The overhaul
2
All, Didn't win the bet with Jay about when the engines would be done, but the fhead 4 did start up last Sunday. It's been too hot to do much more work on it. Current hilarious argument- when the coolant went in, there were leaks around the front and back exhaust manifold studs. After a 20-minute break in run, the leaks stopped. So, my mechanic friend wants me to drain the coolant, extract the studs, put the magic high temp, should be illegal (forever chemical- teflon) sealant on the studs, reassemble. I say that cooked antifreeze seems to be a good sealant, if it's not broke, why fix it? I asked the machine shop to give the oil pump an 11:00, big side up, orientation of the oil pump shaft, so the distributor would have cylinder #1 at 6:00. They did, but at some point the distributor was re worked so #1 is at 12:00, which makes working on timing difficult. I recall extending the range of travel of the distributor mounting plate decades ago so I could get the timing right, never guessed this was the problem. So, the mechanic identifies replacement distributors for $130, wants to help me stimulate the economy some more. But, the replacement distributor is not stock, has no vacuum advance, etc. (Could have Jay buy me a new one so he can have the vacuum advance...) He says we can reorient the distributor next winter. Another old friend, who first worked on the engine with me when we were 19 (to make the engine use less than a quart of oil every 60 miles), wanted me to replace the clutch and pressure plate. The old pressure plate is thinner than the new one. There was a large, maybe 4" wide, thick washer that rode between the throw out bearing and the pressure plate. No knowing any better, we tried to put this back in, would not fit, bell housing wouldn't go on. Removed the washer, all's good, much easier to make the throw-out lever stay in place, too. The theory is that there was a resurfacing operation on the old pressure plate, which required the washer to replace the thickness removed by resurfacing. Don't know. When replacement parts were made domestically, the high cost of new may have made a redo cost effective. With Asian parts, it's a lot cheaper to put in new. I feared installation of the clutch linkage, a rube of a shaft, springs, washers in a tight space. The mechanic had a great idea here; look in the manual. Sure enough, there's a good diagram in there that helped us get it together. He accused me of being cheap about replacing the cotter pins with new, but I had new replacements "on hand", so we were good. "What's the screen door spring doing under here" was the next question. Off to the hardware store to get a more appropriate return spring. The old spring was attached to the car with perfectly fine, authentic hay baling wire, and I have yards of it still in stock. Not good enough for a real mechanic- how can you adjust it? So, there now is a strip of sheet metal, with a twist in the middle, to fill in the gap. The machine shop provided a pre oiling tank; suggested using a scale to determine when we were about to run out of oil, in order to avoid pushing the oil out with compressed air. We used a simple bike hand pump, and I put a section of clear tubing in the line so we could see when we were running out and stop pumping. Worked fine. The oil is impregnated with gold, or at least costs like it, break in oil with ZDDP additives, ouch! But, less expensive than a rebuild. Before this work, the gauges were like this, left to right: Fuel, moved, a full tank registered just over half. Oil pressure guage displayed, accuracy not really known. Temperature guage barely moved. Ammeter seemed OK. Now, the fuel gauge moved with almost nothing in the tank, hoping it's better with a plastic float replacing gas logged cork. Oil pressure seems low to me on an overhauled engine, shows 30-35, don't know a test procedure, perhaps a manual gauge? Temperature gauge fixed by new sensor. Ammeter seems fine. There are no drips on the pan under the car. Some will come, of course, but I'm hoping for less leakage and a non-chattering c
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Vacuum advance
4
Has any one found an inexpensive replacement for the F head vacuum advance. It is almost the same cost to get an EFI distributor as a new one.
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Gauges
3
GOOD NEWS is i got the 54 truck running today. Starts and idles great. So I switched over from 6v to 12v and bought the 3 stunts for the temp, fuel and oil. Nothing reads when running and if you short out the sending units the fuel and oil only go 3/4 of the way. Temp goes to end. Have half tank of gas and oil is pumping. New plastic tank and sending unit. Any ideas?
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Abi Update
14
Those of you that have been on this list for awhile gave me a lot of support and encouragement when my granddaughter, Abi, was dealing with cancer and I was making all those trips from So Cal to Tacoma to be with her. It's been about 9 years and she's 18 now so I thought I should give you an update. This week I was at the Tacoma Dome and watched her get her high school diploma from the Tacoma School of the Arts. Her health is good now and she has developed a real talent for art. I really appreciated everyone's support during that time. This is the result of all those prayers. John 56 Pickup TKER TOY Graham, Wash.
