Keyboard Shortcuts
Likes
- Kresy-Siberia
- Messages
Search
Re: Godmother = Karas/Towarnicka
Hello Hela,
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
My grandmother was from a village near Tarnopol (Gleboczek) and her maiden name was Karas. I wonder if there is a connection with your godmother's husband's family ..... ? Do you have any further information that we can compare ? Maybe you can email me off-line and we can compare notes. Krystyna Szypowska Montreal, Canada ----- Original Message -----
From: "Helena Danielczuk" <helena52@...> To: <Kresy-Siberia@...> Sent: Saturday, October 16, 2004 2:48 AM Subject: RE: [Kresy-Siberia] Military - men in uniform if there are any connections? |
Re: Arnhem - Polish Paratroopers - The Kresy
Amen to that
Every one who lived throughthe war and ended as arefugee outside their homeland deserves to be honoured and it is to that end that I have taken it upon myself to do so from Feb 5th to 13th 2005. I feel that this group, Polands entry into the Europe athe heart its rightful place, etc etc somehow validates the lives lost whether through combat, or through loss of childhood and the formative years. I look at my dad who God willing will celebrate his 85th birthday Nov 10th and the sadness of his years of hard labour ( 1940-1981) are now being followed by the joy of years of peace, he can experince and enjoy the fruits of his labours, the freedom of Polska, the ownership of his own front door and roof, his ogrodek with vegetables and that his dream as a boy of having just that are fulfilled. Bye 4 now Hela. From: "Halina Szulakowska" <hszulakowska@...>_________________________________________________________________ It's fast, it's easy and it's free. Get MSN Messenger today! |
Artiomowskij
J¨®zef Taran
Dear Listers,
I try to help in finding Mieczyslaw Zielinski, b. 1896 who served as policeman in Koso~w (Kossow, Kosowo) Poleski. There is an information he was sent to lagier Artiomowskij (nr 523) in Ural Mountains. Is there any chance to check this information? Best regards Jozef Taran in Warsaw, Poland |
Re: Help please
Hello and Thank you so much
Not just the book but the author would be such an honour and i can tell you it's at kosciol POlski pod wezwaniem Matki Boskiej Czestochowskiej, Landsdowne Place Bradford. I think Mass will be at 11.00 ish and obiad to follow then the film and any talks presentations etcI also envisage a t least aweeks events starting Feb 5th and ending at least the formal aspect of it 13th Feb with the Mass wreathe laying and something which I remember from childhood a spiritual bouquet. i hope the Mass will be anInternational and representatives of all faiths will be represented as I feel that the times we are living in now could do with reminder of the past to enable a more sensible and peaceful future for all outr children. This is an open invitation to all Details of the obiad etc will be posted nearer the date. Bye 4 now Hela. From: "Eugeniusz Krajewski" <e@...>_________________________________________________________________ It's fast, it's easy and it's free. Get MSN Messenger today! |
Re: Help please
Linder Carole Ladbrooke
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýHi
Hela,
?
Linder
here! Can you tell me where and when please? I've also got loads of stuff that
may be useful [from MOD/A3 coloured maps and the route to join Anders/A2 1937
map of Russia, other stuff etc
Email
me at 'ladbrooke@...'. I
live in Notts
Nice
that someone is about to make more youngsters more aware - good
luck!
