Re: For Sale… HA1 keyer - update
Hi,
Re: HA-1 keyer output stuck key-down
I would first unplug the octal-based relay to see if that clears
the problem. You may have a relay whose output contacts
have become welded closed.
Then, replace the relay and remove the relay driver tube, V4.
The relay should be open with that tube removed.
If removing the tube clears the fault, check
the voltage fed to the grid of the tube (V4 pin 2).
(See HA-1 manual section 7.4 for voltage test and test conditions).
If the grid voltage is normal, about -17VDC, the tube itself may be faulty. Use a VTVM or DMM for this test, not a VOM,
because pin 2 is at a very high impedance point.
I assume you already checked the + and - d.c. power supply voltages.
Include a measurement for AC voltage with your DMM. You should only
have a small a.c. ripple on your two d.c. supply outputs.
73,
Ed Knobloch K4PF
|
Bill - here you go (these were the gray knurled plastic knobs used in the SX-110/111 and HT-37 rigs from the early-mid 60s):
?
?
73,
Bob K3AC
In a message dated 9/6/2024 1:42:32 PM Eastern Daylight Time, nz0tham@... writes:
?
[Edited Message Follows]
Got the TO setup with my TS-530S this morning and made some contacts on 30 meters.? Took a while to get used to it being non-iambic but I got to where my fist wasn't too bad lol.? It seems to work just fine. Here's a pic of it.? Very nice condx except for the broken FUNCTION knob.? Anyone got a replacement knob they would like to get rid of?
|
Hello Dave !
I hope the picture below comes through OK.
I’m looking for three of the type of small knob you see two of in the center of the picture of the four knobs below.
Might you have some of them for sale?
Many thanks!
Mike/
K5MGR
________________________________________
? ? Mike Langner
929 Alameda Road NW
Albuquerque, NM 87114-1901
(505) 898-3212 home/home office
(505) 238-8810 cell
mlangner@...
?
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From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Dave Soule via groups.io
Sent: Friday, September 6, 2024 10:46 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HallicraftersRadios] TO Keyer help? I have some of the grey knobs. Dave KB6MBC
On Sep 6, 2024, at 8:33?AM, Mike Langner <mlangner@...> wrote:
? I saw some of these knobs for sale on eBay just yesterday while searching for some correct knobs for my HT-46 (which I could not find).
Mike/
K5MGR
___________________________ ? Mike Langner
929 Alameda Road NW
Albuquerque, NM 87114-1901
(505) 898-3212 home/home office
(505) 238-8810 cell
mlangner@...
? ? Got the TO setup with my TS-530S this morning and made some contacts on 30 meters.? Took a while to get used to it being non-iambic but I got to where my fist wasn't too baf lol.? It seems to work just fine. Here's a pic of it.? Very nice condx except for the broken FUNCTION knob.? Anyone got a replacement knob they would like to get rid of?
|
I have some of the grey knobs.
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Show quoted text
On Sep 6, 2024, at 8:33?AM, Mike Langner <mlangner@...> wrote:
? I saw some of these knobs for sale on eBay just yesterday while searching for some correct knobs for my HT-46 (which I could not find).
Mike/
K5MGR
___________________________ ? Mike Langner
929 Alameda Road NW
Albuquerque, NM 87114-1901
(505) 898-3212 home/home office
(505) 238-8810 cell
mlangner@...
? ? Got the TO setup with my TS-530S this morning and made some contacts on 30 meters.? Took a while to get used to it being non-iambic but I got to where my fist wasn't too baf lol.? It seems to work just fine. Here's a pic of it.? Very nice condx except for the broken FUNCTION knob.? Anyone got a replacement knob they would like to get rid of? <image001.jpg>
|
I saw some of these knobs for sale on eBay just yesterday while searching for some correct knobs for my HT-46 (which I could not find).
Mike/
K5MGR
___________________________ ? Mike Langner
929 Alameda Road NW
Albuquerque, NM 87114-1901
(505) 898-3212 home/home office
(505) 238-8810 cell
mlangner@...
