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Joanne, Ralf,

Yes, please. {Dons "Owner" hat, responds to anticipated cue.}

This is a topic which is not quite relevant to the IC-7000. I concur that it
would be best to take it off-list.

Best 73,
Adam, VA7OJ/AB4OJ
Owner, Yahoo! ic7000 Group


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From: "Ralf Reiterer" <ralfreit@...>

You pretty much have to play around to document it.

I know. I also have done that for other radios. The easy solution for
that boring part would be that Icom document the memory layout for every
radio supporting the 1A 00 command as they did for IC-R8500 and IC-R75.
That would save a lot of time and also prevent any damage of the radio
should corrupted data be written via that command (and the firmware
didn't failed to recoginze the data as being corrupted - the IC-PCR1000
is such a candidate).

This is what I
get for the 00 command:

That pretty much looks like the layout of the PRO version. So seems that
the storing capabilities have not changed between PRO and PROII.
Wondering about how the situation is for the PROIII...

BYTE unk1;
BYTE txtone[ 2 ]; // ? Really three bytes with unk1

Just a hit: I assume that unk1 really belongs to txtone (BYTE
txtone[3];) as that is the case for other radios too. However I have no
idea why Icom needs 3 bytes for a CTCSS tone when 2 suffice. ;-)

And this is what I get for the three P registers, the 1a 01 contents.
Alas, there is no command to transfer the Px registers to the
VFO. (Ah, if you do know one I overlooked please pass it along.)

Unfortunately not. I too do not see great utility in that registers.

...I change bands and the like. It also allows me to play with data

mode

filter selections and bandwidths.

For switching into data mode, you might consider using command 1A 06.

That's the way I used to do it. The switch into data mode is easy. Now
select a filter in data mode? That's the tough part. <sigh> That is
what I worked around using the memory load trick. I found it has some
utility if I do that. It's not huge. But it does work. And I get to
jam set several parameters which slightly reduces the time overhead
required to get the radio parameters fully changed. I implement 100
memories, the cannonical set of bands with WWV and 60 meters, and
3 vfos per hand. That combined with the push buttons I have anove
ny tuning rate slider makes a rather easy to use implementation. The
slider works logarithmicly. The further off center you go the faster
it tunes. And I set the rate tickmarks with buttons so I can quickly
move frequency in decade steps from 1Hz to 10MHz. I also added some
handy buttons for 3kHz steps and 5kHz steps. The 1, 3, and 5 kHz steps
make for nice manually controlled band scanning.

I've been building the thing for myself, mostly. So it works the way
I work rather than making any attempt to create an analog for any form
of receiver dial.

If they do it I do have experience with the "safe way" that we used
in the Motorola Inmarsat terminals. ...

That indeed is a very good strategy. It would be interesting if Icom has
chosen a (similar) safe way for updating the firmware in the IC-7800. If
not that radio would indeed turn into a very expensive brick. ;-)

Just for curiosity: what kind of software do you develop for the
IC-756PROII?

A remote control. If you want to see it I can send it to you. It has
one glaring problem that I need to tweak and repair and some lack of
controllability at the moment - TX tone and filter controls and the
like. Stuff I set and forget for the most part. The problem is making
changes too fast gets it confused. I have gone to considerable effort
to make the remote control safe when you make manual control changes.
That comes back and bites me a little. {^_-} I have in mind two strategies
for fixing the problem. But I'm being lazy at the moment.

If you play with C++ I can even let you have the source under GPL.

Maybe we should move the communication off list. Otherwise people might
beat us for being off topic.

<grin> At least it's more or less on topic. It is about the Pro's.

Send me email if you're interested. (And if I don't answer within about a
day send it to the list. It's rare but sometimes my VERY aggressive spam
filter misfires, particularly if the mail is not plain text or is full of
three letter combinations and odd punctuation marks. (Both are really
good spam indicators, by the way.)

{^_-} W6MKU, Joanne, (The broadcast video software I do is NOT GPL by
ANY stretch of the imagination. This remote control is recreation.)

You pretty much have to play around to document it.

I know. I also have done that for other radios. The easy solution for
that boring part would be that Icom document the memory layout for every
radio supporting the 1A 00 command as they did for IC-R8500 and IC-R75.
That would save a lot of time and also prevent any damage of the radio
should corrupted data be written via that command (and the firmware
didn't failed to recoginze the data as being corrupted - the IC-PCR1000
is such a candidate).

