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Hi Gary, I've been thoroughly enjoying being a part of this forum since its inception, and I've wanted to touch base with you -- but it's probably a good idea that I email you off-list, so we can discuss important topics like beer, and our guitars.... But here, "publicly", I wanted to state (as many others have already) how really cool it is to have your regular input on this forum! Definitely expands on our understanding of the materials presented in "Disappearance". I'm currently about 80 percent along in the book, and I actually find myself holding off from finishing it -- it's like I don't want it to be "over"! Of course, I can always go back and read it again.... (Wouldn't it be great if there was some way I could actually forget I had read it, and then experience it again, as if anew..? Wow; to do something over and over, not remembering you did it before.... What a concept!!) I imagine you and I are about the same age; I certainly remember Carnation Instant Breakfast, and in fact, I remember seeing it on the shelves of our old local A&P market! My A&P memories go back to the days when there was an actual wooden pickle barrel, with the tongs connected to a chain, so you could reach in and select your own pickles... I was always fascinated by that when I was a little kid. So *many* things to chat about with you -- but we can save those for future discussions. I note with interest your upcoming workshops in New York (where I'm originally from) and in New England (where my wife is from). Sorry I won't be able to make them! Any plans for "appearances" here in South Florida? My original connection with ACIM (a little over ten years ago) was through my participations with a wonderful organization called The Palm Beach Center For Living. There is also a Science of Mind, right down the street from where we now live! So there's no shortage of venues in this area that would welcome your workshops... (And I'm sure we could arrange accommodations here at the Bogart Inn -- where you'd also have access to our extensive guitar collection... :^) At any rate, your work has certainly brightened the Light of Joy and Peace for so many of us; so "thank you", and I'll look forward to further conversations! Love, Bliss, and Mirth, Gene

"I can escape from the world I see by giving up attack thoughts." (W-23) This is taken from Ken Wapnicks commentaries on the Workbook Lessons. (Volume 1...Tape 3.) Ossie had mentioned that in Ken's workshop in Atlanta last week, Ken went over this lesson, and she found it so meaningful, so I thought that I would go over it also, and I would like to share it. So from the next paragraph and on, it is Ken, and the lesson. I will break it down into sections to make it easier to read. I hope you get as much out of it as I did. Peace Martha :-) "I can escape from the world I see by giving up attack thoughts." Ken: Okay - now lets do lesson 23 which I mentioned before is an extremely important lesson. It is one of the clearest statements in all the material, about what the world is like and what salvation is, and therefore what salvation is not. What is valuable about this lesson again, is that it's written in very simple language. So - it is even more difficult to mistake what it is saying. It is not saying people won't mistake what it is saying, but it is very clear. (W-23.1.) "The idea for today contains the only way out of fear that will ever succeed." Ken: The title itself is a blockbuster. The world that we see is a world of death - a world of vengeance. It might also be a world of pleasure and happiness. But no pleasure or happiness in this world lasts. Which means, that when it begins to fade, then our anxiety grows - our anger grows. Our specialness feels unfulfilled, etc. And the way to escape from all the pain we experience in the world, is not by changing the world but by changing how we look on the world. "Nothing else will work; everything else is meaningless. But this way cannot fail." Ken: You don't deal with fear by overcoming it in a direct way or by changing anything of the world or the body. You could only escape from fear, by changing the cause of fear. Which is your decision to be separate. "Every thought you have makes up some segment of the world you see. It is with your thoughts, then, that we must work, if your perception of the world is to be changed." Ken: So this is a very clear statement of cause and effect. The cause of everything in the world is our thoughts. And the effect would be everything we experience in the world. So this in another of those statements that he means literally. Every thought you have, makes up some segment of the world you see. It is a point of view of that you must understand from the point of view of the mind. Otherwise you will believe that an individual thought that you (as an individual person have) can have a harmful effect on something external. So you could have an angry thought about somebody, and then something happens to that person and you take this lesson (misunderstand it to mean, I am responsible for what happens.) Thoughts occur in the mind, not the brain. What we identify as our thoughts, are thoughts in the brain. What he is talking about here, and I will get back to this later on in this lesson, is on the level of the mind. Remember the mind is outside of time and space. The entire world of time and space is coming from one thought. Once we believe that we are here, then everything seems to be very real and governed by laws that we have established. And these laws will always be some expression of cause and effect. I do something - somebody else does something back, and this is the effect. I drink poison and then my body has an effect. And maybe gets very very sick and dies - but that is not the cause. But the seeming cause of taking the poison and the seeming effect of my body getting sick and dying are both effects of a larger cause which is a thought that says: "I am going to prove that separation is real and that the body is real, and that sin does have an effect." Now - none of this is explained here - it is explained more in the Text. It is reflected here. At this point Jesus is not expecting his students to have a thorough understanding of the Text. What he is really asking here, that you begin practicing the exercises which will eventually lead yo

