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I recently acquired an HP8643A.? It *SEEMS* to work ok, although admittedly I have not used it very much yet.?
On initial power on, it displays? --- Calibrating --- for a very long time… perhaps 3 minutes or so.? When the --- Calibrating --- finally goes away, it displays Hardware Failure 14 and Calibration Error 2, along with the Result Code 14.020122 *WITHOUT* a plus or minus sign in front of it.? According to the service data, a result code without a sign in front of it indicates a calibration error and require additional action to return the instrument to working condition.? I haven’t found anything on either the Hardware Failure 14 or the Calibration Error 2 in the manual yet.?
I have checked the P/S voltages and all are in tolerance and the max ripple I see is about 20 mV, although I have not seen a spec in the book for ripple.? There is *SOMETIMES* a P/S fail LED lit on the I/O board, but it always goes away.? Obvious this is suspicious, but I don’t know if it means anything or not.
I pulled the I/O board and looked down at the P/S boards and I don’t see any leaky or swollen caps.?
The Serial Number is 3512A01553 and the device has Options H02 and K01 installed.?
Any advice would be appreciated.? I spent some time getting my HP8924C’s up and running recently, so I’m not afraid to get in up to my elbows, but sure would appreciate some direction.
Mike – WM4B
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On 8/27/19 8:14 PM, Mike Besemer wrote: I recently acquired an HP8643A.? It **SEEMS** to work ok,
althoughadmittedlyI have not used it very much yet.?
On initial power on, it displays? --- Calibrating --- for a very long
time… perhaps 3 minutes or so.? When the --- Calibrating --- finally
goes away, it displays Hardware Failure 14 and Calibration Error 2,
along with theResult Code 14.020122*WITHOUT* a plus or minus sign in
front of it.?According to the service data, a result code without a sign
in front of it indicates a calibration errorand require additional
action to return the instrument to working condition.?I haven’t found
anything on either the Hardware Failure 14 or the Calibration Error 2 in
the manual yet.?
I have checked the P/S voltages and all are in tolerance and the max
ripple I see is about 20 mV, although I have not seen a spec in the book
for ripple.?There is **SOMETIMES**a P/S fail LED lit on the I/O board,
but it always goes away.? Obvious this is suspicious, but I don’t know
if it means anything or not.
I pulled the I/O board and looked down at the P/S boards and I don’t see
any leaky or swollen caps.?
The Serial Number is 3512A01553 and the device has Options H02 and K01
installed.?
Any advice would be appreciated.?I spent some time getting my HP8924C’s
up and running recently, so I’m not afraid to get in up to my elbows,
but sure would appreciate some direction. For that PS Fail LED, my money is on a tantalum capacitor trying to short. I'd look around for that and then see if the error code goes away. This family of signal generators performs extensive self-tests; it's easily possible that one of the power rails isn't quite right at startup (i.e., when those tests are run) and then straightens up later on. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
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Thanks Dave... that makes good sense and I was already thinking about the
tantalums.
I suspect there are many, many potential suspects, but hopefully with an ESR
meter and possibly a thermal imager I can find something. Or, I could just
fire the capacitor shotgun at it and hope for the best.
FWIW, it looks like one of the electrolytics on one of the P/S boards was
not original.
I guess I need to order the CLIP.
73,
Mike
WM4B
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-----Original Message----- From: [email protected][mailto: [email protected]] On Behalf Of Dave McGuire Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2019 8:26 PM To: [email protected]Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] HP8643A Displays Result Code 14.020122 On 8/27/19 8:14 PM, Mike Besemer wrote: I recently acquired an HP8643A.? It **SEEMS** to work ok,
althoughadmittedlyI have not used it very much yet.?
On initial power on, it displays? --- Calibrating --- for a very long
time… perhaps 3 minutes or so.? When the --- Calibrating --- finally
goes away, it displays Hardware Failure 14 and Calibration Error 2,
along with theResult Code 14.020122*WITHOUT* a plus or minus sign in
front of it.?According to the service data, a result code without a sign
in front of it indicates a calibration errorand require additional
action to return the instrument to working condition.?I haven’t found
anything on either the Hardware Failure 14 or the Calibration Error 2 in
the manual yet.?
I have checked the P/S voltages and all are in tolerance and the max
ripple I see is about 20 mV, although I have not seen a spec in the book
for ripple.?There is **SOMETIMES**a P/S fail LED lit on the I/O board,
but it always goes away.? Obvious this is suspicious, but I don’t know
if it means anything or not.
