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Re: Sunfish upgrades...
Wayne Carney
John,
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Is this the picture? The Harken Little Hexaratchet can be an option too. I use one attached on the deck. Be careful using a cam cleat. They promote a lot of swimming... 8^) Wayne -----Original Message----- |
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Re: Newbie launching question
Wayne Carney
Adi,
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I think the Vanguard instructions assume a beach launch. As has been stated, rigging at dock side is a bit trickier. Frankly, launching at a ramp sucks, especially when it's crowded. When faced with that situation my technique is: - Step the mast and raise the sail in the usual manner while on the trailer. - Rig the mainsheet. - Drop the sail and tie off the halyard. (put a stopper knot in the free end too) - Tie up the sail and spars with a sail tie or two (bungee loop with a ball) capturing the bridle in one loop so the spars don't slide off the deck. - Leave the rudder off until the boat is in the water. The boat can now be launched and tied to the dock while you park the trailer etc. - Mount the rudder and get the daggerboard ready. I try and raise the sail while standing in knee deep water at the ramp, emulating a beach launch as best possible. If that isn't possible, I do either the point into the wind at the dock number -or- shove off and paddle out method. Once in the clear I point into the wind and raise the sail. Either way it's awkward and takes practice. Wayne -----Original Message----- |
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Re: Sunfish parts
Gail M. Turluck
Dear Adi,
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If you're only going to be sailing recreationally and won't be racing, then any "knockoff" sail you buy will likely serve you long and strong. I have sails in my garage that are 2, 5, 10, 15 and 20 and more years old. The only thing that has truly worn a Sunfish sail to the point that they won't make a Sunfish go is their having been left on a deck in the sun all summer, stored someplace where mice/squirrels/etc. could get at them, or other horrendous storage incidents occurred. It takes years and years of sailing in big breezes (not likely in North America) to truly wear out a Sunfish sail to the point that it disintegrates. The first racing sail I bought I sailed hard and frequently for over nine years and it will still make a boat go for many years. It just didn't have the shape and became porous (as all sailcloth does) that new sails do ... A recreational sail will easily give you 20 years of service if you take good care of it--keep it covered when on the road, store it where it will be kept dry, clean and unbothered by vermin, and loaded and tied in a way when you travel that vibration doesn't put holes in the material. Occasionally you may have an incident which causes a tear, but for a day-sailed boat, any sailmaker can make a quick patch and it will not materially affect your enjoyment. So, at that rate, if you buy a knockoff recreational sail for, say, $200, then for approximately $10 a year you will have sail power. I always recommend that you simply GO SAILING! This points to your being able to go out and get a sail which is made with modern materials, as they will hold up well, get your boat together and hit the water. If you don't want to buy a commercially made sailbag, 44-45" material (I recommend a heavy polyester, not canvas, as canvas molds when it gets wet), 16-1/3 feet long, folded over and sewn into a tube (with a 5/8" seam allowance) with one end closed makes an inexpensive sail cover for on the road. Tie it closed securely. If you can put in a sleeve and feed the rope through the sleeve at that second end of the bag and pull it shut and tie it shut that way, well, then you're a pro! Check the sale rack at the material store for heavy, ugly, polyester or other material that won't hold water, will dry quickly and won't rot. Doesn't matter what color/pattern it is so long as it will protect your sail, gaff, boom and mast. That way, too, you have one handy unit for tying to your rooftop or trailer and for storing wherever it is you store that part of your set up. When you go to roll up your sail you can leave it on the boom and gaff. Pull all of the sail to the port side of the boat/boom/gaff. Keeping the boom and gaff tips together, pull the sail out taught at the end of the sail (makes sail in half). Start rolling from that point