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Re: Refrigerator insulation
For what?it's worth, we installed a Frigoboat Keel Cooler refrigeration unit?in 2023. No alteration to the insulation of the 41-year old ice box. We set yjr temp to 40? and?it maintains a steady temperature all the time. Freezer compartment can keep ice cream! -- Gerald (Jerry) Brecher SIRACH 1982 Sabre 38 MkI,? Now lying Coruna, Spain Sailing?home to Gloucester, MA this summer
488 Pleasant Street
North Andover, MA 01845 USA
mobile: 617-510-5133
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Removing it seems like opening a real can of worms. I wonder if some careful mask taping and skim coating with 3M4000UV might help
--
Rob McCarthy,
1995 #Sabre362 ?#362Sabre
hull 158 “Windhover”
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As Peter said the "fillet" you describe is probably part of the bathtub, which seals the hull/deck
joint & is part of the rub rail. I would leave it alone, the toe rail needs to be removed to replace it.
Mine is not in great shape either, but I think messing with it would only make it worse.
--
Phil Horn
S34 #67
Huntington, LI, NY
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Re: Enlarging the mastgate
Hi Stephanie-
There may be a piece of an old broken bolt that is protruding enough to block the track from sliding freely. My track had been repaired in the past by putting in a new bolt adjacent to a broken bolt in 2 or 3 spots. I drilled the stubs of those bolts down a bit to ensure clearance.?
Joe
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Joe Cleary
Kestrel? -??S36 #54? -??Boston
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Re: Epoch 12V 460Ah LFP battery on Sabre 362?
Bill, ? I spoke with an insurance underwriter at my insurance carrier and they will cover LFP conversions, on a case by case basis, though do have some base line requirements: US battery manufacturer and “quality” [my phrasing] US installation.? They do not, as of yet, require ABYC certified installers.? He / they have seen some nightmare situations of “drop in” LFP installations with very poor general boat maintenance, the classic house wiring with wire nuts, unsupported wires, etc. on 30+ yo boats not designed / built to handle the much higher electrical loads of today. ??I mentioned that I doubted any “US” LFP battery was entirely US manufactured, importing parts to be assembled, and he was non-committal.? There also would be a premium increase due to LFP being onboard.? They are concerned with the limited track record of these batteries being installed in the marine environment, with salt exposure and near constant motion, which in their collective mind, increases the potential risks of these batteries.? ? So worth a call to your insurance company. ? Brian ?
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From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Bill Graves via groups.io
Sent: Sunday, April 13, 2025 1:40 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [SabreSailboat] Epoch 12V 460Ah LFP battery on Sabre 362?? Brian, thank you for reminding me to check with insurance on LFP conversion and for the other tips.? I need to do some more reading and checking. Dave, I hear you about single point of failure. Two lighter batteries is also attractive. ? On Sun, Apr 13, 2025 at 5:14?AM Nauset Beach via <nausetbeach=[email protected]> wrote: Bill, ? I am looking at the Epoch batteries as well, and did read [possibly in Panbo] the Victron comms in that battery were a bit sketchy and speculation was it would take a while to work the bugs out.? That seems to be the major advantage over the Essentials 460, which also is a shorter height at 8.6” [but longer] vs. the 12” of the Elite.? Is also IP54 vs IP67 so not waterproof, just water resistant.? But it will not be in an open bay like on an RV or van.? That same article indicated one could get the same information using a Victron Smart Shunt with the Essentials.? ? Also read some insurance companies either do not cover LFP, or have very specific requirements if one is making the switch, like having to use a certified ABYC electrician in addition to following all the manufacturer’s installation instructions and charging / maintenance protocols. Unfortunately, according to various online forums, my insurance company seems to be one of the one’s which does not cover LFP.? Need to confirm with them this week.? ? Brian Escapade? S426 CT - LIS ? ? Hi all, I've been holding off on LFP battery conversion but the tariff thing is alarming so I'm considering the substantial purchase of an Epoch?12V 460Ah V2 Elite Series battery? for our 362.? Does anyone know if this particular Group D size battery fits under the starboard berth?? This battery is quite a bit taller than the Group 31s I have in there now (and I'm away from the boat and can't measure).? I realize there's more to LFP conversion than swapping the battery. 2003 S362 #261 'Souwester'
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Not positive about the 362, however if the deck joint detail is similar to earlier Sabres that “fillet” may be part of vinyl section running under the toe rail and including the outer rub rail. Have no real idea of what the consequence of removing that would be but it would involve a razor knife, and certainly not something I’d entertain.
?
