Re: 1.1-85 Fails on Self test 11
"If you are very brave you can try to lift the display and resolder the 18 wire flat cable."
Done! All good now, thanks. There was one very clearly not soldered, and a couple that 'might have been a little shy of solder. But the self test ran without issues and the waterfall is perfect!.
Thanks for all your help, it was awesome!
Kindest regards
David
PS, being able to use the second TinySA to calibrate the HIGH worked a treat. I've done it to both and that gives me everything I need. Thanks again.
|
Re: 1.1-85 Fails on Self test 11
Thats is consistent. There seems to be an error in the interface to the display and unfortunately the display test (test 11) hangs instead of giving an error message.
If you are very brave you can try to lift the display and resolder the 18 wire flat cable. Otherwise your tinySA will function well, without waterfall.
Using the serial over USB you can give the command
selftest 0 12
to execute the last of the selftests and check the attenuator
or you can connect high and low connectors, enable the cal output at 30MHz, set center = 30MHz and span =5MHz and do MEASURE/MORE/LINEAR and see if you get an (almost) flat green line.
------------------------------------------
For more info on the tinySA go to https://tinysa.org/wiki/
|
Re: 1.1-85 Fails on Self test 11
Sorry, just to update as well, the waterfall also locks it up.
Thanks
David
|
Re: 1.1-85 Fails on Self test 11
No it doesn't work.
But its fine on the other one.
|
Re: Step attenuator for QRP transmitter to TinySA
Guys, Some simple rules; 100 Watt = +50dBm 10 Watt = +40dBm 1 Watt = +30dBm Target tinySA input level for best harmonics measurements - 20dBm So for 10 Watt transmitter you need 60dB attenuation For 1 Watt transmitter you need 50dB attenuation. Start with a 20dB 5 Watt attenuator? for a 1 Watt transmitter or a?30dB 25 Watt attenuator for a 10 Watt transmitter Do NOT use a 2 Watt eBay attenuator with a 1 Watt transmitter as these will get VERY hot and may self destroy? Add a 1 or 2 Watt 30 dB attenuator to protect the tinySA Use the internal attenuator only to check if harmonics are externally generated
------------------------------------------
For more info on the tinySA go to https://tinysa.org/wiki/
|
Re: Step attenuator for QRP transmitter to TinySA
A 10db attenuation will reduce 1W to 100mW (or +20dBm or -10dBW), perhaps not enough to destroy the TSA but certainly enough to overload it and render useful measurements impossible.
You have to differentiate between damage levels and what is required for useful measurements!!!
73
Jeff
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
-----Original Message----- From: [email protected] < [email protected]> On Behalf Of bigusmith via groups.io Sent: 12 February 2021 02:44 To: [email protected]Subject: Re: [tinysa] Step attenuator for QRP transmitter to TinySA Dang! That doesn't bode well for the utility of the Kay attenuator. I am not used to dealing with RF output power in Decibels instead of watts, but from what little I have gleaned from discussions on-line, 10 Db attenuation wouldn't be enough to bring 1 watt of RF down to the level that would be comfortable for the TinySA. I need to find a table which shows RF output in say, 1/2 watt steps from 1/2 watt to 5 watts, and at each step, how many Db of attenuation is needed to bring to RF down to the proper input level to feed into the TinySA. I would pay $5 0r $10 in a heartbeat for such a chart, as I don't want to fry my TinySA and have to drop another fifty bucks for a replacement. It would also be nice to know the proper input power to the TinySA...in watts, volts (DC, RMS, & PtoP), and Db's since I have run into attenuators which all use different units of measurements and I don't know how to compare them...it's the old apples and oranges gambit! Somewhere, I read that the Kay 520 had 1- 60 Db attenuation (i guess that would be 0,1, 2, 3, 6, 10, 20, 30, 40, 50, 60 DB or something of that ilk) but they didn't say what the max watts would be. FleaBag (eBay) has a number of in-line 10 pole switched attenuators for sale at reasonable prices, but they all seem to be for very low power use with max input power of 0.25 0r 0.50 watts which wouldn't be useful for my 1 to 5 watt transmitters. They say they are for Ham Radio use, but I don't know where they will find a big enough market among the QRPp milliwatters to have dozens of vendors selling 0.25 Watt attenuators. I'm just rambling on now out of pure frustration. EuGene, KA5NLY
|
Re: 1.1-85 Fails on Self test 11
Can you check if the waterfall works? DISPLAY/WATERFALL --
------------------------------------------
For more info on the tinySA go to https://tinysa.org/wiki/
|
1.1-85 Fails on Self test 11
Hi,?
