Re: Felder bandsaws versus x
Tom,?
I faced the same decision a few years ago and ended up buying a FB510 which I’ve been quite happy with. I’m by no means an expert on machine nuances but to me it boiled down to dollars, wheel diameter, and footprint. I have a home shop and primarily make furniture so all of my machines get relatively light use. I bought the saw primarily to resaw veneers for a large dining table and it does that job well, as it does for the myriad other ways I use it. I too kept my old 14” PowerMatic and am happy I did. In that context, here’s how I made the decision.?
?
As I saw it, the only real difference between the machines is the wheel diameter. That translates into two things, 1) a wider throat which allows for wider rips and a bigger table, and 2) larger wheel diameters are easier on thicker wider blades.?
?
-For the furniture work I do wider rips didn’t matter. The table saw and track saw do that job well.?
-Bigger tables are always nice, but the 510 table seemed plenty big and it has been. I do use Felder infeed and outfeed tables for long stock but would do the same with either saw.
-The blade I normally run on the 510 is a 1” Trimaster 2/3 carbide toothed blade, it’s been great and without problems. When I researched blades, I found questions about the minimum wheel size for various blades, but nothing conclusive. For any blade, the smaller the wheel diameter the greater the bending stress on the blade as it turns over the wheel under tension. At some point, that stress can induce metal fatigue. But, I couldn’t find anything conclusive that said that for that blade the ~20” wheel on the 510 was definitely too small and the ~24” on the 610 was definitely fine so I decided not to worry about it. (Apologies for the rough conversions of the actual metric diameters. Oh how I wish we’d catch up with the world…)?
-The footprint of the 510 is just a bit smaller than the 610, and for a home shop, a few inches can matter.?
?
Adding all that up and liking the idea of saving a few dollars, that’s what led me to buying an FB510 and I’m happy I did.
Enjoy your new bandsaw, I'm sure you'll love it whichever way you decide to go.?
?
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I mostly rip on the saw unless the board is super wonky think twist, cup something like that but only of its under 5’ just before for me it’s hard to handle on the mm16 and where the saw is would make it tight?
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On Jan 23, 2022, at 12:22 PM, tom@... wrote:
?Hi Imran!? Speaking for myself here, I find the bandsaw handy for ripping particularly small or narrow pieces that might be challenging to safely rip on the slider. Also, as you point out, the reduced waste can be important when working with material like Ebony. I recently completed a project where I had to fabricate several hundred 3/8" x 3/8" square Ebony plugs for a Greene & Greene -inspired staircase. The Ebony blank was 1-1/2" x 1-1/2" x 24", so it was important to have as little waste as possible.? BTW, the band saw also served as a great crosscutting tool for the plugs, since there was little waste, and the tiny offcuts weren't sent rocketing across the shop.?  -- Tom Gensmer Heritage Home Renewals, LLC Minneapolis, MN
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Hi Imran!? Speaking for myself here, I find the bandsaw handy for ripping particularly small or narrow pieces that might be challenging to safely rip on the slider. Also, as you point out, the reduced waste can be important when working with material like Ebony. I recently completed a project where I had to fabricate several hundred 3/8" x 3/8" square Ebony plugs for a Greene & Greene -inspired staircase. The Ebony blank was 1-1/2" x 1-1/2" x 24", so it was important to have as little waste as possible.? BTW, the band saw also served as a great crosscutting tool for the plugs, since there was little waste, and the tiny offcuts weren't sent rocketing across the shop.?  -- Tom Gensmer Heritage Home Renewals, LLC Minneapolis, MN
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Hey Imran,?
I rip exclusively on the band saw unless I'm trying to straight line lumber. Every board goes to the jointer regardless of where I rip. The band saw never kicks back and has better dust collection since my slider doesn't have overhead dust collection.?
I've been doing it this way for about 12 years now and definitely prefer it over standard ripping at the table saw.?
Have a great day!?
Jarrett
Over the years I have read here that some people prefer ripping on the bandsaw. I guess the poster may not have a slider, but I think that is a minority here. Anyhow, in case I am missing something, why would one carry out a basic rip routinely on the bandsaw when you have a slider?
I know ripping on the bandsaw is safer but I consider my slider pretty safe especially with dry lumber which most of us use most of the times. Special case of suspect wood or green wood could go to the bandsaw, fine.
There is less waste on bandsaw but in general, for me, that is not a consideration 99% of the times.
Then the obvious advantage of supporting heavy & long lumber on the slider without any extra effort. So what am I missing?
Imran
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?Over the years I have read here that some people prefer ripping on the bandsaw. I guess the poster may not have a slider, but I think that is a minority here. Anyhow, in case I am missing something, why would one carry out a basic rip routinely on the bandsaw when you have a slider?