?
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From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Bill Carpenter
Sent: Friday, September 6, 2024 9:28 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HallicraftersRadios] TO Keyer help? Got the TO setup with my TS-530S this morning and made some contacts on 30 meters.? Took a while to get used to it being non-iambic but I got to where my fist wasn't too baf lol.? It seems to work just fine. Here's a pic of it.? Very nice condx except for the broken FUNCTION knob.? Anyone got a replacement knob they would like to get rid of?
|
Got the TO setup with my TS-530S this morning and made some contacts on 30 meters.? Took a while to get used to it being non-iambic but I got to where my fist wasn't too bad lol.? It seems to work just fine. Here's a pic of it.? Very nice condx except for the broken FUNCTION knob.? Anyone got a replacement knob they would like to get rid of?
--
73, Bill NZ0T
|
Re: For Sale… HA1 keyer - update
I had to replace practically all the resistors on my HA-1. The circuit for the dash`s is created by double triggering the dots. The resistance values ??are very important here. It is also important that the mercury relay only works properly in a vertical position !! ? Von: [email protected] <[email protected]> Im Auftrag von Richard Knoppow
Gesendet: Freitag, 6. September 2024 07:07
An: [email protected]
Betreff: Re: [HallicraftersRadios] For Sale… HA1 keyer - update ? May be the same problem I am having. Have not found out yet what is
causing it.
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On 9/5/2024 4:51 PM, Dennis Ashworth, K7FL wrote: Thanks … this is useful. The key paddles are not the issue as the same
thing happens with the plug completely disengaged from the Jack. It may
be a simple as a couple of leads touching … very messy wiring for a
commercial product …. Driving my OCD nuts!
All constructive ideas welcomed
Dennis, K7FL
-- Richard Knoppow Los Angeles WB6KBL SKCC 19998
|
Re: For Sale… HA1 keyer - update
May be the same problem I am having. Have not found out yet what is
causing it.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 9/5/2024 4:51 PM, Dennis Ashworth, K7FL wrote: Thanks … this is useful. The key paddles are not the issue as the same
thing happens with the plug completely disengaged from the Jack. It may
be a simple as a couple of leads touching … very messy wiring for a
commercial product …. Driving my OCD nuts!
All constructive ideas welcomed
Dennis, K7FL
--
Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles
WB6KBL
SKCC 19998
|
For those in need of extender / risers boards I am here to help. Please make contact directly. John WA1ESO (AT) JUNO (DOT) COM
For those in need of extender / risers boards I am here to help. Please make contact directly. John WA1ESO (AT) JUNO (DOT) COM
|
Re: For Sale… HA1 keyer - update
Thanks … this is useful. The key paddles are not the issue as the same thing happens with the plug completely disengaged from the Jack. It may be a simple as a couple of leads touching … very messy wiring for a commercial product …. Driving my OCD nuts!?
All constructive ideas welcomed
Dennis, K7FL
On Thu, Sep 5, 2024 at 2:27?PM Richard Knoppow via <1oldlens1= [email protected]> wrote: As suggested, make sure the connector or paddle is not shorted but my
HA-1 has developed the same problem. I think its a defective capacitor
or resistor. Have been lifting and testing parts. When I cure the
problem I will post here but at the moment its on the back burner.
When I got the keyer it ran slowly on both ranges. In the course of
trouble shooting the current problem I discovered a couple of places
where resistors had been added. Don't know if that caused the slowing
because the current problem started. In any case make sure its not
something simple like a shorted contact before getting deeper into it.
BTW, the unit is hard on tubes because they spend a lot of time
biased off. Hallicrafters recommends computer versions of the tubes that
are designed for this service. May not make a lot of difference, should
work with stock tubes. In any case check the tubes when trouble shooting.
Good luck and please let the list know what you find.
Right now its over 100 here and I really don't feel like doing
anything. Nothing like heat to make you feel lazy (or maybe cold too).