I have two Tinysa, one which arrived today and updated both to the latest firmware 1.1-85.
One completes the Self Test fine, whilst the new one (older on the serial number though) hangs at test 11. Its doesnt "fail", it just stops and needs a power reset.
Any ideas?
Cheers
David
|
Re: Step attenuator for QRP transmitter to TinySA
?TRY? ? ? ? ? ? ??
|
Amazon.com: step attenuator rf
www.amazon.com
|
?Walt Cates,
WD0GOF
?
A
majority of acceptance is not proof of correctness.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Dang!? That doesn't bode well for the utility of the Kay attenuator.? I am not used to dealing with RF output power in Decibels instead of watts, but from what little I have gleaned from discussions on-line, 10 Db attenuation wouldn't be enough to bring
1 watt of RF down to the level that would be comfortable for the TinySA.
I need to find a table which shows RF output in say, 1/2 watt steps from 1/2 watt to 5 watts, and at each step, how many Db of attenuation is needed to bring to RF down to the proper input level to feed into the TinySA.? I would pay $5 0r $10 in a heartbeat
for such a chart, as I don't want to fry my TinySA and have to drop another fifty bucks for a replacement.
It would also be nice to know the proper input power to the TinySA...in watts, volts (DC, RMS, & PtoP), and Db's since I have run into attenuators which all use different units of measurements and I don't know how to compare them...it's the old apples and oranges
gambit!
Somewhere, I read that the Kay 520 had 1- 60 Db attenuation (i guess that would be? 0,1, 2, 3, 6, 10, 20, 30, 40, 50, 60 DB or something of that ilk) but they didn't say what the max watts would be.
FleaBag (eBay) has a number of in-line 10 pole switched attenuators for sale at reasonable prices, but they all seem to be for very low power use with max input power of 0.25 0r 0.50 watts which wouldn't be useful for my 1 to 5 watt transmitters.? They say
they are for Ham Radio use, but I don't know where they will find a big enough market among the QRPp milliwatters to have dozens of vendors selling 0.25 Watt attenuators.
I'm just rambling on now out of pure frustration.
EuGene, KA5NLY
|
Re: Step attenuator for QRP transmitter to TinySA
Dang!? That doesn't bode well for the utility of the Kay attenuator.? I am not used to dealing with RF output power in Decibels instead of watts, but from what little I have gleaned from discussions on-line, 10 Db attenuation wouldn't be enough to bring 1 watt of RF down to the level that would be comfortable for the TinySA.
I need to find a table which shows RF output in say, 1/2 watt steps from 1/2 watt to 5 watts, and at each step, how many Db of attenuation is needed to bring to RF down to the proper input level to feed into the TinySA.? I would pay $5 0r $10 in a heartbeat for such a chart, as I don't want to fry my TinySA and have to drop another fifty bucks for a replacement.
It would also be nice to know the proper input power to the TinySA...in watts, volts (DC, RMS, & PtoP), and Db's since I have run into attenuators which all use different units of measurements and I don't know how to compare them...it's the old apples and oranges gambit!
Somewhere, I read that the Kay 520 had 1- 60 Db attenuation (i guess that would be? 0,1, 2, 3, 6, 10, 20, 30, 40, 50, 60 DB or something of that ilk) but they didn't say what the max watts would be.
