¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

ctrl + shift + ? for shortcuts
© 2025 Groups.io

Re: USCG proposal to remove markers off New England coast

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

I made the point that electronic navigation has too much that can go wrong. "The prudent navigator never relies on a single aid to navigation." Following (tl;dr) are my comments:

This public comment expresses strong concern about proposed discontinuation of numerous Aids to Navigation throughout District 1.

Background

I am co-owner of a recreational auxiliary sail boat, 40 feet LOA, Displ. 18,800 lb., home port Sippican Harbor, Marion MA. We ordinarily frequent coastal waters from Watch Hill, RI to Chatham MA, but include all of District 1 in our cruising range.?

The vessel is equipped with chart plotter, radar, AIS and depth sounder, as is common for vessels of her type and intended service. We navigate using all available aids to navigation, electronic and traditional, and keep paper charts aboard. Ordinarily, GNSS positioning via the chart plotter is our primary reference. We have waypoints covering all routes that we have used, and when we plan to visit a new destination, we set up waypoints and a route. Almost all of our waypoints are approximate locations of buoys.? We steer from waypoint to waypoint, using bearing and COG derived from GNSS before the buoy is in sight, then steer to it visually, cross-checking with the indicated position on the chart plotter and depth soundings. We also cross-check any other visual aids, such as ranges. When we are under sail to windward or downwind (and thus not able to sail the rhumb line), we use our plotted position including charted depth, the chart plotter's sailing features, and visual relative bearing to the waypoint to determine the layline.? In poor visibility, we augment the GNSS-derived bearing with radar. I believe this navigational routine to be prudent and appropriate for a recreational vessel of our size.

Our electrical system is basic and typical for our type and length, with no redundancy: one bank of four batteries for ordinary operational needs, plus a backup starter battery, and one alternator. All electronic navigation depends solely on this DC electrical system. We have one chart plotter. We also have mobile phones, but find that service is intermittent in places; we would not rely on them for safe passage.

In summary, visual Aids to Navigation are essential for safe operation of our vessel.

General Observations

The putative premise of proposed discontinuation of so many buoys is flawed. It is based on an assumption that GNSS, ENC and ECS can be a total substitute for visual sightings. This is false. It is said that the prudent mariner never relies on a single aid to navigation. Removing aids to navigation undercuts this principle: too much can go wrong.? Electronic navigation depends entirely on the integrity of GNSS, the vessel's electrical system, and at least one functioning chart plotter. Yet there is serious concern that hostile actors will jam or spoof GNSS systems; also the US DoD retains the ability to dilute precision of GPS for civilian users. Not only would loss of GNSS deprive all vessels of electronic positioning; it would also disable cellular networks (and thus smartphone applications), which critically depend on GPS for timing and synchronization.? Further, consumer-grade chart plotters do not have the redundancy required for ECDIS, are engineered for cost rather than reliability, are frequently exposed to the weather, and are operated at ambient temperatures outside the Max/Min Temperature parameters of their components. DC electrical systems on smaller vessels are not redundant and have multiple single points of failure. Lightning strikes are a hazard, especially to sailboats, and can destroy all electronic devices onboard. Cellular coverage is incomplete, including many inshore areas, and navigation apps depend on connectivity to retrieve cartography. Finally, electronic navigation is subject to human error. In summary, primary navigation using GNSS and ECS is great but not highly reliable, and MUST be backed up with traditional methods for a reasonable margin of safety.?

Several proposed changes would remove alternating red and green buoys from a pair marking a channel. This is a false economy. Helmsmen need both to visualize the edges of the channel, particularly when keeping clear of a large vessel.

The process (or lack of one) is a serious problem. Ordinarily, the Coast Guard discontinues a few AtoN on occasion, after proper studies and public engagement well in advance of required notice in the LNM. ? The timing and scope of this project strongly suggest that it is motivated by political pressure to cut expenses, regardless of potential consequences. It is shameful that DHS would order such hasty and heedless action at the expense of safety (and probably against the better judgement of USCG careerists).