On 9/5/2024 11:35 AM, Dennis Ashworth, K7FL wrote:
Powered up the HA1. All seems to function except it appears to be stuck
in the key down position … sidetone continuous and contact on output
mercury relay are closed. It’s as if HOLD was selected on the function
switch, although it is not. The panel light shows increasing/decreasing
pulses as the speed control is rotated (to be expected). It may be
something simple, but I’m in the process of moving and just don’t have
time to troubleshoot the device.
So, I’ll let you guys and gals make the decision … $95 post paid con US,
or if no takers, I’ll keep it on my “one of these days” project list.
73!
Dennis, K7FL --
Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles
WB6KBL
SKCC 19998
|
Re: For Sale… HA1 keyer -update
As suggested, make sure the connector or paddle is not shorted but my
HA-1 has developed the same problem. I think its a defective capacitor
or resistor. Have been lifting and testing parts. When I cure the
problem I will post here but at the moment its on the back burner.
When I got the keyer it ran slowly on both ranges. In the course of
trouble shooting the current problem I discovered a couple of places
where resistors had been added. Don't know if that caused the slowing
because the current problem started. In any case make sure its not
something simple like a shorted contact before getting deeper into it.
BTW, the unit is hard on tubes because they spend a lot of time
biased off. Hallicrafters recommends computer versions of the tubes that
are designed for this service. May not make a lot of difference, should
work with stock tubes. In any case check the tubes when trouble shooting.
Good luck and please let the list know what you find.
Right now its over 100 here and I really don't feel like doing
anything. Nothing like heat to make you feel lazy (or maybe cold too).
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 9/5/2024 11:35 AM, Dennis Ashworth, K7FL wrote: Powered up the HA1. All seems to function except it appears to be stuck
in the key down position … sidetone continuous and contact on output
mercury relay are closed. It’s as if HOLD was selected on the function
switch, although it is not. The panel light shows increasing/decreasing
pulses as the speed control is rotated (to be expected). It may be
something simple, but I’m in the process of moving and just don’t have
time to troubleshoot the device.
So, I’ll let you guys and gals make the decision … $95 post paid con US,
or if no takers, I’ll keep it on my “one of these days” project list.
73!
Dennis, K7FL
--
Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles
WB6KBL
SKCC 19998
|
It occurred to me after posting my piece that "keyer" also applies to
the part of a transmitter used to change the output to send code. It can
be some electronic device or a relay, can change bias or some other
voltage. There are many arrangements including frequency shift keying.
Curiously, while frequency shift keying is mostly associated with RTTY
it actually dates back to the spark days when transmitters were keyed by
detuning the output circuit. So, be careful of the context when
encountering the word "keyer".
It is TOO HOT in Los Angeles.
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On 9/4/2024 9:18 PM, Robert Needleman via groups.io wrote: Nope - a bug is a semi-automatic K-E-Y? Not a keyer. The term "keyer"
should be limited to the electronic device that electrically generates
dits/dahs (and requires the use of a mechanical KEY -either single or
dual lever paddle. . Everything else is a KEY. - straight, bug, paddle
key, etc. .
Bob K3AC
--
Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles
WB6KBL
SKCC 19998
|
Re: For Sale… HA1 keyer -update
Sounds like your paddles are not wired right. Quick check, pull the plug. If it stops then you have either a short in the plug or plug not wired correctly. Not uncommon to have things pushed together when assembling the shell back on to the plug. Look for things already close together even before assembly.
For what it's worth on the big semantics discussion, checked my 1964 Handbook for the Vibroplex ad. There it is, the "new by request" Vibro-keyer. This was printed in red so looks to be the introduction of this key. Note they hyphenated it to indicate a Vibroplex model for electronic keyers. That's all there is to it folks, a matching up of terms for a new name of product.