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Contacting Mr. Stewart
2
Hello everybody, my name is Florencio, from Buenos Aires, Argentina. I entered this group in an attemp to contact Mr. Robert Stewart, from Wisconsin. Mr. Stewart used to have a webpage with lots of information about the OHC Tornado engine, but it seems not to be available anymore. Some references found in Internet conducted me to Willystech. I hope to have some luck. Thanks a lot...
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Alternator
8
I hooked up my one wire alternator today to the battery and the wore got so hot I had to cut it. Any thoughts.
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Engine Cooling
5
Good morning. I would like to know what cooling everyone has installed that has worked for cooling a V8 in their Willys. I have a 3 row radiator and a pusher fan but it does not seem to get the job done. Thank you for your support. Todd 1959 Wagon, Cream Soda. . . You can read about PG&E¡¯s data privacy practices at PGE.com/privacy.
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Exhaust manifold on the fhead 4
4
In the last message I mentioned the excellent phone support from Rustoleum concerning their high temperature paint, where they wanted to make a paint job work, but causing a domestic issue with use of the home oven for car work. was not recommended. I "got to looking" at the manifold, and noticed that the surfaces that faces the engine, where the gaskets cover up the sins, were pretty corroded/rusted, and on cyl #4 the manifold had eroded away enough to make the gasket surfaces quite narrow, with pitted areas elsewhere. A friend suggested taping sandpaper to the workbench and going at it to renew the surface. YouTube provided someone that used 60 grit 3M wet/dry paper, (amazed to find it at True Value) 3 pieces, attached with two sided tape top and bottom to a flat surface for the work. Sanded wet; I wore out three sheets, bought some more paper, sanded another hour, and called it good. My expert adviser said I needed to be within .020" of an inch compared to flat; I measured .010". I think I sanded off over 1/8". #4 is now nearly as wide as original, mostly it looks like a new surface, pits and rust gone, a big improvement. I spent a few minutes today sanding out the scratches with 220 grit paper. It is now possible to get new manifolds for this engine, but who knows how good they are, etc. Good project for arm exercise on a very rainy day. Dan -- Dan 53 2wd Wagon Eugene, OR
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Update on Groups.io Reverification Process
12
Thank you Dan. Pavel up North.
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Fhead work in progress
2
So, not remembering what I shared before, so going to repeat some. Have a bad case of scope creep. The original desire was to fix a leaky rear seal situation. The crankshaft was rusted/corroded on the surface the rear main seal rides, so crankshaft removal was required. The engine ran fine otherwise. Disassembly of the engine, with considerable help from friend #1, raised a concern that the connecting rods did not match up, with the #3 weighing more than the other three; he suggested taking the engine to a machine shop, so this, or any other problems, could be identified. and the crankshaft checked out. Friend #2 said- now, how long has the engine run just fine with the connecting rod mismatch? (decades). The "examination" revealed cracks in the block that the machine shop thought beyond where they would want to go with a "locknstich" repair, because the cracks- cylinders 2 and 3- extended from the hardened exhaust valve seats on to the head surface- repairable-and also under the valve seat and down under the valve- where the exhaust heads to the manifold- about an inch, which they did not want to tackle with locknstich. I think I sent a picture of this out. I did contact Locknstich, and they said this was a common repair that they would do, shipping the block to them and so on. Instead, search for another block began, saga explained previously, wound up with one that would work. So, the work with the new block continues- the old block went to the machine shop mid December, I think. -The machine shop had a replacement, correct, connecting rod in their "piles of old stuff". -The crankshaft (from the original engine) cleaned up nicely with polishing only, diameters good, including for the new rear seal. -They ordered replacement exhaust valves, twice, both wrong, decided to use the best 4 from the two blocks. -In the replacement block, the lifters were no longer "flat tappet" but "cupped tappet", (in the replacement block)- they ship these out for resurfacing to their camshaft redoing company- too far gone to redo, but the ones from the original engine were able to be re ground flat. -camshaft redone -Elected to go with new pistons (what's another $80 to the Chinese). -Block cleaned up at "40 over". Having them resurface the flywheel; replacing the clutch, pressure plate, throwout bearing. They do test for leaks on the rear seal: Turn the engine on end, putting oil on the seal, leave it overnight and look for oil in the wrong place in the morning. After assembly, they will make sure compression is good, and also that the effort to turn the engine over is correct. They will loan me a setup to pre oil the engine, a pressure tank that forces oil through the oil pressure guage sensor "hole". They will sell me some gawdawfully expensive break in oil. Assuming the leaks are greatly reduced, will use gold plated "High Zddp" oil. In the "harmonywithspouse" department, I decided to clean up the exhaust manifold, which was fun, using the electrolysis method, washing soda, plastic tube, steel anode, battery charger, etc. Worked pretty well, bought high temperature, ceramic Rustoleum spray paint. Then I read the directions- heat to 200 degrees, allow to cool, repeat at 400 and 600 degrees. Now, by waiting until the oven owner is out of town, it would be possible to do 200 and 400 degrees, 600, how to do that? I confessed about the plan; the response was "as predicted". I called Rustoleum technical support. No recording saying call volumes are high, please wait English speaker answered the phone, with no queue They explained that they didn't want me to bake the manifold in the oven, (not sure if this is a technical issue or that they don't want to cause relationship problems) and emailed me an "on the engine" procedure. Which will differ from the break in procedure-maybe will break in with another manifold, then switch. Will be whining and complaining when the costa are added up. Dan -- Dan 53 2wd Wagon Eugene, OR
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Rebuild starter
2
I have a 1957 station wagon converted to 12v. I would like to keep the old stater that went toes up. Any recommendations where I can send it for rebuild?
