Re: Felder Adjustable Rebate Cutterhead
04.0.160 was the PN first mentioned in this thread.
04.1.160 was not mentioned until Shinta asked for it.
04.1.160 is the one I have, hence my answer to Shinta and not the OP.
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Re: Felder Adjustable Rebate Cutterhead
the PN mentioned is 04.1.160 and it is available on USA felder eshop.
imran?
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On Nov 4, 2020, at 1:41 PM, michael@... wrote: ? [Edited Message Follows]
I think this thread was originally about 04.0.160. I cannot find this cutter at the Felder shop. Maybe it's an older model? Edit: I bought my cutter in October this year. I had trouble finding anyone with the item in stock. The one I found was a former Felder dealer and he found this laying around, so I'm pretty sure my sample is not from 2020.
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Re: Felder Adjustable Rebate Cutterhead
I think this thread was originally about 04.0.160. I cannot find this cutter at the Felder shop. Maybe it's an older model?
Edit: I bought my cutter in October this year. I had trouble finding anyone with the item in stock. The one I found was a former Felder dealer and he found this laying around, so I'm pretty sure my sample is not from 2020.
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Re: Felder Adjustable Rebate Cutterhead
Michael, thank you for the information and link.
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Reading through the thread again, I am confused.? David's post indicates part 04.1.160 to have locating pins that need to be shimmed with spacers with correctly drilled holes that cover the pins.? Gary's post indicates the same thing.? Felder recommended to Gary to remove the pins for cutting tenon.? Their posts dated 2015.? Which year is your cutter set?? Is it possible that Felder updated the cutter design and eliminated the locating pins for the current 04.1.160 (year 2020)??
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Nice and crisp looking miter tenons!? I've been cutting them on the slider using a modified Delta tenoning jig (the one for cabinet saw).? Mine doesn't look as crisp though.?
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Regards,
?
SW
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Trying to find out what everyone does about banding the sides of a 6¡± drawer front since it¡¯s under the machines minimum?
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Re: Felder Adjustable Rebate Cutterhead
On 4-11-2020 17:04, Shinta Wakahisa via groups.io wrote: Gary or anyone,
I am looking at the Felder?04.1.160 rebate cutter and wonder about how to separate the cutters apart for tenon cutting. In the Dutch web shop there is an illustration how to separate it (opposing sides towards each other for tenoning as compared to rebate cutting): The (Dutch) description states it comes with spacer rings to adjust for 28 to 55 mm range. Naturally, there are answers on FOG.? I can only find part 04.3.036 (page 446 of the PDF 2020 catalog) in Felder's 2020 catalog as the only shim set available in the shaper tooling section.? It is listed in the slot cutter section of the catalog.? Is part 04.3.036 compatible with part 04.1.160? I don't see why not, it just seems to be another set of spacers, only reason it won't fit might be the outer diameter of the spacers being larger than provided spaceers, which would reduce the length of your tenons. For the rebate configuration the spacers are in the set AFAICT. Regards, Jonathan
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Re: Felder Adjustable Rebate Cutterhead
Shinta, 04.1.160 does not have locating pins, so you won't need shims with hole pattern. Use any standard 30 mm shim. I don't know where you are located, here is an example at Axminster: The ones from Felder will work as well, but I don't think they are available in bigger sizes. The Omas ones from Axminster are nice since they have the size imprinted on them. Here is 04.1.160 in action: 
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Re: Felder Adjustable Rebate Cutterhead
Gary or anyone,
I am looking at the Felder?04.1.160 rebate cutter and wonder about how to separate the cutters apart for tenon cutting.? Naturally, there are answers on FOG.? I can only find part 04.3.036 (page 446 of the PDF 2020 catalog) in Felder's 2020 catalog as the only shim set available in the shaper tooling section.? It is listed in the slot cutter section of the catalog.? Is part 04.3.036 compatible with part 04.1.160?? Gary, if you are still around, did you refer to part 04.1.160 in your last post above???
Thanks,
SW
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Re: Felder F38 feeder repair
They probably got something jammed between two of the wheels at some point and cracked the sprockets. Could have been defective sprockets to begin with¡ hard to say if they are machined from solid steel or sintered from powdered metal without looking at one. Regardless, this isn¡¯t something I¡¯ve ever heard of in all the years, so I doubt it¡¯s a frequent occurrence.