73 ... Ed, WA9GQK
On Thursday, September 5, 2024 at 01:35:14 PM CDT, Dennis Ashworth, K7FL <dennis@...> wrote:
Powered up the HA1. All seems to function except it appears to be stuck in the key down position … sidetone continuous and contact on output mercury relay are closed. It’s as if HOLD was selected on the function switch, although it is not. The panel light shows increasing/decreasing pulses as the speed control is rotated (to be expected). It may be something simple, but I’m in the process of moving and just don’t have time to troubleshoot the device.?
So, I’ll let you guys and gals make the decision … $95 post paid con US, or if no takers, I’ll keep it on my “one of these days” project list.
?
73!
Dennis, K7FL
|
Re: For Sale… HA1 keyer -update
Powered up the HA1. All seems to function except it appears to be stuck in the key down position … sidetone continuous and contact on output mercury relay are closed. It’s as if HOLD was selected on the function switch, although it is not. The panel light shows increasing/decreasing pulses as the speed control is rotated (to be expected). It may be something simple, but I’m in the process of moving and just don’t have time to troubleshoot the device.?
So, I’ll let you guys and gals make the decision … $95 post paid con US, or if no takers, I’ll keep it on my “one of these days” project list.
?
73!
Dennis, K7FL
|
|
|
Not according to the manufacturer or the dealer selling the most popular semi-automatic bug - it is a KEY::
?
?
Vibroplex Original Bug Keys ORIGINAL-D
????5 out of 5 stars?
?
Part Number:?VIB-ORIGINAL-D
 - ?
- ?
-
?
Original Deluxe, Bug Semi-automatic Key, Chrome Base, Chrome Hardware, Red Paddle, Spring Tension, Each
?
?
?
Nope - a bug is a semi-automatic K-E-Y? Not a keyer. The term "keyer" should be limited to the electronic device that electrically generates dits/dahs (and requires the use of a mechanical KEY -either single or dual lever paddle. . Everything else is a KEY. - straight, bug, paddle key, etc. .?
In a message dated 9/4/2024 11:25:57 PM Eastern Daylight Time, n4fs@... writes:
Hi Rich –
?
You are right, the word keyer alone does not define the instrument. I have over 500 telegraph keys in my collection, but slowly downsizing. However in the context of the HA-1 the keying mechanism could be called a paddle or a keyer. As you said, the HA-1 is also called a keyer as it forms the dits and the dahs as manipulated by the paddle. The HA-1 also has a 3 contact ? inch socket. A bug is also a keyer as it automatically creates the dots and manually the dahs. There are some complex bugs that automatically create both. I also have a very early typewriter that generates International code. It requires a motor to make it work. A real ingenious device with a full keyboard. I believe I have the only one remaining in existence. Regards – Mike
?
Mike B. Feher, N4FS
89 Arnold Blvd.
Howell NJ 07731
908-902-3831
?
?
I think there is confusion in the nomenclature. By keyer I think
you mean what is sometimes called a paddle or paddle set. The thing that
is used to operate the "keyer" meaning the thing that switches the
contact to the transmitter. Calling both "keyer" I think creates
confusion. This is not meant as a criticism of you, its very common. It
also seems common to call a whole automatic sending machine a "keyer".
So, I have a Hallicrafters HA-1 "keyer" and also a Vibroplex
"Vibrokeyer", which is a set of paddles and contacts meant to work with
a "keyer" meaning the electronics that generate dots and dashes like the
HA-1.
I really don't have a solution for this but think its worth some
effort because of the confusion that is caused by the inexact naming.
On 9/4/2024 5:58 PM, Mike Feher wrote:
That is correct, Jeep. All keyers have three contacts. One common and
like you said one for dits and the other for dahs. 73 – Mike
Mike B. Feher, N4FS
89 Arnold Blvd.
Howell NJ 07731
908-902-3831
*From:* [email protected] <[email protected]>
*On Behalf Of *D. Platt via groups.io
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 4, 2024 4:02 PM
*To:* [email protected]
*Subject:* Re: [HallicraftersRadios] TO Keyer help
Does not the TO require a 3 circuit "stereo" 1/4" plug. One side dit,
other side dah?