Linder
|
Re: Help please
Eugeniusz Krajewski
Hi Helu,
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
What a good idea! If I may, I'd like to help by donating a copy of my book Straws in the Wind as well as a copy of my father's Land Deed (Akt Nadawczy). You will recall that the date of 10th February 1940 is pivotal to my story. Perhaps you could let me know in due course when and where the function is to take place. As you know, I live in Lincolnshire and, for me; a trip to Bradford would not be a problem. Good luck, Eugene -----Original Message-----
From: Helena Danielczuk [mailto:helena52@...] Sent: Monday, October 18, 2004 9:57 AM To: Kresy-Siberia@... Subject: [Kresy-Siberia] Help please Hello Last Saturday 16th October here in Bradford W.Yorks the Zjednoczenie were planning and writing the diary of events for 2005. I was in the next room teaching English and waiting for the next group to teach Polish! Imagine my surprise but more than that saddness that 10th Feb was not featured. So I have taken it upon myself to do something about it. So watch out Yorkshire! A Mass has been organised and an obiad. I am desperate to have an exhibition and I think that the materials etc we have on our site are excellent. I have books myself but I need the Marsz Sybirakow and would dearly love to have access to the photos in our albums of pre war Kresy etc etc. I need help inaccessing all of these for a real rather than a virtual audience. I have seen the memorial in Warszawa and have photos etc it is awesome and sad all at the same time I want an exhibition not just for the informed and experienced but to teach about this history tio schools and hope to enlighten those who teach in our schools about WW2!! Please help as I do not have much time but there is so much work. I hope to write to the local press and TV, Radio nearer the time . The Yorkshire Post was particularly helpful and published the article which was posted in September abou the uprising . Bye 4 now Hela. _________________________________________________________________ It's fast, it's easy and it's free. Get MSN Messenger today! * KRESY-SIBERIA GROUP = RESEARCH REMEMBRANCE RECOGNITION "Dedicated to researching, remembering and recognising the Polish citizens deported, enslaved and killed by the Soviet Union during World War Two." * Discussion site : Gallery (photos, documents) : Film and info : * To SUBSCRIBE to the discussion group, send an e-mail saying who you are and describing your interest in the group to: Kresy-Siberia-owner@... * Yahoo! Groups Links |
Re: USSR decree regarding citizenship
Zbigniew Bob Styrna
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýI have two such ankiety from my two uncles. ? They both state ¡°forced elections¡±.? In one ankieta these words are used ¡°..Sowieckie wybory..¡± and ¡°¡listy wyborczwe..¡±? My Polish to English dictionary states that ?WYBORY¡± = ¡°Elections¡±.? It does not say anything about acclimation. ? Ankieta states that in ¡°¡ October 1939, ?candidates were chosen by Soviet Citizens, together with residents of Ukrainian Jewish origin¡¡±? I presume that Soviet Citizens were Soviet Soldiers and KGB, etc. as I can¡¯t see that regular Russian civilians had time to emigrate from Russia into eastern Poland that quickly after Sept 17, 1939 invasion. ?Unless there were Soviets already living in these villages?? Any ideas? ? No where in any of these two, or of the many others I¡¯ve read from Hoover institute does it say about being forced to be a Soviet Citizen. ? These ¡®ankiety¡¯ define to me , and all the other Polish people that read them, and translate them as forced, mock elections that were held at a point of a gun, and disobeying these Russian orders meant instant ¡°arrests¡± and ¡®deportations¡¯. ? I think prior to this Russian voting ¡®fiasco¡± , the Polish citizens were accustomed to? what we call here in the free world, a normal election process where people had free choices and anyone could be a candidate. ?Russia/Communists had/have their ¡°own¡± definition of elections I¡¯m sure. They had no other definition to compare it to. We must remember that in 1939, people did not have TV, Internet surfing, etc.? They did not have instant access to information like we have now.? In fact most of these Polish village farmers, like my relatives, ?only had grade 3 education if they were lucky. ? My uncles and many others, described in their own words, as best as they could that these were not ¡®free ¡° elections as they were used to. ? Who believes that Stalin, after being defeated by the Polish troops in the Polish¨CRussian war of 1918-1920, would be nice and fair to the Polish citizens he just occupied in 1939? ??Like ¡®fair elections¡± ? ? Soviet = Russia ? Regards ? Zbyszek ? ? -----Original
Message----- From: Stefan Wisniowski
[mailto:swisniowski@...]
Sent: October 17, 2004 11:48 PM To: Kresy-Siberia@... Subject: Re: [Kresy-Siberia] Re: USSR decree regarding citizenship ? Roman, |
Re: Arnhem - Polish Paratroopers - The Kresy
Halina,
?
Very well written.? I agree wholeheartedly that our focus should not be too narrow.? I would have thought that a group such as this would give all of us the opportunity to stray from the path so long as the original aim is not lost sight of.
?