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After thinking about Brian's response about the circlips, I unscrewed all of the springs.? With the springs unscrewed and after removing one of the speed change gears from the opposite side, I was able to remove the whole transmission.? Now it will be straightforward to replace the cracked gears.
I just don't know why two drive gears cracked.? Hopefully there isn't something else that caused this.
Thanks everyone for the information!
? ?Dennis
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Re: Tannewitz Brake Questions
Drum brakes are pretty standardized, they will be grouped by diameter and drum width. I doubt you will have much issue finding something that will fit.
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Did some research.? There are two types of electric brakes, magnetic ones where an electro magnet energizes, grabs the hub area of the drum and pulls a lever to activate the brake.? I need to see if I can buy a set that would work with the drums which are integral to the wheels.? If so this is a cheap way to go.? Less than $100 for the brake module and brake shoes etc.? But risk it won¡¯t work with the 1967 AMC brake drum integrated into the wheel. ? The second option is slick but more expensive.? This is an electric-hydraulic brake actuator.? Its basically a master cylinder and solenoid integrated into one package.? The cheapest I found new would be $540 on ebay plus new brake shoes and wheel cylinder etc for the AMC brakes. ? <image001.png> ? Either option also requires a 20A 12V power source.? The second option would for sure work but it¡¯s about $500 more than the first. ? Is having a brake on the top wheel worth $600-700? ? ? Great idea Brian, love it ? ? Go to a trailer supply house, they have all sorts of solenoid actuated brakes, electric and hydraulic. ? ? The solenoid that operated the hydraulic master cylinder was a Cutler Hammer.? I found that Cutler Hammer makes solenoids that may work.? The cheapest one only pulls 0.55lbs and its $699 cheapest online.? Cutler Hammer makes them up to 12.4 lbs and that one is $1350. When I worked in the wire biz we had drawing machines with 50 hp motors with nice disc brakes I expect pretty pricy My Oliver is like Dave K? You might look at Centauro new machines or Zimerman see how they handle it. My best advice is don¡¯t be on the side of the machine when it¡¯s running. Designing and building for 50 years I love the idea of the upper brake. I called and spoke with Tannewitz and they said the hydraulic system was nothing but a headache. ?He also said they used a bunch of different setups over the years.? My saw is direct drive with the drum integrated in the wheel but no brake hardware for that drum.? The upper wheel has the integrated drum and the brakes were all there.? Even the rear plate that holds the drum brakes and wheel cylinder is from a car. ?Apparently the brake parts are all AMC for a Jeep.? ? Near as I can tell this is how it worked. With power off, a spring pulled on the master cylinder shaft to keep the brakes applied. Power on the machine and a large electrical solenoid would energize and take pressure off the master cylinder. ¡¤????????When pressing the stop button the solenoid would lose power and the brakes would be applied. ¡¤????????Press the foot brake lever, which pulls a cable which pulls a lever to press the stop button, now acts like you press stop. ¡¤????????If a blade is too loose a microswitch opens and activates the stop circuit. ¡¤????????If a blade brakes, the tension drops opening a different microswitch activating the stop circuit On my saw the hydraulic system was dry with no fluid, (abandoned) and a modern electronic brake setup like Tannewitz uses today was fitted.? While I would like to have the upper brake the large electrical solenoid for the master cylinder looks to be burned up.? It might be possible to find a replacement which would let me have the brake on the upper wheel.? I will see but not hopeful. Joe, I believe the purpose of the upper brake was to only activate when tension was released quickly as when the blade breaks.? The top wheel locks immediately to keep the blade from chewing up everything.? The bottom brake activates manually with a foot pedal on my Oliver so your Tanny might be different.? The upper safety brake was fairly standard on large old saws.? Dave
I¡¯ve started disassembly and the brakes apparently changed a lot over the years . On my machine both wheels have brake drums integrated but the lower had no brakes.? There is a heavy steel plate that bolts to the motor that has one broken off bolt and a slot crudely cut with a torch.? It¡¯s not clear that drum brakes ever mounted to that plate.? I will remove the upper brakes and the master cylinder. What ever is the simplistic and cheapest I would avoid using a brake Justin case of emergency. In larger machines bigger hp I would use disc brakes . My oliver has an over ride that cuts the motor if the blade brakes than using the manual rub brake. My best advise is don¡¯t stand to the right of the blade so your not buy when blade breaks. martin/campshure/co/llc
mac campshure
7412 elmwood ave.
middleton, wi 53562-3106
608-332-2330?cell Designing and building for 50 years ?My saw serial number says it was built in 1967 and it was built with hydraulic brakes.? At some point it was converted to the electronic brake setup Tannewitz uses now. I have not torn anything down yet, still don't have it off the pallet.? But it looks like the solenoid that drives the master cylinder for the brakes may be fried.??