--
Peter Metcalf
Pfmet@...
Sabre 28 #312 Serenade
Noank, CT
?
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Re: Solar Panels on Bimini with Split Backstay
Maybe of interest....
SV Arrow , S34/1 Campobello Island?
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I am stripping and varnishing all the brightwork on my 362 and am considering removing the factory installed plastic fillet where the caprail meets the deck. It's a mess after years of use and several prior efforts to varnish without good clean-up. I imagine that it's opening up a can of worms so I thought I'd ask you folks what you've discovered if you've done this work yourselves? Was it bonded with 5200? Remove with a heatgun or chemical stripper?
?
Thanks,
Tom Malone
Sabre 362 #173
Port Townsend, WA
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Re: Enlarging the mastgate
Hi All,
?
Continuing this thread as I don’t recall another on a related subject. I ordered the tides track and due to Joe Cleary’s suggestion tried removing the top of the mast which worked better than expected. ? So next challenge was getting the screws out of the track. ?All were firmly mounted but came loose except the longer screw in the very top track which had to be removed via an extraction tool. ?That was successful today! ?
So I thought the rest would be easy( oh but it’s a boat project.) ?The top section moves only about 1/8” up and down. I’ve checked the paint and run the knife blade down each side with no real catches.?
I don’t see a build up of paint and the mast appears clean inside and out, please tell me there isn’t some kind of nut behind the original track? ?How does the track remove??
--
Stephanie
Moderator
Sabre 36, #67
Formerly Sabre 28-2, #289
Wilson Harbor, NY Lake Ontario
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Re: Datamarine Anemometer- wind speed cups aren't moving
Further to my last reply and now I have a little more time, I wouldn't go wireless. We see far to many problems with both the Raymarine and B&G versions. Signals coming down from the old DMI MHU are analog voltages, nothing digital about it and the current Raymarine Short Vane MHU takes the same approach - which I like. Absolutely no compatibility between Datamarine & Raymarine though. I totally agree about keeping the wind display separate. I really don't like the presentation on an Axiom, too busy, like the B&G Triton displays and worse the B&G sailsteer overlay on the Zeus/Vulcan chartplotters which blocks out anything close to you on the screen.
The P79 50/200Khz Shoot thru the hull Txdcr will work well for traditional sonar with a transducer cable that has a DSM/CP370 style plug and then connected to the Axiom using an A80489 Adaptor cable? - as long as the hull is solid glass and not cored.
--
Pete Waterson
“颁丑补谤诲辞苍苍补测”
S38-2
Oriental, NC
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Re: Refrigerator insulation
I'm following up on this project from Jan of 2024, as I'm starting to upgrade my 35 year old refrigeration!
I've read the previous comments from Jay & Carter as well as the original from Matt. Do either of you have any insight into how thick the existing original insulation is ?
I've drilled some test holes & seem to find as much as 3 inches between the refrig shell and the hull, without much room for additional insulation. My boat is a 1988 38' MK II, so manufacturing processes will likely have changed over the course of time.
Carter, if you're still lurking around what did you find ? & how much of the insulation were you able to inject ?
Thanks and Regards?
Mike
s/v Ladylike?
88 38' MK II
Oriental NC
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Re: Solar Panels on Bimini with Split Backstay
While it often sounds like an infomercial, the latest video from Sailing Uma does have some information on solar panel construction and some innovative ideas from a new company. For those considering flexible panels, it is probably worth the 20 minutes or so to watch.
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Dave
Second Star
S362 #113
Fair Haven, NY/Lake Ontario
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On Apr 14, 2025, at 7:10?AM, David Lochner via groups.io <davelochner@...> wrote:
Don’s photo of the dodger clearly shows why panels should be oriented fore and aft. In that photo if the panels were oriented athwartship both panels would be shaded with their production severely curtailed by the boom’s shadow. If they are aligned fore and aft, only one panel would be affected.
Dave
Second Star
S362 #113
Fair Haven, NY/Lake Ontario
On Apr 14, 2025, at 5:56?AM, Nauset Beach via groups.io <nausetbeach@...> wrote:
Hi Don,
?
I have read some people have used 4 mm polycarbonate as a backing and asked Ocean Planet about it, even going to 6 mm. ?They said not to do it and further they would not honor a warranty [5 years] claim if any panel were placed across a support frame.? The reason being as Dave mentioned, the repeated flexing over a hard point can damage the cells and wiring connections.? The manual for Solbian SP panels actually warns against doing that:?
?
“Canvas Installation - If installing on canvas, do not run any panels over a support bar. This was previously done with polycarbonate backing, but experience has shown that the solar panels can still be damaged by pressure from a crossbar.”??