Chris? Scotland
Halina Szulakowska wrote: Hello everyone,
- all new features - even more fun! |
Arnhem - Polish Paratroopers - The Kresy
Halina Szulakowska
Hello everyone,
I have been away from the KS-group for a number of months and have only just re-subscribed. This time last month I was in Arnhem for 7 days for the 60th commemoration of Operation Market-Garden. My mother and I were representing my father, Antoni Szulakowski, who took part in the operation, but is sadly no longer with us. It was an emotional time to be with the men of both the Polish and British airborne. The 'Lest We Forget' foundation hosted around 600 veterans and widows during the rememberance week. I felt very honoured to be a part of this historic event, and was especially proud of the Polish veterans - some of whom I have had the priviledge to know since my childhood via the ZPS (Zwiazek Polskich Spadochroniarzy). As a group, although our focus is the Soviet deportation of Polish Citizens from the Eastern Borderlands, we have discussed all manner of topics relating to Poland's history - especially the timespan of WWII. The KS-Group have, for example, always been quick to remember the anniversaries of battles such as Monte Cassino and the Warsaw Uprising. I was, therefore, a little upset to read back to the group's September discussion on Market-Garden. One member actually said that, pertaining to Arnhem, "this is not on our Kresy-Siberia topic". And there seems to have been some hostility towards the German veterans who had quietly attended the commemoration to also, quite rightly, mourn their dead. In war everyone suffers. I have been in two minds as to whether I should broach this topic or not - especially since I was unsubscribed at the time Arnhem was mentioned. But I have since realised that I do want to share a few thoughts, and I apologise to anyone that may find my response a little late in the day. I think it is right to remember how our fathers, grandfathers, uncles, brothers, members of our own KS group, fought for their right to a free homeland: a homeland which they wanted complete with the Eastern Borderlands where many of them had been born. My father's only concern was to return to the Polesie which he loved so dearly, and where several generations of his family had farmed the land. Major-General Sosabowski's motto for his Brigade was 'Najkrotsza droga!', and his aim for the Pierwsza Samodzielna Brigada Spadochronowa was to land in Warsaw and liberate Poland as quickly as possible. These men, some of whom had been Soviet deportees, were all united in their refugee status and their home-sickness. During the service of rememberance at the Polish Monument in Driel, the Dutch children of the local school sang a song in the Polish language. It was 'Jaka Piekna Nasza Polska Cala'. The elderly paratrooper sitting to my left began to cry: "It's what I fought for. I fought for my beautiful Poland, and for her to be free". More specifically, he had fought to return to his 'beautiful' Podole from which he had been deported on 10th February 1940. I don't think you can divorce the deportations from the events that impacted on the deportees both during and after WWII. I certainly can't separate my father's military history, nor his consequent civilian life in Britain, from that night when the Szulakowski family were bundled onto a cattletruck in Sienkiewicze village and taken to Vologda as slave labour. Tata once told me that, even though years had passed, there remained a part of him which was forever the deportee. So please can I ask that the group remains open to all of the history, which has affected our families and friends. Serdeczne Pozdrowienia, Halina Szulakowska UK |
Janek Now Knows His Birthday! Sto lat!
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýDrogi Janek!
?
This is spectacular news!? I am so happy for you!? Sto lat!
?
It's very strange with my father's birthday.? All these years we celebrated his birthday on August?13th.? His birthday was like a national holiday to him too--I remember a huge party complete with tents and even a belly dancer when he was in his early forties!? (This was due to his love of the Middle East.)? There was no such thing as putting off the celebration to the weekend if the day fell during the week or whenever.? It had to be celebrated on the actual day!? When the Group got the Evacuation list, I was shocked to see that my father's birthday was noted in September!? Although I don't know if I believe this 100 per cent yet, I wonder now when his true birthday is.??I have been putting off for years writing to the Lwow archives for?his certificate and also my aunt's since I've always been concentrating on another area.? My aunt has no idea of her?real birthday, and mystery now surrounds?my father's day.?
?
Na zdrowie, Janek!
Eve Jesionka Jankowicz
USA?? |
Re: USSR decree regarding citizenship (Plebiscite)
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýHello Stefan, Roman, and Group -
?
Yes, Stefan, my grandfather's ankiety was stamped with a Polish Eagle, the only ankiety I have in my possession to be so stamped.? In his ankiety, he mentions the "election" plebiscite.? This I wrote of in 2001 to the Group.? Please see my Post No. 331.? In my? Grand Uncle Feliks' ankiety, he also mentioned the plebiscite?which was basically the same as his brother's, my grandfather, Maksymilian Jesionka, who was a Sgt. in the Austrian ulan in World War I.
?