Below are comments on proposed changes in some of the areas that I know well. They should be taken as examples. Many other proposed discontinuations would be equally ill-advised, and by highlighting these I by no means depricate the importance of others.

Woods Hole Passage

Woods Hole is the primary entry to Vineyard Sound and Nantucket Sound from Buzzards Bay and the Cape Cod Canal. It is heavily trafficked by recreational vessels in season, some throwing wakes and/or operating at excessive speeds. A mariner unfamiliar with these waters would inevitably be disoriented upon entering the passage from either direction. The channels that appear as "Broadway" and "The Straight" on the charts are narrow, and surrounded by rocks. Currents peak at 4.4 kts or more, uncomfortably close to the maximum speed of a smaller auxiliary.? I consider Woods Hole Passage to be the most dangerous area of our cruising grounds, and even after hundreds of transits, treat it with utmost respect.

The turn from The Straight to Broadway is particularly hazardous as the head current becomes a cross current with the turn.?Eastbound, buoy G'5' marks the start of that turn, critically on a strong flood current.? In season, groundings on Middle Ledge occur about once a week because confused helmsmen try to pass to the wrong side of G'5'; removing it would make these occurrences more frequent. R'4A' is an important visual reference for judging side-slip toward the edge of the channel and provides a visual assist for judging the current. G'7' delineates the edge of the channel as the vessel makes the turn from the northern branch. Westbound in flood current, R'2', R'2A' and R'4' together form a visual reference for the eastern edge of the channel. Eastbound, R'8' and R'6' form a range and provide an initial visual reference for the current. G'11' and G'13' are major waypoints and visual references for passage to Woods Hole from Buzzards Bay. Similarly, Nobska Point Lighted Bell is the primary visual aid for navigating from West Chop to the eastern channel.

Buzzards Bay

Frequent tugs with barge in tow in the shipping channel are a hazard to small, slower vessels. AIS has been a great help, but in case of failure (or as a cross-check), the helmsman must judge the width of the channel in order to decide how best to keep clear. This is a case where removing either buoy of a red-green pair presents a navigational challenge.

Felix Ledge G'3' (Quicks Hole) marks an isolated rock. Safe passage from the North from Lone Rock G'LR' can be had by visually splitting the distance between G'3' and R'2'. The current runs strong, and visual reference to any side slip is necessary.

New Bedford SE approach buoy R'2SE' marks safe water to the south of a reef extending from West Island. For vessels transiting between New Bedford or Padanarum and Mattapoisett, Marion, Wareham, or the Cape Cod Canal, it marks a course change, making it a primary visual aid.

New Bedford SW approach buoy Fl.R'8' Bell marks a waypoint on the route to Padanarum from the south, or from the east under sail in prevailing southwest winds. It lines up with Middle Ledge RG'AB' Fl.R Gong to form a range on the approach to Padanarum.

Cuttyhunk fairway buoy RW'CH' is the main visual aid marking the entrance to Cuttyhunk Harbor. While we usually use G'1E' as our electronic waypoint, the fairway buoy would be essential if we had to navigate visually to Cuttyhunk from Buzzards Bay.

Westport Harbor is marginal for us because of depth. If we were to go there, Westport Harbor Entrance Lighted Bell G'1' would be an essential waypoint for lining up with the channel and avoiding the ledge to the northwest.

Vineyard Sound

Squash Meadow East End Bell Buoy and Squash Meadow West End bifurcation buoy mark a hazardous reef and no-go zone between them.

The two red buoys southwest of Sow and Pigs reef mark a notorious patch of water, the site of many shipwrecks. Eldridge explained how the set of the current draws vessels into the rocks. Any vessel navigating visually is at risk, particularly if they are not aware of Eldridge's? advice.

Nantucket Sound

Tuckernuck Shoal buoy G'3'and Cross Rip Shoal South End buoy are critical primary visual waypoints for the route from Nantucket to Martha's Vineyard and Woods Hole. We use them to check our progress and course, and would need them if unable to use ECS.