K3HVG
|
Any device that puts morse code on a transmitter to convey intelligence is a keyer. Since a key keys, it is a keyer. That could even be broader for some digital modes and modulators. 73 – Mike ? Mike B. Feher, N4FS 89 Arnold Blvd. Howell NJ 07731 908-902-3831 ?
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From: [email protected] < [email protected]> On Behalf Of Robert Needleman via groups.io Sent: Thursday, September 5, 2024 12:18 AM To: [email protected]Subject: Re: [HallicraftersRadios] TO Keyer help ? Nope - a bug is a semi-automatic K-E-Y? Not a keyer. The term "keyer" should be limited to the electronic device that electrically generates dits/dahs (and requires the use of a mechanical KEY -either single or dual lever paddle. . Everything else is a KEY. - straight, bug, paddle key, etc. .?
In a message dated 9/4/2024 11:25:57 PM Eastern Daylight Time, n4fs@... writes:
Hi Rich – ? You are right, the word keyer alone does not define the instrument. I have over 500 telegraph keys in my collection, but slowly downsizing. However in the context of the HA-1 the keying mechanism could be called a paddle or a keyer. As you said, the HA-1 is also called a keyer as it forms the dits and the dahs as manipulated by the paddle. The HA-1 also has a 3 contact ? inch socket. A bug is also a keyer as it automatically creates the dots and manually the dahs. There are some complex bugs that automatically create both. I also have a very early typewriter that generates International code. It requires a motor to make it work. A real ingenious device with a full keyboard. I believe I have the only one remaining in existence. Regards – Mike ? Mike B. Feher, N4FS 89 Arnold Blvd. Howell NJ 07731 908-902-3831 ? ? I think there is confusion in the nomenclature. By keyer I think
you mean what is sometimes called a paddle or paddle set. The thing that
is used to operate the "keyer" meaning the thing that switches the
contact to the transmitter. Calling both "keyer" I think creates
confusion. This is not meant as a criticism of you, its very common. It
also seems common to call a whole automatic sending machine a "keyer".
So, I have a Hallicrafters HA-1 "keyer" and also a Vibroplex
"Vibrokeyer", which is a set of paddles and contacts meant to work with
a "keyer" meaning the electronics that generate dots and dashes like the
HA-1.
I really don't have a solution for this but think its worth some
effort because of the confusion that is caused by the inexact naming.
On 9/4/2024 5:58 PM, Mike Feher wrote: That is correct, Jeep. All keyers have three contacts. One common and
like you said one for dits and the other for dahs. 73 – Mike
Mike B. Feher, N4FS
89 Arnold Blvd.
Howell NJ 07731
908-902-3831
*From:* [email protected] <[email protected]>
*On Behalf Of *D. Platt via groups.io
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 4, 2024 4:02 PM
*To:* [email protected]
*Subject:* Re: [HallicraftersRadios] TO Keyer help
Does not the TO require a 3 circuit "stereo" 1/4" plug. One side dit,
other side dah?
K3HVG
|
Nope - a bug is a semi-automatic K-E-Y? Not a keyer. The term "keyer" should be limited to the electronic device that electrically generates dits/dahs (and requires the use of a mechanical KEY -either single or dual lever paddle. . Everything else is a KEY. - straight, bug, paddle key, etc. .?
?
Bob K3AC
In a message dated 9/4/2024 11:25:57 PM Eastern Daylight Time, n4fs@... writes:
?
Hi Rich –
?
You are right, the word keyer alone does not define the instrument. I have over 500 telegraph keys in my collection, but slowly downsizing. However in the context of the HA-1 the keying mechanism could be called a paddle or a keyer. As you said, the HA-1 is also called a keyer as it forms the dits and the dahs as manipulated by the paddle. The HA-1 also has a 3 contact ? inch socket. A bug is also a keyer as it automatically creates the dots and manually the dahs. There are some complex bugs that automatically create both. I also have a very early typewriter that generates International code. It requires a motor to make it work. A real ingenious device with a full keyboard. I believe I have the only one remaining in existence. Regards – Mike
?
