Re: Thinking about getting rid of my w650
According to all the specs I've read the W650 weighs 450 wet which means that 1200 weighs 130 lbs more...Which is the equivalent of a 9st pillion extra. That gives the 1200 a power to weight ratio of 8.7. A 50 bhp W has a power to weight ratio of 9. ....not hugely higher. Now factor in the fact that a W that makes power to 8000 rpm...some 3000 rpm higher than the Harley and can therefore be at least one gear lower and you have the reason why a stock 1200 Sportster can't stay with my bike.
Jon
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Show quoted text
Triumph Bonneville..477 lbs dry
Harley Davidson Sportster 883...502 lbs dry
Kawasaki W 650...450 lbs dry
Harley Davidson Sportster 1200 Roadster..584 lbs wet (couldn't find dry)
Gas weighs 5.68 lbs per US gallon, oil 2 lbs per quart..shouldn't be
terribly hard to do the math if you knew the capacities..which I don't.
James Franklin
2411 Pine Summit DR. E
Jacksonville, Florida 32211
808-225-0994 (cell)
From: Ruari McLennan <r.mclennan@...>
Reply-To: W650riders@...
To: W650riders@...
Subject: Re: [W650riders] Re: Thinking about getting rid of my w650
Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2007 20:19:21 -0700
How much does the Halrey weigh, James?
Ruari
----- Original Message -----
From: "James Franklin" <jimw650@...>
To: <W650riders@...>
Sent: Sunday, July 15, 2007 6:57 PM
Subject: Re: [W650riders] Re: Thinking about getting rid of my w650
A stock 1200 Sportster is doing the 1/4 in 13.02...half a second quicker
than the fastest W 650 I have ever seen a test on. At 100 MPH (the HDs
terminal speed), 1/2 second would be about 75 feet ahead, the W rider
would
know he lost, but the Sportster rider would know he was close.
The 1200 makes 64.4 HP, 20 more than a stock W.
It's stock torque is 72.7 lb-ft at 3700 RPM, which would be around 70 MPH,
or twice what the W has at that speed in 5th.
A W, not even a 50 HP W, is not much of a roll-on challenge for a 1200
Sportster.
But an 883, which costs (supposedly) closer to the W, really isn't in the
same performance class.
The 883 makes 43.1 HP, about two less than the average W, yet weighs 50
lbs
more.
the 883 makes 43 ft lbs torque at 4550 RPM, the W 37.5 5100 RPM (that is
around 80 MPH for the W)
The best 1/4 mile I have seen for an 883..15.16 sec at 88.33 MPH (that
puts
it right there with a good Honda CB 350 or a Suzuki X6 Hustler). The
slowest W test I have is 14.33 @ 92.34
The W, when compared to the Sportster, is a revver. When you compare it
to
a stock 883, you get a lot more performance for your money. The 883 needs
pipes, and a cam, with a little chip manipulation to match a stock W. Not
much after market hi-perf stuff is available for the W, but the W is a
retro, and it is quicker than a 60s Bonneville or Lightning. And the W is
pretty low key, it has a compression ratio of only 8.4 to 1, whereas the
Yamaha XS 650 was 10 to 1. Has anyone shaved the heads on a W to see what
kind of power is available there? Jon, you just did pipes and jets and
got
50 HP.
Jon, you probably beat the rider, not the machine, if what you rolled away
from was a 1200 and you did it in 5th gear, but there is no dishonor in
downshifting if the other bike has a 500cc advantage. I have ridden a lot
of
Sportsters (883s/1000s/1200s)..none of the rubber mounted engine ones
yet..but I never rode a Sportster as comfortable as the W, or as confidant
at parking lot speeds. And I bet Lucy was much more comfortable on the
back
of your W than she would have been on that skinny slab HD provides for a
passenger on the Sportster.
James Franklin
2411 Pine Summit DR. E
Jacksonville, Florida 32211
808-225-0994 (cell)
From: "Jonhaddock@..." <jonhaddock@...>
Reply-To: W650riders@...
To: <W650riders@...>
Subject: Re: [W650riders] Re: Thinking about getting rid of my w650
Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2007 01:56:42 +0100
Well a stock one isn't as quick as a W650 which is about as slow as modern
motorcycles get....which makes the Sporty pretty slow. Certainly my warmed
up W will beat a loud piped 1200 Sporty from 60 to 100 plus....two
up.....And Lucy was on the back when we did it...
A 1200 Sporty is by no means slow. It's about as fast a Harley
platform as there is. /--- In W650riders@..., "Alexander
Ward" <award@...> wrote:
I've been lurking on this list for years, but now I have to chime
in
on this topic.
I think the Sportster is a great partner to the W650. I have both a
2000 W650 and a 1996 Sportster XL1200S Sport. The Sport has
adjustable Showa forks and dual front discs. If you add rearsets and
clipons and a decent seat, then it becomes a really fun scoot. '
No, it is not particularly fast, but the wide flat powerband
and more than ample torque combine with decent handling and braking
to make it easy to ride without requiring a lot of work. If you
switch to 17" wheels and sticky tires it gets even better. Don't
worry about the vibration if you buy an older one with a solid- mount
engine, just install BalanceMasters active vibration dampers and
fiddle with the final drive ratios (or even switch to chain drive)
and once it is dialed in, then just enjoy it.
Although any Japanese 600 can run rings around it, that is balanced
out by the double-takes from all of the head-to-toe leather-clad
dumplings on their cool Harleys who are cruising along at 30mph when
you pass them on the outside of a curve.