I pulled the I/O board and looked down at the P/S boards and I don’t see
any leaky or swollen caps.?
The Serial Number is 3512A01553 and the device has Options H02 and K01
installed.?
Any advice would be appreciated.?I spent some time getting my HP8924C’s
up and running recently, so I’m not afraid to get in up to my elbows,
but sure would appreciate some direction. For that PS Fail LED, my money is on a tantalum capacitor trying to short. I'd look around for that and then see if the error code goes away. This family of signal generators performs extensive self-tests; it's easily possible that one of the power rails isn't quite right at startup (i.e., when those tests are run) and then straightens up later on. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
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If you can get the boards to a visible configuration, the thermal
imager might be your best bet. I find about-to-blow-up Ta capacitors
with one all the time. Very handy!
-Dave
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Show quoted text
On 8/27/19 9:19 PM, Mike Besemer wrote: Thanks Dave... that makes good sense and I was already thinking about the
tantalums.
I suspect there are many, many potential suspects, but hopefully with an ESR
meter and possibly a thermal imager I can find something. Or, I could just
fire the capacitor shotgun at it and hope for the best.
FWIW, it looks like one of the electrolytics on one of the P/S boards was
not original.
I guess I need to order the CLIP.
73,
Mike
WM4B
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Dave McGuire
Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2019 8:26 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] HP8643A Displays Result Code
14.020122
On 8/27/19 8:14 PM, Mike Besemer wrote:
I recently acquired an HP8643A.? It **SEEMS** to work ok,
althoughadmittedlyI have not used it very much yet.?
On initial power on, it displays? --- Calibrating --- for a very long
time… perhaps 3 minutes or so.? When the --- Calibrating --- finally
goes away, it displays Hardware Failure 14 and Calibration Error 2,
along with theResult Code 14.020122*WITHOUT* a plus or minus sign in
front of it.?According to the service data, a result code without a sign
in front of it indicates a calibration errorand require additional
action to return the instrument to working condition.?I haven’t found
anything on either the Hardware Failure 14 or the Calibration Error 2 in
the manual yet.?
I have checked the P/S voltages and all are in tolerance and the max
ripple I see is about 20 mV, although I have not seen a spec in the book
for ripple.?There is **SOMETIMES**a P/S fail LED lit on the I/O board,
but it always goes away.? Obvious this is suspicious, but I don’t know
if it means anything or not.
I pulled the I/O board and looked down at the P/S boards and I don’t see
any leaky or swollen caps.?
The Serial Number is 3512A01553 and the device has Options H02 and K01
installed.?
Any advice would be appreciated.?I spent some time getting my HP8924C’s
up and running recently, so I’m not afraid to get in up to my elbows,
but sure would appreciate some direction. For that PS Fail LED, my money is on a tantalum capacitor trying to
short. I'd look around for that and then see if the error code goes
away. This family of signal generators performs extensive self-tests;
it's easily possible that one of the power rails isn't quite right at
startup (i.e., when those tests are run) and then straightens up later on.
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
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My 8643A showed?14.020.116, which I deciphered to “5.2V rail out of spec”. Turned out it was at 4.9V, and indeed out of spec. Recapping the PSU fixed it all up. Note that I looked for ripple and found none.
Siggi
On Tue, Aug 27, 2019 at 20:20 Mike Besemer < mwbesemer@...> wrote:
I recently acquired an HP8643A.? It *SEEMS* to work ok, although admittedly I have not used it very much yet.?
On initial power on, it displays? --- Calibrating --- for a very long time… perhaps 3 minutes or so.? When the --- Calibrating --- finally goes away, it displays Hardware Failure 14 and Calibration Error 2, along with the Result Code 14.020122 *WITHOUT* a plus or minus sign in front of it.? According to the service data, a result code without a sign in front of it indicates a calibration error and require additional action to return the instrument to working condition.? I haven’t found anything on either the Hardware Failure 14 or the Calibration Error 2 in the manual yet.?
I have checked the P/S voltages and all are in tolerance and the max ripple I see is about 20 mV, although I have not seen a spec in the book for ripple.? There is *SOMETIMES* a P/S fail LED lit on the I/O board, but it always goes away.? Obvious this is suspicious, but I don’t know if it means anything or not.