I know ripping on the bandsaw is safer but I consider my slider pretty safe especially with dry lumber which most of us use most of the times. Special case of suspect wood or green wood could go to the bandsaw, fine.
There is less waste on bandsaw but in general, for me, that is not a consideration 99% of the times.
Then the obvious advantage of supporting heavy & long lumber on the slider without any extra effort. So what am I missing?
Imran
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Re: Felder bandsaws versus x
I'm quite interested in this topic, as I'm planning on adding a second band saw to my Shop in the coming years. I'm currently using a Laguna LT14SUV (14" saw), and it has served well as a great entry level saw (3hp motor, 14" resaw capacity, ceramic guides, etc...). That being said, I would like to eventually set up the Laguna with a 1/4" blade for curved work, and adding a larger saw for straight work. My inclination is to look at a FB510 or 610, but am curious as to whether there's a compelling case to be made for one machine over the other??
For reference, I work in a one-person shop, and for starters I'd be using the machine primarily for "straight" work (ripping and the occasional re-saw). There's an outside chance that I'd eventually consider a re-saw setup (power feed, etc...), but it is not in cards for starters, and am open to the idea of getting a third, dedicated resaw machine, leaving the FB machine free for utility work.?
The FB510 and FB610 have very similar specifications, including using the same motor and same resaw capacity. They differ slightly in negative tilt (-10 degrees for 510, -5 degrees for 610), rip capacity, and overall size/weight.?
Anyways, for users of FB5xx and FB6xx machines, why did you pick your machine over the other??
--
Tom Gensmer
Heritage Home Renewals, LLC
Minneapolis, MN
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Re: Cabinet Lift Recommendations
I actually have the original Gillift.. it does have it's limitations such as how big of a cabinet you can put on it without it tipping or falling off and the height it can lift to.? But it does work well
On Saturday, January 22, 2022, 05:50:07 PM PST, Jason Holtz <jholtzy@...> wrote:
The Gillift is the original, and much lighter weight than the one you've used. It's all aluminum construction. I worked with a guy that installed everything solo with one. Very handy when you need it. Jason Holtz
J. Holtz Furniture
3307 Snelling Ave. South
Minneapolis, MN 55406
612.432.2765 -- Jason J. Holtz Furniture 3307 Snelling Ave. South Minneapolis, MN 55406
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Re: Kappa 550 x motion problems
My question is..How do you clean it out of the bearings that are buried in the rolling table? it's not like they are exposed for easy access or cleaning
On Sunday, January 23, 2022, 07:28:41 AM PST, Mark Kessler <mkessler10@...> wrote:
Guess I will stop using it, wonder if maybe because I never used anything else it didn’t gum up, maybe it binds or doesn’t fully dissolve other previous lubricants. On Jan 22, 2022, at 8:50 PM, imranindiana <imranindiana@...> wrote:
?
Just curious, who is Felder listening to when specifying Ballistol. I almost bought it a yr or 2 ago when it was mentioned here; can’t recall for what purpose.
Imran
On Jan 22, 2022, at 8:37 PM, david@... via groups.io <david@...> wrote:
? Yes, in my case. ?The? Ballistol?collected enough of the bearing cage to be a dust magnet and began to run rough. ?I don’t have the same remote start system as you have or the 550 OP. ?Mine is the older version that does not send any electrical signals through the sliding table. ?But the dust being collected on the bearing cage was causing issues within a few days, so I cleaned it all up with kerosene and denatured alcohol which was a total PITA. ?I do use a white Scotch-Brite pad () with WD-40 for routine cleaning of the slider ways as well as the telescoping support arm for the outrigger table to get the sawdust that gets pressed into the rollers out of that mechanism. ? I have not had issues (yet) i have used it 2-3 times on the slides but i wipe it completely off , Brian, David os that what you did and it still gummed up? ?Interesting, the rep said to apply with a white 3m pad. He also said denatured alcohol would work in the interim. Have others had this contact issue with the slider switch?
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Re: Kappa 550 x motion problems
Guess I will stop using it, wonder if maybe because I never used anything else it didn’t gum up, maybe it binds or doesn’t fully dissolve other previous lubricants.
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On Jan 22, 2022, at 8:50 PM, imranindiana <imranindiana@...> wrote:
? Just curious, who is Felder listening to when specifying Ballistol. I almost bought it a yr or 2 ago when it was mentioned here; can’t recall for what purpose.
Imran
On Jan 22, 2022, at 8:37 PM, david@... via groups.io <david@...> wrote:
? Yes, in my case. ?The? Ballistol?collected enough of the bearing cage to be a dust magnet and began to run rough. ?I don’t have the same remote start system as you have or the 550 OP. ?Mine is the older version that does not send any electrical signals through the sliding table. ?But the dust being collected on the bearing cage was causing issues within a few days, so I cleaned it all up with kerosene and denatured alcohol which was a total PITA. ?I do use a white Scotch-Brite pad () with WD-40 for routine cleaning of the slider ways as well as the telescoping support arm for the outrigger table to get the sawdust that gets pressed into the rollers out of that mechanism. ?
