Hi Dion. This could be fun. Let's get all the .NET negatives out in
the open. I guess some counterpoints to the runtime objection would
be,

- 20MB is (or is fast becoming) small potatoes, MS has made it easy
to get the .NET runtime update, and future versions of Windows will
include it

- if one's primary interest is in gaining access to a group's work
for one's own purposes (for trading), then one wouldn't be too
concerned that others might have a harder time getting it (and all
the developers get the runtime as part of their installation)

--- In twsapi@y..., "goldensilvermana" <kybryan@c...> wrote:

Dkamp

Here is how I envision a workable solution:

What is this in response to? This post makes it sound like the
charter of this group is to develop some trading platform, not to
discuss the TWS API.

It is the little guy against the big boys and I smell blood.

Huh? Blood? This makes no sense to me. Personally, by implementing
my own solution, I am not competing with the "big boys." Only if I am
planning on selling it do I compete. I am developing something
because nothing exists that does what I need.

The problem is that there are many lone wolves running down rabbit
trails and that is not the solution

We are running down different trails. If people truly have the same
needs, these should be communicated to IB as TWS feature requests.
Personally, I am almost certain that my requirements are different
than others'.

The problem with .NET is that you have to distribute a 20MB .NET
runtime to everyone. Even Windows XP does not have the .NET runtime
included by default.

Monday, June 10, 2002, 2:50:02 PM, you wrote:

d> Thanks Scott for getting responses.

d> Seems like way to go in a cooperative project is to get participants
d> to use .NET framework, where language choice is least likely to cause
d> problems, and C/C++ can be used to generate/process any necessary
d> unmanaged (= not under control of .NET runtime) or legacy code. I
d> think that will get us the most bang for the buck with repect to our
d> individual uses of the code (but perhaps not the most bang if someone
d> wanted to sell and distribute a cross-platform app - not a high
d> priority for me - but makes sense for IB's use of Java in TWS).

d> So what do the other 180 people up here think of what I just wrote
d> with respect to development platform selection for such a cooperative
d> effort? (We can do a separte survey to figure out who's actually
d> interested in such a project. Am just fishing for .NET objections to
d> start with.) Thanks!

Re: C++ vs. C#.NET vs. VB.NET
--------------------------------------------------------------------

d> --

----------
??? Kent's full of crap! :)

I have yet to see a business app that can't be written in VB

d> instead

of C++ and have the user know the difference. Most of the problems
with business apps involve query times against backend databases,
which usually isn't the front end's fault.

Just so you don't think I'm biased, I've done VB and C++ stuff for
almost 10 years. VB beats C++ hands down as the business dev

d> language

of choice.

d> Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT

d> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
d> twsapi-unsubscribe@...



d> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to theYahoo! Terms of Service.

Thanks Scott for getting responses.

Seems like way to go in a cooperative project is to get participants
to use .NET framework, where language choice is least likely to cause
problems, and C/C++ can be used to generate/process any necessary
unmanaged (= not under control of .NET runtime) or legacy code. I
think that will get us the most bang for the buck with repect to our
individual uses of the code (but perhaps not the most bang if someone
wanted to sell and distribute a cross-platform app - not a high
priority for me - but makes sense for IB's use of Java in TWS).

So what do the other 180 people up here think of what I just wrote
with respect to development platform selection for such a cooperative
effort? (We can do a separte survey to figure out who's actually
interested in such a project. Am just fishing for .NET objections to
start with.) Thanks!

Re: C++ vs. C#.NET vs. VB.NET
--------------------------------------------------------------------

--

----------
Kent's full of crap! :)

I have yet to see a business app that can't be written in VB

instead

of C++ and have the user know the difference. Most of the problems
with business apps involve query times against backend databases,
which usually isn't the front end's fault.

Just so you don't think I'm biased, I've done VB and C++ stuff for
almost 10 years. VB beats C++ hands down as the business dev

language

of choice.

hi-thanks for the e-mail. Will be gone for a few days and will respond after that. Please send future e-mails to??????? kybryan@...???????????????? thanks

dtkamp wrote:

Done

test

Done

--- In twsapi@y..., "ajr" <areider-list@n...> wrote:

and every time someone posts, we are all going to get his

autoresponder email. Could the moderator set him to nomail please?