I pulled the I/O board and looked down at the P/S boards and I don’t see any leaky or swollen caps.?
The Serial Number is 3512A01553 and the device has Options H02 and K01 installed.?
Any advice would be appreciated.? I spent some time getting my HP8924C’s up and running recently, so I’m not afraid to get in up to my elbows, but sure would appreciate some direction.
Mike – WM4B
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Dear Mike,
I’ve had that one.
It may be as benign as the back-up battery needs replacing.
When I first bought mine, which had not been used for at least some months, I would get this eror.
Then I found, after running it for some hours, I could switch off and then switch on a few days later and it would revert to previous settings, without going through the Calibrating….. or producing an error.
It has settled down to going through calibration, but no error, if it is not used for more than a week.
Of course it is quite possible that there is a capacitor fault, but, for now, I am building up the enthusiasm for the weight lifting required to get the generator out of the rack, so that I can replace the back-up battery.
Regards,
Alwyn
_____________________________________________________
Alwyn Seeds, Director
SynOptika Ltd.,
114 Beaufort Street,
London,
SW3 6BU,
England.
Tel.: +44 (0) 20 7376 4110
SynOptika Ltd., Registered in England and Wales: No. 04606737
Registered Office: 114 Beaufort Street, London, SW3 6BU, United Kingdom. _____________________________________________________
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Thank you, Alwyn.? The backup battery has also entered my mind.? Where is it located?
73,
Mike
WM4B
On August 28, 2019 at 4:07 AM "alwyn.seeds1" <a.seeds@...> wrote:
Dear Mike,
I’ve had that one.
It may be as benign as the back-up battery needs replacing.
When I first bought mine, which had not been used for at least some months, I would get this eror.
Then I found, after running it for some hours, I could switch off and then switch on a few days later and it would revert to previous settings, without going through the Calibrating….. or producing an error.
It has settled down to going through calibration, but no error, if it is not used for more than a week.
Of course it is quite possible that there is a capacitor fault, but, for now, I am building up the enthusiasm for the weight lifting required to get the generator out of the rack, so that I can replace the back-up battery.
Regards,
Alwyn
_____________________________________________________
Alwyn Seeds, Director
SynOptika Ltd.,
114 Beaufort Street,
London,
SW3 6BU,
England.
Tel.: +44 (0) 20 7376 4110
SynOptika Ltd., Registered in England and Wales: No. 04606737
Registered Office: 114 Beaufort Street, London, SW3 6BU, United Kingdom. _____________________________________________________
?
?
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On Wed, Aug 28, 2019 at 7:04 AM Mike Besemer < mwbesemer@...> wrote:
Thank you, Alwyn.? The backup battery has also entered my mind.? Where is it located?
The battery is a 3 cell NiCad on the processor board. If the battery's bad, the generator will self-calibrate on every power on. It's not the cause of the self-test failures.
I have the Artekmedia CLIP and service manual. On page 2c-63 of the service manual it lists the power supply error codes and the limits for the power supplies. According table 2c-26, 14,02n,nnn codes relate to the +5.2V power supply. The limits as measured by a DVM are 5.048-5.352V.?I found the 14,02 code accurate, as my 5.2V was at 4.9V when I measured it (at the IO board).?
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Thanks, but been there, done that.? That info is also in the Assembly Level Repair Guide.?
I ordered the CLIP this morning, but I can't download it at work or on my phone. That being said, the Hardware Failure 14 *IS* a P/S code; I found that info in the firmware manual.? I'll have to investigate further, but I'm going to change the damn battery first so it doesn't take 5 minutes to power it on.
Mike
WM4B
On August 28, 2019 at 11:36 AM Siggi <siggi@...> wrote:
On Wed, Aug 28, 2019 at 7:04 AM Mike Besemer < mwbesemer@...> wrote: Thank you, Alwyn.? The backup battery has also entered my mind.? Where is it located?
The battery is a 3 cell NiCad on the processor board. If the battery's bad, the generator will self-calibrate on every power on. It's not the cause of the self-test failures.
I have the Artekmedia CLIP and service manual. On page 2c-63 of the service manual it lists the power supply error codes and the limits for the power supplies. According table 2c-26, 14,02n,nnn codes relate to the +5.2V power supply. The limits as measured by a DVM are 5.048-5.352V.?I found the 14,02 code accurate, as my 5.2V was at 4.9V when I measured it (at the IO board).?