?
Using Starboard would probably flex less than polycarbonate, especially anchored to the support frame under the canvas.? I have only used 1” Starboard and that is not bending.? Would ?” Starboard adopt the various curves on top of the frame like the masonite?? Am not seeing how the zippers in the canvas to attach to the frame could be modified and still maintain adequate tension on the canvas across the full bimini frame.? [Possibly due to the coffee not kicking in yet.]? Would have thought having partial zippers vs. running the full length of the support frame would create uneven tension, but maybe not.??
?
I looked at the Custom Marine but my fore / aft maximum length is 41”that will still fit inside the support frames, though that would go over the center support.??
?
Please post more photos as your project progresses.??
?
Thanks,
Brian
Escapade S426
CT / LIS
?
?
Attached are the photos of my masonite templates for solar panel backing plate plates. ?Four photos show the templates mounted on top of the Bimini. ?Note the problems with gaps between the canvas and the template. ?One photo shows the template mounted under the Bimini and over the center ridge pipe, and one photo shows a template (simulating a solar panels) mounted directly over the backing plate under the Bimini in the previous photo. ?This is the plan I will use. ?The tech guy at Custom Marine Products thinks it’s an excellent idea and gave it his blessing, for whatever that’s worth. ?My local canvass guy likes it too, and says modification to the center pipe zipper can be done at reasonable cost.
As previously stated I plan to make the actual backing plates out of 1/4” StarBoard with the edges rounded off because I think it is much better suited to the marine environment. I will mount the backing plates and the panels with appropriate length 10x24 bolts a washers in the fashion of the bolt kit available through Custom Marine Products. ?I will also have some grommets and 2” squares of reinforcing canvass add to the bolt holes, again at minimal cost.
Re: Datamarine Anemometer- wind speed cups aren't moving
I didn't read this thread, so maybe I'm duplicating what's already here, but here is what I know:
DMI Marine website is :
Website is still working, but not sure for how much longer. What you need is a Speed PCB for the MHU - pretty simple install if you can find one, but they don't list it on their website anymore as an available spare.
For a new MHU they want $850.00 (We sell a complete Raymarine Wind pack (Display, Masthead Unit and Mast Cable) for $899.95 so a new DMI MHU doesn't make sense. You really need to be at a boatyard with a manlift to run a new cable comfortably,? unless you are the mountaineering type and have ascender gear. Not sure if a Sabre 32 has a deck stepped mast, but if so that can be an issue running a new cable in a mast that is already stepped.
--
Pete Waterson
“颁丑补谤诲辞苍苍补测”
S38-2
Oriental, NC
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Re: 362 Yanmar-Kanzaki transmission removal
Bumping to confirm that the damper disc part number for the 362 with Yanmar 3JH2E + KBW10-E is 177099-03500. The original 1300hr disc looks fine, but with all of the trouble to R&R the transmission, new makes sense.? Thanks /Ed
--
SV Enigma, Sabre 362 #199
Lake Erie @ Sandusky, OH
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Re: Solar Panels on Bimini with Split Backstay
Don’s photo of the dodger clearly shows why panels should be oriented fore and aft. In that photo if the panels were oriented athwartship both panels would be shaded with their production severely curtailed by the boom’s shadow. If they are aligned fore and aft, only one panel would be affected.
