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Hello All,
Before I shell out the $$$ for a SCU-17 or SignalLink I have a couple questions.
When using the Data IN/OUT port on back of rig do you need to also wired in the PTT circuit shown on page 19 of the User Manual.
I ask because my logging and digital modes software will key radio via CAT.
Or is it mandatory that when using HF Data Port PTT has to be controlled via the Data Port.
I would like to use the radio on VHF/UHF data modes also and I know that going to be on the mini din.
I went thru my spare parts box today and tried to wire up the Easy Digi interface to see how the radio would do on some HF FT-8. I had audio from rig to pc no problem along with PTT from HRD CAT or WSJT-X. I just could not get audio from the pc back into radio and Tx the audio. It would key radio but showed no output power on radio meter,In line power meter.
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Depending on which brand of sound card interface you get dictates if it keys the radio via VOX or using CAT.? ?I have a SignaLink which uses VOX on the DATA in/out port for HF on the rear panel of the FT-847.? To the best of my knowledge, I do not believe that the SignaLink can use CAT for it's HF PTT operation.? You can look on their website to see what it supports for the FT-847.? That all being said, the HF digital works as expected on mine.?
You are correct in that if you intend on using the VHF/UHF FM data modes, it will be via the 6 pin DIN connector.??
?
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According to some notes I copied from one of the forums (either VarAC or VARA).......here is what was said.? I'm sorry I didn't make a note of the source it came from.? VarAC is typically done on HF.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Congratulations, your latest VarAC 3.7.9 with 847 rig now can handle the ft847 with PTT over RTS or CTS and CAT over serial-com.
Here the specific ft847 requirements as I have it working:
1.? PTT and modulation must be on the same connector with ptt over RTS or CTS, and NOT ptt over cat
2.? The PKT connector is ONLY for FM. The Data-In-Out connector is ONLY for all except FM, usually SSB. VaraHF uses Data-In-Out.
3.? The circuit diagram in Yaesu-manual-(my page 16) has a wrong capacitor with 10uF in "afsk-out". I must use 0.47uF. With 10uF my ptt switches too slowly.
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?
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As Stu notes, the challenge with using the 847 with the digital
modes is that the source of PTT needs to be the same as the source
of the audio, EXCEPT for CAT.? CAT control of PTT for some reason
that continues to baffle me uses audio from the mike jack in the
front of the radio.? I have yet to figure out a use for PTT
via CAT.
HF modes use the data jack and the PTT circuit, VHF/UHF packet uses
the DIN and the separate PTT pin, so if you have one sound card for
both modes it becomes an interesting challenge in building a cable
with the right connectors (and DC-blocking) to do both.
Greg? KO6TH
Tim Davis KJ4DHF via groups.io wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Hello All,
Before I shell out the $$$ for a SCU-17 or SignalLink I have a
couple questions.
When using the Data IN/OUT port on back of rig do you need to also
wired in the PTT circuit shown on page 19 of the User Manual.
I ask because my logging and digital modes software will key radio
via CAT.
Or is it mandatory that when using HF Data Port PTT has to be
controlled via the Data Port.
I would like to use the radio on VHF/UHF data modes also and I
know that going to be on the mini din.
I went thru my spare parts box today and tried to wire up the Easy
Digi interface to see how the radio would do on some HF FT-8. I
had audio from rig to pc no problem along with PTT from HRD CAT or
WSJT-X. I just could not get audio from the pc back into radio and
Tx the audio. It would key radio but showed no output power on
radio meter,In line power meter.
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Hello All,
Well that makes sense as to why it was not passing audio back to radio as PTT was being handled via CAT like all my other rigs.
Does not make sense why Yaesu done it that way except that it mutes the mic or suppose to on the 847. I will add the cap and the resistor into the interface
line to see if that takes care of the problem.
Thanks All
Tim
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Greetings,
My FT-847 is connected to a SignaLink USB via a SignaLink?SLCAB847 cable plugged into the Data IN/Out jack on the rear of the radio.? I run WSJT-X with CAT control for the PTT and frequency control.? On HF and 6m I?regularly operate using?FT-8, FT-4, and WSPR and it works good for me.? On 2m and 70cm I've run WSPR with the same hardware and it works just as well as it does on HF.? This morning, I tested it on both 2m and 70cm using FT-8 and the CAT control changes frequency's and controls the radio's PTT as expected.
I've also used the same hardware configuration with JS8Call, which is based on WSJT-X.? It works as expected with CAT control for frequency selection and PTT.? I tested JS8Call on 2m this morning and the radio transmitted using CAT PTT.
Attached my WSJT-X configuration screen for the above hardware configuration.? I happen to use 9600 baud instead of 4800 baud which is the default.? I've used 4800 baud in the past and it works just fine.? Keep in mind that that some early FT-847's may only support unidirectional data on the CAT port.