?
?
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I ordered the CLIP file today and got the download link, but I can NOT get it downloaded properly.? I’ve tried with 4 different browsers, two different computers, and my phone.? Each time the file is a different size and will not open with Adobe.? Got an email in to Artek; either the file got corrupted or their server is timing out. ? Had a 3.6 volt battery laying around so I swapped it in… that took care of the 5-minute ---CALIBRATING--- message.? Now it’s throwing random hardware failure codes with 14 (p/s) being common each time.? Rechecked the power supply with a plotter and the 5.2 VDC is low on startup and climbs slowly toward the lower acceptable limit.? Need to get the CLIP downloaded to troubleshoot further.? Have an order placed for a proper backup battery. ? Mike WM4B ?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Siggi
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2019 11:36 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] HP8643A Displays Result Code 14.020122 ? On Wed, Aug 28, 2019 at 7:04 AM Mike Besemer <mwbesemer@...> wrote: Thank you, Alwyn.? The backup battery has also entered my mind.? Where is it located?
The battery is a 3 cell NiCad on the processor board. If the battery's bad, the generator will self-calibrate on every power on. It's not the cause of the self-test failures. I have the Artekmedia CLIP and service manual. On page 2c-63 of the service manual it lists the power supply error codes and the limits for the power supplies. According table 2c-26, 14,02n,nnn codes relate to the +5.2V power supply. The limits as measured by a DVM are 5.048-5.352V.?I found the 14,02 code accurate, as my 5.2V was at 4.9V when I measured it (at the IO board).?
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On Wed, Aug 28, 2019 at 6:27 PM Mike Besemer < mwbesemer@...> wrote: Now it’s throwing random hardware failure codes with 14 (p/s) being common each time.? Rechecked the power supply with a plotter and the 5.2 VDC is low on startup and climbs slowly toward the lower acceptable limit.? Need to get the CLIP downloaded to troubleshoot further.
Sadly the CLIP is not going to help you with the power supply, when you crack'er open you'll find two COTS switchers in there. One powers the oven for the high-stability oscillator and the soft power on, the other one powers the rest of the instrument, and the CLIP has schematics for neither one. Thankfully I found that a full recap just fixed it(TM) in mine. I don't remember how hard it was to get at the PSU, but you might try just tacking a new cap over the 5.2V smoothing cap for a quick and dirty diagnosis.
I just went looking for photos, and it looks like the PSU drops out the bottom of the instrument. There's a "filter" board downstream from the PSU, and it's chock-a-block with inductors and smoothing caps, which is probably why no ripple shows at the IO board even when the PSU caps are gonsky.
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Greetings,
?
????
This result code seems to be a common one for the 8643a.?
????
As has been pointed out, the PS is a conglomeration of COTS units, but the CLIP
does have the interconnects.
???
? ?????Back
in May of 2016 the 14.020122 annoyance advanced to the point where my 8643a generator
became VERY flaky.?
????
It would loose PL, and simply not run reliably. The top cover was removed and
the voltages measured.?
? ???The
-5 was previously -4.83, but now had dropped to -4.41. ?Bootstrapping a
bench supply proved that
????
restoring -5 would make the RF reliable again.
?
????
The power supplies were removed and setup for testing on the bench.
????
The clear suspect was the black brick DC to DC that took in +24 and generates
the -5.
????
This is on the leftmost board that filters the outputs of the two main
switchers.?
?????
It was powered up with a +24 V bench supply, loaded with 30 ohms, and produced
5.22 volts.?
????
The entire supply was then AC powered up, and no obvious problem could be
found.
????
The instrument was partially re-assembled,
and the -5 NOW is -5.18 under load.
?
????
?Go figure.? PS self test now passes and instrument powers up without
the painful “calibration” cycle.
?
???
??My best guess is it was ?a contact problem given all the
connectors and the removal and reinsertion cleared the fault. ???
?
????
?As of August 2019 .... it is still working fine. ?No component
changes.
????
HTH as they say
.....
?
Dick
Sent from?a Logic Free?Asylum
deep within The?Sanctuary State?of California using?my phoneI.
Bibimus Ergo Sumus, En Vino Veritas, Quaerite et Invenietis, Illegitimi non Carborundum
?
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Mike Besemer - WM4B
Dave McGuire
Dick Benson