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HELP!!! My Eurovan died on me over the weekend. I turn the key, but
whatever connects the iginition swith to the starter is broken. The
starter works fine as long as it can get power, whatever broke is
preventing power from getting to the starter. The battery is fine as
well. Is there a parking break switch, or starter relay that might
have gone out? Where are they located?

Thanks a million.
Philip

Anyone know of a good place for a FULL (suck 'n pump NOT drop 'n drain)
trans fluid change in Detroit area?

Use the point of a sharp knife to gently pry up the mesh around the edges.
Usually pops off easily.



Stuart

'97 EVC



_____

From: ev_update@... [mailto:ev_update@...] On Behalf
Of mtbcronometro
Sent: Monday, May 26, 2008 9:09 PM
To: ev_update@...
Subject: [ev_update] Speaker grill?



I have a 1993 that one of the dashboard speakers went bad. How do you
remove the grill without damaging the dash or grill?

Sorry for the delay with the pictures...

I was scrambling getting the van ready for a Memorial Day road trip
to Mammoth Cave for some camping with the kids.









--- In ev_update@..., "jeff_westy" <k-and-j.drexel@...>
wrote:

We have an '02 EVWK with Yakima bars mounted to Yakima "Wide Body"
bolt-on mounts with 1A Raingutter towers. I chose this just because
you can find the 1A towers and bars cheap on craigslist.

I have a Thule Mountaineer 17 cu ft cargo box and Yakima BasketCase
mounted up top. Cargo box for soft cargo and the basket for a

tricycle

and bike trailer.

Works great. No issues with the top other than it's hard(er) to lift
and I have to put a prop rod under the front of the poptop when it's
up to make sure it doesn't fall down... and I carry a stool to get

up

top to get things down and put them back up.

I'll post a link to some pictures tomorrow.

--- In ev_update@..., "glencgilbert" <glen@> wrote:

I am new 1993 Eurovan MV Weekender owner. I am taking my wife and

kids

cross country this summer for 2 mos. and would like to add a

cargo box

to the roof. Will this harm the pop top? Does anyone have
recommendations for particular cargo box sizes or types of mounts

that

fit? I will only pop the top when the box is empty at night. The
Yakima I am looking at weighs 35 lbs. for 15 cubic feet of

storage

for pillows, sleeping bags, clothes, etc. I saw one person added

an

additional support bar for his poptop. Is that necessary? Thank

you,

Glen

Nice idea, Paul

-- In ev_update@..., "pkgloger" <pkgloger@...> wrote:

--- In ev_update@..., Robert Webster <salsared2004@>

wrote:

I bent down on the floor of my '97 EVC when it was relatively

dark

outside and was able to see the flame by looking through the left
end of the grill on the botom of the fridge.

The "viewing of the flame" in the Norcold is one of the best

examples

of "YMMV" in the EV Camper world. The clever folks at Winnebogus
really "engineered" this one.

On some campers (Bruce's '97 EVC, for apparent example) the viewing
window is on the side of the burner box that faces the centerline of
the vehicle. On others (MY '97 EVC, for example) the viewing window
is on the side of the burner box that faces the REAR of the vehicle
and is impossible to see without removing the fridge from the
cabinetry. BUT to remove it far enough to see the window, the LP

line

must be disconnected!

My semi-solution was to have a welding-supply shop make up a short

(2

to 3 ft.) hose with fittings to match the gas line. Now I can fire

up

to observe the flame with the unit sitting in the middle of the

floor.

Paul in Pittsfield

--- In ev_update@..., Robert Webster <salsared2004@...> wrote:

I bent down on the floor of my '97 EVC when it was relatively dark
outside and was able to see the flame by looking through the left
end of the grill on the botom of the fridge.

The "viewing of the flame" in the Norcold is one of the best examples
of "YMMV" in the EV Camper world. The clever folks at Winnebogus
really "engineered" this one.

