Re: U2 Erratic Timing - some detail
--- In QRPLabs@..., Barry Chambers <b.chambers@...> wrote:
On 23/05/2013 21:50, David Atkins wrote:
I hope the detailed description of the erratic behaviour, recorded below,
will give an indication to someone of the cause.
My Trimble Jupiter modules refused to register [both of them]. So did my
Sure Evaluation kit. Even though they all work perfectly with several GPS
evaluation programmes. An EM-406a arrived from Germany this morning, and I
have tried everything I have seen suggested in the past week or so.
This is
how it goes:
I have Frame set to 10
I have Start set to 04
GPS Baud is 04800,01,1,8
Use GPS On
Inv GPS On -- yes, I know, but nothing works with it off
Frq set to 10.140.198
Locator is rubbish
Set Time is rubbish
Switch on at 16:00:04
Locator sets correctly to IO91, time sets correctly to 16:00:04, Sys Frq
remains un-modified;
Time them increments in two-second steps every second -- 06, 08, 10,
etc --
until it reads 16:03:50, when it resets itself to the correct time
(16:01:26, say). Then count up at double speed until it gets to 16:03:50,
when it resets itself to the correct time, and starts counting up at
double
speed again. This happens over and over until the time really is 16:03:50,
when it counts on up to 16:04:00 and starts transmitting. Of course, it
counted at double speed, so the transmission starts at about 3 seconds
before the start of the even minute. But the transmission itself is at
normal speed, so I can decode it on another rig.
After the transmission, we go through the double speed until the clock
reads
16:13:50, then the reset etc cycle goes on until the transmission at a
couple of seconds before 16:14:00.
Does that seem reasonable?
OK, so how do I cure it? I have the RX data pin of the module tied to Vcc,
and both ground pins are connected to 0v. Beyond that, I have tried
pull-up
resistors (10k ohm) and pull-down resistors on the pps line and/or the TX
data line. No change.
?help?
David G8XBZ
David
Your GPS experiences pretty well match mine, except that I'm using a
EM-406A GPS.
--
73
Barry, G8AGN
Me too. My EM-406A is the same.
|
Re: U2 Erratic Timing - some detail
On 23/05/2013 21:50, David Atkins
wrote:
?
I hope the detailed description of the erratic behaviour,
recorded below,
will give an indication to someone of the cause.
My Trimble Jupiter modules refused to register [both of
them]. So did my
Sure Evaluation kit. Even though they all work perfectly
with several GPS
evaluation programmes. An EM-406a arrived from Germany
this morning, and I
have tried everything I have seen suggested in the past
week or so. This is
how it goes:
I have Frame set to 10
I have Start set to 04
GPS Baud is 04800,01,1,8
Use GPS On
Inv GPS On -- yes, I know, but nothing works with it off
Frq set to 10.140.198
Locator is rubbish
Set Time is rubbish
Switch on at 16:00:04
Locator sets correctly to IO91, time sets correctly to
16:00:04, Sys Frq
remains un-modified;
Time them increments in two-second steps every second --
06, 08, 10, etc --
until it reads 16:03:50, when it resets itself to the
correct time
(16:01:26, say). Then count up at double speed until it
gets to 16:03:50,
when it resets itself to the correct time, and starts
counting up at double
speed again. This happens over and over until the time
really is 16:03:50,
when it counts on up to 16:04:00 and starts transmitting.
Of course, it
counted at double speed, so the transmission starts at
about 3 seconds
before the start of the even minute. But the transmission
itself is at
normal speed, so I can decode it on another rig.
After the transmission, we go through the double speed
until the clock reads
16:13:50, then the reset etc cycle goes on until the
transmission at a
couple of seconds before 16:14:00.
Does that seem reasonable?
OK, so how do I cure it? I have the RX data pin of the
module tied to Vcc,
and both ground pins are connected to 0v. Beyond that, I
have tried pull-up
resistors (10k ohm) and pull-down resistors on the pps
line and/or the TX
data line. No change.
?help?
David G8XBZ
David
Your GPS experiences pretty well match mine, except that I'm using a
EM-406A GPS.
--
73
Barry, G8AGN
|
U2 Erratic Timing - some detail
I hope the detailed description of the erratic behaviour, recorded below,
will give an indication to someone of the cause.