73,
John
AB0VX
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Hi John,
Thanks for the info.
Using your SignalLink with the SLCAB847 is 1 way I was looking at going. With the SL you also need the jumper module SLMODHT correct?
And from what I understand is the jumper module is what controls the CAT on the DATA In/Out port on rig. So if that is case should not need CAT enabled in either WSJT-X or DMR780 for rtty/psk. Or am I just overthinking this to much?
?Now that really sparks my interest as SL says the SLCAB847 will only work on HF and has to use front mic for UHF/VHF.
I also sent you an email from qrz email address.
Tim
KJ4DHF
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I think you must be right, that the SignaLink's internal
VOX-generated PTT is what is triggering the 847 via the Data
connector.? Changing the PTT Method to VOX in WSJT-X would confirm
this.? Apparently, when both Data PTT and CAT PTT are present, the
Data port wins.?
That said, I was able to *barely* use the Data port's audio with PTT
coming from CAT.? The muting of the Data port's audio isn't perfect,
so if you feed a strong (speaker-level) audio into it, a little
sneaks through.? I doubt this was what they had in mind.? No idea
how close I came to damaging the rig by doing so, but it was worth a
multiplier one Field Day some years ago...? :)
Greg? KO6TH
Tim Davis KJ4DHF via groups.io wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Hi John,
Thanks for the info.
Using your SignalLink with the SLCAB847 is 1 way I was looking at
going. With the SL you also need the jumper module SLMODHT
correct?
And from what I understand is the jumper module is what controls
the CAT on the DATA In/Out port on rig. So if that is case should
not need CAT enabled in either WSJT-X or DMR780 for rtty/psk. Or
am I just overthinking this to much?
?Now that really sparks my interest as SL says the SLCAB847 will
only work on HF and has to use front mic for UHF/VHF.
I also sent you an email from qrz email address.
Tim
KJ4DHF
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Hello Greg,
I am curious with the Signal Link keying the radio via VOX generated PTT also.
As the SL has nothing to do with the CAT then the AFSK software should work via VOX setting and not comm port PTT. With this black sheep radio from Yaesu there is no telling.
Maybe John "AB0VX"can run a couple test to see with his 847 and Signal Link.
I will be ordering me a SL and module for my 847 in next few day's.
I tried using the Easy Digi by KF5INZ as I used them on other rigs and had a spare here. I could never get it to pass audio trying to trigger PTT from the current on the TX audio line from pc to 847. It would work if I used a second serial port on pc to key PTT on the Easy Digi. I just did not want to have to tie up 2 com ports on pc to 1 for CAT and 1 for PTT. I could make it work if I built my own Null modem cable from PC to 847 and pull the wires for DTR/RTS from same com port to interface board.
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Splitting out the serial port's signals for CAT and PTT is great if
the software supports it - both CAT and PTT on the same adapter -
without a conflict.? Sounds like it does.? Thanks for mentioning
that.
I don't have a SignaLink box, instead running my digital modes from
Linux on a Raspberry Pi and a custom set of cables.? Initially I
used a GPIO pin to drive PTT, but ran into software that wasn't
tuned for the Pi platform (didn't "do" GPIO), so had to add another
serial adapter on USB.? Matched that with a multi-ported audio cable
to both DIN and TRS ports, along with switches for polarity (active
high vs low), etc.? It's my Winchester Mystery Adapter, one that
kind of grew on its own with no end in sight.? Probably something I
should rework for whatever PTT commonality there exists among ALL
the software apps (WSJTX, Fldigi, Direwolf, QSSTV, etc...).?
Modem-based PTT is likely the one.? If I can break that out from the
CAT port, that would simplify things even further.? I believe that
Craig KM6LYW (creator of the DigiPi) uses a single method for all
software in his system.
Greg? KO6TH
Tim Davis KJ4DHF via groups.io wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Hello Greg,
I am curious with the Signal Link keying the radio via VOX
generated PTT also.
As the SL has nothing to do with the CAT then the AFSK software
should work via VOX setting and not comm port PTT. With this black
sheep radio from Yaesu there is no telling.
Maybe John "AB0VX"can run a couple test to see with his 847 and
Signal Link.
I will be ordering me a SL and module for my 847 in next few
day's.
I tried using the Easy Digi by KF5INZ as I used them on other rigs
and had a spare here. I could never get it to pass audio trying to
trigger PTT from the current on the TX audio line from pc to 847.
It would work if I used a second serial port on pc to key PTT on
the Easy Digi. I just did not want to have to tie up 2 com ports
on pc to 1 for CAT and 1 for PTT. I could make it work if I built
my own Null modem cable from PC to 847 and pull the wires for
DTR/RTS from same com port to interface board.