On some campers (Bruce's '97 EVC, for apparent example) the viewing
window is on the side of the burner box that faces the centerline of
the vehicle. On others (MY '97 EVC, for example) the viewing window
is on the side of the burner box that faces the REAR of the vehicle
and is impossible to see without removing the fridge from the
cabinetry. BUT to remove it far enough to see the window, the LP line
must be disconnected!

My semi-solution was to have a welding-supply shop make up a short (2
to 3 ft.) hose with fittings to match the gas line. Now I can fire up
to observe the flame with the unit sitting in the middle of the floor.

Paul in Pittsfield

Hi Bruce--

I think that the vacuum trick will work to a point but it's probably not a
bad idea to pull the fridge every year or two (it's really not a bad job) to
check out the burner and do a proper cleaning of the flue. When you tap the
flue with a hammer the soot will go down and fall on the burner. Eventually
the burner will get clogged. As we talked about the last time I wil try the
vacuum trick this summer but still do my yearly pull and clean also.
Forest

Interesting that you have a Prius as well as an EVC since we have an '04 Prius. I've also thought about the high cost of gas (and the consumption guilt issue, too) for the EVC camping trip vs the Prius camping trip [we have no problem going on long tent camping trips with small vehicles (our first crosscountry camping trip was done in a 1970 Austin America)]. About 3 years ago my wife, adult daughter, and I took a 30 day, 8900-mile crosscountry camping trip in the Prius. The poor car held up well and averaged 47.5 MPG. I figure that we bought the EVC for camping trips and that the increased fuel prices (well, up to a certain point, anyway) will not put a damper on EVC vacations. We're planning a trip of approx. 10,000 miles in the fall.

Bruce Webster
'97 EVC
'04 Prius
(work in progress) 97 Ford Ranger EV conversion

rvdalton <rvdalton@...> wrote:
anyone have any good resources or personal experiences? This may be
the first time I weigh the cost of gas and decide to go Prius/motel
rather than EVC/camping. Your thoughts?

Karen

Remove the vent cover (3 or 4 screws), hold the vacuum hose (the tip on my vacuum is the same diameter as the fridge exhaust pipe) up against the exhaust (inner) pipe, and turn the vacuum on for a short time period. Remove the hose, tap lightly on the exhaust pipe with a hammer, and repeat the vacuuming. I got a lot of soot out of mine and the fridge worked fine afterwards. However, part of my problem was a discharged coach battery and soot buildup may not have been a real problem.

Bruce Webster
'97 EVC

berkeley5960 <newsie@...> wrote:
Bruce: How do you vacuum the vent?

Karen

Pete

I'll be interested to see how this works out for you since I'm dreading the day I ned to pull my reefer.

Bruce

Pete Peterson <tds3pete@...> wrote:
-Bruce- I did the vent vacuum trick...thanks for bringing it up. This
fridge has always worked super on gas and I just want to keep it that
way.
When I pull it out, I'll be able to look closely at the burner box
and scope out this visual inspection issue.

Pete

-- In ev_update@..., Robert Webster <salsared2004@...>
wrote:

Forest, Pete, et. al.

I bent down on the floor of my '97 EVC when it was relatively

dark outside and was able to see the flame by looking through the
left end of the grill on the botom of the fridge. Pete...have you
tried the vent vacuum trick?

Bruce Webster
'97 EVC

forest flanigan <creoflan@...> wrote:
Hi Pete-
I know folks on here have talked about a viewing window but I don't

seem to

be able to see anything either.

Forest

On Mon, May 26, 2008 at 12:14 PM, Pete Peterson <tds3pete@...>

wrote:

Forest, thanks for timely post. I just happened to be fooling

around

with mine yesterday and considered taking it out. It has been

lighting

a little slow lately, and I wanted to see what was involved. I

decided

if it ain't broke don't fix it.

Now that I know how easy it is, I will probably pull it next time.

One question...the manual talks about viewing the flame by looking
under the installed unit in place. I can see the burner box fine,

but

the viewing port appears to be on the side. Do folks use a mirror

to

view the flame in place or what?

Pete

10,000 miles divided by 20mpg = 500 gal of fuel; $4.00 x 500 gal = $2000.
Dang!

