Re: uBITX new Board V4.0-Rev.C
... aha ... that is smart done from Ashar . Also the Raduino-Board now is mounted on the backside of the 25 MHz crystal board , not more inside between space of LCD-Board and 25 MHz board , that means easy plug&play ... Now also the Raduino can easy replaced without something is to unscrew screws ... Thanks , Jens / HB9JOI +++ -----Urspr¨¹ngliche Nachricht----- From: Raj vu2zap Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2018 3:25 PM To: [email protected]Subject: Re: [BITX20] uBITX new Board V4.0-Rev.C 2x2 Jens, Gnd+In and Gnd+Out, add your own filter socket. You will have to disable the stock filter! Raj At 11/10/2018, you wrote: Anybody knows for what is " P3 " connector on the new board ?
(2 x 3 pin , female , located beside left from the12 mHz filter-crystals)
73 , Jens / HB9JOI
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Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement
About the possession I guess that a non filtered output shows a higher power, which is the sum of the fundamental, the spurs, harmonics and all the garbage left.
Il 11/ott/2018 14:37, "Raj vu2zap" < rajendrakumargg@...> ha scritto:
Relays are sealed, cant use SWR grease. I remember reading in QST some
year April
about how SWR grease makes all the standing waves slip and fall off the
antenna :-))
Most of my testing with harmonics were done on 7.2 or 14.2 Mhz. With
Panasonic relays
the 2rd harmonic shot up by ~20db and the 5th dropped below the -43dbm
green line.
As soon a I get back to the bench I am going to mill off the plastic
around a Panasonic and
see what the construction is. Its height is a little less than the
"Virtual" brand. This should
give us a better understanding or open a new can of worms!
This one of the best groups to learn from, thanks to you guys!
Raj
At 11/10/2018, you wrote:
My guess is that your Panasonic
are possessed by some SWR...
Il 11/ott/2018 13:01, "Raj vu2zap"
<
rajendrakumargg@...> ha scritto:
- Kees,
- My guess is that the contacts being underside are close to the ground
plane of the board and that must be
- helping decreasing the "coupling" of both sets of
contacts.
- Imagine a loop on one side of the relay and another on the other
side.. perfect inductive coupling. The
- Axicom has smaller loops compared to Virtual and others.
- My Panasonic relays made the harmonics worse.. BUT the power out
increased !!! about 20%.
- It's possessed I tell you!
- Raj
- Panasonic relay DS2Y-S-DC12V
- At 11/10/2018, you wrote:
- >Those inductances all look right. Sure would like to know WHY the
Axicom relays have better readings.
|
Something not right 24V PA BITX40
I have my BITX40 up and running. Just got on the air for the first time a month ago. Lots of FT8 contacts and a few other digital contacts. I just put it in a case with a switch for the PA power section.
I can run the PA with the 12 volts or switch to an external source. Before boxing it I was able 13 Watts on 24.5volts. Currently I only get 7 Watts on 24.5 volts.
On 12 volts I get 5.5 Watts with 1.2 amps draw with a loud hello and 97 mA idle
On 24.5 volts I get 7 Watts with 1.5 amp draw with a loud hello and 103 mA idle.
Did I break something or am I doing something wrong? Using Lipo batteries for the PA and they sit idle at 24.5 volts and drop to 24.1 during the transmit. I tried increasing the drive on RV136. Seems I might get more output momentary then it settles back down to 7 Watts.
Any thoughts are appreciated.
|
Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement
Hi Raj,
Funny, I have a DE-5000, LC-100A (real cheap one from eBay) and the AADE and they all agree within less than 1 percent. You might have a bad crystal oscillator on the uP in your AADE? Or maybe I just got lucky as I was given my AADE by a friend, several years ago. Not sure where he got it.
The biggest surprise is how accurate the very inexpensive LC-100A has been. I think I paid $9.95 USD with free shipping for it.
Jim, W0EB
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
------ Original Message ------ From: "Raj vu2zap" <rajendrakumargg@...> To: [email protected]Sent: 10/11/2018 3:45:22 AM Subject: Re: [BITX20] Harmonics and Relay Replacement I don't trust my AADE meter below 1uH. I use a meter called DE 5000, it read commercial
sub uH inductors very accurately. The AADE meter was way off.