This is what I
get for the 00 command:

That pretty much looks like the layout of the PRO version. So seems that
the storing capabilities have not changed between PRO and PROII.
Wondering about how the situation is for the PROIII...

BYTE unk1;
BYTE txtone[ 2 ]; // ? Really three bytes with unk1

Just a hit: I assume that unk1 really belongs to txtone (BYTE
txtone[3];) as that is the case for other radios too. However I have no
idea why Icom needs 3 bytes for a CTCSS tone when 2 suffice. ;-)

And this is what I get for the three P registers, the 1a 01 contents.
Alas, there is no command to transfer the Px registers to the
VFO. (Ah, if you do know one I overlooked please pass it along.)

Unfortunately not. I too do not see great utility in that registers.

...I change bands and the like. It also allows me to play with data

mode

filter selections and bandwidths.

For switching into data mode, you might consider using command 1A 06.

If they do it I do have experience with the "safe way" that we used
in the Motorola Inmarsat terminals. ...

That indeed is a very good strategy. It would be interesting if Icom has
chosen a (similar) safe way for updating the firmware in the IC-7800. If
not that radio would indeed turn into a very expensive brick. ;-)

Just for curiosity: what kind of software do you develop for the
IC-756PROII?

Maybe we should move the communication off list. Otherwise people might
beat us for being off topic.

Regards
Ralf, OE5ROP

From: "Ralf Reiterer" <ralfreit@...>

Where in the data field returned by the 1a 00 command does
the ProII return repeater offset? It returns tones and
whether tones are in use. It rather ignores the concept of
offset as far as I can find.

Yeah, it seems so since it also does provides split operation only by
command 0F but no shift state (DUP-, DUP+). Unfortunately I have not
found any documentation about the contents sent by the IC-756PROII and
III for command 1A 00 . As I'm currently writing a
IC-756/PRO/PROII/PROIII driver for my software (www.radioctl.com) any
documentation for that command would be helpful.

You pretty much have to play around to document it. This is what I
get for the 00 command:
typedef struct
{
BYTE subcommand;
BYTE memoryNumber[ 2 ];
BYTE sel; //Sel- Scan Select flag (1 byte) $01
BYTE frequency[ 5 ];
BYTE mode;
BYTE filterbw;
BYTE flags; // Flags: &01 - when set, Tx Subtone on
// &02 - when set, Rx Subtone on
// &10 - when set, Mode LSB, USB,
// AM, FM is modified to data mode
BYTE unk1;
BYTE txtone[ 2 ]; // ? Really three bytes with unk1
BYTE unk2;
BYTE rxtone[ 2 ]; // ? really three bytes with unk1.
BYTE name[ 10 ]; // 10 bytes ascii name (Fill in end tag first)
} ICOM_memory;

And this is what I get for the three P registers, the 1a 01 contents.
Alas, there is no command to transfer the Px registers to the VFO. (Ah,
if you do know one I overlooked please pass it along.) I've not looked
too hard into the Px memories because I see little utility to it. (I am
using memory 99 as a utility memory for jam setting the transceiver when
I change bands and the like. It also allows me to play with data mode
filter selections and bandwidths.

typedef struct
{
BYTE band;
BYTE bandregister;
BYTE frequency[ 5 ];
BYTE mode;
BYTE filterbw;
BYTE unk1; // maybe subtone flags.
BYTE unk2;
BYTE txtone[ 2 ];
BYTE unk3;
BYTE rxtone[ 2 ];
} ICOM_px_memory;

I wonder if the 7000's firmware
will be updateable.

I really hope that it will be. Man each modern computer allows the BIOS
to be updated, so shouldn't it be standard for all modern radio devices
too!?

If they do it I do have experience with the "safe way" that we used
in the Motorola Inmarsat terminals. Always run from RAM. For an update
transfer to a never written to chunk of EEPROM or an actual PROM with
the necessary bootloader code. Once new code is in memory and the set
is running from that code it can be written to the EEPROM in one
relatively fast operation. If it gets interrupted the untouched part of
memory still allows you to update your radio. Otherwise those SatCom
terminals could become VERY expensive boatanchors. It was well thought
out in advance to prevent the boatanchor phenomenon. They learned from
seeing what happened with the first Intel motherboards/boatanchors that
had the EEPROM feature.

{^_-} W6MKU

Where in the data field returned by the 1a 00 command does
the ProII return repeater offset? It returns tones and
whether tones are in use. It rather ignores the concept of
offset as far as I can find.