My Trimble Jupiter modules refused to register [both of them]. So did my
Sure Evaluation kit. Even though they all work perfectly with several GPS
evaluation programmes. An EM-406a arrived from Germany this morning, and I
have tried everything I have seen suggested in the past week or so. This is
how it goes:
I have Frame set to 10
I have Start set to 04
GPS Baud is 04800,01,1,8
Use GPS On
Inv GPS On -- yes, I know, but nothing works with it off
Frq set to 10.140.198
Locator is rubbish
Set Time is rubbish
Switch on at 16:00:04
Locator sets correctly to IO91, time sets correctly to 16:00:04, Sys Frq
remains un-modified;
Time them increments in two-second steps every second -- 06, 08, 10, etc --
until it reads 16:03:50, when it resets itself to the correct time
(16:01:26, say). Then count up at double speed until it gets to 16:03:50,
when it resets itself to the correct time, and starts counting up at double
speed again. This happens over and over until the time really is 16:03:50,
when it counts on up to 16:04:00 and starts transmitting. Of course, it
counted at double speed, so the transmission starts at about 3 seconds
before the start of the even minute. But the transmission itself is at
normal speed, so I can decode it on another rig.
After the transmission, we go through the double speed until the clock reads
16:13:50, then the reset etc cycle goes on until the transmission at a
couple of seconds before 16:14:00.
Does that seem reasonable?
OK, so how do I cure it? I have the RX data pin of the module tied to Vcc,
and both ground pins are connected to 0v. Beyond that, I have tried pull-up
resistors (10k ohm) and pull-down resistors on the pps line and/or the TX
data line. No change.
?help?
David G8XBZ
|
U2 gets an outing on 40m.
Played FSKCW and Slow Hell on 40m earlier, works very well and
watched the quality of my signals on a couple of grabbers.
I'm pleased to report that despite being run with no heatsinks for
hours on end all three PA FETS are quite happily chugging away with no problems despite running hot at 9 volts ;-)
Still need to box the dratted thing as time allows...
73 da 'FTD
|
On 23/05/2013 19:05, Philip wrote: What type of antenna are you using on 474? Hi Philip Tiny by normal standards but I don't have much space, it's an inverted L 5.5m up 5.5m out. Latest 'DX' G0KTN @ 145Km. 73 Eddie G3ZJO.
|
Eddie
What type of antenna are you using on 474?
Philip G4JVF
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--- In QRPLabs@..., g3zjo <g3zjo@...> wrote:
QRPLabs
This morning I got round to sorting my arrangement for using my external
LPF's with the U2. I now have the possibility of output on any band
except for the moment 136KHz.
The 200mW of RF out on 474.2KHz (dial freq) WSPR produced instant
reports from 2 stations best DX up to now 91Km. I have run 10mW on the
band in the past and got results from the closest stations, although the
band is not at its best at this time of year it will be interesting to
see what transpires. With these sort of powers I have reached over 1000Km.
73 Eddie G3ZJO
|
Thanks !
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--- In QRPLabs@..., g3zjo <g3zjo@...> wrote:
On 23/05/2013 12:22, andyfoad@... wrote:
How many BS170 / supply volts are you using ? Hi Andy
Just the one and 5V, I am not a QRO merchant. :-)
Eddie
|
Re: Ultimate2 kit status summary
Same problem as I noticed and mentioned in an earlier post.
At first I thought that when I had the 28Mhz PA problem that I
might have caused some damage to the ATMEGA.
73 de Andy
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--- In QRPLabs@..., Keith Maton <nentecular@...> wrote:
I've captured it and uploaded it here:
73 Keith.
On 22 May 2013, at 22:37, Hans Summers <hans.summers@...> wrote:
Hi Keith
Can you give me a photo of how it looks with the digit missing off the right? Or, write out exactly the display, character by character? Then I can try to get it corrected/moved.
73 Hans G0UPL
|
Re: Ultimate2 kit status summary
I've captured it and uploaded it here:
73 Keith.
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Show quoted text
?
Hi Keith
Can you give me a photo of how it looks with the digit missing off the right? ?Or, write out exactly the display, character by character? Then I can try to get it corrected/moved.
73 Hans G0UPL
|
On 23/05/2013 12:35, Barry Chambers wrote: I'm receiving you about -22/23 on 475702. Yep I see your Spots Barry 129Km. Thanks Eddie
|
On 23/05/2013 11:47, g3zjo wrote:
?