I had intended to restore it including the brakes but this will be a saw I intend to use and I assume the electronic brake is a better system than the car brake setup. Does anyone have experience?
?
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Re: Felder F38 feeder repair
After thinking about Brian's response about the circlips, I unscrewed all of the springs.? With the springs unscrewed and after removing one of the speed change gears from the opposite side, I was able to remove the whole transmission.? Now it will be straightforward to replace the cracked gears.
I just don't know why two drive gears cracked.? Hopefully there isn't something else that caused this.
Thanks everyone for the information!
? ?Dennis
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I received the attached document from Felder about planer belt tensioning in 2005. ? Not sure this is applicable to your machine. ??
It might be interesting what prompted Felder to send me this document. ? Turns out that on the initial production run of the new model, the factory had over-tensioned the belts which as causing the motor shafts to sheer off after a few hours. ?Indeed, in my situation, the email warning came too late - when running some faceframe material through the planer, I heard a loud ¡°CLUNK¡± then I could hear the planer head grind to a stop. ? Pulling off the back covers, there it was - the shaft of the 13HP motor had sheered clean off and the pulley was laying in the bottom of the chassis. ? Took two air freight shipments and 3 weeks to get a replacement. ? The first replacement which ultimately made it¡¯s way back to Felder was described as looking like it had fallen 20 stories out of a building onto concrete. ?
After several back-and-forth exchanges with Felder about how to know the belt was properly tensioned, the consensus was that when plucked, the belt should resonate at 160 Hz. I scratched my head how I was going to know if the belt was vibrating at 160 Hz. ? Then I decided to translate that to a key on my piano, recorded that sound on my iPhone, then did the belt tensioning to match what I was hearing on the iPhone in the shop. ?Today there is an app for the iPhone that will display the frequency of any sound it¡¯s hearing. ? It is especially good at suggesting when my cocktail ice clinking together is at the right temperature. ?:-)
David Best
https://www.instagram.com/davidpbest/
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Thanks Colin, but I don't see a black motor vent anywhere.? I did remove the green motor cover to get to the back of the motor but I don't see any screws.? I'm also not able to budge the motor mount screws on the inside of the motor.? They are tight as can be.
<20201103_155017.jpg>
<20201103_154944.jpg>
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Hi Jeff, those are the elect motor retaining bolts, I wouldn¡¯t think belt should go between 2 rollers, it should just run between motor pulley & cutter head pulley. In second photo looks like adjuster long grub screw there. So I would make sure and use ring spanner or socket so as do not round off bolt/nut heads, always hard in these enclosed areas, so maybe a bit of heat and wd 40 etc, once loosed move to other side as in photo and adjust grub screw up and then get some sort of lever under motor close to pulley end and lever up motor to get your belt on and reverse to tighten belt. Colin ? Sent from for Windows 10 ?
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Re: Tannewitz Brake Questions
Did some research.? There are two types of electric brakes, magnetic ones where an electro magnet energizes, grabs the hub area of the drum and pulls
a lever to activate the brake.? I need to see if I can buy a set that would work with the drums which are integral to the wheels.? If so this is a cheap way to go.? Less than $100 for the brake module and brake shoes etc.? But risk it won¡¯t work with the 1967
AMC brake drum integrated into the wheel.
?
The second option is slick but more expensive.? This is an electric-hydraulic brake actuator.? Its basically a master cylinder and solenoid integrated
into one package.? The cheapest I found new would be $540 on ebay plus new brake shoes and wheel cylinder etc for the AMC brakes.
?
?
Either option also requires a 20A 12V power source.? The second option would for sure work but it¡¯s about $500 more than the first.
?
Is having a brake on the top wheel worth $600-700?
?
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From: [email protected] < [email protected]>
On Behalf Of Joe Jensen
Sent: Tuesday, November 3, 2020 2:28 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [FOG] Tannewitz Brake Questions
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Great idea Brian, love it
?
?
Go to a trailer supply house, they have all sorts of solenoid actuated brakes, electric and hydraulic.
?
?