Dave Second Star S362 #113 Fair Haven, NY/Lake Ontario
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On Apr 14, 2025, at 5:56?AM, Nauset Beach via groups.io <nausetbeach@...> wrote:
Hi Don, ? I have read some people have used 4 mm polycarbonate as a backing and asked Ocean Planet about it, even going to 6 mm. ?They said not to do it and further they would not honor a warranty [5 years] claim if any panel were placed across a support frame.? The reason being as Dave mentioned, the repeated flexing over a hard point can damage the cells and wiring connections.? The manual for Solbian SP panels actually warns against doing that:? ? “Canvas Installation - If installing on canvas, do not run any panels over a support bar. This was previously done with polycarbonate backing, but experience has shown that the solar panels can still be damaged by pressure from a crossbar.”?? ? Using Starboard would probably flex less than polycarbonate, especially anchored to the support frame under the canvas.? I have only used 1” Starboard and that is not bending.? Would ?” Starboard adopt the various curves on top of the frame like the masonite?? Am not seeing how the zippers in the canvas to attach to the frame could be modified and still maintain adequate tension on the canvas across the full bimini frame.? [Possibly due to the coffee not kicking in yet.]? Would have thought having partial zippers vs. running the full length of the support frame would create uneven tension, but maybe not.?? ? I looked at the Custom Marine but my fore / aft maximum length is 41”that will still fit inside the support frames, though that would go over the center support.?? ? Please post more photos as your project progresses.?? ? Thanks, Brian Escapade S426 CT / LIS ? ? Attached are the photos of my masonite templates for solar panel backing plate plates. ?Four photos show the templates mounted on top of the Bimini. ?Note the problems with gaps between the canvas and the template. ?One photo shows the template mounted under the Bimini and over the center ridge pipe, and one photo shows a template (simulating a solar panels) mounted directly over the backing plate under the Bimini in the previous photo. ?This is the plan I will use. ?The tech guy at Custom Marine Products thinks it’s an excellent idea and gave it his blessing, for whatever that’s worth. ?My local canvass guy likes it too, and says modification to the center pipe zipper can be done at reasonable cost. As previously stated I plan to make the actual backing plates out of 1/4” StarBoard with the edges rounded off because I think it is much better suited to the marine environment. I will mount the backing plates and the panels with appropriate length 10x24 bolts a washers in the fashion of the bolt kit available through Custom Marine Products. ?I will also have some grommets and 2” squares of reinforcing canvass add to the bolt holes, again at minimal cost.
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Re: Solar Panels on Bimini with Split Backstay
Hi Don, ? I have read some people have used 4 mm polycarbonate as a backing and asked Ocean Planet about it, even going to 6 mm. ?They said not to do it and further they would not honor a warranty [5 years] claim if any panel were placed across a support frame.? The reason being as Dave mentioned, the repeated flexing over a hard point can damage the cells and wiring connections.? The manual for Solbian SP panels actually warns against doing that: ? “Canvas Installation - If installing on canvas, do not run any panels over a support bar. This was previously done with polycarbonate backing, but experience has shown that the solar panels can still be damaged by pressure from a crossbar.”? ? Using Starboard would probably flex less than polycarbonate, especially anchored to the support frame under the canvas.? I have only used 1” Starboard and that is not bending.? Would ?” Starboard adopt the various curves on top of the frame like the masonite?? Am not seeing how the zippers in the canvas to attach to the frame could be modified and still maintain adequate tension on the canvas across the full bimini frame.? [Possibly due to the coffee not kicking in yet.]? Would have thought having partial zippers vs. running the full length of the support frame would create uneven tension, but maybe not.? ? I looked at the Custom Marine but my fore / aft maximum length is 41”that will still fit inside the support frames, though that would go over the center support.? ? Please post more photos as your project progresses.? ? Thanks, Brian Escapade S426 CT / LIS ?
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From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Oceans via groups.io
Sent: Sunday, April 13, 2025 10:08 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [SabreSailboat] Solar Panels on Bimini with Split Backstay? Attached are the photos of my masonite templates for solar panel backing plate plates. ?Four photos show the templates mounted on top of the Bimini. ?Note the problems with gaps between the canvas and the template. ?One photo shows the template mounted under the Bimini and over the center ridge pipe, and one photo shows a template (simulating a solar panels) mounted directly over the backing plate under the Bimini in the previous photo. ?This is the plan I will use. ?The tech guy at Custom Marine Products thinks it’s an excellent idea and gave it his blessing, for whatever that’s worth. ?My local canvass guy likes it too, and says modification to the center pipe zipper can be done at reasonable cost. As previously stated I plan to make the actual backing plates out of 1/4” StarBoard with the edges rounded off because I think it is much better suited to the marine environment. I will mount the backing plates and the panels with appropriate length 10x24 bolts a washers in the fashion of the bolt kit available through Custom Marine Products. ?I will also have some grommets and 2” squares of reinforcing canvass add to the bolt holes, again at minimal cost.
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Jorgen:
Allison’s comment reminded me of an upholstery shop that does custom work on classic & modern cars, has worked on boats, and does a fair amount of commercial & residential work. Try Carthom Upholstery Corp. in New Rochelle (at the entrance of
New Rochelle Municipal Marina). I used to winter there before the garage replacement project, and they had a variety of projects going on.
Good luck,
Franz Alvarez
S/V Tranquility, S38 MKII
A few boats down from you! ;-)
Get
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Jorgen I did a headliner many years ago and it is a huge amount of work. ?The few things I did we low density coat and spray adhesive we also used monel staples to attach to panels. ?If it is too big a job for you, try going to an auto upholstery
shop
Allison Lehman
Swiftsure Yachts
510 912-5800 cell
510 860-4640 fax
allisonleh@... ? ? ??