of the sail, keeping it flat, so you end up with a 3rd small tube--the boom, the gaff and the sail. Double check to make sure that the sail is not at all fouled on the gooseneck to avoid holes being worn from sharp points on the gooseneck while stored in the sailbag. I leave my halyard through the tip of the mast and keep the mast in the gooseneck hole. I coil the halyard so it is snug to the tip of the mast to keep that mast in that position, just in case the bag opens on the road (keeps you from losing the mast, I know people it has happened to). If you ever think you will end up racing, you would eventually end up buying a Racing sail (from a dealer, only way to get them, built by North but only available through dealer network). But, don't get the racing sail now to learn and practice with. An inexpensive copy will suit you just fine. There are quite a few sailmakers who make generic type lateen-rig sails. The colored recreational sails sold by Vanguard are not all cut to the racing sail pattern, either, though if they have the "racing approved" sticker on them from Vanguard/North, then they are legal. The Vanguard rec sails (and all their predecessors) are 7-12% smaller than the Vanguard/North racing sails. I can't say whether it's worth extra money to get an "official" sail or not, though my guess would be that it is not. This likely is more information than you ever wanted to know about Sunfish sails. Get that boat together and go sailing! Good luck. Sincerely, Gail ~~~/)~~~/)~~~~/)~~~/)~~~/)~~~~/)~ Gail M. Turluck ISCA Masters Coordinator USSCA Masters Coordinator ~~~/)~~~/)~~~~/)~~~/)~~~/)~~~~/)~ -----Original Message-----
From: Wayne Carney [mailto:wcarney@...] Sent: Monday, June 16, 2003 4:31 PM To: sunfish_sailor@... Subject: RE: [sunfish_sailor] Re: Sunfish parts Adi, Is the sail cloth quality better forIn short, not necessarily. A good sailmaker will provide just as good a sail. I believe there are a couple of qualities to look at - Material, Cut, and Workmanship. The official Sunfish sail specs are elusive. The material is no doubt polyester in the 3.6 oz to 4.0 oz range. That would be typical for small boat sails. The cut might be patented so unofficial sails may have to be slightly different. Look at the exact square footage for a quick comparison. Workmanship will be a matter of inspection when you get a sail. From what I know about basic sail technology I believe the material in the "official" sail is most likely polyester. Nylon was a popular sail material before polyesters came on the scene and is still used today for jibs and inexpensive mainsails. However, Nylon looses it's stiffness quickly, absorbs water (gets heavy when wet), and also expands when wet (changing it's shape). It is lighter and more supple than polyester - why it's popular for jib material, but not desirable for mainsails any longer. I recommend shying away from nylon even if it makes the price a bit less. "Dacron" is the DuPont trade name for a variety of polyester widely used in sails. Sailcloth is tightly woven and has a coating that functions to help it maintain fiber alignment and keep the surface uniform. Look for these qualities. Any good sail will be made with thread that has a UV inhibitor added at the time the polymer was formulated. It may also have an additional UV coating. Look for UV resistant materials. The length of the sailmaker's warranty can be one indicator for degree of UV protection as well as the workmanship. Keep us posted on what you find, Wayne -----Original Message----- Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT If you do not wish to belong to Sunfish_sailor, you may unsubscribe by sending an email to: sunfish_sailor-unsubscribe@... Please do not send unsubscribe requests directly to the group. USEFUL ADDRESSES Post message: sunfish_sailor@... Subscribe: sunfish_sailor-subscribe@... Unsubscribe: sunfish_sailor-unsubscribe@... URL to egroups page: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. |
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Re: New style rudder/tiller needed
Wayne Carney
Other tiller materials can be:
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Hockey sticks, Canoe paddles, Axe handles.... Be very careful choosing aluminum tubing and metal golf club shafts for a tiller extension. There have been cases where some of these materials have broken in a capsize and become razor sharp spears. -----Original Message----- |
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Re: At what year did the "old style" Sunfish become the "new style"?
