Re: Dick Cooper Time Book - 1980s
Ed,
The crews referred to WR-3/RW-2 as the "junker" because, unlike WR-1/RW-6 which was given priority over the road as the paper train, WR-3/RW-2 used to stop and do some switching along the way. As Dad would often say about it, "It took forever to get home because we had to stop at every pissing post along the way". His words. Not mine. It was a general merchandise train.
This symbol, and minor variations of it, were used from about the onset of this service which I suspect was sometime in the 30's or 40's, up until the Gilford Error when most trains were given a four letter symbol. WR-1/RW-6 for a time was WR-1/RO-6 (Rouses Point to Oneonta) in the early 70's and then back to RW-6. In essence, they were PYRP/RPPY (Potomac Yard/Rouses Point) during Gilford.?
Ed
On Monday, April 7, 2025 at 12:44:57 PM EDT, Edward Seaman via groups.io <tankmikegulf22@...> wrote:
You’re welcome Ed. ?As always an informative insight to the D&H operations.?
A follow on question for you.
Why did crews call RW3/WR2 the “Junkier”. And what years was this symbol used on the railroad.?
V/r Ed
On Apr 6, 2025, at 9:04?PM, Ed Cox via groups.io <edcox13@...> wrote:
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Good morning Ed,
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No, Conrail had nothing to do with it. At some point, the unions agreed to "system seniority" as opposed to "division seniority". Because Dad was a "Saratoga/Champlain Division (AKA 3rd & 4th sub-division) man, the only jobs near his home in Colliersville were out of Oneonta and consisted of WR-1/RW-6 (the paper train) or WR-3/RW-2 (known by the crews as "the junker") until the advent of system seniority. Both had Oneonta and Whitehall as home terminals. With system seniority, he was now able to bid on more Oneonta jobs and was able to secure the same jobs listed above heading south instead of north. He was one of the few engineers who was qualified on the whole original main line of the D&H from Wilkes-Barre to Montreal. Bernie O'Brien kept trying to get him to become a "Road Foreman", but Dad was a union rep and not interested in a "management" position.
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Later on, he decided to bid in on jobs south of Wilkes-Barre, just because he loved railroading and new railroads to run on. We were all surprised when he decided to retire at 62. Guilford had screwed things up so bad, he no longer enjoyed the job. He would have turned 99 today.
?
Thanks for asking.
?
Ed
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Ed Cox
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Re: Dick Cooper Time Book - 1980s
You’re welcome Ed. ?As always an informative insight to the D&H operations.?
A follow on question for you.
Why did crews call RW3/WR2 the “Junkier”. And what years was this symbol used on the railroad.?
V/r Ed
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On Apr 6, 2025, at 9:04?PM, Ed Cox via groups.io <edcox13@...> wrote:
? [Edited Message Follows]
Good morning Ed,
?
No, Conrail had nothing to do with it. At some point, the unions agreed to "system seniority" as opposed to "division seniority". Because Dad was a "Saratoga/Champlain Division (AKA 3rd & 4th sub-division) man, the only jobs near his home in Colliersville were out of Oneonta and consisted of WR-1/RW-6 (the paper train) or WR-3/RW-2 (known by the crews as "the junker") until the advent of system seniority. Both had Oneonta and Whitehall as home terminals. With system seniority, he was now able to bid on more Oneonta jobs and was able to secure the same jobs listed above heading south instead of north. He was one of the few engineers who was qualified on the whole original main line of the D&H from Wilkes-Barre to Montreal. Bernie O'Brien kept trying to get him to become a "Road Foreman", but Dad was a union rep and not interested in a "management" position.
?
Later on, he decided to bid in on jobs south of Wilkes-Barre, just because he loved railroading and new railroads to run on. We were all surprised when he decided to retire at 62. Guilford had screwed things up so bad, he no longer enjoyed the job. He would have turned 99 today.
?
Thanks for asking.
?
Ed
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Dick Cooper Time Book - 1960s
1/8/62 Rouses Point yard, power 4073, yard rate, marked on Rouses Point 7:00 AM, marked off Rouses Point 3:00 PM, on duty 8:00, paid $22.16 for 100 miles, O.J. Bombardier engineer, Cooper fireman.
