboats/album?id=132344


Re: KD122 workshop and breakdown timeline

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Hi,

as a reminder to all new prospective KD122 builders: should anyone be willing to cut in half building time, I am selling ready (laminated, faired and antifouled) hulls and ready-to-assemble plywood parts. Everything is available for a visit and inspection 60km from Venice airport.

Everything has been built by Domenico and inspected by Bernd


Il 01/08/21 22:24, Bart De Boer ha scritto:

Hello,

Thank you for your answer.?
But I think I did not ask my question correctly. My timeline should not be expressed in hours but in percentages, hence the 'breakdown'.
?
I intend to stick strictly to Bernd's plans. I had already realised that, for various reasons, this is not always a good idea. Your experience confirms this.
?
Getting lost in details' and 'letting go of perfectionism': also for me something to be aware of and I will not work with deadlines. There will be time for friends and family. Going on holiday on the motorbike will continue :-)
Having an idea of the extent of some of the work is important. For example, some parts cannot be done in cold weather and you might have to rearrange the order. Or for some parts, probably the details, I will ask for professional help. Doing everything yourself is not always cheaper, rarely better and usually faster.
?
?
thank you

Bart - Belgium
?
?


Re: KD122 workshop and breakdown timeline

 

Hi Bart, I see you are from Belgium, where are you living?

I'm from Prinsenbeek in the Netherlands, very close to the Belgium border.
The boat I\m building is an extended version of the ECO 75, which is in a sanding, sanding and sanding fase...

If you like to have a view about how to build the "Bernd way" you're welcome.

Groeten, Jack


Re: KD122 workshop and breakdown timeline

 

Hello,

Thank you for your answer.?
But I think I did not ask my question correctly. My timeline should not be expressed in hours but in percentages, hence the 'breakdown'.
?
I intend to stick strictly to Bernd's plans. I had already realised that, for various reasons, this is not always a good idea. Your experience confirms this.
?
Getting lost in details' and 'letting go of perfectionism': also for me something to be aware of and I will not work with deadlines. There will be time for friends and family. Going on holiday on the motorbike will continue :-)
Having an idea of the extent of some of the work is important. For example, some parts cannot be done in cold weather and you might have to rearrange the order. Or for some parts, probably the details, I will ask for professional help. Doing everything yourself is not always cheaper, rarely better and usually faster.
?
?
thank you

Bart - Belgium
?
?


Re: KD122 workshop and breakdown timeline

 

I am always glad to hear about another KD 122 build. We have taken a long time to build our Voyager, but then again we have had some delays. Last year a big tree fell on the barn (this time not in a hurricane) and smashed 1/6th of the building. And other life delays over the past few years. Seven surgeries, another child born, etc. And I don¡¯t work on Sundays or during the evening time when we put the children to bed. In general, I have tried to not sacrifice family time, but there is an ebb and flow to the work as we try to work on it together often. ?My work style has been careful and over-thought until recently, when I have tried to learn from Domenico and others to release perfectionism and just build the boat well. Building the boat itself has not taken very much time. It is all the extras that take most of the time. Including the few places where I have departed from the plans.?

Another thing that slows us down is the winter season. Will cold weather be an issue? Insulating the shed is expensive but nice to have. Our shed is not insulated. I tried to heat small parts of the boat over the winter for a while, but it never worked great. Then I built a small box shed between the bows and insulated it to have a place to precoat panels and make small parts in the cold weather. It works great.?

Building the hulls took four or five months. You could do it faster than us, but that was plenty fast. If you make the three beams before flipping the hulls, you can use your friends who help flip the hulls to also align them and place the beams on. That all went very fast. Making the bridgedeck floor was not too slow either. I think Domenico wanted to use pvc pipe external floor supports instead of making the ply and mahogany ones in the plans. But you have to glass and sand them either way.?

Then I really started slowing down and getting lost in the details. I researched and built composite chainplates, and then composite brackets, stanchions, and cleats. We decided to insulate the hulls and decks. We changed the steering linkage, added aft steps, cockpit seat lockers, a different rig, a different mainsheet attachment, outboard motor sleds, conduits for all systems, and¡­ all of these and others took a lot of thought and added complication. And we were trying to rethink every part as we built instead of just building the boat, then fitting it out. Now we are back to just building, I think. And we hope to finish soon.

I think the construction of the hulls and beams and floor will feel quite fast. Deadlines are not so important for those. ?The slow part comes in the details once the structure is all there.?


Re: KD122 workshop and breakdown timeline

 

Hi

?

I start with workspace. 14X8m is sufficient. Also for tools, material, and space for a good Epoxy ¡°station¡±.

Time to build the boat is a lot more difficult. To start, everybody has a different work speed. Just for the work hours, we have here two very extreme two extremely different examples.

Domenico in Italy builds the boat, almost ready in a year. But attention, just the time-consuming things like fitting out were not done jet.

Patrick in the USA is now for 5 years busy with the boat. Not to forget, he was very unlucky. A hurricane destructed his working space and half of his work.
It would be nice when both of them could reflect on their experience.

I calculated for me, that I could build the boat in around 2800 hours. I am a bit of a maniac when I work. I am very focused as people, who know me could attest.

A? guy, who was building his own recumbent wood bike had this to say ? Don't measure your progress using someone other rules¡°


Very true

Bernd

?


Re: Updated album CATAPROA, Harald, Germany #photo-notice

 

Its me
Harald
Go to the photos from Hans. He has a Little Tri. Same rig as on the Cataproa.?Little Trimaran Hans.
He is a very keen and experienced sailor and has made many good extras on his boat and rig.
He uses a Dyneema loop to hold the jard to the mast. A brail rope to scandalize the sail in a quick way and a zipper
reef system. I sailed the boat without a reef on the Med without any problem
Cheers
Bernd?


KD122 workshop and breakdown timeline

 


Hello, I am looking for a space to build the KD122. What is the best minimum area you need to build it? ok, the boat is 12x6.2 , there is space between the hulls but maybe there are reasons to increase the work area to 14x8 or 16x10.
In the study plan of K122 there is a table of contents on page 18. It would be a good mental aid to know how much time (roughly) each step would take. In projects, time monitoring and working with, in this case soft, deadlines is important. Anyone who can make these estimates?

thank you.
?
?


Re: Updated album CATAPROA, Harald, Germany #photo-notice

 

Hi Philip,

just a short question, have you ever sailed your cataproa in strong winds? If you reef your sail, what about the upper spar? Is there ?a
special method to attach it to the mast?

Thank you,

Harald


Re: Updated album CATAPROA, Harald, Germany #photo-notice

 

Herald, nice Cataproa. I like mine very much and I believe it will become very popular.
Rgards
Philip Malan

On Friday, 30 July 2021, 21:46:48 SAST, Harald Niespor via groups.io <vitamedi62@...> wrote:


Thank you ...and it sails great! There are still some adjustments to do, a kind of sliding mast top ring for example...


Re: Updated album CATAPROA, Harald, Germany #photo-notice

 

Thank you ...and it sails great! There are still some adjustments to do, a kind of sliding mast top ring for example...