Re: Saw blade sharpening service?
Hi David,
??? There was a permissions issue.? Brian fixed it this morning.?
You should be able to edit things now.
--
Michael Garrison Stuber
On 2/27/2020 10:32 PM, David P Best
wrote:
I don¡¯t see how to edit the Wiki Sources file. ?I¡¯m logged in, can
see the Sources page, but see no editing controls.
David Best
On Feb 27, 2020, at 7:00 PM, Michael Garrison
Stuber < mtgstuber@...>
wrote:
There's actually a "Wiki" page in Groups.IO:
/g/felderownersgroup/wiki/home
It might make more sense to put it there, as
it would allow anyone to add/edit it and it would any
issues with files being locked or overwritten.
I took a stab at a "Sources" page.? I've
listed Rangate, Lamb Tool Works, Mac's Airtight
Clamps, and Quinn as starting items.
I welcome folks to edit / add as needed.
--
Michael Garrison Stuber.
On 2/27/2020 3:44 PM, David
Davies wrote:
Do we need to start a
"sources" document in the files section where we can
list these good places to find the stuff we need?
Dave Davies
On Thu, Feb 27,
2020 at 5:42 PM Jason Holtz < jholtzy@...>
wrote:
Quinn is great. You won't
be disappointed.
Jason Holtz
J. Holtz Furniture
3307 Snelling Ave. South
Minneapolis, MN 55406
612.432.2765
--
Jason
J. Holtz Furniture
3307 Snelling Ave. South
Minneapolis, MN 55406
--
Dave & Marie Davies
318-219-7868
--
Michael Garrison Stuber
--
Michael Garrison Stuber
|
I asked several times ¡°is everything tight? All the bolts installed?¡± They said yes... tension? I guess, they pushed their finger on the belt and said thats good. bolts? Didn¡¯t see a torque wrench, they are arm tightened Regards, Mark
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On Feb 28, 2020, at 9:25 AM, John Kee <jmkserv@...> wrote:
? Well the solution looks pretty straight forward Mark, align the pulleys properly. Whether you do it or Felder. You said the techs just blew it off as not important shows they have very little understanding of how drive belts and pulley alignment effect vibration. You said it was pulled apart, did they tighten and tension everything? That and the other possible source of the vibration¡ ? From: mark thomas <murkyd@...>
Sent: Friday, February 28, 2020 9:14 AM
To: Mark Kessler <mkessler10@...>; [email protected]
Subject: Re: [FOG] Saw vibration ? On Fri, Feb 28, 2020 at 05:57 AM, Mark Kessler wrote: maybe the belt jumping teeth twice is a red hearing
Seems more likely an alignment problem than a red herring.
--
|
The other thing i asked them when replacing the motor was ¡°don¡¯t you need to check to make sure the motor pulley is in line with the arbor¡± response was, no it just goes on the motor shaft all the way back and its good.?
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On Feb 28, 2020, at 9:18 AM, Mark Kessler via Groups.Io <mkessler10@...> wrote:
? That and the other possible source of the vibration¡ ? From: mark thomas <murkyd@...>
Sent: Friday, February 28, 2020 9:14 AM
To: Mark Kessler <mkessler10@...>; [email protected]
Subject: Re: [FOG] Saw vibration ? On Fri, Feb 28, 2020 at 05:57 AM, Mark Kessler wrote: maybe the belt jumping teeth twice is a red hearing
Seems more likely an alignment problem than a red herring.
|
Well the solution looks pretty straight forward Mark, align the pulleys properly. Whether you do it or Felder. You said the techs just blew it off as not important shows they have very little understanding of how drive belts and pulley alignment effect vibration. You said it was pulled apart, did they tighten and tension everything?
That and the other possible source of the vibration¡ ? From: mark thomas <murkyd@...>
Sent: Friday, February 28, 2020 9:14 AM
To: Mark Kessler <mkessler10@...>; [email protected]
Subject: Re: [FOG] Saw vibration ? On Fri, Feb 28, 2020 at 05:57 AM, Mark Kessler wrote: maybe the belt jumping teeth twice is a red hearing
Seems more likely an alignment problem than a red herring.
|
That and the other possible source of the vibration¡ ?
