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Another new member -- intro

 

I have just been approved as a member of this list and have been busy reading many of the posts to familiarize myself with it. I am not a licensed amateur radio operator but have been a SWL since high school in the Sixties. I "discovered" shortwave when my father let me fiddle with his 1936 RCA Victor 2-band consumer radio which he had purchased new. I found it in my parents' attic ca. 1990 and restored it. I own two Hallicrafters receivers--an almost-functioning S20R which I've owned for a couple of years, and an SX-28 (not an "A" model) which I've owned and used for over 30 years and which failed a couple of months ago. I intend to get both operating before long and will probably have a few questions about them for this list along the way. Looking forward to following many of the topics discussed here.
?
Tom


Re: 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

 

You did not read that right

It is similar but not the Edison system - the one we use is SIMILAR to the Edison split DC system!

A?split-phase?or?single-phase three-wire?system is a type of??distribution. It is the??(AC) equivalent of the original??three-wire??system. Its primary advantage is that, for a given capacity of a distribution system, it saves conductor material over a single-ended single-phase system.

On Fri, Jan 10, 2025 at 10:25?AM Jim Whartenby via <old_radio=[email protected]> wrote:
Yes, it is known as the Edison split phase system, see:
Jim
Logic: Method used to arrive at the wrong conclusion, with confidence.? Murphy


On Friday, January 10, 2025 at 04:12:26 AM CST, Donald J via <djeffarndt=[email protected]> wrote:


"Edison" split phase system? Edison fought the AC system - he was the DC guy

Grounding and where neutral and ground interconnect depends on where the main (i.e. first) panel is located. After that any other panels the grounds and neutrals are separate.

On Mon, Jan 6, 2025 at 10:53?PM Jim Whartenby via <old_radio=[email protected]> wrote:
Isn't the neutral line grounded in the Edison split phase system at the pole mounted transformer and again at the service entrance of the residence?? Every house I have lived in had a copper clad steel rod driven into the ground just below the power meter and the main cutoff switch boxes.
Jim
Logic: Method used to arrive at the wrong conclusion, with confidence.? Murphy


On Monday, January 6, 2025 at 02:57:23 PM CST, don Root <drootofallevil@...> wrote:


Maynard, it was the connection at the pole in my case; anyhow as someone said, the so called “neutral” can not be guaranteed to be at ground level.

?

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Maynard Wright, P. E., W6PAP via
Sent: Monday, January 6, 2025 9:18 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HallicraftersRadios] 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

?

That happened to mine, too, some years ago. Measurements showed that
the neutral lead coming from the power company via the service entrance
had a loose connection which the power guys fixed quickly once they arrived.

73,

Maynard
W6PAP


--
don??? va3drl


Re: 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

 

Yes, it is known as the Edison split phase system, see:
Jim
Logic: Method used to arrive at the wrong conclusion, with confidence.? Murphy


On Friday, January 10, 2025 at 04:12:26 AM CST, Donald J via groups.io <djeffarndt@...> wrote:


"Edison" split phase system? Edison fought the AC system - he was the DC guy

Grounding and where neutral and ground interconnect depends on where the main (i.e. first) panel is located. After that any other panels the grounds and neutrals are separate.

On Mon, Jan 6, 2025 at 10:53?PM Jim Whartenby via <old_radio=[email protected]> wrote:
Isn't the neutral line grounded in the Edison split phase system at the pole mounted transformer and again at the service entrance of the residence?? Every house I have lived in had a copper clad steel rod driven into the ground just below the power meter and the main cutoff switch boxes.
Jim
Logic: Method used to arrive at the wrong conclusion, with confidence.? Murphy


On Monday, January 6, 2025 at 02:57:23 PM CST, don Root <drootofallevil@...> wrote:


Maynard, it was the connection at the pole in my case; anyhow as someone said, the so called “neutral” can not be guaranteed to be at ground level.

?

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Maynard Wright, P. E., W6PAP via
Sent: Monday, January 6, 2025 9:18 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HallicraftersRadios] 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

?

That happened to mine, too, some years ago. Measurements showed that
the neutral lead coming from the power company via the service entrance
had a loose connection which the power guys fixed quickly once they arrived.

73,

Maynard
W6PAP


--
don??? va3drl


Re: 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

 

"Edison" split phase system? Edison fought the AC system - he was the DC guy

Grounding and where neutral and ground interconnect depends on where the main (i.e. first) panel is located. After that any other panels the grounds and neutrals are separate.