The solenoid that operated the hydraulic master cylinder was a Cutler Hammer.? I found that Cutler Hammer makes solenoids that may work.? The cheapest
one only pulls 0.55lbs and its $699 cheapest online.? Cutler Hammer makes them up to 12.4 lbs and that one is $1350.
When I worked in the wire biz we had drawing machines with 50 hp motors with nice disc brakes I expect pretty pricy
My Oliver is like Dave K?
You might look at Centauro new machines or Zimerman see how they handle it.
My best advice is don¡¯t be on the side of the machine when it¡¯s running.
Designing and building for 50 years
I love the idea of the upper brake. I called and spoke with Tannewitz and they said the hydraulic system was nothing but a headache. ?He also said they
used a bunch of different setups over the years.? My saw is direct drive with the drum integrated in the wheel but no brake hardware for that drum.? The upper wheel has the integrated drum and the brakes were all there.? Even the rear plate that holds the
drum brakes and wheel cylinder is from a car. ?Apparently the brake parts are all AMC for a Jeep.? ?
Near as I can tell this is how it worked.
With power off, a spring pulled on the master cylinder shaft to keep the brakes applied.
Power on the machine and a large electrical solenoid would energize and take pressure off the master cylinder.
¡¤???????
When pressing the stop button the solenoid would lose power and the brakes would be applied.
¡¤???????
Press the foot brake lever, which pulls a cable which pulls a lever to press the stop button, now acts like you press stop.
¡¤???????
If a blade is too loose a microswitch opens and activates the stop circuit.
¡¤???????
If a blade brakes, the tension drops opening a different microswitch activating the stop circuit
On my saw the hydraulic system was dry with no fluid, (abandoned) and a modern electronic brake setup like Tannewitz uses today was fitted.? While I
would like to have the upper brake the large electrical solenoid for the master cylinder looks to be burned up.? It might be possible to find a replacement which would let me have the brake on the upper wheel.? I will see but not hopeful.
Joe, I believe the purpose of the upper brake was to only activate when tension was released quickly as when the blade breaks.? The top wheel locks immediately to keep the blade from chewing up everything.?
The bottom brake activates manually with a foot pedal on my Oliver so your Tanny might be different.? The upper safety brake was fairly standard on large old saws.? Dave
I¡¯ve started disassembly and the brakes apparently changed a lot over the years . On my machine both wheels have brake drums integrated but the lower
had no brakes.? There is a heavy steel plate that bolts to the motor that has one broken off bolt and a slot crudely cut with a torch.? It¡¯s not clear that drum brakes ever mounted to that plate.? I will remove the upper brakes and the master cylinder.
What ever is the simplistic and cheapest I would avoid using a brake Justin case of emergency.
In larger machines bigger hp I would use disc brakes .
My oliver has an over ride that cuts the motor if the blade brakes than using the manual rub brake.
My best advise is don¡¯t stand to the right of the blade so your not buy when blade breaks.
martin/campshure/co/llc
mac campshure
7412 elmwood ave.
middleton, wi 53562-3106
608-332-2330?cell
Designing and building for 50 years
?My saw serial number says it was built in 1967 and it was built with hydraulic brakes.? At some point it was converted to the electronic brake setup Tannewitz uses now. I have not torn anything down yet, still don't have it off the pallet.?
But it looks like the solenoid that drives the master cylinder for the brakes may be fried.??
I had intended to restore it including the brakes but this will be a saw I intend to use and I assume the electronic brake is a better system than the car brake setup. Does anyone have experience?
?
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Thanks Colin, but I don't see a black motor vent anywhere.? I did remove the green motor cover to get to the back of the motor but I don't see any screws.? I'm also not able to budge the motor mount screws on the inside of the motor.? They are tight as can be.  
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Sorry Jeff I should of read your email a bit better, ¡°M¡± is motor vent and would be on infeed/outfeed side of planer/thicknesser at the base, this will give you to access to elect motor and pulleys. (just looks like a square black louvre cover). ¡°R¡± adjusting bolt generally will be at the face mounting plate/pulley end of elect motor-at the top, before this will have to loosen 4 face plate bolts on cabinet to elect motor. Colin ? Sent from for Windows 10 ?
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Hi Jeff, M is the black ventilator on grid( air vent for elect motor and access point), R is the adjustment screw. Colin ? Sent from for Windows 10 ?
