Jim,

Could you explain more on how to make the mix with the copper wire? I like the idea of less corrosive fumes.

Thanks,

Dave



On 3/19/2019 2:39 PM, Jim Higgins wrote:

If you're adding H2O2 to the solution, you don't need bubbles to regenerate since the oxygen from the H2O2 will do the regeneration.

Personally I'd make a solution of copper wire in HCl and H2O2 and do my etching with that, using air to regenerate. No H2O2 after the initial amount needed to get the reaction started to make the solution, and once the initial solution is prepared, only a bit of HCl left over. Let the cupric chloride in the solution do the etching and regenerate with air... adding a bit of HCl when the solution won't fully regenerate or if etching produces a persistent brownish color. That approach also virtually eliminates the HCl fumes everyone seems to be so concerned about since there isn't a great excess of HCl.

Jim H

Pretty much need a handle and tip to test. However, you might be able to wire just a tip with a diy socket of hobby?

brass or an Arduino type wire jumper and outer clips. It's at RF frequencies so not a long turm hookup,?

but a go-nogo test.

On Thu, Mar 21, 2019 at 7:25 PM Dave <theschemer@...> wrote:

@Harvey,

?? I picked up an older PS2E-01 from ebay without a soldering pencil and
it was listed as "tested-good".? I got the unit and both lights appear
to be on when powered up. Is that all it takes to be tested or do I need
an iron to be sure it works? I missed out on a soldering pencil as I was
sick and had a rough day with other stuff that day and missed the
bidding. Also, are the new pencils from China any good or are they to be
avoided?

Thanks,

Dave

p.s All my carbide drills arrived along with other goodies that I have
been waiting on. :) Hopefully I got the best sizes.

_.

<> is a rather complete chart of chemical resistance of various plastics. Legend and description of the chart's resistance ratings are on the last page.

Donald.
--
*Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue
() no proprietary attachments; no html mail
/\ <>

On 2019-03-20 2:40 p.m., Michael Sims wrote:

Another possibility for the tank is to use a Storage Dispenser from Walmart.? The dispenser is the kind used for storing and dispensing cereal or other grains.

I've been using one obtained from Walmart for a ferric chloride etching tank for a number of years.?? Recently purchased another one of the same size and I'm assuming the new one is made of the same material as the original dispenser.
The label on the new dispenser says the material is polypropylene and dimensions are 7 1/2" w x 3 1/2" d x 11" h, not including the top. Unfortunately, I don't have any of the labeling, etc., that came with the original dispenser.

I've been leaving the ferric chloride in the dispenser as it has a removable, tight top and I've notice no degradation in the flexibility or strength of the original dispenser.? The tank heater and tubing used with the bubbler are removed after each use.

??In addition, the bubbler (fish tank aerator), 1/4" tubing and connections were obtained from the pet section of Walmart.? I already had a fish tank heater.

I would be interested in knowing if polypropylene can be used as an etching tank for other common PCB etching chemicals, e.g., H2O2, HCl, etc.

?? 73,
?? Mike, K4GMH



--
Mike, K4GMH

Another possibility for the tank is to use a Storage Dispenser from Walmart.? The dispenser is the kind used for storing and dispensing cereal or other grains.?

I've been using one obtained from Walmart for a ferric chloride etching tank for a number of years.?? Recently purchased another one of the same size and I'm assuming the new one is made of the same material as the original dispenser.??

The label on the new dispenser says the material is polypropylene and dimensions are 7 1/2" w x 3 1/2" d x 11" h, not including the top.? Unfortunately, I don't have any of the labeling, etc., that came with the original dispenser.

I've been leaving the ferric chloride in the dispenser as it has a removable, tight top and I've notice no degradation in the flexibility or strength of the original dispenser.? The tank heater and tubing used with the bubbler are removed after each use.

?In addition, the bubbler (fish tank aerator), 1/4" tubing and connections were obtained from the pet section of Walmart.? I already had a fish tank heater.?

I would be interested in knowing if polypropylene can be used as an etching tank for other common PCB etching chemicals, e.g., H2O2, HCl, etc.?

? 73,

? Mike, K4GMH

--
Mike, K4GMH

I would suggest that for an easy low cost etching tank, go to a thrift store and purchase a suitable sized crock pot .? Make sure it is a ceramic one .? They are not affected by Ferric Chloride , have a built in heating element .? I store mine , an 8.5 qt oval one , outside under a cover to keep the weather out .? Use an oval or round unit , the rectangular ones have cracking issues .? For long term use (leaving the etchant in long term , you may need to replace the screw in the center of the clear glass cover with a titanium one , and the seal around the lid with one made from some slit gas line of epdm rubber hose .? I suggest filling with water , to the desired level , and time it for how long it takes to reach your desired temperature with the desired amount of liquid .? I would expect that ceramic would also stand up to HCL and peroxide also .? I am currently working on an idea of using a motor such as a vibrating unit as a cell phone has , for agitation rather than bubbles , but I haven't decided yet .??

_._,_._,_

---

If you're adding H2O2 to the solution, you don't need bubbles to regenerate since the oxygen from the H2O2 will do the regeneration.

Personally I'd make a solution of copper wire in HCl and H2O2 and do my etching with that, using air to regenerate. No H2O2 after the initial amount needed to get the reaction started to make the solution, and once the initial solution is prepared, only a bit of HCl left over. Let the cupric chloride in the solution do the etching and regenerate with air... adding a bit of HCl when the solution won't fully regenerate or if etching produces a persistent brownish color. That approach also virtually eliminates the HCl fumes everyone seems to be so concerned about since there isn't a great excess of HCl.