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Try a program called VSPE or Virtual Serial Port Emulator and choose splitter. Then select COM20 as your virtual port and make sure you set a common baud rate. Then set the same baud rate for CAT and control in the other 2 options whilst ensuring the baud rate is correct.
De Spence G5STO
VSPE is free and give prompts after 30 days to register but it doesn’t stop functioning just doesn’t allow you to save the settings until you register. Sent while portable! please excuse typos.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 24 Mar 2024, at 22:50, Greg D <ko6th.greg@...> wrote:
?
Splitting out the serial port's signals for CAT and PTT is great if
the software supports it - both CAT and PTT on the same adapter -
without a conflict.? Sounds like it does.? Thanks for mentioning
that.
I don't have a SignaLink box, instead running my digital modes from
Linux on a Raspberry Pi and a custom set of cables.? Initially I
used a GPIO pin to drive PTT, but ran into software that wasn't
tuned for the Pi platform (didn't "do" GPIO), so had to add another
serial adapter on USB.? Matched that with a multi-ported audio cable
to both DIN and TRS ports, along with switches for polarity (active
high vs low), etc.? It's my Winchester Mystery Adapter, one that
kind of grew on its own with no end in sight.? Probably something I
should rework for whatever PTT commonality there exists among ALL
the software apps (WSJTX, Fldigi, Direwolf, QSSTV, etc...).?
Modem-based PTT is likely the one.? If I can break that out from the
CAT port, that would simplify things even further.? I believe that
Craig KM6LYW (creator of the DigiPi) uses a single method for all
software in his system.
Greg? KO6TH
Tim Davis KJ4DHF via groups.io wrote:
Hello Greg,
I am curious with the Signal Link keying the radio via VOX
generated PTT also.
As the SL has nothing to do with the CAT then the AFSK software
should work via VOX setting and not comm port PTT. With this black
sheep radio from Yaesu there is no telling.
Maybe John "AB0VX"can run a couple test to see with his 847 and
Signal Link.
I will be ordering me a SL and module for my 847 in next few
day's.
I tried using the Easy Digi by KF5INZ as I used them on other rigs
and had a spare here. I could never get it to pass audio trying to
trigger PTT from the current on the TX audio line from pc to 847.
It would work if I used a second serial port on pc to key PTT on
the Easy Digi. I just did not want to have to tie up 2 com ports
on pc to 1 for CAT and 1 for PTT. I could make it work if I built
my own Null modem cable from PC to 847 and pull the wires for
DTR/RTS from same com port to interface board.
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Windows-only application, so not something I can use.? Perhaps others...
Greg? KO6TH
Spence G5STO via groups.io wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Try a program called VSPE or Virtual Serial Port Emulator and choose splitter. Then select COM20 as your virtual port and make sure you set a common baud rate. Then set the same baud rate for CAT and control in the other 2 options whilst ensuring the baud rate is correct.
De Spence G5STO
VSPE is free and give prompts after 30 days to register but it doesn’t stop functioning just doesn’t allow you to save the settings until you register.
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Is there no way to take the RTS pin on the 9 pin connector and run it into a transistor at the base and use it to switch the PTT line at 0vdc.
This way you can still use the RX, TX and gnd pins for CAT control and use RTS high (12v I believe) as breakout. You don’t need any voltage on the collector and the emitter to a common ground with the base and appropriate resistor to the RTS. The PTT can sit in collector and be grounded via the resistor. Most software should allow the RTS keying but I will be honest I’ve not been following this thread that closely.
Please correct me if this won’t work for you?
De Spence G5STO
Ps: I use this method to ground my relays via 0vdc line into an optoisolator. The optoisolator is powered and the transistor brings the internal IR led to ground to switch on.
Sent while portable! please excuse typos.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 24 Mar 2024, at 23:00, Greg D <ko6th.greg@...> wrote:
?Windows-only application, so not something I can use. Perhaps others...
Greg KO6TH
Spence G5STO via groups.io wrote:
Try a program called VSPE or Virtual Serial Port Emulator and choose splitter. Then select COM20 as your virtual port and make sure you set a common baud rate. Then set the same baud rate for CAT and control in the other 2 options whilst ensuring the baud rate is correct.
De Spence G5STO
VSPE is free and give prompts after 30 days to register but it doesn’t stop functioning just doesn’t allow you to save the settings until you register.
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Hello Spence, That is basically what I had to do to use this interface. I had to have access to to the RYS pin on the pc side of the CAT cable. So I just I need to splice into the serial cable and tap the RTS pin from the PC to the opticoupler and ground. Then I made the cross over ( null modem) to the radio inside the project box going to the serial port on radio. Then just added the audio lines to the pc and radio. 
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Ooohhh I like that a lot. It’s similar to my first data interface except I used a USB sound card too and patched the transformed into it direct.