"I can escape from the world I see by giving up attack thoughts." (W-23) This is taken from Ken Wapnicks commentaries on the Workbook Lessons. (Volume 1...Tape 3.) continuing from paragraph 4. "The world you see is a vengeful world, and everything in it is a symbol of vengeance." Ken: These are very strong statements. And they are as uncompromising as anything that you will find in the Text. Everything in this world is a symbol of vengeance. Why? Because if you believe there is a world, and there is something in the world, then your saying that God no longer exists. And if God no longer exists, its because I killed him and now I believe He is justified in taking vengeance on me. And I block out that whole horrendous thought, project it out. And I believe in the world that will seek its vengeance on me. "Each of your perceptions of "external reality" (and obviously "external reality" is put in quotes, because there is no reality outside.) "is a pictorial representation..." Ken: Which is a fancy way of saying "projection." "of your own attack thoughts." Ken: This is the same idea that he says early in the Text: "that all thinking produces form on some level." It's the same idea as we saw that "every thought you have, makes up some segment of the world you see." And this thinking - and he is only talking about in the ego thought system... this thinking would always be, some aspect of attack. "One can well ask if this can be called seeing. Is not fantasy a better word for such a process, and hallucination a more appropriate term for the result?" Ken: Fantasy is of course a psychological term for thoughts that are not real. And they are thoughts that give you what you want. So if you really want to defend against your guilt then you have fantasies of pleasure. Of getting what you want. Well everything in this world comes from a fantasy thought. The world is giving me what I want. Basically its giving me a haven so that I could hide from God. "You see the world that you have made, but you do not see yourself as the image maker." Ken: That is what denial is. That is exactly what he discussed in lesson 136 - on sickness. That we make up the sickness and then forget that we made it up. And its another way of saying that we are the dreamer of the dream, but we have forgotten that we are the dreamer, and believe the dream is dreaming us. "You cannot be saved from the world, but you can escape from its cause." Ken: Ultimately you can't be saved from the world, because there is no world. What you are saved from, is your belief system that tells you there is a world. And the belief system is always predicated on the belief that "I" have killed off God, so that I could exist in His place. "This is what salvation means, for where is the world you see when its cause is gone?" Ken: So - when your in the real world, your literally outside the dream. You are no longer identified with being separate from God. You are identified completely with the Holy Spirit's love. At that time, the world doesn't exist for you any more. You may appear to be in the world the way Jesus did, but your reality is outside of the world. You are outside of the dream. Therefore, for you - the world has disappeared. "Vision already holds a replacement for everything you think you see now." Ken: Vision, of course would be the Course's term for right-minded perception, or for identifying with the Holy Spirit's Thought system of Atonement. "Loveliness can light your images, and so transform them that you will love them, even though they were made of hate." Ken: This is a reference back to lesson 15. "My thoughts are images I have made." Which talked about the little sparks of light that creep up around objects. And I explained, that was not to be taken literally. It was originally meant for a friend of Helen and Bill's. But you should understand it, in terms of its content. Which means, you learn to see things differently. And that "seeing" is what light represents. And this is even clearer. "Loveliness can light your images." So everything in the world now becomes lov