Jim H



Received from Jean-Paul Louis via Groups.Io at 3/19/2019 02:53 PM UTC:

Jeffrey,
You need bubbles if you use HCl plus H2O2, to regenerate the solution. The benefit of bubbles is double. They regenerate the solution and agitate thy he bath at the same time.

Just a thought,
Jean-Paul
N1JPL


On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 11:58 PM, Jeffrey Ohlson via Groups.Io <jeff_062@...> wrote:

I would suggest that for an easy low cost etching tank, go to a thrift store and purchase a suitable sized crock pot. Make sure it is a ceramic one. They are not affected by Ferric Chloride, have a built in heating element. I store mine, an 8.5 qt oval one, outside under a cover to keep the weather out. Use an oval or round unit, the rectangular ones have cracking issues. For long term use (leaving the etchant in long term, you may need to replace the screw in the center of the clear glass cover with a titanium one, and the seal around the lid with one made from some slit gas line of epdm rubber hose.? I suggest filling with water, to the desired level, and time it for how long it takes to reach your desired temperature with the desired amount of liquid. I would expect that ceramic would also stand up to HCL and peroxide also. I am currently working on an idea of using a motor such as a vibrating unit as a cell phone has, for agitation rather than bubbles, but I haven't decided yet .

Another possibility for the tank is to use a Storage Dispenser from Walmart.? The dispenser is the kind used for storing and dispensing cereal or other grains.
I've been using one obtained from Walmart for a ferric chloride etching tank for a number of years.?? Recently purchased another one of the same size and I'm assuming the new one is made of the same material as the original dispenser.
The label on the new dispenser says the material is polypropylene and dimensions are 7 1/2" w x 3 1/2" d x 11" h, not including the top. Unfortunately, I don't have any of the labeling, etc., that came with the original dispenser.
I've been leaving the ferric chloride in the dispenser as it has a removable, tight top and I've notice no degradation in the flexibility or strength of the original dispenser.? The tank heater and tubing used with the bubbler are removed after each use.
?In addition, the bubbler (fish tank aerator), 1/4" tubing and connections were obtained from the pet section of Walmart.? I already had a fish tank heater.
I would be interested in knowing if polypropylene can be used as an etching tank for other common PCB etching chemicals, e.g., H2O2, HCl, etc.
? 73,
? Mike, K4GMH
--
Mike, K4GMH

Another possibility for the tank is to use a Storage Dispenser from Walmart.?? The dispenser is the kind used for storing and dispensing cereal or other grains.??

I've been using one obtained from Walmart for a ferric chloride etching tank for a number of years.? ?? Recently purchased another one of the same size and I'm assuming the new one is made of the same material as the original dispenser.? ??
The label on the new dispenser says the material is polypropylene and dimensions are 7 1/2" w x 3 1/2" d x 11" h, not including the top.?? Unfortunately, I don't have any of the labeling, etc., that came with the original dispenser.

I've been leaving the ferric chloride in the dispenser as it has a removable, tight top and I've notice no degradation in the flexibility or strength of the original dispenser.?? The tank heater and tubing used with the bubbler are removed after each use.

? In addition, the bubbler (fish tank aerator), 1/4" tubing and connections were obtained from the pet section of Walmart.?? I already had a fish tank heater.??

I would be interested in knowing if polypropylene can be used as an etching tank for other common PCB etching chemicals, e.g., H2O2, HCl, etc.??

?? 73,
?? Mike, K4GMH



--
Mike, K4GMH

Jeffrey,
You need bubbles if you use HCl plus H2O2, to regenerate the solution. The benefit of bubbles is double. They regenerate the solution and agitate thy he bath at the same time.

Just a thought,
Jean-Paul
N1JPL


On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 11:58 PM, Jeffrey Ohlson via Groups.Io <jeff_062@...> wrote:

I would suggest that for an easy low cost etching tank, go to a thrift store and purchase a suitable sized crock pot. Make sure it is a ceramic one. They are not affected by Ferric Chloride, have a built in heating element. I store mine, an 8.5 qt oval one, outside under a cover to keep the weather out. Use an oval or round unit, the rectangular ones have cracking issues. For long term use (leaving the etchant in long term, you may need to replace the screw in the center of the clear glass cover with a titanium one, and the seal around the lid with one made from some slit gas line of epdm rubber hose. I suggest filling with water, to the desired level, and time it for how long it takes to reach your desired temperature with the desired amount of liquid. I would expect that ceramic would also stand up to HCL and peroxide also. I am currently working on an idea of using a motor such as a vibrating unit as a cell phone has, for agitation rather than bubbles, but I haven't decided yet .

On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 11:58 PM, Jeffrey Ohlson via Groups.Io

<jeff_062@...> wrote:

I would suggest that for an easy low cost etching tank, go to a thrift store and purchase a suitable sized crock pot .? Make sure it is a ceramic one .? They are not affected by Ferric Chloride , have a built in heating element .? I store mine , an 8.5 qt oval one , outside under a cover to keep the weather out .? Use an oval or round unit , the rectangular ones have cracking issues .? For long term use (leaving the etchant in long term , you may need to replace the screw in the center of the clear glass cover with a titanium one , and the seal around the lid with one made from some slit gas line of epdm rubber hose .? I suggest filling with water , to the desired level , and time it for how long it takes to reach your desired temperature with the desired amount of liquid .? I would expect that ceramic would also stand up to HCL and peroxide also .? I am currently working on an idea of using a motor such as a vibrating unit as a cell phone has , for agitation rather than bubbles , but I haven't decided yet .??