Wayne Carney
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-----Original Message----- Do you have the hardware? |
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Re: Sunfish parts
Wayne Carney
Adi,
Is the sail cloth quality better forIn short, not necessarily. A good sailmaker will provide just as good a sail. I believe there are a couple of qualities to look at - Material, Cut, and Workmanship. The official Sunfish sail specs are elusive. The material is no doubt polyester in the 3.6 oz to 4.0 oz range. That would be typical for small boat sails. The cut might be patented so unofficial sails may have to be slightly different. Look at the exact square footage for a quick comparison. Workmanship will be a matter of inspection when you get a sail. From what I know about basic sail technology I believe the material in the "official" sail is most likely polyester. Nylon was a popular sail material before polyesters came on the scene and is still used today for jibs and inexpensive mainsails. However, Nylon looses it's stiffness quickly, absorbs water (gets heavy when wet), and also expands when wet (changing it's shape). It is lighter and more supple than polyester - why it's popular for jib material, but not desirable for mainsails any longer. I recommend shying away from nylon even if it makes the price a bit less. "Dacron" is the DuPont trade name for a variety of polyester widely used in sails. Sailcloth is tightly woven and has a coating that functions to help it maintain fiber alignment and keep the surface uniform. Look for these qualities. Any good sail will be made with thread that has a UV inhibitor added at the time the polymer was formulated. It may also have an additional UV coating. Look for UV resistant materials. The length of the sailmaker's warranty can be one indicator for degree of UV protection as well as the workmanship. Keep us posted on what you find, Wayne -----Original Message----- |
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Re: rack to dolly, one person
Gail M. Turluck
My how times change! Used to be the bottom rack was fought over, a big
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prize for ease of loading! I recommend spraying the area where your boat will be stored with Roundup, then you will have a season with no weed issues! And loading to a bottom rack by oneself is a breeze, particularly with a dolly. Actually, the ladder method works pretty well. Just takes patience, care, planning, and balance. It helps to be tall ... Sincerely, Gail ~~~/)~~~/)~~~~/)~~~/)~~~/)~~~~/)~ Gail M. Turluck ~~~/)~~~/)~~~~/)~~~/)~~~/)~~~~/)~ -----Original Message-----
From: Charles Neuman [mailto:charles@...] Sent: Sunday, June 15, 2003 11:00 PM To: sunfish_sailor@... Subject: [sunfish_sailor] Re: rack to dolly, one person Actually, I was wrong, the racks are horizontal, so it's much easier to get a boat on and off with one person. Better yet, people don't like to use the lowest racks because of the weeds growing there, so I could use those. As for upper racks... I remember seeing some pictures in the Sunfish Bible showing how to get a Sunfish on the roof of a car singlehandedly. The person used a ladder, rested the bow on that, then brought the stern up to the car top, and then finally the bow up to the roof. I don't think I'd try it. :) Charles Long Island |
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Re: Looking for Sunfish in NY area
Nathan Weber
Thanks,
I got the same message myself. But I appreciate you efforts. Nate "Wayne Carney" <wcarney@...> 06/15/03 11:54PM >>> =================================================================== This message originates from the law firm of Frommer Lawrence & Haug LLP. It contains information that may be confidential or privileged and is intended only for the individual or entity named above. No one else may disclose, copy, distribute, or use the contents of this message. Unauthorized use, dissemination, and duplication is strictly prohibited, and may be unlawful. All personal messages express views solely of the sender, which are not to be attributed to Frommer Lawrence & Haug LLP, and may not be copied or distributed without this disclaimer. If you received this message in error, please notify us immediately at firm@... or call (212) 588-0800. |
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Re: Looking for Sunfish in NY area
Wayne Carney
Nate,
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Don't know if this is within your area, I saw this in another list-- Wayne For sale in Westerly RI: 1964 or so boat, good condition, upgraded = rudder, painted, very sailable for kick around boat. $200. Possible = trailer 150 reply to medtho@... -----Original Message----- |
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Re: rack to dolly, one person
Actually, I was wrong, the racks are horizontal, so it's much easier to
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get a boat on and off with one person. Better yet, people don't like to use the lowest racks because of the weeds growing there, so I could use those. As for upper racks... I remember seeing some pictures in the Sunfish Bible showing how to get a Sunfish on the roof of a car singlehandedly. The person used a ladder, rested the bow on that, then brought the stern up to the car top, and then finally the bow up to the roof. I don't think I'd try it. :) Charles Long Island On Fri, 13 Jun 2003, Charles Neuman wrote:
I might end up with rack storage for my Sunfish this summer. The boats are |
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Re: New style rudder/tiller needed
mikey m
When I rigged my used sunfish. I needed a tiller and tiller extension.. I used a Post hole digger handle and had a friend cut it down to 3/4 of an inch.. about 13.00 $ i bought a universal from the sunfish dealer and used an aluminun handle with grip and connected the 2 pieces together. Total cost less than 40 dollars...