I have not had issues (yet) i have used it 2-3 times on the slides but i wipe it completely off , Brian, David os that what you did and it still gummed up? ?Interesting, the rep said to apply with a white 3m pad. He also said denatured alcohol would work in the interim. Have others had this contact issue with the slider switch?
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Re: Kappa 550 x motion problems
Just curious, who is Felder listening to when specifying Ballistol. I almost bought it a yr or 2 ago when it was mentioned here; can’t recall for what purpose.
Imran
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On Jan 22, 2022, at 8:37 PM, david@... via groups.io <david@...> wrote: ? Yes, in my case. ?The? Ballistol?collected enough of the bearing cage to be a dust magnet and began to run rough. ?I don’t have the same remote start system as you have or the 550 OP. ?Mine is the older version that does not send any electrical signals through the sliding table. ?But the dust being collected on the bearing cage was causing issues within a few days, so I cleaned it all up with kerosene and denatured alcohol which was a total PITA. ?I do use a white Scotch-Brite pad () with WD-40 for routine cleaning of the slider ways as well as the telescoping support arm for the outrigger table to get the sawdust that gets pressed into the rollers out of that mechanism. ?
I have not had issues (yet) i have used it 2-3 times on the slides but i wipe it completely off , Brian, David os that what you did and it still gummed up? ?Interesting, the rep said to apply with a white 3m pad. He also said denatured alcohol would work in the interim. Have others had this contact issue with the slider switch?
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Re: Cabinet Lift Recommendations
The Gillift is the original, and much lighter weight than the one you've used. It's all aluminum construction. I worked with a guy that installed everything solo with one. Very handy when you need it. Jason Holtz
J. Holtz Furniture
3307 Snelling Ave. South
Minneapolis, MN 55406
612.432.2765 -- Jason J. Holtz Furniture 3307 Snelling Ave. South Minneapolis, MN 55406
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Re: Newest Splinter tongue design for non-DRO fences
Correction: The thread and screw are 1/4 x 20 not 1/4 x 18
On Sat, Jan 22, 2022 at 4:08 PM Fred Rossi < fred@...> wrote: Super simple. I cut a long piece of oak to mate the printed block, cut a few lengths to match the block width (1/8” round over bit for the inside match), double stick tape block and wood together, drilled the whole thing twice with a 13/64 bit, tapped the block with 1/4x18 tap, enlarged the wood holes and used 2 1/4x18 1 3/8” long screws to hold it all together.?
The wood was made about 1/4” too wide so I could run the whole assembly past the saw to create a zero clearance. I am going to make another ?for a 45deg cut zero clearance.?
Hope?this helps.?
Fred?
On Sat, Jan 22, 2022 at 3:35 PM G. Lane < lane247@...> wrote: Hi Fred..? i love that design change!!!..may i ask? how the sacrfical block is attached to the plastic??? I may modify? mine? to your arrangement when i wear it out
_____________________
Fred Rossi 617.905.6497
-- _____________________
Fred Rossi 617.905.6497
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Re: Kappa 550 x motion problems
Yes, in my case. ?The? Ballistol?collected enough of the bearing cage to be a dust magnet and began to run rough. ?I don’t have the same remote start system as you have or the 550 OP. ?Mine is the older version that does not send any electrical signals through the sliding table. ?But the dust being collected on the bearing cage was causing issues within a few days, so I cleaned it all up with kerosene and denatured alcohol which was a total PITA. ?I do use a white Scotch-Brite pad () with WD-40 for routine cleaning of the slider ways as well as the telescoping support arm for the outrigger table to get the sawdust that gets pressed into the rollers out of that mechanism. ?
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I have not had issues (yet) i have used it 2-3 times on the slides but i wipe it completely off , Brian, David os that what you did and it still gummed up? ?Interesting, the rep said to apply with a white 3m pad. He also said denatured alcohol would work in the interim. Have others had this contact issue with the slider switch?
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Re: Kappa 550 x motion problems
Thanks for that Brian. Never used anything on my K915 for 4 years and never had a problem….? Just wiped it with a dry cloth. BB
On Sat, Jan 22, 2022 at 16:21 Brian Lamb < blamb11@...> wrote: I tried it on my slider and it gummed up the works something fierce. Took me quite a while to get it cleaned back out and rolling smoothly.
On Jan 22, 2022, at 3:58 PM, Bill Belanger < Bill@...> wrote:
Thanks David. Never knew what that was for… On Sat, Jan 22, 2022 at 12:08 David Shores < dgshores@...> wrote: Hello Jack,
The on/off buttons on the end of the slider utilize the guides or 'ways' of the slider assembly to complete the switch circuit.? Thus the slider itself becomes part of the E-stop string circuit. ?