QRPLabs
This morning I got round to sorting my arrangement for
using my external
LPF's with the U2. I now have the possibility of output on
any band
except for the moment 136KHz.
The 200mW of RF out on 474.2KHz (dial freq) WSPR produced
instant
reports from 2 stations best DX up to now 91Km. I have run
10mW on the
band in the past and got results from the closest
stations, although the
band is not at its best at this time of year it will be
interesting to
see what transpires. With these sort of powers I have
reached over 1000Km.
73 Eddie G3ZJO
Eddie
the Dx is 129km - still getting good decodes.
--
73
Barry, G8AGN
|
On 23/05/2013 12:22, andyfoad@... wrote: How many BS170 / supply volts are you using ? Hi Andy Just the one and 5V, I am not a QRO merchant. :-) Eddie
|
On 23/05/2013 11:47, g3zjo wrote:
?
QRPLabs
This morning I got round to sorting my arrangement for
using my external
LPF's with the U2. I now have the possibility of output on
any band
except for the moment 136KHz.
The 200mW of RF out on 474.2KHz (dial freq) WSPR produced
instant
reports from 2 stations best DX up to now 91Km. I have run
10mW on the
band in the past and got results from the closest
stations, although the
band is not at its best at this time of year it will be
interesting to
see what transpires. With these sort of powers I have
reached over 1000Km.
73 Eddie G3ZJO
Eddie
I'm receiving you about -22/23 on 475702.
--
73
Barry, G8AGN
|
--- In QRPLabs@..., g3zjo <g3zjo@...> wrote: The 200mW of RF out on 474.2KHz (dial freq) WSPR produced instant
reports from 2 stations best DX up to now 91Km. How many BS170 / supply volts are you using ? I'm hoping to box mine now in the next few days, now all my hardware is available and ready to use. 73 de Andy
|
QRPLabs
This morning I got round to sorting my arrangement for using my external LPF's with the U2. I now have the possibility of output on any band except for the moment 136KHz.
The 200mW of RF out on 474.2KHz (dial freq) WSPR produced instant reports from 2 stations best DX up to now 91Km. I have run 10mW on the band in the past and got results from the closest stations, although the band is not at its best at this time of year it will be interesting to see what transpires. With these sort of powers I have reached over 1000Km.
73 Eddie G3ZJO
|
Re: Ultimate2 kit status summary
Hi Keith
Can you give me a photo of how it looks with the digit missing off the right? ?Or, write out exactly the display, character by character? Then I can try to get it corrected/moved.
73 Hans G0UPL
On Wed, May 22, 2013 at 5:24 PM, Keith Maton <nentecular@...> wrote:
?
Hi Hans,
I've been doing some testing and changing the SPEED parameter so that my callsign fits nicely in ten minute frames - If I set speed to 10 then my callsign fits with 20 seconds to spare so that's absolutely perfect.
However, in FSKCW10 mode, while idle between frames, the far right digit of the time is missed off because the clock has moved to the right. ?So it shows 16:24:1?
There are a couple of spaces to the left of the time display, could you shift the clock one character to the left so that it will fit when using a SPEED parameter that runs into double figures please?
Thanks,
73 Keith, G6NHU
?
All
My email box is full of millions of emails and so I thought, to clarify all my and your thinking, one big post should list it all out. Summarise where we are with it all. If I am missing anything, please let me know.?
Enhancement requests: firstly, there are a number of new requests (other than the GPS and 10m issues, of which more later). I'll attempt to put as many as I can in the v2.02 firmware version. These are as follows:
1) Support for the WSPR-15 mode (useful for LF WSPR) 2) Adding 1 digit to the GPS Baud setting, so the kit can be used with 115kbps (also requested for an Ultimate1 v1.09 enhancement)
3) Allowing the / character in messages for FSKCW, QRSS, DFCW, CW modes 4) Removing the 42.5MHz (approx) upper frequency limit 5) Fix a couple of occasional cosmetic bugs appearing in the Time-setting menu item
6) Move the Time setting to the front of the menu items, as it is used more often than any others when using the WSPR mode and everything is already set up (e.g. for correcting the time, when no GPS is being used).