Every season, a few boats run aground on the Nantucket breakwater. Frequent ferries make the narrow channel hazardous to slow-moving recreational vessels.? Nantucket Harbor channel buoy G'1' is essential to lining up a vessel navigating visually to the channel approaching from the North, since the range at Coast Guard Station Nantucket is not visible from there without binoculars. Northbound, it marks edge of the channel, and we steer to it to keep clear of ferries and other faster vessels using the middle of the channel.

The approach to Hyannis Harbor is tricky to navigate because of all the rocks, particularly Bishop and Clerks. The buoyage system there gives the navigator several options for passage between them.

Chatham Roads Bell G'3' and particularly Stage Harbor entrance lighted bell R'SH' help the navigator line up their vessel to the narrow entrance to Stage Harbor.

Block Island Sound

Fl.R'2' is a primary visual marker along several routes between New Harbor, Block Island and points north and east.

Between Fishers Island and Watch Hill, RI

The passage from Rhode Island Sound to Fishers Island Sound is another route that I treat with extra respect. I consider it poorly marked as it is. The passages between sections of reef are narrow and through shallow water, and the current is strong. Watch Hill GR'WH' marks a shallow that is not a serious problem for our draft, but which I would avoid in inclement weather. I would not ordinarily choose to use Catumb Passage but the line between G'3C' and G'1C' is navigable if necessary. Lords Passage is a preferred alternative to Watch Hill Passage, as RW'L' lighted whistle, G'7' and R'2L' mark a triangle of relatively deep water.? Wicopesset Rock G'1' marks an isolated rock that is a hazard on the route to East Harbor Fishers Island from the east, and G'7' and G'9' are part of a string of green buoys marking that route and the unsafe water to the south. Stonington Harbor Channel R'1' and G'3' mark safe passage into Stonington, as well as isolated rocks.



On 5/16/2025 2:02 PM, Jim Starkey wrote:

If you write a reply, keep in mind that channel and hazard markers are indeed critically important, but pure "navigational" buoys are mostly obsolete.? The test should be something like, "a marker is critical when someone should be looking at the markers and not have his/her head buried in a chart/plotter."? Arguing that we should keep everything risks losing the ones that are truly important.

Pulling the buoys in Woods Hole is nothing but nuts!

On 5/16/2025 1:32 PM, Jim Harman via groups.io wrote:
A friend alerted me to a Coast Guard proposal to remove hundreds of navigational markers along the New England coast, including red/white checkered harbor entrance buoys, several buoys around Block Island, Stonington and Watch Hill, the Cape Cod Canal, Woods Hole, and well over 100 along the Maine coast. Apparently the markers would not be removed until next year sometime, but they are open to public comment until June 13.
?
There is an independent website with a chart showing the proposed removals, information about the proposal, and how to submit comments here:
?
I plan to submit comments and thought others might be interested as well.?
--
-- Jim Harman
Arcadia
S402 #2
Southport CT
--
Jim Starkey, AmorphousDB, LLC

--
Jim Starkey
Shearwater
SW42, earlier S36
Manchester, Mass



Re: S28 MK I ignition lock/switch wiring

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

I am not sure I would put 12v through the switch without ohming out the wires to see where they go even with an accurate wiring diagram. Sabre put Universal, Volvo, and Westerbeke engines in these boat, with overlap in the model year. Some boats have been repowered or rewired along the way. Some boats may be pristine but Sabre 28s were made for over 20 years over 30 years ago.

The extra 10 minute activity is worth it to avoid the $200 to have your alternator, starter, or both rebuilt.