Yeah, it seems so since it also does provides split operation only by
command 0F but no shift state (DUP-, DUP+). Unfortunately I have not
found any documentation about the contents sent by the IC-756PROII and
III for command 1A 00 . As I'm currently writing a
IC-756/PRO/PROII/PROIII driver for my software (www.radioctl.com) any
documentation for that command would be helpful.

It's another "failing" on the
part of ICOM in the ProII. And if the firmware cannot be
updated in the ProIII there are undubtedly some similar
failures that it endures.

Unfortunately that not only convers the ProII or III firmware but almost
any. Take the IC-706MKIIG, it has the same front panel than the IC-703
but unlike the radio the MKIIG does not allow controlling volume or
squelch via CI-V - a feature/command that has already been available
when the IC-R7100 came out! Another example is the new R20. It has
exactly the same command set than the R10 although the radio itself has
many more features. I really have no idea why they place such
unnecessary (virtual) limits in the firmware...

I wonder if the 7000's firmware
will be updateable.

I really hope that it will be. Man each modern computer allows the BIOS
to be updated, so shouldn't it be standard for all modern radio devices
too!?

Ralf

Here is a mirror site, for those times when QSL.net is having a not-so-good
day:



Best 73,
Adam, VA7OJ/AB4OJ
Owner, Yahoo! ic7000 Group


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From: "Ralf Reiterer" <ralfreit@...>

You can already download memory files to the IC-706... there
is software that does this very well.. It uses the C-IV
interface on the 706.

...

On the other hand all modern Icom radios like IC-756ProII/III or IC-703
offer an extended command (1A 00) that allows to read/write the full
content of the channel. On the IC-703 for example it is possible to
write split frequency, CTCSS and repeater tone and even the alphanumeric
memory name with this extended command. As the IC-703 is very similar to
the IC-706MKIIG (with respect to the firmware) that would have been also
a great addition to that rig.

Where in the data field returned by the 1a 00 command does the ProII
return repeater offset? It returns tones and whether tones are in use.
It rather ignores the concept of offset as far as I can find. It's another
"failing" on the part of ICOM in the ProII. And if the firmware cannot
be updated in the ProIII there are undubtedly some similar failures that
it endures. I wonder if the 7000's firmware will be updateable.

{^_-}

You can already download memory files to the IC-706... there
is software that does this very well.. It uses the C-IV
interface on the 706.

Unfortunately that's not 100% correct. The memory storing and loading
capability offered by the IC-706 over CI-V does not allow to write/read
the full contents of a memory channel. For example it is not possible to
write the alphanumeric memory name. Also the split frequency cannot be
read/written directly.

On the other hand all modern Icom radios like IC-756ProII/III or IC-703
offer an extended command (1A 00) that allows to read/write the full
content of the channel. On the IC-703 for example it is possible to
write split frequency, CTCSS and repeater tone and even the alphanumeric
memory name with this extended command. As the IC-703 is very similar to
the IC-706MKIIG (with respect to the firmware) that would have been also
a great addition to that rig.

The bottom line is, I really hope the IC-7000 will provide that command
and (more important) Icom will document it properly as they did for
IC-R8500.

Regards
Ralf

You can already download memory files to the IC-706... there is software that does this very well.. It uses the C-IV interface on the 706.

I did some cut and paste to put the IC-7000 next to the IC-706. The IC-7000
frequency display seems to be about 1/4" high versus about 5/8" high for the
706. The smaller numbers would not be much of an issue the way that I
normally operate (i.e. sitting still with the engine off), but it seems like
it may be a too small when operating mobile in motion. I am also wondering
about the brightness and contrast of the display in a bright mobile
environment. I used a 756PRO during field day one year and the display,
although readable, lacked sufficient brightness.

Here is a link to the picture that I made of the IC-7000 next to the IC-706.
I assumed that the height of the 7000 was the same as that of the 706.



John DeRuiter, WM7A

Good idea-- However the search was zero...
One comment was could they hide it???
Answer is NO... It is all of public record. In fact in their submission they have to provide a copy of the manual in addition to the lab test data and photo's of the test setup etc...

Here is a sample of what you can find -- this being the IC-756 PROIII

'AFJ217800'

73 de W4MAY Paul



Message: 16
Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 12:15:07 -0800 (PST)
From: chuck maurer <lomaurer@...>
Subject: FCC approval

Has anyone searched the FCC website for documents
concerning the approval cycle required by the FCC for
type acceptance or whatever they call it. This
process takes several months and must be done prior to
US marketing. The problem is knowing what ICOM called
the 7000 when they submitted it to the FCC. It could
be under a code name.
Chuck
KE5DMF

What has kept me from buying most mobile rigs is the lack of a computer interface that lets me download and upload memory files to and from the radio.