The DE meter can be set for 1,10,100 KHz measurement frequency. At 100K the meter
reads 1nH
Raj
You will need the accesories TL-21 and 22 ..
At 11/10/2018, you wrote:
Kees,
In measuring a Virtual relay and an Axicom relay that I have here, both show approximately 20nH.
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Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement
Hi Jim,
Just wanting to lob out an idea for consideration on your multiple uBITX board relay experiment, if it is still in progress.
Mounting the Axicom relays from the back side, where they are directly over a mostly ground plane.
Experiment split to see if it further improves / or addresses your 40m question.
Thanks for the work / effort.
Rgds,
Gary
AG5TX
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Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement
I agree with you Raj. Also, I believe it's because the Axicom relays were designed from the beginning to be used in RF applications where the ones originally used in the uBITX were and are not. The originals are power relays and no thought was given to RF isolation when they were manufactured. It's unfortunate but not all relays of this type are created equal and it is difficult to design RF carrying circuits using power relays when the internal capacitance and/or inductances are not known and not provided in the respective data sheets.
As to being "possessed", I know the 40 meter band on at least one of my uBITX boards IS possessed because the Axicom relays only marginally helped on 40. On all the other bands the 3rd harmonic was reduced significantly (at least 15 dBC) over the original relays.
Jim Sheldon - W0EB
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------ Original Message ------ From: "Raj vu2zap" <rajendrakumargg@...> To: [email protected]Sent: 10/11/2018 6:01:37 AM Subject: Re: [BITX20] Harmonics and Relay Replacement Kees,
My guess is that the contacts being underside are close to the ground plane of the board and that must be
helping decreasing the "coupling" of both sets of contacts.
Imagine a loop on one side of the relay and another on the other side.. perfect inductive coupling. The
Axicom has smaller loops compared to Virtual and others.
My Panasonic relays made the harmonics worse.. BUT the power out increased !!! about 20%.
It's possessed I tell you!
Raj
Panasonic relay DS2Y-S-DC12V
At 11/10/2018, you wrote:
Those inductances all look right. Sure would like to know WHY the Axicom relays have better readings.
|
BITX QSO Afternoon/Evening, Sunday, October, 14 3PM & 7PM Local Time, 7277 kHz in North America, 7177 kHz elsewhere.
Just a friendly reminder to tune in to 7.277 or 7.177 for the Sunday Bitx net. Same format as before. Hope to catch you then!
Jay
WS4JM
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Re: uBITX new Board V4.0-Rev.C
2x2 Jens,
Gnd+In and Gnd+Out, add your own filter socket. You will have to disable the stock filter!
Raj
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
At 11/10/2018, you wrote: Anybody knows for what is " P3 " connector on the new board ?
(2 x 3 pin , female , located beside left from the12 mHz filter-crystals)
73 , Jens / HB9JOI
|
uBITX new Board V4.0-Rev.C
Anybody knows for what is " P3 " connector on the new board ?
(2 x 3 pin , female?, located beside left from the12 mHz filter-crystals)
73 , Jens / HB9JOI
|
Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement
Relays are sealed, cant use SWR grease. I remember reading in QST some
year April
about how SWR grease makes all the standing waves slip and fall off the
antenna :-))
Most of my testing with harmonics were done on 7.2 or 14.2 Mhz. With
Panasonic relays
the 2rd harmonic shot up by ~20db and the 5th dropped below the -43dbm
green line.
As soon a I get back to the bench I am going to mill off the plastic
around a Panasonic and
see what the construction is. Its height is a little less than the
"Virtual" brand. This should
give us a better understanding or open a new can of worms!
This one of the best groups to learn from, thanks to you guys!
Raj
At 11/10/2018, you wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
My guess is that your Panasonic
are possessed by some SWR...
Il 11/ott/2018 13:01, "Raj vu2zap"
<
rajendrakumargg@...> ha scritto:
- Kees,
- My guess is that the contacts being underside are close to the ground
plane of the board and that must be
- helping decreasing the "coupling" of both sets of
contacts.