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Show quoted text
From: mark thomas <murkyd@...>
Sent: Friday, February 28, 2020 9:14 AM
To: Mark Kessler <mkessler10@...>; [email protected]
Subject: Re: [FOG] Saw vibration ? On Fri, Feb 28, 2020 at 05:57 AM, Mark Kessler wrote: maybe the belt jumping teeth twice is a red hearing
Seems more likely an alignment problem than a red herring.
|
Let¡¯s not get my post on a different subject:) but I always (I try) hit reply all then put whoever i am addressing in the ¡°to¡± and in the ¡°cc¡± FOG? Lets discuss the funny groups io issue on Johns new thread /g/felderownersgroup/topic/emails_and_signing_them/71607379?p=,,,20,0,0,0::recentpostdate%2Fsticky,,,20,2,0,71607379
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On Feb 28, 2020, at 9:08 AM, mark thomas <murkyd@...> wrote:
?On Fri, Feb 28, 2020 at 12:03 AM, david@... wrote: The following was addressed to me specifically. ? I never made such a posting. ? Who is the ¡°you¡± in your ¡°We had . ?. ? . ? . ending with you ²õ²¹²â¾±²Ô²µ:¡±?
I just pressed the "Reply" button on the last post on the thread.? Groups.io sends emails to both the poster and the group (a dumb behavior)
|
On Fri, Feb 28, 2020 at 05:57 AM, Mark Kessler wrote:
maybe the belt jumping teeth twice is a red hearing
Seems more likely an alignment problem than a red herring.
|
On Fri, Feb 28, 2020 at 12:03 AM, david@... wrote:
The following was addressed to me specifically. ? I never made such a posting. ? Who is the ¡°you¡± in your ¡°We had . ?. ? . ? . ending with you ²õ²¹²â¾±²Ô²µ:¡±?
I just pressed the "Reply" button on the last post on the thread.? Groups.io sends emails to both the poster and the group (a dumb behavior)
|
Re: Emails and Signing Them
I get 2 of my own postings a lot of times and when I reply as well sometimes, drives me nuts. ? ?
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From: [email protected] < [email protected]> On Behalf Of imranindiana via Groups.Io Sent: Friday, February 28, 2020 8:47 AM To: [email protected]; jmkserv@... Subject: Re: [FOG] Emails and Signing Them ? Mark T¡¯s response was after David had responded to Mark K. If you are replying to the thread from email and you choose reply then the reply goes to the last poster AND the group - just like this msg. I think this is what happened. Mark T¡¯s response was not only addressed to David but to both David and the group. At least this is how it came to my email. ?I was reading this mornings emails from the group and found David Best's response to Mark Thomas very interesting. ("The following was addressed to me specifically. ? I never made such a posting. ? Who is the ¡°you¡± in your ¡°We had . ?. ? . ? . ending with?you?²õ²¹²â¾±²Ô²µ:¡±?" ) Now I know David would like everyone to sign their posts but I knew this was directed at Mark K from Mark T before I opened the email. I have noticed that with the new .io group, before I open every email, I get has the persons full name, email address and subject. This is both in Google Email and the Samsung Email on my phone. I also get some emails from the forum that look like they are only coming to me but are actually going to the forum. This is a little confusing, so curious on what others see.?
John
JMK Services
|
Re: Emails and Signing Them
John? Personally I think it is a shit show , confusing yes . Hard to keep track of the volume.? Mac,,, Designing and building for 47 years
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On Feb 28, 2020, at 6:56 AM, jmkserv@... wrote:
?I was reading this mornings emails from the group and found David Best's response to Mark Thomas very interesting. ("The following was addressed to me specifically. ? I never made such a posting. ? Who is the ¡°you¡± in your ¡°We had . ?. ? . ? . ending with?you?²õ²¹²â¾±²Ô²µ:¡±?" ) Now I know David would like everyone to sign their posts but I knew this was directed at Mark K from Mark T before I opened the email. I have noticed that with the new .io group, before I open every email, I get has the persons full name, email address and subject. This is both in Google Email and the Samsung Email on my phone. I also get some emails from the forum that look like they are only coming to me but are actually going to the forum. This is a little confusing, so curious on what others see.?