Hey Gene. Sure, I'd love to appear in South Florida. How about all winter? (LOL) You should have been in Maine in January. Yikes! (Another forgiveness lesson.) Really appreciated your posting, although I haven't gotten that e-mail with your address yet. My e- mail is garyrrenard@... I'm hearing that most people who have the book read it twice. I think that's good. It's like when I enjoy a movie and watch it for a second time I always notice something I didn't notice the first time. Plus you absorb the whole thing more. As far as beer goes, thanks to the Course, I no longer believe that I can escape from the world I see by drinking Coors light. I have to admit however, that I still, albeit rarely, have a few. For you women in the group; it's a guy thing. I still play my guitar in private, but haven't in public for about 13 years. (Time flies when you're going crazy.) I still like to play but as far as performing goes, it's like "been there, done that." I played for a living for twenty years and I had enough by the end. One thing I don't miss is everybody else's smoke rising up to the stage! But I regress. It *was* fun. I've been from Key West up to Palm Beach and it's great in the winter. Hope to see you there sometime, whether I do a workshop or not, but hopefully I will. Enough rambling for now. I now realize I should have done this as an e-mail but hey, did I know that when I started it? Love and peace, Gary.

Larry, thanks so much for your encouraging remarks about the book. I agree with you entirely in your observations about Ken and some of the criticisms of "Disappearance." And as you say, forgiveness is the only valid response. I'd love to receive a copy of your book. I can't see your entire e-mail address on the posting and I don't have a list of the group addresses because I'm not the founder or moderator or anything. Try sending me an e-mail so I can send you my home mailing address for the book. The first part of my e-mail address is GaryRRenard and the second half of it is @Yahoo.com See if that shows O.K. in the posting. (Hee-Hee) (Also, you can click on my Yahoo profile and it has my e-mail address.) If I'm ever going to do a workshop or speak in your neck of the woods I'll try to let you know. Also, my schedule will be posted both here and at the Fearless Books Website from time to time. I'm not doing that many appearances right now, but the Holy Spirit will let me know if I should. Will I ever appear in Texas? Well, as Swami Baba Gee-Whiz once said to me, "If you have to ask, then you don't know." Love and peace, Gary.

Quantum physics does explain to the intellect that non-dualism is a fact at the sub-atomic level. The event and the observer are inter- connected into one. The intellect will only carry us so far toward Oneness realization. Constant practice of the teachings will dissolve the egoic mind and the dream it projects. It's a long journey indeed. In Chaos theory, a small disturbance in a large and seemingly random system can eventually bring out a profound impact on the overall system. Once we choose the direction toward God, the awakening is imminent. It may take many lifetimes. But time is also an illusion……

Hi Gary, What a book!!! Having been a Course student and facillitator for a number of years, and author of the book, "Where Does It Say?---A Basic Index for a Course in Miracles," (plug!) and a devoted attendee at 2 or 3 of Ken Wapnick's Roscoe, NY seminars, I want to say "BRAVO!" to you for your most inspiring book! I often wonder that if those who criticize Ken Wapnick could only meet him in person, would change their minds about him. Your "Disappearance" book criticisms that you receive may be a backhanded way of striking out at him, and if so, I'm sure he'll quickly forgive as you so aptly do also. I would like to send you a copy of my book, so if you would send your mailing address I'll mail you one by return post. It may help you in your own studies. I live in Big Sandy TX, about 90 miles east of Dallas, out in the East Texas Piney Woods. Originally from Nashville, TN, Ken would remember me as his "rebel brother." I would like to attend any meetings you may put on within 100 or so miles of my home. However, again, I will travel to see you anywhere I can, so a schedule of your dates would be greatly appreciated. (Later) OOPS! I just (today!) discovered your discussion group on Yahoo! so will also post this (abbreviated) email there now. . . Hurray, Jon Mundy is a former dealer of my book, and a wonderful "Swami" from the last reunion I attended at MDC, Anaheim, CA a couple of years ago. Again, I am so grateful for your book...WE'RE GONNA MAKE IT FOR SURE! Love & Best Wishes, Larry Goodman

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Back from my Course in Miracles retreat and this song once again came up for me. I call this the "The Prodigal Son's Lament." In my mind, I am before the Father sharing why I left his Love, what I have learned in my journeys and I that I want to come Home. I do hope this song speaks to the "prodigal child" in each of us ... remembering that God Loves you and me. Peace Where to Do Broken Hearts Go? http://www.daretosing.com/CuteBlackBW