Mike B. Feher, N4FS
89 Arnold Blvd.
Howell NJ 07731
908-902-3831
?
?
I think there is confusion in the nomenclature. By keyer I think
you mean what is sometimes called a paddle or paddle set. The thing that
is used to operate the "keyer" meaning the thing that switches the
contact to the transmitter. Calling both "keyer" I think creates
confusion. This is not meant as a criticism of you, its very common. It
also seems common to call a whole automatic sending machine a "keyer".
So, I have a Hallicrafters HA-1 "keyer" and also a Vibroplex
"Vibrokeyer", which is a set of paddles and contacts meant to work with
a "keyer" meaning the electronics that generate dots and dashes like the
HA-1.
I really don't have a solution for this but think its worth some
effort because of the confusion that is caused by the inexact naming.
On 9/4/2024 5:58 PM, Mike Feher wrote:
That is correct, Jeep. All keyers have three contacts. One common and
like you said one for dits and the other for dahs. 73 – Mike
Mike B. Feher, N4FS
89 Arnold Blvd.
Howell NJ 07731
908-902-3831
*From:* [email protected] <[email protected]>
*On Behalf Of *D. Platt via groups.io
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 4, 2024 4:02 PM
*To:* [email protected]
*Subject:* Re: [HallicraftersRadios] TO Keyer help
Does not the TO require a 3 circuit "stereo" 1/4" plug. One side dit,
other side dah?
K3HVG
|
Well, it's pretty clear that Vibroplex is the guilty party here. For some reason, they had the "brilliant" (not ) idea of naming their version of a single lever paddle "Vibrokeyer". Obviously it is a mechanical? paddle and has nothing to do with being an electronic keyer in any way. All the other manufacturers of paddles (Bencher, Kent, Begali, etc)? call them just that - single or dual (iambic) level PADDLES. No mention of keyer in their product lines!? So if we just eliminate the confusion generated by Vibroplex, it's perfectly clear that a paddle is the mechanical device that must be connected to an (electronic) keyer in order to generate the dits and dahs.And that eliminates the confusion.??
?
Bob K3AC
In a message dated 9/4/2024 10:50:26 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 1oldlens1@... writes:
?
I think there is confusion in the nomenclature. By keyer I think you mean what is sometimes called a paddle or paddle set. The thing that is used to operate the "keyer" meaning the thing that switches the contact to the transmitter. Calling both "keyer" I think creates confusion. This is not meant as a criticism of you, its very common. It also seems common to call a whole automatic sending machine a "keyer". So, I have a Hallicrafters HA-1 "keyer" and also a Vibroplex "Vibrokeyer", which is a set of paddles and contacts meant to work with a "keyer" meaning the electronics that generate dots and dashes like the HA-1. I really don't have a solution for this but think its worth some effort because of the confusion that is caused by the inexact naming. On 9/4/2024 5:58 PM, Mike Feher wrote:
That is correct, Jeep. All keyers have three contacts. One common and
like you said one for dits and the other for dahs. 73 – Mike
Mike B. Feher, N4FS
89 Arnold Blvd.
Howell NJ 07731
908-902-3831
*From:* [email protected] <[email protected]>
*On Behalf Of *D. Platt via groups.io
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 4, 2024 4:02 PM
*To:* [email protected]
*Subject:* Re: [HallicraftersRadios] TO Keyer help
Does not the TO require a 3 circuit "stereo" 1/4" plug. One side dit,
other side dah?
K3HVG
-- Richard Knoppow Los Angeles WB6KBL SKCC 19998
|
Hah! This gets even more fun. My kx3 lets me send RTTY using the CW paddles. Does that mean my kx3 is an ASR-33? :-) It decodes RTTY as well. But I can't figure out where to load the paper roll :-(
?
--lyndon
|
Mike Langner