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I am trying to change the planer belt on my BF631 and am having trouble with the manual.? I've got the belt and have it installed on the top pulley but can't figure out how to put it on the lower pulley.? The manual says to "remove the black motor ventilator on grid", and I have no idea what that is trying to say; I'm sure it made more sense in the original German :)? I don't see any black motor cover nor do I see the tension screw R where they show it being.? Any help is appreciated. 
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Mike it wouldn¡¯t hurt to change belt while your at it, mind you the belts do last quite a bit longer than the wheels, wheels I would change every 4=5 years. If having a look, access area by way of air vent panel at base of planer/thicknesser on outfeed side. Colin ? Sent from for Windows 10 ?
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Re: Tannewitz Brake Questions
I know there are some out in Mesa, could find out who my friend used. There is also Auto Safety House, they carry all that sort of thing, but are on the west side of town.
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Great idea Brian, love it ? ? Go to a trailer supply house, they have all sorts of solenoid actuated brakes, electric and hydraulic. ? ? The solenoid that operated the hydraulic master cylinder was a Cutler Hammer.? I found that Cutler Hammer makes solenoids that may work.? The cheapest one only pulls 0.55lbs and its $699 cheapest online.? Cutler Hammer makes them up to 12.4 lbs and that one is $1350. When I worked in the wire biz we had drawing machines with 50 hp motors with nice disc brakes I expect pretty pricy My Oliver is like Dave K? You might look at Centauro new machines or Zimerman see how they handle it. My best advice is don¡¯t be on the side of the machine when it¡¯s running. Designing and building for 50 years I love the idea of the upper brake. I called and spoke with Tannewitz and they said the hydraulic system was nothing but a headache. ?He also said they used a bunch of different setups over the years.? My saw is direct drive with the drum integrated in the wheel but no brake hardware for that drum.? The upper wheel has the integrated drum and the brakes were all there.? Even the rear plate that holds the drum brakes and wheel cylinder is from a car. ?Apparently the brake parts are all AMC for a Jeep.? ? Near as I can tell this is how it worked. With power off, a spring pulled on the master cylinder shaft to keep the brakes applied. Power on the machine and a large electrical solenoid would energize and take pressure off the master cylinder. ¡¤????????When pressing the stop button the solenoid would lose power and the brakes would be applied. ¡¤????????Press the foot brake lever, which pulls a cable which pulls a lever to press the stop button, now acts like you press stop. ¡¤????????If a blade is too loose a microswitch opens and activates the stop circuit. ¡¤????????If a blade brakes, the tension drops opening a different microswitch activating the stop circuit On my saw the hydraulic system was dry with no fluid, (abandoned) and a modern electronic brake setup like Tannewitz uses today was fitted.? While I would like to have the upper brake the large electrical solenoid for the master cylinder looks to be burned up.? It might be possible to find a replacement which would let me have the brake on the upper wheel.? I will see but not hopeful. Joe, I believe the purpose of the upper brake was to only activate when tension was released quickly as when the blade breaks.? The top wheel locks immediately to keep the blade from chewing up everything.? The bottom brake activates manually with a foot pedal on my Oliver so your Tanny might be different.? The upper safety brake was fairly standard on large old saws.? Dave
I¡¯ve started disassembly and the brakes apparently changed a lot over the years . On my machine both wheels have brake drums integrated but the lower had no brakes.? There is a heavy steel plate that bolts to the motor that has one broken off bolt and a slot crudely cut with a torch.? It¡¯s not clear that drum brakes ever mounted to that plate.? I will remove the upper brakes and the master cylinder. What ever is the simplistic and cheapest I would avoid using a brake Justin case of emergency. In larger machines bigger hp I would use disc brakes . My oliver has an over ride that cuts the motor if the blade brakes than using the manual rub brake. My best advise is don¡¯t stand to the right of the blade so your not buy when blade breaks. martin/campshure/co/llc
mac campshure
7412 elmwood ave.
middleton, wi 53562-3106
608-332-2330?cell Designing and building for 50 years ?My saw serial number says it was built in 1967 and it was built with hydraulic brakes.? At some point it was converted to the electronic brake setup Tannewitz uses now. I have not torn anything down yet, still don't have it off the pallet.? But it looks like the solenoid that drives the master cylinder for the brakes may be fried.??
I had intended to restore it including the brakes but this will be a saw I intend to use and I assume the electronic brake is a better system than the car brake setup. Does anyone have experience?
?
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imran
Jonathan Martens
David P. Best
Joe Jensen