You do have to think about it though. One of the classic disparaging
comments about Harleys is that they vibrate so much that parts fall
off. It is true, too. the first time I rode the Sporty any
distance, both mirrors, the taillight, and one turn signal fell off.
I felt like I had finally gained admittance to a long and proud
tradition!
At any rate, keep the W650, get a Sportster too.
Alex
--- In W650riders@..., "Larry Botheras"
<larry.botheras@> wrote:
Think long and hard. unless it's tricked up the 1200 sporty
will
feel
slower than the W IMHO, it's not that much more powerful (HD never
quote)
but it is a lot heavier
From: W650riders@... [mailto:W650riders@...] On
Behalf Of John
Sent: 11 July 2007 06:39
To: W650riders@...
Subject: [W650riders] Thinking about getting rid of my w650
I found a sportster 1200r that's tempting me to get rid of the w.
What
are your thoughts on the 2006 sportster 1200 roadster?
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Re: Thinking about getting rid of my w650
Of course it could be that the person who buys a Sportster couldn't give a toss whether you out accelerate them or not. Maybe they are happy just cruising at their own pace
Dick
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
----- Original Message ----- From: "Jonhaddock@..." <jonhaddock@...> To: <W650riders@...> Sent: Monday, July 16, 2007 11:37 AM Subject: Re: [W650riders] Re: Thinking about getting rid of my w650
It might make 20 bhp more but it is not only hauling a fair bit more weight,
but it can't rev anywhere near as high at any given speed. The W can be
always be at least one gear lower. THAT is what most people fail to factor
in... rear wheel torque ( which is the ONLY torque that matters), is a
product of engine torque minus transmission losses over gearbox ratio ...
If you have 100lbsft over a 1:1 gear ratio you have 100 lbs ft
If you have 50 lbs ft over a 0.5 to one ratio, you have 100 lbs ft
That's why a weedy little Jap 600 can make a 1200cc Harley with all that
crankshaft torque look like a garbage truck in the acceleration stakes.
...gearing and revs.
A stock W is tailing off above 6500 rpm, an opened up one is still pulling
at 8000. No tester worth his salt is going to waste his time revving a stock
bike past 7000 so they shift up. My bike still has a 1000rpm left in that
lower gear before I change...AND I'm dropping into the next higher gear with
proportionally more power available.
Basically, When that guy came past, I simply shifted down three gears....I
never even saw top gear. The Sportster would have had to have been at least
3000 rpm lower at a similar speed and that is a VERY big difference in gear
ratios to overcome.
Jon
|
Re: Thinking about getting rid of my w650
It might make 20 bhp more but it is not only hauling a fair bit more weight, but it can't rev anywhere near as high at any given speed. The W can be always be at least one gear lower. THAT is what most people fail to factor in... rear wheel torque ( which is the ONLY torque that matters), is a product of engine torque minus transmission losses over gearbox ratio ...
If you have 100lbsft over a 1:1 gear ratio you have 100 lbs ft
If you have 50 lbs ft over a 0.5 to one ratio, you have 100 lbs ft
That's why a weedy little Jap 600 can make a 1200cc Harley with all that crankshaft torque look like a garbage truck in the acceleration stakes. ...gearing and revs.
A stock W is tailing off above 6500 rpm, an opened up one is still pulling at 8000. No tester worth his salt is going to waste his time revving a stock bike past 7000 so they shift up. My bike still has a 1000rpm left in that lower gear before I change...AND I'm dropping into the next higher gear with proportionally more power available.
Basically, When that guy came past, I simply shifted down three gears....I never even saw top gear. The Sportster would have had to have been at least 3000 rpm lower at a similar speed and that is a VERY big difference in gear ratios to overcome.
Jon
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
A stock 1200 Sportster is doing the 1/4 in 13.02...half a second quicker
than the fastest W 650 I have ever seen a test on. At 100 MPH (the HDs
terminal speed), 1/2 second would be about 75 feet ahead, the W rider would
know he lost, but the Sportster rider would know he was close.
The 1200 makes 64.4 HP, 20 more than a stock W.
It's stock torque is 72.7 lb-ft at 3700 RPM, which would be around 70 MPH,
or twice what the W has at that speed in 5th.
A W, not even a 50 HP W, is not much of a roll-on challenge for a 1200
Sportster.
But an 883, which costs (supposedly) closer to the W, really isn't in the
same performance class.
The 883 makes 43.1 HP, about two less than the average W, yet weighs 50 lbs
more.
the 883 makes 43 ft lbs torque at 4550 RPM, the W 37.5 5100 RPM (that is
around 80 MPH for the W)
The best 1/4 mile I have seen for an 883..15.16 sec at 88.33 MPH (that puts
it right there with a good Honda CB 350 or a Suzuki X6 Hustler). The
slowest W test I have is 14.33 @ 92.34
The W, when compared to the Sportster, is a revver. When you compare it to
a stock 883, you get a lot more performance for your money. The 883 needs
pipes, and a cam, with a little chip manipulation to match a stock W. Not
much after market hi-perf stuff is available for the W, but the W is a
retro, and it is quicker than a 60s Bonneville or Lightning. And the W is
pretty low key, it has a compression ratio of only 8.4 to 1, whereas the
Yamaha XS 650 was 10 to 1. Has anyone shaved the heads on a W to see what
kind of power is available there? Jon, you just did pipes and jets and got
50 HP.
Jon, you probably beat the rider, not the machine, if what you rolled away
from was a 1200 and you did it in 5th gear, but there is no dishonor in
downshifting if the other bike has a 500cc advantage. I have ridden a lot of
Sportsters (883s/1000s/1200s)..none of the rubber mounted engine ones
yet..but I never rode a Sportster as comfortable as the W, or as confidant
at parking lot speeds. And I bet Lucy was much more comfortable on the back
of your W than she would have been on that skinny slab HD provides for a
passenger on the Sportster.