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Wayne Carney <wcarney@...> wrote:Hi John, I don't blame you for not wanting to set sail with your current rig. I gather you didn't find any used parts available on the Sunfish Bulletin Board? GOOD NEWS - I just took another look at your photos. It appears that you do not need to do anything to your boat. It is already equipped with the "new style" gudgeon bracket. BAD NEWS - Coincidentally I was on the phone with a Sunfish supplier when your email came through, so I asked about the best solution. Oddly enough, they concur it's less expensive to buy a complete conversion kit - which includes the tiller (P/N 79072 $330) than it is to purchase the Rudder assembly (P/N 66620 $204) and Tiller (P/N 66647 $142) separately. (Blah) For what it's worth..... If you remove the "adaptor", you should get at least $100 for your old rudder setup on the bulletin board or ebay. (maybe more if you refinish the wood) Wayne -----Original Message----- Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT If you do not wish to belong to Sunfish_sailor, you may unsubscribe by sending an email to: sunfish_sailor-unsubscribe@... Please do not send unsubscribe requests directly to the group. USEFUL ADDRESSES Post message: sunfish_sailor@... Subscribe: sunfish_sailor-subscribe@... Unsubscribe: sunfish_sailor-unsubscribe@... URL to egroups page: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! |
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rack to dolly, one person
I might end up with rack storage for my Sunfish this summer. The boats are
stored sideways in a rack made of 2x4's. I'm curious about a method for moving the boat from the rack to a dolly all by myself. Any ideas? I think the rack has a top to it, which means I could attach a rope that could be used to suspend part of the boat. Here's the method I thought of: The boat would have been placed on the rack bow first. Holding the stern, slide the boat out until it's almost all the way out. Then attach a line from the handle at the bow to the top of the boat rack. If you can, hoist the bow up a bit. When you pull the boat out further, the line will keep the bow from hitting the ground. The boat would then be suspended at the bow. I would then handle the boat by the stern, rotate it so it is horizontal, and then lower the stern onto the dolly. Then detach the line from the bow and wiggle the boat so it is positioned more correctly on the dolly. Alternatively, just slide the boat from the rack to the ground (using carpet if necessary) so it stands on its edge. Then slowly lay it flat on the ground. Then eventually get it on the dolly, using various methods. Feedback? Charles |
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Re: Newbie launching question
Thanks for the advice guys. I was specifically asking about launching
from a single boat trailer at a ramp and whether to raise the sail before you start backing into the ramp or after the boat is launched. It is obvious now that the sail must be raised only after the boat is in the water and preferably after you have shoved off. I was confused because the sequence of the Vanguard rigging instructions implied that the sail is to be raised before launching. Cheers, Adi --- In sunfish_sailor@..., Charles Neuman <charles@c...> wrote: correctI've heard conflicting information about whether the sail should questionway?Do you mean launching from a trailor, or just launching from a pier? may be whether to shove off and then hoist the sail, or weather tohoist the sail while the boat is at the dock, and then push off.way I can point the boat into the wind and not worry about getting thesail or the line stuck on part of the dock. However, you have to know howfar you would drift, and you gotta act fast, because even when it doesn'tlook like you'd drift, you will. I carry a telescoping paddle with me,and it fits in the storage compartment (which is only on the newer'fishes). It's nice to have, and a necessary safety device in my opinion,especially if you're launching like I just described.at the dock and then push off. In some ways that's safer because you don'trisk drifting into rocks on the shore, or whatever obstruction is nearby.But the wind has to be in the right direction.think about anyway. I'm no expert myself. I've my share of mishaps to knowthat you can mess it up no matter how you do it! :)had been there for other things and forgot to look there for the sailnumber removal question. |
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Re: Newbie launching question