Best regards,
Eve Jesionka Jankowicz
USA
-----
I wonder if anyone in the group has any similar memories of a |
Re: Help please
Lisa Blenkinsop
Helena, If there is anything I can do to help please let me know - I am just down the raod in Lancaster. Either way, I would like to know how you get on and to visit the exhibition. Best wishes, Lisa Lancaster, UK |
Help please
Hello
Last Saturday 16th October here in Bradford W.Yorks the Zjednoczenie were planning and writing the diary of events for 2005. I was in the next room teaching English and waiting for the next group to teach Polish! Imagine my surprise but more than that saddness that 10th Feb was not featured. So I have taken it upon myself to do something about it. So watch out Yorkshire! A Mass has been organised and an obiad. I am desperate to have an exhibition and I think that the materials etc we have on our site are excellent. I have books myself but I need the Marsz Sybirakow and would dearly love to have access to the photos in our albums of pre war Kresy etc etc. I need help inaccessing all of these for a real rather than a virtual audience. I have seen the memorial in Warszawa and have photos etc it is awesome and sad all at the same time I want an exhibition not just for the informed and experienced but to teach about this history tio schools and hope to enlighten those who teach in our schools about WW2!! Please help as I do not have much time but there is so much work. I hope to write to the local press and TV, Radio nearer the time . The Yorkshire Post was particularly helpful and published the article which was posted in September abou the uprising . Bye 4 now Hela. _________________________________________________________________ It's fast, it's easy and it's free. Get MSN Messenger today! |
Re: USSR decree regarding citizenship
Stefan Wisniowski
Roman,
You were right, these were not elections as we understand them in the Western world. However, they did form the basis for claiming that the residents of the Kresy voted to be incorporated in to the USSR and hence become Soviet citizens. However, as you pointed out, these ¡°elections¡± were not an expression of the popular will. Hence the imposition of citizenship was not legal according to international law as stated by Halina (and rather than argue law between non-lawyers at least we are agreed that it was unconscionable and unjust). I appreciate that you can not change your memories. As you pointed out by reference to the ankiety, people can only report their own perceptions of events. I wonder if anyone in the group has any similar memories of a plebiscite on 29-30 October asking ¡°do you want to join the Soviet Union, yes or no?¡±, or better yet, if anybody knows of any documents describing this event? I have not heard about read about it before, just about the 22 October ¡°elections¡±. As for the Polish government, I stand corrected. I thought you were upset from your comments that they abandoned the 400,000 Polish soldiers that surrendered to Germans and that President Moscicki and his Government, by escaping to Rumania on Sept. 17, gave the Soviet Union an excuse they needed to invade Poland to restore order. Perhaps it was still the best thing that could have been done. Regards -- Stefan Wisniowski (moderator) Sydney, Australia |
Re: USSR decree regarding citizenship
romed46
Stefan,
The Winston Dictionary defines the word "elect" to mean " to choose from among the number". Soviet Union was a one party, it is the communist party, state. All decisions and selections of officials were made by the national or local communist party. The selected individuals were presented to the community at a meeting and confirmed by acclamation. To submit a different name was considered to be a contra-revolutionary act and subject to a severe punishment.I believe that you and the others consider Soviet arranged acclamation meetings to be elections. I do not. As you suggested I have read the article on Jean Iwanski's website. I see that it was prepared by a British writer and is unsigned.He refers to Lwow as Lemberg, and he never heard the term "Western Ukraine" and thinks that even local population doesn't know it. I don't think it is a credible document. In the fall of 1939 I was a first year student at the Lwow Polytechnic, with my home town being the town of Stryj (population 32,000) and 60 km south of Lwow, I commuted betwen the two and witnessed the events as they occured.I can not change my memory and the knowledge of the events because some unknown British writer, years after the events occured, wrote a misleading story. No, Stefan, I am not upset that the Polish government fled Warsaw, I simply asked a hypothetical question.I still ponder what would have happened,where would I be living now,where would you be living, etc, etc. Roman Skulski West Vancouver, Canada --- In Kresy-Siberia@..., Stefan Wisniowski <swisniowski@p...