James Franklin
2411 Pine Summit DR. E
Jacksonville, Florida 32211
808-225-0994 (cell)
From: "Jonhaddock@..." <jonhaddock@...>
Reply-To: W650riders@...
To: <W650riders@...>
Subject: Re: [W650riders] Re: Thinking about getting rid of my w650
Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2007 01:56:42 +0100
Well a stock one isn't as quick as a W650 which is about as slow as modern
motorcycles get....which makes the Sporty pretty slow. Certainly my warmed
up W will beat a loud piped 1200 Sporty from 60 to 100 plus....two
up.....And Lucy was on the back when we did it...
A 1200 Sporty is by no means slow. It's about as fast a Harley
platform as there is. /--- In W650riders@..., "Alexander
Ward" <award@...> wrote:
I've been lurking on this list for years, but now I have to chime
in
on this topic.
I think the Sportster is a great partner to the W650. I have both a
2000 W650 and a 1996 Sportster XL1200S Sport. The Sport has
adjustable Showa forks and dual front discs. If you add rearsets and
clipons and a decent seat, then it becomes a really fun scoot. '
No, it is not particularly fast, but the wide flat powerband
and more than ample torque combine with decent handling and braking
to make it easy to ride without requiring a lot of work. If you
switch to 17" wheels and sticky tires it gets even better. Don't
worry about the vibration if you buy an older one with a solid- mount
engine, just install BalanceMasters active vibration dampers and
fiddle with the final drive ratios (or even switch to chain drive)
and once it is dialed in, then just enjoy it.
Although any Japanese 600 can run rings around it, that is balanced
out by the double-takes from all of the head-to-toe leather-clad
dumplings on their cool Harleys who are cruising along at 30mph when
you pass them on the outside of a curve.
You do have to think about it though. One of the classic disparaging
comments about Harleys is that they vibrate so much that parts fall
off. It is true, too. the first time I rode the Sporty any
distance, both mirrors, the taillight, and one turn signal fell off.
I felt like I had finally gained admittance to a long and proud
tradition!
At any rate, keep the W650, get a Sportster too.
Alex
--- In W650riders@..., "Larry Botheras"
<larry.botheras@> wrote:
Think long and hard. unless it's tricked up the 1200 sporty
will
feel
slower than the W IMHO, it's not that much more powerful (HD never
quote)
but it is a lot heavier
From: W650riders@... [mailto:W650riders@...] On
Behalf Of John
Sent: 11 July 2007 06:39
To: W650riders@...
Subject: [W650riders] Thinking about getting rid of my w650
I found a sportster 1200r that's tempting me to get rid of the w.
What
are your thoughts on the 2006 sportster 1200 roadster?
Go to temporary photos site - ::
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_________________________________________________________________
Don't get caught with egg on your face. Play Chicktionary!
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|
Re: Thinking about getting rid of my w650
?
So Pray tell us What was the worse?
Dick
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2007 8:09 AM
Subject: Re: [W650riders] Re: Thinking
about getting rid of my w650
I'm afraid I am speaking from a position of knowledge...?
Second worst bike I ever rode... the worst was an 883
----Original Message----
From: eustisgary@...
Date:
16/07/2007 1:41
To: <W650riders@...>
Subj:
[W650riders] Re: Thinking about getting rid of my w650
Have you actually ridden a 1200 Sporty?--- In
W650riders@yahoogroups.com,
"Larry Botheras" ...>
wrote:
>
>
Think long and hard. unless it's tricked up the 1200 sporty will
feel
> slower than the W IMHO, it's not that much more powerful
(HD never
quote)
> but it is a lot heavier
>
>
>
> From: W650riders@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:W650riders@yahoogroups.com]
On
> Behalf Of John
> Sent: 11 July 2007 06:39
> To: W650riders@yahoogroups.com
>
Subject: [W650riders] Thinking about getting rid of my w650
>
>
>
> I found a sportster 1200r that's tempting me to get rid of
the w.
What
> are your thoughts on the 2006 sportster 1200
roadster?
>
___________________________________________________________
Tiscali
Broadband only ?9.99 a month for your first 3 months!
http://www.tiscali.co.uk/products/broadband/
|
Re: Bought myself a W.....
|
Re: Bought myself a W.....
Thanxalot. You saved my kids from becoming fatherless!
|
Whilst on the subject of big cats I just thought I
would mention the fact that tomorrow (Tuesday) is the day I'm off to feed the
tigers
Dick
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2007 4:01 AM
Subject: Re: [W650riders] Re: The new
Buell - NWC
Yeah.? The motorcycle
ones are pretty nice looking too... ;)
In a message dated 7/15/2007
1:40:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time, hazel@...
writes:
Panthers are GORGEOUS!!!
?
Rrrose.
@>-->--
|
Re: Thinking about getting rid of my w650
I'm afraid I am speaking from a position of knowledge...? Second worst bike I ever rode... the worst was an 883
----Original Message----
From: eustisgary@...
