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Voice ID'er for P25 Repeater
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Ron Sales
Why ruin a good repeater with junk like that P25 is supposed to be quiet. From: "'Rob Lee' rob@... [Repeater-Builder]" To: Repeater-Builder@... Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2018 9:43 PM Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Voice ID'er for P25 Repeater
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Looking for just a voice identifier for a P25
repeater. Any suggestions?
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Ed McKinney
I am interested in that as well! ____________________________________________________________________________________________ Seven? Three Ed McKinney - _______________________________________________________________________________ ?????????? an under servitude to the muslims ?????????? in any way or form. ____________________________________________________________________________________________
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Personally I don't see the need - but -?
There are two options that could work for this.? One is to use the wireline input and use analog for your voice announcement.? The other is to use a surplus DIU to vocode the announcement and inject it that way via V.24.? In either case I would recommend setting the wireline as lower-priority than repeat so it won't step on users and keep the CWID enabled for compliance in case a voice ID is missed.? The audio source for these announcements could be just about anything - from a raspberry PI (with a sound card) to a regular repeater controller.? The DIUs have come down in price significantly and can be had for under $100.? They are very handy for a number of applications also including audio logging/streaming.? This assumes you are running a Motorola Quantar or GTR 8000 and have a wireline card with the V.24 Daughter board.? If you don't they are widely available for reasonable prices. Dan Woodie, CETsr KC8ZUM |
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Ed McKinney
Not quite. It is ti ID every 10 minutes when a QSO is going on, along with CW ID, a voice would be nice. It does ID with CW now. I know commercial P-25s are ti ID every 15 minutes! On them, I understand no need for voice for the end users are not interested. ____________________________________________________________________________________________ Seven? Three Ed McKinney - _______________________________________________________________________________ ?????????? an under servitude to the muslims ?????????? in any way or form. ____________________________________________________________________________________________ On Wed, Sep 12, 2018 at 12:04 PM Ron Sales rre49sale@... [Repeater-Builder] <Repeater-Builder@...> wrote:
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I would also question the need/want for a voice ID on P25, though if adjusted properly and unlike most voice IDs it may work well. As for how, it greatly depends on your equipment. Often P25 repeaters are transparent where they receive the data, perform FEC, and rebroadcast. There are a few that have builtin interfaces but others require additional equipment. Quantars, for example, are transparent repeaters and require a DIU3000 to interface at a wireline level.
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On 9/12/2018 12:34 PM, Ed McKinney kb8qeu@... [Repeater-Builder] wrote:
Not quite. It is ti ID every 10 minutes when a QSO is going on, along with Ummm...doesn't it still have to ID in analog? |
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Ed McKinney
Hi I am interested in the VHF (2 meter ham) P-25. I read where they are 4TDM or something like that where four can have four conversations at once without interference with each, similar to trunking. Am I thinking right? For the whole group about P-25, is there a website I can go-to to learn P-25 deeply? Or, any PDF for downloading? I really had not learned much digital for in my past in the late 70s, they were talking about such in the W3C magazine. I use to read it at Texas Instrument's library. I do want to have a P-25 at my repeater stack of analogs. Also, can a P-25 be tied/linked with the analogs via an audio bridge? Well, a lot to learn! So, thanks in advance! TTFN! ____________________________________________________________________________________________ Seven? Three Ed McKinney - _______________________________________________________________________________ ?????????? an under servitude to the muslims ?????????? in any way or form. ____________________________________________________________________________________________ On Wed, Sep 12, 2018 at 1:24 PM Brett Friermood brett.friermood@... [Repeater-Builder] <Repeater-Builder@...> wrote:
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¿ªÔÆÌåÓý1. P25 Phase 1 (C4FM) is one transmission per channel. P25 Phase II is two-slot TDMA which gives two voice paths per channel.2. I¡¯d suggest starting with the Wiki which, although it¡¯s geared more to scanner users, does have some decent info on P25. There are some white papers out there elsewhere which go more deeply into the theory behind P25 but I can¡¯t remember where offhand. 3. Yes, you could patch a P25 repeater to an analog repeater, although you need to be careful about where you get the audio. Best bet is probably to use wireline connections so the audio is analog. Tom
--- Tom Swisher wa8pyr.list@... "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb?voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty?is a well-armed lamb contesting the?vote." - Benjamin Franklin
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Ed McKinney
Thank you for the info. It helps a lot! Still miles to go before I sleep! ____________________________________________________________________________________________ Seven? Three Ed McKinney - _______________________________________________________________________________ ?????????? an under servitude to the muslims ?????????? in any way or form. ____________________________________________________________________________________________ On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 1:35 PM Tom Swisher wa8pyr.list@... [Repeater-Builder] <Repeater-Builder@...> wrote:
