Hi,

I recently aquired an older RongFU RF-114 model bandsaw to restore, it was throwing blades by previous owner.

I need to replace all bearings and seals.

?

I need the exact info/measurements placing the bearings on the two gearbox sfats plus the seal positions, seeing I cannot trust the way they came out when I received the saw.

?

How can I find a manual for this, and the precise installation instructions regarding the sma:: gearbox components.

?

Thankyou in advance

Chris/Hettie

Hi John, I got everything cleaned and painted and replaced 4x bearings, had to make tools on lathe to get new bearings set on shaft with oil seales, ...sealed SKF bearings.? Today I installed the two gears in casing with shaft centrepoints hopefully alligned. I fitted the drive pulley, which had a very slight play, used paint trick to get it set stiff. I made a spacer between outer bearing and pulley so pully dont go deaper than it should for C-Clip at end of shaft. Now I just need to buy a new key fit to complete this part. From what I can gather the oil must be 85W-140 gear oil, now I am trying to find that oil locally and it not destroy bronze/brass gear, I am pretty happy how this part turned out. I could not find the info exactly I wanted, but after cleaning the shafts I found bearing markings as indication. It looks like the 2 gears are alligned correctly, I will test to confirm this later. The bearings press harder on shafts than on inner casings, I made use of freezer. I go on my logic here, I doubt I can totally trust previous assembly seeing it throw blades.

On Mon, May 8, 2023 at 9:23?PM John Vreede <vreededesign@...> wrote:

Hi Chris/Hettie

Gearbox repair is?the most complicated part of working on these saws, but it appears you've got the gearbox apart?and that's a feat in itself.

There is no OEM manual that has the info you require, they never did the manuals like that, however the information is known, though I haven't got it quite in the format you've asked for.

It'll be quicker for me to PM you what I've got and we can discuss what extra you need from there - jv

On Tue, May 9, 2023 at 3:50?AM <hettiechom@...> wrote:

Hi,

I recently aquired an older RongFU RF-114 model bandsaw to restore, it was throwing blades by previous owner.

I need to replace all bearings and seals.

?

I need the exact info/measurements placing the bearings on the two gearbox sfats plus the seal positions, seeing I cannot trust the way they came out when I received the saw.

?

How can I find a manual for this, and the precise installation instructions regarding the sma:: gearbox components.

?

Thankyou in advance

Chris/Hettie

Suggestion: Make a transparent cover for the gearbox. I made mine from 3/8” acrylic about 15 years ago and it’s really nice to see the condition of the oil and gears while it’s running.?

Gary

Suggestion: Make a transparent cover for the gearbox. I made mine from 3/8” acrylic about 15 years ago and it’s really nice to see the condition of the oil and gears while it’s running.?

Gary

Hi John, this is how the short shaft came out as I found the saw.

-The bearing is next to gear, then an oil seal, then a rubber like sqared O-ring and next bearing. Does the spacing of this looke original and correct-?

On Wed, May 10, 2023 at 7:22?PM Hettie Chom via <hettiechom=[email protected]> wrote:

Hi, John, thanks for advice on oil etc...

I discovered a problem I don't like. The short shaft to the main drive pulley:

-The main drive pulley has play in it on the shaft=I took care of that.

-Then I discovered that I have play moving the pulley , and its not coming from the pulley with key and no play there.

-I then removed this pully, and can feel the play with two new bearings fitted......I am trying to figure this out, because the bearings fit snug to the shaft and in the housing....I am a bit confused at this..........Originally I thought it was a bit of a short distance shaft for driving a metal saw blade? at tention and was condidering fitting 3 sealed bearings in a row without an oil seal. Do you think oil can leak past 3 sealed bearings -?

-I will then see if this clears up the problem.......

On Wed, May 10, 2023 at 1:19?AM John Vreede <vreededesign@...> wrote:

Sorry Gary didn't mean to dis you, you posted during the time I was still writing and I didn't see it - I agree it's nice to see the oil churning about and that there's enough of it still.??

Without the clear cover I would never have known that one of the oils?I tested (Lucas 75W-140 gear oil ), touted as being a '...synthetic gear oil...', almost instantly (<5sec) turned white (air/oil emulsion - which does not lubricate well at all).?

I was testing mainly 'synthetic' oils as these normally lubricate better, but found that? the word 'synthetic', legally, has no defined meaning in relation to oil.? In fact it's not used by the American Petroleum Institute, who control oil products in the US, for that reason. Anyone can call their oil 'synthetic' if the least bit of it is synthesised and, let's face it, the additive packages that all multigrade oils contain are all synthesised. Let the buyer beware - jv? ?

