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Re: printing with Qimage
Diane,
That's how I print, and I believe most others do, also. When I print to file in Qimage, I set the printer ICC to QTR-RGB Gray Matte and leave Smart Sharpening at the default. Then I open the tiff with QTR. Works great. Some folks just set QTR to monitor a folder and let it print automatically when the tiff is saved in Qimage. The collaboration between Roy, Stephen, and Mike was wonderful and made for a simple workflow. I was thrilled when QTR was first released for Windows. Then when Stephen created QTRGui, it was so much better. And now, with Mike's input, and further improvements in QTR and the GUI, it's a real pleasure to work with. Metemerism-free prints and I can easily change the look from selenium-toned to warm and everything in between. What fun!! John L --- In QuadtoneRIP@..., "Diane Fields" <picnic@c...> wrote: I know there are RGB ICC profiles for QTR gray-matte and gray-photo. I also know these are to be used for printing from Qimage. I have and have used Qimage for a number of years and happen to be using it this morning. That brought up the question in my mind--just how are others printing from Qimage using QTR? Are you printing to file, then using that saved tiff to bring into the QTR GUI?
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To Diane -- Re: The Advantages of QTR Are?
Steve
Diane, the other day you offered to to do a print screen offlist to
show me how 'step wedging' is done. That would be a great help to me if you could provide me with that info. Thanks in advance! Steve --- In QuadtoneRIP@..., "Diane Fields" <picnic@c...> wrote: Steve, I'm a newbie too at QTR but maybe because I've read theother list for several years (and have been printing b/w for a good while, first with the 1280 and with the 2200) and am pretty familiar with PS, the QTR workflow works for me. ink/paper combo. If you notice on the Digital/bw list they spray their prints to counter that problem. The newer R800 and R1800, we assume, will deal with the bronzing by using the Gloss Optimizer (and this is the 'glop' they talk about on the other list--they are adding it into a cart to use with the black inks--3rd party--like with the MIS inks and Paul Roark's curves). Lou Dina's that explained how to softproof in QTR? particular curves will look like on that particular paper. I laid out my 11 sheets with the step wedges on them and was able to pick out the papers I liked, then I could see what a 75 warm and 25 cool blend looked like, for instance, on that paper. I like not quite neutral--just a bit of warmth to it. On different papers the curve blend I might choose could be different--because the tone of the papers affects the image a great deal. you want to print, then you have to choose a 'curve' for it down below. For instance, I want to print on Epson Velvet. So--I choose a matte paper in the paper dropdown. I make the selections as to dpi, etc. in all the other places. Probably I would check 'centered' (but if you are doing step wedge printing, you will keep dragging the step wedge file around in the window to place it differently for different printing--if you don't understand this, I can do a print screen and send it to you offlist). Now--you need to select your blend percentage (middle box) and your curves. Since I use Epson Enhanced matte as a proofing paper for Velvet, I feel that those curves will be close enough for me for Epson Velvet. In the left curve drop down box, I choose EEnhMatte-Cool and in the right box I choose EEnhmatte-Warm. From my series of step wedges I did on my Epson Velvet paper (I did 6 rather than do a long series of percentages. Once I establish for sure what papers I'm going to use all the time, I will do a series of step wedges from 100% cool to 100% warm in 10% increments) I find that a 60 cool/40 warm is about the blend I like on that paper. So--I move the blend slider over to 60 (the blend number represents the amount of the curve on the left-- the one for the cool). I did not adjust my ink limit for this paper (though I may in the future) so I will not make any other slider adjustments for now. Then---I'm ready to click on print and that's it. will help you correct any tonality/contrast issues with your print-- before you print (for the most part--its pretty difficult to get a perfect reading on a monitor to match a paper print because of the difference in the mediums). on the papers you use all the time will be a big help--and I'll be glad to help you figure out how to do that. this QTR stuff and you've been very helpful by answering many of mypaper? Is this effect eliminated using the QTR?etc. Do you know where I can find a simplified tutorial that explainshow to use this software? I know Roy Harrington talks about it onhis QTR site but I'm finding it a little too technical. |
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Re: Problem with QTRGui
Steve
Steve, it's quite possible that is whats happen. I will have to
download and install the newer version. --- In QuadtoneRIP@..., "Stephen Billard" <sbillard@s...> wrote: Could be you are running version 2.1 (or earlier)? There was anerror in that version 2.1, the right hand curve was not properly displayed.Before 2.1 the feature did not exist.curve graph' and I click on that (I'm using a Wacom pen), the curve is shown. Notsure why you would not get that.show a graph,is there a reason for this? I've been told that it's supposeto. |
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Re: Problem with QTRGui
Stephen Billard
开云体育Could
be you are running version 2.1 (or earlier)? There was an error in that version
2.1, the right hand curve was not properly displayed. Before 2.1 the feature did
not exist.