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Email Address
Please remove my flatfender@... from you contact list. My new email address is dan.flatfender@.... The old address will be discontinued soon. Thanks Dan
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1962 Willys Wagon
3
After a 26-year nap, my grandfather's 62 Willys Wagon fired and ran this past weekend. We are still working on the brakes, permanent fuel setup, and getting it to idle. I am looking for a good used tailgate and 16" rims in the Virginia/TN area. Thank you, Gavin
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Dan's overhaul
22
Continuing on the story, the engine from the wagon went to the machine shop for an evaluation. They didn't like this condition: What we have are genuine block cracks, cylinders 2 and 3, that go from about an inch on the top, under the valve seat, and down the inside of the valve "hole", not sure of the proper name. While Locknstich makes products and has a process for dealing with cracks, the depth down the valve hole they didn't like. So, the search began for a replacement block. Nothing on Craigslist, anywhere within 1000 miles. 150 miles to the south were a pair of engines that were complete, that had been used for a school project years ago, then stored. Engine #1 looked like this: No pistons, or pushrod's; surface cylinder rust, one crack, but smaller, and does not extend below valve seat. But never bored out. Decided to look at engine #2: Notice the crack across the top, including under the peened area, and from the exhaust valve. I took this engine back. There turned out to be a third block, with no head. It looked great on the top, no cracks, never bored, hooray! Until a side view revealed... A little patch and JB weld, maybe? This engine does have a good crankshaft, helpful connecting rods, and a decent camshaft. So, we're going with the first block, with some parts, probably, from the third block. Dan -- Dan 53 2wd Wagon Eugene, OR
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Fw: Update on Groups.io Reverification Process
I reviewed most of the member directory and couldn't find anyone impacted by this. You may get a message asking you to reverify your membership in Willystech, this is what it's about. Dan From: Groups.io Reverification <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2024 1:59 PM To: dan mulholland <mulhollanddr@...> Subject: Update on Groups.io Reverification Process Dear dan mulholland, You are receiving this email because you are an owner or moderator of one or more Groups.io groups. We are in the process of reverifying some of our users and we wanted to make sure you knew what was happening and why. For more detail about this, please visit the Reverification FAQ, at /static/reverifyfaq On Saturday January 13th, 2024, an anti-spam service called Spamhaus labeled one of our email servers as a spam sender. This caused any email service that uses Spamhaus to stop accepting email from our server. Because of this, we began a reverification process and sent out reverification emails to a subset of our users on Sunday January 14th. Spamhaus lifted their block on Monday, January 15th, 2024, but we need to continue the reverification process. You can see which, if any, of your users are affected. Go to the Admin section of your group and look at the Members page. Next to each user's email, there may be a badge with the letters RI or RS. RI means the confirmation/reverification is in progress, but has not been completed. RS means the confirmation/reverification has been successfully completed. Here are the next steps in the reverification process: On Sunday, January 28th, group emails to people in the RI state will be disabled. Messages from moderators and login link emails will still work. Until February 11th, people will still be able to reverify themselves and the RI and RS badges will still show up in the Members page. After that, members still in the RI state will be removed from groups. The activity log entry will be Membership - Member Removed, with the added reason of reverification failed. For domains where no reverifications happened, no invites or direct adds will be permitted going forward. If there is a valid person on one of those domains, they should contact [email protected] to have the domain ban lifted. We apologize for the inconvenience this process may cause, but it is necessary to ensure that we are able to continue delivering group email reliably. Thank you for using Groups.io. Best Regards, The Groups.io Team -- Dan 53 2wd Wagon Eugene, OR
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F134 redo challenge