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Re: Dick Cooper Time Book - 1980s
Good morning Ed,
?
No, Conrail had nothing to do with it. At some point, the unions agreed to "system seniority" as opposed to "division seniority". Because Dad was a "Saratoga/Champlain Division (AKA 3rd & 4th sub-division) man, the only jobs near his home in Colliersville were out of Oneonta and consisted of WR-1/RW-6 (the paper train) or WR-3/RW-2 (known by the crews as "the junker") until the advent of system seniority. Both had Oneonta and Whitehall as home terminals. With system seniority, he was now able to bid on more Oneonta jobs and was able to secure the same jobs listed above heading south instead of north. He was one of the few engineers who was qualified on the whole original main line of the D&H from Wilkes-Barre to Montreal. Bernie O'Brien kept trying to get him to become a "Road Foreman", but Dad was a union rep and not interested in a "management" position.
?
Later on, he decided to bid in on jobs south of Wilkes-Barre, just because he loved railroading and new railroads to run on. We were all surprised when he decided to retire at 62. Guilford had screwed things up so bad, he no longer enjoyed the job. He would have turned 99 today.
?
Thanks for asking.
?
Ed
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Dick Cooper Time Book - 1950s
6/9/53 Deadhead, yard rate, marked on Mohawk 7:00 AM, marked off Colonie 8:00 AM, on duty 1:00, paid $2.68 for 16 miles.
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6/9/53 Kenwood yard, power 4043, yard rate, marked on Colonie 8:00 AM, marked off Colonie 5:20 PM, on duty 9:20, paid $18.59 for 125 miles, Bruder engineer, Cooper fireman.
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6/9/53 Deadhead, yard rate, marked on Colonie 5:20 PM, marked off Mohawk 6:20 PM, paid $2.68 for 16 miles.
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Re: Dick Cooper Time Book - 1980s
A question Ed. I notice in the 1980s that your Dad is working the on the southern portion of the railroad vs in the 1970s he worked the norther portion. Was this caused by the formation of Conrail and the expansion??
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On Apr 4, 2025, at 11:16?AM, Ed Cox via groups.io <edcox13@...> wrote:
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8/1/80 WR-7, power 7617-7402-7601-7418, through freight rate, marked on Hudson 6:00 PM, marked off Oneonta 6:00 AM, on duty 12:00, paid $145.61 for 160 miles, Cooper engineer, no fireman, Tommy Flynn conductor.
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Dick Cooper Time Book - Guilford Error
11/22/85 RPPY, power B&M 210-D&H 7407-2922, through freight rate, marked on Rouses Point 9:00 PM, 50" switching Ft. Edward, marked off Mohawk 5:20 AM, on duty 8:20, paid $202.57 for 195 miles, Cooper engineer, no fireman, J. Anzalone conductor.
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Dick Cooper Time Book - 1980s
8/1/80 WR-7, power 7617-7402-7601-7418, through freight rate, marked on Hudson 6:00 PM, marked off Oneonta 6:00 AM, on duty 12:00, paid $145.61 for 160 miles, Cooper engineer, no fireman, Tommy Flynn conductor.
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Dick Cooper Time Book - 1970s
7/15/71 RW-6, power 610-755-759, through freight rate, marked on Whitehall 1:15 AM, marked off Oneonta 7:00 AM, on duty 5:45, paid $39.78 for 130 miles, Stan Chapman engineer, Cooper fireman.
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Dick Cooper Time Book - 1969
7/14/69 WR-1, power 604-711-701, through freight rate, marked on Oneonta 11:30 AM, marked off Whitehall 4:15 PM, on duty 4:45, paid $34.71 for 130 miles, John Bowen engineer, Cooper fireman.
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Dick Cooper Time Book - 1962
9/5/62 Plattsburg yard, power 4056, yard-local freight rate, marked on Plattsburg 6:30 AM, marked off Plattsburg 2:30 PM, on duty 8:00, paid $22.56 for 100 miles, F.C. Adams engineer, Cooper fireman.