Its beyond me why any computer interface to a radio doesn't always include that feature... or why bother at all eh?

The ability to load frequencies of interest based on current events going on in the world (ham and swl), and for different travel destinations is important to me. It takes a lot of time to manually load frequencies. It takes a long time to create memory files too for various interest support. But when done, it is so fast and convenient to change those memory channels, even on the road with a lap top.

Keep in mind I prefer the radio to be as free of a computer connection to work fully and completely. I don't want a computer to have to be connected to fake the memory files for me that are not there when the radio is bare bones.

73 from Bill - WD8ARZ

Correct link for mirror site of English-language IC-7000 page. Apologies for
the typographic error.



Best 73,
Adam, VA7OJ/AB4OJ
Owner, Yahoo! ic7000 Group


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Ah, many thanks I thought it was my PC.

Well, having looked at the French documentation and able to stumble
along and interpret the specs... Icom may have come close to my wish
list.

Owning a Mark V, VX-5R, FT7800 and a prior owner of 706 MkIIG for
mobile use, my wish list of features for a 'car' sized rig is as
follows:

A) 1000 memories and multiple bank groupins so that it can be used
as a scanner like my FT-7800 can do.

B) Be able to scan Up or Down with a simple knob turn like most
Yaesu allow

C) Better display like that presented... Hope Icom learns how to
design the LCD driver circuits though!!!!!!

D) A CAT interface that make SENSE instead of the crippled MkIIG
limited capabilities

E) KEEP the SWR graphing capabilies but also support 144/430 here

F) Keep all of the current 706 MkIIG features like the Ts etc...

G) Add basspand tuning as well as the ability to setup filter width!

H) AND MY BIG GRIPE --- ALLOW THE 'TAGS' TO BE CONTINUOULY VISIBLE
AS WELL AS FREQUENCY so that when you scan, you get BOTH on the
display! The 706 MkIIG was a real PAIN in this regard, you needed to
rotate through the S2 (Scan) and G4(tag display) menus to do that!


Look, the 706MkIIG was (and is) a great HF rig as the numerous
contacts that I have made with the corresponding reply "I cannot
believe you are mobile" will attest to... BTW -- with a 20m hamstick!
BUT, I am looking for 1 rig that can act in multiple roles one of
which is a scanner!

After purchasing a Bearcat non-trunking scanner, I can see the
obvious differences BUT having tons of memory and groups would
definetly fill my needs in this area.

Tuning car mounted hamstick with a 706 was a real simple thing!
Seeing what the SWR (as a graph and having it remembered) is also
really nice!

A tuner would be a plus BUT with the above tuned hamsticks, 15..10m
really didn't need a tuner in my setup!

Bottom line, I want the ease of the 706MkIIG tuning when going down
the road BUT I want more features when I'm parked and waiting for
the XYL to finish her shopping!!!

Still waiting for the qsl website so I can look at files...

73,
W1LSO

Thanks Adam. IC-756proII has not a very powerfull DSP. We will see.

73, Peter

--- In ic7000@..., Adam Farson <farson@s...> wrote:

Hi Peter,

As far as I can determine without the schematics, the 756Pro3 uses

the same

DSP, ADC and DAC as the 756Pro2. It has been reported that the

noise

reduction is superior to that of the Pro2; this may suggest a

slightly

faster DSP.

Cheers for now, 73,
Adam VA7OJ/AB4OJ




-----Original Message-----
From: Peter [mailto:hb9pjt@u...]
Sent: Wednesday, February 16, 2005 13:40
To: ic7000@...
Subject: [ic7000] Re: Price of the IC-7000




Adam, does the 756ProIII not have a more powerfull DSP than the
ProII?

--- In ic7000@..., Adam Farson <farson@s...> wrote:

Hi Buck,

Yes, the IC-7000 will use DSP filtering in the final IF. This is

the same

technology as used in the IC-756Pro series, the IC-746Pro/7400

and

the

IC-7800.



The ultimate performance of the DSP-IF subsystem - dynamic range,

noise

floor, filter shape factors, noise reduction etc. is a function

of the ADC

(analogue/digital converter) which is the interface between the

analogue

RF/IF chain and the DSP. The faster the DSP chip, the better the

filter

shape factors, NR etc. are likely to be. All the current Icom

DSP-

based

radios use a 24-bit ADC and DAC and a 32-bit floating-point DSP.