?
?
-Stephen
?
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Re: Problem with QTRGui
Steve
I'm not sure either, perhaps I have an older QTR version?
--- In QuadtoneRIP@..., "Diane Fields" <picnic@c...> wrote: Steve, when I right click over the curve title, it says, 'show curvegraph' and I click on that (I'm using a Wacom pen), the curve is shown. Not sure why you would not get that. show a graph,is there a reason for this? I've been told that it's supposeto. |
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Re: Problem with QTRGui
Diane Fields
开云体育Steve, when I right click over the curve
title, it says, 'show curve graph' and? I click on that (I'm using a Wacom
pen), the curve is shown.? Not sure why you would not get
that.
?
Diane
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printing with Qimage
Diane Fields
开云体育I know there are RGB ICC profiles for QTR
gray-matte and gray-photo.? I also know these are to be used for printing
from Qimage.? I have and have used Qimage for a number of years and happen
to be using it this morning.? That brought up the question in my mind--just
how are others printing from Qimage using QTR?? Are you printing to file,
then using that saved tiff to bring into the QTR GUI?
?
?
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Message topics
Scott Graham
Please change the message subjects when you change topics.
"the advantages of QTR" has gone down the tubes and will soon start being deleted, unless of course it talks about advantages of QTR... :) "after a full day..." doesn't say anything either (the subject, not necessarily the message) Scott: moderator/owner |
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Re: After a full day I think I have everything loaded correctly but.......
Epson's photo black is a very warm almost brown black and used with QTR will print exactly that way. The photo black (pk) curves supplied with QTR don't use toner inks to compensate for the pk only the light black (right click on the curve in the QTRgui and it will show a graph of the curve). Instead, try using the UC-NoBlack-Neutral curve. This might seem counterintuitive but since it doesn't use pk it won't print brown and has the benefit of allowing the use of any paper without having to switch black inks - just leave mat black installed.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Will montauklady wrote:
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Re: After a full day I think I have everything loaded correctly but.......
Carl Schofield
--- In QuadtoneRIP@..., "montauklady" <gpfly205ss@e...>
wrote: did..but I am looking for a cool/neutral black not warm tone (read brown)Try the "NoK" profile with luster paper. It doesn't use any black ink, but it does produce a neutral/cool print using only the neutralized (with light cyan and light magenta inks) light black ink. If you need really deep blacks then a neutral profile that uses either neutralized Photo Black (with full strength cyan and magenta) or even better the MIS PKN (cool neutral version of the Photo black ink) should be used. The Epson Photo Black ink that is used with RC papers is extremely warm. I don't think that any of the older profiles for RC papers that have been distributed use a neutralized Photo Black ink and that may be the source of the warm tones you are getting. |
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Re: The Advantages of QTR Are?
Diane Fields
开云体育Steve, the following is the text from Lou
Dina's post:
?
? . Could you send me that post on Soft Proofing by |
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After a full day I think I have everything loaded correctly but.......