Just soldering them together may result in only a temporary repair. On mine,
it appeared that the wires were a bit too short to start with and as a
result each time the driver's door was fully opened, the ground wire was stretched
beyond its length until it separated. In my case, I needed at add an inch of
length to that one ground wire.


Bob W.
2001 Weekender

That seems to be a common problem. Electric driver side window and
both mirrors stopped working on my 2001 EV too. First sporadic, and
then completely. When I pushed back the rubber, I found 3 broken
cables. Someone recommended to just solder them back together - which
I first thought was a ... idea, but it indeed worked well. Go and try
it, it is the quickest and least expensive way to fix it.

-Edgar

I do not have any personal experience but I happened to listen to and interview today with Keith Meldahl author of the book Hard Road West, The book is actually about the gold rush trail to California but I believe it followed the same route as the Oregon trail for at least half of the way. There is a link to the interview here -

Larry
LA, CA

rvdalton <rvdalton@...> wrote: anyone have any good resources or personal experiences? This may be
the first time I weigh the cost of gas and decide to go Prius/motel
rather than EVC/camping. Your thoughts?

--- Sea2river@... wrote:

I noticed that you have recommended doing this mod numerous times. How long ago did you do the

mod and what are the results?

I didn't do it unfortunately because I knew about it only after my 40K change and I'm not due for
another 20K yet and I wasn't going to open the van up again just to do it. (And being that my van
is for sale anyway, I probably won't even get that far).

But the mod is this screw:


Turn that screw in (tighten). Don't loosen...it has a built-in sort of ratcheting mechanism (not
the right word but I can't think of how to describe it otherwise) and is never meant to be
loosened - you will break it if you loosen it. only tighten. it increases the pressure in the
lines and makes the clutches come together firmer and faster. You should notice quicker shifting
between R and D and back again and less slip.

Here's a more complete discussion on the mod (not on a Eurovan but on another VW) if you're
looking for more feedback on those who have done this.

I have a 1993 that one of the dashboard speakers went bad. How do you
remove the grill without damaging the dash or grill?

anyone have any good resources or personal experiences? This may be
the first time I weigh the cost of gas and decide to go Prius/motel
rather than EVC/camping. Your thoughts?

Just reread Dave's original description--the Bentley matches the
location of F95/G110 as Dave has described.

--- In ev_update@..., "Carl Henderson" <chendermi@...> wrote:

F95 (after-run coolant pump thermal switch). The Bentley doesn't show
a location for this device.

On models WITH Climatronic (i.e., GLS and non-Weekender MV's), F95 is
shown combined with G110 (A/C engine coolant temperature sensor) into
a 4-pin device. G110 is shown in a location "behind intake manifold,
center, in coolant hose above exhaust manifold heat shield". But
maybe this device is really mounted in the thermostat housing? And
maybe the 4-pin device is installed in vehicles which aren't outfitted
Climatronic, even though one half of the device isn't actually used?
The Bentley CD isn't very helpful here.

In a message dated 5/25/2008 12:33:43 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
davebo1896@ writes:

There is a 4-pin blue sensor in a hose near the top of the

block that

is for the after-run pumps.

The Bentley wiring diagrams for a 2003 show the following devices:

G2 (sensor for temp. gauge) and G62 (sensor for ECU) combined in a
4-pin device and mounted in the thermostat housing. This is the
upgraded green D-shaped device (originally black).

F163 (A/C cutout thermal switch) and F165 (3rd speed coolant fan
control thermal switch) combined in a 4-pin device and mounted in the
thermostat housing. This is the green square device.

F95 (after-run coolant pump thermal switch). The Bentley doesn't show
a location for this device.

That's what I've got in my '99, too (although in a slightly different
configuration). 5 devices (G2, G62, F163, F165, F95).

On models WITH Climatronic (i.e., GLS and non-Weekender MV's), F95 is
shown combined with G110 (A/C engine coolant temperature sensor) into
a 4-pin device.

OK, then there's the new 6th device not present in earlier models:
the G110 ((A/C engine coolant temperature sensor).


So, the ECU gets one temp sender (G62) and Climatronic gets another
(G110).