Date: 16/07/2007 1:41
To:
Subj: [W650riders] Re: Thinking about getting rid of my w650
Have you actually ridden a 1200 Sporty?--- In
W650riders@yahoogroups.com, "Larry Botheras" ...>
wrote:
>
> Think long and hard. unless it's tricked up the 1200 sporty will
feel
> slower than the W IMHO, it's not that much more powerful (HD never
quote)
> but it is a lot heavier
>
>
>
> From: W650riders@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:W650riders@yahoogroups.com] On
> Behalf Of John
> Sent: 11 July 2007 06:39
> To: W650riders@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [W650riders] Thinking about getting rid of my w650
>
>
>
> I found a sportster 1200r that's tempting me to get rid of the w.
What
> are your thoughts on the 2006 sportster 1200 roadster?
>
___________________________________________________________ Tiscali Broadband only ?9.99 a month for your first 3 months! http://www.tiscali.co.uk/products/broadband/
|
Re: Pipes and Jet Kit - Denver, Colorado
They don't need db meters. There's a tag that's on all stock pipes. It isn't there, you get a ticket.
Jake
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
----- Original Message ----- From: "Jonhaddock@..." <jonhaddock@...> To: <W650riders@...> Sent: Sunday, July 15, 2007 4:44 AM Subject: Re: [W650riders] Pipes and Jet Kit - Denver, Colorado hmm...Is this a measure just to give Police the power of instant fine should an excessively loud bike go by, or is it going to be rigorously backed up with pull-ins and db meters. 1981 Harleys will be worth a bit I expect! Jon Don't know. But it does bring to mind something I read today in American
Motorcyclist. You know how some folks say "Loud pipes save
lives", and other folks counter with "No, loud pipes cost rights!"? Guess
who was right? As of June 4th, anybody who lives in or
rides through Denver, Colorado now have a law specific to motorcycles. Any
motorcycle built after 1982 there must have the OEM pipes
on it, or it gets a 500 dollar ticket. If your muffler wears out over time
or is damaged in a crash, you'd be forced to purchase an
exact replacement from the dealership at OEM prices, if they're available
at all. The example they totted up was for a 2004 Kaw Mean
Streak. It'd be $1,331, plus bolts, hangers, etc. For a 1996 Suzuki
Bandit, it'd be $1,206, for a bike that has a resale value under
$2000.
Worst case is a 1983 Honda V45 Interceptor. The parts you can buy would
cost 672 dollars, but two of the headpipes and the left
muffler are discontinued. So that bike would be illegal to ride in Denver,
throw it on the scrap-pile.
Way to go, Denver bikers!
I don't think the general public was impressed with the loud bikes, or
even intimidated.
Jake
----- Original Message -----
From: "John " <schnozejt@...>
Looking for somewhere or a mft I can get some loud/good sound pipes
for my doubleYeah. Also need a jet kit to go along with it and would
like the pipes to look classic.
Thanks,
John
2065959753@...
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|
Re: NWC: On a Happier Note in Texas
I've been a member of the AMA for many many years.
I've used their Motow Plus service several times, it's a lifesaver. (Motow Plus
provides a free tow for any vehicle you're on/in, something like 35 miles or
so.)
?
Jake
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
----- Original Message -----
Jake
Did you join the AMA?
?
Dennis
----- Original Message -----
A new law takes effect in Texas on September
1st requiring all traffic-actuated signals at intersections to recognize
motorcycles! WooHOO!
?
Jake
|
Re: Thinking about getting rid of my w650
So much for Wikipedia. It says a quart of oil weighs 1.88 lbs,
and a quart of HD oil weighs 4 lbs. No wonder they're so heavy.  ?
Dennis
?
?
?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, July 15, 2007 8:56 PM
Subject: Re: [W650riders] Re: Thinking
about getting rid of my w650
Triumph Bonneville..477 lbs dry
Harley Davidson Sportster 883...502
lbs dry
Kawasaki W 650...450 lbs dry
Harley Davidson Sportster 1200
Roadster..584 lbs wet (couldn't find dry)
Gas weighs 5.68 lbs per US
gallon, oil 2 lbs per quart..shouldn't be
terribly hard to do the
math if you knew the capacities..which I don't.
James Franklin
. 
|
Re: 95, 295, 495 Highways, all.... nwc
You'da loved my EH.? It would hang even with 600 cc sportbikes up to it's top speed (limited by rev limiter), had a perfectly flat power curve, and beat a 'busa on a dyno drag. James Franklin wrote: The Victory has promise, their own engine and a parent company with a proven
track record.
Kawasaki's Drifter is still the best "Indian" ever made. Hendee would have
liked it. bean counters and greed killed the Springfield Indian after Hendee
died.
Besides in magazines, I have never seen a EH, haven't seen a dealership
either..not unusual in Hawaii I guess, but I used to spend one month a year
riding around on the mainland..and never saw one.
I am not a cruiser guy, so I don't mourn the loss of EH or Indian as much as
I do Norton or Vincent.
James Franklin
2411
Pine Summit DR. E
Jacksonville, Florida 32211
808-225-0994 (cell)
From: john gary simpson
Reply-To: W650riders@...
To: W650riders@...
Subject: RE: [W650riders] Re: 95, 295, 495 Highways, all.... nwc
Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2007 17:59:52 -0700 (PDT)
Unfortunately the state taxpayers spent the money on the building. The
Hanlons did a LOT of promoting, and signed up many dealerships, but they
stayed with their plan to have an in-house engine instead of using a
Harley=clone engine. That delayed the product by nearly three years. When
they finally put it into production, it was basically untested and
unrefined, Every buyer was a beta tester! The good part is that fixes for
the problems have been developed by the X community and the community
support structure is fantastic. After bottoming out, used X prices are
heading back up. Onceset up properly (about
$2000), the X is one heck of a
cruising motorcycle. Mine beat all comers at Phil Peterson's Miami Harley
Davidson Anniversary Dyno Shootout, including the lone Hayabusa that came to
embarass the American motorcycles.