FleaBag (eBay) has a number of in-line 10 pole switched attenuators for sale at reasonable prices, but they all seem to be for very low power use with max input power of 0.25 0r 0.50 watts which wouldn't be useful for my 1 to 5 watt transmitters.? They say they are for Ham Radio use, but I don't know where they will find a big enough market among the QRPp milliwatters to have dozens of vendors selling 0.25 Watt attenuators.
I'm just rambling on now out of pure frustration.
EuGene, KA5NLY
|
Re: Starting this month, we have printed power warning labels on the surface of tinySA.
Spec sheet says the Kay 520 is rated for half a watt.? If it were my attenuator, I wouldn't push my luck.
|
Re: Step attenuator for QRP transmitter to TinySA
I have a similar rotary attenuator that's
rated for 2 watts.? I'd use that as an upper limit.? The Kay model
is zero to ten dB.
73 charlie, k1xx
On 2/11/2021 5:17 PM, bigusmith via
groups.io wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
I have a Kay Model 520 (Kay #80138) 0 - 10 scale rotary attenuator
that I would like to use to allow me to test 100 Milliwatt to 5
Watt QRP transmitters using my TinySA, but I have not been able to
find a spec sheet on the attenuator, so I don't know how many
watts input it can handle and how much attenuation it will
provide.
I, of course, do not want to overload the attenuator and/or the
TinySA if I try to test my 5 watt QRP rig.? Anyone have any ideas?
EuGene, KA5NLY
|
Step attenuator for QRP transmitter to TinySA
I have a Kay Model 520 (Kay #80138) 0 - 10 scale rotary attenuator that I would like to use to allow me to test 100 Milliwatt to 5 Watt QRP transmitters using my TinySA, but I have not been able to find a spec sheet on the attenuator, so I don't know how many watts input it can handle and how much attenuation it will provide.
I, of course, do not want to overload the attenuator and/or the TinySA if I try to test my 5 watt QRP rig.? Anyone have any ideas?
EuGene, KA5NLY
|
Re: Starting this month, we have printed power warning labels on the surface of tinySA.
Eugene,
I would not put more than 100mw into that Kay. It is a 10 db step attenuator 0-70db. Why get separate attenuators for each transmitter? Just use one transmitter under test at a time. Get a 30db 10 watt attenuator. That makes a watt to milliwatt converter. So then your various transmitters are converted to -3, 0, 3 and 7 dbm. These are all safe levels for the tinysa. If you want, you could add your Kay 520 on the output of the 30db attenuator to reduce by about 10-20 db more.
Gary
W9TD
|
Re: serial USB not recognized - a clone ? - "to be, or not to be, that is the question"
Thanks Martin, mine works OK and is exactly as you say. The other
chap seemed concerned that it was not in the Ports list when in
DFU mode.
On 11/02/2021 09:34, Martin J.K. wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Geoff,
you wrote ''As soon as I enter DFU mode via config, the device
disappears from the Ports list''.
That is how it is supposed to be with the TinySA in DFU mode.
Now, in Device Manager, section Universial Serial Bus controllers
you should see ''STM Device in DFU Mode''.
Martin 9A2JK
|
Re: serial USB not recognized - a clone ? - "to be, or not to be, that is the question"
Geoff, you wrote ''As soon as I enter DFU mode via config, the device disappears from the Ports list''. That is how it is supposed to be with the TinySA in DFU mode. Now, in Device Manager, section Universial Serial Bus controllers you should see ''STM Device in DFU Mode''. Martin 9A2JK 
|
Re: Starting this month, we have printed power warning labels on the surface of tinySA.
On Wed, Feb 10, 2021 at 11:17 PM, Carsten Bormann wrote:
I don¡¯t recollect immediately if a lower input than 10dBm gives you better results with the tinySA.
When measuring harmonics of a transmitter you want maximum spur free dynamic range of the tinySA. This spur free dynamic range depends on the input level at the mixer. With +10dBm input the mixer will see at least -20dbm which is not optimal For best measurement results try to get the input level to the tinySA between -25dBm and -15dBm so you can still use the built in attenuator to optimize the measurement ? --
------------------------------------------
For more info on the tinySA go to https://tinysa.org/wiki/
|
Re: Starting this month, we have printed power warning labels on the surface of tinySA.