"I can escape from the world I see by giving up attack thoughts." (W-23) This is taken from Ken Wapnicks commentaries on the Workbook Lessons. (Volume 1...Tape 3.) continuing from paragraph 5, and on. Ken: Paragraph five, is where I had originally derived the three steps of forgiveness, that I used to teach a lot. (W-23.5.) "The idea for today introduces the thought that you are not trapped in the world you see, because its cause can be changed. This change requires, first, that the cause be identified" Ken: In other words - the problem is not what is outside in the world. The reason I am upset is not because of what my body is doing, or not doing. Or what someone else's body is doing or not doing to me. The cause of my upset is a decision I have made in my mind. That is the first step. And then - there is the second step ..."Let go." What letting go means, I now ask Jesus or the Holy Spirit for help - that I look at my guilt differently. The cause of the world and my attack thoughts (another way to say my guilt) and I realize that just as my attack on you, was a projection (it was made up) so was my attack on myself made up too. That I remain as God created me. Nothing has changed who I am. So - letting go, means I let go of the guilt and my attack thoughts, with the love of Jesus next to me. And the third step: "and then let go, so that it can be replaced." Ken: At the moment that I ask Jesus for help and I look at my guilt and my attack thoughts with his love next to me, then in that instant he shines on the guilt, and it is gone. My job is to bring the guilt to him. First the guilt I have projected on to you. I bring that inside in my mind, and then the guilt that is in my mind, I bring to him. Which is - what looking means -and the moment I do that, it is gone. Because I have accepted the love and light that was always present.. "The first two steps in this process require your cooperation. The final one does not." Ken: Our job is simply (which is what a little willingness reflects) - our job is to bring to him all our ego thoughts...the ego thoughts we have projected out and made up about the world. And the ego thoughts we have made up about ourselves. "Your images have already been replaced." Ken: So the line I quoted earlier from chapter 28, "The world was over long ago." That everything that we believe is already gone. We just believe it is here. That is why he refers to it as a hallucination. "By taking the first two steps, you will see that this is so." Ken: So what enables us to realize that the Principle of the Atonement is true, and nothing else is, what enables us to do that - is to change our mind, at what we were so sure that we were right about. That there is world out there that hurts me. Victimizes me. And that is a defense against an inner world, which is even more painful. I was wrong about the world outside, and I am wrong about the world inside. "Besides using it throughout the day as the need arises, five practice periods are required in applying today's idea. As you look about you, repeat the idea slowly to yourself first, and then close your eyes and devote about a minute to searching your mind for as many attack thoughts as occur to you." Ken: I discussed last time, the importance of searching your mind. The reason that we have to search our mind, is because these attack thoughts are hidden. So part of the training that we undergo as students of the Course is to really allow us to see the attack thoughts that are there, but are covered over.... (now skip to the next paragraph.) "In the practice periods, be sure to include both your thoughts of attacking and of being attacked. Their effects are exactly the same because they are exactly the same. Ken:There is no difference between being a victim and being a victimizer. Attack is attack, is attack. " You do not recognize this as yet, and you are asked at this time only to treat them as the same in today's practice periods." Ken: So this is a theme that we find recurring. Where Jesus is making it very clear that he is not expecting us to identify

As this is an open forum, I have a question that has been on my mind? On another forum I was accused of being argumentative and defensive, and it was portrayed to me, as though this was some sort of consistent character flaw on my part. At the time, I didn't really feel like dealing with it, so I just unsubscribed. Now that I am feeling better however, I checked with my family, as they are the most honest with me, of anyone that I can think of. Yesterday I read the offending post of mine to my one son, and he started laughing, and said: "Well, you know mom, you can be quite blunt at times, as your post clearly shows, but the argumenativeness, I just don't see." This has me wondering just how we can tell if how another is telling us of how we are coming across, is the way we are, or is it just their own projections that they don't want to look at? Even if no one answers this, it helps me to sort of put it out there, and not try to bottle it up, inside myself. Thanks Martha