CMC/Indian imrpoved dramatically, but never got past being just another
Harley clone with skirted fenders. It simply wasn't an Indian.
But had Excelsior hit the market three years sooner with a 1200 Sporty
motor, there may have been enough sales to build a following and a war chest
by the time they finished developing that magnificent little engine that
they had designed by those Engish racing guys!
James Franklin wrote:
But now that we have brought EH into it, never read a test where
the
journalists liked it, and what I did read about the company is, they spent
way too much on an extravagant office building and perks for the brothers
who started it, and should have spent more money
on promotion and
establishing dealerships.
For the CMC Indian, for their last two years, they had a new CEO and build
quality was way up..but they burned a lot of bridges with their initial
bikes, mostly CDI and other component problems..but the bike was more of an
assembled than a manufactured bike.
James Franklin
2411 Pine Summit DR. E
Jacksonville, Florida 32211
808-225-0994 (cell)
From: "James Franklin"
Reply-To: W650riders@...
To: W650riders@...
Subject: RE: [W650riders] Re: 95, 295, 495 Highways, all.... nwc
Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2007 14:31:23 -1000
Actually, that quote attributed to me, was not from me, don't know where it
came from, but was probably a reply to what I had written earlier about the
CMC
James Franklin
2411 Pine Summit DR. E
Jacksonville, Florida 32211
808-225-0994 (cell)
From: "john gary simpson"
Reply-To: W650riders@...
To: W650riders@...
Subject: [W650riders] Re: 95, 295, 495 Highways, all.... nwc
Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2007 21:42:43 -0000
Excelsior-Henderson bit the dust when the dotcoms took off. They
needed money to ramp up production, and most of their investors
pulled out and started putting their money in dotcoms instead. Too
bad. My 11 second EH was one of the most satisfying bikes I ever
owned!--- In W650riders@..., "James Franklin"
wrote:
>
> The Excelsior/Henderson people screwed that up even though they
had huge
> backing money. Indian (California Motorcycle Company version, not
the
> Springfield company original) sold really poor quality motorcycles
in the
> beginning, some of it was bad suppliers...the bike was a
composite, and some
> of it of course, was trying to build too many, too soon. In
their
last
> couple of years the product was better quality, but the bike had a
limited
> market, and those really interested probably bought the original
bikes and
> got burned.
>
>
>
> James Franklin
> P.O. Box 289
> Waimanalo, HI 96795-0289
> USA
> 808-225-0994 (cell)
>
>
>
>
> ----Original Message Follows----
> From: "kevin_cooklin"
> Reply-To: W650riders@...
> To: W650riders@...
> Subject: [W650riders] Re: 95, 295, 495 Highways, all.... nwc
> Date: Fri, 15 Sep 2006 02:00:38 -0000
>
> Hey, Den--
>
> If I remember our goodly Gene had a GB? They are not cheap
anymore.
> Distant memories
> tell me my own papa (I'm not Italian but am using this for
literary effect
> only) bought one,
> then lost it in a poker game. The dog. He could have waited
for
me to take
> it for a spin.
> But it's a gorgeous bike. To. Be. Sure.
>
> Ninja. I probably just need to hop on one sometime and go crazy.
In all
> honesty, I've had
> this anti-crotch-rocket mentality all my life, and I don't know
why.
> There's no reason for
> it. I graduated from high school in 1980. There's absolutely no
sense to
> it. So I need to
> overcome the prejudice and give it a go. Come on out and let me
take yours
> for a spin. I
> still would sell off my house for a 750 Norton Roadster, though.
It be in
> the blood.
>
> Don't completely rule out the new Norton, although all bets are
most likely
> on failure.
> Huge undertaking, and underfunding is always the killer. [The
attempt to
> bring back the
> Indian is an architypal model on the subject, and they had BIG
funding].
> Still, I like a guy
> or gal
who is so passionate about what he does that he/she f____s
up the
> funding, doesn't
> get it right, and yet..... had to do it. Artists, creative folk,
so rarely
> get the accounting, but
> they get everything else. Let's hope he gets through it.
>
> Did you sell the W because you were tired of it or because you
wanted to
> gain a couple of
> other cool bikes?
>
> kev
>
>
>
>
> --- In W650riders@..., "Dennis J. Guggemos"
> wrote:
> >
> > Kev
> >
> > The GB is buckets of fun, and a sure conversation starter just
like the
> W. The Ninja isn't
> a 114hp 600 four, just a lowly 65 hp twin. Tops out around 130 I
hear but
> I'll never find
> out for myself. It does get to the ton in a hurry though. It has a
pretty
> fair power band,
> kind of like a super W, useable low
end, comes on the cam about 6k
and pulls
> like a m-f-
> r. Red line at 11k but max power at around 8800. They cheaped out
on the
> suspension,
> the only adjustment is rear spring preload. The forks are just
beefier W
> forks. However
> that frame is super stiff, the racers love it.
> >
> > Sold the W to a guy that walked into the local dealer where I
had left
> word. Seems like a
> nice kid, said that's they way he would have wanted to fix it up
so I saved
> him a lot of
> trouble. He does a lot of 2-up with his gf and they like it.
They're not
> really near here so
> not likely I'll see it again.
> >
> > I read a bike tabloid a month or so ago that told of the demise
of the
> Norton. I suppose
> if they can find another bunch of money it could still be a go. I
don't
> trust everything I read
> on their website now as
the $ meltdown happened months ago but the
website
> didn't say
> anything about it.