On Wed, May 10, 2023 at 7:20?AM Gary Johnson via <gwj=[email protected]> wrote:

Suggestion: Make a transparent cover for the gearbox. I made mine from 3/8” acrylic about 15 years ago and it’s really nice to see the condition of the oil and gears while it’s running.?

Gary

Does the gearbox output shaft assembly look correct? - Yes & No

Yes its that short. Think from memory just under 1.5" overall between the outsides of the ball races. One of the many failings in this gearbox design, but it is what it is.?

No The order of the oil seal and spacer is wrong, Inner bearing, then seal (spring around the seal lip toward the gearbox), then there should be am 8mm long?steel spacer which is a sloppy fit in the casting but still bears against the outer diameter of the seal and the outer bearing, Lastly the outer bearing.?

To improve lubrication of the outer bearing, which is the main cause of failure, prise off any inner seal with a seal pick and half fill the void between the seal spacer, ring and inner face of the bearing with some thin moly grease.

Just so we're on the same page; when you say "...main drive pulley.." I think that you mean?the bandwheel on the gearbox output shaft which?drives the sawblade around, not the pulley on the gearbox input shaft. Am I right?

Assuming I'm right, and you are not experiencing any radial movement in the drive bandwheel because?you say "...I took care of that..." , then the movement you are talking about is axial, i.e. endfloat in the shaft.? Am I right in assuming this?

There should be no endfloat in either shaft.? If you are experiencing this then the bearing outer is not as tight fit in the casting as most people have.? This is just a manufacturing tolerance issue and no big deal so long as you have the bearing retainer ring in place (It's screwed onto the outside of the gearbox casting where you can see it behind the drive bandwheel) AND the spacer that goes in between?the outer output-shaft bearing.? Most people don't?need that spacer as the bearing outer ring is too tight a fit in the casting but in cases where its not then the spacer is what prevents the whole output shaft from migrating back into the gearbox and the following?all happens:

• this misalignment can contribute to derailing the blade, though a failed outer output shaft bearing is much more of an issue in the blade coming off (the extra clearance in the failed bearing allows the output shaft to bend under the blade tension, which steers the blade into derailing from the drive wheel)
• the drive bandwheel can rub on the sawframe casting (the axial forces from the worm and wheel and bending of the output shaft from the blade tension, tends to drive the shaft inward rather than outward)
• the brass gear loses its centering over the worm and rubs against the gearbox lid?
• In time the misalignment between worm and wheel will destroy the brass gear? ?

?I've measured this spacer as between 0.260" to 0.280" long on RF115/ RF128's. Cut one from a piece of 5/8" ID conduit if yours is missing, plastic or metal as there is very little force on it.? The actual length really needs to be determined from wherever the drive bandwheel sits on the output shaft when the blade tracks properly (back of the blade hits and misses the rim of the drive wheel when blade is at the proper tension). That's a whole other story which we can go into if your blade doesn't track properly after you've rebuilt the gearbox?

I don't think a 3rd bearing would take any load,? the way the shaft flexes, But you may have a point.? Unfortunately the rubber seals on a 6202-RS bearing are only there to retain grease and are not supposed to be effective in sealing in oil and you definitely don't want oil leaks. Three bearings all with a single seal on the outside might well be a better and sealed bearing set, however I've not tried it.? The seal drag would be lots higher than standard, because Its way higher with just a 6202-2RS outer bearing (std is only a shielded? 6202-Z) - jv

On Thu, May 11, 2023 at 6:24?AM Hettie Chom <hettiechom@...> wrote:

Hi John, this is how the short shaft came out as I found the saw.

-The bearing is next to gear, then an oil seal, then a rubber like sqared O-ring and next bearing. Does the spacing of this looke original and correct-?

On Wed, May 10, 2023 at 7:22?PM Hettie Chom via <hettiechom=[email protected]> wrote:

Hi, John, thanks for advice on oil etc...

I discovered a problem I don't like. The short shaft to the main drive pulley:

-The main drive pulley has play in it on the shaft=I took care of that.

-Then I discovered that I have play moving the pulley , and its not coming from the pulley with key and no play there.

-I then removed this pully, and can feel the play with two new bearings fitted......I am trying to figure this out, because the bearings fit snug to the shaft and in the housing....I am a bit confused at this..........Originally I thought it was a bit of a short distance shaft for driving a metal saw blade? at tention and was condidering fitting 3 sealed bearings in a row without an oil seal. Do you think oil can leak past 3 sealed bearings -?

-I will then see if this clears up the problem.......