Martha, Thank you for listing Ken's lesson. It's very good. Part of Ken's talk is based on "I can escape from the world I see by giving up attack thoughts." (W-23) I think the reason that I can escape the world I SEE by giving up attack thoughts, is not because attack thoughts are "bad," but because attack thoughts are illusions. Attack thoughts are illusions, because attack is impossible. No one can attack me and I cannot attack anyone else. All the emotional and physical pain that I have ever felt has been caused by my own mind, not by anything anyone else did to me. I have simply given myself an "hypnotic suggestion" that if such and such happens I will feel emotional and/or physical pain. The fact that emotional and physical pain is removed by hypnotic suggestion, shows that the body does not feel anything. It is only the mind that thinks the body feels anything. Therefore, to give up attack thoughts is simply to give up the illusion that attack is possible. No one has ever hurt me and I have never hurt anyone. That is why there is no sin, and why there is no guilt. As the Course says, "All that the ego is, is an idea that it is POSSIBLE that things could happen to the Son of God without his will …. This is the MAD IDEA you have enshrined upon your altars, and which you worship." (T-21.II.6.) This suggests that even my saying to someone, "I forgive you" is the evidence of my misperception. As the Course says, " … no one can forgive a sin that he believes is real." (T-27.II.2.) A more accurate demonstration of "forgiveness" might be the phrase "No problem, nothing to forgive." For example, someone might say to me, "I'm sorry I'm late." True "forgiveness" might be the response, "No problem, nothing to forgive." Since no one outside of me can cause me any pain, no one outside of me can cause me any problems. Therefore, "No problem, nothing to forgive." Bill

Welcome, Karen, Your intentions were of love. You meant no harm. What you are can only be a help to us as the whole world can be. I see no need to forgive as in truth there is nothing to forgive. Please stop thinking you are stupid. You are not. Neither is the man who was upset about what it "appeared that you did". Another opportunity for me to remember that we are all Sons of God. Love, Linda Do you Yahoo!? SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month!

To All Precious Ones growing in Miracles....and a special welcome to Karen, From another list I'm on....this came, and I thought at first that it was this list....it's just what I needed with all the latest postings.... It's from another wonderful resource within our illusions, "The Four Agreements," just a reminder... 1. Be Impeccable With Your Word Speak with integrity. Say only what you mean. Avoid using the word to speak against yourself or to gossip about others. Use the power of your word in the direction of truth and love. 2. Don't Take Anything Personally Nothing others do is because of you. What others say and do is a projection of their own reality, their own dream. When you are immune to the opinions and actions of others; you won't be the victim of needless suffering. 3. Don't Make Assumptions Find the courage to ask questions and to express what you really want. Communicate with others as clearly as you can to avoid misunderstandings, sadness, and drama. With just this one agreement, you can completely transform your life. 4. Always Do Your Best Your best is going to change from moment to moment;it will be different when you are healthy as opposed to sick. Under any circumstance, simply do your best, and you will avoid self-judgment, self-abuse, and regret. Be well and take care of your precious self! Thank you for listening... Sheila Namast: I honor in you the divinity that I honor within myself and I know we are one. From: "nashandfam" <nashandfam@...> Reply-To: Disappearance_of_the_Universe@... To: Disappearance_of_the_Universe@... Subject: [Disappearance_of_the_Universe] Re: Hi. I'm Karen, and I ask to join Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 02:59:38 -0000 Hi again everyone. I just wanted to thank all of you, especially Linda, Martha, Gene, Ossie, Suzanne and of course Gary for welcoming me and making me feel right at home. You people are sweethearts, and the love that shows up all through your postings speaks for itself. Love and Blessings, Karen. _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail

First, thanks Sheila. I see a lot of truth in "The Four Agreements". I'd like to share some CITATIONS from the Course for you newcomers. First, about, "I made you. It is in the Course.": "...What if you recognized this world is an hallucination? What if you really understood you made it up?" (T443) About God making the world and people, not!: "The reality of death if firmly rooted in the belief that God's Son is a body. And if God created bodies, death would indeed be real. But God would not be loving." (M66-67) "The world you see is an illusion of a world. God did not create it, for what He creates must be eternal as Himself." (CL85) About God creating any part of the world, not!: "There is no world! This is the central thought the Course attempts to teach." (W243) About the unseen, unconscious mind controlling bodies, as if they were ROBOTS, but cleverly masking this control through the forces of the universe: "The body appears to be largely self-motivated and independent, yet it actually responds only to the intentions of the mind." (PRxii) About unconscious guilt being the driving force behind this world: "Guilt asks for punishment, and its request is granted. Not in truth, but in the world of shadows and illusions built on sin." (T554) About non-duality. Duality = 2. (This is for you mathematicians out there.) Non-duality = 1, which is non-twoness. Thus oneness means no division. Duality (2) = DIVISION. Thus oneness = NON-DUALITY. Two or more (division) = ego. "The ego is the part of your mind that believes in division. How could a part of God detach itself without believing it is attacking him?" (T84) The solution? "Forgiveness is the central theme that runs throughout salvation, holding all its parts in meaningful relationships, the course it runs directed and its outcome sure." (W324) Love and peace, Gary.