EuGene,
You can check the attenuation steps of the Kay 520 by turning on the tinySA calibration signal and connecting your atttenuator to HIGH and LOW on the tinySA.? I think it is 0dB to 70dB in 10dB steps.? It should be good for at least 0.5 watts, and probably works reasonably well to at least 500MHz.? (I have seen one reference to it working up to 2GHz.)
--John Gord
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Wed, Feb 10, 2021 at 10:53 PM, bigusmith wrote:
Carsten,
I'm looking to get attenuators to use with various QRP transmitters baur am not sure how much dB of attenuation is needed to use for each of the QRP transmitters with the following watts output:? 0.5 watts, 1 watt. 3 watts, & 5 watts.? ?I will select four 10 watt max input attenuators, one for each of those four transmitters, and have the following attenuations to choose from: 6dB, 10dB, 20dB, 30dB, 40dB.? I will label each one with which transmitter if will be used to provide a safe input to the Tiny SA.
I do have a KAY Elemetrics model 520 step attenuator but have been unable to fins a spec sheet on it to let me know it max input in watts and the min & max attenuation steps in dBs, so I'm hesitant to use it for anything while I am in the dark on it specs.
EuGene, KA5NLY
|
Re: Starting this month, we have printed power warning labels on the surface of tinySA.
Hi EuGene,
I don¡¯t know why you are specifically addressing me, but here goes:
5 W is 37 dBm (log10(5 W / 1 mW) log10(5000) ¡Ö 3.7).
Since you don¡¯t really know what exactly the transmitter will output, let¡¯s say you want to be safe up to 40 dBm, giving 3 dB safety margin.
10dBm is the max safe input, and 40 dBm - 10 dBm = 30 dB (no m;
dB is a measure of gain or attenuation; dBm is a measure of power by giving the gain relative to 1 mW).
Of course, the fact that an attenuator nominally is 30 dB does not mean that it really is at the frequency you are going to use it with, so that may use up some of the 3 dB safety margin we gave ourselves above.
Now, you probably don¡¯t just want to not blow up the tinySA, but also get a good measurement. I don¡¯t recollect immediately if a lower input than 10dBm gives you better results with the tinySA.
Gr¨¹?e, Carsten
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 2021-02-11, at 05:58, bigusmith via groups.io <bigusmith@...> wrote:
Carsten,
I'm looking to get attenuators to use with various QRP transmitters baur am not sure how much dB of attenuation is needed to use for each of the QRP transmitters with the following watts output: 0.5 watts, 1 watt. 3 watts, & 5 watts. I will select four 10 watt max input attenuators, one for each of those four transmitters, and have the following attenuations to choose from: 6dB, 10dB, 20dB, 30dB, 40dB. I will label each one with which transmitter if will be used to provide a safe input to the Tiny SA.
I do have a KAY Elemetrics model 520 step attenuator but have been unable to fins a spec sheet on it to let me know it max input in watts and the min & max attenuation steps in dBs, so I'm hesitant to use it for anything while I am in the dark on it specs.
EuGene, KA5NLY
|
Re: Starting this month, we have printed power warning labels on the surface of tinySA.
Carsten,
I'm looking to get attenuators to use with various QRP transmitters baur am not sure how much dB of attenuation is needed to use for each of the QRP transmitters with the following watts output:? 0.5 watts, 1 watt. 3 watts, & 5 watts.? ?I will select four 10 watt max input attenuators, one for each of those four transmitters, and have the following attenuations to choose from: 6dB, 10dB, 20dB, 30dB, 40dB.? I will label each one with which transmitter if will be used to provide a safe input to the Tiny SA.
I do have a KAY Elemetrics model 520 step attenuator but have been unable to fins a spec sheet on it to let me know it max input in watts and the min & max attenuation steps in dBs, so I'm hesitant to use it for anything while I am in the dark on it specs.
EuGene, KA5NLY
|
waltcates
bigusmith
Jim Allyn - N7JA
Gary W9TD