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I am trying to understand the differences in the color of the lettering on
CPR's fleet of heavyweight and lightweight tuscan cars (not the stainless
steel) passenger cars in the 1950's.

The C-D-S dry transfers define Gold and Imitation Gold lettering, with the
imitation gold being a yellow color, similar to the yellow on the C-D-S dry
transfers for the stainless steel cars. Further, the C-D-S instruction
identify the gold as being used pre 1935 and the imitation gold being used
post 1935. Now I can well understand that heavyweight passenger cars that
were lettered in gold prior to 1935 would have lasted into the 1940's and
even possibly the 1950's but what about the lightweight passenger cars
commonly refered to as the "Grove" cars. Was the lettering on these cars
yellow or gold. From the photo's in John Riddell's "Canadian Pacific Color
Guide ..." it looks like the lettering could be gold.

Or is it that the C-D-S yellow is simply too yellow.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Michael Salfi
Kitchener, Ontario

email: msalfi@...

We are the navvies who work upon the railway,
Swinging our hammers in the bright glazing sun,
Laying down track and building the bridges,
Bending our backs till the railroad is done.

From "The Canadian Railroad Trilogy", by Gordon Lightfoot

C Liners 4064 and 4065 were the Demo units for CLC, 4064 was originally
lettered City of Kingston while in it's demo stage. Unit 4064 was retired
from service in February 16, 1972, and scrapped at Ogden shops.

SAD!

Jeff Semper
Mactier Sub (Burbidge)
Woodbridge, On.

According to Diesel Era 4104 and 4105 were both retired on June 20, 1975.
Unit 4105 was scrapped at Ogden shops (Calgary). I believe that 4104 along
with 4065 were preserved, I know for a fact that 4065 currently sits at the
Museum of Natural Science in Ottawa at the rear of the facility. I took
photos of this unit when I visited the museum late last year, it is in rough
shape, the paint is badly faded and corrosion is most evident. As far as
4104 goes I here that it is in the Ogden shops and may be used for the new
CP excursion passenger train through the rockies.
Can anyone confirm that this is indeed the case or if this unit was actually
preserved?

Jeff Semper
Mactier Sub (Burbidge)
Woodbridge, On.

Hello There!

First time with this group.

Does anybody have any information on the whereabouts of the old CP
unit 4104, a Fairbanks Morse "C" Liner passenger engine? It possibly
was retired in the late 60's, perhaps in Calgary or in the Kootenays
somewhere.

A group of us are looking to find out if it was saved, and where.

Thanks for any help,

TAPMAN

Train 440 is a Toronto Yard bypass train that originates at
Thunder Bay to Wellend on an as-required basis.

Train 441 is a Toronto Yard bypass train that originates at
Wellend and terminates at Winnipeg on an as-required basis.

Ross Harrison

The 4 UP Dash 8 are on CP for testing and evaluation.

All the circulars issued to operating employees state the same.

How CP is paying for them (possibly via HPH) is another matter
entirely.

As far as I know, the plan is now try and put them together, or
restrict them to 481/482 so that downloads can be done to
accurately measure fuel consumption and operating performance.

How well a Dash 8 will perform after nearly 15 years of heavy
service on the UP versus 20-28 year old SD40s remains to be seen.

Ross Harrison

Bill Miller wrote:

From: Bill Miller <bmiller@...>

Whilst reading of caboose marker light meanings, I recalled this
little
joke I saved a few years ......

Some knob writes to a newsgroup:
Are they the RED, White and Blue-green light at the top of the

engine

faceplate?
If they are, I thought they were there for showing seniority

levels.

Response:
Yes. The engineer with the most seniority gets to show green lights.
The next oldest gets to show white lights.
All others have to keep the lights extinguished except for the

youngest

engineer who must display red lights and take the siding for

everybody

else.

Bill

----------------------------------------------------------------------

----------------------------------------------------------------------
C-P-R "Canadian Pacific Railway"

Bill,

How about the CNR conductor walking down the aisle of a passenger coach
being stopped by a lady passenger.

"Oh Conductor, I was just wondering; what do the stars and bars on the
sleeve of your uniform jacket mean?"

"Well, ma am," answered the conductor, "the stars are the number of
times I've been married, and the bars are the number of children I
have."

"Oh, my." exclaimed the lady.

"Why, what's the matter," asked the conductor.

"Well, I couldn't help noticing that you're brakeman is of very loose
morals."

"What on earth makes you say that," asked the conductor.

"Well', answered the lady, "I see he has three children, and he's never
been married.'

Gary

)

From: plawson@...

CP 3005. Is it AC power? Just wondering?

No. GP38AC and similar models are not AC locomotives, they have AC
alternators but power is coverted to DC for DC traction motors.

Yes the 3000-3020 are all AC. 3017 to 3019 are SOO Line and the 3004 is E&N Railfrieght.

Dane

From: plawson@...
Reply-To: C-P-R@...
To: C-P-R@...
Subject: Re: [C-P-R] CP 3005 (ex E&N)
Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 12:08:58 -0800

CP 3005. Is it AC power? Just wondering?

Patrick Lawson

CP GP38AC 3005 out of Ogden overhaul has been relettered Canadian

Pacific

but is still E&N green.