New shop items requests: I have had requests to add the following items to the shop: 1) Selling BS170 transistors separately to the main kit 2) Sell the 4-pin headers and sockets separately to the main kit
3) Make available LF band modules for 475kHz and 135kHz?
10m etc issue: The summary of this issue is that it appears that there may be an arithmetic precision issue in the code for setting the DDS frequency word, which becomes apparent when the amount of shift is small in relation to the output frequency. So I need to change that part of the code which deals with calculating the DDS frequency word. Although, it remains considerably confusing because some people appear to have had some 10m WSPR spots. Perhaps they were lucky to choose frequencies which happened to work.
GPS issue:?There appears to be an issue with some GPS modules which worked in U1 but not U2. There have been some reports of people using GPS with no trouble, with Ultimate2. My current theory is that the short pulse width from some GPS modules is interfering with, or being interfered by, the incoming serial data stream. So I need to look at the differences between how I did the GPS work in U1 and U2.
Other comments:
1) People have remarked on the frequency switching transients when the DDS frequency changes. I think this is a minor thing which if all else was well, should not interfere with kit operation or WSPR decode etc. However, I checked in this area of the code and I did actually find that I think the frequency is being briefly set to zero before the new frequency is set, and that this might be making the short frequency glitch longer than necessary. So in v2.02 I will attempt to tidy that up.?
2) Regarding the blue potentiometer on the DDS module. When the modules arrive from the manufacturer, it appears that the blue potentiometers are not set up - that manifests itself as no output squarewave from the comparator. Before packing the kits, I individually tested every single one of the 200 DDS modules. 29 were discarded as their stability was found to be unsuitable. The rest of them, the potentiometer was adjusted for best output on 30m. So I thought that it should not need further adjustment by kit builders. However, it is possible that the setting on 10m might be more critical, or different, from the optimum setting on 30m - as some constructors have found out and advised.?
3) Someone mentioned that the maximum output frequency of the comparator is only 1MHz. However I don't think that this is correct. The specification of the DDS module from the manufacturer sometimes says that the squarewave output is valid up to 1MHz. But the DDS module output is straight from the comparator output pin of the AD9850 DDS chip and I don't see anything in the AD9850 datasheet about any upper frequency limitation.?
4) Feedback on the question of whether to reverse the BS170 transistors in the new PCB, or reverse the silk screen, or leave as is - was rather (surprisingly) mixed. So I still have to consider that one.?
? 5) I had some delay with ordering all the components, because PayPal rather unreasonably decided they should block my account to make sure I'm not a money launderer. That's all resolved now so I can continue with ordering the remaining components for the next set of 200 kits.?
I think that's about it. Let me know if I have missed anything out.
73 Hans G0UPL
|
Re: U2 Frequency and 1PPs
Ok Andy, Colin!
Ok! I will add an indication that GPS lock has occurred! One more for the wish-list!
73 Hans G0UPL
On Wed, May 22, 2013 at 2:10 PM, Colin XSD <m0xsd@...> wrote:
?
That sounds like a good idea to me, how
about some 'square brackets' around the Locator i.e. in my case
IO84 becomes [IO84]?
73, Colin M0XSD.
?
Is is a good idea to have a small indication on the LCD
when in
normal operatin gmode that indicates that the GPS has
locked ?
That would save having to check the DDS Ref Freq menu.
Hans ?
73 de Andy
|
Hi Eddie
That's an interesting request, and I can certainly see the use of it! I added it to the wish-list!
73 Hans G0UPL
On Wed, May 22, 2013 at 2:48 PM, g3zjo <g3zjo@...> wrote:
?
When entering Message Data it would be nice to have the right button
(Scroll Mode) scroll through the alphabet A to Z then stop waiting for a
press before scrolling again through the symbols to the
stop again, the finally scroll through the numbers to 9.
It would save me a lot of going round the houses.
Eddie G3ZJO
|
Re: Ultimate2 kit status summary
Hi Hans,
I've been doing some testing and changing the SPEED parameter so that my callsign fits nicely in ten minute frames - If I set speed to 10 then my callsign fits with 20 seconds to spare so that's absolutely perfect.
However, in FSKCW10 mode, while idle between frames, the far right digit of the time is missed off because the clock has moved to the right. ?So it shows 16:24:1?
There are a couple of spaces to the left of the time display, could you shift the clock one character to the left so that it will fit when using a SPEED parameter that runs into double figures please?