> >
> > Dennis
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: kevin_cooklin
> > To: W650riders@...
> > Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 5:29 AM
> > Subject: [W650riders] Re: 95, 295, 495 Highways, all....
> >
> >
> > Dennis--
> >
> > Wow, two other bikes.... and sold your W. Hey, the GB500 has
to be a
> blast, as does the
> > Ninja. I'm pretty sure I'd kill myself with a Ninja. Of
course, now
> that you've sold the W,
> > you must resign your office! Kidding, of course. Did you sell
the W to
> a pal, or on Ebay,
> > or.... just curious.
> >
> > Did the new Norton just call it quits recently? I was
checking
them as
> recently as a
> month
> > ago; at that time they indicated they'd quit their factory
and were in
> search for another.
> > They were also seeking more money, of course. But they had
not formally
> thrown in
> the
> > towel. What a shame. But heck, that new Ducati Sport Classic,
the GT,
> sure looks nice.
> > Haven't seen one for real yet.
> >
> > Yes, need to get out there more on the bike. It's already
feeling like
> fall here in PA.
> >
> > Best,
> >
> > kev
> > Recent Activity
> > a.. 16New Members
> > b.. 1New Files
> > Visit Your Group
> > SPONSORED LINKS
> > a.. Kawasaki motorcycles
> > b.. Kawasaki vulcan
> > c.. Kawasaki motorcycle accessory
> > d.. Kawasaki motorcycle exhaust
> > e.. Kawasaki motorcycle part
> >
Yahoo! News
> > Space News
> >
> > Get the latest
> >
> > space related news
> >
> > Y! Toolbar
> > Get it Free!
> >
> > easy 1-click access
> >
> > to your groups.
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups
> > Start a group
> >
> > in 3 easy steps.
> >
> > Connect with others.
> > .
> >
>
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Re: Thinking about getting rid of my w650
Triumph Bonneville..477 lbs dry
Harley Davidson Sportster 883...502 lbs dry
Kawasaki W 650...450 lbs dry
Harley Davidson Sportster 1200 Roadster..584 lbs wet (couldn't find dry)
Gas weighs 5.68 lbs per US gallon, oil 2 lbs per quart..shouldn't be terribly hard to do the math if you knew the capacities..which I don't.
James Franklin
2411 Pine Summit DR. E
Jacksonville, Florida 32211
808-225-0994 (cell)
From: Ruari McLennan <r.mclennan@...>
Reply-To: W650riders@...
To: W650riders@...
Subject: Re: [W650riders] Re: Thinking about getting rid of my w650
Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2007 20:19:21 -0700
How much does the Halrey weigh, James?
Ruari
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
----- Original Message ----- From: "James Franklin" <jimw650@...> To: <W650riders@...> Sent: Sunday, July 15, 2007 6:57 PM Subject: Re: [W650riders] Re: Thinking about getting rid of my w650 A stock 1200 Sportster is doing the 1/4 in 13.02...half a second quicker
than the fastest W 650 I have ever seen a test on. At 100 MPH (the HDs
terminal speed), 1/2 second would be about 75 feet ahead, the W rider
would
know he lost, but the Sportster rider would know he was close.
The 1200 makes 64.4 HP, 20 more than a stock W.
It's stock torque is 72.7 lb-ft at 3700 RPM, which would be around 70 MPH, or twice what the W has at that speed in 5th.
A W, not even a 50 HP W, is not much of a roll-on challenge for a 1200
Sportster.
But an 883, which costs (supposedly) closer to the W, really isn't in the
same performance class.
The 883 makes 43.1 HP, about two less than the average W, yet weighs 50
lbs
more.
the 883 makes 43 ft lbs torque at 4550 RPM, the W 37.5 5100 RPM (that is
around 80 MPH for the W)
The best 1/4 mile I have seen for an 883..15.16 sec at 88.33 MPH (that
puts
it right there with a good Honda CB 350 or a Suzuki X6 Hustler). The
slowest W test I have is 14.33 @ 92.34
The W, when compared to the Sportster, is a revver. When you compare it
to
a stock 883, you get a lot more performance for your money. The 883 needs pipes, and a cam, with a little chip manipulation to match a stock W. Not much after market hi-perf stuff is available for the W, but the W is a
retro, and it is quicker than a 60s Bonneville or Lightning. And the W is pretty low key, it has a compression ratio of only 8.4 to 1, whereas the
Yamaha XS 650 was 10 to 1. Has anyone shaved the heads on a W to see what kind of power is available there? Jon, you just did pipes and jets and
got
50 HP.
Jon, you probably beat the rider, not the machine, if what you rolled away from was a 1200 and you did it in 5th gear, but there is no dishonor in
downshifting if the other bike has a 500cc advantage. I have ridden a lot
of
Sportsters (883s/1000s/1200s)..none of the rubber mounted engine ones
yet..but I never rode a Sportster as comfortable as the W, or as confidant at parking lot speeds. And I bet Lucy was much more comfortable on the
back
of your W than she would have been on that skinny slab HD provides for a
passenger on the Sportster.
James Franklin
2411 Pine Summit DR. E
Jacksonville, Florida 32211
808-225-0994 (cell)
From: "Jonhaddock@..." <jonhaddock@...>
Reply-To: W650riders@...
To: <W650riders@...>
Subject: Re: [W650riders] Re: Thinking about getting rid of my w650
Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2007 01:56:42 +0100
Well a stock one isn't as quick as a W650 which is about as slow as modern motorcycles get....which makes the Sporty pretty slow. Certainly my warmed up W will beat a loud piped 1200 Sporty from 60 to 100 plus....two
up.....And Lucy was on the back when we did it...