John
JMK Services
|
So here is some updated info on this issue, geese really sorry for all the text it required more explaining than planned¡ ? Honestly the techs spent so much time (2.5 days) just trying to calibrate the replacement AD941 and the Saw that they were toasted by the time they were to troubleshoot the vibration issue, they tried to blow it off however I reminded them that they first initially said that they noticed the vibration as well notating that it was worse in the chassis. The Saw is still way out of calibration but lets save that for later. ? Back to the vibration¡ ? The scoring belt was removed with no real change, then the blade, no real change then the motor belt with no real change. That indicated that the motor and or the pulley on the motor was the culprit. ? The motor and pully was swapped with new and I noticed an immediate change in that the vibration - the ?kinda low freq sound I was hearing was gone and virtually no vibration. I couldn¡¯t believe it, I was absolutely thrilled that the issue was resolved - that was until the drive belt and scoring belt was put on, the vibration is a little different but seems like it actually increased, it¡¯s noticeable more than previous with the riving knife vibration. ? Basically the that¡¯s where the tech¡¯s left it, they were like oh well. I assumed when Felder told me they would trouble shoot the issue they would actually have a plan and methodically go through it, the dial indicator didn¡¯t come out once to measure arbor run out, blade run out, any of the scoring components etcetera.. but this is not a bash email, just some background. ? A few interesting things, on the last tech visit maybe late October the main and scoring were removed by the tech and then reinstalled, I had been using the saw about 1 month when Greg Bryson from Felder contacted me about the poor saw cuts and had me do a little bit of visual checks which included looking inside the saw cabinet. What I found was that the scoring belt was not reinstalled correctly by the tech (pic attached) it was of a few teeth towards the slider, I couldn¡¯t believe the tech did that so I put on a new belt and I am sure I put it on correctly. So that was in early Dec and I have been using the saw since then, on Tues night (or wed morn) I turned on the saw for the tech¡¯s and I started to smell burning rubber and stopped the saw, the belt had jumped the pully and started rubbing against the casting (opposite direct as previous). ? Also note that this is a mechanical score machine ? So now I think the tech reinstalled the scoring belt the first time and was installed correctly, idk maybe the belt jumping teeth twice is a red hearing and has nothing to do with the vibration but now I am even more suspicious, I brought it up with the tech¡¯s and they didn¡¯t seem think it was that interesting/relevant that it occurred twice. ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
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From: [email protected] < [email protected]> On Behalf Of Mark Kessler via Groups.Io Sent: Friday, February 28, 2020 8:02 AM To: murkyd@... Cc: [email protected]Subject: Re: [FOG] Saw vibration ? Mark Thomas, ? Yes it was me that posted that thread and it is the same saw, your copy/paste is from this thread ? Poor saw cuts on k700 #sawsetup /g/felderownersgroup/topic/66186968#99898 ? and another one from before ? K700s Vibration /g/felderownersgroup/topic/36269629?p=Created,,,20,1,0,0 ? ? I will update this thread (Saw vibration) with more updated history ? ? From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of mark thomas
Sent: Friday, February 28, 2020 2:12 AM
To: david@...; [email protected]
Subject: Re: [FOG] Saw vibration ? We had a very long thread on your saw vibration back in early December, ending with you saying:
I am in touch with Felder service And between the photos of the sawcuts, some additional measurements i took and a video of the vibration of the riving knife (which i did not post) they feel there possibly could be an issue as it does not look normal. Will update when final resolution is obtained (could be weeks)?
I assume this is the same saw?? Is there an update on your engagement with Felder?
|
Re: Emails and Signing Them
Mark T¡¯s response was after David had responded to Mark K. If you are replying to the thread from email and you choose reply then the reply goes to the last poster AND the group - just like this msg. I think this is what happened. Mark T¡¯s response was not only addressed to David but to both David and the group. At least this is how it came to my email.
Imran On Feb 28, 2020, at 5:56 PM, jmkserv@... wrote:
?I was reading this mornings emails from the group and found David Best's response to Mark Thomas very interesting. ("The following was addressed to me specifically. ? I never made such a posting. ? Who is the ¡°you¡± in your ¡°We had . ?. ? . ? . ending with?you?²õ²¹²â¾±²Ô²µ:¡±?" ) Now I know David would like everyone to sign their posts but I knew this was directed at Mark K from Mark T before I opened the email. I have noticed that with the new .io group, before I open every email, I get has the persons full name, email address and subject. This is both in Google Email and the Samsung Email on my phone. I also get some emails from the forum that look like they are only coming to me but are actually going to the forum. This is a little confusing, so curious on what others see.?
John
JMK Services
|
Thanks David, I will try this later today and post my results
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-----Original Message----- From: David P Best <david@...> Sent: Friday, February 28, 2020 1:31 AM To: [email protected]; Mk Vt <mkessler10@...> Subject: Re: [FOG] Saw vibration Try the quarter, dime and nickel test. Put them standing on edge and see if any/which falls over. That would give us something to try on individual machines. David Best On Feb 27, 2020, at 9:12 PM, Mark Kessler <mkessler10@...> wrote:
No the Riving knife is not the only evidence, it's the only way I
think I could describe it to others online, all I can say is that I am
very surprised at the amount of vibration, it has more than my 30 year
old Inca saw which had a bad bearing, trunnion cracked and welded
twice (not that that would mean anything except the saw was abused)
and multiple users (again the saw was beat).