Thanks,
73 Keith, G6NHU
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
?
All
My email box is full of millions of emails and so I thought, to clarify all my and your thinking, one big post should list it all out. Summarise where we are with it all. If I am missing anything, please let me know.?
Enhancement requests: firstly, there are a number of new requests (other than the GPS and 10m issues, of which more later). I'll attempt to put as many as I can in the v2.02 firmware version. These are as follows:
1) Support for the WSPR-15 mode (useful for LF WSPR) 2) Adding 1 digit to the GPS Baud setting, so the kit can be used with 115kbps (also requested for an Ultimate1 v1.09 enhancement)
3) Allowing the / character in messages for FSKCW, QRSS, DFCW, CW modes 4) Removing the 42.5MHz (approx) upper frequency limit 5) Fix a couple of occasional cosmetic bugs appearing in the Time-setting menu item
6) Move the Time setting to the front of the menu items, as it is used more often than any others when using the WSPR mode and everything is already set up (e.g. for correcting the time, when no GPS is being used).
New shop items requests: I have had requests to add the following items to the shop: 1) Selling BS170 transistors separately to the main kit 2) Sell the 4-pin headers and sockets separately to the main kit
3) Make available LF band modules for 475kHz and 135kHz?
10m etc issue: The summary of this issue is that it appears that there may be an arithmetic precision issue in the code for setting the DDS frequency word, which becomes apparent when the amount of shift is small in relation to the output frequency. So I need to change that part of the code which deals with calculating the DDS frequency word. Although, it remains considerably confusing because some people appear to have had some 10m WSPR spots. Perhaps they were lucky to choose frequencies which happened to work.
GPS issue:?There appears to be an issue with some GPS modules which worked in U1 but not U2. There have been some reports of people using GPS with no trouble, with Ultimate2. My current theory is that the short pulse width from some GPS modules is interfering with, or being interfered by, the incoming serial data stream. So I need to look at the differences between how I did the GPS work in U1 and U2.
Other comments:
1) People have remarked on the frequency switching transients when the DDS frequency changes. I think this is a minor thing which if all else was well, should not interfere with kit operation or WSPR decode etc. However, I checked in this area of the code and I did actually find that I think the frequency is being briefly set to zero before the new frequency is set, and that this might be making the short frequency glitch longer than necessary. So in v2.02 I will attempt to tidy that up.?
2) Regarding the blue potentiometer on the DDS module. When the modules arrive from the manufacturer, it appears that the blue potentiometers are not set up - that manifests itself as no output squarewave from the comparator. Before packing the kits, I individually tested every single one of the 200 DDS modules. 29 were discarded as their stability was found to be unsuitable. The rest of them, the potentiometer was adjusted for best output on 30m. So I thought that it should not need further adjustment by kit builders. However, it is possible that the setting on 10m might be more critical, or different, from the optimum setting on 30m - as some constructors have found out and advised.?
3) Someone mentioned that the maximum output frequency of the comparator is only 1MHz. However I don't think that this is correct. The specification of the DDS module from the manufacturer sometimes says that the squarewave output is valid up to 1MHz. But the DDS module output is straight from the comparator output pin of the AD9850 DDS chip and I don't see anything in the AD9850 datasheet about any upper frequency limitation.?
4) Feedback on the question of whether to reverse the BS170 transistors in the new PCB, or reverse the silk screen, or leave as is - was rather (surprisingly) mixed. So I still have to consider that one.?
? 5) I had some delay with ordering all the components, because PayPal rather unreasonably decided they should block my account to make sure I'm not a money launderer. That's all resolved now so I can continue with ordering the remaining components for the next set of 200 kits.?
I think that's about it. Let me know if I have missed anything out.
73 Hans G0UPL
|
Re: U2 Frequency and 1PPs
--- In QRPLabs@..., "peter_helm@..." <peter@...> wrote:
How do I know when the U2 is frequency synchronized to the 1PPS.
Mmmm, tried "all"? settings. freq stays at 125.000.000. Time does not get updated It seems to sulk with GPS on and do nothing. tried inverting and all pulse width up to 50%. GPS is GARMIN GPS16 LV version at 5 volts in. Pulses out at 4.5 volts for NMEA and PPS Yes have had frame at 04 and waited. sorry to be a pain. 73 Peter G8AEN
|