Corey

On May 15, 2025, at 4:41?PM, Michael Sterling via groups.io <sterling1mster@...> wrote:

?
Corey, I don't think it's quite as random as you suggest
?I have the original factory wiring diagram from 1988 & it's been quote accurate?
?Certainly some changes have been made since the boat left the factory but even those have been easy to follow.
To the OP try to get your hands on an original diagram.
Mike
s/v Ladylike?
88 38' MK II

Michael Sterling
Ph. 252-646-9610


On Thu, May 15, 2025, 2:35?PM Corey Manero via <ckmanero=[email protected]> wrote:
Unfortunately in those days the wiring changed by engine, model, day of the week, hull number, and what the person doing the install had for breakfast. Then 40 years provided opportunities for the wiring to be changed.?

The safest bet to avoid letting the smoke out is to ohm out each wire.?

Corey
Light S28-1
Essex, CT

On May 15, 2025, at 12:18?PM, PIOTR SERWIK via <cuivier1=[email protected]> wrote:

?
Hi, All.?
I'm afraid I may be forced to replace my ignition switch on S28 Mk I. Does anyone have any idea where all these cables go to? I'm trying to replace it with a Colee- Hersee 3-position ignition switch and I have no clue which wires go where. I'll try attaching the photo of current switch.?
?
<IMG_2432 _3_.jpg>


Re: USCG proposal to remove markers off New England coast

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

If you write a reply, keep in mind that channel and hazard markers are indeed critically important, but pure "navigational" buoys are mostly obsolete.? The test should be something like, "a marker is critical when someone should be looking at the markers and not have his/her head buried in a chart/plotter."? Arguing that we should keep everything risks losing the ones that are truly important.

Pulling the buoys in Woods Hole is nothing but nuts!

On 5/16/2025 1:32 PM, Jim Harman via groups.io wrote:
A friend alerted me to a Coast Guard proposal to remove hundreds of navigational markers along the New England coast, including red/white checkered harbor entrance buoys, several buoys around Block Island, Stonington and Watch Hill, the Cape Cod Canal, Woods Hole, and well over 100 along the Maine coast. Apparently the markers would not be removed until next year sometime, but they are open to public comment until June 13.
?
There is an independent website with a chart showing the proposed removals, information about the proposal, and how to submit comments here:
?
I plan to submit comments and thought others might be interested as well.?
--
-- Jim Harman
Arcadia
S402 #2
Southport CT
--
Jim Starkey, AmorphousDB, LLC

--
Jim Starkey
Shearwater
SW42, earlier S36
Manchester, Mass


USCG proposal to remove markers off New England coast

 

A friend alerted me to a Coast Guard proposal to remove hundreds of navigational markers along the New England coast, including red/white checkered harbor entrance buoys, several buoys around Block Island, Stonington and Watch Hill, the Cape Cod Canal, Woods Hole, and well over 100 along the Maine coast. Apparently the markers would not be removed until next year sometime, but they are open to public comment until June 13.
?
There is an independent website with a chart showing the proposed removals, information about the proposal, and how to submit comments here:
?
I plan to submit comments and thought others might be interested as well.?
--
-- Jim Harman
Arcadia
S402 #2
Southport CT


Re: How many are still around?

 

A blast from the past. I remember your name from 20 years ago when we both had S28s. Great boats and a absolute sleeper on the race course.
Bill Kellner
ExS28 Second Wind hull 258
S32 CB Throwback hull 22
Sandusky Ohio

On Fri, May 16, 2025 at 10:21?AM Sid Wax via <sid_w=[email protected]> wrote:
Interesting question... I personally witnessed the demise? of two of them.? Passing Fancy was done in in a collision with another sailboat under power.? Very tragic... Passing Fancy (319). I owned her for 15 years, and had just done some major upgrades during COVID.? The next year I bought another one -Empijones...I don't recall the sail number... That one died a natural death... rotted cockpit sole and a bad engine.? I'm in the market for another one right now.


Re: How many are still around?

 

Interesting question... I personally witnessed the demise? of two of them.? Passing Fancy was done in in a collision with another sailboat under power.? Very tragic... Passing Fancy (319). I owned her for 15 years, and had just done some major upgrades during COVID.? The next year I bought another one -Empijones...I don't recall the sail number... That one died a natural death... rotted cockpit sole and a bad engine.? I'm in the market for another one right now.