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at

CP 3005. Is it AC power? Just wondering?

Patrick Lawson

Rails North has been updated. Featured this month are CN, CP, DWP, BCR,
and Soo

The following is forwarded to see if there is someone "out there" with
definite knowledge. Please contact Don directly.

Dale Wilson.

From: Donald Forsyth <D.Forsyth@...>
Date: Thursday, March 02, 2000 9:35 AM
Subject: Re: CPR "U" sleepers

I don't know if you would know but maybe you could point me in

the right direction. What I would like to know is, in a "U" sleeper were
the partitions between sections a permanent piece or were they removed
during the day. Reason is I am detailing my Shoreham cars (HO) and want to
be as close as possible to prototype. Any help would be appreciated,
Thanks Don Forsyth. NMRA/PNR/CPSig

________________________________________________________
Dale Wilson <dale.wilson@...>;
Nickel Belt Rails, Box 483, Station "B", Sudbury, ON, P3E 4P6
24 Hour Fax (705) 674-4049
Visit the Algoma Eastern Railway Heritage Group's Web Site:

________________________________________________________

I saw 3005 just a while back in Vancouver and it didn't look at all in need of paint. The things look better than the 1 year old AC4400CWs.

Dane

From: PBowers <57era@...>
Reply-To: C-P-R@...
To: C-P-R@...
Subject: Re: [C-P-R] CP 3005 (ex E&N)
Date: Sun, 05 Mar 2000 12:17:54

New green or just patched green? New Canadian Pacific lettering? Inquiring
minds want to know!!

pb

At 07:29 AM 3/5/00 -0500, you wrote:

From: Bill Miller <bmiller@...>

CP GP38AC 3005 out of Ogden overhaul has been relettered Canadian Pacific
but is still E&N green.


Bill


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Peter Bowers To Reply: click on
Owen Sound, Ont. Canada mailto:ve3gwx@...

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--- Steve Bradley <cdnrail@...> wrote:

From: Steve Bradley <cdnrail@...>

CN now comes into Lambton off the CN Weston Sub. 577 is actually handling
traffic from CN's former KO10 ( the Leaside Job) out of Mac Yard.
As CN is no longer using the Leaside Spur , no CN/CP interchanges are made at
Leaside. It is all now done at Lambton.

Where does CN connect with Leaside? Is it via the connceting track down
through the Don Valley and into the TTR?

Never in my life have I seen a train cross that viaduct that crosses the
Bayview/Bloor ramp, the CN Bala Sub and Bayview Avenue near the old Toronto
Brick works.

CB

=====
________________________________________________________________________
Christian Base
Richmond Hill ON Canada
MP 18.7, CN Bala Sub
Owner:
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger.

Message text written by P. Bowers

New green or just patched green? New Canadian Pacific lettering?

Inquiring
minds want to know!!
<

They only removed the decal that had E&N Railfreight and applied the new
lettering. Nothing was done to the paint.

Gordon Webster
Columbus, Ohio, USeh
gordon67@...

Through the entire vicinity that's usually referred to
as Bayview (The CP Hamilton sub and the trackage
rights on CN's Oakville sub) there are many CP trains
through the primarily CN area...

441 To Toronto Via Oakville sub
521 " "
523 " "
525 " "
557 " "
733 " "
735 " "
911 Northbound via Hamilton sub
440 Southbound via Hamilton sub
512 " "
522 " "
558 " "
730 " "
734 " "
912 " "

Then there are the two semi-regular 504-505 Detours
which travel up the Dundas sub and onward to Chicago
Via CN...

440/441 are recent additions, I know they originate
and terminate in Winnipeg, but other than that I'm in
the dark. 512 is also a recent addition to avoid
congestion at Montreal apparently.

=====
Paul Hammond
Merritton, CN Grimsby Subdivision
St. Caterines, Ontario Canada
rlk1752@...
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger.

CPRS-5646,BNSF-4920 for 511-05, still in the yard at Toronto 1117-05.


Bill

Gentlemen, it hasn't been there for a while now. I was through there a couple months back on a dealer transfer, and it wasn't there. The F7B, and the H-16-44 weren't there either. Does anyone know where they may be at?

Chris Davidson

From: "Bruce Archer" <b-larcher@...>
Reply-To: C-P-R@...
To: <C-P-R@...>
Subject: Re: [C-P-R] CP 4104 Fairbanks Morse "C" Liner Whereabouts
Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 18:03:49 -0500

I saw a "C" liner in High River, Alberta a couple of years ago. It was in
the museum there.
Bruce Archer
----- Original Message -----
From: <taprice@...>
To: <C-P-R@...>
Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2000 5:23 PM
Subject: [C-P-R] CP 4104 Fairbanks Morse "C" Liner Whereabouts

From: taprice@...


Hello There!

First time with this group.

Does anybody have any information on the whereabouts of the old CP
unit 4104, a Fairbanks Morse "C" Liner passenger engine? It possibly
was retired in the late 60's, perhaps in Calgary or in the Kootenays
somewhere.

A group of us are looking to find out if it was saved, and where.

Thanks for any help,

TAPMAN



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Do these trains often operate with only CP power or is there run through
stuff like HLGX,NS?


dave