I finally figured out how to get it to work...especially with your
help Diane...but my prints are still too warm pc epson 2200 epson inks epson luster paper. No I haven't printed wedges, as you did..but I am looking for a cool/neutral black not warm tone (read brown) prints. Suggestions? Combinations? |
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Re: The Advantages of QTR Are?
Steve
Thanks, Diane, I'm going to have to do some experimenting based on
what you've described here. I'm sure I'll be back with more questions for you. Could you send me that post on Soft Proofing by Lou Dina? I'd like to read up on it. Thanks! Steve --- In QuadtoneRIP@..., "Diane Fields" <picnic@c...> wrote: Steve, I'm a newbie too at QTR but maybe because I've read theother list for several years (and have been printing b/w for a good while, first with the 1280 and with the 2200) and am pretty familiar with PS, the QTR workflow works for me. ink/paper combo. If you notice on the Digital/bw list they spray their prints to counter that problem. The newer R800 and R1800, we assume, will deal with the bronzing by using the Gloss Optimizer (and this is the 'glop' they talk about on the other list--they are adding it into a cart to use with the black inks--3rd party--like with the MIS inks and Paul Roark's curves). Lou Dina's that explained how to softproof in QTR? particular curves will look like on that particular paper. I laid out my 11 sheets with the step wedges on them and was able to pick out the papers I liked, then I could see what a 75 warm and 25 cool blend looked like, for instance, on that paper. I like not quite neutral--just a bit of warmth to it. On different papers the curve blend I might choose could be different--because the tone of the papers affects the image a great deal. you want to print, then you have to choose a 'curve' for it down below. For instance, I want to print on Epson Velvet. So--I choose a matte paper in the paper dropdown. I make the selections as to dpi, etc. in all the other places. Probably I would check 'centered' (but if you are doing step wedge printing, you will keep dragging the step wedge file around in the window to place it differently for different printing--if you don't understand this, I can do a print screen and send it to you offlist). Now--you need to select your blend percentage (middle box) and your curves. Since I use Epson Enhanced matte as a proofing paper for Velvet, I feel that those curves will be close enough for me for Epson Velvet. In the left curve drop down box, I choose EEnhMatte-Cool and in the right box I choose EEnhmatte-Warm. From my series of step wedges I did on my Epson Velvet paper (I did 6 rather than do a long series of percentages. Once I establish for sure what papers I'm going to use all the time, I will do a series of step wedges from 100% cool to 100% warm in 10% increments) I find that a 60 cool/40 warm is about the blend I like on that paper. So--I move the blend slider over to 60 (the blend number represents the amount of the curve on the left-- the one for the cool). I did not adjust my ink limit for this paper (though I may in the future) so I will not make any other slider adjustments for now. Then---I'm ready to click on print and that's it. will help you correct any tonality/contrast issues with your print-- before you print (for the most part--its pretty difficult to get a perfect reading on a monitor to match a paper print because of the difference in the mediums). on the papers you use all the time will be a big help--and I'll be glad to help you figure out how to do that. this QTR stuff and you've been very helpful by answering many of mypaper? Is this effect eliminated using the QTR?etc. Do you know where I can find a simplified tutorial that explainshow to use this software? I know Roy Harrington talks about it onhis QTR site but I'm finding it a little too technical. |
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Re: The Advantages of QTR Are?
Diane Fields
开云体育Bernie, that's about it.? I don't think
you can assign a grayscale profile until you 'convert' to grayscale, but I could
be wrong.? Nonetheless, you do need to 'convert' to first the LAB--because
you will probably want to save this as your master tiff.? Then--convert
this file to either gray-matte or gray-photo and save this tiff and use it to
print from.?
?
I haven't printed on the Ilford paper but
after doing step wedges on my Epson Premium Semigloss and laying out all my 11
papers, I found that it was much creamier than I had really ever thought.?