Re: Water Tank Gaskets

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Or your local marine chandlery if they carry engine parts; so $12 cash for three sets of four ring gaskets (water, waste, diesel) is better than $16 for one at WM. Just bring in the old ones to match. Grainger is great idea.

Franz Alvarez
S/V Tranquility S38MKII
Soon to be headed to CI

Get


From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Christopher M Evans via groups.io <chris.evans61@...>
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2025 7:40:47 AM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [SabreSailboat] Water Tank Gaskets
?
Joe,
?
What size did you find for the deck fills?
--
Christopher Evans
Habanero S32
Reedville, VA

--
Franz Alvarez
S/V Tranquility - S38MKII


Re: How many are still around?

 

Hi Rich
small world!!
Thanks for the comeback.?
Good to know.?
she was purchased by Tish, a sailing instructor, brought round through the Chesapeake and Delaware canal and up the ?NJ coast to her berth in Kingston NY on the Rondout. ?Brackish to Fresh.?
we brought her through Hell Gate to Long Island sound in 2021.?
PO kept lots of ship¡¯s equipment notes. Very handy!
fair winds
sincerely?
Eugene & Maureen?
?
--
Eugene & Maureen
¡®°Õ¾±³¾±ð´Ç³Ü³Ù¡¯
34-2 1987 #301
Fort Rachel Marina
Mystic, CT


Re: Water Tank Gaskets

 

Joe,
?
What size did you find for the deck fills?
--
Christopher Evans
Habanero S32
Reedville, VA


Re: Water Tank Gaskets

 

Thanks Joe,
?
I never thought of Grainger...Or McMaster-Carr.
--
Christopher Evans
Habanero S32 #89
Reedville, VA


Re: Fairclough cover for S28 free

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

As an FYI ¨C these are great covers but they are cotton canvas / duck and do shrink.? On my other boat we had Fairclough add 10¡± to the aft section several years ago after ~ 12 years of use from new.? They also need restitching after 10 years as UV does degrade the thread. ?

?

We had a new cover made last year for our Sabre and it was more than a little tight from the outset.? So tight that some of the stitching was pulling out, and the zippers at the mast unzipped by themselves several times this past winter.? This summer Fairclough is adding some material to ease the fit.

?

Brian

Escapade? S426

CT / LIS

?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Peter via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2025 8:40 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [SabreSailboat] Fairclough cover for S28 free

?

Hello Elizabeth, Serenade is indeed a 28, so no stretching necessary. I would also be very interested, love to have it, if it¡¯s still officially available and will come get it ASAP if you need it gone. You can PM me, email me, contact me however you wish and make arrangements to meet at the yacht club. I look forward to hearing from you, if it doesn¡¯t work out for the previous posters.?

Best, Peter Metcalf

?

--

Peter Metcalf
Pfmet@...
Sabre 28 #312 Serenade
Noank, CT


Re: Squirrel issue

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Chris you can by pass the Erie Canal and go to lake Champlain and then to the st Lawrence river. It is longer but no delays and you get to see Montreal.
Sabre 402#37. Lake Ontario?
Mike Newbury?

On May 15, 2025, at 9:12?PM, greglocke03 via groups.io <greglocke03@...> wrote:

?
Unless you have proof? Ie. Squirrel scat, or a visual, my guess would be mice or a rat which are near impossible to keep out.?
I would look for the nest made from your sail.
Squirrel nests tend to be high in a tree.?
Greg
S34-2 #338
Duet
New London. Ct


Re: 426 belt replacement - raw water hose makes it difficult

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Hi Neil,
Unfortunately I don¡¯t have any pics of our motor as she looks today, just partial pics. ?I am enclosing a 2003 426 stock Yanmar install. ?This is not our boat but it was how our boat looked when we bought it. I believe the only difference is the overflow tank is on port on Kingfisher. ?We do not have any interference on our engine when changing the belt and we have a serpentine belt. ?Can you post a picture?