Thanks for clearing that up.








--- In ev_update@..., "Carl Henderson" <chendermi@...> wrote:

Dave,

The Bentley wiring diagrams for a 2003 show the following devices:

G2 (sensor for temp. gauge) and G62 (sensor for ECU) combined in a
4-pin device and mounted in the thermostat housing. This is the
upgraded green D-shaped device (originally black).

F163 (A/C cutout thermal switch) and F165 (3rd speed coolant fan
control thermal switch) combined in a 4-pin device and mounted in the
thermostat housing. This is the green square device.

F95 (after-run coolant pump thermal switch). The Bentley doesn't show
a location for this device.

On models WITH Climatronic (i.e., GLS and non-Weekender MV's), F95 is
shown combined with G110 (A/C engine coolant temperature sensor) into
a 4-pin device. G110 is shown in a location "behind intake manifold,
center, in coolant hose above exhaust manifold heat shield". But
maybe this device is really mounted in the thermostat housing? And
maybe the 4-pin device is installed in vehicles which aren't outfitted
Climatronic, even though one half of the device isn't actually used?
The Bentley CD isn't very helpful here.

And finally, there's FC (coolant fan control), which is a 3-pin device
shown mounted near or in the radiator and not really part of this
listing of devices in the thermostat housing, but I thought I'd list
it since it is related to coolant temperatures.

I have a 2003 Weekender. Next time I pull the belly pan, I'll have a
look at the thermostat housing to see what's there. I did replace the
black with a green D-shaped device several years ago as a preventative
measure.

Carl


--- In ev_update@..., "dave_king_ev" <dave_king_ev@> wrote:

There is something wrong with this "good info" because it describes
all 3 sensors as 4-pin sensors, which would mean 12 pins total, and
that would mean 6 devices.

But, as far as I can tell (I have a '99 12 valve, and a paper Bentley,
but there has been a discussion on vortex -- complete with wiring
diagrams posted for the 24 valve motor -- and what I've seen is
consistent with mine) there are just 5 devices:

ECU
gage
fan
afterrun pump
AC cutout

Various models -- the 5 cylinder, the 12 valve, the 24 valve -- have
various locations and combinations for all the sensors involved (for
example on some models the ECU and gage sensors are combined in a
4-pin device while on other models the ECU sensor is a 2-pin
device) but all models use only those 5 devices, which would mean only
10 total pins.

But, Dave's information shows 3 devices with 4 pins each which is 12
pins which means 6 devices.

Something is not adding up. Does the 24 valve motor have a 6th
device? If so, what is it?



--- In ev_update@..., Sea2river@ wrote:

Good info.

And when replacing the sensor, if you replace the cap on the

coolant

reservoir (after relieving any residual pressure), the amount of

coolant loss will

be less that a cup.

Bob W.


In a message dated 5/25/2008 12:33:43 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
davebo1896@ writes:

And the new green d-shaped (oval) sensor did the trick.

The dash gauge is now working.

Another note, I think the AC was not working while this sensor was
malfunctioning. It seems to be working now. I'm not sure if this is
related.

So to sum up ...

There are two sensors under the engine in the thermostat housing.
You'll have to drop the belly pan to get to these, they are on the
driver's side.

The 4-pin d-shaped (oval) is for the dash gauge and the fuel
injection. The new sensor is green, the original one was black. the
black ones are a known problem.

The 4-pin square sensor next to the d-shaped sensor is for the

fans.

There is a 4-pin blue sensor in a hose near the top of the

block that

is for the after-run pumps.

Each sensor is held in with a c-clip. Each sensor has a rubber

o-ring.

It is possible to swap out the sensors without draining the coolant
system, but you need to be quick with the lower ones (make sure the
coolant is cold, safety goggles and a closed mouth are advised)

The o-ring does not always come out when you pull the sensor. Make
sure it is accounted for before replacing the c-clip. Also be sure
the sensor is under the c-clip not over it, or it will pop out and
drain all your coolant.

Sensors and o-rings are available from Steve at
_ ()

Thanks All !!