Consequently it affects the 'cool' curve quite a bit, but when you print from a
100% warm to a 100% cool, you can see the differences as you progress from one
to the other and its marked.? My most neutral prints will be on Hahnemuhle
PHotorag, Velvet, Innova Photo Fibaprint and Epson Enhanced Matte--all of which
are matte papers.
?
The RIP won't affect bronzing--because that's
a paper/ink thing.? I haven't sprayed any since I mostly print b/w on matte
paper, but not always.? On the other list they are all spraying their gloss
and semi gloss prints and are using 'glop' (gloss optimizer) in a cart with
their 3rd party inks.? I'll have to try the Lyson spray though--good to
hear when someone likes a particular brand.
?
If you try the softproofing in gray-LAB I
think you would find it helpful also.? You can tweak that final
contrast/tonality if needed.? Have you found the gray file on Roy's
page?
?
Diane
?
?
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Re: QTR EEnh matte cool Se curve
Diane Fields
开云体育Thank you Carl.? I just happened to try
that with the CoolSe--without understanding what the curve was.? Found a
blend I liked and made it a preset.
?
Diane
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Re: The Advantages of QTR Are?
Diane Fields
开云体育Steve, I'm a newbie too at QTR but maybe
because I've read the other list for several years (and have been printing b/w
for a good while, first with the 1280 and with the 2200) and am pretty familiar
with PS, the QTR workflow works for me.
?
No, QTR won't cure bronzing because that's a
function of the ink/paper combo.? If you notice on the Digital/bw list they
spray their prints to counter that problem.? The newer R800 and R1800, we
assume, will deal with the bronzing by using the Gloss Optimizer (and this is
the 'glop' they talk about on the other list--they are adding it into a cart to
use with the black inks--3rd party--like with the MIS inks and Paul Roark's
curves).
?
I don't know of a tutorial.? Did I send
you the post I found of Lou Dina's that explained how to softproof in
QTR?
?
What the step wedges help you with is
envisioning what those particular curves will look like on that particular
paper.? I laid out my 11 sheets with the step wedges on them and was able
to pick out the papers I liked, then I could see what a 75 warm and 25 cool
blend looked like, for instance, on that paper.? I like not quite
neutral--just a bit of warmth to it.? On different papers the curve blend I
might choose could be different--because the tone of the papers affects the
image a great deal.
?
When you open the QTR GUI in Windows and you
select the image file you want to print, then you have to choose a 'curve' for
it down below.? For instance, I want to print on Epson Velvet.? So--I
choose a matte paper in the paper dropdown.? I make the selections as to
dpi, etc. in all the other places.? Probably I would check 'centered' (but
if you are doing step wedge printing, you will keep dragging the step wedge file
around in the window to place it differently for different printing--if you
don't understand this, I can do a print screen and send it to you
offlist).? Now--you need to select your blend percentage (middle box) and
your curves.? Since I use Epson Enhanced matte as a proofing paper for
Velvet, I feel that those curves will be close enough for me for Epson
Velvet.? In the left curve drop down box, I choose EEnhMatte-Cool and in
the right box I choose EEnhmatte-Warm.? From my series of step wedges I did
on my Epson Velvet paper (I did 6 rather than do a long series of
percentages.? Once I establish for sure what papers I'm going to use all
the time, I will do a series of step wedges from 100% cool to 100% warm in 10%
increments) I find that a 60 cool/40 warm is about the blend I like on that
paper.? So--I move the blend slider over to?60 (the blend number
represents the amount of the curve on the left--the one for the cool).? I
did not adjust my ink limit for this paper (though I may in the future) so I
will not make any other slider adjustments for now.? Then---I'm ready to
click on print and that's it.
?
I addressed softproofing in the post to Anne
(Montauk lady).? It will help you correct any tonality/contrast issues with
your print--before you print (for the most part--its pretty difficult to get a
perfect reading on a monitor to match a paper print because of the difference in
the mediums).
?
I hope this is helpful.? I really think
printing the step wedges on the papers you use all the time will be a big
help--and I'll be glad to help you figure out how to do that.