IMG_2687.jpeg

Allison Lehman
Swiftsure Yachts
allison@...
Cell: 510.912.5800
Fax: 510.860.4640
PastedGraphic-1.tiff

On May 15, 2025, at 9:17?AM, Neil Russell via groups.io <neil.e.russell@...> wrote:

Has anyone figured out a good way to move the raw water hose and re attach it when replacing alternator belts on a 426?

The hose literally prevents the alternator (we have 105A Balmar) from moving more than 1/4¡± toward the centerline.

¡ª±·±ð¾±±ô

neil dot e dot russell at gmail.com
¡°Whisper II¡±
S426-034
Salem MA




--
Allison
S426 Kingfisher
SF Bay/Pacifc Northwest


Re: How many are still around?

 

I just got instructions for changing signature - Subscription/settings/signature.?
--
Piotr Serwik
S28 Mk I (standing rigging from Mk II).
1972, Hull #13
"Deep Blew"
Rock Hall, MD


Re: How many are still around?

 
Edited

This is a great list. I've added Sheba VII...a 425 hull #88.? Now i have to fig¨´re out how to add my signature...


Re: AGM Battery recommendation

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

I bought our Delphia 40 three years ago and haven¡¯t worried. As some of you know I use a stock Yanmar alternator and a Victron DC/DC that maxes at 30amps. ?I¡¯ve run the 200ah (2x 100ah) down to 30ah total a couple times w no impact. ?And still getting the reqd voltage at that level.?

My two 125w panels and two Victron controllers just arrived yesterday from CMP.?



Please consider the environment before printing this email. Thank you.


On May 15, 2025, at 2:03?PM, Jim Starkey via groups.io <Jim@...> wrote:

?With AGM, everything, EVERYTHING, depends on how they were treated.? When we bought our current boat, it had a 4 AGM house bank that didn't make it through 4 years of use.? The AGM starting battery, on the other hand, is still going strong after 16 years.

AGMs were invented, designed, and intended for use as aircraft starting batteries, which are more or less guaranteed to be fully recharged before the start of the takeoff roll.? Used on a cruising boat that lives on mooring and without solar, AGMs are a disaster.? Topped off daily from solar, no problem.? Topped off daily while plugged in at a marina, fine unless you take extended cruises.

But frankly, word of mouth without knowing the details of installation and usage isn't going to tell you anything worth knowing.

[The other question is whether to convert to LFP now or wait until the new batteries crap out.? I'm told that among the best things about LFP is that you don't have to worry about them.? But I haven't reached that point...]

On 5/15/2025 4:13 PM, David & Catherine via groups.io wrote:
We have just replaced our 4 D batteries in our "not.a Sabre" with two Full River 4 D AGM batteries . ??They came well recommended and another boat in the marina has had them so far for eight years with no problem.

Cheers,
David

Ex "Solitaire 1" Sabre 402
now " Chinook 1 " Catalina 42 Mk 2
Kingston Ont.




--
Jim Starkey, AmorphousDB, LLC






Re: Water Tank Gaskets

 

I bought replacement O-rings for the cleanout ports on the water and holding tanks from Grainger, as well as deck fills. The minimum quantities were high (10 and 25) for the different sizes, but they were not expensive.
--
Joe Cleary

Kestrel? -??S36 #54? -??Boston


Re: S28 MK I ignition lock/switch wiring

 

Assuming the current switch still works, you could?
  • disconnect the battery
  • note which wire(s) go to each terminal on the switch
  • Disconnect all the wires
  • Use an ohmmeter to see which terminals?are connected together in each switch position.
  • Using the ohmmeter and the information that came with the new switch, figure out the corresponding terminals on the new switch.
  • Reconnect the wires to the corresponding terminals on the new switch.
I would guess that the red wire with the boot on it goes?to the battery.
The terminal with multiple wires is probably the "Ignition/Run" position, which would be connected to the battery in all the other positions.
One of the other terminals should be the "Start" position, it's not clear what the 4th terminal is for.


?