- Imagine a loop on one side of the relay and another on the other
side.. perfect inductive coupling. The
- Axicom has smaller loops compared to Virtual and others.
- My Panasonic relays made the harmonics worse.. BUT the power out
increased !!! about 20%.
- It's possessed I tell you!
- Raj
- Panasonic relay DS2Y-S-DC12V
- At 11/10/2018, you wrote:
- >Those inductances all look right. Sure would like to know WHY the
Axicom relays have better readings.
|
Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement
FYI, similar AXICOM relays are mounted on the RF sensed TX/RX switch (changeover) by Kanga. Attached you find the pic of one I assembled some time ago. As this provides RX protection, Kanga has evidently chosen the relays that offered a good compromise between cost and RF separation at HF.
Il 11/ott/2018 13:20, "iz oos" < and2oosiz2@...> ha scritto: My guess is that your Panasonic are possessed by some SWR...
|
Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement
My guess is that your Panasonic are possessed by some SWR...
Il 11/ott/2018 13:01, "Raj vu2zap" < rajendrakumargg@...> ha scritto: Kees,
My guess is that the contacts being underside are close to the ground plane of the board and that must be
helping decreasing the "coupling" of both sets of contacts.
Imagine a loop on one side of the relay and another on the other side.. perfect inductive coupling. The
Axicom has smaller loops compared to Virtual and others.
My Panasonic relays made the harmonics worse.. BUT the power out increased !!! about 20%.
It's possessed I tell you!
Raj
Panasonic relay DS2Y-S-DC12V
At 11/10/2018, you wrote:
>Those inductances all look right. Sure would like to know WHY the Axicom relays have better readings.
|
Hi Guys,
I am awaiting delivery of my uBitX.? Now preparing the case and add-ons (like Frd/Rev power, fan controller, sound card interface, audio power amp, etc).
Have been watching the spur / harmonic discussion with interest. Already have new 680 uh inductors on order, not relays (yet).
It may be a bit early, but when the "dust settles" will anyone assemble a list of the various methods and modifications that best address the issue??? That would be much appreciated!
Thanks for all the info....
Woody? -? KZ4AK
www.albe24.com
|
Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement
Kees,
My guess is that the contacts being underside are close to the ground plane of the board and that must be
helping decreasing the "coupling" of both sets of contacts.
Imagine a loop on one side of the relay and another on the other side.. perfect inductive coupling. The
Axicom has smaller loops compared to Virtual and others.
My Panasonic relays made the harmonics worse.. BUT the power out increased !!! about 20%.
It's possessed I tell you!
Raj
Panasonic relay DS2Y-S-DC12V
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
At 11/10/2018, you wrote: Those inductances all look right. Sure would like to know WHY the Axicom relays have better readings.
|
Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement
toggle quoted message
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On Wed, Oct 10, 2018 at 4:43 PM Jim Sheldon < w0eb@...> wrote: Thanks Mike, Ordered 10 of them from Arrow - even cheaper than Digi-Key by a couple of bucks and certainly much cheaper on the shipping with Arrow's free overnight shipping.
My Digi-Key order will be here in about an hour and I'll mod the two V4 boards I have.? After the Arrow order arrives tomorrow, I'll mod the 2 V3 boards and run the Spectrum tests on them.
Jim Sheldon, W0EB
------ Original Message ------
Sent: 10/10/2018 9:07:12 AM
Subject: Re: [BITX20] Harmonics and Relay Replacement
For those in the USA, you can order these from Arrow electronics (). They are a little cheaper, plus you get free overnight shipping. I ordered some and will try to replicate Mike's results. Mike M. KU4QO
On Mon, Oct 8, 2018 at 3:54 PM Mike Doty via Groups.Io <mikedoty= [email protected]> wrote: I thought I would pass this along, for whatever it is worth.? I have two Ver 3 and one Ver 4 uBiTX rigs.? I have replaced K3, KT1, KT2, and KT3 relays with Axicom relays which has knocked down the 3rd, 5th, and 7th harmonic levels from -35dB to below -50dB on all 3 rigs without any board modifications to the LPF circuits.? This may be anecdotal but with 3 rigs showing the same results it may be something to consider.? I purchased the relays from Mouser - part # 655-V23105A5403A201.? Cost was $2.89 per relay plus shipping.? I've attached photos (sorry for the blurriness) showing the before and after results on my Ver 4 rig.