Dave




****Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking

with

Tyler Florence" on AOL Food.

()

Dave,

The Bentley wiring diagrams for a 2003 show the following devices:

G2 (sensor for temp. gauge) and G62 (sensor for ECU) combined in a
4-pin device and mounted in the thermostat housing. This is the
upgraded green D-shaped device (originally black).

F163 (A/C cutout thermal switch) and F165 (3rd speed coolant fan
control thermal switch) combined in a 4-pin device and mounted in the
thermostat housing. This is the green square device.

F95 (after-run coolant pump thermal switch). The Bentley doesn't show
a location for this device.

On models WITH Climatronic (i.e., GLS and non-Weekender MV's), F95 is
shown combined with G110 (A/C engine coolant temperature sensor) into
a 4-pin device. G110 is shown in a location "behind intake manifold,
center, in coolant hose above exhaust manifold heat shield". But
maybe this device is really mounted in the thermostat housing? And
maybe the 4-pin device is installed in vehicles which aren't outfitted
Climatronic, even though one half of the device isn't actually used?
The Bentley CD isn't very helpful here.

And finally, there's FC (coolant fan control), which is a 3-pin device
shown mounted near or in the radiator and not really part of this
listing of devices in the thermostat housing, but I thought I'd list
it since it is related to coolant temperatures.

I have a 2003 Weekender. Next time I pull the belly pan, I'll have a
look at the thermostat housing to see what's there. I did replace the
black with a green D-shaped device several years ago as a preventative
measure.

Carl


--- In ev_update@..., "dave_king_ev" <dave_king_ev@...> wrote:

There is something wrong with this "good info" because it describes
all 3 sensors as 4-pin sensors, which would mean 12 pins total, and
that would mean 6 devices.

But, as far as I can tell (I have a '99 12 valve, and a paper Bentley,
but there has been a discussion on vortex -- complete with wiring
diagrams posted for the 24 valve motor -- and what I've seen is
consistent with mine) there are just 5 devices:

ECU
gage
fan
afterrun pump
AC cutout

Various models -- the 5 cylinder, the 12 valve, the 24 valve -- have
various locations and combinations for all the sensors involved (for
example on some models the ECU and gage sensors are combined in a
4-pin device while on other models the ECU sensor is a 2-pin
device) but all models use only those 5 devices, which would mean only
10 total pins.

But, Dave's information shows 3 devices with 4 pins each which is 12
pins which means 6 devices.

Something is not adding up. Does the 24 valve motor have a 6th
device? If so, what is it?



--- In ev_update@..., Sea2river@ wrote:

Good info.

And when replacing the sensor, if you replace the cap on the coolant
reservoir (after relieving any residual pressure), the amount of

coolant loss will

be less that a cup.

Bob W.


In a message dated 5/25/2008 12:33:43 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
davebo1896@ writes:

And the new green d-shaped (oval) sensor did the trick.

The dash gauge is now working.

Another note, I think the AC was not working while this sensor was
malfunctioning. It seems to be working now. I'm not sure if this is
related.

So to sum up ...

There are two sensors under the engine in the thermostat housing.
You'll have to drop the belly pan to get to these, they are on the
driver's side.

The 4-pin d-shaped (oval) is for the dash gauge and the fuel
injection. The new sensor is green, the original one was black. the
black ones are a known problem.

The 4-pin square sensor next to the d-shaped sensor is for the fans.

There is a 4-pin blue sensor in a hose near the top of the block that
is for the after-run pumps.

Each sensor is held in with a c-clip. Each sensor has a rubber

o-ring.

It is possible to swap out the sensors without draining the coolant
system, but you need to be quick with the lower ones (make sure the
coolant is cold, safety goggles and a closed mouth are advised)

The o-ring does not always come out when you pull the sensor. Make
sure it is accounted for before replacing the c-clip. Also be sure
the sensor is under the c-clip not over it, or it will pop out and
drain all your coolant.

Sensors and o-rings are available from Steve at
_ ()

Thanks All !!

Dave




****Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking

with

Tyler Florence" on AOL Food.

()

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]