I've heard conflicting information about whether the sail shouldDo you mean launching from a trailor, or just launching from a pier? If the boat is already in the water, and the mast is up, then the question may be whether to shove off and then hoist the sail, or weather to hoist the sail while the boat is at the dock, and then push off. Ideally I like to be clear of the dock and then raise the sail. That way I can point the boat into the wind and not worry about getting the sail or the line stuck on part of the dock. However, you have to know how far you would drift, and you gotta act fast, because even when it doesn't look like you'd drift, you will. I carry a telescoping paddle with me, and it fits in the storage compartment (which is only on the newer 'fishes). It's nice to have, and a necessary safety device in my opinion, especially if you're launching like I just described. If the wind is just right, then you can raise the sail while you're at the dock and then push off. In some ways that's safer because you don't risk drifting into rocks on the shore, or whatever obstruction is nearby. But the wind has to be in the right direction. Not sure if this answers your question, but it's interesting to think about anyway. I'm no expert myself. I've my share of mishaps to know that you can mess it up no matter how you do it! :) Charles Long Island, NY P.S. Gail, thanks for the reference to the FAQ at www.sunfish.org. I had been there for other things and forgot to look there for the sail number removal question. |
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Re: Newbie launching question
Nolan Habegger
I've heard conflicting information about whether the sail shouldAdi, I've seen people who have single boat trailers rig the entire boat before putting it in the water, but I've never seen anyone with the sail up at launch. I can't see how it would be efficient to do so, unless you have someone who can wrangle the boat into a proper position to secure it to a dock while you park your trailer. Even then it seems a bit awkward. Because I have a two boat trailer, I put the boat in the water and walk it around to a suitable "in irons" position before stepping the mast, rigging the boat, etc. I don't raise the sail until just before I'm ready to pull away from the dock. This is primarily to avoid dealing with the boom while rigging. After raising the sail, I just push off the dock and set up on a suitable tack or reach depending on wind direction. Pretty much textbook. Nolan Habegger The Woodlands, TX email: nhabegger@... |
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Re: At what year did the "old style" Sunfish become the "new style"?
Gail M. Turluck
All there is are the class rules on the web site. No real templates. Home
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made is illegal for racing. Good luck. Gail ~~~/)~~~/)~~~~/)~~~/)~~~/)~~~~/)~ Gail M. Turluck ISCA Masters Coordinator USSCA Masters Coordinator ~~~/)~~~/)~~~~/)~~~/)~~~/)~~~~/)~ -----Original Message-----
From: fnhspartan [mailto:marquette_93@...] Sent: Friday, June 13, 2003 1:53 PM To: sunfish_sailor@... Subject: [sunfish_sailor] At what year did the "old style" Sunfish become the "new style"? And where can I find templates for making rudders and keel boards? Yahoo! Groups Sponsor If you do not wish to belong to Sunfish_sailor, you may unsubscribe by sending an email to: sunfish_sailor-unsubscribe@... Please do not send unsubscribe requests directly to the group. USEFUL ADDRESSES Post message: sunfish_sailor@... Subscribe: sunfish_sailor-subscribe@... Unsubscribe: sunfish_sailor-unsubscribe@... URL to egroups page: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. |
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Re: Sunfish parts
Thanks for all the pointers guys. I have one more question: Is the
sail cloth quality better for the official Sunfish sail (North Sails?) as compared to the other vendors. Thanks, Adi --- In sunfish_sailor@..., "Wayne Carney" <wcarney@f...> wrote: Adi,of colored sails for $185.Sunfish Sunfishtype sail for $175. I assume this will be plain white, with no beinglogo. I've also seen a recreational sail for 'casual use only' mightoffered by SailNet for $150. Are these good prices? What caveats tape onthere be in getting it done by a local sail loft? the fairly long tears, I cannot imagine it will survive too long. |
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Re: Sunfish upgrades...
Dave Jeffries
Mine is on the deck ~just~ forward of the cockpit, so that the sheet hangs straight down into the cockpit when cleated and not being held (by hand).
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Dave J sd0044@... ----- Original Message -----
From: John C To: sunfish_sailor@... Sent: Friday, June 13, 2003 08:24 Subject: [sunfish_sailor] Sunfish upgrades... I am still looking for a late style rudder set to go with my '76 Sunfish. In the mean time I want to upgrade the main sheet handling system. Mine has the little 'hook' sort of cleat with no real cleating capability. I think the new fish have a swivel cam cleat with bulls eye fairlead from the factory, correct? If I get one, does it connect in the same location as the original cleat, or does it need to be installed to the horizontal deck section above the original location? I have seen a photo of one, but forget where. John C Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT If you do not wish to belong to Sunfish_sailor, you may unsubscribe by sending an email to: sunfish_sailor-unsubscribe@... Please do not send unsubscribe requests directly to the group. USEFUL ADDRESSES Post message: sunfish_sailor@... Subscribe: sunfish_sailor-subscribe@... Unsubscribe: sunfish_sailor-unsubscribe@... URL to egroups page: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. |
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