--73--? Mike? --? W0MNE
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Info is nice always go by inductance values for tuned circuits as per sch but not mechanical turns wound. If you wind same, needed inductance has to be checked and tweaked. On Tue, Oct 9, 2018 at 10:06 PM jim via Groups.Io <ab7vf@...> wrote:
From the uBITX website "circuit details" section :
Coil Details
L5, L7 : 12 turns on T30-6
L1, L2, L3, L4, L11, L12, L13 : 9 turns on T30-6
L14, L15, L16: 10 turns on T30-6
L14, L15, L16: 14 turns on T30-6
L20, L21, L22: 19 turns on T30-6
All the RF transfomers are 8-10 trifilar turns on FT37-43
Jim
On Monday, October 8, 2018, 11:24:09 AM PDT, cburf1@... <cburf1@...> wrote:
Hi all,
I'm about to embark on my first homebrew transceiver and have chosen the uBITX. I am lucky to have been given access to a large collection of unwanted though-hole components as we have gradually moved to surface mount at my company. For this reason, I am looking to do a project similar to this:
My questions for now all regard the toroidal transformers. I can't find any info about these.
1. What toroids are used?
2. How many wraps of wire?
3. Are there any off-the-shelf alternatives anyone knows of should I choose to buy them?
Thanks for the help.
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Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement
Raj, Obviously the reading could as accurate as your crystal used
across AADE meter.
Nice to know that you own an AADE meter.
REGARDS
SARMA
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On Thu, Oct 11, 2018 at 2:16 PM Raj vu2zap <rajendrakumargg@...> wrote:
I don't trust my AADE meter below 1uH. I use a meter called DE 5000, it read commercial
sub uH inductors very accurately. The AADE meter was way off.
The DE meter can be set for 1,10,100 KHz measurement frequency. At 100K the meter
reads 1nH
Raj
You will need the accesories TL-21 and 22 ..
At 11/10/2018, you wrote:
Kees,
In measuring a Virtual relay and an Axicom relay that I have here, both show approximately 20nH.
|
Re: Harmonics and Relay Replacement
I don't trust my AADE meter below 1uH. I use a meter called DE 5000, it read commercial
sub uH inductors very accurately. The AADE meter was way off.
The DE meter can be set for 1,10,100 KHz measurement frequency. At 100K the meter
reads 1nH
Raj
You will need the accesories TL-21 and 22 ..
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
At 11/10/2018, you wrote: Kees,
In measuring a Virtual relay and an Axicom relay that I have here, both show approximately 20nH.
|
Re: Purchase of uBitx on hold until?
Joe,
With 45MHz filter you may lose up to half the power. With SMD I get like 95% of stock.
Raj
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At 11/10/2018, you wrote: Are you saying that the second 45mhz mod can be removed from the TX with this mod? How much power loss is lost with the 45mhz is in place?
Nice work by the way. I?€?d like to try this for sure.
Joe
PS wheres Allison been? She must be on vacation.
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Re: uBITX new build, quiet audio #ubitx; volume control wired backwards
Hi, you are not alone, I did the same mistake. And evidently ver. 4 is more robust than ver. 3. I had to replace the audio final in ver. 3 (the good but infamous TDA).
Il 11/ott/2018 05:59, "Robin Midgett" < K4IDC@...> ha scritto: This is what happened to me with my first ?BitX; yellow volume wire was connected to volume wiper (Vol-M) & orange wire was connected to Vol. high, which is backwards. Once I corrected that, the audio problems disappeared. I verified the mistake using an ohmmeter; orange (Vol-M) should connect to junction of C72 & C78. I don't have the original instruction sheet handy but I'm pretty sure it was followed properly. I have v4.3 ?BitX.
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Jens/HB9JOI
Jim Sheldon
Jay - WS4JM
Raj vu2zap