?
Diane.?
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Re: QTR EEnh matte cool Se curve
Carl Schofield
The "CoolSe" curve uses slightly more light magenta than light cyan, whereas a "Cool"
curve uses equal amounts of light magenta and light cyan to cool the warm light black ink. The "CoolSe" is an attempt to emulate the tones of a lightly selenium toned silver gelatin print. You could blend either the "Cool" or "CoolSe" curves with a warm or carbon curve to generate a neutral print. --- In QuadtoneRIP@..., "Diane Fields" <picnic@c...> wrote: Could anyone tell me just what this curve is---is it a blend of Sepia and cool forEEnhMatte? I saw a post not long ago about the use of this curve--with perhaps a warm curve??? Can't remember the context of the post--and am not sure
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Re: The Advantages of QTR Are?
Bernie Raffe
开云体育Hi Steve and Diane ? I’ve been following this carefully, because I’ve been using QTR for my black and whites with reasonable success for the last couple of weeks (with Windows) and didn’t know about the grey icc files. I just use my usual Photoshop b&w workflow and print with QTR (although I make the prints much less warm than I used to – as Steve says they do print rather warm). ? I’m going to give the ICC files a try, but still a bit confused. Leaving the proofing process to one side for the moment, am I right in saying that these are the steps:- ?
? By the way, I use Ilford Smooth Pearl paper and like others have been alarmed by the bronzing affect (printing with QTR doesn’t appear to affect the amount of bronzing). What I’ve been doing is this. If the print was to go under glass for a customer, then I used the QTR printed photo, otherwise I would send the photo off to the lab to be printed. However, I’ve now discovered Lyson Printguard – this spray drastically reduces the bronzing effect and also completely eliminates the gloss differential (which was very noticeable on my prints as I shoot mostly against a white background). So now I print all b&w with QTR. ? Thanks for your help Bernie ? ? ? ? -----Original
Message----- From: Steve
[mailto:blizzie12@...]
Sent: 03 April 2005 19:44 To: QuadtoneRIP@... Subject: [QuadtoneRIP] Re: The Advantages of QTR Are? ?
-- -- |
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Re: The Advantages of QTR Are?
Steve
Thanks, Diane, I'm really struggling with the understanding of this
QTR stuff and you've been very helpful by answering many of my questions on this forum. I'm familar of the metamerism problem caused by the different lighting, but what about 'bronzing' when printing b&w on gloss paper? Is this effect eliminated using the QTR? I'm still not clear on the 'step wedges', 'blends' and 'curves', etc. Do you know where I can find a simplified tutorial that explains how to use this software? I know Roy Harrington talks about it on his QTR site but I'm finding it a little too technical. Looking forward to hearng back from you. Steve --- In QuadtoneRIP@..., "Diane Fields" <picnic@c...> wrote: Steve, the BIG advantage of using QTR over PS is the lack ofmetamerism in monotones. I've printed b/w or monotones for years with first a 1280 and then my 2200. I print from either PS or Qimage. I have been unhappy with metamerism from day one, however the 'alternatives' were pretty expensive (RIPs) or I just hadn't made the decision to go with a dedicated printer yet. When I bought my 2200 several years ago I had strongly considered that path, but had procrastinated 'dealing with' monotones by using duotones which helped a bit (not really--they just visually diverted you a bit with toning). I've subscriebed to the Digital b/w print maillist off and on for a good while, and when I resubbed in late Winter I discovered that there was a reasonably priced RIP available for Windows. I demoed it for several weeks and was sold on it. my reason for printing with it. I do all my postprocessing in PS first, then bring a finished file to QTR, select my blend for the paper I'm using and get excellent prints. In the past I was using Epson Velvet primarily for my matte prints, some Hahnemuhle Photorag. I've just done a series of step wedges on 11 different papers and have a good reference point for other papers also. I use Epson Premium Semigloss for my non-matte prints. your opinions. Thanks! |
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