The 756Pro

series uses the ADI SHARC, whilst the 746Pro and 7800 use faster

TI devices.

The ADC used in the 756Pro series has a slightly better noise

floor than

that of the 746Pro. The 7800 uses very high-quality ADC's which

are rather

costly.

The demands placed on the DAC (digital/analogue converter are

rather less

than those which the ADC has to meet, although the DAC plays an

important

role in setting the dynamic range of the transmitter. The ADC is

the key to

the receiver; if it degrades the incoming IF signal, all that

information is

lost forever and cannot be recovered.

There are a number of articles covering these topics (and others)

on my Icom

page.



Cheers for now, 73,
Adam VA7OJ/AB4OJ


-----Original Message-----
From: Buck (N4PGW) [mailto:na4fm-list@t...]
Sent: 16 February 2005 05:58
To: ic7000@...
Subject: [ic7000] Price of the IC-7000


Hello to all and thank you to the moderator of this reflector.

Ever since I have seen the IC-7000, I have been reading and

talking about

it. Like most of us here, I have considered it the new IC-706

radio but

after all I have read and seen, I have begun to think that 7000

is

to the

706 what the 756 pro is to the 746 pro.

What weighs most strongly is the fact that it will use electronic

filtering

rather than the crystal lattice filter. If I recall, isn't this

the same

filtering technology used in the IC-7800, the $10,000 radio?

From what I gather, the 706 is the most popular mobile HF radio

on

the

market with sales greatly exceeding its runner-up. Right now it

sells for

about $800 US. I realize that the cost of technology drops over

time, and

with inflation, prices rise a bit, but at this point I am

wondering if the

rig might not be priced considerably higher than the 706. Around

here, a

few hams are thinking it will be in the $1500 US range.

What do you all think?

Buck
N4PGW




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Yahoo! Groups Links








Scanned by WinProxy

Hi Ya'akov,

Here is the English translation:



Mirror site:



We may set up a file area later on, once the IC-7000 has been released.

Best 73,
Adam, VA7OJ/AB4OJ
Moderator, Yahoo! ic7000 Group

Somebody else already did an English summary of the features:



(seems to be down at present)

Alan NV8A


On 02/19/05 01:38 pm Ya`akov N. Miles tossed the following ingredients into the ever-growing pot of cybersoup:

I have a picture of the IC-7000 and the specifications in French
available as a download from ftp://ftp.yehudi.ca/ham-radio/ic-7000.pdf
I was wondering if anyone has a picture of the IC-7000 and
specifications in English, and if they did, then upload it to the
directory "incoming" Many many people have visited my web site just
to pick up the ic-7000.pdf file, and I am sure they are not all fluent
in French(!)

Is the ic-7000 group going to set up a file area?

Hello, would you please point me to the link?

I have a fast broadband connection but cannot get to the published
sites!

Thanks,

Laurier St.Onge ( W1LSO )



--- In ic7000@..., "Mark - AA6DX" <aa6dx@a...> wrote:

Hi all .. wow, what a busy group for its age! HIHI ... you know, I

love the looks of what I've seen in the pix .. I downloaded the
manual, etc ... my problem is age is taking its toll on my eyes, an
I can just picture going down the road trying to take advantage of
the mini screen on the 7??? ---- and if it's there, I want to use
it .. HIHI This would be a great time for someone (not me!) to jump
in and manufacture a great accessory, a plug-in flat BIG SCREEN
(12VDC) monitor that replicates (?) the face of the rig .. ..
something one could Velcro to the dash, etc..... an entrepreneur
could make a killing!

I have been using (by choice) my MKIIG as a home station for the

last few months just to really learn to run it, which is hard to do
while mobile. I have been very impressed with its capabilities
during contests, etc... Right after I get my new PROIII in a
couple months, I will start a piggy bank for a 7??? if it pans out.

73, and Howdy! to all -- Mark, AA6DX Eureka, FAR

NORTHERN CALIFORNIA

Hi Peter,

As far as I can determine without the schematics, the 756Pro3 uses the same
DSP, ADC and DAC as the 756Pro2. It has been reported that the noise
reduction is superior to that of the Pro2; this may suggest a slightly
faster DSP.

Cheers for now, 73,
Adam VA7OJ/AB4OJ