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On
Behalf Of Jonathan Smith
Sent: Friday, February 28, 2020 12:05 AM
To: [email protected]; mkessler10@...
Subject: Re: [FOG] Saw vibration
Is the riving knife the only evidence of vibration? If so, it may just
be a harmonic and can be stopped by changing its mounting position.
Try to raise or lower it or move the mount toward or away from the blade.
Normally spinning machines will hit harmonic speeds, sometimes
multiples, as they coast to a stop. Unfortunately, Felders with vfd
brakes stop too fast to see this. My 3400 rpm bench grinder jumps
around at about 1000 rmp as it coasts down but runs smoothly before
and after. Side story, I sold a 400hp,
1200 rpm hammer hog to a chip mill in Port Angeles, WA. This is a big
garbage disposal machine for wood waste like bark and other log yard trash. It ran smooth as glass except there was a catwalk handrail about 30'
away on the same support structure that vibrated like crazy to the
point it cracked the welds. They fixed the welds and added a 10 lb
weight. Changing the mass solve the problem.
Jon S
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
On Behalf Of Mark Kessler
Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2020 8:35 PM
To: Felder Owner Group
Subject: [FOG] Saw vibration
Does anyone else experience this amount of vibration when their saw is
running? This is a 2019 k700. Please post video of same if possible. Thanks!
Regards, Mark
--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
|
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From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of mark thomas
Sent: Friday, February 28, 2020 2:12 AM
To: david@...; [email protected]
Subject: Re: [FOG] Saw vibration ? We had a very long thread on your saw vibration back in early December, ending with you saying:
I am in touch with Felder service And between the photos of the sawcuts, some additional measurements i took and a video of the vibration of the riving knife (which i did not post) they feel there possibly could be an issue as it does not look normal. Will update when final resolution is obtained (could be weeks)?
I assume this is the same saw?? Is there an update on your engagement with Felder?
|
I was reading this mornings emails from the group and found David Best's response to Mark Thomas very interesting. ("The following was addressed to me specifically. ? I never made such a posting. ? Who is the ¡°you¡± in your ¡°We had . ?. ? . ? . ending with?you?²õ²¹²â¾±²Ô²µ:¡±?" ) Now I know David would like everyone to sign their posts but I knew this was directed at Mark K from Mark T before I opened the email. I have noticed that with the new .io group, before I open every email, I get has the persons full name, email address and subject. This is both in Google Email and the Samsung Email on my phone. I also get some emails from the forum that look like they are only coming to me but are actually going to the forum. This is a little confusing, so curious on what others see.?
John
JMK Services
|
The following was addressed to me specifically. ? I never made such a posting. ? Who is the ¡°you¡± in your ¡°We had . ?. ? . ? . ending with you ²õ²¹²â¾±²Ô²µ:¡±?
David Best Begin forwarded message:
Subject: Re: [FOG] Saw vibration
Date: February 27, 2020 at 11:12:11 PM PST
We had a very long thread on your saw vibration back in early December, ending with you saying:
I am in touch with Felder service And between the photos of the sawcuts, some additional measurements i took and a video of the vibration of the riving knife (which i did not post) they feel there possibly could be an issue as it does not look normal. Will update when final resolution is obtained (could be weeks)?
I assume this is the same saw?? Is there an update on your engagement with Felder?
|
David,
Due to this thread I did do a nickel test along with vibration analysis with following app.
https://apps.apple.com/us/app/vibration-analysis/id817385888
Nickel in 2 orientation and IIRC in 2 or 3 locations stayed put even through start and stop. This on 2002 KF700 with 3KW motors.
Imran
On Feb 28, 2020, at 11:30 AM, "david@..." <david@...> wrote:
?Try the quarter, dime and nickel test. ??Put them standing on edge and see if any/which falls over. ??That would give us something to try on individual machines.David BestOn Feb 27, 2020, at 9:12 PM, Mark Kessler <mkessler10@...> wrote:
No the Riving knife is not the only evidence, it's the only way I think I
could describe it to others online, all I can say is that I am very
surprised at the amount of vibration, it has more than my 30 year old Inca
saw which had a bad bearing, trunnion cracked and welded twice (not that
that would mean anything except the saw was abused) and multiple users
(again the saw was beat).
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of
Jonathan Smith
Sent: Friday, February 28, 2020 12:05 AM
To: [email protected]; mkessler10@...
Subject: Re: [FOG] Saw vibration
Is the riving knife the only evidence of vibration? If so, it may just be a
harmonic and can be stopped by changing its mounting position. ?Try to raise
or lower it or move the mount toward or away from the blade.