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Dick Cooper Time Book - Rio Grande
7/7/62 461-2, power narrow gauge K-28 2-8-2 478, local freight rate, marked on Durango 8:50 AM, marked off Durango 6:25 PM, on duty 9:35, paid $25.23 for 130 miles, G.B. Greathouse engineer, Cooper fireman.
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Re: Dick Cooper Time Book - 1969
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On Mar 28, 2025, at 5:42?AM, Ed Cox via groups.io <edcox13@...> wrote:
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Rick,
He never said much of anything about it. I know he did appreciate the medical insurance and retirement.
The only comment I remember him saying about his wages was in relation to a deal made by the Brotherhood of Locomotive Engineers with management. (He was a member and eventually General Chairman of the Brotherhood of Locomotive Firemen and Enginemen which was part of the UTU). He said the BLE sold the firemen down the tubes for fifty cents a day when they negotiated to have firemen eliminated from engine service by attrition.
Ed
On Thursday, March 27, 2025 at 09:50:39 PM EDT, Richard E. Shivik <dnhreshivik@...> wrote:
Ed,
Did Dick always consider himself "well paid"?
Rick
On Tuesday, March 25, 2025 at 09:33:21 AM EDT, Ed Cox via groups.io <edcox13@...> wrote:
7/13/69 RW-6, power 601-607-604, through freight rate, marked on Whitehall 2:00 AM, 5" initial terminal daley, marked off Oneonta 11:00 AM, on duty 9:00, paid $34.99 for 131 miles, John Bowen engineer, Cooper fireman.
-- Ed Cox
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Does anyone know where I can find a schematic drawing of Whitehall's yard office?
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Thanks.
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Dick Cooper Time Book - 1960s
1/7/62 WR-7, power 4091-4104-4117, through freight rate, marked on Whitehall 1:30 PM, marked off Rouses Point 6:40 PM, on duty 5:10, paid $23.83 for 115 miles, J.P. O'Neil engineer, Cooper fireman.
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Dick Cooper Time Book - 1950s
6/7/53 Layed in.
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6/8/53 work Richmondville, power 3013, through freight rate, marked on Mohawk 4:00 AM, marked off Mohawk 4:20 PM, on duty 12:20, paid $24.82 for 181 miles, Primett engineer, Cooper fireman.
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SOLD: FS: 2 Proto 1000 CN 50' Newsprint Box Cars
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Re: FS: 2 Proto 1000 CN 50' Newsprint Box Cars
Jeff,
I need your address.
Ed
On Friday, March 28, 2025 at 07:53:20 AM EDT, jgmartin718@... <jgmartin718@...> wrote:
Good morning!? Sold!? A welcome addition to my WR-1/RW-6 (if the layout ever gets finished).? Let me know the total. Jeff ----------------------------------------- From: "Ed Cox via groups.io" To: [email protected]Cc: Sent: Friday March 28 2025 7:39:52AM Subject: [DandH-Railroad] FS: 2 Proto 1000 CN 50' Newsprint Box Cars
#400522 and 400428. $25 each plus shipping. PayPal or USPS
Money order.
-- Ed Cox
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Re: FS: 2 Proto 1000 CN 50' Newsprint Box Cars
Good morning!? Sold!? A welcome addition to my WR-1/RW-6 (if the layout ever gets finished).? Let me know the total. Jeff ----------------------------------------- From: "Ed Cox via groups.io" To: [email protected]Cc: Sent: Friday March 28 2025 7:39:52AM Subject: [DandH-Railroad] FS: 2 Proto 1000 CN 50' Newsprint Box Cars
#400522 and 400428. $25 each plus shipping. PayPal or USPS
Money order.
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Dick Cooper Time Book - Guilford Error
11/20/85 Regular day off.
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11/21/85 PYRP, power B&M 210-D&H 7407-2922, through freight rate, marked on Mohawk 11:30 PM, marked off Rouses Point 7:20 AM, on duty 7:50, paid $182.83 for 176 miles, Cooper engineer, no fireman, J. Anzalone conductor.
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Ed Cox