On Mon, Jan 6, 2025 at 10:53?PM Jim Whartenby via <old_radio=[email protected]> wrote:
Isn't the neutral line grounded in the Edison split phase system at the pole mounted transformer and again at the service entrance of the residence?? Every house I have lived in had a copper clad steel rod driven into the ground just below the power meter and the main cutoff switch boxes.
Jim
Logic: Method used to arrive at the wrong conclusion, with confidence.? Murphy


On Monday, January 6, 2025 at 02:57:23 PM CST, don Root <drootofallevil@...> wrote:


Maynard, it was the connection at the pole in my case; anyhow as someone said, the so called “neutral” can not be guaranteed to be at ground level.

?

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Maynard Wright, P. E., W6PAP via
Sent: Monday, January 6, 2025 9:18 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HallicraftersRadios] 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

?

That happened to mine, too, some years ago. Measurements showed that
the neutral lead coming from the power company via the service entrance
had a loose connection which the power guys fixed quickly once they arrived.

73,

Maynard
W6PAP


--
don??? va3drl


Re: 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

 

开云体育

Leon,? RE ?you should?CHECK AND INSPECT it from time to time

Check IT the neutral only ? or IT the local grounding only ?? … as far the neutral is concerned, ?how do you go about testing it ?

Your local ground might be easier to test.. but exactly what are you going to test ??? my guess would be that corroded connections are high on the list of potential failure points.

People in this general area might just LOOSE their ground rod connection? due to the midnight copper thieves..

?

Thinking about? any disconnection to test, I am reminded of a ?“Mayday” episode where a big fancy plane crashed, primarily caused by tape put over the pitot tubes while they washed the plane or something, but the tape was not removed and was very hard to see from the ground.. so they were well up in the air before they knew the altitude gauges were wonky. ??

?

weedeater operators should be required to have a license; they could take your fenders off too.

The guy next door it trying to fell our shared power pole with his weedeater

Sorry for all the extra gibberish ?

?

Leon Robinson ?? K5JLR

Political Correctness is a Political Disease.

Politicians and Diapers should be changed
often and for the same reasons.

?

?

On Monday, January 6, 2025 at 09:53:32 PM CST, Jim Whartenby via groups.io <old_radio@...> wrote:

?

?

Isn't the neutral line grounded in the Edison split phase system at the pole mounted transformer and again at the service entrance of the residence?? Every house I have lived in had a copper clad steel rod driven into the ground just below the power meter and the main cutoff switch boxes.

Jim

Logic: Method used to arrive at the wrong conclusion, with confidence.? Murphy

?

?

On Monday, January 6, 2025 at 02:57:23 PM CST, don Root <drootofallevil@...> wrote:

?

?

Maynard, it was the connection at the pole in my case; anyhow as someone said, the so called “neutral” can not be guaranteed to be at ground level. ?

?

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Leon Robinson
Sent: Thursday, January 9, 2025 4:59 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HallicraftersRadios] 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

?

That's the way it is supposed to be.? But to be SAFE you should?

CHECK AND INSPECT it from time to time, things can and do happen.

?

Recently my internet connection on the power?pole was cut by a weedeater.

Things like this do happen occasionally.

?

Leon Robinson ?? K5JLR

Political Correctness is a Political Disease.

Politicians and Diapers should be changed
often and for the same reasons.

?

?

On Monday, January 6, 2025 at 09:53:32 PM CST, Jim Whartenby via groups.io <old_radio@...> wrote:

?

?

Isn't the neutral line grounded in the Edison split phase system at the pole mounted transformer and again at the service entrance of the residence?? Every house I have lived in had a copper clad steel rod driven into the ground just below the power meter and the main cutoff switch boxes.

Jim

??


--
don??? va3drl


Re: 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

 

That's the way it is supposed to be.? But to be SAFE you should?
CHECK AND INSPECT it from time to time, things can and do happen.

Recently my internet connection on the power?pole was cut by a weedeater.
Things like this do happen occasionally.

Leon Robinson ?? K5JLR

Political Correctness is a Political Disease.

Politicians and Diapers should be changed
often and for the same reasons.


On Monday, January 6, 2025 at 09:53:32 PM CST, Jim Whartenby via groups.io <old_radio@...> wrote:


Isn't the neutral line grounded in the Edison split phase system at the pole mounted transformer and again at the service entrance of the residence?? Every house I have lived in had a copper clad steel rod driven into the ground just below the power meter and the main cutoff switch boxes.
Jim
Logic: Method used to arrive at the wrong conclusion, with confidence.? Murphy


On Monday, January 6, 2025 at 02:57:23 PM CST, don Root <drootofallevil@...> wrote:


Maynard, it was the connection at the pole in my case; anyhow as someone said, the so called “neutral” can not be guaranteed to be at ground level.

?

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Maynard Wright, P. E., W6PAP via groups.io
Sent: Monday, January 6, 2025 9:18 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HallicraftersRadios] 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

?

