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Re: Ecclesiastes - Quotes from GOOD NEWS BIBLE

 

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Thank you Greig.? Merlene
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From: Greig and Anne Lipman
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2020 6:00 PM
Subject: Re: [b4uc] Ecclesiastes - Quotes from GOOD NEWS BIBLE
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Hi Marlene
Ecclesiastes 9 is one of my favourite chapters. I think one key is the “under the sun” idea )vs the above the sun) it talks about;? All of the joys and sorrows of this life happen “under the sun.“ it mentions that Joys and happiness can be extracted by maintaining happy parameters in the close relationships each of us have. Go outside this boundary leads to pain and sorrow.
Therefore There is an opposite. It must? be “above the sun”. That is; Heaven. The place where Christ has ascended to. Thessalonians and Hebrews tell us that Christ will return one day from there.
At that time He will raise the Dead in Christ. (All those who accepted him as saviour)
“Sheol”In Ecclesiastes 9 is the grave. This is one of the verses that tell is that there is no life there. The New Testament tells us, especially the incident between Jesus and Mary about? her beloved brother Lazarus. Where Jesus says he is both, asleep and also dead. Read the whole account from when Jesus recieves the news of Lazarus’ passing.
Mary response is interesting because she had been taught about a resurrection day before the first Easter occurred. Ie she knew a Resurrection doctrine and about the Last day.
So these thoughts are very different to the idea of a spirit going to heaven when We die.
But i reckon there are enough scriptures for me to take comfort.
It opposes that awful comment like: “ when the child who has passed is In heaven ..”because God wanted him more than his parents.“
Or
that an unbelieving parent is in hell looking up wishing he had believed.
No, this Ecclesiastes idea says in Sheol there is no thought (therefore life) BUT Jesus says: “I AM THE RESURRECTION? AND THE LIFE” and “I will come back Again and receive you unto myself so that where i am;You may he there also, therefore comfort one another with these words.“
I say: Hallelujah what a saviour.!!
Yours,
Greig

On 29 Sep 2020, at 1:50 pm, Mandy <mandyflynn01@...> wrote:

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Hi everyone interesting comments thank you. Just a thought do you think that if today someone saw all that gloom they? would be treated for depression and given medication,? many people for various reasons feel like that, not me but family members. Enjoy the rest of you holidays. ?
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Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.
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-------- Original message --------
From: "Ray via groups.io" <ray.sarlin@...>
Date: 28/9/20 5:33 pm (GMT+10:00)
Subject: Re: [b4uc] Ecclesiastes - Quotes from GOOD NEWS BIBLE
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Hi Merlene,
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At least Solomon saw that there was more to life than just what was under the sun.
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Your detailed treatise reminds me of the words of Socrates in his comment to Plato around 500 B.C., "It may be that the Deity can forgive sins, but I do not see how."? The wisdom of the so-called "wisest man who ever lived" wasn't even close to a match for Godly wisdom.
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Thank God for the New Testament, which is just another way to say thank God for Jesus!
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Daniel Webster suggested that the greatest thought that ever entered the mind of Man was "My responsibility to my Maker."? As you so excellently point out, Solomon's thoughts centred on himself.
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Fortunately for Solomon, and for us, the Maker sets a low bar for our salvation, our acceptance of the gift of His Son.
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Thanks, Merlene.? Hopefully we'll hear from some others.
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Blessings,
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Ray
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On Monday, 28 September 2020, 05:05:19 pm AEST, Merlene <merlene@...> wrote:
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Hi Ray and fellow Students,
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Last Thursday you, Ray, asked the Group whether or not it believed King Solomon (The Preacher) will make it to Heaven or not.? I was one of those who believe he did not repent, nor did he find peace, nor find God (or The Lord) and died a bitter, albeit very knowledgeable and rich man.? My reasons:
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I didn’t hear anything said that the Preacher gave thanks to God, or thanks to anyone for that matter.? Nor did I hear that he received joy in giving – his only happiness was through “living the high life”.? In fact, in giving Advice to Young People starting in Chapter 11 at verse 9:? Enjoy your youth.? Be happy while you are still young.? Do what you want to do, and follow your heart’s desire. But remember that God is going to judge you for whatever you do.? ...... you aren’t going to be young very long.? So “remember” your Creator while you are still young, before those dismal days and years come when you will say “I don’t enjoy life”.
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He then proceeds to go on and on about the dismal reality of Old Age quoting that “..... and all desire will have gone”.? Not a word here about being glad in the Lord, or finding joy in loving God.? ALL the way through Ecclesiastes His God is portrayed as a God of judgement, righteous, keen to give us our “just deserts” so as to speak.? Nothing about He is preparing a Place for us, etc. etc. after mortal death – no hope promised here.
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He repeatedly advises to continue to eat, drink and enjoy yourselves, i.e. MATERIAL, bodily happiness.? Even to the extent in Chapter 11 to Invest your money wisely.? Although God made everything, it is not given to us to know Him nor how He works or even whether or not He helps us, especially when the Preacher says – you never know whether or it it will grow well etc. – intimating it is all a matter of chance.? No matter how long you live, remember that you will be dead much longer – there is nothing AT ALL to look forward to ever.
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In Chapter 9 verse 7:? Go ahead – eat your food and be happy;? drink your wine and be cheerful.? It’s alright with God. Enjoy life with the woman you love, as long as you live the useless life that God has given you in this world.? Enjoy every useless day of it!!?? Nothing here about God also giving us another richer SPIRITUAL LIFE.
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What!! Have I misread it.? No, I don’t think so.? The Preacher is intimating that there is NO life after death, except that God is going to judge us – see his final words in verse 13: there is only one thing to say: have reverence for God and obey His commands, because this is ALL THAT MAN WAS CREATED for.
Finally, verse 14:? God is going to judge everything we do, whether good or bad, even things done in secret.
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I believe that Solomon didn’t search for God in a personal way, even at the end.? What he felt was regret and sorrow that all his good times of dining, wining, excesses, doing as he pleased, indulging himself, etc. and so on, were going to end, and he didn’t want that AT ALL.? He wanted it to continue forever, but without his aging body which I believe he resented.? The whole tone of Ecclesiastes is one of despair, not regret, but despair that the life he lived on earth was going to end and that was THE END – nothing more for mankind.?
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Not a mention that God is a God of love and a rewarder of those who do give Him reverence and obey His commands – but didn’t say? “love and honour Him, Praise Him” – didn’t see those words anywhere!
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All of Solomon’s wealth, wisdom and physical attraction didn’t help him at the End – he believed he returned to dust!??
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Over to the rest of you for your comments -
I hope I can be convinced that I am wrong – but I don’t think so – and I’ll need some convincing on this one!
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Sincerely to you All,
Merlene
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