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Since you didn't quote anyone's message we have no way of knowing what you are talking about or referring to. If by chance you are referring to the original post, anyone that has a P25 radio, receiver, or <$50 in hardware with some ambition and a working knowledge of linux would be able to hear a voice ID broadcast in P25 mode, just as with anything other P25 voice traffic. And unless something changed, audio transmitted in unencrypted P25 voice frames will certainly be heard through a properly programmed P25 radio. |
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Joe Borovetz
Items 2 and 3 in the previous post are both wrong. Radio Reference is the last place that I would even think about looking for P25 hardware information. You cannot get analog audio out of a P25 repeater at the wireline port when running in P25 mode. There is enough bad information floating around out there without folks adding to it. Without a lot of technical expertise and the hardware and software to do so running a voice ID on a P25 repeater in P25 mode is not the easiest thing to do. Run the repeater in mixed mode operation and feed the ID in as analog audio on the repeater in analog mode. Program your radios to operate in mixed mode. Even this is difficult unless you know how to program the wildcard settings, I am assuming you are using a Quantar. Buy a Northcomm Technologies cable and they will send you the instructions for programming the wildcard settings. Otherwise be prepared to get into the world of the DIU3000 and V.24 connections to the Quantar. |
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It sure would help if you would quote the post you are talking about
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
rather than make many of us guess. Mick - W7CAT ----- Original Message -----
From: "Joe Borovetz j.borovetz@... [Repeater-Builder]" To: "Repeater-Builder@..." Sent: Friday, September 14, 2018 11:32:14 AM Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Voice ID'er for P25 Repeater > Items 2 and 3 in the previous post are both wrong. > Radio Reference is the last place that I would even think about looking for P25 hardware information. > You cannot get analog audio out of a P25 repeater at the wireline port when running in P25 mode. > There is enough bad information floating around out there without folks adding to it. > Without a lot of technical expertise and the hardware and software to do so running a voice ID on a P25 repeater in P25 mode is not the easiest thing to do. > Run the repeater in mixed mode operation and feed the ID in as analog audio on the repeater in analog mode. Program your radios to operate in mixed mode. > Even this is difficult unless you know how to program the wildcard settings, I am assuming you are using a Quantar. > > Buy a Northcomm Technologies cable and they will send you the instructions for programming the wildcard settings. > Otherwise be prepared to get into the world of the DIU3000 and V.24 connections to the Quantar. > -- Untitled Document Be sure to check out all the latest at our web site <;! <; 
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Ed McKinney
I am wondering how can a P25 repeater identifies, even in commercial application at 15 minute intervals? How would the FCC knows it's operational or not? In amateur application, at least a CW IDer. Voice is nicer. HMMmm... ____________________________________________________________________________________________ Seven? Three Ed McKinney - _______________________________________________________________________________ ?????????? an under servitude to the muslims ?????????? in any way or form. ____________________________________________________________________________________________ On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 11:55 AM Brett Friermood brett.friermood@... [Repeater-Builder] <Repeater-Builder@...> wrote:
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Ed,
For conventional ID is generally done via CWID during between transmissions, generally every 15 minutes for commercial and public safety. If a user keys up it overrides the ID and re-tries during the next period of inactivity. Trunking is a different story. Due to the disruption that a CWID would cause, particularly on a control channel, there is an alternative ID scheme where the ID is contained in the data stream. The FCC (or anyone who can do a little bit of research on the internet) can decode this easily. Voice IDers are unnecessary and waste resources. If you absolutely must have one at least use something that doesn't sound like a computer voice from 1985. The purpose of an ID is for legal compliance ONLY. Any other use is just utilizing it as a convenience and should not be catered to. ID your station using the method that has the least impact on users and the least utilization of the hardware (Key-up time) and call it good. If you must have a voice ID please follow my recommendation to use the wireline (4-Wire Analog or V.24 from a DIU) and set it to the lowest priority so your users will not be impacted and can key over it. The CWID should still be enabled to ensure compliance even whe the voice ID is overridden. This should be set so that it doesn't encode PL/DPL so that the impact to users is minimized. Dan Woodie, CETsr KC8ZUM |
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Frank Perkins
Hi Ed, Just a thought . . I use a $37?ID-o-Matic IV for my Maxtrac 440 repeater to CW identify, control the fan, etc. They have a small add-on audio board (I think it was $20) to capture hold, and produce a voice identification. The little controller works well and is programmable via a USB cable with laptop running any terminal emulation program. Frank N6CES On Sat, Sep 15, 2018, 12:00 PM Ed McKinney kb8qeu@... [Repeater-Builder] <Repeater-Builder@...> wrote:
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