On Thu, May 15, 2025 at 4:41?PM Michael Sterling via <sterling1mster=[email protected]> wrote:
Corey, I don't think it's quite as random as you suggest
?I have the original factory wiring diagram from 1988 & it's been quote accurate?
?Certainly some changes have been made since the boat left the factory but even those have been easy to follow.
To the OP try to get your hands on an original diagram.
Mike
s/v Ladylike?
88 38' MK II

Michael Sterling
Ph. 252-646-9610


On Thu, May 15, 2025, 2:35?PM Corey Manero via <ckmanero=[email protected]> wrote:
Unfortunately in those days the wiring changed by engine, model, day of the week, hull number, and what the person doing the install had for breakfast. Then 40 years provided opportunities for the wiring to be changed.?

The safest bet to avoid letting the smoke out is to ohm out each wire.?

Corey
Light S28-1
Essex, CT

On May 15, 2025, at 12:18?PM, PIOTR SERWIK via <cuivier1=[email protected]> wrote:

?
Hi, All.?
I'm afraid I may be forced to replace my ignition switch on S28 Mk I. Does anyone have any idea where all these cables go to? I'm trying to replace it with a Colee- Hersee 3-position ignition switch and I have no clue which wires go where. I'll try attaching the photo of current switch.?
?
<IMG_2432 _3_.jpg>



--

--Jim Harman


--
-- Jim Harman
Arcadia
S402 #2
Southport CT


Re: AGM Battery recommendation

 

With AGM, everything, EVERYTHING, depends on how they were treated.? When we bought our current boat, it had a 4 AGM house bank that didn't make it through 4 years of use.? The AGM starting battery, on the other hand, is still going strong after 16 years.

AGMs were invented, designed, and intended for use as aircraft starting batteries, which are more or less guaranteed to be fully recharged before the start of the takeoff roll.? Used on a cruising boat that lives on mooring and without solar, AGMs are a disaster.? Topped off daily from solar, no problem.? Topped off daily while plugged in at a marina, fine unless you take extended cruises.

But frankly, word of mouth without knowing the details of installation and usage isn't going to tell you anything worth knowing.

[The other question is whether to convert to LFP now or wait until the new batteries crap out.? I'm told that among the best things about LFP is that you don't have to worry about them.? But I haven't reached that point...]

On 5/15/2025 4:13 PM, David & Catherine via groups.io wrote:
We have just replaced our 4 D batteries in our "not.a Sabre" with two Full River 4 D AGM batteries . They came well recommended and another boat in the marina has had them so far for eight years with no problem.

Cheers,
David

Ex "Solitaire 1" Sabre 402
now " Chinook 1 " Catalina 42 Mk 2
Kingston Ont.



--
Jim Starkey, AmorphousDB, LLC


Re: S28 MK I ignition lock/switch wiring

 

Corey, I don't think it's quite as random as you suggest
?I have the original factory wiring diagram from 1988 & it's been quote accurate?
?Certainly some changes have been made since the boat left the factory but even those have been easy to follow.
To the OP try to get your hands on an original diagram.
Mike
s/v Ladylike?
88 38' MK II

Michael Sterling
Ph. 252-646-9610


On Thu, May 15, 2025, 2:35?PM Corey Manero via <ckmanero=[email protected]> wrote:
Unfortunately in those days the wiring changed by engine, model, day of the week, hull number, and what the person doing the install had for breakfast. Then 40 years provided opportunities for the wiring to be changed.?

The safest bet to avoid letting the smoke out is to ohm out each wire.?

Corey
Light S28-1
Essex, CT

On May 15, 2025, at 12:18?PM, PIOTR SERWIK via <cuivier1=[email protected]> wrote:

?
Hi, All.?
I'm afraid I may be forced to replace my ignition switch on S28 Mk I. Does anyone have any idea where all these cables go to? I'm trying to replace it with a Colee- Hersee 3-position ignition switch and I have no clue which wires go where. I'll try attaching the photo of current switch.?
?
<IMG_2432 _3_.jpg>