Normally spinning machines will hit harmonic speeds, sometimes multiples, as
they coast to a stop. ?Unfortunately, Felders with vfd brakes stop too fast
to see this. ?My 3400 rpm bench grinder jumps around at about 1000 rmp as it
coasts down but runs smoothly before and after. ?Side story, I sold a 400hp,
1200 rpm hammer hog to a chip mill in Port Angeles, WA. ?This is a big
garbage disposal machine for wood waste like bark and other log yard trash.
It ran smooth as glass except there was a catwalk handrail about 30' away on
the same support structure that vibrated like crazy to the point it cracked
the welds. ?They fixed the welds and added a 10 lb weight. ?Changing the
mass solve the problem.
Jon S
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On
Behalf Of Mark Kessler
Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2020 8:35 PM
To: Felder Owner Group
Subject: [FOG] Saw vibration
Does anyone else experience this amount of vibration when their saw is
running? This is a 2019 k700. Please post video of same if possible. Thanks!
Regards, Mark
--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com
|
We had a very long thread on your saw vibration back in early December, ending with you saying:
I am in touch with Felder service And between the photos of the sawcuts, some additional measurements i took and a video of the vibration of the riving knife (which i did not post) they feel there possibly could be an issue as it does not look normal. Will update when final resolution is obtained (could be weeks)?
I assume this is the same saw?? Is there an update on your engagement with Felder?
|
Re: Saw blade sharpening service?
I don¡¯t see how to edit the Wiki Sources file. ?I¡¯m logged in, can see the Sources page, but see no editing controls.
David Best
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Feb 27, 2020, at 7:00 PM, Michael Garrison Stuber < mtgstuber@...> wrote:
There's actually a "Wiki" page in Groups.IO:
/g/felderownersgroup/wiki/home It might make more sense to put it there, as it would allow
anyone to add/edit it and it would any issues with files being
locked or overwritten. I took a stab at a "Sources" page.? I've listed Rangate, Lamb
Tool Works, Mac's Airtight Clamps, and Quinn as starting items. I welcome folks to edit / add as needed.
-- Michael Garrison Stuber.
On 2/27/2020 3:44 PM, David Davies
wrote:
Do we need to start a "sources" document in the
files section where we can list these good places to find the
stuff we need?
Dave Davies
On Thu, Feb 27, 2020 at 5:42
PM Jason Holtz < jholtzy@...> wrote:
Quinn is great. You won't be disappointed.
Jason Holtz
J. Holtz Furniture
3307 Snelling Ave. South
Minneapolis, MN 55406
612.432.2765
--
Jason
J. Holtz Furniture
3307 Snelling Ave. South
Minneapolis, MN 55406
--
Dave & Marie Davies
318-219-7868
--
Michael Garrison Stuber
|
Try the quarter, dime and nickel test. Put them standing on edge and see if any/which falls over. That would give us something to try on individual machines.
David Best
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Feb 27, 2020, at 9:12 PM, Mark Kessler <mkessler10@...> wrote:
No the Riving knife is not the only evidence, it's the only way I think I
could describe it to others online, all I can say is that I am very
surprised at the amount of vibration, it has more than my 30 year old Inca
saw which had a bad bearing, trunnion cracked and welded twice (not that
that would mean anything except the saw was abused) and multiple users
(again the saw was beat).
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of
Jonathan Smith
Sent: Friday, February 28, 2020 12:05 AM
To: [email protected]; mkessler10@...
Subject: Re: [FOG] Saw vibration
Is the riving knife the only evidence of vibration? If so, it may just be a
harmonic and can be stopped by changing its mounting position. Try to raise
or lower it or move the mount toward or away from the blade.
Normally spinning machines will hit harmonic speeds, sometimes multiples, as
they coast to a stop. Unfortunately, Felders with vfd brakes stop too fast
to see this. My 3400 rpm bench grinder jumps around at about 1000 rmp as it
coasts down but runs smoothly before and after. Side story, I sold a 400hp,
1200 rpm hammer hog to a chip mill in Port Angeles, WA. This is a big
garbage disposal machine for wood waste like bark and other log yard trash.
It ran smooth as glass except there was a catwalk handrail about 30' away on
the same support structure that vibrated like crazy to the point it cracked
the welds. They fixed the welds and added a 10 lb weight. Changing the
mass solve the problem.
Jon S
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On
Behalf Of Mark Kessler
Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2020 8:35 PM
To: Felder Owner Group
Subject: [FOG] Saw vibration
Does anyone else experience this amount of vibration when their saw is
running? This is a 2019 k700. Please post video of same if possible. Thanks!
Regards, Mark
--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
|
imran
David P. Best