On Apr 13, 2025, at 5:51?PM, Jorgen Naess via groups.io <joergen.naess@...> wrote:
?
I have started the headliner repair project on my S452. Naugahyde (vinyl) and 3M 76 adhesive has been purchased. I also bought some high density 1/8 foam for a few areas needing a full repair. I have removed most of the plywood ceiling panels from the
main cabin. Planning to do the work at home.
?
Also, to practice ahead of time I bought extra plywood. Today, after practicing, I am afraid the results do not look that good. I have decided I need professional help to complete this. As the headliner is a high-visibility item it needs to look great.
?
So, question to the group; can anyone recommend a reputable boat/marine upholsterer somewhere in the NY Metro, CT or Long Island area? I am also actively searching as of this writing.
?
Thank very much in advance!
?
Jorgen Naess
2001 Sabre 452, VENTO
Winter: Mamaroneck, NY
Summer: Greenport, NY
?
--
Allison
S426 Kingfisher
SF Bay/Pacifc Northwest
-- Franz Alvarez S/V Tranquility - S38MKII
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Jorgen I did a headliner many years ago and it is a huge amount of work. ?The few things I did we low density coat and spray adhesive we also used monel staples to attach to panels. ?If it is too big a job for you, try going to an auto upholstery shop Allison Lehman Swiftsure Yachts 510 912-5800 cell 510 860-4640 fax allisonleh@... ? ? ??
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On Apr 13, 2025, at 5:51?PM, Jorgen Naess via groups.io <joergen.naess@...> wrote:
? I have started the headliner repair project on my S452. Naugahyde (vinyl) and 3M 76 adhesive has been purchased. I also bought some high density 1/8 foam for a few areas needing a full repair. I have removed most of the plywood ceiling panels from the main cabin. Planning to do the work at home.
?
Also, to practice ahead of time I bought extra plywood. Today, after practicing, I am afraid the results do not look that good. I have decided I need professional help to complete this. As the headliner is a high-visibility item it needs to look great.
?
So, question to the group; can anyone recommend a reputable boat/marine upholsterer somewhere in the NY Metro, CT or Long Island area? I am also actively searching as of this writing.
?
Thank very much in advance!
?
Jorgen Naess
2001 Sabre 452, VENTO
Winter: Mamaroneck, NY
Summer: Greenport, NY
?
--
Allison
S426 Kingfisher
SF Bay/Pacifc Northwest
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Re: Datamarine Anemometer- wind speed cups aren't moving
Verne I have the P79 mounted in my Shamrock fishing boat, solid glass hull. It is connected to a Garmin MFD with CHIRP sonar. It works great, provides accurate depth, structure, bottom density and fish. I would say TMI for sailing. The deepest I’ve been in was 90’ and got good readings.?
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On Apr 13, 2025, at 3:49?PM, Jeff Bartlett via groups.io <Jhbartlett@...> wrote:
? Verne,
?
Two years ago (summer 2023) I sent my DataMarine wind masthead unit to DMI Marine in MA.? They were able to rebuild it, and it has been working fine since.
?
They were moving locations in 2024 and it isn't clear to me if they've reopened/are still in business but probably worth a shot if you haven't checked on them.? Their website is still up with an email address.??
?
?
--
Jeff B
1988 Sabre 34-2, 347
S/V Northwood
Deale, MD
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Re: Solar Panels on Bimini with Split Backstay
?Brian,
Attached are the photos of my masonite templates for solar panel backing plate plates. ?Four photos show the templates mounted on top of the Bimini. ?Note the problems with gaps between the canvas and the template. ?One photo shows the template mounted under the Bimini and over the center ridge pipe, and one photo shows a template (simulating a solar panels) mounted directly over the backing plate under the Bimini in the previous photo. ?This is the plan I will use. ?The tech guy at Custom Marine Products thinks it’s an excellent idea and gave it his blessing, for whatever that’s worth. ?My local canvass guy likes it too, and says modification to the center pipe zipper can be done at reasonable cost.
As previously stated I plan to make the actual backing plates out of 1/4” StarBoard with the edges rounded off because I think it is much better suited to the marine environment. I will mount the backing plates and the panels with appropriate length 10x24 bolts a washers in the fashion of the bolt kit available through Custom Marine Products. ?I will also have some grommets and 2” squares of reinforcing canvass add to the bolt holes, again at minimal cost.
Don Fleming
Duet
S-38-1 #77
Hudson River
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Jerry Brecher
Rob McCarthy
Philip Horn
Peter
Tim Smith
Stephanie
Pete Waterson