Hi friends. My name is Karen and I'm Gary's wife. I've done something that isn't right and so I wanted to apologize for it and ask to join in posting on this group as a way of possibly working it out. I posted a message, which I said was anyonymous, on another board called trcm, that contained factual information about the popularity of Gary's book. I realize it was wrong to do this, even though what the message said was true and even though it is a habit of many of the people at that group to post using pseudo names. I also posted there around April using my maiden name, without pointing out that I was Gary's wife. D. Patrick Miller of Fearless Books, who is Gary's publisher, was informed by Gary of my latest posting after I told Gary. (I only told him after he asked me about it.) Patrick has told Gary that he will explain the situation to the people at trcm. I thought it was only fair to Gary that I do so here. Gary has never posted using a pseudo name, and I have only done so in the instances just described. Also, as far as I know, Gary has never said anything that wasn't true in any posting, ever. Neither have I, except for the name situation just described. I'm sorry for doing something so stupid. I didn't think that the partly hostile crowd at trcm would believe what I was saying if they knew I was Gary's wife, and I have been too anxious to try to help him. I hope Gary will see this as a call for help (knowing him, he probably will.) And I hope it will be all right with you if I post here from time to time as a way of joining. Love and thanks, Karen.

**One of the things I especially appreciated in reading Gary's book were the historical examples that Pursah and Arten spoke of concerning the various forms of victim/victimiztion scripts that governments from the beginning have been using ... and I was able to apply that to what is happening here in the States. Which is exactly what is happening on this board - there is no order of difficulty in anything which seems to happen. All is a projection of my mind. Thank you for pointing it out to me, all of you. Judy To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Disappearance_of_the_Universe-unsubscribe@... Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

Gary, You mentioned going to Florida in January. Remember Tucson is wonderful in January too, and we'd love having you here. Can you believe I'm brave enough to come out of hiding finally? I'll probably go right back to lurking cause I'm not really a 'chatty' person. Oh well, I forgive me. I've really enjoyed all the messages here on forgiveness. I seem to need constant reminders, from your book, from ACIM, from others. I admire your act of forgiveness in response to one of the comments here. It is obvious, Gary, that you truly practice what you write. Hugh Prather says simply, "Do not take the bait." I'm still learning to take that advice. You already know how much I like your book, but thanks again. God bless, Ann

Jeanette Hi Jeanette. No problem. I went over and checked out your post and it looked to me like you were just trying to point out that this group is thriving, which I appreciate. Everything happens the way it's supposed to. It's all a forgiveness lesson. It's just that sometimes I reserve the right to forgive and not respond! Love and peace, Gary.

Jeanette, quite frankly, I can't believe my perception when I read some of the recent posts that feel really negative to me. I've decided that it's a call for love, and I can forgive and let it go completely. In my field of special education, it's called "ignoring inappropriate behaviour." So instead of giving it ANY more energy on the list, I wanted to write to you specifically, and copy the list. Talk about not being in control! Whew!!! I bless and release you, and all on the list...and all replies that come henceforth to this list... Sheila Namast: I honor in you the divinity that I honor within myself and I know we are one. From: "Jeanette" <jeanettejoy@...> Reply-To: Disappearance_of_the_Universe@... Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 12:40:59 -0400 And within your forgiving attitude, I'll make this my conclusion to the matter, as well, Jeanette _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail

Hi Sheila, In an earlier post, I mentioned: "...if it's something wrong that I really did, I can understand their being mad... but when I've simply been misunderstood, and I have clearly explained the errors in their perception -- and they STILL remain upset with me -- yes, I know it's a wonderful opportunity for me to practice advanced forgiveness, and let it go, and forgive what never happened... And I do! I really do, more and more all the time.... Still, there seems to be a part of me that just wants to know, "why?"... And then, you wrote: What a PERFECT reminder! Thank you, Sheila... ...and to Karen, who said: Hey; it takes some to know some.... Hugs to all, Gene