On Wed, May 10, 2023 at 1:19?AM John Vreede <vreededesign@...> wrote:

Sorry Gary didn't mean to dis you, you posted during the time I was still writing and I didn't see it - I agree it's nice to see the oil churning about and that there's enough of it still.??

Without the clear cover I would never have known that one of the oils?I tested (Lucas 75W-140 gear oil ), touted as being a '...synthetic gear oil...', almost instantly (<5sec) turned white (air/oil emulsion - which does not lubricate well at all).?

I was testing mainly 'synthetic' oils as these normally lubricate better, but found that? the word 'synthetic', legally, has no defined meaning in relation to oil.? In fact it's not used by the American Petroleum Institute, who control oil products in the US, for that reason. Anyone can call their oil 'synthetic' if the least bit of it is synthesised and, let's face it, the additive packages that all multigrade oils contain are all synthesised. Let the buyer beware - jv? ?

On Wed, May 10, 2023 at 7:20?AM Gary Johnson via <gwj=[email protected]> wrote:

Suggestion: Make a transparent cover for the gearbox. I made mine from 3/8” acrylic about 15 years ago and it’s really nice to see the condition of the oil and gears while it’s running.?

Gary

[Edited Message Follows]

Thanks for the info, the all play is what I wanted to know about. The blade tightning I can control by tightning it, the blade tilt I can control by adjusting a bolt & grubscrew, however the play thats in the direction not covered by above adjustments I have no way to control.

Your experience is good to know.

I did an experiment and will know later on if it bad or good outcome when I actually saw with it. I got this bandsaw because it thrown blades. It seems the previous owner replaced the slave wheel bush, which is new and has no play, I just made a proper spacer to take out the endplay here. I also corrected the main wheel/gearbox bearing assembly to the best of my ability. If it stay put when in use what I have done will be the selution.

Temp Mod(Experiment):I decided to make two new plates at slave wheel a bit thicker and milled down, so that it slide with zero play, busy today with this. When in use I will know if this mod was any good, if not I revert back to original plates. With this zero play, I can still adjiust the blade tention, and the blade tilt, just from a zero play base.

On Thu, Nov 30, 2023 at 1:16?AM Bill Armstrong <bill_1955@...> wrote:

I have a Grizzly 5 x 6, and with the blade removed, the idler has play all over the place. Pick a axis, it moves in any. It all goes away once you install the blade and tighten it, and has never been a problem in the 15+ years I’ve had the saw. ?

?

Other Bill

?

On Nov 29, 2023, at 1:54 PM, Hettie Chom <hettiechom@...> wrote:

[Edited Message Follows]

Previously:

I made a bracket that swivel on top of compressor(Silenced) cabinet, of which in turn the top can open up like a car bonnet to access compressor parts to remove/repace when needed. The bansaw in turn can swivel up and vertical out of the way to reveal a top stainless steel tray for use if needed.

Installing the bansaw(Refurbishing) on top of compressor:
Hi, back at the bandsaw. I would like to know about the play in the slave wheel alignment adjustment device. I understand the Tention of the blade adjustment and movement, as well as the Blade Tilt adjustment with fasteners "C & "B" in photo edited it swivel around "A".

Problem:Play in Blade tilting device I cannot adjust, is it normal or a problem-?

<0_Play-AdjustableFrontWheelDevice.jpg>

?

What I don't understand is the amount of play up/down as indicated in purple when you pull up & down on pulley or pully shaft with pulley removed. I would say mine has excessive play here, which I cannot adjust. Before I make some mods with milling machine, I would like to hear your opinion around this-?

Thankyou
Chris

?

?

Made some progress-Photos

Need to do:

1-Wire electrics so it shut off with reset electrically like mill or lathe(Relay hold).

2-To obtain correct blade and start setting it to saw accurately, whatever it takes.

3-To make/design a heavy backstop for whole lid + bandsaw contraption to hold it the bandsaw vertically(Not the saw vertical like when you want to saw vertical), this is to hold the bandsaw vertically out of the way of compressor lid so the stainless tray can be used with lathe if needed, otherwise a small tray at end over this one is used.

4-Minor mods to compressor sides and painting.

Made some progress-Photos

Need to do:

1-Wire electrics so it shut off with reset electrically like mill or lathe(Relay hold).

2-To obtain correct blade and start setting it to saw accurately, whatever it takes.

3-To make/design a heavy backstop for whole lid + bandsaw contraption to hold it the bandsaw vertically(Not the saw vertical like when you want to saw vertical), this is to hold the bandsaw vertically out of the way of compressor lid so the stainless tray can be used with lathe if needed, otherwise a small tray at end over this one is used.

4-Minor mods to compressor sides and painting.