That happened to mine, too, some years ago. Measurements showed that
the neutral lead coming from the power company via the service entrance
had a loose connection which the power guys fixed quickly once they arrived.

73,

Maynard
W6PAP


--
don??? va3drl


Re: HT-46

 
Edited

开云体育

Great catch Walt!

HNY.

73/jeff/ac0c
alpha-charlie-zero-charlie
On 1/9/2025 12:17 PM, waltcates via groups.io wrote:

Some time ago there was a topic about a frequency shift when switching from standby to transmit and a problem with the calibrate switching function for CW operation in the HT-46.

Today I ran across a service bulletin addressing this issue. Guess where?? On my website. I knew I had it somewhere, but the old gray cells sometimes don't function well. I guess I need a full re-alignment. Just in case the issue was not?resolved, here?is the bulletin.

?


Walt Cates, WD0GOF
?
A majority of acceptance is not proof of correctness.



HT-46

 
Edited

开云体育

Some time ago there was a topic about a frequency shift when switching from standby to transmit and a problem with the calibrate switching function for CW operation in the HT-46.

Today I ran across a service bulletin addressing this issue. Guess where?? On my website. I knew I had it somewhere, but the old gray cells sometimes don't function well. I guess I need a full re-alignment. Just in case the issue was not?resolved, here?is the bulletin.

?


Walt Cates, WD0GOF
?
A majority of acceptance is not proof of correctness.



WTB SX-28 Cabinet

 

Testing the waters for a SX-28 cabinet intact and in good condition. The SX-28A I'm finishing up needs a nice cabinet to go with it.
?
Let me know what you have.
?
Thanks,?
Tom
W3TA


Re: 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

 

Yes, that's what I understand, too, and we have the ground rod (two) in
place and properly connected to the service entrance panel. But with
the neutral coming from the power company's transformer at high
resistance, which seems to have been the case, the voltages changed a
few volts up or down (more than I liked) when the load inside the house
changed.

I'm not sure what this says about the transformer, connections, and
ground on the power pole. But when the power tech tightened the
connection in the neutral just below the gooseneck above our roof, the
problem disappeared.

73,

Maynard
W6PAP


On 1/7/25 02:07, don Root wrote:
Ya Jim, that or a close variation depending on where you live; the local
grounding being variable with “soil” or rocks or sand. It was the
neutral [grounded neutral] that was open ?so my neutral current had to
go thru my ground to local earth and back 500 feet nominal to the
transformer pole ground. Recall that the codes allow up to 25 ohms to
local ground, so it is not much of a return wire even for a few amps.
Seeing the light bulb brightness and dim-ness was all I needed to know I
had a neutral problem. Then I checked the main neutral bus? to determine
that it was open somewhere outside and called the power Company.?? Of
course all the outlet boxes ?washing machine, fridge, stove would ?be
floating at some voltage above local mother earth too while testing one
L-N load on the stove, and likely really bad if the A/C tried to start.

*From:*[email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] *On Behalf Of *Jim Whartenby via
groups.io
*Sent:* Monday, January 6, 2025 10:53 PM
*To:* [email protected]
*Subject:* Re: [HallicraftersRadios] 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

Isn't the neutral line grounded in the Edison split phase system at the
pole mounted transformer and again at the service entrance of the
residence?? Every house I have lived in had a copper clad steel rod
driven into the ground just below the power meter and the main cutoff
switch boxes.

Jim

Logic: Method used to arrive at the wrong conclusion, with confidence.
Murphy

_,_


--
don??? va3drl


Re: 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

 

开云体育

Ya Jim, that or a close variation depending on where you live; the local grounding being variable with “soil” or rocks or sand. It was the neutral [grounded neutral] that was open ?so my neutral current had to go thru my ground to local earth and back 500 feet nominal to the transformer pole ground. Recall that the codes allow up to 25 ohms to local ground, so it is not much of a return wire even for a few amps.? Seeing the light bulb brightness and dim-ness was all I needed to know I had a neutral problem. Then I checked the main neutral bus? to determine that it was open somewhere outside and called the power Company.?? Of course all the outlet boxes ?washing machine, fridge, stove would ?be floating at some voltage above local mother earth too while testing one L-N load on the stove, and likely really bad if the A/C tried to start. ?

?

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Jim Whartenby via groups.io
Sent: Monday, January 6, 2025 10:53 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HallicraftersRadios] 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

?

Isn't the neutral line grounded in the Edison split phase system at the pole mounted transformer and again at the service entrance of the residence?? Every house I have lived in had a copper clad steel rod driven into the ground just below the power meter and the main cutoff switch boxes.