* REPLY SEPARATOR *

On 6/10/2002 at 3:31 PM Yolanda wrote:
hi-thanks for the e-mail. Will be gone for a few days and will

respond after that. Please send future e-mails to
kybryan@c... thanks

dtkamp wrote:
Hi StatTrader. Your view here sounds quite reasonable for someone

who

is actively writing Java code. Having already stated a counterview,
others are free to decide for themselves, and I'll resist getting

any

deeper into this complex issue unless/until it becomes something

that

needs resolving (such as in some sort of cooperative endeavor).
Peace. (MS also appears to be planning on bringing some form of

Java

back to .NET, which will further confuse the discussion.)
--- In twsapi@y..., "thestattrader" <TheStatTrader@y...> wrote:

True, Java GUI development used to require quite a bit of work-
arounds when SWING was new. But that was a few years ago. I'm not
primarily a GUI guy - I mostly do "mission critical" server side
programming, but when i do venture back into SWING work I haven't

had

many problems. True, it's cross-platform nature brings it's own
headaches with it.

I personaly can't recall any TWS problems that were Java based,

nor

can I imagine any limitations it would introduce outside of
integration to outside apps via the OS (granted, this may be a
primary requirement to some). But any speed or graphics issues

now-

a-

days are generaly based on the developer's experience. I've done
professional c++, vb, delphi, and cobol work - and I'm at a loss

as

to why one would think Java was not suitable platform... java's
weakness is in advanced mathemtics, and even then it was used for

the

3-d graphics engine for EverQuest. And the major firms on wall

street

are big time java shops.

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
twsapi-unsubscribe@y...


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Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT




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开云体育

Another comment from the VB Explorer Board:

Re: C++ vs. C#.NET vs. VB.NET
----------------------------------------------------------------------
----------
Kent's full of crap! :)

I have yet to see a business app that can't be written in VB instead
of C++ and have the user know the difference. Most of the problems
with business apps involve query times against backend databases,
which usually isn't the front end's fault.

Just so you don't think I'm biased, I've done VB and C++ stuff for
almost 10 years. VB beats C++ hands down as the business dev language
of choice.



--- In twsapi@y..., "dtkamp" <dkamp@e...> wrote:

In recent thread on IB board, Kent commented that C++ was the way

to

go for creating serious apps. Is this really true any more if

you're

starting from .NET, where all of its languages are based on same
underlying runtime lib.s and architecture. For purposes of building

a

killer trading app, does it really matter much whether you're using
VB.NET or C#.NET or C++? And can't you just mix in legacy C and C++
lib.s as necessary?

Thanks for your e-mail. I will be out of town for 3 days and will respond after returning. Pleaase send future e-mails to??? kybryan@...???????????? thanks

thestattrader wrote:

Thanks for your e-mail. I will be out of town for 3 days and will respond after returning. Please direct future e-mails to??????????? kybryan@...?????????????? thanks

marinindextrader wrote:

I am out of town for 3 days will respond after returning. Please direct future e-mails to??? kybryan@...??????????????????? thanks

marinindextrader wrote:

Hi StatTrader. Your view here sounds quite reasonable for someone who
is actively writing Java code. Having already stated a counterview,
others are free to decide for themselves, and I'll resist getting any
deeper into this complex issue unless/until it becomes something that
needs resolving (such as in some sort of cooperative endeavor).
Peace. (MS also appears to be planning on bringing some form of Java
back to .NET, which will further confuse the discussion.)

--- In twsapi@y..., "thestattrader" <TheStatTrader@y...> wrote:

True, Java GUI development used to require quite a bit of work-
arounds when SWING was new. But that was a few years ago. I'm not
primarily a GUI guy - I mostly do "mission critical" server side
programming, but when i do venture back into SWING work I haven't

had

many problems. True, it's cross-platform nature brings it's own
headaches with it.

I personaly can't recall any TWS problems that were Java based, nor
can I imagine any limitations it would introduce outside of
integration to outside apps via the OS (granted, this may be a
primary requirement to some). But any speed or graphics issues now-

a-

days are generaly based on the developer's experience. I've done
professional c++, vb, delphi, and cobol work - and I'm at a loss as
to why one would think Java was not suitable platform... java's
weakness is in advanced mathemtics, and even then it was used for

the

3-d graphics engine for EverQuest. And the major firms on wall

street

are big time java shops.

True, Java GUI development used to require quite a bit of work-
arounds when SWING was new. But that was a few years ago. I'm not
primarily a GUI guy - I mostly do "mission critical" server side
programming, but when i do venture back into SWING work I haven't had
many problems. True, it's cross-platform nature brings it's own
headaches with it.

I personaly can't recall any TWS problems that were Java based, nor
can I imagine any limitations it would introduce outside of
integration to outside apps via the OS (granted, this may be a
primary requirement to some). But any speed or graphics issues now-a-
days are generaly based on the developer's experience. I've done
professional c++, vb, delphi, and cobol work - and I'm at a loss as
to why one would think Java was not suitable platform... java's
weakness is in advanced mathemtics, and even then it was used for the
3-d graphics engine for EverQuest. And the major firms on wall street
are big time java shops.

I transfered this question to the VB message board I haunt.