New machines ship with a little packet of Ballistol (a CLP-type of product) which is supposed to be used to clean the ways of the sliding table to ensure good, or at least adequate, electrical contact.? Ballistol is available in the US.
<85AEBEC3-EDE3-42DC-B002-E8579E2A26A4.jpeg>
The packet on the left came with my saw.? The spray can on the right is some I already had.? It is useful stuff .
david shores
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Re: Kappa 550 x motion problems
Yes, I wiped it on, wiped it dry, I thought, and then a day or so later the slider became rough and hard to move. Back to my tried and true WD40 and wipe dry, multiple times and back to moving smoothly with no problems. I think I might have actually cleaned the Ballistol out with mineral spirits to get it completely gone.
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I have not had issues (yet) i have used it 2-3 times on the slides but i wipe it completely off , Brian, David os that what you did and it still gummed up? ?Interesting, the rep said to apply with a white 3m pad. He also said denatured alcohol would work in the interim. Have others had this contact issue with the slider switch?
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Re: Kappa 550 x motion problems
I have not had issues (yet) i have used it 2-3 times on the slides but i wipe it completely off , Brian, David os that what you did and it still gummed up?
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On Jan 22, 2022, at 8:23 PM, Jack Decker via groups.io <vernaculardesign@...> wrote:
?Interesting, the rep said to apply with a white 3m pad. He also said denatured alcohol would work in the interim. Have others had this contact issue with the slider switch?
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Re: Kappa 550 x motion problems
Interesting, the rep said to apply with a white 3m pad. He also said denatured alcohol would work in the interim. Have others had this contact issue with the slider switch?
|
Re: Kappa 550 x motion problems
Same here. ? ?I use Ballistol as lube on the joints of pliers and dikes, and some hinge mechanisms. ?But putting that stuff on the sliding table ways is asking for long term problems as the goo collects in the bearing cage and attracts sawdust. ?That product could actually be the source of contamination that is causing the “run” circuit in the remote on/off system to break causing the machine to trip out and stop. ? I clean the slider ways with WD40 and wipe completely dry multiple times after several full strokes from end to end, or use the Felder spindle fluid which I also wipe dry.
David Best
https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidpbest/albums
https://www.instagram.com/davidpbest/
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On Jan 22, 2022, at 3:21 PM, Brian Lamb <blamb11@...> wrote:
I tried it on my slider and it gummed up the works something fierce. Took me quite a while to get it cleaned back out and rolling smoothly.
On Jan 22, 2022, at 3:58 PM, Bill Belanger < Bill@...> wrote:
Thanks David. Never knew what that was for… On Sat, Jan 22, 2022 at 12:08 David Shores < dgshores@...> wrote: Hello Jack,
The on/off buttons on the end of the slider utilize the guides or 'ways' of the slider assembly to complete the switch circuit.? Thus the slider itself becomes part of the E-stop string circuit. ?
New machines ship with a little packet of Ballistol (a CLP-type of product) which is supposed to be used to clean the ways of the sliding table to ensure good, or at least adequate, electrical contact.? Ballistol is available in the US.
<85AEBEC3-EDE3-42DC-B002-E8579E2A26A4.jpeg>
The packet on the left came with my saw.? The spray can on the right is some I already had.? It is useful stuff .
david shores
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Re: Felder bandsaws versus x
Mark,
?????? Definitely the Lenox Woodmaster CT 1" 1.3 tpi for the win.? It solved a lot of problems.? Still on my first blade after many years and a lot of resawing. Looking for a small cheap bandsaw for curved work as I resaw a lot and don't like to change blades.? Tom Ruth
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Re: Kappa 550 x motion problems
I tried it on my slider and it gummed up the works something fierce. Took me quite a while to get it cleaned back out and rolling smoothly.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Jan 22, 2022, at 3:58 PM, Bill Belanger < Bill@...> wrote:
Thanks David. Never knew what that was for… On Sat, Jan 22, 2022 at 12:08 David Shores < dgshores@...> wrote: Hello Jack,
The on/off buttons on the end of the slider utilize the guides or 'ways' of the slider assembly to complete the switch circuit.? Thus the slider itself becomes part of the E-stop string circuit. ?
New machines ship with a little packet of Ballistol (a CLP-type of product) which is supposed to be used to clean the ways of the sliding table to ensure good, or at least adequate, electrical contact.? Ballistol is available in the US.
<85AEBEC3-EDE3-42DC-B002-E8579E2A26A4.jpeg>
The packet on the left came with my saw.? The spray can on the right is some I already had.? It is useful stuff .
david shores
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Tom Gensmer
imran
Jason Holtz
Fred Rossi
David P. Best
Bill Belanger
Jack Decker