Jim

Logic: Method used to arrive at the wrong conclusion, with confidence.? Murphy

?

?

_,_


--
don??? va3drl


Re: 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

 

Isn't the neutral line grounded in the Edison split phase system at the pole mounted transformer and again at the service entrance of the residence?? Every house I have lived in had a copper clad steel rod driven into the ground just below the power meter and the main cutoff switch boxes.
Jim
Logic: Method used to arrive at the wrong conclusion, with confidence.? Murphy


On Monday, January 6, 2025 at 02:57:23 PM CST, don Root <drootofallevil@...> wrote:


Maynard, it was the connection at the pole in my case; anyhow as someone said, the so called “neutral” can not be guaranteed to be at ground level.

?

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Maynard Wright, P. E., W6PAP via groups.io
Sent: Monday, January 6, 2025 9:18 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HallicraftersRadios] 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

?

That happened to mine, too, some years ago. Measurements showed that
the neutral lead coming from the power company via the service entrance
had a loose connection which the power guys fixed quickly once they arrived.

73,

Maynard
W6PAP


--
don??? va3drl


Re: 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

 

开云体育

Maynard, it was the connection at the pole in my case; anyhow as someone said, the so called “neutral” can not be guaranteed to be at ground level.

?

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Maynard Wright, P. E., W6PAP via groups.io
Sent: Monday, January 6, 2025 9:18 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HallicraftersRadios] 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

?

That happened to mine, too, some years ago. Measurements showed that
the neutral lead coming from the power company via the service entrance
had a loose connection which the power guys fixed quickly once they arrived.

73,

Maynard
W6PAP


--
don??? va3drl


winter project

 

开云体育

I am looking for an SX-146. It doesn't need?to be functional, just complete and not butchered.
borrow or buy.




Walt Cates, WD0GOF
?
A majority of acceptance is not proof of correctness.



Re: 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

 

That happened to mine, too, some years ago. Measurements showed that
the neutral lead coming from the power company via the service entrance
had a loose connection which the power guys fixed quickly once they arrived.

73,

Maynard
W6PAP


On 1/6/25 03:34, don Root wrote:
James, I certainly was not the one to say any topic is stupid. That is
like the idea of a stupid question. What would it take to make a topic
stupid?

Now that you remind me, the neutral to my house went almost open,
leaving 150 volts on one line when the other was loaded. There is
something to think about.

*From:*[email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] *On Behalf Of *James Chaggaris
*Sent:* Sunday, January 5, 2025 11:00 PM
*To:* [email protected]
*Subject:* Re: [HallicraftersRadios] 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

Hi Don, I agree, it's a stupid topic.


--
don??? va3drl


Re: 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

 

开云体育

James, I certainly was not the one to say any topic is stupid. That is like the idea of a stupid question. What would it take to make a topic stupid?

Now that you remind me, the neutral to my house went almost open, leaving 150 volts on one line when the other was loaded. There is something to think about.

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of James Chaggaris
Sent: Sunday, January 5, 2025 11:00 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HallicraftersRadios] 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

?

Hi Don, I agree, it's a stupid topic.


--
don??? va3drl


Re: 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

 

Hi Don, I agree, it's a stupid topic.


Re: 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

 

开云体育

Hi Jim, Sounds good; You can easily start another topic that we will also discuss to whatever length. We gotta do something to keep going,

Meanwhile, the 60Hz power has been going for 130 years? plus and has not been made obsolete.

?

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of James Chaggaris
Sent: Sunday, January 5, 2025 9:39 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HallicraftersRadios] 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

?

Can we please move on to another topic? ?If you're worried about getting a "little tickle" from 120V, you have other issues.

?

73,

Jim N9WW

_._,_._,_


--
don??? va3drl


Re: 2-wire, unpolarized outlet ?

 

Can we please move on to another topic? ?If you're worried about getting a "little tickle" from 120V, you have other issues.
?
73,
Jim N9WW


Re: winter project

 

开云体育

Hello Walt !

I still have the HT-46 that you used for a previous writeup – it’s been on a shelf ever since.

Would you like me to send it to you again!

Just let me know!

Mike/
K5MGR
___________________________________________

?

Mike Langner
929 Alameda Road NW
Albuquerque, NM 87114-1901

(505) 898-3212 home/home office
(505) 238-8810 cell
mlangner@...

?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of waltcates via groups.io
Sent: Sunday, January 5, 2025 3:29 PM
To: HALLI IO GROUP <[email protected]>
Subject: [HallicraftersRadios] winter project

?

I am looking for an?SX146/HT46 station. I would prefer a nonfunctioning but complete?and unmodified set.

I intend to write a repair manual for each.