I take it you are using a 600:600 transformer and 1k:8ohm?
Also it looks like a 4N25 for the PTT line. If you look inside most sound card interfaces there is a similar design and $10 worth of parts but after a few LED’s it’s marketed for $100 which annoys me somewhat.?
? I’m not sure if your using a MAC or Linux but there is still the possibility of using Wine for VSPE but I’m really not a MAC man just Linux and Windows. I work a lot of satellite and trying to get the various programs tied into KISS 8100 port and Doppler shift and PTT together can only be achieved with VSPE. GreenCube springs to mind.
? I think I posted an image of my breakout board for just this reason but I will post it again. I needed 9600baud from the SCU17 but the SCU17 was never designed for the FT847 so had to design a breakout board to tap into the 9600baud data.
? Using two of these little boards I designed means I can simply move the 9600baud data to the 1200baud input to the sound card where before it wasn’t possible.
? I would suggest you could make a 9 pin version of this on vero or breadboard just for testing.
? Great thread this and it’s exploring the same issues I had many moons ago.?
I do have an original SignaLink SL1 without sound card and it does use either VOX or PTT depending on how you configure it. That’s where the extra $90 goes when you buy a commercial item as I’ve experimented with VOX and it’s fraught with small issues, especially with RF getting into the works.
De Spence G5STO
Sent while portable! please excuse typos.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 25 Mar 2024, at 11:49, Tim Davis KJ4DHF via groups.io <kj4dhf@...> wrote:
?Hello Spence, That is basically what I had to do to use this interface. I had to have access to to the RYS pin on the pc side of the CAT cable. So I just I need to splice into the serial cable and tap the RTS pin from the PC to the opticoupler and ground. Then I made the cross over ( null modem) to the radio inside the project box going to the serial port on radio. Then just added the audio lines to the pc and radio.
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Spence,
Right now I am on Windows as have not found a logbook rig interface program I like using yet on Linux. Tried a couple but cannot get use to the layouts. I been using HRD 20+ years and real use to it and it's layout.
?I am not sure on the transformers specs except that they are 600:600. I found these interfaces online about 15 years ago and grabbed some up for my FT100,FT990,FT1000D. They work great on them radio's. I had a couple in spare parts box and when I acquired the 847 I said what the heck let me see if I can get it to work on the 847.
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Using one of the modem lines (RTS or DTR) is likely the "universal" control point for PTT, with a single transistor acting open-collector for pulling the PTT line low.? I would add a series resistor (a few k-ohms) to the base as a current limit.? I believe Craig KM6LYW's DigiPi uses a FET instead of a bipolar transistor, with the same effect.
That said, the challenge for the 847 isn't so much the source of the PTT signal, it's the adapting of that one source of PTT and audio to the two "data" ports (one for HF SSB, one for VHF/UHF FM), and not using the broken CAT interface for anything other than setting the operating frequency.
Greg KO6TH
Spence G5STO via groups.io wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Is there no way to take the RTS pin on the 9 pin connector and run it into a transistor at the base and use it to switch the PTT line at 0vdc.
This way you can still use the RX, TX and gnd pins for CAT control and use RTS high (12v I believe) as breakout. You don’t need any voltage on the collector and the emitter to a common ground with the base and appropriate resistor to the RTS. The PTT can sit in collector and be grounded via the resistor. Most software should allow the RTS keying but I will be honest I’ve not been following this thread that closely.
Please correct me if this won’t work for you?
De Spence G5STO
Ps: I use this method to ground my relays via 0vdc line into an optoisolator. The optoisolator is powered and the transistor brings the internal IR led to ground to switch on.
Sent while portable! please excuse typos.
On 24 Mar 2024, at 23:00, Greg D <ko6th.greg@...> wrote:
?Windows-only application, so not something I can use. Perhaps others...
Greg KO6TH
Spence G5STO via groups.io wrote:
Try a program called VSPE or Virtual Serial Port Emulator and choose splitter. Then select COM20 as your virtual port and make sure you set a common baud rate. Then set the same baud rate for CAT and control in the other 2 options whilst ensuring the baud rate is correct.
De Spence G5STO
VSPE is free and give prompts after 30 days to register but it doesn’t stop functioning just doesn’t allow you to save the settings until you register.
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Greg,
Thanks for your input. Yes that is the challenge for me. Being able to use the PTT function on the Data IN/OUT jack at the rig to pass the audio from pc to rig without damaging the radio circuitry. I am not sure of how to wire the transistor into the tip audio line and where to tie it to the board an work properly and not damage the radio. The cost of the Digi Easy is dirt cheap 847 $$$.
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Hi Greg, check out John M0UKD’s website. At the bottom of this page just above the comments section is a design that should help.
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Stu Olson
Spence G5STO