So, the Fhead is at the machine shop; they found two cracks in the block, both visually begin about an inch from an exhaust valve seat, goes there, and reappears below the valve seat insert. Concern is potential leaks, failure to pass a pressure test, whether or not a repair is possible or advised. Hard to see in this picture, basically two similar cracks within the yellow area. They'd prefer that another block be found. Anybody have an Fhead block around? Dan -- Dan 53 2wd Wagon Eugene, OR
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Torque setting for splined rear transmission hub
8
Looking for an idea about the torque setting for the hub, maybe not the correct word, that connects the transmission to the driveline. This is on the back of the borg warner overdrive on a T96 transmission. I've removed the hub, installing a speedi sleeve to clean up the hub surface so the new seal will work better. The nut came off hard, meaning use of a breaker bar, with the hub itself held by a piece of heavy angle iron bolted to the hub flange. Other than that, our weather made the national news, with an ice storm. More importantly, it made it too cold for me to work in an unheated garage. It's warmed up now and the ice is melting away. I did have a dilemma yesterday. My wife decided to go out and hack the ice off the sidewalk and the walk to if from our house. I was reading a book in front of the fireplace (equipped with an energy efficient insert, works great). So, when do I feel guilty enough to spell her on this task? If I can hold out against my conscience long enough, the job will be nearly or completely done. If I get up and help right away, I'll feel better about myself. Oh, life challenges. Dan -- Dan 53 2wd Wagon Eugene, OR
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Archeology
3
While the engine is of the wagon, waiting for the machine shop, I took on a few other tasks that are easier with the engine out, one being replacement of the heater fan. This message was scratched into the heater core: "RIP- K-3-11-7". Any guesses what the worker at Harrison Heaters meant? The motor needed new bronze bushings, I assume. Not knowing where to find them, I replaced the motor with a "universal" replacement, which actually fit decently with some filing. Two leads, what's up with that? Well, one's for clockwise, the other for counterclockwise, ground the other lead. I can handle that level of complexity. If I rigged up a DPDT switch, I figure I could run the fan in reverse in the summertime, which would provide air conditioning. The fan motors sold by the usual suspects won't fit in this heater, the motors are too fat, so the heater came from a company that sells parts for 40's Chevrolets based in Vancouver WA. It is amazing how many more parts are available now than a few decades ago. Dan -- Dan 53 2wd Wagon Eugene, OR
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F head engine work
First, a Saturday test. Turned over the engine, and this piece fell out. I have an idea- any others Also, Spent a lot of time trying to figure out the "Best gasket Co" seal, concerning the desired diameter of the race of the seal area used for the rear main seal. This started because the metal shaper person on YouTube, who's overhauled many 4 cylinder Willys engines, concluded in 2020 that the Best seal would not work with the diameter used by those that regrind and refurbish crankshafts, which he said was 2.310 inches. instead, this seal required 2.335"; if ground to 2.310, the seal will leak. Other sources on the diameter include Willys specifications, 2.331to 2.3341; the Cj2A page says 2.345. My guess is that the Willys documentation, for all years, assumes a rope seal; and that the Cj2A page does as well. There also is a published standard from the association of machine shops in 2002 (AERO, there will be a test later) that says 2.3202-2.312 is correct if using a non rope seal. Probably the 2.310 evolved since 2002. I contacted The Jeepterman, who sells these seals, they didn't know anything about it. I tried to contact Best, but they didn't respond to email and don't answer the phone. I posted to the metalshaper YouTube video via a comment, asking if this problem had been resolved; fortunately, the answer is yes, the Best seal now works well with the 2.310 diameter. So that's what I'm going to ask the machinist to do. Dan -- Dan 53 2wd Wagon Eugene, OR
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Fhead 134 repair
13
Going ahead with the crankshaft replacement, in order to get a non corroded surface for the rear main seal. With good help, the engine is out. Looked for other issues, fortunately, the valves look great; relieved to find hardened valve seats. Cylinder wall also are fine, no ridges, etc. Will replace the rings while it's open. Thinking of ordering from Kaiser Willys a replacement crankshaft. Hoping the USA made rear main seal will work. Hope the crank will be within specs for the bearing surface. Experience or advice concerning the crankshaft or seal would be welcome. Dan -- Dan 53 2wd Wagon Eugene, OR
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