> wrote: Romanabandoned the nation. But it never surrendered and kept fighting in exile,while other nations sued for peace with the Germans and even set up puppetgovernments. Hard to say which is more of an abandonment.so on. power carries out a plebiscite in the occupied territory asking the population onequestion, do they want to join the Soviet Union,? yes or no.? Nov. 1 - 2/39? The Soviet authorities announce the results of the plebiscite statingthat?99 % voted yes, and that the occupied territory is now part of the SovietUnion? something did happen in Lw¨®w on those days, but it does not correspondwith the published histories of the events leading to the USSR?s claimsof legality for annexing eastern Poland and appropriating its citizens. I referyou to the website for a legal?Revolution from Abroad ? The Soviet Conquest of Poland?s Western Ukraine andWestern Belorussia?.extensive research is based in part on the thousands of depositions in theHoover Institution at Stanford by Polish citizens who were there andescaped to Persia as well as on original Soviet sources.to incorporation of these territories into the USSR and hence to the decree of Sovietelections to be held on Sunday 22 October 1939speeches from activists (usually in Russian) and to endorse candidates.People were rounded up to attend these meetings and if they did not they wereclear to the voters, who were subjected to propaganda about the great SovietUnion etc. but never told exactly what they were voting for.selected by soviet authorities. They were generally unknown to the localcommunity, or were imbeciles, thieves, or otherwise highly incompetent. Whenlocal communities protested and wanted to nominate one of their owncandidates they were admonished as not understanding the system, and told thecarefully monitored and the locals were hounded out of their homes to vote.Any who refused were blacklisted and often arrested.on the ballot. Most ballots were ?spoiled?, for example by crossingout that name, writing obscenities about the USSR, smudging the ballot, writing ina new candidate. ?Good ballots? were those for the officialcandidate. In some places the voter was handed a ballot premarked and told not to lookat it before they deposited it in the ballot box.support for the official candidate. As the electorate generally cast a smallnumber of ?good? ballots (one report said 3%) there were a number ofways of getting the desired result. Some officials counted all ballots as?good? no matter what they said. Other destroyed the ?bad? ballots andsubstituted them with new ones. In any case, they all ended up reporting ?good?votes in the 90%?s as required by the election authorities. The published results were:(or 93%); "Western White Ruthenia: ?2,763,191 / 2,672,280 (or 97%).eastern Poland of about 1/3 Poles, 1/3 Ukrainians and 1/3 split betweenAssemblies were made up as follows: Western Ukraine (1389 Ukrainians, 61 Jews, 44Poles and 8 Russians) and Western Belorussia (659 Belorussians, 105 Poles, 75Jews and 58 Russians).to endorse the new system of government, incorporation into the USSR,and large industry. The sessions were marked by readings of socialistwritings, poems to Stalin and so on. In the Lw¨®w assembly in Lw¨®w, delegateswere seated between NKVD officers to ensure they voted correctly. The one ortwo who did not were later arrested.incorporation with the USSR before the Supreme Soviet (approved 1 November 1939) andthen to Kiev and Minsk respectively for amalgamation with the Ukrainian SSRand numbered so that the authorities could tell who voted which way. Asa result, many were blacklisted and often arrested.leading to incorporation into the USSR was legal and fair? Any questions?home town there was no duress. You also refer to rigged "elections", and ifmy memory serves meone Russian, one Ukrainian and one Jew as candidates. Could you tell mewhere and when the elections were held and for what position or office the |
Re: Enigma Code Breakers
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýThanks!
|
Re: USSR decree regarding citizenship
romed46
-Barbara,
I have read the ankiety that you have suggested and in my opinion the people making these depositions confused ellections with acclamation meetings. Bronislaw Kanas mentions "Sel-Rad", it is an acronym for the Ukrainian " Selo Rada" or a Village Soviet. Soviet authorities used to present three individuals, chairman, secretary and political officer of a village soviet and asked inhabitants for acclamation. In the ankiety one person states that elections took place at night, another that the people blindly went to the voting box and completed all the demands, another states that out of 130 votes only 12 were valid, another states that his parents told him that cards were distributed and the people were required to sign and return them,another one states that that elections were for the parliament (sejm).They were all residents of Warszawka. There are some errors in translation, like translating Polish word "agitacja" to an English word "uprising". Regards, Roman -- In Kresy-Siberia@..., "Barb Kwietniowski" <barbkwie@e...> wrote: "> You also refer to rigged "elections", and if my memory serves mepresentedright,someone else mentioned elections where the Russians whatone Russian, one Ukrainian and one Jew as candidates. translations.position or office the candidates ran. I have not heard about itRoman, They talk about the events after September 1939 and before February1940.
|