A 1200 Sporty is by no means slow. It's about as fast a Harley
platform as there is. /--- In W650riders@..., "Alexander
Ward" <award@...> wrote:
I've been lurking on this list for years, but now I have to chime
in
on this topic.
I think the Sportster is a great partner to the W650. I have both a
2000 W650 and a 1996 Sportster XL1200S Sport. The Sport has
adjustable Showa forks and dual front discs. If you add rearsets and
clipons and a decent seat, then it becomes a really fun scoot. '
No, it is not particularly fast, but the wide flat powerband
and more than ample torque combine with decent handling and braking
to make it easy to ride without requiring a lot of work. If you
switch to 17" wheels and sticky tires it gets even better. Don't
worry about the vibration if you buy an older one with a solid- mount
engine, just install BalanceMasters active vibration dampers and
fiddle with the final drive ratios (or even switch to chain drive)
and once it is dialed in, then just enjoy it.
Although any Japanese 600 can run rings around it, that is balanced
out by the double-takes from all of the head-to-toe leather-clad
dumplings on their cool Harleys who are cruising along at 30mph when
you pass them on the outside of a curve.
You do have to think about it though. One of the classic disparaging
comments about Harleys is that they vibrate so much that parts fall
off. It is true, too. the first time I rode the Sporty any
distance, both mirrors, the taillight, and one turn signal fell off.
I felt like I had finally gained admittance to a long and proud
tradition!
At any rate, keep the W650, get a Sportster too.
Alex
--- In W650riders@..., "Larry Botheras"
<larry.botheras@> wrote:
Think long and hard. unless it's tricked up the 1200 sporty
will
feel
slower than the W IMHO, it's not that much more powerful (HD never
quote)
but it is a lot heavier
From: W650riders@... [mailto:W650riders@...] On
Behalf Of John
Sent: 11 July 2007 06:39
To: W650riders@...
Subject: [W650riders] Thinking about getting rid of my w650
I found a sportster 1200r that's tempting me to get rid of the w.
What
are your thoughts on the 2006 sportster 1200 roadster?
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Don't get caught with egg on your face. Play Chicktionary!
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Re: Thinking about getting rid of my w650
---They say that 95% of all Harleys sold since 1965 are still on the road. They haven't made it home yet. In W650riders@..., "john gary simpson" <eustisgary@...> wrote:
A 1200 Sporty is by no means slow. It's about as fast a Harley
platform as there is. /--- In
W650riders@..., "Alexander Ward" <award@> wrote:
I've been lurking on this list for years, but now I have to
chime in
on this topic.
I think the Sportster is a great partner to the W650. I have both a
2000 W650 and a 1996 Sportster XL1200S Sport. The Sport has
adjustable Showa forks and dual front discs. If you add rearsets and
clipons and a decent seat, then it becomes a really fun scoot. '
No, it is not particularly fast, but the wide flat powerband
and more than ample torque combine with decent handling and
braking
to make it easy to ride without requiring a lot of work. If you
switch to 17" wheels and sticky tires it gets even better.
Don't worry about the vibration if you buy an older one with a solid- mount
engine, just install BalanceMasters active vibration dampers and
fiddle with the final drive ratios (or even switch to chain
drive) and once it is dialed in, then just enjoy it.
Although any Japanese 600 can run rings around it, that is balanced
out by the double-takes from all of the head-to-toe leather-clad
dumplings on their cool Harleys who are cruising along at 30mph when
you pass them on the outside of a curve.
You do have to think about it though. One of the classic disparaging
comments about Harleys is that they vibrate so much that parts fall
off. It is true, too. the first time I rode the Sporty any
distance, both mirrors, the taillight, and one turn signal fell off.
I felt like I had finally gained admittance to a long and proud
tradition!
At any rate, keep the W650, get a Sportster too.
Alex
--- In W650riders@..., "Larry Botheras"
<larry.botheras@> wrote:
Think long and hard. unless it's tricked up the 1200 sporty
will
feel
slower than the W IMHO, it's not that much more powerful (HD never
quote)
but it is a lot heavier
From: W650riders@... [mailto:W650riders@...] On
Behalf Of John
Sent: 11 July 2007 06:39
To: W650riders@...
Subject: [W650riders] Thinking about getting rid of my w650
I found a sportster 1200r that's tempting me to get rid of the w.
What
are your thoughts on the 2006 sportster 1200 roadster?
|
Sent you something off-list re exhausts - for jet kits, check Dynojet or Factory Pro. I installed the latter, they have more experience with people on this list.
Search "Factory Pro" and "Dyno" for my recent reports.
Ruari
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----- Original Message ----- From: "John" <schnozejt@...> To: <W650riders@...> Sent: Saturday, July 14, 2007 7:45 AM Subject: [W650riders] Pipes and Jet Kit Looking for somewhere or a mft I can get some loud/good sound pipes
for my doubleYeah. Also need a jet kit to go along with it and would
like the pipes to look classic.
Thanks,
John
2065959753@...
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Re: Bought myself a W.....
There is a recent callback on wetness problems with the 2005 or 2006 in Japan, I thonk... Check with your dealer.
I have it occasionally and ignore it, it goes away with the weather change. I guess you could unscrew the rim and see if you can clean the plastic faces. Use a non-ammonia non-alcohol window cleaner spray, eg GM window cleaner.
Then, and only then, kill yourself.