Here is a response from one guy there:

Re: C++ vs. C#.NET vs. VB.NET
----------------------------------------------------------------------
----------
In .NET, pretty much all the languages are on equal footing. I think
VB is at a disadvantage with some of the OO stuff, though. I don't
think it has function overloading, which is extremely useful, and I'm
still not sure how much inheritance it allows. I could be wrong on
these, though. I haven't used VB.NET at all. 90% of code or more will
be almost exactly the same with VB and C# because of the shared
framework, which is where almost everything in .NET comes from. It
basically comes down to whether you want to use curly braces or not.
The difference in the two is that small. I haven't looked too much
into C++, and I haven't seen much documentation on C++.NET at all.

In my opinion, C++ is useful for three kinds of developers:
1) Ones who find that speed isn't satisfactory in other languages
2) People who need low-level access to the system
3) Gluttons for punishment. :)

Chris


--- In twsapi@y..., "dtkamp" <dkamp@e...> wrote:

In recent thread on IB board, Kent commented that C++ was the way

to

go for creating serious apps. Is this really true any more if

you're

starting from .NET, where all of its languages are based on same
underlying runtime lib.s and architecture. For purposes of building

a

killer trading app, does it really matter much whether you're using
VB.NET or C#.NET or C++? And can't you just mix in legacy C and C++
lib.s as necessary?

Both of these sites are highly recommended. They have been addded to
the Bookmarks section for future reference.

VB Explorer:

The VB Explorer site has very active excellent message boards with
very helpful people.

Planet Source Safe:

The Planet Source site has an excellent searchable code base.
Submissions are rated. Planet Source is the largest public code
database on the internet.

Scott
Owner

In recent thread on IB board, Kent commented that C++ was the way to
go for creating serious apps. Is this really true any more if you're
starting from .NET, where all of its languages are based on same
underlying runtime lib.s and architecture. For purposes of building a
killer trading app, does it really matter much whether you're using
VB.NET or C#.NET or C++? And can't you just mix in legacy C and C++
lib.s as necessary?

Hi all,

I have seen this problem in both my code, and in the testsocketclient
program.

If I call eConnect once, and it fails, the next time I call it, an
exception is thrown.

Anybody know how the connection process is supposed to work? (ie do
I need to create a new ewrapper and esocketclient each time I try to
connect, or can I reuse?)

thanks

Worth Repeating:

"goldensilvermana":

"It is the
little guy against the big boys and I smell blood. The problem is
that there are many lone wolves running down rabbit trails and that
is not the solution"


--- In twsapi@y..., "goldensilvermana" <kybryan@c...> wrote:

Dkamp

Here is how I envision a workable solution:

(1) All interested parties need to make a list of what problems

they

want solved.
(2) These problems need to be listed then voted on by the

interested

parties.
(3) Their needs to be an agreement on what problems there will be
solutions for.
(4) We need a group of people that will meet the financial
requirements. By meet I mean a small group with large pockets or a
large group that can kick in $50 to $100. What ever it would take

for

the design costs.
(5) There would have to be some organization structure and or

format

that would give the group input.
(6) A lead designer will have to be given the authority and be in
charge to make the decisive final necessary decisions to move the
project along timely.
(7) A committee and or board would be formed that would represent

the

team and be in charge. There cannot be mob rule, but active
participation will be encouraged. Professional people will hold

these

positions.
(8) Legal documents will be signed. All paying members will own a
stake in the software. Owners will pay cash upfront and receive
receipts and documentation.
(9) Initial cash will pay for professional system analysis and
design. Programmers will be determined by bid and or selection

after

system analysis and design is completed. Owners will be expected to
come up with monies for final coding of project.
(10) Resumes and references will be required to select members that
will be actively participating in the system analysis and design

and

coding.
(11) Coding will be compartmentalized to ensure software ownership
security.
(12) As soon as we come up with the cash and a competent team then

we

will move the dialog from the public forum to a secure system for
development.

I estimate about $10,000 to complete a design, but that may change
with the amount of interest and the bells and whistles wanted. I

have

people that I have worked with on projects that are reasonable cost
wise and very competent to execute what this project would entail.

Bottom line there is over 124 members and interested parties on the
Yahoo spin off thread since this thread was first posted. It is the
little guy against the big boys and I smell blood. The problem is
that there are many lone wolves running down rabbit trails and that
is not the solution for everyone. There are those that will always

go

that path but what I propose is organization and structure and

people

that work well within the team environment. We need a place to post
resumes.
Everyone welcome those with just cash and also those with IT skills
and cash. If you are interested in being part owner and would like

to

make a commitment in cash and or sweat please email and or post

Thanks dkamp for the questions, I will be out until Thursday night.

A

Q for you. Would the elite trader link thread help the quest? I see
that you frequent there.