Ruari
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----- Original Message -----
From: "danorrlot" <danorrlot@...>
To: <W650riders@...>
Sent: Saturday, July 14, 2007 9:49 AM
Subject: [W650riders] Bought myself a W.....
....and it`s great! Its a 2000 model with less than 16000 km on the clock, and I love it. It
has been fitted with ohlins rear shocks since the originals were useless. The tyres are TT100
dunlops and it handles beautifully. One little problem though - the clocks have a mist of
water inside them? Do i have to take them all apart and change gaskets? Fill them with
silicone? Kill myself?
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Irn Bru, all right...
Ruari
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----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Campbell" <scrubby64@...> To: <W650riders@...> Sent: Saturday, July 14, 2007 10:16 AM Subject: Re: [W650riders] Henderson Here's a better shot....made in Scotland, from girders...
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ruari McLennan" <r.mclennan@...>
To: <W650riders@...>
Sent: Saturday, July 14, 2007 3:20 PM
Subject: Re: [W650riders] Henderson
What's the flywheel thingy right in the front of it?
Ruari
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Campbell" <scrubby64@...>
To: <W650riders@...>
Sent: Saturday, July 14, 2007 6:10 AM
Subject: Re: [W650riders] Henderson
Yip, uses a Volvo engine...
----- Original Message -----
From: "James Franklin" <jimw650@...>
To: <W650riders@...>
Sent: Saturday, July 14, 2007 11:20 AM
Subject: Re: [W650riders] Henderson
That is a Brittish "Indian", I think, because of copy rights, it can be
called an Indian in England, but if it were sold in the USA, it would be
sold as a Dakota.
Anyway, it is a much better "Indian" than those S&S V-Twin powered
California Motorcycle Company cookie cutter chopper things that won the
rights in court, to use the Indian trademark in the USA.
James Franklin
2411 Pine Summit DR. E
Jacksonville, Florida 32211
808-225-0994 (cell)
From: "Mark Campbell" <scrubby64@...>
Reply-To: W650riders@...
To: <W650riders@...>
Subject: Re: [W650riders] Henderson
Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2007 11:02:27 +0100
Ok, who knows what this is....
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jonhaddock@..." <jonhaddock@...>
To: <W650riders@...>
Sent: Saturday, July 14, 2007 10:43 AM
Subject: Re: [W650riders] Henderson
Like a lot of things in that era, they assumed a reasonable
understanding
of
machinery by the owner!
Neat - saves re-programming the throttle position sensor, eh?
Ruari
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jonhaddock@..." <jonhaddock@...>
To: <W650riders@...>
Sent: Friday, July 13, 2007 1:03 AM
Subject: Re: [W650riders] Henderson
The hand operated advance/retard lever was common on Brit bikes
before
the
development of the spring loaded auto-advance mechanism. You set it
retarded
for starting, minimising kick-backs and ensuring a slow, lazy
tick-over
from
cold, and advanced it for fast running. You could also retard the
ignition
to slog up hills, which was ideal if you were pulling a chair with
the
family on board!
Jon
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<< emfindi1.jpg >>
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Oh...? Now I get it...? Cougars
etc....
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----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, July 15, 2007 8:01 PM
Subject: Re: [W650riders] Re: The new
Buell - NWC
Yeah.? The motorcycle
ones are pretty nice looking too... ;)
In a message dated 7/15/2007
1:40:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time, hazel@...
writes:
Panthers are GORGEOUS!!!
?
Rrrose.
@>-->--
|
Re: Thinking about getting rid of my w650
I lost my magazine collection in my divorce, so 10 to one was from my memory as my home references are pretty much gone.
James Franklin
2411 Pine Summit DR. E
Jacksonville, Florida 32211
808-225-0994 (cell)
From: "Dennis J. Guggemos" <djguggms@...>
Reply-To: W650riders@...
To: <W650riders@...>
Subject: Re: [W650riders] Re: Thinking about getting rid of my w650
Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2007 19:23:58 -0700
James
I believe the original 1970 XS1 had 9:1 compression, and all subsequent XS's
had 8.4:1.
Just FYI. Source and my challengeable memory.
Dennis
_________________________________________________________________
|
The Owner's manual unfortunately shows the fuel tap set pointing backward at "Reserve." The long end is the pointer. It should normally point forward, under "Fuel." To confirm, grab a magnifying glass and look closely at the edge of the tap handle. You should see a tiny almost invisible moulded arrow. I painted my arrow black to make it visible.
Ruari McLennan
Victoria BC
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----- Original Message ----- From: "dvdberman" <dvdberman@...> To: <W650riders@...> Sent: Sunday, July 15, 2007 6:03 PM Subject: [W650riders] Oil/ Oil Additives #1 Just joined W650riders a few days ago and really appreciate all
the
great tech advice.
#2 I've seen some mention about Shell Rotella 15W40
really smoothing out downshifts. True? Also, can the same be
accomplished with an additive? I onced tried the Rotella in my Grand
National because a buddy said it could handle the heat of the turbo
better than 5W30. In the end, I went back to 5W30 because the slight
increase in pressure from the Rotella gave me nothing in better
performance.
#3 I saw an old thread about the annoying headlight rattle. I
fixed mine without bending the flanges on the lamps ring, but
instead, ran a couple wraps of teflon tape at the seal. It snugged up
pretty good.
#4 What actually WAS the final word on the fuel tap? To be safe, I
always top off the tank before heading out. My W is a 2000 and on
page 35 of the OM it shows the "ON" position with the LONGER end of
the flange covering the "RES" lettering.
#5 Any members in Oakland County, Michigan.
Kindest Regards,
DB
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Captain Jake